Episode 362 w/ Robin Thicke

It is drink Chants, motherfucking podcast man. He's a legends eary queens rapper. He's agreed that your boy in O R E. He's a Miami hip hop pioneer. What Up is DJ E f N?

Together they drink it up with some of the biggest players, you know what I mean.

And the most professional, unprofessional podcast and your number one source for drunk drink chans most every day is New Year's e. Listen, it's time for drink Champs. Drink up, motherfuck mother? Would it good? Be hoping these winters should be. This is your boy in O R What up is d J E f N?

And this drink Champs? Yeah, I will make something When when when? When we started this show, we wanted we wanted to dedicate your whole show to legends, to pie up is. This man is not only a legend of pioneer icon. He is I didn't even know he was

Literally this is and and.

It's a frame that I just found out was called blue Eyes so Ould. I did not know what that is. I did not know what it is. But we don't learn today. So in case you don't know, didn't know, who are we talking about? The one only?

Why?

That's Interdusty Now I got a access all top, Yes, sir, Wayne Gretsky. Baby, Well, my dad, you know, my dad was a devout Conde.

You know, he was the American Canadian dad. So he came up with David Foster, the great producer songwriter and Wayne Gresky. Those were his two homies. So I was lucky enough. I was lucky enough. When I was young, David Foster would I'd get to visit my dad would take me to the studio because my dad knew I wanted to be a singer.

When I was seven years old.

He would take me to the studio to visit David Foster when he was working on the Natalie Cole Unforgettable album, when he was working on I Will Always Love You

Home from school. My Wayne Gretzky story is even better. He was. He just threw that out.

Yeah, no, pretty wild growing up, but yeah, well, my Wayne Gretzky story. My dad took my older brother to Russia for a summer vacation, and Wayne was dating Janet and needed a place to stay in La. They wanted to hang in La, so he stayed in my dad's bedroom for like two weeks. I'm going to Joe Tory baseball camp every day in the valley in Los Angeles, So the phone rings about seven thirty in.

The morning one morning. I answered the phone. It's Bruce McNall, the owner of the Kings, and he says, can you please wake Wayne up? And I said no, no, no, he's sleeping. I'm not going in there.

And he said, I need you to go and wake him up. So I go, I wake Wayne up. I go to Joe Tory baseball camp.

I come home.

Wayne's on the podium in Edmonton saying that he's been traded to the Kings. So I answered the phone. The day then Wayne Gretzky was traded the Gigs. Yeah, that's when he left camp. Should have woken him up early.

Yeah.

But my one by one cool fabulous story with him was he took me the first time I'd ever been in a Rolls Royce. He had a white Rolls Royce and he convertible and he took me to McDonald's.

I'll never agree being in the drive through with Wayne driving in a convertible Rolls Royce in the valley and uh yeah.

So a lot of stories like that. Thanks to Pop. Shout out to allan thinks.

Your mother was which show she was? She was on days of our lives. She was a singer.

My mom also had a hit with an R and B singer named Carl Anderson. She had a number one song in the eighties, Friends and Lovers. That's my mom singing with Carl Anderson. So, you know, we've been trying to be black for generations. I had a joke beause my grandfather it was a jazz trumpet player. His father was a jazz trumpet player. So my joke is, we've been trying to be black for six generations.

No, probably straight on different strokes. Your father wrote that and sang it. That's my singing.

Strokes, super dudes, that's my dad's saying. I'm saying when I googled just that this is so amazing. But some of this at that point, No, No, he hadn't.

Actually he uh was always a writer, and he wrote the original Wheel of Fortune theme song and my mom yeah, and my mom sang the facts of life.

That's my mom singing the facts of my question. Yeah, I'll take some.

There was one funny story where I guess MERV. Griffin, you know who owned Wheel of Fortune. My dad wrote the original theme song, and after a few years, my dad was making bank and merv Griffin's like, who's this Canadian dude making all this money? So he rewrote his own theme songs and so he could own it.

Yeah, wow, little noise for that. Man.

I'm sitting there reading and by the way, we do this, wee be artist. And I'm sitting there and that's my friend over there, diego. He gets hyped for nothing and he's already like oh. He kept reading it and we were like it just kept going, kept going, and I was like, it was like, so, how is how was your childhood?

Like? If you you ship like, I want to call it you a platinum spoon, not another silver spoon because you had Wayne Kresty babysit.

Well, my dad was just the most friendly, sociable person you would ever meet.

He loved He was from a small mining town in northern Canada, ten thousand people.

He dreamed of Hollywood. Loved Hollywood. So, like I joke because people are like, oh you Hollywood. I'm like, I'm in Hollywood as a guest. I was born in the sign, you know what I mean. But yeah, so I mean my dad loved it. My mom is a great singer and actress, and so I I just grew up in that.

But what I really loved about my father.

Was his ability to make friends right and legitimate long term friendships. That when when he passed away, the people that showed up for him, even if it's Leo DiCaprio, you know, like they just.

Want to show together.

That was Leo's first job pain And so Leo and I've been homies ever. We were sitting in the classroom together at fourteen years old.

You know, so your homies list is it? I'm just saying, like I was googledness. I was like I was sitting there like some of this got to be made up. You know, sometimes you go google yourself and like people will say shit about you, but this is crazy.

So okay, did you know growing up you you were royanty? Did you know that?

No?

Well, you feel you go somewhere you go.

I think because I saw it so young and my dad handled it so well with such class, right and kindness, you know what I mean.

So I just really appreciated the way my father treated people, and I just wanted to emulate that and following his foot what was he like his character in growing paints? Because that's what you're just very much very much. I mean, you know he's a little more naughty. You know that.

He had his run hosting all the pageants and had a little fun with that for a while.

But no, he was just he was just the most levelble.

He was the kind of guy who would golf and play tennis. Like his whole his whole week was worked out from six a m. Till eleven pm. His whole week was planned. He had dinners every night with friends and somehow never.

Paid for God, my dad go three times a week with friends who had memberships my dad. My dad would play tennis, you know, with people who had the cords to the hook ups. So he found a way to save his money, leave it to his kids. And I look up to my idol forever. But let let's make some mouse. That's all we could fire to be a parent. Yeah, I'm trying to save some money for my children.

Now.

Now I'm always I'm always like when we have guests and we asked, they're drinkless. So that's that's that's my favorite part of the whole show. So when I got actually people's people said he drinks, do say, I say, oh.

He hood, I support du I'm part of it. I'm part of the Duce family. They've been obviously.

I'm with Rock Nations, Jay Brown and jay Z family. And when I was doing this residency in Los Angeles last year, we did about fifteen shows in LA at this small restaurant, only like two hundred and fifty people though people five hundred out the paget man again every week.

No, this was just last year just because I wanted to.

I wanted to do a real intimate show, no smoke, no lights, like right in front of people. So du Sy sponsored all these shows for us, and we got to have Little Wayne came out and two chains and.

It has been a great run. You got Mad Records with a Little Wayne, I got like seven records. I was like, these niggas gott it was like a collaboration album. I'm looking that's not how how is that?

Like?

You know, coming from R and B, you know, World and Collide and with hip hop, yeah.

It's always especial.

But when I'm hearing you guys together, it's like it doesn't seem forced at all. No, like it is because you and Waynam his friends, we were genuine fans of each other.

Are we blue?

Like when I heard go DJ. I mean, you know, I mean he was already blown up. But when I heard go DJ, I was like, this is the next biggest artist period. I told Andre Hall and it was like you think. So I was like, trust me, Dre, this is the one. And so coincidentally he just reached

He just wrapped in between where I wasn't singing wow, And it ended up being on the Carter two album You know it Amazing? How did you want from? OK?

Well, actually, let me finish a good little Wayne story. So the first time that Lil Wayne ever did the Tonight Show and the first time I ever did The Night Show, we did it together.

The first time either.

One of us ever performed on the Grammys, we performed together.

So we have. We did tie my Hands, you know, and he did the big New Orleans thing when he did the Year of the Card to three. So him and I have a real history together, right, Yeah, I think it's I think it's a beautiful thing. Man. I like an y'all together. Yeah, I got mad notes.

Want I want to go back to the relationship with Andre Herral Yes, yeah, lot there.

How did you connect and what was that relationship? Well, he was moving to.

LA to start a record label with Babyface, and they were looking for songs for these couple of artists that they had signed or interested in signing. So Dre had there was this artist who was kind of more of a dancer from Miami, like a more dancer first sing or second, you know. And so Dre comes to my house with Pete Farmer, a veteran A and R man from Arista, and Drake comes in and I play a couple of songs and he's like, that's cool.

But the way you sing them, He's like, I like the way you singing these songs. You're singing.

Artist, And it's like, but I like the way you sing He said, you got your own, you got any your own songs? Like for your own album, and and the funniest thing was just the way the world works. I had just devoted myself to making my debut album, actually creating. I was about twenty years old, you know when I met him, or no, a little old, like twenty two, twenty three, and so I was just started a beautiful world, and I had the first two songs that was going to put on the album.

I sang those two songs for him, and he didn't want to work with the other artist anymore. He was like, I'm hanging with you.

We're doing this, and he he lifted me into his New York City puff Daddy Naomi Campbell world. I remember I had a Halloween party before my album came out. Mariah's dancing on the dance floor, Naomi's there, Seal is there, Paul Thomas Anderson, the award winning director, and Ted Demi.

These were These are the people just hanging out on.

My balcony because of they were friends with Andrea and Yeah and the director, and they're in the studio. They're all sitting there listening to my album before it comes out. Naomi's in there. Mariah was in there for a while but couldn't handle the smoke. It had to walk out. She's like, it's just smoking here. She was wearing a wonder Woman costume with pom poms. I don't know, with some kind of combination.

But so this is me at twenty five years old, before I even had an album out. That's what. That's what with Andrea herro was like. And because I also read somewhere that you wrote for Brandy.

My first a cut that I ever had published was Brandy was fourteen and I was sixteen, and I wrote and I wrote a song for her on her debut album.

But how do they start knowing that you know, you know how to write McKnight.

Actually what happened? I did another great story. They used to call me bang the Light Mark Barby cutt you.

But you notice every line he said, this is a bar okay, Brian Knight, So yeah, I got I call him Brian mcwhiteway.

So I got another one. So I was in a singing group. We were called as One. It was me and three black guys, and one of the black guys his godfather was Algio. So I go to my father at thirteen years old, and I go, Dad, we need a thousand dollars to cut a demo.

My dad goes, no, no, no, we're not starting that. You're too young. I'm not spending one thousand dollars on a demo, and so we went to Algiero.

Algiero put the thousand dollars down paid for my first demo. I got to sing three songs on a mic and some kind of R and B hip hop fashion. Those three songs got heard by Brian McKnight and oh no, no, no, no, there's.

One more step. I got more bars, there's one more step. No no. Those records were.

Heard by Tricky Stewart, who was a young seventeen year old producer out of Chicago who had just moved to Los Angeles with his cousin and brother to start building their song basis. So we're in the studio working with the Braxton sisters and Brian McKnight is in the studio next door. So I started writing songs and cutting songs with Tricky Stewart. I'm like fifteen, fourteen, fifteen, and Brian here was young, yeah, leaving the leaving lead. I would

To the studio every day at fourteen years old.

But Brian ended up hearing that demo and then signed me to a record deal at Interscope Records when I was sixteen with Jimmy Ivan.

Well, when I first heard of you, I haven't asked yes, when I first heard of you, like right here, yeah, I smoke with you, I thought it was Pharrell.

Oh but before I get to the parrel day, I wanted to say something that you said something earlier? Did you said Wayne Gretzky was dating Janet Jackson.

No, No, Janet Janet Gretzky who became Janet. Okay, wait, and that was exerting the Janet days she went to all the hockey games. That was like, that's the way love goes.

No, I was thinking cause I'm like, I'm thinking for fans and the fans Like, wait a minute, he just said, yes, I had to make sure like keep my skills sharp.

You know what I mean? That makes all makes sense?

Okay, all right, So again when I first heard of you, I heard of you through Pharrell. Then I hit the head is Brian McKnight stories. Yea Andre Harrell story. How did you want Forarrell initially get together in the first place?

Well, Jimmy, I mean it was always the king of that. Ye, Jimmy knew the name drops. It's just get better.

Yeah.

The best story about Jimmy was Jimmy signed me. I remember the first time I met Jimmy. I mean I was in the room with John McClain. John McClain was actually the one who signed me and who runs Michael Jackson's counts and stuff like that. One of the great A and rs of all time. So John McClain was Jimmy's right hand man, and John loved my voice. He took me to the record store and bought me Marvin Gaye albums and blah blast. You need to listen to these guys for ad libs. You should practice it. And

To sit on the car with me.

It sounds so so cut to pretty much nine years later, because the records I made with Brian, they were good, but they weren't great, you know, they were like a B album and I didn't hadn't quite formulated an image yet. There really wasn't there besides a young white kid with a good voice singing R and B music. So they said, we'll put it out, but we're not going to really spend any money on promotion. I was like, you know it, just shelf it and I'll come back with something better

Style of music. And Jimmy and I had when I Get You Alone when I came to the meeting, and Jimmy goes, didn't I sign you like eight years ago? Don't already have you signed here? Like what do you mean? I gotta sign you again? And that didn't whoa.

So the first album was made with Andre Face was more of a friend he was, but it was that album was all onre like, you know, my musical and artistic development all.

Came from Madre and my confidence.

Like I had never met anybody who also believed in me, maybe even more than I believed in myself, who saw me bigger than I saw myself.

Because Andre saw the whole thing.

He saw the fashion, the tequila, he saw the future of everything for all of us, you know, and sometimes we didn't even think as big as he did.

And that was the genius of Andre. Okay, we love you, miss but yeah, but how do you get mere? How?

So then Pharrell, So after the first album, Jimmy's like, we got this super talent and but he he didn't connect, you know, we didn't find a way to sell records yet. So he says, I want you to meet with Farrell. So I go in this shoe with Pharrell. Luckily not good. Luckily I had lost without you in the meeting. So I show up to the meeting to meet Pharrell for

But I hadn't had a hit yet. So I go in and I didn't I hadn't even.

Recorded the vocal yet, so I sing Lost Without You Live in Jimmy Ivan's office for Pharrell the first time he hears it.

Obviously right.

I was signed to Star Trek you know, the next day, and ever since then, Farrell has done nothing but blessed me with his genius.

Do you think having famous parents helped you among the way?

I think it helps you young because you see an example of success, You see that it's possible, so you believe it's possible for you too.

Do you know what I mean? It's just like anything in any family.

If your dad's a good lawyer, dad's a good doctor, your mom does you can go, well, then I can do it.

Your dad can do it. I can do it, you know. So it does breed confidence, but then you hit the reality of people judging right and then so yeah, that affected me at a younger age. Now, in hindsight, I realized that's what you have to earn as an artist. You have to earn your own individuality and your own impression that you bypass or at least parallel yourself to your parents accomplishments.

Did you feel that anybody ever treated you as a novelty in that moment, like, oh, I.

Feel like when Andre, because Andre had respect from everybody.

He played music for us. So when Andre first started playing my music for people, there there was a people listened.

You know.

And I remember when Rolling when he played some of it for somebody at the Rolling Stone in one of those popular magazines, and they were like.

They think you sound like Maxwell, And I was like, this is a bad thing on the back. I like, the guy just sold the four million records and he's good sold out the forum. What's sounded a little like Maxwell because like one of the.

New rappers out is a guy named Russ right, and Russ I see he receives a lot of slack because they say that his father was so powerful in the industry that they almost gave it the props to his father.

And that's just we're always trying to knock one peg out people, you know what I mean, and take.

Some away from their own accomplishments.

And the truth is is that it does help to have a leg up, it does help to have connections, it does help to have some financial But my dad didn't give me.

The first grand I didn't get the first thousand dollars, though it might have been the best thing you ever different, you know what I mean.

And that's the thing, that's what we all like. I'm balancing my son. My thirteen year old son has an incredible voice. He's a natural singer, and he's way more comfortable being on.

Stage than I was. Until I was thirty, I was a studio rat.

I literally lived in the studio twelve hours a day until I released the first album and then I started performing. So I didn't become a good performer until, you know, maybe ten years later, you know.

So I think with my son, I want to balance the support.

Support, support, but you're going to have to go write your own songs, go play your own guitar, and have to make your own bones.

You know. Did you have you ever had a regular day? I do now, and happily, Happily, I have four kids.

I have a five year old daughter Mia, a four year old daughter Lola, and a two year old son, and they run my world.

You know. I mean, my thirteen year old goes back and forth between my and Paul and my ex. But my kids are everything.

And I think my dad was such a great dad, and I adored him so much. But he was so busy during my like ten to eighteen era, and he was gone on the weekends. Earn it because he was he was making he was everyone. He was he was everyone, and he didn't really turned down a job. He just hosted everything, you.

Know now, you said, I remember as a kid seeing him post all those things.

You didn't even realize because I didn't know that was work back then.

I just know that I was having fun. That's crazy. Yeah. No, So you literally have to share.

Your father with the one I think a little bit of that time that I missed. I want to make sure I don't miss with my kids.

You know. But my dad, he set the whole family up. He gave us a bar, a standard, you know, to live up to. Hell.

Yeah, I feel like I knew him my whole life. Forty five years old. I put on your dad my whole life.

You know.

The best thing there isn't a set or a show I can go on, or any group of backstage p that I work with. If somebody doesn't come up and say how much they love they've worked with my dad in law, you know what I mean.

And that's that's the legacy, A great legacy. I'm gonna tell you something.

I can no longer watch movies because of how much I know about how film works. It like kind of ruins it for me. Like I kind of like the other day I re visited Seinfeld and I realized Seinfeld didn't shooting on one episode in New York City. Whoa the whole ship you think of that? Ever, the exterior, even the exteriors.

Right was on set.

It was a set, but they was showing. And so I'm watching Seinfeld. This is the show that I loved back then, I still love now, but I'm watching it now now that I know the difference. I feel like it took away from everything, just the magic. Yeah, because you're so much involved in entertainment. Does entertainment bore you now?

No? I think that. I think I bore myself, and I think I have to sometimes.

I think I like to live in the challenges of life and the struggles so I can create something that actually is meaningful to me. If life is too easy, if I don't, if I just go, oh, it's all flowers and everybody's happy, then I'm just gonna write flowers and happy songs.

That's not who I am. I'm a soul. Man. I have to feel the soul of my experience so I can put that soul back into my music.

God damn it, man with the flowers that man, let's go. Let's come on, come on, babe, God damn it. Our show is literally about giving people they flowers and literally want to give you y'all hours.

Man.

I would say, it's like a Grammy coming from the people, right, thank you.

Thank you? Know what? The older way, I heard a great quote from Bob Dylan once.

He said something like, it's always nice to be honored while you're still alive, right right, that's right. And the older we get all these little moments of appreciation or flowers or gratitude, you know, because we were so much more grateful now for everything that we've accomplished and been a part of.

During the ride, you're just going, it ain't enough.

I need another, I need more, And sure I want more more great music, you know, and I want more great friendships.

But but I try not to be so hard on myself anymore, you know, good.

And appreciate all the people that you've actually touched on the way.

Yeah, exactly, And that's why it's good to get out because sometimes the artists, the older you get, you just end up staying inside with your friends and your circle and your family, and you don't even feel that love anymore, and you.

Start thinking it's not out there. And then I go out and I and I see all the smiles and the faces and the handshakes and the people that want to say I love you, And if I'm staying in my house all day, I'll never get to feel that love.

You know, It's probably one of the deepest shit I've ever heard just now, Like that shit makes so much sense to me.

I don't know, I know you're talking to the world, but that moment was talking to me. Yeah, that shit is. You and I have both experienced similar parts of the adventure.

You know.

You know it's crazy.

I noticed that if if I'm even you know, have you ever woke up and you feel like you're having a bad day?

Like you just feel it just on the moment you wake up.

I literally can't go outside because if I go outside, someone's gonna be like, hey, nor you gotta take a picture that I'm saying I got a fucked updated.

Certain they don't give a fuck about my fucking note. They're thinking about that, that music, They think that was all you made me feel good.

So speaking of that, that's the one thing I hear about the music is it seems like you're a feel good person, like you want to feel good, except for when you tried to get your wife back.

You was hurt. You was hurt. Yeah, well I was confused. He was confused.

He was confused because because I knew that we weren't supposed to be together anymore. But I had just had a child and the last thing I wanted to do was spend half of my life away from my child the next eighteen years, only seeing him three and a half days a week.

Real.

So there is in a single thing you wouldn't try. So that album was the most jumbled and confused album because that was the most jumbled and confused part of my life. So I said everything I was going through. So one day I wanted to get her back. The next day I knew was over. You know, one day I wanted to make it work. The next day I knew there.

Was no chance. So that period, oh yeah, music has always been my diary and my therapy. It's and sometime I guess that time it didn't work. You know, it didn't work, but.

It might not have workedally, but internally then.

And then you said it and I'm going to drop. I'm gonna drop. And then these are the beautiful moments.

So I'm mad. I met a birthday, a big birthday party, all these people that I haven't seen this person in a long time. But his daughter, Zoe had been in the studio with me while I was making the Paula album.

She had come to visit. Right, So Lenny Kravinz is sitting there.

And he goes, yo, Zoe told me about the album because she heard it in the studio and I listened to it and I thought it was amazing.

So right there here, here's another peer of mine that I love, and let me get it, let me get in. And he's telling me when I when.

I sold barely sold anything, and everybody told me it was a big mistake, and he's saying, I thought it was amazing, that was beautiful. I said something to the respect of I really respected what you did on that album.

And that's what we do as artists. We hit, we miss, but we have to try and share and tell our story right. And my story at that time was all over the place. Nah.

I mean when I was listening, I was like, okay, I see what it was gonna happen. But you tried, you tried to get it back. You made a whole No.

I tried to sell old idea, the idea.

Of getting her back, but I wasn't actually working on getting her back at the time.

And that's why, because we were already done. You wanted your family together, you want to.

I wrote the songs in real time. I wrote the whole album in maybe two months, you know. But I knew we weren't going to be back together, and that was okay. You know, I heard this great quote recently by Jay Shetty and you guys know this guy, jaj doess a lot of inspirational stuff, and he said, people think that growing apart is a bad thing, but you're still growing. Just because you grew apart, does it mean you didn't grow? And that really touched me deep because

As an L. That's not necessarily an L. Wow, you know what I mean. Meghan Marko write your wedding stations.

And Megan Marco wrote our wedding invitations in collect, Yo, what kind of fucking life. She was a colligor, she's a calligraphy expert, and somehow when she was doing an interview getting married, she said that she did our wedding invitations.

That's the kind of shit that happens in Hollywood. Yo.

She's married, she's literally worried to you, and she happened to do your wedding invitations.

How the fuck is that? Man? That's Hollywood. That's why I always just say this, man, it's Hollywood. Anything's possible, Wow, anything speaking of that?

You know, growing up in Los Angeles, and like I see, I see how you kept saying the valley, And you notice.

None of us was known what you're just talking about. Because when I say the valley in La, yes, in La everyone else. I looked at my already val den. I looked at a.

Couple of couple of my friends and they look but like it's it's actually it's actually one of the toughest towns to be in, right, because it's almost like everyone's a fucking start in California.

It's it's the person bringing you your burger.

Yeah, it was on Martin in nineteen eighty nine, and he's just out there living.

It's just like it's just like that. Yeah, is that something that you're adapt you're just used to all.

I think everything has its pluses and minuses, you know. I think people in Hollywood, they tend to think that they're this close to stardom, and the fact there's a few of them are right, you know.

So I have I've seen it happen.

I've literally seen somebody a month earlier and then the next month they're on the cover of Time magazine and nobody going me.

It's like, things like this really do happen.

And I've been lucky enough to see so many journeys realize their potential.

So I do believe. Even when I see my kids, I don't tell them this is not possible. Anything is possible. I've seen it happen. I've made the impossible possible.

You know, how do you prepare them for the rougher side? Of that because they're that's the percentages are against most.

Well, I don't encourage any of them to get into entertainment business. I encourage them to have craft. Right to build craft something you love to do. If you do it long enough and you build a craft at it, you will success. You will find a place. You can't just want to be a star. You want to be a star, good luck, you know what I mean.

But you want to have craft and if you earn the hours that it takes to learn a craft. I spent twelve hours in the studio every day by the time I was from sixteen to twenty, you know what I mean.

So by the time I was twenty, by the.

Time I was twenty two, I'd written and produced two dozen golden platinum records. Before I'd ever released one of my own songs. I had already had two dozen golden Plantinum albums.

You know I was on Mark anton I wrote Mark Anthony's you Gotta Look for Solid right like No No. Then I had this lucky streak in my late teen years in my early twenties where I happened to be on everybody's biggest album. The song that I wrote for Usher Confessions. The song I wrote for Christina was her debut album, her biggest alum. The song I wrote for Mark Anthony his biggest selling American album. The song I wrote for Maya it was her Plantinum.

So I had this incredible Pink Pink's biggest album was her first album Notes, So this was literally but and you know, by the time I was twenty two years old, I'm just amassed.

Who's helping you get those placements? Because that's difficult publishers. You have publishing company.

Luckily, I signed a publishing deal when I was about sixteen seventeen, and she would pitch me to all these artists and they'd come by our studio and we'd write a song for them and then.

Just get lucky to be on. I never had the hit. I never had to hit, always had a cut on the biggest time. Yeah, that's all you need. You're ready to kick Thomas. Let's go. I'm doing you guys, might if I do it quick break. As you can see, I got the story you want to play in the game. If we're gonna give you two options, I just let them know. She said that I was looking a little shiny, So if they can step in. You can step in anytime you need. Yeah, come your on camera. Yeah, I think she looks good.

If you see me looking too shiny, I can do more. Hit, I'll do a little more right here, I guess some napkins paper, yes, sir, all right?

No, actually I think that nothin's are good? Sure, yeah, a little better? Thank you. I appreciate you money. All right.

We're gonna give you two options. You can kick one and we don't. But if you say both or neither, be politically correct. If you're if you give the politically correct answer, we're all drink.

But we said we don't leave you by yourself.

But if you pick one, nobody drinks, and feel free to give us a story or anything that comes to mind. Many of these two things we tell you. Okay, you want to start, you ont me just start?

You just talk, all right? Usher or Chris Brown?

Oh well, artistically I love both, but but I'm gonna have to pick my man, Usher, just because we go back twenty You got a Grammy together, say yeah, that's my book.

Fair enough? Like we we go to each other's kids, birthday parties and stuff.

I gotta see Breezey don't text me back. Sometimes I'll be sending it in front of video. I'll be saying we hung out recently, had a blast together, but but I send them a video because my my girl and her friends love Chris Brown. Like when it's when it's girls night, is it starts with these joisean loyal you know?

So it ready. So I'll be texting him from the party bus on the birthday night. Give it him one of these. You know. Sometimes he hits back. So so so what is it we we seen? What do you mean? Like? Like I like no, I would just be like yo, party Indio jams tonight. You know what I mean?

I like to send videos to my friends when we're partying to their music.

But I thought you meant like you know you know when Usher answered, So that's why I'm a pareush the face time in the party.

Bush Face signed with us while we were listening to Daddy's Home.

Okay, by the way, I don't want to ask this one. You can do guys na kiss. Oh well, I got records with both. That's another drop. Yeah, I was letting you go. I want you to. I don't know how, Yeah, I don't know how you can pick between those drinking drinking cheers, cheers, Thanks, I love blessed, and.

Yeah, I got I got ship to do today. Yep, drink tests. I'm okay, this is a good one. Marvin Gate or Stevie Wonda, Oh.

Well, h.

That's that's a both that you guys are gonna We're gonna be drunk, because first of all, there's nothing that you can't learn from either one of those catalogs and and and artists and Hartley what I love that. Andre Andre Herrel always knew that those were my two favorites because they sang about love, and that's that's my core has always been to sing about love or to sing about trying to make love better.

That shot, Yeah, yeah, thank you, and Marvin, thanks a lot for both being amazing by the way. We got that just in case, you know, that's that the best. I'm good.

I'm planning a nap after this. Yeah, yeah, I'm the best on the planet. Mother loyal, dig over there smoking it down. Goddamn, it.

Is good. It is good. I never heard nobody. Are you ready, Jodasy or black Street?

Oh once again, Teddy, that's Andre Herrel family.

So Teddy, I have a record with Teddy. We did Sex in the Morning together a Snoop with Snoop Dogg on it. I love Teddy, but Jodas.

Jodasy taught me so much vocally like I worshiped Casey and Jojo and as a listener, as a listener is just the songs of production like that era I was thirty. I think I don't think anybody influenced me more as a teenager than Jodasy vocally and musically like that was I seen come and talk to me in a cappella in my show.

You know what I mean? Like great record and the remix even better and yeah, and you know what's you know what's so great about?

And I know you experienced this too growing up, idolizing these artists and then here I am, and him and I I have been texting about doing a song together.

I need a song like what was the last thing you said me? I need a song like forgetting the artists? Who's just texting you, Casey? See now this is this ship is catching up to me. Now now I can't remember my favorite No.

Casey and I've been texting, yeah, because you know when Andre passed and just all the all of the Disciples of Andre. You know what I mean, we all have stayed in touch and become friends and and yes, so Casey and I've been talking about doing a song together.

I can't remember the artist right now. You got to be incredible. Okay, so you picked Jodysy. I definitely picked joas do now.

So I don't have to drink, you don't have to drive, But shout out to Teddy and black streets.

Shout out to Teddy, Biggie or Big Al. Definitely Biggie for me. Okay, little Wayne or Drake. I gotta pick Wheezy, gotta pick Weezy. I should take a shot for you for me, no one, you gotta pick. And you know I mean Drasey.

I'm literally we're in the car every week for the for the last fifteen years to Drizzy. So but but yeah, there's something about Wayne. There's something about Wayne. I feel that that just has never existed and will never exist. Like it's just such an individual, lyrical, vocal perspective that he brings.

You know, he's a cool dude too.

Yeah, your love, But your father was like the first king of Canada, and then Drake is like the King of Canada.

Drake is Canada. It's the King of Central Page twisted. Damn. That's a good one, Okay, Brian mcmight, well keep.

Sweat, gotta go with McKnight because yeah, that was my Keith, those records that Keith I remember I was.

That was what was so great about Remember I told you about al Giro's god.

His name is Tabiso and Kane and he's become a very successful an R and publisher himself. And he was my first Andre Herrell when I was like fourteen. Oh, here's another good story. So I'm fourteen years old and I'm hanging out with my The other guys in my singing group were nineteen to twenty years old. Right, they had a hookup at the Palladium in La So they decided to take me to the Palladium. It's a boys to men, Joe to C and I believe ABC like,

I don't even know how I got there.

I was just with my older Hollywood like David Faustino, Brian Austin Green, white boyfriends, right.

That's who it was. I was with the white boys. I was with the White Boy crew. I was with the white boy crew. I was with the white boy young.

TV crew, the nine O two one oh crew, and so Brian also getting them. They loved hip hop, right, They're all these hip hop has and I was the same way.

Somehow we become friends through.

My dad taking me to young Hollywood parties whatever. So they took me. So they're all like nineteen twenty years old. I'm fourteen, and and they end up somewhere else. I ended up wandering through the party and I find myself seeing these three black guys, well dressed, kind of sitting there, and I don't even.

Know how this happens. I just kind of walk up and I go, hey, what's what's your name? What you guys doing? Do you guys? You guys sing? And they said, yeah, we sing. I don't know how I had that feeling, and I said, yeah, I sing too. I sang for them right there in the in the palladium at the table on the spot. Made friends.

We ended up starting a singing group together, and that ended up in this guy to be so ended up teaching me about the culture of black music, and about A and R and about how to get a record deal. So when I he took me to Warner Brothers Records, in the first two songs, I sang to get a record deal, where Jodases got a love Wow and commissions.

Running back to you had a fourteen year old whie boy chose I'm about to act man like you ain't never listen to the Beach Boys, you know. I think we all like maybe I wanted to. I love black music and black culture so much naturally, Michael Jordan, Eddie Murphy like that whole era. As a wife, I.

Remember listening to n w A with my headphones and my walkman in the kitchen and my mom doesn't know I'm listening to Bitch, you know.

A Bitch is a bit like that, and I'm like, oh my god, Mom, if you know what I'm listening.

I'm so obsessed with the whole thing, you know, And so it's always just felt like like that was where I belonged to.

That culture is where I belonged, you know.

I don't know, we still don't quick time with slim, but how come like you know, there's people who are obviously white that make black music and there and sometimes they call them a culture volture.

What do you feel about that work a coat of volture? Like, what do you think? I think that that you know, if you're using something, then you're just using it. If you love something, if it's in your so if it's in your blood, if you if you like walk it daily, and you treat every person that's a part of that movement and culture with the same respect and dignity they deserve. Like that you don't have to answer to nobody. I like that. I get yeah, growing pains or different strokes.

I was on the Quins Jones redo of like pyt that I did this whole vocal and t pains on it. That was because I think what happens is you get into a.

Place like where blurred lines and that that year, a couple of years and you're just doing it, literally getting calls for everything, and of course Quincy Jones calls and wants you to drop a verse. You just do it. Six years later totally forgot I'd ever done that record. That's that's that's the beauty of the business. Okay, podcast or radio. You know, I haven't gotten totally into the podcast thing yet. My girl loves it. I think it's it's my impatience, do you know what I mean? I don't.

I like when it when I'm into a series and the new episode drops once a week, so there's a separation and anticipation and I only watch for an hour or plus.

But me trying to sit there and watched like ten.

Episodes in no way, man, No, I gotta go write, I gotta go do something.

Radio well, I mean yeah, I mean I'm as school. I'm thinking radio. Okay, I am, And you know Beyonce, Oh both ain't no answer to that exactly forever Missy or Eve Oh, I gotta pick Missy just I mean Eve, I I did a record with Eve. I think too, and but I love Uh. I think Missy was.

Just one of the most game changing presence. I mean, and her ability to wrap and sing and write and murder for other other artists.

I mean, yeah, Missy's and.

Similar entrance because she started writing. Yeah, and the connection there's a lot of connection's.

Just I mean, wow, if when you go back on her catalog, Virginia not She's Timberland, but con and the songs she wrote for s w V and I mean like peace, Bobby Brown or Johnny Gill.

I gotta go Bobby Brown. I love, I love all that and I sang my my my, like repeatedly. It was huge Johnny. I'm a huge Johnny gil fan.

But my progate the Boby Brown, the dope be cruel, the humping on the ground, the tender Ronnie like when I was a fourteen, I'm talking.

And you know, and and we did the Real Husbands of Hollywood together, so we're family on that talk about it.

I just think Bobby Brown. When Bobby Brown hit and he was rapping and singing and dance like that was That was and the run going back to you, This is gonna be here on Friday. That was Chris. That was the show I got to I don't want to. Oh, I get a lost you know who?

The reason why I know that Fat Joe hit me He's gonna be here Friday, and I think he's coming just to go to the He's a big like that fan of like because isn't it tour's Yeah?

Who else? And that's the wave of entertainment is that you go through.

Your hot phase and then all of a sudden it's just hot and everyone wants to see it and it's coming to test comes back and mentalities and remembering. I mean, that's the beauty of music is how it connects to the journey of your life and reminds you of those eras and times.

You know, and some of the best times your life.

Music is a time machine absolutely for real or Kanye got to pick for real of course, which I wouldn't.

I wouldn't u for Rell, you know, out of everybody that I've ever been around as an artist, married Ja recording, Mary J. Blige vocals or recording Jay Z vocals. That's hard to surpass. But being in the studio and watching for real create has got to be one of the most magical things you can be around. The speed, the authenticity, the passion, and just the cleverness that he and the lyricism, the melody like there isn't a part of it. He can't do all on his own. That's there's so many

He can't do. Just a genius.

When you use the word genius lightly, you know, use it lightly on Pharrell, he's a genius.

So Brandy or Monica, gotta pick Brandy. That's my girl. We did that. We had our first song together, our first cut. He's like a quick time.

But some of them are easy if they're if they're so connected, you know what I mean, Because I'm not picking music over music.

I'm picking connections music Mariah or Janet. Janet gotta pickure now Mariah vocally.

When she came out with Visions of Love, I remember I was proud and this is when I before my voice changed.

I could hit all the octaves, I could hit the fifth octave. Mariah high notes.

Yeah, but for puberty, eleven year old right when Mariah hit was Business of Love is eighty nine, you know, so maybe I'm twelve, so it's right before, so I'm still the last year I could hit that high note. But I remember I learned every single riff of Maria's and I didn't even realize most of my cons most of my most of my studying of riffs and runs came from Take six. I listened to the Take six albums, and if you learn how to sing like Take six, you can pretty much do anything.

So that's where I learned most of my riffs.

But Mariah when she came out, I didn't even realize until I would listen back to my records, like the earlier records I made, how many Mariah riffs I was running, you know what I mean?

How much he influenced me vocally. So justin Biebo or justin Timberlake, that's a tough one. Take a shot.

The people closet the world, they want you to not pick. I'm just telling you they don't want white car.

They don't want that no white on white Cry. But I made that one up that I was like. I was like, let's go. That's good. I know, you know, because I want to be respectful. I'm going through I'm going to Hi Buster eminem Oh. I got to pick Bus the Bus.

We got a few records together and once again, remember remember when they had this thing that.

You could order videos back in the box Man marked the box the box. I remember when my dad first got the first of the box bill. But you came home and I had ordered three hundred dollars worth of videos. My dad was like, no more than box.

Most of the I remember I watched the Leaders of the New School at least twenty times. I thought that video, that first video of Bus a UH and Leaders of the New School was incredible. And then of course the scenario and the whole tribe connections and and and so when you and then you get to Uh, the different vocal stylings that he's done, you know what I mean, how he can change his voice up so much, and lyrical styles. I really think that he's one of the most influential we've ever had.

Bust give you Yeah, it hurts.

Shout out to Bus and Bus shout out the bus the first one that called me. Bussell was one of the first people that called me when I got divorced. When I got separated, when it was public news, he called me. I remember I was at the airport. He called me and just let me know he was there for me and if I needed anything or needed someone to talk to, that he.

Had been through these things and then he would be there for me. Shout out to bus.

YEA, I mean, such a great dude, like Bussell is my my friend that I called for motivation, like when it's time to Like if I could call bus and be like, yo, man, it ain't right, He's not. He'd be like, you mean, he'll give you that motivation that you need. I'm like, I just needed that.

I quean back. He would be like, he ain't let you have a bad day. He ain't letting you have a bad day.

I'm just He's a great one of my He reminds me of one of my favorite lines from the Godfather with Brando is you can act like.

I'm mad, you know what I mean, Like like I'm there for you. I'll hold you and we could have a we can hug it out. But come on, smack you around, Let's get the work done. You know this one. I'm gonna be honest, I don't know what's really this is going go.

Tupac or Jay z Oh Jay for me, I mean Tupac of course, that there's no way to deny anything that he gave us, but Jay has because we've gotten longer and more from Jay.

Also, we continue right now to be inspired by.

Jay every week, every month, the things he does, the way he handles some different ways, right, I mean, there's so much to be inspired by still to this moment, as a husband, as a father, as a businessman, as

He's a beautiful person. Digital our analog.

I'm liking. I'm liking digital now. I think that there's more to uh, there's more to play with on the canvas with digital, right, you know, I'm starting to get it.

I was I was an.

Analog ahead until recently, and now I'm starting to realize that the way that Travis Scott, you know, bends those notes and bends those basses and tweaks that the the the tuning.

I've always been a straight ahead singing. He's singing tune, you're playing tune. You know, you know you could have. I like the imperfections.

That's what I use live music mostly, and that's why I don't auto tune myself, because I like the imperfections of music. But I do think that the originality of what people are doing now with the sonics is pretty pretty I.

Always like analog because to me, music sounded better when we had to be in a room together, like right now, if we want to do a record together and I'm in du Ludolph, Germany and you could be in you could be in Austria or Australia and we can do it and we'll be on the same level. But when you're in that room, like like you said, with for a role, like when you're in that room seeing him make that magic, it makes you want to bring out the best on yourself. So that's the reason why I

Right that the culture of analog is really just the culture.

Of doing it together in the same space.

It inspired collaboration, Like collaboration, it expires different phrasing, It inspires like somebody like I know that some of those like the Drake and twenty one records, and you know, they have to be made in the same room because the way they're bouncing off each other and the way they're complimenting each other's verses and styles and they're changing up.

We're not just doing sixteen and sixteen and sixteen whatever it is. I think it really lends itself to a completely different and now it used to be we'd have the same lupe run for three minutes. All that it is over everybody's changing beats in the middle of the song, blah blah blah. You know so so, and this is great.

This is great for music, and it makes it more fun for the DJs and everything. So I think we continue to love the nostalgia of the old school, but we have to appreciate and embrace that.

You can easily put a plug into it's just because then you love what Bruno does. You know, then You're like, hey, Bruno, you know you murdered.

You know, the analog sound and the old school and great songwriting and strings and when somebody can do that, you know, you're like, well.

Here here, but but not everybody can do what Bruno, it can do with the analog.

Just so you don't wanted to correct you because you said the back and forth, so you can do back and wolf.

Yes, yes, yes, like I've done it before. You're right, I've done it before. I've never done it.

You know, I haven't done a livestream vocal. Uh yeah, collaboration session. You're right, but it does happen.

I mean, like you gotta realize all the technology is like available, it's available album right here.

But see just the way you that you said about movies.

How so maybe I want to envision twenty one and Drake in the studio.

I don't say it was start that I don't want. I'm saying. I'm not saying what they have done.

I'm saying I've done before where I had to go back and forth with Capone and uh he also the skeleton all of like you know, him saying such and such and he knowing I'm gonna say this and then. And we've been on the phone too a couple of times, like yo, send me a send me this, this, this, the leaders far open, leaders far open.

So it's been done before. So that's what I say. But I didn't say want to. It wasn't a missed the day. I did not say that. Okay, Okay, so we ain't take no shot for that, right, No, we're good. Yeah, Tory Lanez of the Weekend. The Weekend. Okay, this is Canada ship right there. Yeah, Canada connected. And you know what I like? I like I like that he uh it really shares his truth lyrically, do you know what I mean?

A lot of R and B or pop uh singers and they they try to just go for the hit a lot of the time. You know, he finds a way to make hits by really truly telling his journey and his stories.

And on the Weekend, Yeah that's right. Yeah, and he's got an amazing voice. Thriller off the wall. Oh that's a tough one. That's about. I can't but I can't. I don't want to say, but I'm.

Gonna go thriller Because the age that I was at, I had to go back to Off the Wall.

It was my older friends at Homie. You need to go back to Off the Wall Thriller. I was seven years old and the thriller Vivent.

It's no coincidence that thriller came out when I was seven, and at seven I decided I.

Wanted to be a singer. There's no coincidence. Why, Okay, you took a shot anyway, Yeah, I'm joining you. I joined. He's all kind of guy I have. I have a driver, so cool. Yes, I'm not driving. Thank you, Drey or Puff. You know Dre obviously as the producer as the one of the greatest producers in the history of music, one of the great But.

I've spent so much time around Puff and his family because of Andre Herrel, you know what I mean.

And I've been a part of that that culture and the party culture. What I love about what Puff does also is and what Andre inspired and they did together. What is celebrating all of these achievements together and continuing to lift each other up.

Not we're having a party and you can't come. No, we're having a party and everybody's coming, right, and we're all gonna be great, and we're all gonna lift up and we're all gonna take pictures together and we're all gonna support this movement that started, you know, with guys like Andre and Russell and Puff and Dr Dre.

Okay Al Green or Teddy Pinogram. Ah, I'm so weird love with you. It's gentle. Just go gentle, sleep gentle, and I'm a Teddy p Manda, you know what I mean. I'll turn the lights off. Don't get me wrong, we'll do that too, but do something about it that I just I go for Okay, this one right here, it's classic m J or Prince. That's that's the that's the big, the big question. When the jay z right like, that's the Yeah, that's the baby Jesus and the adult Jesus. Jesus, that's awesome.

So with Jesus going, I'm gonna I'm gonna go with Jesus, no wrong answer.

One of the great thing is they both taught me different things in different ways. Prince I learned my falsetto or I improved my falsetto by practicing. Prince that was because his control of his falsetto was extraordinary and unrivaled in some ways. So when I when I can sing a door and hit every note in the song.

You know what I mean. I'm proud of myself and Michael. I mean what. Michael was the pioneer of all things. And Prince was ill. He literally has asked out and nobody was offended and he was showing his head and he is. But whatever. I like this song, no one, no one places, no judgment, there's no judgment. I love this record. Did you ever link with Prince I did? I have some great Prince stories? Give us something we'd love Prince stories. I'm at one. Oh every time l A, okay, no,

At a club and Prince was there, somebody would come over to me and say, Princess here and he wants you to, you know, come say hi. And so I would come and say hi the first couple of times, but then he would just sit there all quiet and wouldn't talk, wouldn't say.

Now you're sitting next to him, you were just like you just kind of like say hi, And then he just wants you to sit there with him, do you know what I mean? Just be with me, you know, and hang and I'm like, I get that, but I'm you know, I want to go get wild over here.

And you on this witness stuff, you know what I mean. After he got back to the really most of yeah, I mean most of I think he was. That was the last twelve to fifteen years, yeah, window stuff.

And so so. So one night we're at one Oak and I go to the booth on you usually I with Richie.

He was shout out to Richie my boy, and Prince is there and he's got a lovely lady with him and another friend, and I say hi and we shake hands. And then I'm sitting there and he's just just doing his you know, sit still kind of thing. He's not even moving his shoulders or dance. I'm like, you you can dance, you as you're not even grow So I tell Richard like you you'll get the mic and tell the DZ to play a kiss, you know what I mean.

I just go, you don't have to be the fuck and I sing note for note the whole song.

So as he's sitting there, but after a few lines, he like leans over and he says then to the lady, like, who's that singing?

She goes, it's Robin. He's right there and he looks at me and he just goes on the next two minutes. Just make Prinson. You got a story, Michaels Prince Mo, I wrote Michael sang a song of ut. Yes, I wrote a song by Michael. Story is.

It was the day after the Grammys. It was Madonna and Ricky Martin. Uh, you know Ricky Martin. Ricky Martin comes out on the Grammys and has this big blow up.

Moment, right, he does a couple of life blah blah blah.

So the next day, Tommy Mottola is looking for a duet for Ricky Martin and Madonna. Right, Madonna wants to do a duet with Ricky Martin and Tommy needs the song. He calls Walter Afanasif, who was the producer of the Titanic Celindi on song and all of Mariah's first three albums.

So Walter.

And I had started a song a few months earlier, and so he calls me up and said, I got I got.

A call from Tommy Mottola. He's looking for a song from Madonna and Ricky Martin, and I think that song we started would be perfect for him. I'm in LA because it was the day after the Grammys. Can I come up to your studio? And we finished that song right.

So, the day after the Grammys, Walter Finasif comes to my studio, we finished the vocals on Fall Again. We send it to Tommy Mattola. Tommy says the next day, this is so good, I'm sending it to Michael see bypass Don and Ricky Marty sends it right to Michael. Michael loves it instantly wants to cut it. A couple days later, Tommy Mattola flies me to New York, puts me up at the Trump Hotel to write for Sony

Singing my song and I think I'm twenty one, you know, something like that.

And so Michael ended up releasing it on his History album, and he kept all my vocals in the chorus. So it's him singing the verses and him ad libbing, and it's all my voice on the chorus.

So I do it. That's crazy. I'll wrap up.

I'll wrap up my Michael Jackson's story with I was supposed to I had I had released when I Get You Alone, and he was a big fan of that song. Because I was doing Michael and so I was supposed to open up for him at the O two Arena on July twelfth and fourteenth.

My whole family was going to fly out from Canada and my dad was coming. They were about to book the tickets and Michael passed away. Yeah, so.

Stories stories, Uh, Otis reading or Sam Cook, I'm gonna go Otis.

Just because he had I had some kind of connection with his vocals and that I can explain. I think Otis might be in the end my very favorite singer. Hmmm, because there's the pain turned into.

Any particular, the open the Door, He's got a lot, Yeah, he just the way he sings is just there's something to own it.

Oh no, the classic what's the tri Little Tenderness? If you if you there's some footage of him performing Try Little Tenderness in the UK as this big, strong, powerful black man in the sixties for all these white kids, and it is it's very special to watch and the way he sings and the I mean, you feel something like the world has to change after a person like this sings like this in front of these people, the world has to change. Erica bad or Mary J. Blas,

Mary J. Blige and Joe to see and guy and that that was that was the.

Foundation of And that's when Andre Herrel came to my house. I was like, what he's Uptown Records all the thing for him?

Yeah, well he did with Uptown was incredible and then eventually with Puff and bad Boy, with with that.

All created was crazy. Yeah. The next one, uh D'Angelo, Blao D'Angelo.

I used to play D'Angelo albums first. When people would walk into my after parties. It would always start with D'Angelo. That was the warm upe.

You start with D'Angelo, now addition or Jackson five, you know, uh, for me generationally, it would be New Addition obviously, uh or obviously in my opinion catalog wise, you know, the Jackson five catalog is is so deep.

But I grew up in the New Edition era, and when they split, I had all the album. I had the Johnny gil album. I had their album Treasure Red album.

I had the B v D album, I had the you know, so there was there was the first back then definitely like we said, and then everything broke off and the remixes and the out in the style to the outfits the b he had. I had the backwards overalls with the writing. Absolutely that run that they've had. Absolutely no, That's what I'm saying even till now, but incredible.

TLCOR SWV.

Vocally SWV. Yeah, I would have.

For me, I would have because I'm a singer, you know, I'm a sang sanger. So when I think of Week in the Knees, like the people that I literally would sing and practice their vocals over and over again. TLC was more like these They're just the coolest, funnest and you jam along and they make they have the most incredible personnel these but the vocals of wu V really got to me.

Okay, loyalty or respect, man, that's a I gotta go both. That's the one time. God I got it for that one. You can't really have one without the other. Make goo for that. But I like that you can't have one without the other because you got to think about it, have one without what's that? Love and marriage?

Marriage, loyalty and respect. I always start out the Black album anyway is there? But we played this game all the time, and the thing is, that's the one time that we're not trying to be tricky. Is I think loyalty and respect is just hand in hand.

I think you.

I think you have to have both in order to exist. But yeah, so let's get now that we got that out the way, let's get to.

Blurred line. Oh God, to take a smoke break, you know what? Smoking cigarette in here? Man? I still want to do it on camera? Yeah, I just didn't want to do it. You don't want to do it on camera? Cool a little sugar yet, Okay, I'll do I'll do it. I don't want to get on camp all right, cool, cool, cool. I respect that. I don't want to let's go straight right into it. Sure got it, boy. Yeah, So I know we left off.

Very lines, but I want to get back to that because one of the things is, uh, the Malleable fires.

Yeah, how did that happen?

Well, it had started over on the other side of the hill in the valley, stamping in the valley, and it was b lining straight for our neighborhood during the night. So wife he was checking, you know, the updates and everything. And then around six thirty am, I got up to get ready to take my son to school.

I had a nine month old daughter and wife he was pregnant. So the fumes and the smoke that were coming were so bad that I was like, you know, we got to get out of here. I don't want any of us breathing this stuff, so let's just get out of here. So we started packing up.

And then around eight am, right when we were about to leave, it was a mandatory evacuation for the whole city, so we knew something was wrong.

So I went and grabbed my music. First.

I went and got the computer that you know, got that all the music, and I got my guitars. I got my dad's photo albums, loaded up everything I could into the car. I got a few suits, you know what I mean. And my son packed a bag. I was like, pack up. He just put like a pair of underwear in a book and I was like, dude, you better grab some cit.

But yeah, so we got in the.

Car, headed north to Santa Barbara and then went around to her family who's down in Huntington Beach and spend the night with them. And when we woke up the next morning, if somebody sent a neighbor sent us pictures of you know, are just rubble. The whole thing brubble, Yeah, just into rubble. The funny thing was I have a carport. The carport wasn't touched. I could have taken all the furniture. The only and the thing that really bugged was my piano that I wrote all of those songs on.

Yeah, that one hurs. But thanks shout out to Yamahab sending me a new one because the new one's supposed to be on the way.

That's that's what's crazy about California is you guys actually have earthquakes. You guys have fires, Like like like why is California, this beautiful place that you still stay at.

I think it's just seventy degrees every day. It's just like I remember Jimmy, I mean told me that. He was like, I moved out to.

Califoried but worked in, you know, New York my whole life. Then we moved out to California, and I was like, I'm never going back.

And I think some people have that.

You know, some people are die hard New Yorkers and some people are like, man, you know, the the New York struggle is hard to you know, and sometimes you looking for a little That's why a lot of New Yorkers like to go to Florida too, you know. But but there's nothing nothing makes you stronger than New York, you know what I mean.

And like my New York friends, I wouldn't be like I wouldn't have been able to handle Like when I need when I need shoulders, I call my New York friends, you know what I mean, and they know how to how to you know, give you that that pep talk and that let's get back to a game, you know what I mean. And sometimes I think that's uh, Californians were just wallowing that Sunshownny again. But you learn a lot from New York from New Yorkers.

But Vallible was one of my favorite places on earth. It's a retirement spot.

And I didn't realize that that that when I when I moved out there was because I had a son and this new lovely lady shout out aper love and uh, and I wanted to have a big family, you know, And so we had three kids and and it's beautiful and it's gorgeous, but also I really missed the the I used to live in the Hollywood Hills and I have Andre stoped by every couple of days and we'd smoke one and I'd pick up on some culture. He'd bring some friends by, get some new information, and that

Let me let me actually, because all right really happened in Miami was.

People had hurricane insurance, yeah, but not flood insurance, which was like like I remember, like me when I first moved out here, and it was some type of storm or whatever, right, I forget one of it is, but.

It was it was sandy. It was Sandy, Sandy New York. I thought that was no that went all the way and Katrina.

My studio. Yeah, so my studios people had hurricane assurance. That's how people got over. I mean, it wasn't getting over.

They've said, well, it wasn't the hurricane that caused damage to it. It was the actual flooding, which was the whole difference. It's mandatory now though.

Yeah.

Yeah, So when your situation happened, did you have insurance for that?

I got lucky. Yeah.

I actually about a month before, I was going through my bills and I called my business manager and I was like, why am I paying so much for insurance?

Right? And she was like, there's a lot of fires out there? Thank god.

Months later, Wow, thank god, I paid that bill. And you know, four years, four years later, in hindsight, I got a brand new home, you know, that I built for my kids and I built for I got my own little man cave outside with my fireplace and a barbecue, and I got everything lined up so the kids are right there and the players right there and the treehouse and all that.

So, you know, I think that you get through your toughest times.

But what was important to me, especially when that happened with my son, was just to show him how we survive as a family. That's when you have to lead by example and keep the laughs coming, keep the joy coming.

And let let them know that you're going to be okay. We're going to be okay, and tough times make us strong, you know.

And metaphorical rebuilding your home is just showing your kids, like, look, you just it comes apart, you rebuild it, and.

We have each other, Like really, let's focus on rat We're alive, we're healthy, we're together, and we have a home. We have a room, our heads. Sounds like a chain of events for I think house.

Oh yeah, I had a run, I had I got divorced, sued house, my father passed away, my manager passed away, my house burned down, and then Andre passed away. I lost all three of my my big brother father figures, you know, in a.

Couple of years now now me as you know, being a fellow entertainer. I always knew that I never got over my father's death, right, I never.

I never did. I never, Like I buried it with music. To tell the truth, I'll be honest.

I met the end of the day my father died, Chris Lidy came to see me as my manager who passed away, Chrislidiers love you, Chris, And he told me straight up. He was like, Yo, it's either we can get off of this tour house. On tour, I had a number one record as my father died, right, number one record, number one album in the country. Don't know what it means at this time, twenty two twenty whatever, but I remember him saying to me, like, yo, either we could get his money back or we can have stayed.

And in high that was the right decision.

It was you worked through that. It was the right decision. But later on in life, I could still feel that I never got over.

Yeah. So I mean as a person who lost my father to Obviously, my father wasn't as famous as your father was, but he was your hero. But he was. He was my hero. He was he was literally my hero. I hear you talking about your father, So how is that coping with this, how do you do? You will? I? I had three kids in a row. That was him working for you in heaven. No, no, no, you know what, I had to feel the void. I had to fill

How much as being a father changed the day to day business, I'm doing this.

Oh my gosh. Well, let's just say we don't drink tequila unless we're on drinks one.

But no, I think that, you know, if you're gonna get up at six thirty and be present, and I take.

My kids to school every morning, I'm I'm up at six thirty. I want. I like to be the first face they see.

I like to give them their muffins and their pancakes, and and I like to take them to school. And then once I know they're at school and they're loved and they're uh, they're they're feeling good, then.

I can go to my job, you know what I mean.

So that's that's I like to prioritize my day as my kids come first. They know the dead Dad loves them and got them to their thing on time, well sometimes on time, and then Dad goes to get his exercise or work on his music, blah blah, and then we finished.

The day as a family.

You know.

That was that was the one thing about you. I was super impressive. Off top was we know we do this a lot, and you were on time. You were three minutes early.

I was like, and then I've seen you had to sit together, you had to people coming out, they start filming you. I said, oh they yeah, I was very professional. I was out there like this out there thing. Watched it. You broke the blinds that could have been I don't know, but I looked and I was I was just so impressed. Because that's the thing about.

The business is a lot of us take ship for granted, especially earlier. And I'll tell you who taught me. This is one of my idols. His name is Leo cohnbes Yeah, and I could never beat Leo Cohens to a meeting. Never once could I ever beat him. Like I would try to come half an hour early and he'll be looking. I knew he was gonna try.

This and I'll come an hour early and he'll he'll always like, we'll have a meeting at f and he'll be there at one thirty. I'm like, look you're doing Like He's like, I knew you try to beat me. I'm saying.

To me that was always impressive, Like because you don't waste no one's time. Yeah, one person, Sime is so valuable and the fact I know what I mean, like fully knowing you, I know that you are a great person because it's a certain things about a person that I have to assess in fifteen seconds. You met every criteria, particular as I walk in my father's shoes. And he he loved people, he loved the business, he loved you know, just doing this whole thing.

Man. And I used to get scared when I was. I used to hold onto my music too precious, and so I wouldn't show myself. I would hide myself. And that's why it took me time to become a performer, because I just wanted the music to do all the talking. I didn't want anything else to matter except the music. And then that's with this Mass Singer Show has been so great for me because working with a guy like doctor Can and letting him make fun of me, letting everybody make fun of me.

It's really become my new superpower, which is I can laugh at myself and I can appreciate the things that I'm good at and what I can do, and then I can laugh at what I'm not good at and what I can you know what I mean. And that has really changed my life myself. I mean, because I don't know if I would have done this ten years ago. You know, I would have been too scared of anything that I didn't want to be known for or say. But I've become comfortable in my skin by being the butt of the.

Joke every once in a while. And it's relieving. It's really, yeah, it is. Now let's talk about sex. Therapy. Is sex your therapy? I think that the therapy comes in all forms. I think, you know, a little jay watching the sun go down his therapy. I think me swimming with my two year old son in the pool is therapy. I think it's all making sure that you balance enough of your life to get the joys of everybody in your life and all.

The experiences you can accumulate daily, weekly, and monthly. So for me, the therapy is really just a change of whatever I'm doing right now. The next happy thing is therapeutic. The next happy thing is that making dinner for my kids?

Is there? Do you know what I mean? I like to go to costcos. Yeah, I like to go to extent. I put on a mask, a little little sunglasses. It doesn't work. It doesn't work. You put on a mask, by the way. I love the mask, like because you know I want to be you mean COVID. Yes, you put that on now, like I mean, and then yeah, I put it on.

I go, you know, when I want to go somewhere to a hotel or something like that, Like I'll put it on, put the glasses on. But it's like it didn't matter because I'll be walking through and somebody black, what's up North? I did everything for you not to recognize me. And that's the first thing, Like it doesn't matter my eyebrows.

Robin Dick, I can't hold it bolls.

Okay, but all right, let's look, I got so much notes because your life, your life is really dope.

It's really dope. It's been interesting, it's been interesting. It's been interesting.

Still is so okay, let's let's get to magic. Okay, let's talk about magic for a second. How where was you at?

Well, this was this is when I was going through.

I had just had my first success, real success with Loss Without You and the Evolution album, and everything was happening very fast. I did Oprah a couple of times, and and you know, it was really feeling like, you know, I remember.

Paula at the time. She would say, we're not crazy, We're not crazy.

You know your music like people do like sitting there like thinking these songs are really good. And then you know, finally it reaches the people and gets that kind of response and you're like, Okay, we're not crazy, let's keep going.

So, you know, Magic was really about believing. And and also it was Paula.

Paula was becoming very successful and her and I wrote that song together. She came up with a lot of that wait what yeah, magic, Yeah, that's a lot of.

That's Paula on that.

Paula was great at being able to throw out lyrical ideas, you know what I mean. When I would get stuck on something, I'd be like, I got this great track, but I just need to I don't I don't know, I don't like what I'm singing over it, And she would come up with a little something and give me a spark, and she was amazing at that. So she, her and I wrote Magic together. I think some of it was based on remember the book The Secret, So the the the idea of the Secret is I got it,

Stuff like that.

We can make the future sign so bright, and we can make right now all right. So it was about the power of having magic and all of us to have a magic that we can change our lives, change our futures, and change our course.

By the way, that your record with Trey song was bad Girl with Tray Song, Bad Girl, you got so much hits.

He was that boogie with the hoodie I remember being a boogie record. I forgot Trey was on it too, that's by the way. That's like you went to the bathroom and I was just sitting there talking just now. It was like, yo, you forgot he had a hit record, Like who forgets you have a hit record?

That is a dope problem that well, that's a dope problem trade a little mad you don't even remember, but it's still a good problem.

That's that's because it was more recent. Yeah, it was more recent. And that was one once again digitals that was like where I wasn't with Bookie, So I don't have a studio experience.

I don't picture.

I wasn't there with Trey, you know what I mean. So when I hear it, I'm like, oh, yeah, that's right. So yeah, some of those things don't register as much when you have that visual.

That experience. Right, And you got a song called Brown Liquor. That's the new one with Gotti here Wagatti, that's the new one with got you know what's you know? It's so dope about you, all the accolades we spoke about earlier. Everything we spoke about was you went through to see your passion when you just played your new record, Do you still have that passion? I lost my shit a long time ago.

Like like what I'm trying to tell you is I don't want to say we have similar lights, but we have you know, I believe you forty five years old.

I'm forty five, just turned forty six. Oh don'tkay Dan, you older me By one.

But yeah, yeah, so soone you look at the years and the thing is our maya you still having passion like that ship because because this is the reason why I like a lot of times people ask me for a verse or they asked me to be a part of their music, and I'm kind of like done with that life.

Yeah, but it's a good thing and I'm done with that life.

What I mean by that is if I'm not one hundred percent, I can't do it right right, So I wouldn't waste nobody's time. But for me to see you just now, I just was I was doing my peripheral vision, so I didn't want you.

To know I was just watching you. But I was watching and when I seen your smile, come on the fact that you still have passion, yeah for music is but nomen no, well you used to have passion period because you have such a dope light. You have so much things and you can still I saw that smile. But you know what, I love.

I love the There's nothing better than love, and there's nothing harder than love, you know what I mean.

And so I always have something to write about always because I'm in love, you know what I mean.

And I love my kids, and I miss my dad, and I miss Andre, and there's so much love in my heart for so many people in my life that all I need to do is have the space and the choiet to tap into that love and there's.

Something to talk about, you know.

Now this song is more of a fun sex but in the sense the lyrics are still I'm talking about someone in particular and I'm saying I only.

Drink this liquor. And this is a long Empire Records.

Right I think this one the last album was with Empire. This is independent.

This is just with Me is an Empire independent as well?

Well, I mean this is it would be going through Empire as an imprint.

But not this particular song right now.

Yeah, yeah, because I'm actually I'm formulating the new album and looking for the new distribution deal.

But I want to have most of the album done, you know. I want to have the recorce like that. This is This was the teas like the teaser single, yeah, but teaser singles was not even I don't know if it's got you know, don't The radio hasn't quite picked it up, So I think it's going to be more of just an underground jam.

But I gotta act this because you said this is independent, So you paid for the video or did you get?

Yes? Did you get? You got to ask the question though, No, No, I I I'm going I got, I got a little money, but no, most of this is self finance, okay, self mind.

Yeah, because we have another famous question that we always ask, major or independent.

Oh well, I think for a young artist, a major label deal is can be very helpful.

I think you think today in today's environment, No, I mean.

I'm I think that there's just so many different outlets. But I do think that the support of a major label system. I do think that the deals need to be red reworked. Obviously, I don't think there's a there's fairness within the structure, but I do believe.

That I do miss the Jimmy Ivean roundhouse. That's what he misses. I mean, why when Jimmy Ivan.

Calls you at seven thirty in the morning and says, this is the best record you've ever made, It's going to be number one all over the world, and then it is right, you missed that.

I'm so sorry. It seemed like a practice answer.

No, no, no, I'm a big Jimmy ivan fan shout out to Jimmy ivanen Old.

The time I says, as long as you had a good deal, majors is not the problem. As long as you have a good deal, meaning like you negotiate what you want, right.

But I don't even think you mean that though, to be honest with you, a good deal, because I think you're talking for it to be to have a hit record.

I think yes, the artist that hell, I don't think a major. I don't think a major is good for a hit record. I think a major is helpful in the overall international, worldwide promotion of a brand new art.

If the labels behind you, that's always been our debaker, that the labels behind you. For every artist that had a great experience out of that label, there's ten below one hundred more. I'm just but yeah, a ton that didn't have it, they didn't have the label backing then.

But I'll tell you this, as an artist, there's no worse a feeling in the world. I know. Worst is not a word. I get it. It's a dream chance word.

It's a dream chance world. There's no worse of feeling and dropping a hit record. You knowing this a hit record and then not becoming a hit record that it hurts, and a major label gives you more of an opportunity for your dream to come to fruition. Because what I'm trying to tell you is like after a while, remember you make a hit record and then they say, well it's not as good as your last year.

You fell off, so you got to go in and make another hit record. And as an artist, when you give it to an independent who who's not familiar with the radio station in Atlanta, not familiar with there's one station in Las Vegas, you do the proper thing. You automatically added.

Well, that's what you made all that you went wrong already you said when you give it to an independent, you should be the dependent.

You shouldn't be given it to another independent label. No, I mean, I ain't mean that.

You're right, So okay, when you hire when you're independent, you have to hire a staff. You still have to try to do everything. A major label is to do it because you want that major label win. And boy, when if you if you don't have that great nothing like.

The machine, nothing like there's nothing like the machine. You can all agree to that we love you.

Jimmy's wherever you're at Kevin Leo's, Mike Kaiser.

Don't think work that.

Don't think that the work that you're doing at these major labels is going unnoticed. Because still I'm being honest, and this is what I recommend for every new artist. The first three albums, you go on to major, and then after they spend that twenty million hours on you, then you can spend that twenty million hours on yourself.

I would say backwards.

In today's in today's climate, you could go on through social media, don't do much and just to make whatever music that resonates with your audience. Get these followers and these likes or whatever you need to do. And the labels they're lazy.

Now they're not. They're not. They're not developing artists anymore. And you'll be able to control you can control you. You can have a better deal at a major. Use the machine, come up as an independent, and then come out of that machine a lot more whole.

But most of those records come from the streets, and the streets have the urgency and the and the that deserve the immediate attention of the listeners. You know what, right, Because when there's some fresh on the street, you know that they like when fifty was coming or these records are come and these artists are coming, you know, the labels.

Know and uh. And that's why I agree with you. I think if you, if you already have heat, but if you need the producers and you need the songwriters.

So you need, then the label is going to connect you with those. If you if you're Gotti's camp.

And you just got records and video directors and guys coming straight from the streets in your neighborhood, then you got to I mean, he's got a cash machine.

I think that's a greate example is fifty fifty had the streets already like did before it d independent god independent mix.

But when he got with that label, he got with it.

Was I've always said that he independent, so you can take advantage of the machine.

I think that he could have still been one of the biggest artists without them, but he became one of the biggest superstars with them, like he became Like I love looking at Tony Yale's Instagram and seeing these motherfuckers in places I can't pronounce.

And they just sitting here. I love that ship. I'm like like this is this is it? Like because I saw it from the beginning. So again I love this argument. Just to give a quick analogy, super independent.

The quick analogy I would give is like you're a small business owner doing it on your own and you're you're you're succeeding at us. You reached your your ceiling of success, but you're succeeding, and now you can go to the bank and ask for that credit line that's like a million dollars. You know, that's what That's what the labels are. They're they're credit lines. You know they're they're bad. But but you also no, I mean with experts, I want to appreciate it.

And because as we've had the owner to work with the other people below the CEOs, there are great.

Video heads, marketers, marketers, there are great there are people with can've worked under some people that know how to talk to people that the artists can't. Absolutely and the artists can't get on the phone and hold a conversation with the marketing team and with the blah blah blah team, and you know, and so.

They need those teams to go out into the world for them and and do the talking for them. So I think it's their strength in numbers, you know.

What I mean?

And you you can do as much you want to do, as much as you can individually. Even me is And now I say I want to write the song.

I want to. I want to try to do everything on my own.

Now, if someone else comes in and has a better idea or wants to make it better, I'm all for it. I've got to generate the magic from scratch and then the other.

Things will come. You know what I mean? You know what else?

The problem is to you get to a certain lifestyle that the label has provided for you.

He cannot dumb that. That's hard. Like that's what you really understand about. That's hard? You like that? Like that?

Like on that one I watched him pull up and I said, see that's recolation with ship, that's recogetion, recolletel.

Ship down. You would like. What I'm saying is if you were to sit here and just to say, as he pulled up, was he major Independent? You would know? You would know off top listen he's rolling like a major. That's because I got it. I'm on the TV shows. That's where the car money. By the way, that's hilarious. I love that. Holy I got man more truth.

Okay, I wrote for Brandy, you wrote for brianan Knight, You wrote for Christina Aguilero, You wrote for Color.

Me Bad, Oh Man, color Me Bad? What did you write for them their second album? I was sixteen and.

I was working with Tricky Stewart and their second album. Tricky was working with them, and I wrote a song called sexual Capacity or something like that that ended up being their single off their second album.

Ninety eight Degrees. Yes, I wrote a song with Brian McKnight. Actually, we wrote a song together that ended up on ninety degrees. Mark Anthony Jordan Knight. Now, Jordan was a big, very important part of my musical development.

I'll tell you why. When I signed to Interscope with John McClean and Brian McKnight and Jimmy Ivy in that team at sixteen, they had just signed John had just signed Jordan Knight as a solo artist coming off of the New Kids on the Block. So John was very New Kids on the Block, right, So Jordan I was the lead singer New Kids. So Jim John's like, I

And my first hit top ten record was a baby you Know I Can Give It to You, which was produced with Jimmy jam and Terry Lewis. Wow and so amazing. One the amazing thing.

About Jordan what he did for me because they thought I was a great songwriter, but I wasn't a producer. I wasn't a real producer yet, so Jordan took me with him. That's how I met Walter afanassy if I got to work with Raphael.

Sadik right after he worked with D'Angelo.

I got to work with Teddy Riley. We got to go see I mean we literally went. I got to go, Oh, Jimmy, Jamey, Terry Lewis. I got to go from the best producers camps in the world at the time and learn from all of them.

When I was eighteen years old. How did they treat you? Were they? Because I could sing and write? They you know, I always got that kind of a oh they you would know they were just like this kid's got talent. You know, he wouldn't be here if he didn't, you know. So I was very lucky.

But as far as they were concerned, as long as you come up, you come up with stuff.

So when you come up with a great chorus and Jimmy sitting there doing the baseline live, Jimmy Jam one of the most incredible musicians, I mean, Jimmy Jam, and I learned so much from Jimmy. Those sessions with Jimmy were just life changing for me as a producer, Brian as a vocalist, being in the studio session with Brian learning how to do harmonies and record them, and then being in the studio Jimmy Jam. And this is all by eighteen years old, so I was blessed. We talk

I got to work with Maya on her debut album or I think it was maybe a second album. We did three songs together Pink. That was again from the Tricky Stewart sessions. It was a song that we just wrote and then Pink ended up cutting it because that was the La Face. That was when Ellie Reid and Babyface were still together at La Face and they were feeding le Face songs.

In La was putting them on his different artists, So I can't. And then so as i'm you know, going through your discography, there's a there's a straight up song. I thought it was like hitting, but it's a straight up song called Cocaine. Yes. Straight. It's a good one too. It's good. It's a great Ocaeka. People gonna cut it. Look came So I'll say this just for fun because the lyrics this is this is a true story. You're like a true story, Beverly. He so tell for me

Because we are not richly profilaus to guys.

He used to be like other than this Sugarhill gang. There was no one that ever said said that.

Actually, I think I remember when we were going to release, the label said that there was some challenges. They wanted me to change the title, and.

Then they realized. Then they realized that Eric.

Clapton had released a very famous song just to notice that.

So then then they let it go. They let it go White. That was sugar white. You know, he's not like he says, coke. I think it's called flash and furious. Yeah, it's called cocaine. You can't pat in the word cocaine, so you could just call it right, you can't, right, Well, I don't think so not own throw the label. So you make this record and the label comes to you and says, probably I.

Don't remember, I mean label, you know, a manager called somebody says that there we're having an issue with the song tel cocaine.

Obviously I was coming. Your father was on. Yeah, my dad's a growing Pain's dad. And I'm still trying to pitch market me as a as an R and D exactly the soul singer, slash pop.

Star or whatever, trying to market me as when and so I just h I said, well, I don't really want to change the song title. I mean, it's kind of what the song's about.

It's about cocaine, and you know, I had never tried it, and it was really about the culture that I was seeing.

As my presence in young Hollywood, and how much I saw of it and how much it scared me. And so it's all about the fears of I don't want to be the only one who's not doing it, and I don't want to be you know, but you're you're It's really about the peer pressure of being around movie stars and models and all these things and everybody's doing it, and you know, you don't want to be the only one.

You don't want to be the you don't be.

The proved one of my first uh times in California. I'm sitting up there and I didn't know how much of a commodity having cigarettes was for this community.

And the God comes I ain't a community. God comes up to me, said go for Newport you and then you sold it to Diego.

But by the way, by the way, guys, I'm green, and I'm like just coming to Ali.

I don't know.

So I'm looking like what he's like, yo right now, and I'm like, holy ship. And then I didn't realize. And then I realized I was the only one in the party.

That wasn't a little neck okay, But I felt like that that's that's that was ill for you to like say that. You know what I mean, I feel like be up up front. I think I think that was like genius. I think, yeah, very much. Well, I mean the things, like I said, I always just try to say what I'm going through. And that's why my songs are very.

Chronological, you know, like what I wrote and my album titles, it's all what I.

Was going through literally at the time. You know, Love after war, sex therapy, Oh, I got that. I got all my notes, Love Knows the evolution. There were all literal.

Periods of my life, you know. So all right, now let's get the blurred line. Okay, I can remember I can remember me hearing about this lawsuit. Yes, the record is phenomenal.

You know.

I started well, I don't want to say I started with Forrell, but my second album, my big is oh yeah, what what what? What super Doug was with Forarrell? I seen how he works and I seen so when I listened to it, because we listened to it today. We listened to Marvin Gaye's record, then we listen to your record, Then we listened to Blurred Lines, then we listened to getting back to back back to back. I can hear with Pharrell didn't sample he you know what I mean?

Was doing was doing wrong by showing love? No? I mean you know we uh.

I mean there's been so much said about it that there's not I don't know if there's anything new I can really say.

You just knew you could say. So. The fact is that my respect level of Pharrell's abilities and the fact that I was lucky to be in the room and he chose to write a song. The thing that the genius about him is he will look he literally wouldn't have written that song for anybody else. Wow, Or I mean I helped write it, of course, but you know the mastermind that he is. If any other artist is in that room, he won't write. He's not going to write that song.

He looks at me, my energy, the way we are, the thing he thinks I'll sound good doing blah blah, blah.

It's all his mind works.

On many different masterful levels at the same time, and he knows exactly what he's trying to conceptualized for this particular artist, different from Ed shar and different from Timberlake, different from North. He knows this person, I'm going to do something completely different than I've.

Done for anyone else. That's what we got. It's it was, it's still it's still you put it on live.

When we do the live shows, people go nuts as soon as and so all we really wanted to do when we got into music was do what we love and make people feel like that. So I no matter what has happened since or in hindsight, this feeling it still gives people right in front of my face is worth everything.

It's It's like I say this story. Were on drink Champs a couple of times when I met James Brown. First thing James Brown said, because they came They came up to him and they must have told him, like his nephew or someone.

He didn't know what the funk I was. So he's like, that's Noriega, he's a rapper, and James mind looked up. He said, keep sampling my ship, get a five a selfie. But but what it is is.

Those pioneers. They understand that we want our music to live on forever. And it's something that I had to deal with because I hate when people sample my music.

I can't stand it. I'm sorry, I know that's being petty. Yeah, you are being petty on that that I don't like it what you picked them up for saying keep sampling ship? Yeah, but I don't like it.

But I'm saying we've had George Clinton, so this doesn't become an issue afterwards. Let's clarify that none of us would ever speak for Marvin Gate or his intentions. We are we are pontificating because we're reflecting our own feelings.

Say partificated, Yeah, what does that mean? Just yeah? Projected you and I how we feel about how we feel.

Yes, and we are insinuating that Marvin might have felt the same way.

We do not know. Let's make sure like this, but without any confusion, we're not telling any other artists how to feel about somebody being inspired by our sampling their music, et cetera. To me in my own world, if I if somebody did a similar and it was inspired similarly by my sound or music or vocals, I wouldn't have the same response person, So I can only speak for myself. I want to make sure that we didn't have to and get it thank you speaking yes, yes.

Please, I mean because you know and and also I want to, you know, say like there's certain records that they do as I do, like.

Like like like like girls girls do my record over. That is God the very Maybe I took that part out, yeah, maybe take the learner. And maybe speaking for was hard. We don't want to say baby was hard. There's a couple of others.

I don't want to well, I mean there is the situation where the estates get to listen to it and.

Approve it is you're going through those channel.

It's different because the person themselves none of that music that they sample in, so the feeling for you is different. Yes, and so if you actually do my record over trying to pick me up, you're actually not you're actually doing well. But let's get let's I love that. But guess what, Guess what, Guess what? Guess guess what something that I had to notice. Have you ever seen, for well, post one of those remakes?

Not once? Because you know what I think me and him don't get we don't get what we deserve.

So when a person samples our record and don't have to go through us, I can't understand it.

Yes, like he said, like he said, so so yeah so.

Sometimes so sometimes I do like when they sampled it, and sometimes I don't.

Have you ever been sampled? And I have been sampled. My favorite version, or one of my favorites, was Drake and one of his early mixtapes, did Teach You a Lesson? One of my songs? And he sampled Teach You a Lesson?

And then that's the same record that a Boogie with the Hoodie sample is teaching a lesson?

Did you feel like Nori?

I'll tell you a funny story when when I just because I love I love a boogie with the Hoodie, Uh, that's my man. But when he sent me the first version and here I wrote, this song is such a sweet, intimate and like the first few lines were so hard, That's what.

I'm talking about.

So so I did.

I kind of hit him. I kind of hit him up, and I was like hit my manager too, And I was like, you know, maybe he could just lighten up the beginning a little bit so we could sink into it, you know, and he was cool, he didn't mind just kind of adjusting it out of respect for the okay, you know, it was it was only just the It was like the entrance to the record and here because I'm hearing my music, you know, and I'm like, and

People sample sometimes sometimes it's the record about my.

Father and him passing away. Yeah, and that's so when when when? When?

When when people come on there and then they joyful about this record? Like that wasn't my intention. Like I cried this whole session, laying this down. I had literally tears in there. And you taking this record and you making it over a happy way.

I did so so so I don't like that sometimes, But hold on, I got come on and blurred lines.

We got through that, right, Yeah, lost without you. You already answered that question without me, which one is without me? Oh no, I'm talking about about me. Actually, I was like, I remember that sound.

So many these questions I was asking you, I have on my notes you already answered earlier. Yeah, we got a good loss without your story.

Yes, and you have you have a passion for Latin music here, Oh yeah, I mean I actually listened to uh, you know, Salsa and Boston Nova when I when I exercise or when I'm relaxing. Like though, maybe it's because I don't understand all the words too, and the music is so good that it takes me away and I don't focus on all the words as much.

Well, what salsa art is you like? Oh? I like the old school.

Stuff, you know, Cecily Cruz, And I mean I just have like the Apple playlists and I just it's it's just a great backdrop.

For me to But I have Louis Bonfa is one of my favorites.

He's one of the originators of Brazilian guitar, Like he came before Joe Beam. So once I got into Joe Beam, then I got into Louis Bonfa and he has a playlist that's just and I love the But if it's a social clubs.

Yeah yeah, And you said Cuba, you know, yeah, you know what I'm saying.

So this is something I've been runner in this whole time. You came in with your shirt off, but your chest is red, but your face is not.

I'm irish. What the hell is going on? Is it rare a little red? It's because I've been playing tennis and ship you're taking your shirt off playing tennis? Is I know? I was in Cabo and that's what I took.

I took wife you the Cabo last week and we got four days and I got burnt.

Okay, Okay, she got burned too, So it was a team burnt. Okay, we're making noise for team burns, team burn Hey, you know a family, a family that burns together and stays together. So what what? What? What I mean?

I'm gonna be honest with you, man, just to see you in person and to see like, like, your story is amazing man, Like you know the stuff you've been through in life, stuff that you navigated through life, even when you say like a sad days to be covering.

This an amazing life to me. Like I'm sitting back saying, whoa, but is there something that you feel like you didn't do yet? Oh? You know, I would have liked I would have liked my dad to have been around with the grandkids more to see the grand kids. Yeah, I think when I think of.

Myself, I've already had so much, and I still feel like at this moment, I have so much. I'm so grateful, And I have this great theory that you can't simultaneously be grateful and feel anything negative at the same time.

It's impossible. You can't do it.

If you're grateful, you can't feel envy, you can't feel jealousy, you can't feel rage.

You're grateful.

The only thing you can be is gluttonous. So I try to make sure my I put my gratitude forward.

Most of my day.

I get anxious in the mornings. I worry about all my kids in their future. I have trouble sleeping. I worry about the day, the week, the bills, you know.

Paying for private school for the next fifteen years for four kids or whatever. All these things make it hard to wake up, you know, or make it hard to sleep. But then I just before I even get out of bed, thank you, thank you. I'm so sorry. They're healthy. Here, I'm getting out of bed.

I'm still here, you know, because because the things that I that I had, like my dad and Andre herrel that my go tos are gone. You know, so my not and my manager or my new go tos are my kids and my lady and the friends I got, and and then it's just being grateful for those people that are still here that I.

Get them, you know, and I got them. Is there anybody you ever tried to work with that didn't want to work with you? I'm sure, But you.

Know, I've always probably I believe that that's why I've never asked for help. And maybe it comes from my dad not helping me right from the jump, like when I needed that grant and he was like, yeah, don't need everybody.

You know.

He always told me if I was writing a good song, he said, now you need to learn how to produce. And if I was producing, he said, now you should learn how to play guitar. If I was learning guitar, is it now you should learn how to do hard resourceful. He was always trying to make sure that I had enough resources because he went through the same experience. He had some ups and downs in his career, and when they when he had an L took an L on one of his shows or whatever, he almost got canceled.

I'm gonna make sure I have everything lined up so they can't kick me out or make me feel like I was kicked out. You know. I saw an interview that ETV.

He posted it, but it's an old interview with you and him, I think on the set of Yeah, and he looked he just seems so proud of you, and he was.

He It's funny how he was always trying to get me to be better and do better. And that's what I remember. But then you hear how much he was telling all of his friends, all his friends. Tell me, now, oh, your dad was always talking about you, always bragging about you always, you know.

And that's how That's how our parents are. You know.

They challenge us, but they're usually out there bragging about us the whole time.

Also, so I'm not gonna lie. It seems like because they say Jamaica has got the most jobs, whose dame? My dad was definitely Jamaican. My dad was definitely is definitely part Jamaican.

So now let me ask you, you know, me. I've been making music since nineteen ninety seven. I've been all over, all over, I've been places, and there's always like certain fans that come up to me that look nothing like me, who are nothing like me, and they'll come up to me and they'll be like, what's up, normal, and they'll actually know my story? What's what's one of the craziest stories of fans ever came up to you and just like and just like.

Talk to you and just like and you were like, you're looking at you you like me? Oh, you mean like like somebody that I really like? Old people always regular fan, regular what's the crazy interaction with a Reglar fans? Oh? Man, I wouldn't even know. Your life is too dope. It's just it's no, it's just like no, no, because it's it's been fun.

The different age groups, like you know, first of all, ninety percent of my audience is black women, Black women like you coming to my show.

There's a few scattered Pepperdin like Gary Owens.

You know what I mean, Like, yeah, I don't, I don't get a and so like if I walk through the airport, let's say twenty thirty percent white people recognize men black people would recognize me, you know what I mean.

And that's how for me. And that's even if I make I call everybody, walk by somebody, I'm like, well, you know what I mean, we know each other, you know what I mean. So and the beauty, and that's what I mean is that I'm not I.

That is my brother, that's these are, this is my culture, this is my fans, this is these are my my godfather, my mentor, and my ex wife. But you know what I mean, there's nothing in my life that hasn't been me being a part or wanting to be embraced and appreciate black culture.

You know. And and so that when I walk it, I live it. And that's why I think it's possible for all of us to walk and live with that kind of harmony. You know. Damn I love that so much. I tell you the truth. You know.

That's that's one of my friends over there, that my friend diego and I use his white privilege.

I'm just I'm just being honest. Like if we go outside, we jogging, I'm like, they go in the front, they ain't gonna hit you in the car and then go around this motherfucker Like yeah, we were outside at night time.

They're going around him and listen. No, I said this story on Dream Chances before, but I remember this. I was probably still at the highlight of my rap career.

Whatever, right, still rapping. We're in Amsterdam at a bar. Already sounds good. It actually gives me a little wicked though. So I walk out. I'm the platinum artist, I'm the guy who got us all here, were here. I walk out. They stopped me, say you can't bring that beer outside?

Sir say all right, cool, no problem, go to Smoer cigarette, smooth s cigatta at a time. They go clearly picked up both of the beers and walked right out. And we did that six times the whole night, and every single time the man stopped and let him you cannot drink out here.

And I could have easily been like, listen, listen, oh yeah, why you.

Had the moments where we're like, you know what the fuck? Like I could have easily been like, you know what? The fun and I was just like, you know what, I still win. My beer is still outside.

You think, yeah, you think you did something.

I still get my beer outside, and I swear to God, so uh yeah, because no, that's that's real. Like me thinking about it to this day, it still actually hits me. It hits me because you know what I grew up. I grew up in Queens, and in Queens, you literally cannot be racist.

Let me tell you why. Your neighbor's wife, your other neighbors for the pino, your other.

Neighbors Haitian melting pot, your other neighbor's Russian.

This is for Queens. We are the United Nations of everybody.

If you're Chinese, I literally would come home at night from from where I live, I would smell Chinese food, Russian food, Hatien food, Filipino food of course, Puerto Rican food, have Puerto Rican, and then soul food. God damnit, Jamaican food. I was outside eat jamaking food already.

It was outside.

I already eat you making foods. But literally, literally you can't be racist. So is that something that you have to ever navigate through? Like you know, I'm paying around with my white friend like saying that, But it's something that literally we do you sometimes at certain points, I do use them.

I do, I say, you go, I know, I know.

Is that something you have to have to go through for your one of your friends for us. Clearly you have black friends.

Oh yeah, I mean I just I just Oh I do remember a scenario. Yeah, when I was with I was about fourteen, and I was with my singing group Buddies, and they had a girl at a mall out and you know, an hour out of town or something, who had to hook up on a discount of some clothes or something.

Right, so we were going to go raid the store and get the fifty percent discount. Blah blah blah. Right, So I'm in my basketball uniform from my prep school. It even says Montclair Prep on it.

Wow, and we run in. We come out to the stories with clothes. We get in the car and the two police cars show up. It's you know, maybe they're just closing hours, right, cops pulled me. It's me and my three in my singing buddies, my singing group, my three black friends.

And they pulled me out of the car.

And asked me and pulled me aside and asked me if I was safe and if they had been kidnapped and if I mean.

Fun literally.

This is they brought me here to get free closed my boy.

They teaching me how to say and I was so offend. Then that's when the white offended gets it. That's where the Karen kicks in. How tere you? These are my friends. I'm polling my mother right now. I'm probably my mother and Sherman Oaks, and I want you to get on the phone with her. Oh it's when the white boy kicks in and we have an attorney, I know two attorneys. I'll see you at coast of Mexic corn. Yeah. No,

Love the big cities because at least more influence, more information, more cultural difference is more and more more.

And I have this theory that whatever a family does, patriarch or a matriarch, they just don't want this in their family. Whatever it is, I just don't want that. I'm not going to have that in this house. I'm not gonna have that. It always shows up, of course, well it always shows up.

Whatever thing, whatever you whatever, your grandfather was afraid never wanted to happen in his family.

Oh, it's it's in the kitchen now. It's making right, you count on that. Yeah, it's making it.

And I think that's the beauty of that's the work of God in some ways. You know, we need to keep If your mind is that closed and your family's not moving forward, and you're not opening your heart and your mind and your spirit, then something is going to force you to open it or close it forever. But something's going to happen in your family or your life. It's going to open you to force your heart. So let me ask you to force you to open your heart.

Let me is probably one like serious, serious question I'm gonna ask, right, Like I said, with the story of one friend, like literally I had the best idea. I was like, I'm not going to let this guy ruin my vacation or ruin well I'm not doing right. But at that same time, you know, there's black children that's getting killed every single day by the hands of the police, and you have mixed children. And I remember one of the illest stories I ever heard what Steve Rifkins telling me.

I don't. My kids are pretty fair, okay.

And and because I grew up with all of these being pulled over experiences. That wasn't the only time my friends were pulled over. We were We would be on our way to my father had a place out in Santa Barbara, and I'd be driving with my friends and we just get pulled over and have to get searched out, you know what I mean. Luckily none of them spoke. I just before I ever smoked weed, and they were singers. But we get pulled over just for being black for most of us.

Then I started, man, we got pulled over for being black. Somebody slapper, somebody slapped this white boat. Please, it's wrong with this young man.

But yeah, No, I grew up because I was always around the culture and and and and all my and most of my friends were black. That yeah, I experienced it all the time, and I would be the first I remember fighting my extended family.

My dad was very open minded. My dad wrote jokes with Richard Pryor. You know my dad managed Felippe.

Yeah, he worked one of the early He would sit any We always bragged about it and said, you know, I would just uh, I could get him going and say, hey, mud boone, what did you do with that girl last night?

Oh?

Let me.

Then Richard would go on his rants and but they would have these writing sessions, and so my dad always felt felt like he was a white man in the midst of you know, black culture in some ways. And I respected his open mindedness and my mom saying, uh, you know, had her hit with a black man. So I literally come from an open minded Hollywood hippie you know type family.

So that gave me the right perspective to to grow into that world. Man.

That dope answer I ever heard, because like, you know, I got just like I'm somewhat of a therapist, right.

You saying you're somewhat of a therapist or a comedian Clearly I didn't make the right choice in friends. Clearly they just laughed. They just laugh.

No, But what I'm saying is, what I'm saying is I assess people I have to like. And what I'm trying to say is man like, I like, we went through your lisography.

I have never seen like so much. Stories just keep popping up and it's like, wow, how are you? How are you not? Insane?

How are you not Britney Spears halfway your your hair cut off and insane? One the weekend?

You know what I gotta say, Good woman, This good woman will do that for you. He is called I'm going home at night myself, sir. Yes, yes, good woman.

You know she'll just should make you think the right way and make you clean up what you need to clean up up, and make you respect what needs to be respected and and uh and if you love that woman.

Enough, you'll you'll get it right. Okay. So I mean that's my next lyric. Can we can you guys send me that? Yeah, right now, you got I'm gonna turn that into falsetto. I'm gonna turn that into something falsetto. Listening to the album and I want you, I want you. Please don't cut that part out. No, no, no, got you, No, no, that part of the one points.

But I get home, but I want to ask you as as a And I met Porter before I met with shot him.

Yeah, oh love, shot shot him. Shot Damn.

I don't even know because I still go out there. Well I can say it, so whole house amountable. I met her, probably one of the sweetest women I ever met. Everyone say one man garbage is the next man's trash or whatever. That's not what I'm asking. What I'm asking is to me from the outside. Can Yeah, one may be sent look like a perfect woman. Did you mess that up? Or you know that's that's one of those things. No, no, no, because we already went over this. It was there's a growth,

We're not she's working twelve hour days. I'm working twelve hour days, we're in different cities.

We didn't see each other for six months of the year for a few years in a row, even more maybe, And that that takes a toll, you know, it just naturally it takes a toll. And you and I think that doesn't matter how much love.

And respect you have. Sometimes time apart, you know, breeds different lives, two different lifestyles, two different lives to different thought processes, you know. And I just think we had it all and and we grew apart. Is the is the nicest way to put it. Man, I'm taking a shot for you, not for that forgot. I'm just saying, and I don't. And honestly, in hindsight, it was the best it was. It was the right thing. Like, there's no regret there, if that's what you're asking.

What I'm you know, what's the best thing about it is regardless he was right wrong, in between whatever, you didn't have a messy breakup to us outside looking at it, Yeah, yeah, I looked at it like it was amicable.

Well, you must have missed a fut stories I was trying. Honestly, we're way past all that. Her and I are excellent co parents.

She's an amazing mother and I got you know what you there's luck in picking or being able to start a family with a woman of that quality. I know that my son has a great influence for the rest of his life. She has a great mother. She's a great mother, and so there's only positive things have come out from that sense.

Damn man, God that he answered everything supposed to be a good way. That's where I only feel that way that's got matter is how your son comes out of And.

One thing that that we can say at the time, she didn't want to have any more kids and I wanted to have many, And that's a that's an important factor in a relationship.

You can here, no, I want it was different women. That's Nick Cannon here. I don't know what's going on. This is my friend. I cannot you at just wit you are all here busting in every day a TV show.

She sees the What I love about Nick is there's he's got this bulletproof you know sense about himself, like he's just he's one of the most hard working, he's a great, one of the most helpful to his community, to everyone around him. Like he is just a solid upon solid so we all are laughing and enjoying this. But you know, him and I have had a serious conversation, like I am devoted, have devoted my life to my four kids. You get your spread yourself in and you do have a big heart like him.

And you are a great.

He's such a great guy and and you know it's it's hard to give all of that love that he has to everybody, you know.

So we have spoken about that. But if anyone can do it, Nick Cannon can't. Let's take a shot to n anybody can. If anybody can do it, you can, Nick.

God, Damn God, damn Nick Cannon. Whatever, Nick, wrap it up, super Nick.

We love you. I get to play. Were doing it? Yoh on my one man? I got, I got, I got Okay, I still need a smoke breaks look at the picture. Okay, Yeah we can wrap it up. Okay, we spoke about love at the walk. I'm good. I think as long as it's okay, as long as he takes this, that's a fact. Yeah.

I had this Yugoslavian billionaire fly me out to this southest south of Spain, to Barbia, right to work on his daughter's album.

She was like fourteen years old, and and that was the first time I ever smoked cash. Half this fantastic. You know you're still listen, you still owe me. You gotta smoke, No, no, you gotta smoke. I know math, Yeah, yeah, I know math, math too, and I know what I agree change it. I know math. Math. It's getting there yet, bet I'll tell you about it. Oh what's your what's your? What's what? What do you like more? Making the record or performing the record? Oh? They both have their joys

The creation of the record is a connection to God. It's something that is between me and God. The moment I'm at the piano, something's happening, the feeling comes.

Through you, the words start to come through you.

You know you're connected to something that's larger than you in some way. Because it's going to become larger than you. Somebody else will hear it, someone else will feel it. Ause you know it's that good. I don't feel that way about most songs. I do feel that way every once in a while, I'm writing a song and I know what I'm writing, and I know that it means that much to me, and if it means that much to me, it's going to mean that much to someone else.

The feeling of being on stage is the feeling.

Of community, of state, of family, of friendship, of connection. It's the It's the moment where you are connected to the rest of the world.

But the creation is go straight up. The performance goes straight out and comes back. You know what I mean. Deepest ship ever.

By the way you're a party to only gets worth both that you are you are you are drinking and getting deeper.

I'm trying to trick you and it's not working well.

I spend a lot of I'm working on myself, for better or worse, and that's what That's what the evolution of Robin Thick and a Lot and my last album was called On Earth and in Heaven because it was about the people. It was about losing Andre and my dad, the people that are in heaven and the people that are still here. So I'm constantly working on my place in this world, my place in my family, my place within myself. And that self analyzation sometimes makes you get stuck,

So I try to balance it too, because as I'm hearing you talk, it just sounds like you work work, work, work, work work. What does a vacation I feel like even when I'm on vacation.

I got my headphones, yeah, and my lyric pad, you know what I mean? Because that that means because it doesn't It just doesn't come enough. It doesn't come as much as it used to. I don't have as much time, and I don't I don't have as much space for creativity, thank you. So I try to remind myself to be ready for that lightning bolt, because that when that lightning bolt comes it usually I usually write the song in five to ten minutes, and the all the other ones

It can at times, it can.

It can be a way to create some separation or space when I need it, because I I really do wake up every day trying to give to either give to the art, give to the family, give to your give to just give more than you ask for, you know what I mean, And then you end up receiving a lot because you're giving more than you're asking for.

I don't know you're gonna leave, So let me ask you. They said a great artists have to go through pain. Is that something that you feel like you have to go through in order for you to make great music? You have to go through? Yeah? I think that. Are you a masochist? Because you know what we talked about this earlier.

I think that I I don't mind swimming in it because I know that I'm I'm swimming in it for a purpose, for an end game. I'm swimming in it to make something from it that will make me feel better and will make others feel better, and because I've I've gotten to have that connection with the evolution.

That album was so personal.

Every lyric on that album was me literally trying to find myself, get through the fact that I had a failed album, and and everything that I that everyone told me was gonna happen didn't happen. We had this whole peak that was supposed Jimmy Ivy, Andre Herrel Puff Day, Naomi Campmel's at the sorry here comes the album, you.

Know what I mean?

And then so two years later, I'm doing yoga, I'm going through all, I'm doing therapy, I'm trying to figure and all that evolution of Robin Thick album was based on who am I if I'm not a star? Who am I if I'm not famous? Who can I love myself if I don't make it?

And that that's why that album ended up resonating with a lot of people, because who are you if you're not important?

I related to that so much. Let me just say tell you something. I had an album called Melon Flood the Hustlers, my first album. I feel like Prel had like the most part, like he did like seven records. Every other album probably did one or two. Unflint the Hustle came out, did three and a half mics in a sauce. If you don't get four mics, you don't go go, don't go platinum. I've went to a stated depression. It's it's like the third time I heard you say, I had an album that didn't work, and it was

Well?

No, I think that I think that some things are too soon, some things are you know, before their time. And and that's with the beauty of art.

Is it a great movie and a great one of your songs will end up on a thing and it and then it gets another life for him and and and and it's only supposed to be appreciated by those that are that.

It reaches, you know, and we can't reach everybody all the time. I'm sorry, I'm taking another shot. I'm sorry. You gotta be wropped up like the going on.

I'm just being honest because I heard I heard him saying that, and he said it three times, or maybe even more than three times, and you're like, yo, I how to artist? And the thing is, we still got to come outside when you have something that to the people's perception. Instead it didn't come out, and it didn't come we still got to come outside, and we still got to smile. We still have the smartestie being entertained of fameous going to you went too bad?

Are you doing it? I got so.

I appreciate you being so honest and being so humble about it saying that because we still got to be who we are. And these people thought that we had a failure moment, right right, So the fact that you kept saying that all night. One, you're not avoiding it, You're saying it straight up.

And then two did this.

Because my album that people thought fail eventually went eventually went platinum.

I love this, it eventually went platinum. So this moment you're setting me up perfectly. We're talking about my first album. I believe my first album is my greatest artistic achievement.

Wow. Did you believe it then? Though?

And I did then and we all did and I still do, and and the fans and the friends and the and the peers. The fact that before evolution, before lost without you that ushered jay Z for real, Naomi Seal like Puff Daddy. They were all saying, you're this is great, this music is great. So that that was enough for me at the time. Then, because Jimmy spent so much money and it didn't hit, I was all scared.

I had to go to the drawing board.

I wrote all these that I just had this piano and it was just me at the piano, just drilling these songs one after the other, and then something magical happened.

You know.

Let me ask you, though, did those same piers that told you was a great album did they change when the sales didn't reflect that.

No, No, all the because they didn't need to. Like it's always it's always the B level people that are wishy washy. And you know, usually the people who are that great, they have so much confidence in themselves because they should that they can appreciate your greatness too. Jay Z knows he's great to be sounds great too, because I'm pretty great.

Yes, But but I I've learned that the more the people accomplished and really truly have genuine confidence in themselves, they're okay telling you that you're great.

Also, we've told I've told Nori plenty of times with men Flint that and a lot of people have told you we all thought it was an amazing album.

He always was like, this is my worst album only because you created it. And I believe the fan. No, no, that's not what happened. You created that album in a in a difficult time for your life.

Yes, right after my father was around where you should have said that. I was right after my father died.

Dad gave me all this money and they told me you still got to perform, and I'm just carrying. When I was in the studio, I wasn't there. I was thinking about, like, why the does this happen? You know, I remember, please man, you were asking that we do it part two my father say that.

But yeah, me hearing you say that, I would identify with you so much because one I could tell you still came outside.

Well, you know what happened was the beauty of it. And that's what Andrea was teaching me at the time. Was I just wanted to paint.

When I made the first album, I just I had so many ideas, so many desires that I wanted to be different from anyone who had ever existed.

Period. I wanted to be the only me that ever happened, and that's what that album was about. The second album was about I didn't connect Somehow How do I connect? How do I tell a more personal story that will connect with people personally?

Because the first album was sonically, you know, all in my opinion, sonically impressive production. But the lyrics on the second album is why is the loss without you? The complicated is the Angels to the sky? Cocaine? You know, got to be down lyric after lyric of I'm trying to connect with you. I reached out and I opened my arms and I wanted everybody to hug me back, and that's what that album was.

Well, let me just tell you something. This was a pleasure. I've really, I really, I've really had my expectations up here. But you just through the roof around the corner. We're on a fire hydrant. A compliment. I'm just being honest and you and you guys, you guys are the best at this. So that's very nice. What you did above and beyond.

Your story is so beautiful and you got to continue telling it because I'm just saying, this ship is great.

Well, this is the most stories I've ever told in one you know, because I've seen this, I've seen you guys, and I see the way you talk, and I see how real it is, and I know your story. I'm a fan of yours and what you're doing now and just being real and being yourself on the daily and letting people into your world and your heart as a big tough man who's you know, hit pop game, and

Thank you. I appreciate it, thank you, No, I appreciate man. Man. Let me just be honest with you.

You really opened up you really, you really didn't hold back on nothing. And that's really dope because you are a rock star, superstar.

Take that, honey, your royalty, you take that, honey, rock star. I'm gonna get points. I'm gonna get points at home, man, and we respect the ship out of you with.

Drink Champs is a Drink Champs LLC production in association with Interval Presents. Hosts and executive producers n O.

R E and d J. E.

F N from Interval Presents Executive producers Alan Coy and Jake Kleinberg. Listen to Drink Champs on Apple pot, Amazon Music, Spotify, Stitcher, or wherever you get your podcasts. Thanks for joining us for another episode of Drink Champs, hosted by Yours Truly, dj e f N and n O r E. Please make sure to follow us on all our socials That's at drink Champs across all platforms, at the Real Noriagon, ig at Noriega on Twitter, mine is at.

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