Mouth to Mouth with Katherine Bailess (aka Erica Marsh) • EP214

This originally aired February two thousand and five, and in real time. I don't know when you're listening to this podcast, but you're getting us late at night, and are white people may or may not be sober. God, we're all going to sound like night sweaty balls. We're gonna just talk all, you know. I feel like I feel like I sound like the sloth in Zootopia. Look, I just found my my head. So anyways, am I so quiet

and so far away? Oh? Yeah, my microphones? That's amazing. No, you guys, I was just saying I feel like I sound like the sloth in Zootopia. I'm like, hello, we also just worked a full day on Good Sam which hold on, this episode is airing like very soon before our episode, before our episode. So maybe let's let's tease out a little bit because it's um it's always a highlight of my week when we do this podcast together. It really is like the nice thing in my life.

I'm doing a show about like true crime, and it is dark, and so I know that once a week I get this light at the end of the tunnel where we just get to like laugh and joke around up and being able to be on set with you guys for the first time in a century. Congratulations, I'm a hundred years old. Yeah, you floated it on like a Sunday, and by like Wednesday, we were on planes. It was it was it was nice. It was so fast how that happened, and so fabulous and we had

such a blast. And I'm so excited for the audience to watch too, because you know how excited everybody's going to mean hit us with the dates every dates and times, dates and times. Yes, next week, March ladies are back together. Hello, and we had guys, we have something special coming up before the Good Sam episode. You're not ready for this. Are you ready for this and ready for this? Maybe they know because we were talking about how it is going to be the three of March. Do you think

they know? I mean, we're not subtle. Guys. What's our day. We're doing a live event. We're doing a nice live drama queens event. Oh my gosh, it's our second man, our second one. Guys. I'm so freaking pumped about this one. Um me too. Tell him what our guest Tell him why, because I'm not going to be able to be cool. You know who our guest is, guys. It's Brian Greenberg's coming on the twenty third. I cannot freaking wait. I

can't wait. And it feels nice to have him on our second live event because obviously our first one, our Thumber party, was just the gals. But we're very blessed in this moment of the rewatch by Jake Jigelski's arms. And I think we should ask Brian Greenberg to wear a tank look carrying those babies around. He's got carrying his babies around and he's probably ripped still. And if we're gonna be on Zoom, we might as well give the people what they want, don't you think, God, that's

not one of those white tanks. He is such a treasure, not only in these episodes, but currently you can get your tickets on looped live dot com. Yes, and our event. Our event is going to be March three at six pm Pacific, nine pm Eastern, so you can spend the hour with us. Uh, we'll see what Brian Greenberg wears. And at ten pm Eastern seven pm. No, it's just ten pm every resident. At ten pm, you will go from the event into our very special episode. The three

of us are acting on Good Sam on CBS. We're on screen together for the first time as a trio in four years. It's gonna be such a fun night. I can't wait. I can't wait. I can't wait. I'm so curious to see because there were moments when you guys came in so she when we first started rehearsing scenes, and I caught myself just staring at you both, being like, oh my god, it's finally happening. And then I was like, oh god, I have a line, like I have to

do my job. I'm supposed to be talking, and I wonder if any of that just pure staring at you too, Like the unicorns in the room is going to be in the edit. Well, I did a d R today for the good Samuel. You did you do a R? I did mind yesterday. It was so wild, like seen us all together as grown ups. Oh my god, I haven't seen it yet. There we are, We're doing it. It was so fun because we had there had such

a second a secondhand communication. It was a shorthand immediately as soon as we got it was like riding a bike muscle. Memory just jumped right back. Wow, we haventage pictures. We'll post all those two. We have so many photos for you event and show on the twenty three. That feels like a sign. I mean, of all the days our episode could have aired. Mar Hello, are we all going to get to went three tattoos on our tramp stamp area? Like Hayley? We need to get some somewhere.

Are we going to get a Roman numeral? Just to try to edge it up? It's gotta be cooler. It's gotta be cooler. We can't hit the nail right on the head. We'll come up with something. You know what. This is another thing our our friends and fans, we would love for you to submit some ideas to us. How do we make twenty three cool? Tell us show us, send us smart? Someone going to design tattoos for us? I mean, I'm into it. Guys. People have gotten our

signatures tattooed on their bodies. What if we got someone's art tattooed on our I would love to see some fan design some fantattoos. Maybe a raven with the twenty three or just the twenty three altogether. Just I don't say like a raven or I'm liking Hillary's idea of like a like a Roman numeral twenty three or is there some symbol to ravens and then three ravens? Oh? All right, you know who I'm a fan of? Who our guest this episode. You guys, we're going to take

a break. Don't go anywhere, because when we come back, it's about to get awesome. This is gonna be full. In a voice that needs no introduction, ladies and gentlemen, it is the one, the only. Erica Mars Catherine Bayless, Oh my god, you have no idea how we've been gushing about you. You are an icon on our show. Erica Marsh came in like a roll of thunder. Sister. Oh my gosh, y'all, that was the most full time I've ever had and so close. We were such babies, yeah,

like like tight. And then we got into a lot of messes outside of what are you talking about? What missus Angel Catherine? Okay, we need a recap because you First of all, I just read this in the bio they sent. Were you and were we in bring it on again together? Yes? No? Okay, so Joy, you and I met from Abigail Spencer. We met in New York City and you were singing somewhere, Oh my gosh, the Foxy Ladies Love Bookie seventies explosion. How do the words

that you just said? So then it was the wait pause. It was a cabaret that I did at on Christopher Street at the Duplex, which is like a big gay nightclub in in um oh yeah, oh yeah, it was like it was amazing. Um and I did this show that was five women doing like the Stretch of the seventies theme songs and like well known songs from the Stretch of the seventies, and um my dresser backstage was Bryce Dallas Howard And who was I know, it's crazy.

She was at n y U at the time, and then um, my friend Abby Spencer from We were both on soaps together when we did this show. And Abby's from Pensacola, which why do you know her? Why didn't you know her? Are you from her? From Christopher Danon his daddy was on so okay, yes, she and she was close with their family. So Abby and I were

both doing Foxy Ladies Love Boogie Seventies Explosion in sequence. Uh, you know, every three or four nights a week or whatever, doing this cabaret show in New York, And then we met. Did you come to see the show? Cat? Of course I saw you saying honey, oh my god, saying in dance and do everything like you're so talented you are? We went, so, how did you end up doing this cheer movie? Uh? How did you end up doing? When? Did so? We met in New York, but then we

worked together and bring it on again? Yeah? Okay, were you at one of the cheerleaders? No? No, no no, no, was like I was three weeks. I feel like I'd lead cheer later. But I came to l A my very first audition ever in Los Angeles. I went out and I went and met my agents and they said, oh, um, so we have a gothic cheerleader for you. I was like, this is not gothis I tried, but I didn't really all.

I just put on a black shirt. I got my gay bestie to like just like read with me, and then I went in and they go, we'll be right back, and then they go, can you read for like the reporter? So I was the multi personality, yes, cremick reporter. And I told Dame Santa Stephano was the director. I said, um, it would be very cool, like maybe if I just like tumbled into my like introduction. So I went and tumbled, y'all. I sprained something body and I was like, oh, maybe

I should have done that. But I still did some front stuff stuff, some front stuff. I mean, like I always have to give like a show. But remember this now. I totally remember this now. That's why because we didn't have I don't know if we maybe had one scene together. Now I have to see if we can find it where I was like, were you interviewing the cheerleaders or something? I was and you were being bitchy? Yeah, Like how was your character super bitchy? It's so crazy because that

predates one Tree Hill by how many years? How many years to? Yeah, but hey, Sophia, oh no, here it comes coms. So I went out for Brook twice and I got a call back. No, I was not going to say this tonight, but I was like, yeah, I love this, I know, and you're obviously you're the person for Brook. But they kept on calling me back and I was like, and when you got I was like, no,

she is spot Um, oh my god. You know when you get a role, you know, like or like a thousand girls went out because their day serves and actresses and they're like, you know what, I mean, you knew it was yours? No, you just know, but you know what, you know what actually, Like, I have the chills, literally, I got the chills when you said that, because that scene with us after the election in the office talking

about what we're both afraid of. These two girls who don't get vulnerable with anyone for some reason or meeting kind of in this little sacred space and getting vulnerable with each other, and Erica marsh Is is in it in her own way. It was like seeing these two girls mirroring each other. Well they're negatives of each other. Yeah, they're like two sides of the same coin, right, So

that makes perfect sense to me. Yeah. Yeah, And um so when I got the job, no one, no one told me that I was mirroring um Reese Witherspoon in Election. After I got the job, someone came up to me. I'm not gonna say who it is. I was at a Gilmore Girls because I was on Gilmo Girls before that, and um someone said, oh, I get it, now you're rased for the Spain. What. Oh that's funny. I didn't.

I didn't either, you so made it your own. I did, but I did um watch election, Yeah, because she's really Yeah, that's a perfect studied it. But I'm like, I made it Katherine Erica. But anyway, she's so funny because they didn't tell me that the audition, which is Catherine you you're such a good actress and we've been you know, Look, there are so many I was saying this when were

watching the episode. There are so many bad choices that so many other actresses would have made in that spot because it's a it's a real easy role to do the caricature version of yeah yeah, and there's no dimension and there's no depth, and it's like you're just what's on the page. And when you were on the screen, you brought so much in There was so there was

so much depth. You could tell that this was a girl who I mean, how interesting to see a character who's fighting for her position, um, but who is wholly aware of the fact that this is all she has and self aware enough to admit it to another person who is her rival. That takes so much confidence, It takes so much vulnerability also, um Moxie man and age to be able to admit. I just was so impressed with your choices. You gave so much depth to her, and it made me want to see so much more

of Erica. Yes, I mean, it's why we got lucky we I mean off screen to have you, because it could have been an episode or two and none of us could take our eyes off you. I mean even even the way you know, you come up in the hallway and apologize and and you know, say good luck tomorrow, like your your dancers posture like informed this girl. Her posture was perfect, your physicality was perfect. We were just like, I mean, we're still gushing, but we were gushing over

all of this. Oh gosh, my dancers poster lord commercy. Somebody said that to me of the night y'all at dinner, and I'm like, she slouch. No, No, I've got jurisdiction over the slouch. So so hard to unlearn my slouching. Hey, what was it? What was it supposed to be? What was Rikamar supposed to be? How many episodes they tell you?

They never told me, they never told me? Said recurring? Okay, but um yeah, it just it was just that it was recurring, and it was kind of like they said that they didn't have anywhere else to go with her. How many did you do totally? It says six or seven, but I think I did eight. I don't know. Yeah, it feels like yeah. And they cut they cut the beach scenes because I guess the mouth and I weren't going for They were testing out to see if there

was a future there. I mean, I don't know. I mean, you know, we had some chemistry, the two of us. Yeah you did. Yeah, those lips. Okay, hold on, are we gonna play like Kiss and Tell right now? Because I love that game. We've got a big kiss in this episode to talk about two so yeah, let's play Kiss and Tell? Yeah, because um, I was like, I've

never kissed anybody on screen before like that really, whoa? No, I'd only just been like whatever, just speaker and like dancer and like kiss people in the cheek and it all. And then it was just like whoa. And then we kiss on mouth. I'm like in its cloth, of course it's mouth. And these are the biggest lips I think I've ever kissed in my life, Like yeah, fantastic, yummy you you could just fall into those pillow lips and get all the girls fell in love with mouth. They

now we know the reason. And I'll tell you one other thing. Um, they got me confused with another girl. Sometimes there was another girl on the show that was blind. Yes, yeah, I have like that baby face or whatever, and um yeah, so they got no, no, no, that's not me. Melt had to type is that what we're saying here? I guess. So they're like that, that's so funny. So wait, what was what was the process? Like? Because I know, you know you said that they let you know it was

a recurring role. But where were you where were you living? How did you get the audition? Like like how did it all start? So I just on Gilmer Girls, and I had a recurring on there and then I got an audition for One Tree Hill and I'm like, this is great. I mean, this is the one I wanted to be on. And then they auditioned me and I kept on getting callbacks, and the last callback they didn't give me any direction. I just did it and then I just left. I'm like, well, I didn't get that,

and then all of a sudden I got it. They wanted me to flyop directly to Wilmington's Um. It was probably four days later. I bought a Christmas Tree. I've never done one since, and I had to just get my best friend to get rid of it. She didn't get rid of it until February. Y'all. Now they were they were treading like there was like stuff everywhere. I was like, whatever, you're a great friend, but whatever. But yeah, so I got it, and then Gilmer Girls wanted me

back and I said. My manager was like, well, she's booked on One Tree all now, and then they just kept on write and more and more for me, right, And then that's how it happened. And so I didn't do Gilmer Balls anymore. And once r He'll just kept on Happening. Then after that season, I didn't come back.

By the way, your character is so good and so dynamic, and you you know, there's always these stereotypes about high school kids, right, and you take that overachiever and you make her approachable and you make her interesting, and that's hard to do. You know. It's like Ione Sky plays that character and say anything. You know where it's just like you love school. You're such a nerd. Um. Yeah, that's how that's your ticket out. Man. There's a reason

kids commit to school. Were you into school when you were growing up? Well, there's a funny story about that. So Um I was the yes you were was the day sir, the cheerleader, musical theater kid. I was everything And unfortunately I didn't really get to do acting and all that and fixed for Mississippi because we didn't have that opportunity. I did everything else and I'll never forget um.

I went out for vice presidents and this is kind of why I resonated um Sofia, because I I pulled from that when we do the scenes, because I went out for vice president of the student body, y'all, and I was captured the Chilean squad in or was going to be for senior year, and no one wanted. They knew I was a very busy person with dancing in ballet and everything and all that. No one really wanted me to be the vice president went I mean, I had everybody voting for me, I was campaigning, I had

it all. I had like seventh graders going out and I didn't get it. And I'm going to be very us right now. Some other chick got it your garden. Me and um I sat in the counselor's office for probably three hours crying, stop. Do you want us to fight her? We'll fight her, all right. She probably know I'm not gonna say her name, but yes I was. I was so but heard about it. But in the interim, I probably never should have been vice president because I was too with all my extra stuff. You know, I

just want a sidebar. You went to the counselor's office, which is so awesome. I never went to our guidance counselor. I was always like, I don't know, I was afraid or I guess I just thought, whatever they pay you to just like trying to we don't need anybody. But it's so great, Like I love as an adult now knowing that kids did actually go to the guidance counselor. That's cool, Joy, Joy. I was one of fifty two

in my class. Are you serious? Yeah? Of course in the series fifty two people in my graduating class, I was one of fifty five. Okay, see I'm not the only one. Yeah, I mean I was one of four hundred. I don't know how many, but it was small. Well, um, was that a private school? Yeah? Catholic? Y, Yes, girls school like Sophia went to. I was boys and girls. And you better believe Katherine was kissing boys at that school. Maybe if you weren't. Hillary. I got married that Joe.

I was gonna say, you got married two weeks ago. You are a literal newly wed. All right, we've got some good love love stuff in this episode. So I hit us with the wedding stuff. Tell us, tell us the story, please. Okay. Well, my fiance at the time was like, we didn't know where we wanted. We moved to Nashville because we just we needed to change and it was just better forever. Where were you living from? Where When did you guys make that move? Gay? Yeah? And so we get here and you know, it takes

a lot to move. It's very stressful. So here and it takes a couple of months. And then my daddy's birthday, by daddy's seventieth birthday, my daddy, my daddy's birthday, and we celebrated me on when we were driving back from Oxford, Mississippi, and Michael goes, Katherine, what about Oxford? And I got shields. I was like, yes, yes, let's do it there. So we started making plans. Y'all. We planned a freaking fairytale wedding within two months. Shut up, Oh yes, we yes,

we did. I'd tell you. We were like oldies all day every day. I love it. How long have you guys been to day? My daddy did the alligator, which I want to post on Wait stop, well you what do you mean your dad did the alligator? You cooked an alligator? Yeah, you know the alligator? Right now? Is it a dance? It's a dance move, y'all. It is the craziest dance move. I don't even know what I thought you were talking about food. I thought you legitimately like put an alligator on a spit and cooked it.

He starts like doing these pitch ups, I think, and he starts moving his body and he's seventy and by the way, he's got black hair, which never he's never died it, I swear to God, like everyone thinks he dies it, but he doesn't. And he starts getting down on the ground. One. That's my dad. That's oh my god. I love that you had the old fashioned, big family wedding.

Is that what you always envisioned? Yeah, mm hmm, idea, idea. Well, we were going to try to make it like a hundred and like twenty, but I have a hundred relatives. Oh my god. Um, So we decided that we would invite a couple more people, and then my mom invited her people and it was probably to fifty. What fun you very much, our school president. If you can throw a wedding with two hundred and fifty people in two months, I mean, that is a tactical operation that you just

went through. I'm into it, Katherine. How long have you guys been together? So this is how we met short version. So we literally were at the Hollywood Bowl in September two and I looked at my friend. I said, I need to find a man at night or somebody tonight. Right, and I just broke it up with somebody else and I will kid you know, right, he was standing behind me, you know the hollow bowl, there's the walkways. We were really pretty high up and are you seeing where was

I sitting? Who are you seeing? Who's playing Dave Matthew? Oh my god, Oh my god? It's perfect? Yeah, we are the same age. I'm saying. I love this, Catherine, I love this loving rock and roll. This is this is great. Um. Let me ask you one question of all the boys on the show, right, like, which boy speaks to you? Is it Nathan? Is it Lucas? Is it Jake? Is it Mouth? Like? What's your type? Lord Mercy? Um?

Probably Nathan Um, you know the you know, the bad boy kind of like, you know, just a little bit um and again. But Thenyian, I had so many scenes with mal and he's the sftie and I have a thing for that. So like he really did work out that we were together, you know, on the show, and he was I mean it does help that. You know, Lee is just like the most amazing person. He's the best and so easy to work with and so just like it's such great ideas and make space for you

as an actor. I mean I just loved him. I know you hit the jackpots this. Um, did you watch this? I want to know, wait, wait before we go to the episode questions. I want to know, since we've just watched and we're really in the flashback of our of our twenties, who is your Yankee most like? Out of all the boys on our show? Yeah, who's your husband? Like? Is he a Nathan or a mouth? Who is he? He's not a mouth. He might be a Nathan or Chad Michael. He's a hybrid. He's a Scott Brother hybrid.

I mean that's the best option, it really is. Yeah. I mean he's tough. He's tough. These sweet's got a soft hearts always fine that that's so you? Yeah yeo. I mean he's probably listen to me right now. Tell him to come hang out with us. We've got we've got some ladies that are very curious. Our curiosity is peaked right O. God, he might get a little job

like all the all beautiful girls. We're flirty. So watch out, all right, Um, we're going to take a break right now, and then we're gonna watch the We're gonna talk about the episode. Uh, Katherine, did you watch the episode? Oh heck, yeah I did. Okay, Yeah, I was in tears. I was like, oh my god, it's so crazy. It was so long ago, and wow, yeah, it was super cool to watch it. I watched the whole dang bank good.

But we just did too. We watched the whole dang thing, and we hope you at home watched the whole dang thing too, so we can all come back and talk about it. We'll be right back. We're back with our sweetheart, Katherine Bayleiss. Katherine, you're so good at being still, you know, like it takes a lot for an actor to be comfortable enough to be still and just deliver their lines. Yeah,

it seems actually really hard to find. Yeah, especially when we're playing teenagers and we're all goofy and wiggily and stuff. Of what were you basing it on? What were your inspirations for this role? So I think I've had to internalize it when again, like when I was going out like for vice president of my student body and everything, and I kind of internalized that, and also I knew that I couldn't be big because she wasn't supposed to be big. She didn't know how to be big. She

was just this really introvert, had no friends. Her only friend was like her presidency. Yeah, maybe one other friend, and you just cannot um. I don't know. It just kind of came naturally, and I'll never forget Bevin said something to me. Really yes, because Bevin had a bunch of lines this episode. Yeah, Bevin looked over to me. And that wasn't a very long it was with you, but I mean, Sophia, it wasn't a very long scene.

It was when when I lost and I was started to internalize that and started to crop, and she was like, how did you do that? And I went, I don't know. I mean, it's just like it just happened. And then that's what that you have to just visualize, you in that moment in high school where you're going, oh my god, I just lost to a girl that never even knew about being president and I've been doing this my entire life. This is all I had. And yeah, and that's kind

of like how I got there. I think, Yeah, I think I learned that probably through Liam Esper, through acting classes. It was like not, but I'm kind of a big person and I am very animated so sometimes I am animated, but that role I kind of was just yeah, yeah, she's stoked, is what you would say, right, Yeah, And it needed that because Brooke has so much energy and bounce and she's bubbling and busy, and yeah, it really

needed that opposite energy. I think my favorite scene between me or Eric and Brooke was the very first scene when I turned around my hair flipped. Yes, Oh I love that scene too, because you were actually so sincere and so like genuinely wanting to help her until the moment that you realize that she said. The moment she says I'm running for president. I've been Presidence is like seventh grade. Yeah. It was so great. It had that speed, It had that clip of like the old Spencer Tracy

Katherine Hepburn movies, you know, in that clip. Is hard to do sometimes with guest stars because sometimes directors just so you guys at home now, when they come on to set, they know, like, oh, the regular kids kind of have it made up in their mind how they're going to be I'm gonna overdirect the guest stars and really get in their head, you know. And so you didn't let anyone get in your head, you know, you knew what you wanted to do, and you were toe

to toe was soap? Who Sophia has chewed up and spit out every other actor on our show? What does that? Even? Macca? Your singers, you're one liners are Brooke? Brooke had good one liners. It's true. Yeah, I love a good one man. But also to come on the show at a time when it was I really had a height, the height of its popularity. Um, you know, it was right in that zone when everybody was talking about One Tree Hill

and it was very much in the cultural zeitgeist. And for you to come in and not be intimidated and not you really brought your own thing. You didn't worry about stepping on toes. You were like here to take up your own space, which is as an actor, that's what you want. You want to be around on the people that you can trust. Yeah, it's so cool, and you know what to to even that point you made Hillary, because yeah, damn Brooke had withering loeliners and the thing

that Brooke would throw at a character like this. Erica was unintimidated and and really threw down at Brooke in ways she wasn't accustomed to having anyone challenge her, and you know, you don't expect that from the perfect president who's so academic that she doesn't have any friends. And yet here was Erica marsh like in the ring, and I think that's what made that moment between them in the office feels so tender and like it could be something like they might be friends. It was very cool.

Then it happens, Well, we have so much in this episode. I mean, should we just go back. Let's talk about Eric, Let's talk about Catherine's crush. Let's talk about Nathan um because Nathan, we start to see hints of old Nathan starting to see bad boy. Let's talk about that trajectory. I was really I loved seeing James without any gel in his hair, was totally baby faced in his his hair, with his hair down. And you know, as we've talked about before, James was the youngest on the show, and

he took his job so seriously. He had an acting coach that would come in and work with him, and I remember how much he cared about getting this stuff right. So I know that he was working really hard at this and it really paid off. I just loved seeing this switch of vulnerability and angst in trouble and Nathan um and I love seeing the hints of old Nathan coming back. And he punched Dan what and then punched Dan beer in class? Beer in class? Which is worth

the beer in class? Are punching your dad? I mean, doesn't everybody want to punch Dan? I think so, Like, I don't know. I was more shocked that he was ripping beers in class and then the gall to be like, don't worry, I brought enough for everybody, and he started passing them out in front of the teacher. Okay, So, Katherine, when you watched the episode and you saw the teacher in the little baby skirt, did you have a reaction

to the und your head what I call? I'm like, hey, I could be playing her now because Sophia and I walked right into the trap because they pull out and they do the wide shot of the teacher and we're like, what's with the skirt? And then Nathan makes the comment like and tries to slut shame the teacher, and we realized, like, man, we loved right into that, damn it. We talked about true religions, jeans that you wore the religion jeanes, those

are so good. Yeah. They Yeah, those the fashion crazy stuff. I mean that time was two four. Yeah, well we shot it in two thousand four, so it aired in two thousand, right at the beginning of two thousand five. Yeah, a lot of a lot of love handle on my part. With those low rise jeans. It was just like, what's gonna spill out over this? You know? What I loved was Brooks brooch. Do you remember? That was the time

when it brooches were really in. It was in all the magazines put on and you were the crop sweater with the skin tight tank tops. You could see it was just made your boobs bigger and your waist really t not you but the people who were it, but also you, And it was really cute. I love that look. I I will say I loved that whole outfit. Those plaid pants, you know, I love a plaid pant. And

I was laughing at that crop sweater. But that's such an iconic moment that when in the hallway, and I've seen that photo so many times, but watching the episode, I was like, God, I used to have so many abs, Like you guys, My abs were sick and they went all the way down and I was watching me just walk out of the hallway to to hear the announcement by myself, and I was like, I know, I'm supposed to really be invested in Brook's emotional journey, but god,

I miss that abdominal situation. Oh my god. No, but it was it was nice. I didn't know how nice it was at the time. I probably would have worned just more crrupt things. But it's I like that outfit. You had good outfits of this episode. I liked also when you were wearing at the beginning of the episode when we come to school. I don't like what I'm wearing. I don't like my hair. Blue don't No, you don't like your hair and the ding dong you guys, this

is ridiculous. However, Hillary, the conversations, you're just wild curly hair, because it wasn't curly hair, it was it all burned off, and I hated that. That's how I looked when Jake Jabowski came back, like, I remember being so self conscious, like, oh man, I just really would like it if it were different right now. Um. But the conversation that we had in the parking lot about the similarities between Chris Keller and Nathan. That's interesting, digress. I loved that. I

also loved I'm just saying the same person. Well, before we get into the boys, I'm gonna go ahead and say I loved our walking talks of them. Are walking talks were so good walking through the parking lot, walk through the hallway, and they were at a clip that felt really real and the energy was so high. But God, when we were in the parking lot and Brooks talking about how Haley changed Nathan and well when she first met him, he was arrogant and self centered and really talented,

and you know they're the same. Yeah, that hit hard, Joy was it was it weird for you to watch Hillary and I having that conversation while Haley was away on tour with Chris Ri. Oh my god, Oh my god, it's true that what they were saying about me is true. Gosh, it was weird because I didn't know I was in

this episode. I thought I wasn't. But I guess that's how they I guess they filmed a bunch of my stuff all in when last week we were talking about they filmed it all kind of in one chunk, So I think that was one of the pieces I guess, um, yeah it was, and you weren't wrong. I mean the fact that Haley was so attracted to a project and you know, somebody to fix, and that's kind of what Nathan was. And then she fixed them, so to speak, and now there's something else. Okay. I don't think that

that's totally what's going on with Haley. I think that that's a part of it, like a subconscious part of her attraction to Chris, that she's denying and pushing away and trying to do the right thing. I love a project. So many women do to Catherine projects. Oh hey, yeah, I love a project. Project. Yeah, I will say though. Ah, there was a point where my dad sat me down and was like, you already rescue dogs, stop dating sick puppies. And I was like Dad, I was like, oh Dad,

it cuts deep. Also, you're you're very right. You're very right. It's not my responsibility to save human beings. This is really awkward and terrible and horrible, and I have to go. Now. You've always been like that, Sophia. I mean, you were like in your early early early twenties, like you always rescued doll. I remember going on and I'm going how many dands? I mean, which she got the parvo puppies? Were you there? I'm puppies? I wish I was so sweet,

But yeah, that I learned my lesson. I was like, yeah, taking home a dog in her nine puppies was a real big mistake. But you know, I've learned that lesson about animals and human beings too, And look at us just growing up and you know who doesn't need fixing? Stay with me now, sew Katherine, did you ever get to hang out with Brian Greenberg or were you guys ships passing in the night? Oh no, no, no no, we

hung out a bunch. I was there. Yeah, yeah, yeah, we um we don't got a good a good amount because he was working at the same time I was working, and there are a lot of people that like ship sailing in the you know, but like we were on kind of the same schedule, so yeah, I got to know them pretty well. And he just had twins. Oh yeah, him do that I went to because I prised my egge twice. Really, you guys went to the same doctor, good like, well, not him, no, but he's honestly, he's

such a good person. You know a lot of guys have been revealed to be gross in the last couple of years. Greenberg doesn't have to worry about that. Greenberg has always been above board and he's kind and professional and awesome and we got really, really lucky to have him. And you know, the girls tease me about the whole like Payton Jake Jabelski thing because I turned purple during the Jake Jagelski scenes. I'm so embarrassed. So hot, you guys, that kiss so good he's and he is such a

leading man. He is such a leading man. He knows how to use the camera, how to use the space in between you guys. He's in such control of his instrument as an artist. It was really really said it. I locked eyes and we were like, what are you saying right now? You know what I mean? Joys like his dancers posture, Oh my god, Oh my god. Now, Also the delayed gratification of that kiss. We've been waiting for that kiss for so long. Yes, that's you know what,

That's what we wanted. Remember with with Peyton and Lucas and how it happened so fast and we were all like and it was creepy. It was creepy. This is what we waited for. It so what we wanted in the fact that you so long to lean it. It's so tender, like biting your limp a little. Oh god, I'm so good. I loved it. I really liked that. The night before they kissed, Peyton left the room and was like, this is too much, and he didn't chase her into the room that you know, the other bedroom

is needy. There was no there was like like no game playing. He just took that night to formulate his thoughts so that the next night he was like, I lied to you about while I was coming here. I I want to be with you, and you know, like I dorked out. I mean, I'm like trying so hard to be cool, I say me, I'm like talking about

Peyton forced. Peyton is like tried so hard to be cool. Um, but working with someone like Brian who he switches from being Brian your buddy behind camera to like Jake Chakilski this like kind of soulful dude. You know, like there's a there's a shift in the energy where it's really easy to have a huge freaking crush on Jake Chikowski and then go like have drinks at the bar, you know, with your buddy Greenberg. And and that's nice that that

that energy shift can happen in a really easy way. Yeah. Well, and I know we've talked about this before, but Brian was such a good friend to all of us and was always such a safe, like quality guy. And I think some of his natural energy is what you see coming out of Jake in these really tender scenes, because he is a soulful, present, considerate human and to watch these two teenagers be withholding out of a little bit

of fear and a little bit of discomfort. Peyton leaves the room and says like, this is a lot for my emotions. I don't know what's happening here. I gotta protect myself and and he sits with it and realizes, well, I'm keeping something from her, and maybe that's why she's keeping something from me. It's so patient and kind. Yeah, I love them, I love them, I love them and other hot boy energy mouth getting up to give the speech. Do you think this is when Erica marsh falls in

love with him? Yes, mm hmm. There's a moment that they caught and I haven't seen this in a long time, and I will she that's when Eric was like, I won't get those lips. I'm gonna get those lips. Where'd you guys kiss for the first time? Do remember? Yeah?

It was in front of my house, Eric, or Erica's house, and I did the whole you know, you know, when you're you're acting and you don't even know what's gonna happen, and you bite you a little, and I like, I don't know how awkward it was, but I did it. And I didn't even know I did it when it happened, and I saw it on feeling for the first time, I'm like, Okay, that what works because I'm awkward and whatever I'm in high school or which I was in high school. Um. Yeah, and yeah, that was the first

time we kissed. And it was so cute, Oh my god, so much. Yeah. I love that mouth came came up to Brooks Rescue. I love seeing them come back together. After the last time that we saw him confess to her that he threw the brick through her windshield and it's just too hard for him to be friends with her anymore. We needed that friendship back, We needed them to come back together. Yeah. And sometimes when you when you're you know you're smarting because you don't quite know

what to say after a fight. Yeah. The the swooping in and standing up for someone and essentially proclaiming to other people why you love them, you know, it's that was that was like a love letter in action, and it reminded them both how much they cared about each other's friendships. And it was just so sweet, you know, for Brooke to be seen for who she is, not not her popularity or what people assume about her, and and for Mouth to be, you know, the hero in

front of the whole school. I just loved it. Yeah, me too. A lot of knights in shining armor in this episode. You know, we've got saving the Day, We've got Jake Jakalski just being a smoke show. Andy. I was just gonna say with the iconic line, I do tend to get what I get what I wanted. He's coming for Dan and you called it so if you said Dan, look at Paul make the choice to have Dany rattled at the end of that scene. It was so smart. Little we needed it. We needed to know

that Dan is capable of being rattled by someone. Yeah, And it was just a flash on Paul's face. But it was such a good choice as an actor to play the bravado and then to go oh oh, like what's going to happen? And then you see Andy outside like he's got a steak out, like in his suburban calling some guy on his cell phone, and I'm like, what is he gonna do? I can't for next week? Honestly, I don't remember, but I can't wait. Catherine, was was

Karen part of your hangouts? Too? Did you guys hang? Okay? So Kieren and I did a movie before I got No, Yes, we did. It was called See It Fear. What was it about besides fear on the open waters? It was in the sea and we were on a boat and one thing nobody knows, but they didn't allow fake blood on that boat because it was a very nice yacht. So we had to kitchup, you're gonna say, so we had to bleed Kieren and our boyfriend and girlfriend on

that movie. So when I got once you re heal, I got there and Kieren already had a recurring role, so I knew joy and I grew Kieren and so like I had some friends, thank God, because I was there for so long and I was like, I need to make friends do it. Oh my god, I love it so much. The last piece, we definitely need to address those and Karen because we haven't really touched on

that up. That scene was so beautiful and to watch, I will say one thing I loved was watching her get ultimately vulnerable with Nathan, this mother who's lost his son, and this this boy who's you know, lost his family and his wife. It it interestingly made Andy getting protective over her even more exciting to me because he's taking

action because he's seeing what it's doing to her. But we as the viewers, get to see her confide in someone else and you, and and it gives you the feeling like all these people's emotions are just spilling out everywhere. I thought it was a great choice. I agree. I loved seeing James let himself be that vulnerable he hasn't done that on the show yet, and his voice cracking like that. God, it broke my heart for him. Yeah,

me too. And watching Karen be the support system that he never had and the weird switching roles that the boy are doing in Lucas living with Dan talking about books, being like Buddy buddy so awful. And the fact that Karen, in her moment of need, in her hour of need, missing her son, having Nathan ironically be the one that comes to her and trusts her. It's such a beautiful storytelling.

And you know we talked about healing. What an interesting healing thing I imagine for the subconscious to have Dan Scott's son apologize I'm sorry my dad was such a dick to you. Yeah, miss Row, I'm sorry. That must have really hurt you. Oh that makes me want to cry. It was beautiful. Well, we know why Nathan is so upset. It's because Haley is a smoke shows by her sweet the Records makeover with the smoky eye and like the sexy Halter top in this episode, it was such a

delight to see your rock and roll girl makeover. It was for me too. I was like, Oh, I like that. Yeah, I really, I think this is so interesting to watch Haley now that I'm kind of watching as a third party. Uh. And I've seen Haley's trajectory, watching her go and do this thing that's like it's like partially for herself, but

it's not totally without selfish motives. In a negative way, like, there's some things that are good that you need to do for yourself and your own dreams and all that, but there's there's something about it that is the secrecy, the hiddenness, that tucking something away, that the independence. Yeah, but it's like longing for independence, but she's doing it the wrong way. She's doing it in a sly secretive

way instead of trusting Nathan. I like se flaw, Yeah, I like I like that Haley was a kid doing this rather than an adult going, let's sit down and have a mature convert station. Tell me what you're really feeling, and I'll tell you what I'm really feeling. And then I'm gonna go do this thing and I'll call you and your FaceTime every day and check in. Which is who she's always been. Yeah, and by the way, it's

who we should all be in our real relationships. But it's less interesting to watch on TV watching Haley have a secret and and rebel and be bad and refuse to call home and and everyone's tortured and she doesn't care. You're like, what is going? Oh my god? And it makes it exciting because I want to know why she's suddenly behaving like this like, why is our friend going off the deep end? She's a bad girl. Guys, She's a bad It makes me wonder what Haley is most

likely too is now. It's like she's she used to be most likely to, you know, be the friend you could rely on, and now I'm like, I don't know, Catherine. Um, we do a bit on this show called most Likely To where we spin a wheel and we have to declare a character and also a real life actor from our show. Um, as that most likely to, We're gonna spend the wheel right now, you're gonna help us figure this out? Okay, then okay fine, most likely to leave

acting and take up golfing, Sofia, no, shut up. In real life, Baby Jenny is now at college on a golfing scholarship. She's like, you g a, oh my god. Mace Holcomb, who played Baby Jenny Jake's baby, is like it makes me feel a thousand years old that she is in college, especially as like we're seeing all these scenes of us like college yes, yes, no, no, no no no no, yeah, sure is and she's going to

be on TV soon. Her mom like, I'm from Facebook friends with her mom, and her mom posts she's going to be on tv um because she's like in the p g A circuit she's doing ordinarily well it's insane, so um, I guess, I guess, baby Jenny. What's her name? Oh? No, Grace in real life? Okay, which character do we think off believe what their profession is to just just retire and be a golf h m hmm. I feel like I feel like Skills would do that if he, if he can. Our go to answers are always mouth and

skills and favorite characters. I don't know it's so true character wise. Maybe Andy, Oh yeah, he doesn't need a job. He's rich. He does. That's right, that feels fair. Yeah, that's a good answer. Golf really reads as like a very wealthy man's Yeah. Yeah. Dennis always played golf, except for Michael, dentist from North Carolina who had a boat. Loved him. Oh yeah, the hot dentist. We'll talk about

that a different hot days. By the way, nothing better than like having a hot dentist but who also has a cool wife and cute kids and they just like take you out on their boat. I was like, can you guys adopt me? Like? What is this life? You lead. I love it. Here was a dream. God, it was lovely. Catherine. Thank you so much for coming and being on our show. I'm so glad you were here. Hey, tell your cute husband.

We said, Hi, he's watching some show. See. The thing is we want has he seen you in this show? Going to see me? Has he seen you in oh? Um? You know what? I think he might some scenes you might need to But I was watching this episode in the d N earlier and I was like, baby, come see baby Katherine. Yeah, yeah, check a load of this. Hey, look at look, look at a little bitch Katherine. Um,

which hadn't really changed that much anyway. Next episode, Season two, number fifteen, unopened letter to the world's Hey, thanks for listening. Don't forget to leave us a review. You can also follow us on Instagram at Drama Queens O t H or email us at Drama Queens at I heart radio

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