Kissing is Gross • EP102

I expect to be affected. Friends. We all cried at the end. I know what you were saying, like during the zoom, I mean when we were just watching the episode, Hillary, you were saying that you you're it's you're really realizing what it is that Um was capturing people's hearts, because you know, at the time when we were on the show, it's harder to it's harder to see because it's all mixed in with everything that we're experiencing behind the scenes too. So to just watch it back kind of pure, uh

with fresh eyes is um. I'm getting it too. I'm starting to really get it. Yeah, And when you see it put together, you know, edited just right, and the music is just right, and it ends on that beautiful Gavin Degrass song What's so emotional? And and then Lucas turns and looks and says, your art matters again. Three choked up who admitted at first it's what got in first, I did. I'm such a crier. I just wow, I

feel crazy, I'm crying. But it was such a you know, that's what was great about this show is that, like we were saying before, where everything now in this um genre is really heightened and high stakes and like that Riverdale Vampire Diaries, like sort of high concept stuff, the superheroes and all that, which is so great. I love those shows. But but we what we don't have a lot of right now is just um teenagers with an attention span that can like sit and watch. I guess

maybe that's what it is. I don't know if it's lack of content or if it's just the fact that the world has changed, But it seems harder to sell this kind of a show now that it did then.

But back then, like all you all you needed was the very genuine, real um emotion of the human experience and something that's simple of the struggle of somebody wanting answers, and how they built it up the whole episode until the end when it's just one small, vulnerable moment and he just says that one thing to you, your art matters. It's what got me here. You didn't have to say that, but it was vulnerable, and it's exactly what every teenage girl wants a cute boy to turn and say something

vulnerable and meaningful to her. I mean immediately I was like sixteen again, like, oh my god, I just want that well, And I think what's really interesting is it in a way that that never goes away, right, Yeah, y'all we grow up and then we realize inside of us are still scared kids everything like this show. I think so, maybe because one thing I will say is I get what you mean. Like these high concept shows have really evolved now, but people are still watching our show.

And I think it's because at the root of it, it gave a bunch of people permission to be scared, to be vulnerable, to beings, to feel feelings, and like, no matter in what ways they might have been succeeding, or or how good their lives were at home, or perhaps how rough their lives were at home, they had a place to come and feel vulnerable and feel like they could take risks. You know, it's a risk to turn around and look at the girl at the basketball game and say that to her when her boyfriend is

standing over there. But but we took these risks to be seen on screen, and I think so many people crave that now. It's such a teeny tiny moment, and I honestly like that line is the line that fans say to me more than any other, and it is ingrained in I have it embroidered from a fan, like hanging up on a wall in my house. Um. And it's to watch it back because I haven't seen it since it aired is so weird because it's such a small moment and it made such a big impact, And like,

I'm coming off of a weird weekend. I literally just drove through my hometown and hung out with some friends from high school and and shared all these like vulnerable things with them that I didn't have the moxie or um confidence to tell them when we were seventeen in real life. So to watch these seventeen year olds on TV, I mean, it could be us playing these people are

like total strangers. But just to watch these seventeen year olds on TV like say things that are earnest, it's everything you want to have the guts to say when you're that age, but it's just so hard. It's shocking to watch. Yeah, but in that moment on the court, did it feel like a big Did you feel it in that moment how powerful that was or only within

the storytelling that we're watching back. I think I was so scared of the process of filmmaking while we were doing it that everything to me was like, how do I hit my mark, how do I find lens? How do I do all these things? And and I joke all the time about how at the time, like Chad, I was so mean to Chad when we first started

doing the show. It's just like, don't even look at me, You're just a dumb boy whatever, um, because I was such a snarky little brat, and so watching it, I have this joke where I'm like, I believe in the power of the edit right where you can like do a totally dorky scene, but when they lay some good music on it, I mean, you know what I mean, they piece it together. The end of that episode. I believe in the power of that edit. They did a really solid job making that feel like a punch in

the gut. Yeah, And when you watch it, you get you get the narrative of the edit, you get the melody of the episode. And when we're doing it, you know, we're in the gym for eighteen hours that day. You're not you're not conscious of it. And and it's funny, you know, Joy, you were saying something earlier when we were watching about how it's a blur for us because we did it for so long and it was so

many years. And I did something and I don't know if I told you guys this, and this was just an averaging, but I went through and looked at, you know, some time sheets and was like, okay, So if I wanted to make an average of how many hours we shot every episode, and then what that means over eighty seven episodes, it means that from you guys starting the pilot to us finishing episode, we filmed this show. The conservative estimate is thirty five thousand hours of our lives.

What So that's why we don't remember anything, you guys. So the cool thing is math I that French I got the graph paper out, you know, like, this is the way in which I'm like, this is why when people asked me if Brooke Davis and I are similar, I'm like, so in some ways we became similar and in many ways not at all. I love math and and I needed like a data point to understand why

I couldn't always remember things that fans were asking. And I'm actually so excited to be here a because we get to do this every week, and I get to do these two of my favorite women and be because now we're going to get to experience what they did, because at the time, we never did even if we saw an episode, even if there was like a big something, we had a watch party. We were still filming thousands of hours a year, and so now we're just gonna like watch the show and just see the edits. Did

we ever have a watch party? The only watch party I remember is Honey Grove, Texas, where we sat down with some fans and watched the show. But did we ever I remember one in uh somewhere in Landfalls Center. I think there was some bar maybe that people met up in to watch a finale or something. Yeah, I think it was near the movie theater. I can't remember, but yeah, what are those sports bars like that? I don't know. See this, I won't remember, but rarely we

did that. But wait, let's talk about something that we have to address, which is the introduction of Brooke Davis. She came in cute with that little flippy hair. Now Rachel, it was like the grown out Rachel that hair looked back at it and I'm just like, wow, I didn't I just didn't really know the hair was so it was. I actually sort of find it charming because it is very innocent and sweet and and but then the thing that is so traumatic for me is that I'd plucked

out half of my eyebrows. Like, so you talk about this, I love it. I love the skinny nineties brows. I think there's a girl. I'm telling you. I think it's very flattering. But also, like I'm Italian, I can't I can't get rid of these. By the way, I'm so lucky because they grew back when I stopped plucking them out. And I'm very thankful to my mother and her mother for that. Your eyebrow grabbing castor oil on my eyebrows. So I remember when you showed up. I thought you

looked like Janine Turner. Is that Is that what I'm thinking of exposure? Yes? Yes, because she had that cute mole, have a cute mole, and I was like and also just that kind of like sultry like raise one eyebrow, give you that like side eye look. And I was like, Oh, she's got that thing that Sherylyn Fenn has it too, you know, like you you embodied those women who just kind of had like a little bit of mystery to them. Um. And it was such a good introduction to Brooke Davis

because she does she gives like such good cheerleading side eye. Man. You were also exactly what the energy that the show needed. I mean that they introduced Jake with the boys and you with the with the girls and the Girl's Tea, and it was like every everybody got a little we have We'll talk more about Jake in a minute, but um,

I loved what you the energy that you brought. It was like just bubbly and fun and but there was a depth there which we saw when you were talking about um, your future and you know, your fear and we were saying um in when we were watching it. We were talking with each other and saying that that line about you know, I'll here's what's going to happen un as I get fat. And it's like, I can see how so many girls who went into audition would have read that as like a funny line. But you know,

family talk about why you knew how to nail that line? Yeah, gosh, I think because and we've we talked about this a little bit. When we first got together to talk about this um there was so much about Brooke I didn't understand and that I couldn't relate to. And I I was so scared to admit I didn't know. So I like was desperately trying to figure it out. And so the sultry cheerleader, I was like they they yes, side, I was like, that's what they do. Like I never

held a fair of pomp bombs, you know. And and and the interesting thing for me was those were the things I had to find in her, and like her boldness and and her her very over sort of sexiness and stuff made me scared. But the the fear I

could understand because I was a raid. And then that fear in particular I really understood because I'd seen girls who were in families like that, families that said, you've got to do this job, or you've got to be in this pageant, or you need to do this, and don't you ever gain an ounce, because then you'll never get a man, and you'll And I watched girls wither under that. I had a friend in high school who had to go to rehab for an eating disorder because

she grew up in a family like that. And it was heartbreaking and scary as a teenager to see a friend go to the hospital, you know. And and so for me that line, to not play it as a joke, to play it as a deep seated fear, felt really honest for things I'd seen before. That made all the difference with your character. Well, did they ever talk to you about the trajectory of Brooke, Like, did you know that down the road Brooke Davis would become like the

voice of reason? No? No, no, I mean, my god, I I thought in the beginning, And you know, we'll get to it in the next episodes. But if our if our o G fans are here, they've seen them before. Um, Like, you know, I thought that the stunt in the back seat of the car, which I think might be in the episode after this was like a one time thing, was a stunt. I didn't know that. You know, they were really going to try to push me to behave

that way, to be this like outlandish girl. And now it's funny because at the time I was like, this is ridiculous and high school girls aren't promiscuous like this, And now I'm like, who am I to call any woman promiscuous? Rude? But you know, at the time, I just was like, I don't know, and and you know, years into the show, I think they were just like, we're so sick of fighting with you that we're just going to start to make her more like you, which

was fun. I won, and then there were there were like, way is I got to be so bold? Like later down the line, you know when I trashed that cafe across from Karen's, Like I would never do that, but god, don't you just fantasize about like walking in a room and just shoving everything off a table? Like she felt so free to me in ways that I never did. But but yeah, I had no idea what she was

going to be. All they said to me was, you know, we've got this show, and it's so good and everyone everyone's dealing with sadness, and we need somebody who's really happy and likes to mix it up. And I thought when I read that line about I'll be you know, successful and get everything I ever want unless I get fat, I thought, Oh, that's the hint. That's a hint for who she really is. Didn't you guys grow up hearing like I'm going to go to college and get my mrs.

I knew. I knew girls who grew up in the South who said that, I don't know what an mrs is. I'm sorry, that's your degree. You're going to go to college to whoever you're dating your senior year in college. That's such a Southern thing to say. Yeah, I mean where I grew up, it was like, oh, yeah, I'm going here to get my mrs. You know, all the engineers go to this school, all the architects go to

this school, all the lawyers go to this school. Yeah, that's a very Southern and I guess like upper upper echelon East Coast too, But I don't know that they'd say it that way. I mean, the Rednecks still say it. Joy. Yeah, I lived in Dallas till I was twelve. I should know. That's how you get out of that lower that lower system. You're like, I'm gonna go get my mrs. She got into the state school. She's gonna do well. You know.

Think about the trajectory that Brooke took, though. That's so interesting that you would start in that place of genuinely like just being like all those other you know, the example of all those other type of girls that you are just talking about, um, which I hate saying anyway, type of anything like the generalization. Everyone's obviously got all their own individual struggles, but there is some sort of collective community similarity in that way that she would have

come from. And to see her go from that too, the incredibly empowered woman that she became, I mean, that's such an interesting and heroic journey. I loved that I did too, and I loved I loved that she made it feel possible for so many people, and I loved that she always found it with women. So many girls

are raised to seek validation from men, you know. And I even think back to all of us being kids and you know, trying to figure it out and be in relationships while we were there, and that's how you think you're a grown up, But really you grow up. Really you find your people in the women in your lives first and foremost. And you know, we've all been together for a hell of a lot longer than most of us have been with anybody else. You know, I've

been in my marriage exactly. And so then I was like, wait, how long is a twelve? I was like trying to do the math real quick in my head. I need to write it down when I do it, um. But I I thought that that was so special, like even you talking about her trajectory. You know, Brooke launched her

business living with Haley. Brooke made decisions about her future with Peyton, like I loved being able to despite so many ways in which like a group of old men writing for us made me say that teenage girls would never say your poor name. Come on, we would never as long as we're addressing, Wait, what your first pets in your mother's maiden name? My first pet was Shepherd, and my mom's maiden name is well, I can't tell

people my mother's maiden name. That's like questions at the Social Security Office calls and asks you, wait, then, what are our characters mother's maiden names. Do we know that? Well, then we I just said mine, So you guys go, oh yeah, mine's Bunny Regard. Well do you know Ellie's maiden name? I don't know Victor Elli Harp it was Harp. Oh. I don't think Peyton had a pet. I had a dog named Misty. I feel like she would Misty Harp. Misty Harp definitely got her. Mrs Misty Harp's out there.

I'm so sorry. I just want to, um, gosh, I don't know that Victoria had a maiden name that I was aware of. Um. But my our first dog's name was Bouncer because my mom could make that. He was from Bodyguard. So Bouncer Davis is kind of hideous. Usual. I just see boobs everywhere, but totally not something that a teenage girl would talk about. You handled the naughty talk, baby. Why. Here's why I had to because, oh my gosh, wait, guys,

you have a producer. It's Victorian Montgomery. See, this is why we have people helping us make this show, because they know the things we don't. So Bouncer Montgomery is even worse. Yeah, it sounds like an old like Southern gothic. Oh my god, William Faulkner character, But go back, go back, because you're right, you know, Mail. The reason why I had to was, I mean, it's definitely something that I would have said something about, like I don't wanna you know,

why are we talking about this. That's not something teenage girls would talk about. And I was also really conservative and at the time and just very you know at the time at the time. We'll take more about where you are now after the show. Um, but look, I mean when I joined the show, I was told, in no uncertain terms, this show is about geting and sucking. I can't believe said that to you. Almost spit what it was, like, you, she's going to be prude, she needs she can't be on this show. And it was

just so outrageous. So anyway, so I knew that, you know, like I was going to have to like, you know, I knew my character, so I wasn't concerned that my character was like going to go in a direction that I would have felt compromised in or whatever. So I was like, OK, I think you were going to wind up naked in a back seat. I didn't like if it was on too that's right, I'm going to sing

you a song. Tell Yeah. So when that line showed up in the script, I was like, Okay, I'm just gonna I'm just gonna pardon the fun I'm gonna suck it up, and uh, oh my god, it writes oh my god. Yeah, so that's where that came from anyway. But by the way, two episodes in a row, now Hayley's making comparisons to Dawson and Joey because you say it's Dawson's freak, Like, did you think that Hayley and Lucas were hooking up in the show? I did. I thought for sure, same. Yeah, I think that's what they

were originally going for. But Chad and I had no chemistry, so it just didn't work. Yeah. I mean I kind of felt that way with James because when I met James on the pilot, like we went out with our parents, you know, and like we were buddies, and I I also was like such a proof that I hadn't like really kissed that many people in real life, So you know, kissing kissing James on the show was like weird and

that was hot and heavy. In the backseats they shot that scene multiple times because they realized that neither one of us that ever kissed on television before, right, so, which means like neither one of us had been being directed. The very first scene that you ever have to like, hook up is the weirdest thing ever because it's not real. So you're like, oh, no tongue, no tongue. Is this a conversation? We need to have hands? Where those go?

And you're a teenager, you're so awkward talking about your body or kissing anybody in the first place. And I was twenty one and James was seventeen, and there was a legality thing in the back of my mind where I'm like, God, am I going to prison? Like home men?

So there was just so much going on, and there's forty people staying around and you're shooting it at four o'clock in morning and everybody just wants to go home, and you're like, god damn, it just kissed me the way we're spposed to kiss and like I don't need to do and you're supposed to know what to do. I don't know what to do. Yeah, They're like, run your hand up her leg and he's probably okay, Can

I don't joy. They did a whole series of inserts of just his hands on different body parts of mine, and I'm just thinking, like, did I put lotion on? Did I shave? Are we supposed to shave from the knee up now? Because I've been one of those girls who like, you were a slut if you shaved from the knee up, you know. And I don't think it until I joined the show that I was like, oh, yeah,

I guess I should do that. When they start doing insert work on your thigh, god yeah, And it was just that was so um traumatic and oh my god. I never I didn't think about this until just now. You know what made me realize that James was like a child is that we did this like a whole take of kissing and it went on and on and on and on, and I'm like, somebody cut, somebody will cut. This is so uncomfortable. And finally they yell cut and James goes sorg and I was like, what I said, Sorg,

I remember what is sword? And he goes gross backwards and you made T shirts, Hillary, I did sure teenage a literal teenager. Sorg kissing you is sorg kissing you sord right now. Oh my god, it was gross. Guys. Sorry, Oh my god, that's so funny. God, I was jealous because I was like all the Joy's kisses with James seemed really like like passionate and really like gentle and loving, and James and I like we were like two um cobras just biting each other. They really captured the teenage

hormones each other. Is this how we do it? Smash your face against my come on, let's head about each other, chip our teeth. But interestingly, it feels so authentic for sure, Like so much of what was so special about the show is how authentic things felt and how honest they were and like unpolished. Who was your first kiss in real life? Sophia go, no, you go okay, my first bread?

I mean I had like a there was there was like a summer camp kiss with this really tall, green eyed Spanish boy was very tall and and like chubby and just super like like a big like a linebacker. And he kissed me out on the ropes course at summer camp. But there was no tongue. There was no tongue. It was just limps and it was it was a smooth but it was like slow and sweet. But then my French kiss, my first French kiss was this boy and we were in his basement and he kissed me,

but he licked all the outside of my mouth. It was like, I don't I guess neither of us knew what I definitely know. I was like, I feel like this is not the way it's supposed to be done. There's not video evidence of that. Oh man, oh no, I will say and I will never tell you who. But I had one of the most aggressive and inappropriate kisses I've ever had on camera on our show What About You know what it is? I feel like joy I've told you this, but I will never reveal to

the audience. But I was bitten by someone. Oh that's right on our show. And when I said for the whole time now, and I don't think that take made it because I hit him. I mean I didn't like hit him in the face. I just like shoved him back because it really hurt. And I said, what are

you doing? And he goes, I'm being sexy and I was like, it's not sexy like I'm being There has to be like somewhere there's probably that in an outtake and for his sake, I hope it doesn't come out, because like I don't want to ruin his future prospects. But oh man, I was like, you need to talk to someone about this, and don't bite my face again, sir. Sexual activity is such a luck of the draw thing as you grow up in life, like who you end up being able to kiss? Yeah exactly. I mean that

it makes a big difference. Hillary, who do you kiss for the first time? Well, my first like prude kiss, um, no tongue kiss, that's the differentiation. Tongue no, Yeah, exactly, first, no tongue kiss. I'm doing the Music Man in fifth grade and there's a sixth grade boy who has really good hair and it's a very good dresser and in the play with you, totally in the play with me, and it is such a babe, and we get along

and we like all the same things. And so I google him as an adult and he is a hairdresser and a flight attendant now and he definitely, um is gay. And I feel so like flattered that he thought I was worth kissing in my super awkward years. Like it was one of those things that I was like, oh my God, of course, like yes, our energies were very but also that's been a common theme in my life

ever since, you know. Um, and then tongue kiss was I had started dating a really bad boy in high school, like a bad and I was not a bad girl. And he, I guess that's like the chicken dated before me, like had a kid and stuff. Like he was definitely is actually active, and I wouldn't kiss him for like eight months, Like I was like, no, I'd like peck him, but I was like, if you put your tongue in my mouth, I'm a whore, Like that's it, it's over.

And so finally homecoming night we went to homecoming, we come home, he's dropping me off. I finally like lean over and he puts his tongue in my mouth, and it's like he's a very he's very experienced and he's a very good kisser. And all of a sudden, the brights of my dad's truck flip on behind us, and I'm just like, of course, of course, of course. Um yeah it was you know, it was like sitcom. I'm just like, thanks dead. Finally you ruin into my moment.

You ruined my tonk is dead. Sophia who are you stuck in face with Oh man, it's so sweet. My my first no tongue kiss and my first frensh kiss. We're with the same person, no are you? Yeah? Yeah? You guys my high school sweetheart until the end of my junior year in high school. It was my best friend from summer camp since I was nine. My god, like the sweetest little bunny, just the best person, the

best person. And I feel so I feel like, on the one hand, so lucky, and on the other hand, I'm like, you were so nice that you made me so naive in the world. God damn it. I just had no idea. But yeah, I don't know. It was just like so lovely. It was a sweet way to kind of grow up and like fall in love and have it last for so long. And I remember when we were just like we've been together for so long and we'd never experienced anything else, And um, I mean,

did you think you were going to get married? Oh? You were? I was like, I was the Haley James. I was like, this is it. And I also think back and I'm like that sweet teenage boy who never pressured me into having sex with him, who just was like, it's okay that you're not ready, like literally for years, for almost a decade. My god, when you consider the fact that we like fell in love and hell to hands at summer camp at nine. Um, you know, we broke up when we were sixteen, and I remember just

being devastated. I remember laying on the floor, like the cold tile floor of the bathroom, just sobbing because I was like, Okay, I don't know how this has happened, and I know it was right, but what's going on? And I went to school and I had told my best friend and when I like walked into school, she came to meet me. And we walked in and everyone was like, oh my god, what happened? Because I think

I looked really sad. And she said she looked at two of the girls we were friends with, and she goes, the couple of the century just broke up and said we heard about Brad Pitton Jennifer Aniston and they were like, no, you ding Dons or Brad and Gwyneth back then actually yeah, And we were all so sad because they were like so emo and hot and they had the same haircut and yeah, and she was like no self, and everyone was like no, we were like the teenage love story.

It was so sweet. Eat. Speaking of sweetness, let's talk about Brian green Man. The sweetest he was. He really was. We got robbed when he went and did his other show, like an HBO show. Fine. I feel like we'd all have had a much. I just feel like things would have been better if he'd stayed. I might be giving my cards away here. Listen, Sophia and I at the time, it's so in love with him. We really were joy.

You were hanging out with Chef. You were like on the Chef train, and Sophia and I over at the Riverview Sweets. I remember writing down in the elevator of the Riverview Sweets with you. And I was in a relationship, so I could not say I think Greenberg is cute, but I was like he's so he's self fun. It is just like he's really cool, you know. And you were like, oh yeah, yeah, Well you and I were like little girls just being like, oh my god, he's

so cute. Oh my god. Like when you're so young that you get excited that someone else thinks the person you think is cute is cute because it's just so exciting and validation and you have that damn guitar everywhere. That's right. Yeah, he was a babe and by the way, like stay to babe, like he's still the nicest suite on the planet. Love how much he loves his wife, like he is the guy that he was then, like

there was nothing false about him. That's what I loved about him as an actor too, is when you watch him on screen, he there's there's nothing fake. He's he can't be um anything other than just real in that way. You know, he's so genuine when he takes that bag in just my heart because it's such a thing Dan does to Lucas going his son and then it's you know,

his son again another double entendre um. But and you see the heartbreak on Chad's face playing Lucas in that scene, and you're just like it knocks the wind out of you. And then Brian comes in don't let him take it, and just takes the bag and puts it over his shoulder. Hold on. I love how we refer to most of the actors by their character's name, but with Greenberg, were like Brian, like it was really his joy. Brian's a hero.

I was told you know in like season two, the Peyton and Jake were in game and I was like, hey, and I think they just said that to throw me off the trail. Okay, this is a good place for us to talk about this because we all got told lots of things that weren't the same. And I was told by the away from day one that Peyton and Lucas were endgame, Like I signed up for a pilot in which Peyton was not willing to admit that she loved the you know, the emo boy, And so you

got told Peyton and Jake were endgame? But did you did that because they wanted me to not lean into the chat of it? Do you know what I mean? Like it was it was a mind game. Oh heaven forbid. They just tell us what our jobs are as actors because we're professionals. Um, It's like, why did they want us to like be weirdly invested in things behind the scenes? Joy? Did you did you always know it was gonna be Haley and Nathan or did you think it was going

to be something or someone else? No? I was surprised. I thought it was going to be Haley and Lucas for a little bit, but then our energy was so sibling nous that there was just no Yeah, I just didn't that didn't happen. Um, So I don't know, I'm

trying to remember. I think it was yeah once. Uh. I'll be interested to see when this happens, because I think it's later on in season one, when Haley starts tutoring Nathan, And I think that was originally just supposed to be an extra conflict of interest with Lucas, like Lucas's best friend is now has to work with Nathan. But James and I, you know who knew we had chemistry and on screen and as soon as we started, you know, getting on together, it was like people started

liking it. And there were message boards back then, and I so, I'm I don't know, it would be nice to talk with some of the writers on our show who were there at that. I was told after the pilot. I was told after the pilot that that Nathan and Haley we're going to be like really, oh yeah, that was part of the reason they recast because they were like, no, we need Nathan and Haley like she's gonna fix him.

And I was like, interesting, yeah, So, I I mean they told me and that's why they were like, you know, we need someone who is sexy so but like doesn't act like it, you know, so that Nathan gets drawn in by this understated thing. And so so all of my codependent issues really worked for me in this life. Yeah, I was here to save him. High school girl with codependent issues. Guys, we cannot bring home the fixer uppers. Like for any teenage girl listening right now, don't bring

home the baggage. Just leave it at school. And anyone who tells you you make me want to be better, no, no run for the hills. I remember my dad using a metaphor that he thought I would understand because my parents literally in college, I rescued so many dogs and I would always bring them in my parents house for a night before I could figure out where to take them.

It is, it'll get there, it'll come back around. My dad was like, if you bring home one more straight dog into this house where we already have dogs, I will literally change the locks and never let you back in. So I was like, Okay, I guess six was too many, but okay fine. And years later, you know, fast forward, I don't know we're in our like mid twenties and my dad just said, no more sick puppies. Rescue dogs,

not people. And I just remember being like just sobbing because I never I didn't understand that that the sort of I don't know that that desire or that subconscious thing. Basically, Joy, what I'm saying is I have codependency issues, said them, I'm glad we share that, and I just I didn't know that that was bleeding into spaces where it could be, you know, detrimental to me. And so, yeah, baggage at school, puppies, the shelter, just keep just keep your keep on moving

out there kids, the promise. Um, can we talk about Dan because this really was like a dance centric episode manipulating all the kids. But it's so weird to see how young all the parents are show, and as a parent now, it is interesting to watch those storylines which we noted earlier that it was well, I'm recognizing for the first time why one of the reasons why our show is so popular among such a broad age range because you could watch it with your kids, um, in

high school or you know whatever. I don't know what age is appropriate for this show, but um, at the time you would watch it with your young adults, and then the grownups would watch it as well because they had storylines that they were interested in. And I think it's really cool. I'm liking watching the parents storyline now.

I didn't really care much when I was twenty. When Dan tells Nathan, Nathan says, oh, he's hitting on my girlfriend right in front of me, And Dan says, you know, if you're going to get in a fight, getting a fight over something important. I remember feeling so slighted as a young person, but now as an adult, like if my son came home, I was like, I'm going to fight over a girl. I feel like you big idiot, Like what are you doing? And so to find myself as a grown up siding with Dan Scott like what

if I become that's crazy? Yeah? And Karen watching Karen um, you know, not go to the game and wrestle with Like I want to support my son, but I just can't go beat That must have been hard. I'll be curious to know what Moira has to say about that, because that's that's a hard choice to justify, Like to not be able to get past your own uh issues with the you know, for her for Karen not to be able to get past her issues with Dan and you guys not show up. Have you gone back to

your high schools in real life? Yes? When'd you go? Um? Five? Six, seven years ago? Seven years ago? Probably just walked through the halls. I went back for a fundraiser, but I don't even remember when it's gotta it's got to be

at least that long. It's just so weird because we have these like fake high school memories and like the sets that we walked through as as as many times as we walked through a real high school halls, you know, and so to go back to like the real space that's seen with Karen being like, you know what, what did she say? That place knows too much. I can't go back there. That too much, too much. I got

chills when she said that, Uh I did? I think we all have places that feel like that, And I think, in a way, isn't it interesting that our show has carried that energy for us in a sense until we've been like, no, wait, this is ours and we made it and it was awesome. We're taking it back, you know, it's a big thing and enjoy to your point, what when you asked like how, I wonder how m mairear

did that. I think our experience in Wilmington actually being so isolated on our show because it was like it was all college kids and retired people mostly like you. It really was like we just had each other. It was very insular. It was very small, and so I think at times when we were figuring ourselves out, it could make failure feel so much bigger. And I don't know.

I would almost wager that maybe for her it was every single person who's in that gym tonight has a story about me, Like there's no anonymity in a town like tree Hill. That was kind of part of the point, um was how in everybody's everybody else was So I don't know, I'd be curious to know that. Yeah, for sure. Yeah. This was also the episode where we got to hear the theme song for the first time. Yeah, we had

our opening credits. Yes, I don't want to be in That song comes on and I like walk into a restaurant or whatever I'm liked or am I like proud of it? Do I like walk around secretly being punked? I think it used to be that, like in supermarkets or in restaurants. It was on a loop, so you knew that like no one. It was just like a block of music that played over and over again. Now with the way like Spotify or like technology works, I feel like I'm being punked because it's everywhere. I'm like,

are we've followed? Are they tracking our phones? Does someone think this is funny that they're like, it could be her or it could not be her, But this is how we're going to find out. And then and then if you get weird, if you get socially awkward, it's her, it's her. It's totally. Oh god, I do love that song. I still love it. I think it's such a good so that whole album is really strong. Gavin degras what's

the album? It's Chariot, right. The album is called Chariot and the song at the end of the episode was a Gavin Degrass song also called Belief, which is a super powerful song. He's such an amazing songwriter. Her partying with him at fire Belly. When did he come visit? Was it the show flo episode? Yeah, the Yokra episode. He came back to visit. He was there a few times. He came back in the end Yeah, he was in and out. Yeah, he played like our kickoff party. I

think like we premiered. He came to Wilmington's and like played at a bar or something. But I just remember like being around a pool table with Gavin de All being like, wow, he's really famous. Yeah, so cool that he's sang our song. Yeah, he's fun time too. He's a great guy. Did you tour with him? Yeah, yep, I went on tour with him and Michelle Branch and, Um, yeah, he's just like he's got that swagger. He's got that like you know, deep artistic soulful heart, but has also

like got a he's a great time. He'll just you know, shoot the shop with anybody, who'll have a conversation with anybody from anywhere. He's a curious person. And I just think he's a super cool guy. Um to catch on and off and yeah, he's a good guy. Has he ever come to one of the conventions? No, but he should. They should bring him out, Gavin. If you're listening, Gavin, don't be a dork. Come hang out with us. It's so fun. We'll just bring him on this show is

what we need to do. I had one of my coolest moments with Gavin he when he opened for Billy years later after the show was ended, he opened for Billy Joel on Billy Joel's tour, and everybody that knows me knows what a freak I am about Billy Joel. Like I know every song, I know every word every song. He's my favorite. So I went to a Joel concert and he was opening, and I I had like I texted him, but you know, I didn't hear. I was like, you know, he's getting ready to go do a show.

He's not gonna respond. So I was sitting in the front and he and Gavin does his song, and he starts doing our theme song and he's like walking down around the audience and it's like a Hollywood bowl, so you can come down the side of the stage and come around the middle and up the middle. And as he comes around up the middle, he's got security around him. And I was like and I just like I told my friend who was with us, off the right back, and I just ran out into the aisle and like

rushed him like a crazy fan. And I got right up in his space like and I was like and I and I was like, either he's gonna see me and he's gonna let me sing this with him, or he's going to be totally freaked out, and like they're gonna the security is gonna take me away, but I'm gonna take the reds gut he w. I'm at a Belly Joel concert. I have to do it. So I ran up and uh, and he definitely was like uh.

And then his face wished when he saw me and recognized me, and it was like, oh god, it brought me in and we sang on the mic together for a second but it was so great, and then he went up. They put us up on the big tron or whatever the big screen is. We were singing together. So I staying at a Billy Joel talk concert. Technically he texted me afterwards he was like, I have a cold. You might want to take some vitamins see when you go. Also, though,

I just love your boldness. You're like, I'm going to rush the performer joy your iconic Yeah, I would have been too scared, Like what if had been there to catch me getting like, you know, clotheslines by security? Who's the broad you know? Life is short? Yeah? I like that you went for it. Um speaking of going for it, this whole Peyton art thing. Um, people all the time, I want to know who drew those pictures. Like, I'm

just gonna say it wasn't me. We had like trained professionals that did all the artwork and so all the stuff that you see. Um, maybe our awesome producer can pull up her name. Yeah, be nice to know the name of the person that did all that. I don't know. I don't know if it was the same person. We

had such a great art department. You know. Some of the artwork though that was taped up to the wall that Peyton tears down was stuff that I drawn during the pilot and then they just like ripped it out of the notebooks that they've given me and taped it up because it was like we gotta cover some wall space. Um. So all of my real art is the trash art and it was drawn by It's on their Hillary and the chat they just Helen Ward. Did Helen do all seasons?

I mean it's iconic. People make you know, those canvases that they want us to sign a conquestion making money that I do too. There's a little coffee table book Peyton Pictures Sad stuff. You know, what's so weird is that when the show started, it was like our art, but I'd come from MTV and I'm like not an arty lady, but I did have like the music thing going, and so the transition from art to music for Peyton, it was one of those things where it was like

art imitating life, you know, and and Sophia. You just talked about this like your character had to turn into Sophia a little bit more in order for it to fit right, Joy, did you feel, I mean they added you becoming a musician because you were such a skilled

musician in real life. You know, yeah, they did. I mean I think that our I did love that about the show, that there was a heavy, heavy bent on our artists, um prowess being whether it was writers or people who were reading you know, great literature or art, great music. Um, I mean those are cornerstones of our show. That um again something that is a little harder to find now in this genre. And I just love that.

And yes, I think, you know, it's just total providence, uh, coincidence, whatever you want to call it, that I was able to um be cast on a show that had that one of the music as a major cornerstone, and that you know, I never came on the show thinking I was going to play a musician ever, and I don't think anyone planned that. UM And uh yeah, Mark heard me singing to myself in a parking lot um and just decided to He was like, hey, do you want

to sing on the show? I was like, I don't know, do I I really didn't know because I was like I just it was so much I was uncertain about at the time. But yeah, really glad that I did. It was just super cool. UM opened up a lot of doors for me, and I think, you know, to your point, the idea that we got to talk about music and writing and and really elevate there sort of

pathways into feeling and human experience and catharsis. Those are things that a lot of people weren't getting and and we were all talking during the episode about how interesting it was, Like even in that scene with Lucas and Karen in the cafe when he's so mad and she's yelling at him because he got in a fight with Nathan at school and he's just he's being a boy, you know, he's expressing anger and frustration and and to

see that in that character. And then on the flip side to have Nathan's character being a little boy who has been pressured to behave like a man and like the wrong kind of man, you know, a petty, um narcissistic man. It was so incredible to kind of have these men on this seesaw of feeling. It gave all these people permission and and we, obviously as as the girls, got to do so much of our own um you know. I was going to say leg work, and I'm like,

I guess it's heart work, like emotional stuff. But I think that's part of why it's really lived for a lot of people still is because they no matter what end of the spectrum you come in on you you feel represented in some way. And and I would like to think you feel permission to like feel your feelings in your own complexities and things. Well, did boys cry on TEA? I see? I was never watching teen dramas, so the only boy I ever like no, cried on TV?

Was awesome because I see that meme of James Vanderby now it's like a meme. But did boys cry on TV? Back? Oh? I'm sure they did. I'm sure they really know I feel like this was an episode of Luke Perry crying cha. Chad was really really good about being vulnerable as a boy, you know, and not having to play that toxic masculinity thing of like I don't feel anything, I'm dead inside.

You know, he went for it, And I think that's such an interesting thing too, you know that that they wanted him to play Nathan, and he wanted to do something different than he had been doing for his career, and and you know, isn't it so funny that then and we've talked about this before, but like you had

sweet little baby James coming to play Nathan. He's such a sensitive soul and then had to come in and be bad and it's I don't know, it's just so it's so interesting all the things that we all were able to try and and the ways we had to push ourselves to be these people. Have you guys ever seen James's audition tape, because like room and it's like, hey,

it's nice to see you. Cool, cool, you know what it's like so chill, and then when they just start the scene like I can't imagine that, like turn in the audition, It's like, oh no, I'm evil, you know,

so wild. I also it's striking me in this moment because you know, Hillary, you were talking about how um like even in your scenes, like when when Peyton and Lucas would be doing these emotional scenes, like Chad would always you know, meet you there and then Joy, I remember asking you something when we were working early early years and I was like, how do you do that? Though? Like what what's the mechanism to cry like that? Like

I have to get so sad? And you just looked at me and you were like, well, you know, I just kind of and you did this thing. You went somewhere in your head and you looked to the side and then you were crying, and I was like, what are you kidding me? It was like the most magical thing I've ever seen. And in this moment, it's hitting me that, you know, you guys, you and Chad really came in having had the most experience on sets and

like me, Hillary and James didn't know anything. And yeah, man, but it's but it's cool because I realized that in this moment, I'm like, ah, right, you guys had like these amazing performer skill sets that I just remember. I remember watching you do things and just being like, Wow, we had a lot of fun. We had a lot of opportunities to do that, and you got a lot more opportunities to do all that too. So I I mean,

I think Brooke took you built it for yourself. Yeah, you really did, and I'm so excited for us to see more of that. The next episode is the famous one of you in the back seat of the car. I um, but you know, we get to know a little bit more about Brook. So to all our friends at home, we heard you all really liked are most likely to his last week? And so the three of us did a little digging on the internet and we dug up some pretty excellent most likely too excited about

like they're so ridiculous. We would like if you guys continue to find this fun to pick one every week and decide who we want to attribute it to. What is the one for this week? Okay, who is mostly likely to go on The Bachelor? Not that we've seen her yet, But the moment I saw that come out of the hat, my first thought was deb oh, yes, yes, I deserve a second chapter. I've been dealing with Scott for decades. Yeah, I'm gonna say a probably Rachel. Oh

my god, Daniel hasn't a periodet, but Rachel did. Maxim. Um, yeah, I mean she had all sorts of weird stuff and it didn't after I left. Didn't she end up doing like a TV show with Dan Scott or something weird? Oh? Yeah, she ended up Well do we give away the spoiler? I heard a rumor that they ended up together, Like, she's totally the person to end up on the Bachelor. Yeah, she ended up with the rich guy on a private jet. You're right, it's Rachel. God bless, I love her. Okay,

you guys are flooding our inbox. We love it so much. It's so cool to hear from all of you. Um okay, So we have some questions with listener questions. Are you girls ready for this? How invasive are there? I'm not feeling witty today. I'm sorry. I was going to say something about my last kynecology appointment, but that would be

totally appropriate, okay. Um. Simon was wondering what your first impressions of each other were, which we talked about a little bit, and whether they still remain the same now, and do you think filming on location in particular made you all much closer. Well, I still think Sophia is beautiful, and I was blown away to find out that she was so incredibly brilliant as well, Like what a what an amazing um double double header double hitter? What do they call it? God really told out with both hands

on you, kiddo, She's a winner. Listen. I remember realizing how smart Sophia was when we started doing Crew Christmas presents and we would get the entire crew best Buy gift certificates, and Sophia was a person that was like, you guys are stressing me out. I'm going to handle this. And she would go to best Buy by like a thousand gifts certificates and then have the lists of names and figure out who got what and like being her trailer, just managing that and it was a task. Girlfriend. You

got the money, she got all the money from everything. Yes, and that's pre Venmo and Hillary, I still think you're also beautiful and so cool and so soulful and smart, and I mean yes, our for my first impressionce of both of you stuck and have deepened for sure a hundred percent. Hillary, You're like wickedly intimidatingly cool and so

yourself and and actually something you share. I was just about to pivot to you, Joy, but I realized one of the things that like, I love the most about you both, and that also makes me feel intimidated because I feel like I don't know anything, is you have such a deep well of like expert level musical theater knowledge. Sometimes together, but when the three of us are together, one of you says something and then you go off on a tangent and I'm like, where are they going?

What are they talking about? What is this? It's usually straight to Jean Valjean, Yeah, it's it's it's lames her into the woods. It's one of the two. Yeah. My first impression of Joy, and this is something that continues to ring true is Joy is the all American girl next door. She is wholesome and like so easy to love right out of the gates. But Joy has a naughty streak that I always felt so privileged to know about.

And so just recently we have a mutual friend and we were talking about Joy and she's like, you know, Joy is just so wholesome and so good, and I'm like, what, Joy, are you hanging out? Because I know, I know party, Joy, and she is fun Joy. When Joy lets you into that cut, loose circle, you've made it, that's the that's the upper echelon. It feels real nice because it's true. You're so beautiful and talented and you sing like an angel.

And and I think because you were playing Hayley, we all were like h and then and then we can get into like the Whiskey nights, and you're just like, oh, I've made, I've made. Give me, give me a glass of Johnny Walker and a nice long Virginia Slim and I'll have a real good night. Good bad girls club here we come, bad girls, all right. What's our next question? Oh, Hillary, this one's for you, Stacy says Hillary. In the pilot episode, did you actually almost run over Chad with the comment? Christ?

I mean didn't. So here's what's up. I hadn't really driven a car since high school because I lived in Manhattan, Like why would I drive a car? Uh? And so I came down. I don't know that my license was even good, and they give me this car that is

you know, it's a vintage car. Brakes aren't awesome. It shifts in and out of gear on its own and they're just like, Okay, honey, what you need to do is pick up a little speed and then like hit the brakes and hit this mark exactly because he's just gonna be standing here and because I couldn't even hit a mark walking, Like, how am I gonna Chad's quick? He's limber, he survived. What do you want to out? Yeah? Um, okay, great.

So those are our listener questions. Will you guys keep please, please keep sending them to us to figure out what you want to talk about. We know what we want to talk about. We could just go on and on forever. Can we talk about Joy and her secret talent? This is truly one of the greatest things, and especially you know, a year into not being able to not only be together because we don't live in the same place as all of us, but no one could be together because

of this pandemic. And then it was finally safe for us to do this and we got to do our shoot. And I mean listen, we may or may not have taken all those bottles of Jane Walker home from the bar with us. In my in my defense, I did bring them for us. I brought them as presents. And then we opened them all um Joy's Ranch. No, who

would ever waste a great bottle of whiskey. We took them to Joy's ranch and we were like out with the horses and the dogs, and then we turn around and this goddess woman with her mermaid hair is mixing the stiffest drinks that were just so good. Well, the rose petals are what got me. Joy goes down to her garden and it's just like plucking rose petals to

put in drinks and like she fairy this. It was glorious. Yeah, you made us this like floral version of an old fashioned I mean it's what inspired the cocktails that we literally made with Jack. We got to make boxes of them because of you. So cool, so we got we Okay. I love mixology. It's something that I kind of started over the pandemic, and it's to me, it's kind of like the closest I know how to get to potion making.

Like there's like all these pretty bottles and you can pour stuff out and mix things and they taste good and they make you feel certain ways and it's very exciting. So yeah, it's been become a bit of a hobby. And uh yeah, that was one of my favorite I really love there's a rose syrup. It's it's not a syrup, it's a laqueur. It's rose laqueur. And when you mix it into kind of like an old fashioned style drink

with whiskey, it's particularly particularly great. So um, yeah, I'll have to post that that recipe as well as our our smokey um Lepsongong smoky syrup t infused cocktail that we got to make with Jane Walker, and it's called the Iconic, So pass the word around. That's the Iconic Drama Queen, and we'll post those recipes soon. But yeah, that was fun, and I'm so glad that you girls came over because it was really haven't been able to

really do that just all all together. We were supposed to come to your house just for dinner, and so when I didn't leave to like one o'clock in the morning, it's like like, I hope we get a car out here, and we did. Um, But yeah, it was an adventure. I love it out there, just sitting out on your patio and like seeing the horses and all the stars and being able to catch up. That's like the first time we've gotten to hang out in somebody's backyard since

we were in Wilmington's. Oh my gosh, that's right, that's so true. Yeah, because so much of what we've all been able to do, you know, over the last half decade has been in cities around the world, like we'll go to Montreal, we'll go to Paris. We haven't been able to just sit at home. And it felt so nice. Uh so, how should we wrap up? Guys? Should we talk? I mean, well, we need to talk about what our

favorite lines of the episode are for sure? Okay, well I don't think there's any I mean I guess, well, your Art Matters is, like, that's the one that's like the star line. Yeah, it's it's tattooed on my heart, Like I'm not in real life, guys, Like I don't really have a tattooed, but um it, yeah, I feel like that's the heart of Peyton, Like that line. Everything comes back to that and and it's your art Matters is that iconic line. But it's it's the support line.

It's what got me here, Like that's the whole thing of it. You did something and it made me brave. It didn't matter after you gave him that whole speech, the whole ground up speech at the car and what does it matter, doesn't matter to anybody anyway, and that he took the risk to say that to you in spite of how often you reject him. Boys should always talk to us that way, Just always tell us what we want to hear. Thank you, And I gotta say the sleeper hit for me was definitely that place knows

too much. That was a punch in the gut, the grown up line that hits us now as grown ups, where it's like, yeah, yeah, girls, this has been so fun. I can't wait till our next one. I love you. I'm so dirty from farming today, so I love that this is our lady break like where we get to just like pause and the seventeen year old girls again and have great. Al Right, guys, saddle up, we'll see you next week. H as always were your drama queens.

We love you. We all about that high school drama girl, drama girl, all about them high school queens, and forever we'll take you for a ride at our comic girl cheering for the right drama cueen up girl fashion. But you'll tough, girls. You could sit with us. Girl drama Queens, John mcqueens, Drawn mc queen's drama John McQueen's drama Queens,