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Hey, guys, welcome back.
Look.
Weddings are expensive, and we had one in the last episode, so this was definitely like a paired down episode. It was a yeah, it's a quiet, little, easy breezy episode. Huh.
Was I bored or because we have less of an attention span now because the you know what's put out now, the content that's out is always so fast paced to keep up with everybody's short attention span? Or was it just a boring episode.
All saying things that we've already said ten million times. I like when we do just two on two scenes because it's theater fun. And I thought there were some great nuggets in this.
There were. Yeah.
I like the device of how the montages. It sort of felt like we were doing these merry ground scenes. I liked that one scene would bleed right into the next, and everyone was sort of confronting these ideas of what you want and who have you been and where do you think you're going? All these sort of beautiful themes. Love that, but it did feel slow and clunky. And Hillary, you did a great service to our show and to
Peyton Sawyer doing what you did in this episode. You are a good person and an even better actor.
Right right, Well, here's the thing. I'm a lot older right now, bit as petty as I was in my early twenties, and I just it's hard to look back at yourself and be like, hey, kid, you were juggling a lot in this situation, and uh and you said your lines and you hit your marks. Good job. You know. We'd seen some fan comments before we watch this where they were like, oh god, they're gonna hate this one.
Thank god they've warned us.
Oh god, yeah, I know. If anybody hasn't seen this episode, let's tell them what it was?
What was it?
Season five, episode thirteen. What do we got?
Echoes? Silence, patience, and grace because apparently so many echoes and apparently grace is all we talk about on the show. Anymore.
Oh god, it's a.
Lot of regurgitated dialogue. Yeah, give them this synopsis, Okay.
Lucas picks up the pieces after being left at the altar by Lindsay, Nathan and Hayley deal with the repercussions of Jamie's abduction. Brooke is haunted by her past as she considers adopting, and Peyton is visited by an old friend.
Wait as the get Bork is haunted by her past. She's twenty two.
Right, yeah, her high school pass. There's yeah, so much to say.
How do we break this one down? Because it was a merry go round and and I'll say I like the merry go Round device, Yeah for a lot an act, maybe two acts, but I kept waiting for us to get off the ride and like actually get into what was going on.
It was so introspective.
A couple of loops would have been good. And by act three I was like, well, no, I just have motion sickness. We're just we're still doing this, We're still spinning around. Okay, very are you know?
We could perform this as a stage show on one of those like rotating stages like Ley miss using.
Like Hamilton, do you walk in one direction and the stage skins.
Everybody's picking up the last line of the last person seeing the first line and the next scene.
Yeah, I was very carefully crafted. It definitely felt to me it felt overwritten, and it felt like kind of it kind of felt masturbatory, like you just like the writer just sitting there, just here's all my pros and let me just find all the ways to say things that. It was just very like, all right, already, can we like we get it?
Yeah, we got it.
I thought we all looked good though we looked good.
We did. Yeah, I mean my haircut was a crime, but I will be clear. We copied Victoria Beckham's bob that year. So it was a moment in fashion history. Yes, it just has aged so poorly. And y'all I have such a big skull, like I'm not meant to have short tight hair like that.
I'm just not tight air.
It's not good.
I like that little suit vest get up that you wore when you picked Jamie up. I was like, she's professional. What doesn't this woman seeing her?
I've just dressed up in a soup for my interview that my mother tanked.
This whole thing was so bizarre to me, I mean, let's just start talking about that part, because Okay, I I don't know, I haven't got I actually have looked into adoption at times in my life, and I haven't gotten that far into the process where I'm sitting down one on one with somebody, But I am The one thing that seems to be the real barrier for most families with adoption is money. And I get that it was fifty thirteen years ago. I don't ask me to do math, but I get it was a while ago.
But I don't know. There's just so many kids out there that need homes. I really have a hard time believing that anyone would judge someone's pick apart someone's.
High school history, school, high school boyfriends is my favorite question. It's so absurd.
It's so absurd, And to look at this incredibly successful, driven woman and then decide to not recommend her to have a child simply because she's questioning the motive, Like there's no history in Brook's life that would say that, oh, she just has a whim and then walks away from it. That's not who Brooke is at all. Like she started a company and was followed through with it. Her friendships she stayed and followed through in spite of difficulties. I mean,
there's just so much I don't know. I didn't buy it. I didn't buy it.
I didn't buy it either. The pettiness of that woman being like, didn't you date that boy and didn't your friend maybe your heart broken over his failed wedding too, and you decided you need a baby? Like what it was? So like mustache Spinny, there.
Would have been some action in this episode at least if you had just flat out bust it out, laughing at her, just.
Like I'm so sorry, what's happening? Is this happening?
Yeah?
Like insanity.
Yeah.
I learned a lot about adoption from Willie Garson because he adopted his son right at the same time that I gave birth to Gus, and when we met, we were like, you know, new parents together. And he adopted his son when Nathan was like seven eight years old, so he was an older kid but still very young,
and Willie before he met anybody. You have to do a series of classes, yeah, right, And there's you know, night classes you have to take and social workers teach you how to do stuff, and it's a pretty extensive process you go through before you get to this phase of like, I don't know, you shoplifted in high school. I don't think you're ready for this because they are trying to judge you by who you are now, you know, and like how stable you are and do you show up every week and all of that.
Who did you turn into in spite of having parents that were a complete disaster.
Yeah, it would have been great to see Brooke do that kind of training and really, you know, really get into what that exploratory process is as opposed to this, I don't know what are they do things interview people should bring a clipboard, you know, they're just definitely guessing here well.
And one of the things that drives me insane about all of this as well is like people when I think about my friends, you know, who've adopted, and like two of my best friends adopted both of their kids
through the foster care system. What they have gone through as dad's the way they have advocated for their children, like what it takes to go out and give a home to a child, the amount of work, Like even the fact that we didn't address like Brooke could have gone and gotten a donor, she could have gone out with the explicit desire to like get pregnant and be a mom. You know, she has sat here and said,
I want to adopt. I want to give a home to a kid who doesn't have the life they deserve, who has been given up for what ever circumstance, and provide a child with a better life than I have, Like, you know, as a single woman, to make that choice
is such a signal of like effort and seriousness. To me, It's like, you know, when we see these lunatics in some of the states in our nation trying to stop gay parents from adopting, I'm like, no kid has ever been more wanted or advocated for, like stop enough, you know.
Any So many people go out and like who get pregnant and whoopsie accident, like and it bothers me that that we leaned into like shaming this woman, but we didn't talk at all about what it means to make that decision, the effort you're willing to make, the advocacy of that to your point about really adopting becomes a part of your life, Like you have to jo life. Yeah, you have to jump through hoops to adopt a child that you simply don't if you, you know, go out.
And if you get knocked up. Yeahah, And I like, I don't.
I don't mean to judge anybody, like look by the way, like I have so many friends who struggled through fertility, Like becoming a parent is hard for a lot of
people a lot of the time. Yeah, but there's also you know what Brooke says, like nobody made my mom get interviewed, nobody made her take a class like should have, and it it feels like such a missed opportunity here, And I don't know, like having so many friends who've been through it, and you know who in our country and countries around the world, like Italy with that fascist woman who's taking lesbian moms off their birth certificates of their children. Like I'm so angry about the way like
modern families and adoptive parents get treated. And I forgot that Brooke got shamed in this episode by the adoption woman.
I'm just like, oh my lord, She's like, are you gonna get married?
Are you gonna get married? Do you do you drink?
Do you date?
You dated boys in high school?
Like what you're into a bartender? Now? Does he drink?
He makes drinks like owen sober, Like.
You took care of an addict? How dare you?
You didn't turn your back on some way he was struggling monster. Oh it just like fires me up and makes me so upset.
It just means they didn't google adoption process. No one googled it. Heyes, jeeved it. Whatever the we were doing back then, Like it's so easy. Did you just say ask jeeved it? The children won't know what that means.
Say, well, know what that means. But it was cool back then.
I'm trying to remember where this goes, because was it? There was something about this actress though, because she I really liked her. I really liked that. She wasn't mean or bitchy or snooty or I mean, she was very warm.
She dis got such a good actress.
Yes, so it's such a such a a warmth and openness about her. And when she left after Brooke gives the big speech, I remember feeling like, I think this whole thing was a test so that she could see how far Brook would fight for what she wants. Do we remember if that's where it's going, I.
Don't remember, but I will say when we had that confrontation, and I got to deliver the I Am one in a million speech. Yeah, watching it today, I was like, oh, I see it. Something's turning for her, Like it's gonna change. Yeah. I don't know how quickly Angie comes into the picture, but I know that I foster that little girl with this terrible haircut. So, for whatever that's worth it, I hate that haircut so much.
It's your mom haircut.
Yeah, trying to look older and responsible. But yeah, I thought Judith played it so beautifully. I just I think again. You know, this was the writer's strike back then. These scripts were turned in and then they were never edited. It's so clunky, it's so intense. It wasn't researched, it wasn't based in any sort of a reality. Yeah, she made a whole meal with what was barely an appetizer on the page for her. So then hats off to her, but oh yeah, it just like, oh it makes me so mad.
I like this idea that you mentioned a little bit of, you know, Brooke a kid who came from a no parent home, that little thing of like, did you come from a single parent home? I came from a no.
Parent, no parent home.
Yeah, this idea that Brooke wants to find another child with a no parent home and provide that. You know, I think as we get older, there's a lot of mother work that is done in therapy and things like that, and I have found I didn't realize that not everyone on the planet wants to be a mom like their whole life. Because I did. I was like, you know, five six years old, like sleeping with baby dolls, like
these are my children? Yeah? And then when I met people that were like, no, I'm good man, I was like, oh, wow, cool. And I have a daughter who has zero interest in being a parent. She is I'm like, do you want a baby doll? She's like, that's disgusting, And in my mind, in my mind, I'm like, it's because it's because I felt like I needed to correct some things, right, Like I'll just have my own kids and do it my
way and it'll be so much better. My daughter doesn't feel like she needs to correct anything, and so she saw don cycle. The cycle ends here, killing it. I'm gonna interpret it. She'll hear this in therapy so many years later and she'll be like, mom, that wasn't it
at all. I didn't want a baby that idea, of course, correcting in order to find like, I don't know, you're safety net, you know, like wanting to have someone to love is a basic human instinct and pivoting away from like dudes and making it about like what can I pour love into, you know, as opposed to what will love me back.
Yeah, it's a great distinction.
It's an important pivot for Brooke.
Yeah, I love it, especially for someone who is taught to only find her worth in being validated by others, to say no, no, I feel best about myself actually when I give to others. Yeah, when I support my friends, when I help people achieve their dreams. And she wants to do that in this role as a mom because of what she's experienced as a godparent and you know, as this auntie to Jamie. I think it's really this
special distinction. And I don't know, maybe because that's a hard one sort of sense of self worth for her, Maybe that's why I feel a little protective and I'm like, really blew this storyline. We could have done it better. Yeah, Like sometimes when people with our characters, I feel like they're working with you. Got like, like my actual friends, I'm like, no, Hayley James deserved better poles, we are
deserved better. Like I get really like I get protective of us even though it's not us us, Like I don't know, I think, yeah, same, I think to your point, the way we are talking about this and that evolution, Yeah, it could have been acknowledged, better, handled better. It could have been a bigger deal if we'd gone deeper with it.
We're rushing into it. It's been one month since you told Peyton and Lucas, I want to have a baby.
Well, also, none of that stuff was well thought out, Like, no, now Brooks out here trying to adopt. She's not trying to have a baby with Lucas. She's never gonna have a baby with the man who is the love of her best friend's life. Like that was insane, and it's like, what did we do it for? We didn't even follow through on it.
That's what frustrates me, that the lack of follow through, because there are so many kids that need to be adopted in so many families who have gone through adoption, and how difficult that journey can be. What amazing opportunity that would have been to share that journey on our show through a character that's so beloved, and you could have taken the time and walked through that. I think so many people would have showed up for that and loved to go through that journey with Brooke.
Well and the other side of the journey choosing to build a modern family. Asking a friend to be a donor, sure is such a big deal, and something so sacred and like could have also been a big deal. But it's like we sort of dishonored both realities that people go through, and I wish we hadn't because it felt out of character for her and it felt like it sort of cheapened both experiences a little bit. But to your point, nobody googled it and then we were on strike and nobody could change it.
I guess, yeah, there was just one person in a room typing stream of consciousness and then put it in all of our mouths.
I'm a genius. It wasn't the later seasons where I got passionate enough where I'd read a scene and be like, I'm not saying that I rewrote it. Yeah, I wasn't that confident yet totally.
I wish I love that I'm a one and a million thing I did too.
I feel like I hadn't heard that before. And I don't know if that's something that fans write a lot or if you hear that back a lot, but for some reason, that was out of my range of views. So I loved that.
Yeah, that is one of the ones that I get to talk to people about a lot, and I loved it too.
Yeah, it's such an encouraging thing to I mean, that is one of those lines that I think as a young girl or boy, just a fan watching the show, is if you walk away from that, that's a line that sticks with you that you can put as a badge on yourself, Like, yeah, you know what, that's who I am too.
I like that this whole Victoria Brook narrative. Brooke knows she will be a good mother and it is something that has never been encouraged or validated by her mother, and so you're seeing her reach for a brass ring that no one's valued except her. Like, you know, Peyton is like kids. Yeah, I mean, baby, I'm here, but like not on my radar. Yeah, you know, it's not like everyone around her is like kids, kids, kids, kids. She has identified the thing that she knows will make
her feel fulfilled and doesn't need any external validation. And maybe that's why, even though it's a complicated storyline, I do like it for Brooke because when you can arrive at that place where you're like, this is my thing and I don't need any other people in my life to tell me it's good, because I know it's good.
Yeah, I love it.
It's cool to see her in that space.
I agree, And I think maybe it's because I like the storyline so much that I wish we'd gone a little deeper with it.
Yeah, yeah, you know, I like.
Yeah, if you're going to adopt as a single person, do you have to identify who you're next of kin? Is so like, if something happens to you, who takes care of this child like you do? I feel like there's a lot of protocol that could have been juicy conversations for broken Yeah, and it didn't happen, Just didn't. Yeah, Victoria's trying to like give power of attorney or something creepy.
I like what you said, Hillary about the mother work that we do, and you know, Hailey says, it made me think of that moment in the therapy sessions when
Haley said I won't be an absent parent. And I was like, why is that such a why she harping on, Oh yeah, because her parents were always sort of in and out and around, And I was like, all those I mean, it's not that they weren't ever present, but they were very loose and I loose handed with all the kids sort of all of them kind of raising themselves. It seems like.
That's a great point. Is this a whole episode about mothers? Because Peyton talked about her mom too, Like Hailey's trying to imagine a new form of motherhood that she didn't experience.
Yeah.
Yeah, And it's not that it's the wedge between her and Nathan, but it's certainly like when you build a little wall of pillows in a bed, it's that it's a soft wall, soft between you and your partner.
She's afraid of pursuing her own things because she doesn't want to make her kids feel abandoned.
Well, and I think the idea of mother work is really interesting because as you start to do your own work and your own healing, you also start to realize how those relationships have affected you. Right, Like Luke is talking about this pain and not being seen and being underestimated. Haley is voicing that she does not want to be absent.
She wants to be there for Jamie. She's working on this because she wants to give him a certain kind of stability and a presence of you know, with her and even Yeah, Hill, I mean, you're talking about the relationship and the love, but you're also talking about art and belief. And the whole thing starts with Peyton talking about how her mom used to sing to her. Yeah, and that's this personal relationship and it evolves into her
identity with music and how she sees herself. And I think it's really interesting that in all these stages of our lives as women, our experiences as children gets reflected back to us, right, Like you're seeing who you are as an adult and knowing how you were influenced by your mother. And you know, you go to therapy and they talk about how when you start to heal your
matrilineal line, like it can go back generations. Like there's work my mom and I have done that has healed wounds that my mom carried from her mother who died a long time ago. Yeah, And it's it's so powerful and oh, there's like a part of me that watching
this today with you guys goes. Can you imagine if from this moment in time, like this present moment in history, knowing as much as we do and having as much access to mental health care and perspective and research as we do in twenty twenty three, like, oh my god, imagine know well we would have done with these storylines and we were making our show.
Thatday, I'll do Back then, I was all like, I'm a pleaser. Everything's fine in my family. I'm going yeah, today I would have been like, we got to work all on some stuff.
I'm setting a boundary. This is my soft wall.
I have words for this now. Haley said something that broke my heart, and I think it's part of this mother work. She said. She when you guys were talking about what you wanted, she listed, She's like, I want to trust Nathan again. I want to you know, I want to be happy, healthy, safe, She said, I want Jamie to feel appreciated. And the idea of saying that about your child, it's like, is she talking about her own inner child?
Right?
Because you always want for your kid what you didn't have for yourself and sense of just wanting your child to be appreciated. Yeah, I don't know why that hits so hard.
That's so true that it does really break your heart. If you see your child offering a part of themselves to a friend or something and they're trying and they just get ignored or shut down or whatever.
It's like like.
I know my kid and the other person's not they're not not seeing her to just you know. I mean, God, it breaks my heart. Even if she says hi to somebody and they don't hear it, I mean, and then she's just like standing there.
Like whoa, I will hold a grudge.
Like, But yeah, I think that's a really interesting thing to think about. I haven't. I haven't thought about it that way.
How was that monster day of filming for you guys? In the therapy, it was fine.
I mean, look, I remember reading the script and even doing the lines feeling like this is so sophisticated. I have done plenty of couple's therapy in my life, and I don't ever remember it feeling that poetic and perfectly. Everyone's just sharing their vulnerability in such lovely kind way. I mean, it was just very like it's scripted.
Yeah, it was very buttoned up, and maybe because it's four weeks later, but I'm like, nobody's having an outburst?
Yeah, what was the deal with that?
Like?
Why did nobody had the entire episode was just I don't know, is that our fault as actors? Did we try? And then we were told just keep it all mellow? Was the material not warranting any of those emotions, Like I didn't want to ever force anything.
We were all hungover from that hunh episode party. We were just like, yeah, mail it in.
But you know what, those episodes are really hard to because all the dialogue is the same. That's what I remember about being in there, because you're saying the same thing six different ways, but it's paragraphs and paragraphs every time. That is the hardest dialogue to remember because it has no meaning really.
Well, and when you're saying the same thing over and over again, by the time you're on the fourth scene, you're like, what do these words mean? Yeah, like, which, I'm supposed to say this thing, which is a version of that thing, but I've already said it that way, and I have to remember to say it this way. It really can scramble your brain.
Yeah, and you can't change the words because they are already matched exactly in the upcoming scene that we filmed three days ago, So you can't say it in your own words. Yeah, it's this was a technical episode, it was indeed, but we were lucky with this, uh, with this casting that you guys had. As you were thinking, arapist, I mean we were excited to see her that you're did know.
Yeah, you nailed it. You called it out. I can't believe you recognize her for sixteen candles. This is what you said, right.
Yeah, So we've had a John Hughes appearance in the Breakfast Club episode and in this episode.
Havelen Morris as Olivia Prewitt. Is that? Yeah, correct, So Havelen Morris.
I'm looking at her and her hair color is different, but she's got that same arched eyebrow, and I'm like, this is Jake RAN's girlfriend? Pretty in pink? Is she British?
Havelyn is definitely a very British name, or unless it's like Welsh or Irish or something, well let's google.
Hold.
It's just every time she's giving you and Nathan relationship advice, I'm imagining the scene where her hair is caught in the door jam Noe of Jake Rand's bedroom. She's not British, She's she's from Jersey.
Guys, good for her. We were watching the episode and I just said, why did they make this woman do a British accent? We are in North Carolina. Why why is the therapist supposed to be British? I don't understand.
I didn't get that one either.
I would love to ask her about it.
And it was so posh.
Yeah, it wasn't even like I'm from the streets in London I was.
It was not cock me. It was very It just wasn't conversational. Yes, it's just so like, where did they find this British buttoned up therapist? And why would she be the most relatable marriage therapist for Nathan and Haley who are so not buttoned up? But you know what, look,
I did love the advice she gave. I loved the idea of thinking about something that happens in so many relationships, that long term relationships, which is people stopped playing with each other, they stopped going out and having fun and tapping into the childlike excitement and what it was that they first fell in love with each other four and so I thought that was great advice, especially for a young couple, like don't lose your joy, don't lose your wonder and your laughter. Go find that.
I love that she'd called Nathan and Haley out though, where she was just like, you guys are twenty two years you totally you're not old. Please stop, you're making fools of yourself.
Yeah, and to remind people not not to give up on their play and their and their spark, you know, especially at twenty two. It's so wild to hear her say that to you guys, and to hear you know, broke have to kind of defend herself to the adoption woman. I'm twenty two. It's like we are baby babies on this show.
Babies just defeated babies, defeated tired babies. I've written hard and put up with. That's right.
What we crept out, we craft good.
Nathan and Haley.
Are buried under the weight of all the responsibilities that they've got and then all you know, stress and the trauma and of course Dan and all the stress that that brings back, which I still don't know why he was being beaten up at the beginning of the episode. But we can come back to that.
Yeah, I was just gonna say, like, good on Nathan and Haley to have this huge traumatic event happen and be in therapy like the next day if you've already met four times and it's been a month.
Yeah, exactly.
I would make him sit on net for a couple weeks before I was like, all right, I'm going to schedule an appointment and find an opening now.
Yeah, that's how they ended up with the uptighte British lady. She was like, I don't care who it is the first place that says yes, but I but.
It is there.
There's so I think that happens so often. I know it does in my life. I get caught up in all the responsibilities and I've forgotten, like I think it's been a week since I've just played, like just gone outside and ran around and kicked a soccer ball around with my kid. I've been so buried under responsibilities and it's a good reminder anyway. I'm glad that I was grateful for that. It was a little gift of that today from this episode. Yeah, I thought that.
Was really nice, a little bit of therapy. I like, I like all three of us yelling at the screen while Nathan and Haley are back home and she's making the bed and it's like, okay, well, do you want to hang out later tonight? Maybe her now?
Yeah, do it now afternoon delight?
Man?
Now, well they did. They got right back into it, back in the settle.
Thank god.
Yeah fine, I'm so happy we've reached that point. Yeah, Haley James, you have a what I wrote this and down you have a serious ass, Haley James, say it again, Say it again. This episode was obviously interesting for me because I had to deal with Voldemort. Worst Voldemort, Yeah, fucking worst. I wasn't speaking to him in real life, and so he wrote himself into the episode and me hugging him.
I'm so psychotic, Like, can you guys imagine Shonda Rhymes or Aaron Sorkin casting themselves on their own show. Especially in that scenario he compared himself.
To the writer of Sons of Anarchy. He was like, yeah, I'm like that, and I'm just like, you're not like that, a gay, Wow.
You're really not.
It was so creepy. And so I got the script and I was just like, all right, it's one day of work. It's just one day of work. I only have one day to be in this officeool film all these scenes. And you know, my boyfriend's dad was directing, and my brother's on set. There's like all these dudes on set. And it just wasn't quite enough. And so I invited my dad to work this day. And my dad came and sat behind the monitor the whole day. Wow, which was kind of weird, right, because he clearly wasn't
there to be friendly. He was just just being of presence. Yeah, and my dad is a jack of all trades, and he is really good at bullwhips. He had like an Indiana Jones thing in the eighties and wanted to learn how to play with bullwhips. It's always really good at it.
I thought you were just giving us a metaphor. You mean actual, No, an actual bullwhip, real bull Whip's amazing. Can't wait to keep going.
So in between every take, I would just like be line to the monitor and just like go stand next to my dad because you can't touch me, you can't pull me into a sidebark conversation, can't do any of that if I'm just like shooting and making jokes with my dad. And so it's lunch, and my dad has also been chatting up Mike Rail, our sound mixer, and they'd known each other, you know, like I'm I was in a band with Mike Rail that played at the
hundredth Party. And so they're chatting and stuff, and Mike divulges that he had been in the circus in his early twenties and was an animal trainer and also knows how to use whips. And so we break for lunch and Voldemort goes off to the production office where his office has like a view of the parking lot, and my dad and Mike Rail proceed to go out into crew parking, which is right next to the production office, and pull out bull whips and start doing all these
tricks and just like cracking I'm real loud. So they're making all this noise and it was the most redneck like Carneye move that could be done. It was just like a message. It was like, hey don't so you don't what an awkward day at work? What a show day?
That is like the North Carolina version of the Dad and Clue lest being like I got a forty five and a shovel and no one.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, there's a bull whip in the back of my Ford Explorer.
Watch.
Bro.
I love that you had your dad come out. That's great. It's really just taking advantage of the men in your life that care about you, that you know, stick around and stand up for you. That's amazing.
Well, it didn't let's be clear, it didn't like necessarily solve anything, did it for that day? That's it. It was like for that day, even to.
Give you a day of reprieve.
I can't imagine doing that day and not having that because no one else was going to be like, hey man, like he's up here. Yeah, you can tell about my body language. I'm like always pointed away. I'm never looking like directly at him. I'm just sort of like delivering these monologues to the ether.
Well, you're walking around the office and yeah, I think you know what struck me, And I'm curious if you remember any of this, but just like knowing what you tended to gravitate to in wardrobe. Yeah, the fact that you were in that skirt and those heels. And to be clear for our listeners, like our boss approved all our wardrobe. I was like, did he did he like select out of the line of stuff you had tried on for you know that four episode chunk or whatever,
like oh, I'm coming in this episode. I want or in a short skirt. It like it like made me, it made me feel like itchy watching you walk around because I was like, oh, I hate that she had to be in there with him.
We didn't have fittings just for like for the episode. Maybe we would do that if it was a really big episode. It's like this is the wedding and we have to get all like our wedding dresses. But usually it was like, just come do one big fit and it'll cover six episodes.
Yeah, four or five, six episodes at a time.
I don't remember how that played out, but I just I also remember because I do remember being uncomfortable in the skirt. I was seated. They wanted me to sit on the desk, and I'm like, I can't sit on the desk. I have to lean against the desk. It's like everything was very strategic, and I remember thinking like if I throw a hissy fit and I'm like I need to go put on pants, It'll just I'll have lost. I'll have lost, and so goddamn it, like I'm I
am not going to be flustered. I'm not gonna be bothered. I'm gonna show up and I'm gonna say these stupid lines and then I'm gonna go home and you know, play with the whip. Yeah, do Indiana Jones tricks. But I love that the fan base has acknowledged how absolutely cringey this is. There was a time for that person where he thought he was so cool. So I'm a good actor, I'm so cool, and I think there were
maybe some fans that validated that. And now that we've just like aired all the dirty laundry, people are like, what a nerd?
That's just so weird that he Why in the world is Peyton talking to Max the record store guy.
About and why does he know about Lucas and all their deepest little.
In details of her life? Like I'm so confused. I mean, how long was Peyton net Thud.
And he was not thirty six, He was not thirty six, yet here what kind of nerd ages himself down? I'm should to think of.
Other people that Peyton could have been talking to realistically, and like, you want a random person that wasn't Chris Keller, great, that would have been the first choice for sure, Mia instead he's.
Holding up her record and I'm like, so, you paid yourself as the creator and show runner. I made the most money of anybody on our show. You paid yourself to be an actor and took an episode away from a Mia all these other characters.
Yeayeah, but where's Barbara? Yeah? Cool to have Barbara home.
Moira, Moira, It's like, where's Karen. Oh, she's coming back. She could have been with you and Andy could have been with Lucas.
Yeah.
Oh, that would have been so good.
Dang it.
I felt that viscerally. That was in my gut right there. You just said that, and I'm like.
That that honestly would have been so great for the long term of the show.
Yeah, where it's like obviously yeah, and like she's getting advice and then Andy's telling Lucas, here's how you go back and get Lindsey. That would have been so interesting.
Yeah, how do I feel about that?
By the way, Lucas going in and talking to like, I was not into that speech. I have to say, it felt like so manipulative and like the same thing he said for the last five years to all the other girls.
Pretty yeah, he said it to Brooke for sure.
Yeah, I'm going to prove it to you waiting. I'll be waiting for how long?
Yeah? Wait? Did he ever say it to Peyton? Because I feel like Peyton was always kind of chasing him. I don't remember him being like, oh, wait for you, Peyton.
You know at the beginning he was chasing Peyton like crazy, and she was like, why are you so crazy?
I wish she would have said it just like that, why are you so crazy? Man? Yeah?
I think it's important to acknowledge that at twenty two years old, you really do think you know what you want and I did, Yeah, sure, that's fair, and then you.
Find out later like, oh I don't and that's okay too. And Lucas, God bless him, just is not willing to give up. And I think got some good advice from Andy of just like, hey, you know, she just needs assurance from you, the same way I did with your mom. I knew that your mom had some unfinished business. I stuck around and I respected her space.
But running out on a wedding is different than like, honey, I need a little assurance from you. I don't know if you really bounce back from that.
I mean maybe in Lucas's mind. He's like, oh, that was kind of embarrassing. Maybe she just needs me to tell her I don't care.
Yeah, you know, well I wonder about that too, Right, is how much of it could be about the ego of not wanting to be left, because there are plenty of people who feel like that, and there are plenty of men who will do anything to not embarrass yet left when their partner finds out who they really are.
And why I had a breakup once. I remember him looking at me and going, you're going to realize once I'm gone all the things that I do and you won't be able to get through without me. And I was just like I.
Remember in the moment be like, oh, well you think that's true, honey, take the trash out all the time?
Like, what are you talking about?
Yeah, I don't know.
I think he genuinely does care for Lindsey.
Yes, I think she represents a side of him he has aspired to his entire life, successful literary couple, you know, helping each other with the dead dad situation, like they heal a lot.
Of each other's wounds. But there's just always that Peyton Barnacle, Fester and you know.
That's something that's been so that's a very common theme in romance stories, that there's one person that you're meant for and that's the person you're going to be, and no matter what happens, it's always just going to keep coming around, and that's going to be the person. I feel like the older I've gotten and the more I've seen and been through, I don't know. I just don't
know about that narrative. I mean, I know that first love is strong, and that you that person will always be with you in your heart, and that the memories, like the first boy I was ever in love with, I'll always remember that, and there's always going to be moments where I I'm grateful for the first time I was in love, but I don't I'm glad we're not together, like life has taken me in so many different directions.
I agree with you, Joy, I think the older I get, the more I'm like, man, I could live with anybody, My husband could live with anybody. We're easygoing people. We make the choice, yeah, to live together, and so Lucas and Lindsay could end up happily ever after. But there's a choice there, and she's making the choice like hey, no, thanks, Yeah, and he's got her in this weird professional headlock that I'm like, oh god, Lucas, don't do that. That's not romance.
That's weird.
And oh that's so the professional headlock. That's great.
Yeah, I'll only do the book if you edited.
I'm like, yeah, I think there are times in my life when I have latched onto a person because I in a romantic situation, because I there's that mindset that's just so pervasive in culture, because it shows like ours with moments like this, like it's Lucas and Peyton and that's it, and that's gonna be It's Ross and Rachel, it's it's he's her lobster. It's the thing that's that we're taught over and over and over again. If there's that one person, it's just got to be the person
you keep going back to. But I just I don't I don't know if that's really true. It's neither here nor there, or just something I thought of while we were.
No, it's not a magic trick, man.
Yeah, it's like, yeah, that's a weird thing.
But I like that Peyton has not reached out to him once. This entire time.
I love that.
Yeah, when Andy asked Lucas, He's like, oh, have you heard from Baiden? And it's like, no power move, Nope, so just above board, thank.
You so much, self care move actually keeping it classy, very proud. Yeah.
Yeah. Meanwhile, I'm gonna go pour my heart out to Maths.
Well, I've been talking to Dan. I'm it was just so random.
She could have been talking to Dan. Oh my god, that one so much better, just like, Hey, no one's talking to you either. Cool story, Yeah.
I don't want to talk to you. And he could have been like, well, clearly nobody wants to talk to you, like you could have been a funny, like nasty little tete a tete.
Yeah. Maybe if they're both at the graveyard, he's visiting Keith's grave, she's visiting her mom. Somehow they end up talking.
This is why we have writers through Yeah, all right, Well, the fist fight at the beginning of the episode.
I loved that.
Did they all think that Dan kidnapped the little boy?
That's what's so confusing.
No, I think Dan wouldn't have been able to leave the house without saying And that's why Jamie's like, thank you everyone knew Carrie took him. Yeah, but they could have done it better.
But why would they start beating him up. I'm just so confused. I liked the action. It was the only action we got in the episode. Yeah, besides the end.
Maybe because Dan followed her and didn't call the cops, like all the things he didn't do well. He needed to be the hero, and it's like, you don't get to be the hero, you're a murderer. I don't know.
Yeah, that was pretty confusing.
Also, why did Dan pay off the social worker? I miss that part.
That's going to be in the future. I think. I think in that there's going to be something that comes up where that guy was like, oh, Dan says I paid him off.
He wanted him to listen to him, he wanted to chat.
Yeah, it was. It was a weird little He was like, how about you keep this money and just have a small talk with me, But clearly he wanted to leave that money there and make it look like that guy took a bribe. Yeah. But I didn't get anything out of that scene, didn't. I didn't get any new information. I mean, you know, Paul was fine as always, he was great, But what do you do with them? If there's nothing on the paper, what are you going to do?
Paul was good, but it was so random. And then to have the guy be like, didn't you kill your brother? It's like, really, this is what we're talking about, like we all know. And what was weird to me is that everybody knows what Dan Scott did. He was the mayor of Tree Hill and he's creeping around the elementary school girl and nobody's calling the police. He's talking to little kids through the fence. A grown ass man nod at My child's preschool.
Parents couldn't even show up early for pickup until the kids over the fence. They were like, sit in your car when it's time for you to come out, we'll let you know.
Yeah, you can't just show up for lunch like you used to.
It's really weird.
He wasn't into that either, But I'm curious to see where it's going.
Hey, it can't get worse, you know what.
This is silly. Everything is silly. And we have a fan question that I find to be very silly and also adorable. Who wants to read it?
I don't want to die?
Oh no, yeah, okay, you had.
The most to deal with this joy because you had to deal.
With Nathan Sweaty boys, all right, when you have a scene where you're supposed to sweat on your face like and body after a workout at basketball game fight, is it just water? Are they actually like forcing us as actors to work out and work up a sweat before we do a scene. No, they're not forcing else to work out. Although sometimes the boys, to make their muscles look really big, will sit and do pull ups right before a shot because they want to be bulgy.
They're like, oh man, we're going to roll the.
Dummies. No, the makeup artists have a little spray bottle. They squirt your face with water.
They missed you, well, they missed you with water. And they also have it's like a glycerin solution, you know that they put on those spongy so like they'll they'll they'll pat this glycerin. It's like a gel. It's gross all over your forehead, so the sweat beads stay, and then wardrobes sprang your shirt with water and you're just like sticky and wet all day. It's pretty disgusting.
Yeah, that's the answer, folks.
Thanks Kaylin. Like how do I get that Dewey look? That's it? Do you think they just love teen dramas so much that we went from having that super mat makeup in the early two thousands to they're like, how do we make all these bitches Dewey Dewey?
I was real happy when Dewey and the Dewey look kicked in. I do love it.
You just wake up in the morning and you're like, you know what I want to look like today? A glazed donut.
I don't know that I have a choice anymore.
I mean to look like a snack, all right?
So are we going to spin a wheel?
Ye?
Do it?
What are we going to get?
I don't know.
This week we have our most likely too?
Didn't we have this question already?
Am I crazy?
I don't remember this one?
Because I wanted this answer?
Who is most likely to burn Thanksgiving dinner? Well?
Didn't Brook I was gonna say. I did on the show and we had to put the turkey out with a fire extinguisher. It was a funny scene with me and Sharon Lawrence in Austin. It was great.
I think I directed that episode, really, I think.
So, I will say a great episode, great scene, not me in real life.
No, you are so like she's got a call sheet for the whole cooking schedule.
Yeah, who's burning the turkey in real life? Who's burning in real life?
Guys, don't tell her. I said this, it's Daniel because because she tries to do too much, like instead of like parceling it out, she'd be like, I can do it. I can do it. I'm gonna cook three turkeys, one deep fried, one in the oven, and another like in a toaster owner something. And she's the one who's like, I got it, and not all three will burn.
But one of one of them will. I would forget about the turkey. I could see that happening, being like, what am I missing?
Yeah? Yeah, I don't even like turkey, So yeah, let's just eat ham eazy, open the foil. Did we have a honorable mention this episode? What we love?
God, I don't know, it's never this hard.
Did you just say it's never this hard?
Yeah, it's never usually honorable mentions kind of jump out. I'm having a hard time, Joy.
I go with what you were saying earlier about your scenes. I really like, I really liked the reminder despite how clunky, so much of the episode felt I like that we offered the audience a reminder to play yeah, you know, like don't take it all so seriously all the time. That felt nice.
Yeah, I agree, great, I love that giving the honorable mention theme. Oh oh you guys, what what.
The one of the biggest hawks I have ever seen just landed in my backyard and picked up a pillow and then realized it like swooped in, picked up a pillow, realized it wasn't an animal, dropped it and kept on its merry way. But it flew under the tree in my backyard. That was insane.
Babe? Is this a metaphor?
And we need to look up the spiritual meeting and.
Talk cowk medicine?
Next Oh guys, all right, next week we have season five, episode fourteen, What do You Go Home to? Sophia goes home to hawks, be careful.
Hawk medicine, awareness, enlightenment.
We're gonna learn some more. All right, thank you guys, Ready to go?
Hey, thanks for listening.
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