A Royal Mess • EP112

um an emotional roller coaster. Differently in US, there are things we learned about our show for the first time. There were cringes and cries and and I mean revelations honestly in episode twelve crash course, in polite conversation, it was a crash, all right. This show aired originally on February third, two thousand four. We were into winter shooting

and my god, it was cold. Um. And and this one, if you recall, is about after the last episode where Larry comes home and Peyton gets time with her dad. In this one, she receives the devastating news that her dad is lost at sea, and she and Lucas take a trip to Hilton Head, South Carolina to identify a body that has washed ashore, which turns into an overnight and oh goodness, And if there wasn't enough drama, Nathan's grandparents come to town. Don't know, Dev and Dan are separated,

and secrets start to be spilled. Grandma and Grandpa come into town. Was a revelation. Majorly, we learned things we did not know majorly pardon the pun, because we had major Dad, Gerald McCraney. I didn't I set it up and I didn't even know. Wait, I have to say how excited I was because I was a huge Major Dad fan and he was married to Delta Burk and I was a big Designing Women fan, and Jeryl McCraney was like a household name in my home growing up.

And when they told me, and Tess Harper too, by the way, um, from Little Girl Lost Remember that movie that like lifetime movie in the eighties that everybody watched. She is an icon? Yes, Um, So when they told me Tess Harper and Jeryld McCraney were playing Nathan's grandparents, and then I got to work, I lost my mind.

I lost my dinner so excited. And the first scene when I got to work with him was the dinner party, and I just remember walking in and like seeing him sitting there at the dental dinner table waiting for our blocking rehearsal, and I was just speechless. I was so star struck. How was it, like, could he tell that you were geeking out? I don't know. I mean he

was lovely. Both of them were so so sweet and smart, and I love just listening to their ideas on the scene and hearing the way that they um spoke up about their their thoughts on their characters, even though they were jumping in as a guest star, which you know a lot of younger people when they come in as a guest star, they're scared to have ideas on shows because we're you know, we're new and we just want

to get along with everybody. And seeing the way of a vet like walks into a room and it's like, no, I'm taking up space here. You hired me for a reason. I have ideas, let's talk about them. It was like so baller um. So anyway, I just loved them. I feel like joy as as your friend and Hill I'm I'm sure you saw this too. There's the shot when Haley walks in with Nathan and sees Royal, and I was like, that's Joy. That is truely losing her mind

that it's Gerald McCraney. I want to know, like, like Joy when they announced the blocking and they're like, all right, we're gonna have Haley sitting next to Royal. Just feel like the excitement. Yeah, I can handle that I'm sitting next to Major down so cool. So really, but I

also saw Joy. You empowered as an actress a little bit more in this episode through your wardrobe because your outfit at that dinner felt like like Haley's had to wear a bunch of goofy on this ship, you know, and you came to impress your boyfriend's family, and I'm sure it helped that you were also like game to impress these like totally awesome guest stars. Um, do you remember picking that outfit because it is like gorgeous? Thanks? Yeah, it was very sort of I guess it was kind

of sixties that outfit. I I don't remember specifically the fitting, although it does make sense to me that it would have been. It's the first time we see Haley really dressed up for anything, your hands, my hair was curled, she had a little extra makeup on. She really went out of her way, and I've a vintage vibe on Haley makes a lot of sense. And what I liked about this too, which you were saying that she's it wasn't powering as an actors, but I think it was

more just that Haley was really getting to Um. I've been watching her come into her own over the course of the last twelve episodes and seeing that she is trying to figure out who she is like we all did in high school, and I'm enjoying that journey for her, Like do I wear weird hats? Is that who I am? Like a dressed up in vintage himes? Like is this who I am? You know, just experimenting with all that

fun stuff that you do in high school. I think Hayley really gets to because clearly Peyton and Lucas in this storyline are doing all the grown up stuff, like all the scandalous grown up stuff. And I think throughout at least the beginning of the show the first couple of seasons, Haley definitely gets to be sort of the stereotypical high school girl that people can relate to in that curiously through Haley where it's like Brooke knows who she is, Like Brooke is wearing juice suits from A

to Z. Yeah, you know, she's solid figured it out. Okay. It didn't even register with me until you just said episode twelve, Like, if this was a show that was on air today, this would be the end of the season. Oh yeah, Like nobody goes past twelve episodes really anymore, So this would be the cliffhanger where everyone's like, Wow, what's going to happen. So the fact that we're only halfway through season, you've got relieve every I mean, and guys, we went on in later seasons to do twenty three

and twenty four. I mean we we did full years of shooting. It was so wild and god, yeah, I just remember, you know, our whole storyline before you guys go on your road trip, He'll evolved around us, you know, fixing up your dad's old car. God, and I remember when they pulled the cover off that thing. I'm such a gearhead, and I was like, oh my god, what's happening. I was so and then I had to be like, you can fix the starter right, like such a danged But I loved I loved seeing that because I had

such a sense memory of how cold we were. And I remember those nights out with that corvette and you and I huddled in the car under down jackets trying to get warm before they'd take them away and we'd have to just like be in our t shirts. Winter in Wilmington's what an introduction. We thought, like, it's the South South, surely it will be ninety degrees. Um. Wrong, It is so wet and so cold in the winter

because that wind chills brutal. Yeah. I mean you you're from Virginia Hill and I was Texas and New Jersey. But well, Texas being the South in the winter, I knew that it was going to be cold, and I'm sure you did too from Virginia. But but because it was a coastal town and we were on the water, it was a different kind of cold. Like all the scenes where you can see our love handles, right, yeah, I really, so, I'm like, can I get a coat

that covers my ass? Like my body? He goes out through my back and my butt, And I just remember like that constant fight of can I get a coat? That covers my ass. Please a jacket, please place place

yea myself? Okay, I want to talk about My first question in this episode was why do you think Brooke so casually backed out and let Peyton and Brooke I mean Sarry, Peyton and Lucas go on this road trip and not just let, but like volunteered, Like hey, you two go ahead and go without any reservation or concern or I like, I mean again, I think it's a device. Like we talked about how earlier in the season, Brooke was made a device for conflict at the party. Um

in this episode, this road trip is the device. But I think what I liked about it because I've been clamoring for, you know, her motivation, who she really is, why does she behave the way she behaves? And I think after the last episode where she says this is what I think is happening, I think he's basically dating us both uh and Peyton says, no, you need to trust yourself. He picked you and I love you. I

think she's really trying to lean into that. I think she's trying to trust her best friend, and I think she's trying to trust her boyfriend. And I think as we're getting to learn her motivations, she's learning about herself too. And I remember thinking, well, as we watched it, it's such a moment of self awareness to say I'm really not good in a crisis, and you know, essentially, if it's your dad, I'm gonna lose it and you're going to have to take care of me. And that's completely inappropriate.

You know. I was like wow, Like, yeah, I loved I loved that she was willing to admit that and be honest about her fear and say, like, the thing I'm going to be really good at is sitting here and answering the phone and holding holding it down like I trust you guys. And I think, knowing what was coming, I had to lean into it extra because we knew that the whole point was we'd get to a betrayal. It pains me. I see how inclusive Brook is in

this episode. It's like, Oh, we're gonna be on a date together, Like, let's fend some quality time together fixing Peyton's dad's car, you know, like let's go to Peyton's house, let's check up on her, let's you know, like she got the memo that Peyton was feeling weird. She misinterpreted it as like, oh, you're feeling like a third wheel. Let me just overcompensate, which is so noble and so sweet and so endearing, and like, I did we not

watch these episodes when we filmed them? I guess not, Guys, I don't think so, because look, I mean, if you look at the episode, Look how many nights we were shooting. We weren't home when these episodes were airing, so we wouldn't see them. Your tevo. We had tevo, but I would staying were you rich? I didn't want to go home and watch the show. I wanted to come and watch I Love Lucy or like whatever the new thing was that was on, you know, some big fancy show.

I was sick of I was sick of us because I was with us. But all these years later, I'm not sick of us now now I can't get enough. No, But it's I think we all had these moments in this episode where we were like, wait, what oh, I mean revelatory. We all missed the dance Scott and Emmo, so let's address so Danny when they called when his mom shows up calling him Danny at the beginning, of

this episode and it's Danny's birthday. And then Gerald McRaney comes in and checks on Karen, Like, these are all things that I don't remember, Like him checking up on Karen is indicative of of something really I don't know, subversive going on for the last you know, how old are the kids? Sixteen years old? Yeah? Maybe wonder like has he been helping to pay for Lucas? Has he been?

I mean, why is he in touch with Karen? And he said it's an old friend and he said it sincerely, So it wasn't like he was it was It wasn't ominous. It was like they actually are in touch. But that makes sense for some narcissistic patriarch to be like trying to puppet things and pulling strings in all directions too well, And I wondered in that moment because Dan and Karen were together in high school, so Dan would have been living with Royal, Like what kind of a relationship Royal

had with Karen? Was he mad at Dan for leaving Karen? Did he feel like his son slighted this girl? It's like it's it's it launched me into a thousand questions. Well, he's also like a great looking man, and sometimes great looking man just like to be adored. UM. And so it makes sense that he would sit next to cute little Haley in her cute little sweater at dinner, and makes sense that he was probably on friendly terms with Karen when she was the cute little girl in a

cute little sweater. You know, there is that um nostalgia that certain people carry because he married his cute little wife who probably wore a cute little sweater once. UM. And so those kinds of patterns of of I don't know muchism makes sense. Yeah. I also I don't know that he UM. I was just thinking about what you were saying about him being there when Karen and Dan were together, and I don't know that he would have

supported their relationship. UM, I think it. But I could see his character encouraging Dan to break up with her, but then feeling guilty about it and so like making up for it by staying in touch with her and trying to pay for Lucas in some way or something. I don't know. Do we ever solve this mystery? Does it come up in future episodes? I don't know. I guess we're going to have to watch I am realizing though, in this moment where I'm like, oh man, this is a this is a place where Brick and I are

really actually so similar that I didn't see then. But you being like it's so sweet and noble. She's trying to include her, and I'm like, what do you do you think he would have been so mad at his son for being a bad guy, And I'm like, god, damn it, this is why I just this is why I've gotten myself into so much trouble because I'm like, no, it has to be the best version of the situation.

Everybody's being nice and you are an eternal optimist. That is real life, just like, oh no, his intentions are totally pure. This person is being sweet. Damn it. It's striking that they cast someone that looks enough like Barbara. You know, Tess and Barbara have a very similar style in this show, and it makes sense that when faced with a choice, Danny Um goes with the girl that looks like his mom, especially if he's trying to win

his dad's approval and similar personalities too. I mean, if you slack a Southern accent on Barb, you've got there's a there's a pretty similar vibe going on there, tough, tough lady. Yeah, it's true. It was also a very cool choice I think on the on the part of both our hair and makeup, to partners and wardrobe to style them in the same way. The morning after the big dinner, they're both in the kitchen wearing these like eggplant purple shirts. Do we think it was on purpose? Though? Yeah?

What do you think? Remember we had such limited resources, and season one we had limited resources. But guys, I remember, I remember all the way back to the beginning, there were very conscious conversations about the colors that people were put in. I wore a lot of black and red and bold colors because Brooke was like a bad girl Hill if you notice, like you, you were wearing a lot of white and black and and that like sage green, and they would always put Chad. They'd always put Chad

in that blue version of a sage green. I don't know what that's called. It's like a cadet blue and the heather blue there it is. And like so there were all these choices about what the colors that the characters were wearing represented, and then they put Joy in like everything color all the same time, you were like a color wheel exactly, every leftover color goes on joy. But yeah, I do. I think it was on purpose.

And and like you said, even when you see them at the dinner party, they kind of blew out Barbara's hair to be a little fuller like Tessa's hair, you know. Um so that Mrs Scott Sr. And Mrs Scott Jr. Look very very alike. I thought that was really smart. Hey guys, it's Jana Kramer. The I Heart Radio Music Festival is back. Join us for the official I Heart Radio Music Festival pre show podcast hosted by me Jana Kramer.

It's going to be a blast and we will have all your favorite celebrities and artists joining, such as Chrissy Mets, Debbie Gibson, Joey McIntyre, Donny Osmonde, Degrees, Teddy Mellencamp and so many more. Get your tickets today at on location live dot com. Let's get lucky. I loved seeing Dan as a teenage boy, and I really thought Paul did a nice job making those choices and how quickly he switched from big, alpha tough guy into submissive teenage boys

as soon as his dad showed up. And even at the dinner table, like when Barbe was sorry, deb was talking and uh, he just looked at her and gave her this look with like wide eyes and then like look, just Karen, come, my dad's gonna So sweet but really

good performance that was so sharp. Paul turned in an extraordinary performance in this episode, given he was also really ill and he got He got super sick during this episode during that dinner party, and no one would not like we even forgot because his performance is so strong, and I was like, wait a second, they had to shoot this scene really weird because Paul had to go

to the hospital and too. I don't know, he's just he's able to focus in a way that's really respectable, and I would you know, I think that's why they threw in that line at the beginning of the dinner party scene. Did you hear tests say you don't you look sick, Danny? Which could just be like, oh, your dad's here and you're stressed out. But I also think part of it was coverage because he was like sweating profuse. He just used it. Um, that's acting, kids, We're just

getting a trooper. He is nothing if not professional, and you know, make sure that he can push through, and he's like refuses to take anyone's pity kind of about him, and because he's such a bear, but he's so tender. There's like nothing better than being protected by Paul Johanssen. This is so lovely and so in the moment where

he needed support. Um, I think it's so sweet that the whole crew and all of you guys who were in that scene really stepped up to make sure you could shoot him out and he could go to the hospital. I mean, because this is the reality of our job. It kind of doesn't matter if you're sick. You've got to get the shots, and that can be really detrimental

to people. And so you know, you guys doing the wide shots that included everyone, and then doing all of Paul's coverage, and then having Jim who worked in the prop department, was it then? Was it Craig? Who's it in for him? Do you remember? I feel like there was Jim Nelson. I think it was Jim Nelson. And just the thought that you know, everyone would do that is I really think it speaks to the sort of

generosity of spirit of of our crew. Yeah, at this point, this was the last episode we shot before Christmas break Yeah, because then we all took off for like three weeks or a month and came back and Paul was better, and it was like, I thank god, but no one really knew how sick he'd been. Um, it was kind of a revelation when we came back in January, which makes it even more interesting to watch this episode and

be like, he just knocked it out. I mean, and even the scenes, obviously, the dinner scenes are so a impressive because of his performance and be extra impressive because you know what he was dealing with. But that scene in the dealership when Gerald Royal, Dan's dad comes in and starts kind of riding him and jabbing at him with his accomplishments in front of the customer, and then you know, punches him and says, oh look you're still fit.

You go, oh my god. This is who Dan is with Nathan, and it's who Royal is with Dan, and you realize these relationships have just generationally mirrored, and it's like a big revelation for Nathan to to to be experience that in that like real time, to hear that come to light like that. I wrote this line down Joy because it was my favorite line of the episode when Nathan's apologizing that Haley like witnessed all that at

the dinner and Haley says, it's okay. It helped me understand you, like, burying witness to someone else's mess is the most intimate thing you can do, because without having to discuss it to death, you understand the person so much more. And Haley being the one person that can bear witness to what Nathan's going through is so sweet. I mean, we've all watched each other in real life deal with some like terribly messy things, and I think

that's why we're friends twenty years later, you know. Haley also, uh had my favorite line of the episode because Nathan goes because she says, you know, now you know the truth, and Nathan goes, yeah, but I just don't know what to do with it, and Haley goes, okay, okay, perfect. So like, also, how how impressive, how good at boundaries? She is just like, okay, well, good luck with that. I'm going to go do my life now. She had

a curfew. Man, She's like, look, my parents are gonna start flipping the porch light and like, no codependence here, Like she just showed up. She was at the dinner party, like, oh, his knees are great. Yeah, like speaking up, trying to like help everybody be fine, and then it goes take some you know, he drops her off home and yeah, well, good, good luck with your problem. I'm thank you for allowing me to and it's that and you know, hope that goes well for you can let me know how it

works out. Wow, I mean, is that just like having being a part of a really big family that you naturally I mean because I am an only child and I have no experience with that. That's so foreign to me that a young woman would be that confident and have those boundaries. Yeah, I mean, I'm not that person. I'm the one that's like, cool, let's sit here on the porch for three hours while you dug it out.

You know. I know it's four in the morning and I have to do something early, but like, let yeah, sure, what do it? What else do you need? Yeah? Same? Who knew that we should have been taking lessons from the Haley playbook and steading boundaries for ourselves. Girls. Okay, we all need to get okay tattooed and kiss here. That killed me because you go okay, and then you give him a kiss, like on this funny side part

of the mouth face kissing. You gave him like and then you walked away, and I was like, God, it's delicious. I mean, did you think in this moment? Do you think in this moment that Haley is like reconsidering, She's like, oh, there's like three bad generations of this. Do I want to be? I think that's a legitimate question. That's that's

I don't know. I don't think I thought of that in the moment, But if I were Haley now, I certainly would be thinking, well, I think as adult women, we can't help but think about that now, because we're old enough that we've we've looked at our young selves, why we were the way we were, what we carried, what we learned consciously and unconsciously, like we can therafy. And now they're like, well, you know, she's looking at this generational inherited bullshit, wondering if she's going to be

dep Scott. It's like, maybe she wasn't when she was sixteen, but we are in this moment um Peyton doesn't have a generational thing to look to, and so I think that is this episode was really difficult for me because I felt like Peyton had already had to deal with so many of these like major traumatic like sad things. It's like the whole you know, my mom is dead and now my best friend's kissing his boy, and like every episode he gets bigger and bigger and bigger with

the Peyton trauma. And so when I got the script, it was like, my dad is what now? Like what I hadn't experienced in real life, like a major, like panic inducing loss like that, um, like my pastor had passed away, you know, and that was someone who I really respected a lot, but it wasn't my dad, um. And so I was just like, is this just to

give me to cry again? Like I don't I don't know how many times I can do this, because you feel like you're going to run out of AMMO or run out of steam if you just do it every single episode. And so that that whole thing was so hard because in between scenes, Sophie and Chad could be like fun, you know, like you guys can be having fun, and I would have to just like sit in a corner and like Altyd's and you know, and sad songs

and try to stay sad. Oh. I thought you made a really interesting choice in this episode actually as an actor, because you had been doing so many, so many episodes um sullen and depressed and struggling and um, and that's what was written for you, so that's what you were doing. And in this episode you leaned into the vulnerability and it softened you and there was even though you were sad, it wasn't the kind of sad that we've been watching you do it was. It was it was a much

softer little girl vulnerable um warm. It was like really seeing Peyton warm, I think for the first time, the whole redemption thing. They're like, everyone hates you, We're gonna take away your dead now. What I thought was so interesting, though, is that in the last episode, I felt like we started to see you that way. There was something so beautiful about Larry Peyton's dad coming in and we got to see you be this little girl and and really

feel her being sixteen. And and what it led me to see or believe was that this girl who's sixteen, who lives alone, the angst that teenager's experience could also be armored for Peyton. This girl kind of there alone in the world, and then as soon as her dad came back, she got to soften. Exactly what Joy is saying.

It was so tender and sweet. I remember having a thought during this being like, God, that's why I think they leaned into like Peyton in pain, because the way you played it was so genuine and beautiful and it made me love you so much. And and so I think that they took that moment and and really made this new freedom, this new emotional vulnerability, this this young girl. They were like, and maybe we'll take it all away.

And as an audience member, I mean I did this episode with you, and watching it now, it wounded me so much, thinking like, please don't hurt this little girl that you guys are both being incredibly generous. Thank you, But um, the thing that's really hard for me in this episode is that, yes, like we were trying to age Peyton down right and show like this is a kid. She's just a kid, you know, because a kid that lives alone and like, but then to take it from

like this is a kid too. Now we're gonna do some sexy time stuff. Make it makes sense. Oh now I just almost split water out of my, it's so ridiculous. We were all like mouths agape, just watching this, Like she finds the she goes back to the motel, finds the bracelet, and I couldn't foundom because I didn't remember. I don't remember what was going to happen. So I was like, why are they Why are they going back

to this motel? I mean, I loved that set. That was a beautiful set, but I just don't figure out, like, for what reason did they make her have the bracelet back in the motel? It seems like such a strange scene choice. Okay, should find a bracelet. She's sad, like, all right, we never see the bracelet again. And then all of a sudden, he's taking a shirt off and he's looking at you like, and it was so cross.

It started in the fittings because I was just I was like, what, No, he's gonna take your shirt off? And I was like, I don't want to do the dad, I'm going to keep a tank top on, right, And they're like, okay, finely, Chad take his shirt off. You know, for as much complaining as I've done about us having to like naked, the boys, also, how do you make it all the time. Um, so you know it was fair. Um, but I was like, no, I'm going to wear a tank top. So Chad trying to figure out which layer

to grab because I'm actually wearing three shirts. Uh yeah, so I'm trying to figure that out with a big pain in the ass. But the way they described it to me to make it makes sense still doesn't make any sense to me. I think they knew that Sandra Bullock was my hero. She's always been my hero. We're from Northern Virginia. Like I remember like reading Good Housekeeping as a kid because she was on the cover and I was like, oh yeah, I just let her so much.

And I was told that this was like the movie Speed, where you've been through this traumatic thing with someone and there's so much pent up angst that you can't help but fall into each other's arms at the end of it. And as a twenty one year old, I was like, okay, sure, you know, I guess it took a lot of convincing. As an almost fourty year old, I'm like, bullshit, would have had a bad day. Don't touch me. Something of

a shake, yeah, hard pass. I'm Keith Scott just with like the glass of brown liquor, just like no one talked to me. Speed is like full of adrenaline that of course they're gonna you know, it's like the release of all the adrenaline that's not the grief of pulling the back a sheet on a course and thinking it might be your parents. By the way, even though it's not your parents, you just looked at a dead body like I can't think of anything grosser. And by the way,

this person bury this plotline was one of your dad's coworkers. Yeah, yeah, right, like, hello, what's happening? Never never acknowledged again how long it had been in the water. I mean, it's just so inappropriate on writing on that one. I think they could I think they definitely could have done better. We need Peyton and Lucas to kiss again. How do we make it

even crazier than the last time? But look, you never know what's going on the writer's room, because they could have had a completely different plan, and that you know

how sometimes the rewrites would come in or whatever. I don't know if you remember how far in advance you had this, but it's totally possible they had a different plan and then they got you know, Gossip Girl did something scandalous, got a bunch of ratings, and then the network called and was like, we need more sex in this episode, and then you know, somebody was forced to make it up. So, you know, in the defense of some of the writers in the room, you never quite

know what's going on or where it's coming from. And I will say too, that's a great point, Joy, because a lot of our writers were young, a lot of our writers didn't have, you know, tons of experience on other shows. And I think there is something really interesting about even how they explained it to you Hill. This is not an uncommon device on screen to people have this really intense emotional experience and then they hook up. It's like, why there's slut cops in every TV show.

Slut Cops is the name of of a TV show I want to do, right, because let's let's come down to it, so you know this, catch some bad guys and them gonna lick your face. Yeah, okay, it's the idea that a woman the idea that a woman processes trauma through her sexuality is not something that I necessarily

align with, but maybe some people do. You know, well, yeah, everybody has different experiences expressions like sure, I bet we could have a really interesting conversation with some women about this. I I'm more in your camp where I'm like, I've had a really bad day. I either want the world's most platonic hug, even if it's from my partner, or I want to be left alone and get under a gravity blanket and then be like, know this hugs me

and no one else talk to me. Girl, gravity blanket sounds pleasing, I think, Well, the reason it felt out of place to me is because, um, when I want comfort is when I'm feeling trauma, Like I need comfort because something's wrong. But in this episode everything had kind of just been fixed, like she you know, everything's okay now, So it felt like it just felt like a bad timing to me. It would have made way more sense in the room the night before for her to be

crying for him to be comforting her. She rolls over like it's just a hug, and then it just sort of happens in bed like that feels much more of a natural transition rather than like everything's better now. Well, I think they were trying to do a bait and switch, like they wanted people to think it was going to happen that night, and then it didn't, and then it's like, okay, we're in the clear, and then it was like supposed to be a sneak attack. Um. I think this episode

was really well written for all the Dan Scott stuff. Yes, and I think, you know, like Peyton constantly being faced with trauma is like a hard line to walk, but okay, we're walking it and we're getting through it. Some people are cursed, she's a cursed human. Um, it's just the let's let's make her younger to then have her do some like much older stuff and shoot it in a

way that is kind of graphic. Um. You know, it's not graphics for Cable, but if these were real life sixteen year olds playing these parts, you couldn't do that way. It'd be so it'd be very, very frowned upon. Um. So it just feels weird that people want to see pretend sixteen year olds get down. I don't want to sixteen year olds aren't sixteen. I know. My favorite part of that was when your hair got stuck on his necklace. That was like, that's real. How can we awkward this up?

I leaned into the awkward of that for sure, but that was great and I will I don't know thinking about it, I get the device. It does work. The point is that there's a connection between these people and that figuring out, you know, love and relationships at sixteen is really messy. And there was no reason you had to pull your clothes off. You could have just been making out. That's bad enough, right, It's bad enough. It's that,

you know, we've talked about it multiple times. I'm sure that's what initially came in, and they're like, let's turn it up to eleven, let's add a Brooke pervert comment. Let's know, we're gonna put Haley in ahead, and then we're gonna turn to everyone. We have news. Hi, we're doing a virtual event in September in honor of one Tree whe Everyone in the O T H Fam knows it's our favorite day and this event is also going

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That's looped live dot com for tickets. Do you guys remember your like, you know, when you're first in high school and you're starting to make out with boys and stuff. Do you remember how awkward it was though, and how like you didn't know what You're trying to kind of copy the things you saw in the movie and shows like ours, But you know it always felt so I mean, gosh, I remember one of my first French kisses. I think it was my first French kiss. I it was this

really rich boy in our neighborhood. I was kind of like the poor girl from the wrong side of the tracks, Like my house is across the street from the highway and like directly, um, you know, And but there was this boy my neighborhood that lived in Upper Saddle River, which is like, you know, within walking distance of where I was in Walton, New Jersey. And you're making it sound like pretty in pink like Andy well he um, he took me out a date to the Bubble Lounge,

and I was seventeen. He took me the Bubble Lounge in Manhattan. He like had a car that drove us there, like if they had a driver. Sorry, I'm going I'm going way off. But anyway, that was And then we got into the Champagne Lounge and like I was like, oh my, that was the first time I was ever drunk.

You know. I drank two glasses of champagne and one sitting thinking I don't feel anything, and then I stood up in the whole room just like shifted into place, turned my but um, sorry, I'm digressing, but anyway, I want to know everything. And then the next day or another, the next week or something whatever, when we hung out again. We were hanging out in his basement and there was

a game show on TV. I think was Jeopardy or something, and he were sitting on the couch and he starts to kiss me, and um, he he like was like kissing all around, like like all around my mouth. It was like your face face. It was like a whole face kiss, and you know it was sweet boy. I mean, we didn't know what we were doing, but I definitely was like I think whatever we're doing. This isn't it tell us his name later because I need to google

this person. But um, but I just remember now looking back at that, I'm going, just gosh, it was so awkward. You know, you don't know what you're doing. You're just trying, like this is what we do. We just mash our faces together. I don't know, you know so sweet. I remember like I was a very late bloomer and I didn't start kissing until very late in the game. And then once I did, right uh, like senior year, summer

summer after senior year. I remember it being like a great thrill to teach boys who hadn't kissed anyone really how to do it. Like that was like a thing where I was like, I am going to educate some boys so that we go off into the world and make it a happier, gentler boy. Yeah. I loved. I loved being like, let's slow this down, come on gently, You've done your duty to for society. That's it, undone. I put my time in. Congratulations girls, you're welcome. No,

I mean I've seen luck. I learned a kiss from a good kisser. I mean that's a that's a nice thing. To be able to look back and say, I think some of the kissing on this show was not my finest work because I was so scared that there's like a camera right there, you know, and it's like these these first season kisses were my first time ever ever

doing that, like without actually kissing. It's like a fake kiss, you know, so you're there's no tongue, and your natural like muscle memory is to like kiss with tongue because that's what you've been doing. And so in this so weird, it's like guppies, man, your life just guppies, like, you know. It was so gross and weird. I was doing a pilot.

I played Paul Sorvino's daughter in a pilot when I was fourteen, and it was called burning Down the House or something before the movie with Steve Martin came out, and my character of Paul Orvino had three daughters, and my character had to make out with a boy on the couch for like a whole scene while someone else is talking, you know. So it's a sitcom. So the other person is talking and they keep looking back at us and we're just like still you know, mashing each

other's snogging. So you were fourteen. I was fourteen. I might have been fifteen, but it was I mean, I was young, and I was supposed to play this teenager and the girl um Gina, oh gosh, I can't remember her last name, but she was so lovely and she played my older sister. And I remember just sitting down with her because we had done the blocking rehearsal. But

you don't really kiss in blocking her. You're not supposed to kiss and blocking hers and supposed to and you just sort of like lean in and like, you know, we're here, we're here. You put your faces side by side exactly. Thank you do a little cheek touch, cheek to cheek. Um. But I I sat down next to her. I went to her dressing remember knocking on her door and being like, I've never done it on camera, kiss before. What am I supposed to do? I don't know what

we're supposed to do? And Gina was so sweet. I'm going to look up her last name. I don't know why it's escaping me. It's my bad memory. Um, but she was like, oh, no problem. She she sat me down and she just walked me through all of it.

You know. It's kind of like you want to open your mouth and and just press it up against each other, and you and you sort of like get each other catch each other's lips a little bit, but you don't want to put your tongue in each other's mouth, so it just you want to make it look like you're French kissing, but you're not. Actually, Um, she was really sweet. So that's how I that's what I learned to do. Listen.

We all have to learn from somebody. Um. And yeah, it is an awkward thing to watch back in retro. It's so uncomfortable. I will say nothing gives me a greater giggle than when the three of us are on these zooms together and kissing scenes come up for any of us all just like cringing and covering our faces with our hands, like we're so horrified. And I don't know, I find it funny. Hill. She did a movie with Jeff. It was like some horror movie in a cabin with

Eric Palladino, and I'm pretty sure Jeff was in it. Well, then I'm pretty sure Jeff kissed her too. Because guys, we have some listener questions, and I really feel like I need to ask Samantha's question to the group because it's about this. She says, how do you separate acting feelings from real ones? For example, with Nathan and Haley, the chemistry and love you feel coming from you throughout the whole show is crazy. Did it ever get confusing

in real life? I'm gonna go ahead and tack on a reference to earlier in the show when we were talking about the palpable chemistry between Deb Scott and Keith. Scott and Craig have such good chemistry, and it's like, I think this is actually really a good question, So Joy take it away. Gina Phillips. By the way, Gina Phillips, Um, Okay, So I mean that's why location ships start. Location ships. That's a word. Yeah, shut up. It's like the most common.

I mean, look at every all of our favorite people on all of our favorite shows and in some of our favorite films have all dated each other. I mean I loved, Oh my god, Rachel McAdams and Ryan Gosling when they were remember when they kissed on stage at they from TV Awards and we were like, the notebook is real real? You know it? Yeah, I mean we've all we've all had our versions of that personally, I feel that the more friction I have with someone off camera,

the better it reads on camera. Um. Look, everyone knows Chad and I in season one were like, you know, two budding heads. We didn't necessarily agree on anything, and we grew to get along. But in season one, because our characters were so being thrust together, and I was aware of the want for it to be really like people want to think it's real, and so I was overcompensating for that, and so i'd be real with Chad.

I guess, you know, for Samantha and so many other people. Yeah, our our job is to create this real world, this real chemistry, and I think, you know, sometimes it turns into something that's actually real in real life. Again, I will never get over Rachel McAdams and Ryan Bawsin kissing at the MTV Awards noon. I loved it. I was in a book fan. I loved that relationship. Um, and you know, obviously not attached to it. It's no longer

a thing. But I do think it is funny man to know sometimes people who have amazing on screen chemistry who actually hated each other vice versa. I've seen people I don't know, if you guys have ever seen this. I've seen real life couples try to act together and their chemistry on screen is so flat, And I think nothing is funnier because in life I'm like, no, you guys are cute, but when you when there's a camera,

you get really awkward and you lose it. Joe and I just did the Here's Nigan episode for the Walking Down. I had night years about it, like I would like wake up in the middle of the night in the weeks leading up to shooting that, and I was like, oh my god, what if it goes wrong, Like what if it's bad? And instead we had the best time

ever and it was like super fun. But boy, I'm gonna tell you, like leading up to it, and he also had like, you know, been excited about it publicly like oh, my wife is coming to work to play and like then I think it dawned on him like, oh no, if this is bad, we've never done it before.

And so now to Samantha's point, um, it feels really nice to work with someone who I don't there's like not a boundary, you know what, you can be as like whatever as you want to be, and so like being able to really kiss your spouse when you're supposed to be in a kissing scene. It's like you were getting a wake something that's fun. Yeah, it snuck up and it was really fun. So yeah, it's it's a gamble man. There are some actors out there. Some people

can create chemistry with anyone. Yeah, and other people it doesn't matter how good looking they are. There's something about this your own personal the things that you're attracted to in other humans, and it's friendship chemistry as well. Um, and you know you just can't it's hard to force it. Um. You know what it is joy You've talked about. It's the listening. Listening as an actor makes you a better lover and it makes you a better friend on camera.

And I think that is the difference. And so some of these scenes where like we just kind of smashed together and there isn't like a dialogue before, Like Sophia, you and like just you know, broken Lucas have had some like talks and then a kiss, and then Haley and Nathan have had some talks and then it kiss and like pace just like headbutting people really without any kind of conversation. So it feels a little I want

to talk about it. It does get confusing, though, I mean, I think especially when you work with somebody that long. I mean, for me with James. James and I always got on really well, but he was a lot younger than me, and I just didn't really occur to me to have personal romantic feelings for him. Um. But as a show went on, and the more time we spend together, I mean, I would totally have like a romantic dream about him and wake up and be like, oh wow,

that was interesting. We're kissing all day, We're like make it out and we're like being all lovey dovey. Of course it's going to work your way into its way to wage your subconscious Um. But no, but you know, we never ever got together in real life, and that's honestly probably what kept the chemistry alive on screen for so long too. Yeah, boundaries are important, they are you need that yearning? Um? Sweet, Do we have any other

questions we want to hit before we do? Most likely? Yeah, well let's see we have corn asking when do you think the series concept changed from Ravens to ot to one? What was the season promo? Was the season one promo photo shoot? Awkward and at what point did you begin to feel like actual friends and not just coworkers. Well, we have a lot of questions here, Yeah, that's a lot. Well it changed. It changed after we shot the pilot. Think yeah, well it was just the title. It wasn't

the concept. It was just the title. It changed a little bit. I mean it went from being it was the way it was pitched, and we've talked about this was it was supposed to be like eight Mile with like the Boy from the Wrong Side of the Tracks, just to be like, you know, very gritty drama kind of thing. All the sexy stuff came in as a direct result of this summer launch of the o C because it was a smash hit. I mean it was

everywhere everywhere, and so we were told, okay, we'll match that. Um. But by the way, I don't know that that's a bad thing, because all of a sudden, the female characters got a much bigger piece of the pie, and you know, screen time and stuff like that. It's great, give me more, I'll take it. Yeah. Uh. Season one promo shoot photo shoot. Oh, the one where we were laying on each other. I was like, is that really put us in the bed? Yeah? It was on set. We filmed that, and we shot

that on a stage. Photo shoots are always awkward at I mean, at that age, it was always awkward because if we were all just we wanted to look great, and we were all sort of you know, all this sort of pitting us against each other was happening. Plus just the natural, uh sense of insecurity and jealous that I think a lot of women feel with young girls

feel with each other. And we're in an environment where we were always being compared to each other, and so I think photo shoots definitely got weird in the beginning. I think we eased up after a while, but yeah, it was a little weird. Plus laying everybody on top of each other and being like who we ripping off

with that photo shoot. There was another show friends had done, like the cover of Rolling Stone or something, all of them in a bed, and so we did it, and then Gossip Girl did it after us, like everyone has done. Every has that. It's so funny and my actual favorite part of season one was that them to kind of tease us. All the grown ups did it, so Barbara and Paul and Barry and Craig. It was genius. So they copied it, and so then there were two posters.

We need to post those, we need to on our social media because it was genius and Craig schefferd wore a tank top and it was I just loved it. They were so funny about it, so great. Yeah, I mean, I don't remember the photo shoot itself being weird. What I remember is it was the first time i'd been airbrushed, you know, when I worked at MTV and they did, like VJ photos, they didn't, you know, make us look different than we did. You know, we looked like we

did on TV. But in this photo shoot, you know, we get the pictures back in like my boobs because Joy you had out a T shirt and Hilary and I were both in tank tops and we were like, who'se boobs? Are these beats the heck out of me? Man? My whole life. Um, that was weird. And then also I didn't realize in the editing process, you know, if you're taking a group photo and somebody else looks really good and you were making a dumb face, they'll just take your face from a different picture and smack it

on there. And so there's one picture of Chad and I sitting on like Lucas's steps, where my head is clearly not attached to my body. Oh my gosh. I remember being like so personally upset about it, and the note you know, from all the powers that be are like, honey, nobody cares. And it was so like, oh, I get it. I'm a thing that we just sell now, like this is like a Sears catalog, you know, buy it, don't

buy it. No one cares. Um. Yeah, that was the editing process of when your body becomes a thing to buy and sell and like a brand. That was a weird concept. It was also so weird to me that because there's a thing we get to do where you get the images and you have what they call them kills. You have a certain number of kills, and when you're young, they give you barely any but you can say, like I really hate this picture of me and please don't

use it. But what was always so strange to me was that we couldn't say what our favorite pictures were. Oh yeah, we couldn't say I feel my best in this, please use one of these ten images that I like. They just sort of like, no, we pick the we pick you, we sell you. We own your image. We do what we do with your face what we want, and I still find it really weird. But I love weird. Then, dude, I look like I just parted in every promo picture we have because I've always got this huh, always the

way I looked so awkward. There's one of me out there that I see floating around all the time, and I look so sort of angular and mannish and like it's too much makeup. There's like a little bit of um, I don't I don't know, it's just this doesn't work. It's always bothers me um that photo. And there's anthing we can do about them. There isn't nothing we can do. But you know, there's lots of bigger fish to fry

in the world exact to sham hand problem. I suppose our fans actually make better art for us, like they do a great job of putting us in our best lights. So thank you so much. And by the way, we've been loving your drama Queen's artwork. Everybody, it's so fun to see that. Um And please keep sending us emails, let us know what you're enjoying about the show, what you want to hear more. Of UM and uh and

thank you so much for joining us. Should we display some fan art for our live event, you guys, get it in. We're also excited because we're gonna be together in real life for O th h D. So I can't wait to squeeze you guys to You know, tickets are on sales, So y'all come hang out with us. We love you. Come hang sing along with Gavin DeGraw and some special guests. Hey, let's been a wheel before we go. Yeah, I was gonna say, now we know

that we're all most likely to hate our press photos. Okay, dingh, we know this one most likely to win a Grammy. Yes, most likely to win a Grammy is none other Hayley James Scott. Right, that's right, Yes, girl, let's do that. When we do that, I mean, honestly, we know it's like a game. We know there's like record labels that like take people out to lunch and stuff like that. Like I'll whoever lunch for you to win a Grammy.

I'm into it. I'm in. I'm so in. Well, I just had a meeting with the record label UM last week actually to talk about doing a country record and just yeah, there's something's brewing. There's something's brewing with I've got a tambourine if you need some backup, Yes, I do. Sit here it sweet. Well you, guys, this episode was traumatic across the board. I'm glad we went together. Well.

Next week is episode thirteen, Hanging by a Moment, Hanging by a Moment, Hey Baby, February ten, two thousand and four. On their way to drive Karen home from the airport, Karen's back, Keith Lucas collide with an oncoming vehicle. More crashes, leaving Lucas unconscious and fighting for his life. Drama Drama Queens. Okay, guys, bye, We'll see you next week. Hey, thanks for listening. Don't

forget to leave us a review. You can also follow us on Instagram at Drama Queens O t h or email us at Drama Queens at I heart radio dot com. See you next time. Were all about that high school drama? Girl Drama Girl, all about them high school queens. We'll take you for a ride at our comic girl Cheering for the right draw a queens dreelease my girl up girl fashion. But you're tough girls. You could sit with us. Girl Drama Queeze Drama, Quez Drama, Queen's Drama, Drama, Queen's Drama, Queens