This is doctor Wendy Walsh and you're listening to KFI AM six forty the Doctor Wendy Walsh Show on demand on the iHeartRadio app. If you're new to me, I'm a psychology professor, not a therapist, but I am obsessed with the science of love. Producer Kayla. How you doing, I'm wonderful, Doctor Wendy. How are you anything new happening in your love life? A heartbreak? Heartbreak, laymen and heartbreak? You know it's funny. Yes, yesterday we had my book group. I got to host it at my house.
It's been a while, so it's my turn. And there's some people brought their younger nieces, daughters, whatever. So we had this smattering of girls in their twenties and then the wise old Auntie's there in the room. And one of the women said, I don't know how it came out of the blue because it didn't have anything to do with the book we were reading. But she said, what's about this choking thing, the choking trend that's happening right, She's just learning she's late to the party, And I said,
oh, let me go. First of all, men are the average age that young boys begin to watch porn. Are you sitting down? People? Is the age of eleven. According to research, the average young American boy is starting to be exposed to porn by eleven. By the time he's in his twenties, he is now graduated to more misogynistic, more violent, crazy porn, and then he's dating young women who are competing in a high supply sexual economy. I'll get there in a minute against other women. So
they think they have to give him what he's accustomed to. Believe me, no woman goes waking up in the morning, Wow, I'd really like to be choked tonight. Caleb. Why did you look up like that? And you had a little smirk like you've had that thought in the morning. You remember that guy we had on who was like the escort for the rich. The we had him. He was a hotty macat face. You remember,
he was really cute. Really, he was like, there's a way to hair, and there's a way to so I think it's like doors kill me, but there's a way to do Yeah. But there's a difference between a little slap and tickle. Don't slap on me. Choke is fine with slap. That's why I draw the line someone cutting off your air toobe you're supposed to be able to breathe like a little bit, Well, they don't know how to do it right. And I would never trust a high test offshore
a man at his moment of please okay. And then somehow I brought up the whole thing of remember the former Dodger Trevor Bauer, and the whole thing from a couple of years ago and the girl that was all beat up by him, and he got off in court because he said, well, she gave me consent. Gentlemen, if a woman says hit me, if a woman says choke me, a gentleman says no, thank you, ma'am.
That's what you say, No, thank you, ma'am. Okay. So yeah, that's what the choking trend is about, is because women are trying to catch up with what men's new interests are. And I got to that point in my book group and then they said, what did you say about it? The high supply sexual economy? What is that? What does that thing? And I realized that I had been talking about this for years. It's all in my book The Thirty Day Love Detalks, and yet on KFI
I haven't brought it up in a while, in a long while. And so there are these women of all ages going down a tunnel in the dark without a flashlight. So let me illuminate for you what the mating marketplace is right now. We are fast heading towards a culture of matriarchy. We're not there yet, it's gonna be a few more decades. Okay, calm down. We have seen a feminization of college campuses as we've entered the information age
now, even with the hard scientists. In fact, one of the young women who was at the book club yesterday is an engineering student, and she said, even in her discipline, it's fifty to fifty men and women. But the other disciplines it's far more women than men. Men are just not getting educated. Because it's the information age. Women are more uniquely suited. We're talkers, we're texters, we're typers, we have more social sensitivity.
In the information age, our skill set is actually needed. We don't need to necessarily be building infrastructure, although Biden's been doing it. Apparently there's an infrastructure bill happened. So anyway, so we have the feminization of college campuses. We have women using a big chunk of their fertility window, which is a biological reality, getting educated and building their careers. We have men who
are now not having to work hard for women. Not so long ago, in order for a ban to have sex with a woman, he had to impress her, he had to sacrifice for her. But right now, the price of sex see the sexual economy. You know I was getting there. The price of sex has been declining. Did you know in nineteen fifty the average time between meeting somebody and marrying them was about six months. Why? Yes, the price of sex was six months of courtship and an altar in
nineteen fifty. In the nineteen eighties it was something called the three date rule. You had to pay for three expensive dates. A man would pay so that he could, you know, have his fun with the woman. Today, the price of sex has dropped to the barrel bottom price of one well worded text. And sometimes all that text says is U up late at night? You up? I'm disgusted. So men lose ambition when women put out sex into the economy in high supply. At the same time, women believe
that what's good for the goose is good for the gander. If they can have as much sex as they want, then women should be able to too. But you don't hear about the hookup culture. Are the girls crying in therapist's office because they're thinking all this free sex is a stepping stone to finding a mate? And usually it's not, because here's the thing. No gender life someone who they don't have to work for. They value what they have
to sacrifice for. And so if you think you're gonna be the fun girl and give it up and not be a problem to him, and he's gonna turn around one day and go, you know what, you are wife material, it's not gonna happen. Did you know a man can have sex with the same woman every week for six months and not like her one bit more than he did that first time. And if a woman has sex with a man regularly for six months, her body gives us so much oxytocin she falls
in love, even if he's a loser. So anyway, the high supply sexual economy is hurting women. What's the answer, Well, stop having sex. No, it depends what you're looking for. If you want a short term relationship, have a short term relationship, but don't think you're gonna convert it. Okay, if you want a long term relationship, then you need to be cool and make him work for it. Like him work for it. That's it. Make him work for it. And then the other thing
that came up is, you know, we're all grown women. We're like, why don't we just date women and just use him for their sperm? And I'm like, that is kind of where we're going. I think, nothing, it's gonna happen all right. When we come back, I want to talk about the Kids Online Safety Act? Was it last week or the week before? Two weeks ago? Two weeks ago? I want to talk about what's going on and why we all should be calling our congress person so
we can save the mental health of our children and teenagers. And later the secret to happy couples. Apparently they fight right and I'm going to tell you how they do that. And for singles, how to say no politely, not necessarily sex. I mean, if somebody asked you out and you don't want to go out, or you went out with them for a little bit and then you're like, I don't want to continue this, how to do it nicely without ghosting them, And also how to learn to tolerate rejection.
We got so much coming up, and I'll be taking your calls and going to social media and blah blah blah. It's gonna be so much fun. You're listening the Doctor Wendy Walls Show on KFI AM six forty. We Live Everywhere on the iHeartRadio app. You're listening to Doctor Wendy Walsh on demand from KFI AM six forty. I got a wedding coming up to time. Does that make me not a single mom anymore? Well, I think the fiance and the relationship makes you not single. I know, but I was like,
now that once the kids are over. My youngest just turned twenty one, so she's not a kid. So am I still a single mom? And then if I get married, am I still a single? But they don't live now. I don't think you're a single mom anymore. Okay, I was a single mom for eighteen years. The first one did not get a cell phone until I'm going to say at least eighth grade or ninth grade. The second one was a digital native from the beginning. I mean iPads
and strollers, the whole thing. I'd make every mistake that you could ever have made, because I had a kid who was not neurotypical and she had screaming meltdown tantrums and stick a video in front of her face and a calmer down and get you around public. However, I will honestly say that the younger one has struggled more with her mental health than the older one. I'm not fully blaming social media. There are many, many, many features.
But there are a growing group of parents out there there with a very loud voice who are starting to blow the whistle on these social media companies. It's been going on for a couple of years. Do you remember two weeks ago we had Mary Rode. She was part of something called the Common Sense Media Group, and she's in New York and she'd helped do a rally to try to get past the New York Child Data Protection Act. She's a teacher.
Her fifteen year old son joined Facebook because he wanted to sell something on Facebook Marketplace. He'd never been on Facebook before. He stayed home from school one day because he just had his braces tightened cutie, and he was in pain. And so he gets on Facebook and gets a private message from a cute little girl who or what he thinks is a cute little girl, and he sees that some of his other friends are friends with her, so we think
she's safe and a real person. And his friends are at school so we can't check it out. They don't have their phones in classroom. So he starts having a great all time messaging her and flirting with her for a number of hours till she asked him to send a headshot, and she sends her headshot, and then it gets a little more explicit, and she sextorts him.
She gets him to send some sexually explicit shot and then suddenly she I don't know if you ever realized he was being catfished by a syndicate potentially in Nigeria. We don't know exactly, but that's where a lot of them are. And this person at the other end of the line says, if you don't send me money, I'm going to send this video that you made or picture, whatever it was, to every single person on your social media who shares your last name, your grandma, your aunties, your uncles, everybody.
This kid was so ashamed that he died by suicide that day, and it took only six hours of using social media. It is heartbreaking. In twenty twenty two, a new bill was introduced in the Senate called the Kids Online Safety Act Kids Online Safety Act KOSA. It got very good, more than sixty senators bipartisan support in the Senate. It recently passed a key House
subcommittee vote. President Biden has supported the bill, but guess what, they don't have a date on the calendar yet for the House to even vote on it, so it's sitting there in limbo. This week, The New York Times wrote a profile of a similar mother, not Mary Ord, another one named deb schmil who has met with thirteen lawmakers in the last couple of weeks. She herself has taken a little apartment in Washington to try to get them.
Her daughter, Becca died at the age of eighteen. She died after taking a drug that, unbeknownst to her, was laced with fentanyl that she bought on Facebook Before that, Why did she reach out to Brad Ruggs. Her daughter was traumatized because she was raped by a boy she'd met online, and then when other kids found about it out about it, she was cyberbullied on Snapchat. This woman is out there saying we need to get this passed.
But they are up against all the tech companies who've been paying for the politicians of course and contributing to their and the tech companies are of the stupid argument that's like, this is not going to protect kids data if they have to ask the age of the kids and verify the age that's stealing their data. Oh stop, that's double speak. So I want everyone today to write
your congress person. If you don't know who congress person is, you just go online Congress, Doug Over or whatever you put in your zip code. It's so simple. And you say we need Kosa Kosay Coosa, the Kids Online Safety Act up for a vote in the House, because it's sitting there languishing. It's got no date. For the rest of us. Let's talk about good digital hygiene for all of us. Number one, we all need to be doing this. I don't care what your age. Don't go online
first thing in the morning or last thing at night. Don't already pollute your brain with social media. Set virtual boundaries for yourself. Limit screen time, commit to checking your email only every few hours, never have your phone at the dinner table, and say no to tech in the evening. For at least two hours before you go to bed, read a real book, watch some comedy on Netflix if you have to, but don't look at your phone. That blue light will keep you up all night. We have to all
practice good digital hygiene. Sleeping with it in a different room has proven to be really beneficial if you just like leave it in the living room. Low. Yeah, because they buzz and beep and do everything and we grab it exactly. So we need to start doing this for all of us, for our mental health, especially for our kids and teenagers. And write your congress
person, please kossay Kids Online Safety Act. Okay, when we come back, did you know there's a secret to happy couples and it was discovered in research? Good research too. They fight right, let me explain what that is. When we come back. You are listening to the Doctor Wendy Walls Show on KFI AM six forty. Were live everywhere on the iHeartRadio app. You're listening to Doctor Wendy Walsh on demand from KFI AM six forty. This
is the Doctor Wendy Wall Show. So I'm gonna tell you something. Julio and I had a fight last week, and you know what, we had to fight about neither of us remember, we don't actually remember the topic, but we know probably what triggered it, which is we were separated because he was far away doing the movie. I was far away. We had time change problem, and so as a result, we get a little antsy when we're away from each other and snippy and I don't sleep as well when I'm
not with him, and so I was overtired. There's actually research say that just getting a good night's sleep is one of the best things you can do for your relationship. But anyway, I don't sleep well, and so we had this knockdown, drag him out, silly little argument on the phone. Honestly, neither of us, now that we're back together, can remember the content of it and what and the big thing here, the big news here is that the point is we have an understanding of why it happened, which
was the distance and the separation. So you know, I quote them all the time. Probably my favorite researchers on the planet when it comes to marriage are John and Julie Gotman at the Gotman Institute at the University of Washington. They are psychologists who've been studying couples for twenty thirty forty years, and they say that there are certain kinds of fights that happen with couples. Right,
they are, first of all, problems that can be solved. Those are the same things like you're not parking your car straight and I can't fit in the garage, or I don't like the way you undo the toothpaste, or can you do this? Or not have the TV on when I'm trying to go to sleep. These are just problems. You come to a compromise, you solve them. It's done. I have another friend who's a Mariagan family therapist, and I said to her one time, what is the most common
thing that couples fight about? And she goes it doesn't matter what it is, it's that it never goes away. So the goatmans call this the perpetual problem. In other words, opposites attract. We attract to somebody who's different from us, and then we get them in our orbit, and now we
don't like that thing that's different. Right, there's this perpetual problem. It might be a value driven thing, like somebody spends a lot of money in the other person's a savor it. Maybe you know something about night owls mourning people. It might be some people one is more religious than the other, some deep value thing, might be a parenting thing, a perpetual problem, and it just keeps coming up. Right, So the Gotmans say, the
third level is the gridlock perpetual problems. And that's a perpetual problem that actually has been mishandled in the past. So now it's a big old tender spot and nobody wants to bring it up. They're just tiptoeing around this issue. But it's always there. It's the elephant in the living room. So what
the Gotmans say is that smart couples the happy couples. And here's the thing I love about the research that they study couples who they've actually been able to put couples in a room and problems solve together, and watch how they interact, how they maybe reach out for care, touch each other, or be
polite, respectful in their tone even though they disagree. They look at if there's name calling, all kinds of stuff, and they can actually tell with like ninety percent accuracy if the couple's going to be divorced within five years just by watching them in a lab for ten minutes, right, Because it's all about conflict style. So they also study couples who are relatively happy for decades. And here's the secret. It all comes down to how they fight.
The biggest mistake that couples make, according to the Gotmans and the research, is that they fight to win. Somebody wants to be right, somebody wants to win. And if you are fighting to win, the relationship will lose because if somebody wins, somebody else loses. And now you're with a partner who has lower self esteem, who feels bad or has a grudge. Now, So the couples who are smart, the masters at fighting, they don't
fight to win. They fight to understand. So fighting to understand means taking the conversation about what the issue is, the surfacey thing, and trying to go a little bit deeper, trying to figure out why your partner has this strong feeling, whether it actually is related to what's happening right now or something in their childhood, but you really want to try to understand the issue.
For instance, one time years ago, I was with this guy and I said something, but I remembered it wrong, so I misspoke, But I was quite sure, excuse me, that I said it right. Right. So I was kind of like, no, no, no, really, and he got so angry. I did remember it wrong, by the way. But the reason why he got angry because later I said to him,
you know, I feel like because of what happened in your childhood. He had told me earlier that in his childhood the family, both parents had gas lit him all the time, and they talked to him about a reality that he knew as a kid just wasn't true or wasn't right right. They were always misleading him and tricking him and lying to him. The kids know everything, they're a sponge. They know the truth. You can't really lie.
And so I was able to get him to see, oh my god, I triggered you because I had the memory wrong, so it felt like I was gaslighting it. We ended up making up and everything was fine. Right. So here's a question you ask in the throes of a fight. If you can calm down a bit and use a nice tone, say honey, is there something that might have happened in your childhood this make you feel so
strongly about this? Or ask them to imagine what is their dream about how it will be resolved instead, So what do you want me to do about it. No, not that you say, Okay, let's try to problem solve here. I see that you're really upset. How would you like to see this settled? How would you like to see the outcome? Help me understand what you need right now? If you talk like that, you'll get through the issues. So that's why Hulu and I don't remember the content of
the fight we had last week. The argument. It was a fight. It was argument on the phone because we were able to go, Oh, it's because as we're far apart, it's because we're missing each other. We're both irritable because of that. Right, So what you want to do is try to inject some empathy into the fight. Now. I know it's hard. You've been triggered, you're mad, they're really pissing you off. Also, when you've been in a long term relationship, you kind of take them
for granted. You know they're not going to walk out the door. So it's hard for you to be soft. But you have to. You have to allow your partner to express their truth without fear or judgment. You have to start doing it yourself as well. All right, when we come back, I want to talk to single people out there, single people of any age who are maybe going to be asking somebody out, maybe have been asked out, maybe had a date or two with somebody, and now you're like,
Eh, I don't think that person's for me. How do you reject somebody nicely? What do you do? And also if you're the rejectee, how do you tolerate that? Let's talk about hell healthy rejection. When we come back, you are listening to the Doctor Wendy Wall Show on KFI AM six forty. We live everywhere on the iHeartRadio app. You're listening to Doctor Wendy Walsh on demand from KFI AM six forty. Hi, everybody, you are live in our KFI AM six forty studios in Burbank, California, and
we are live live live. After this segment, I am going to be taking your phone calls live, So producer Kayla is going to head to the phones in a few minutes and screen the calls. You can say hi to her first. If you have a relationship question, you are welcome to call in. The number is one eight hundred five two zero one five three four. That's one eight hundred five to zero one KFI. But not quite yet, because she hasn't opened the phone lines yet, but you will. I'll
announce the number again too, all right. Many people have a very hard time rejecting another person. Nobody wants to hurt anybody, right, We don't want to give them pain, and so we have trouble saying no. We
have trouble setting back boundaries because we're basically nice people. Most people are basically nice people, right, And so the problem in the dating scene, especially if you're single and it's early on, is that you might end up going on a date with somebody you don't even like, just because you don't want to say no, or they're being persistent in some way. And the other problem is that, you know, besides that you went on a pity date,
is that you might ghost somebody. A lot of people do that where they just don't respond, and that hurts the mental health of the other person because they sit there at a loss. Psychologists would call it ruminating. What did I did wrong? Did they get my text? Did they know? Did they get my hands? I don't know, right, It's a terrible feeling to be ghosted, right. It impacts somebody's self esteem. They often
blame themselves. They're imagining why this could have happened. Okay, first of all, if we're talking about rejection, here's what you should not do. You should not wean somebody. Ladies, you are famous for this. Actually, dudes, you do it too. A lot of you guys did it to me back in the day. I remember, all Right, when you wean someone, you just take longer and longer between the check ins, and the texts are fewer words, and the phone calls start to become nonexistent.
Right, That's called weaning them. The problem is if somebody has if they're really into you, or they have a little anxiety around attachment, this actually ignites them. They want to get closer, so they try more and more ways to try to get these bids for your attention. So weaning somebody not
only doesn't work, but it often makes them come back stronger. And the other thing, kind of like weaning is if somebody asks you out, try not to give them false hope by saying things like I'm just really busy this week, Like they say you want to go see this show Friday, No I can, I'm busy. No. You have to say no, thank you. You can't just say I'm busy, because if you say are busy, they think it's just the Friday night that's the problem, and they're going
to keep trying. And if you say things like oh, maybe another time, it leaves them like want more. Right, That is not saying no. If you've gone on a few dates with somebody and you know sometime it takes two three dates for you to go no, probably not for me. You don't want to do the whole talk about Hey, you know it's not you, it's me. I'm not really ready for a relationship. Oh come on, you went on a date. Of course you were ready for a
relationship. You were looking for somebody. So you have to find a way to be very clear. And as I mentioned before, never ever, ever, ever, ever ever ever, ghost, don't ghost. You can send a text that's polite. So let's talk about the things you can do to say no to a date or no to somebody that you might have had a couple of dates with. The most important thing is you want to be clear when you say no, but also polite, and you also want to say
few words. Here's why. If you say something like oh, that's really kind of you to ask me, but no, thank you, that's very clear they got the message right. But if you say, oh, that's really kind of you, no, thank you. I don't really like Beyonce. What woman's going to say that, right, So you're gonna they're immediately good to now mount an argument. Oh no, really, she's great.
You should come check her out. Right. The more information you give when you're negotiating, you're giving fuel for the other person to argue with you. So less is more. Just say that's really kind of you, no thank you. Also, if you've been on a date with somebody or two or three and they call again, you want to thank them for following up. Thanks for calling again, that's really sweet of you. I did have a good time, But I want to be honest. I don't think we're meant
for each other romantically. The thing I used to say to people is I think you're great, but I just don't think romance is in the cards for us. That's implying like, hey, you're a good person and you're in you're good for somebody. I used to have a system when I rejected men. That was a very good rejector. Now I used to do all the bad things before, and I'd wonder why they wouldn't go away. I try to wean them and all that stuff, and they keep coming back with more
and sending me presents and whatever. And so now now I'm taken now. But back when I was dating finding my man, I would, you know, have the conversation. Maybe I just met them on the app and then I get on the phone so I could do some real interviewing before deciding on the date. And then if I decided I didn't want to go on a date after that, I would have this canned text and it usually began with something personal like, hey, great, great chatting with you on the phone.
You know, have fun at your sister's wedding or whatever they talked about is coming up. I actually don't think romance is in the cards for us, but I'll be happy to keep you in mind for a friend sometime. Now. Let me tell you, no man ever wrote back okay, b word. They never said anything rude. They either did not write back at all because they knew where they stood, which is fine, or they said hey, thanks, yeah, we can keep in touch, thanks for your
honesty. They'd often say thanks for your honesty. They would just know. People want to know where they stand, and it's possible to be kind when you say no. You can be empathetic and say something like, you know, I really wish you the best, and I hope you find to your person. What a sweet thing to say, right, I really hope you find your person. You could say something like I had a great time with you, but I don't think it's going to continue in the way that you
want it. It's not working for me, but thank you and great, you know, like throw in some compliments along the way. Now. I want to be clear, there are certain times when it's absolutely okay not to be nice to somebody when you're rejecting them. And these are the people who don't get the kindness followed by the very clear no, thank you. Right. They are the people who don't take no for an answer. They are the people who keep harassing you and asking you out again and again and again.
You know who you are. People you need to learn to take no for an answer. So you need to say to this person, I appreciate you asking the answers. No, please don't ask me again. You have to give them the next life of behavior that you want, right, please don't ask me again. And if they try to guilt you or manipulate you. You can actually just say I'm not interested. Please respect that, and you don't have to get mad. You can just sit flat. I'm not
interested. Please respect that. Right. If they're totally making you feel creeped out, though, you have my full permission to be as blunt as possible and just say your behavior is making me feel uncomfortable. I'm gonna tell you a story many years ago, I went on a date with a man. It was a lovely date, drinks, appetizer somewhere, which is the first time meeting him off an app and then we get out to the valet Parker.
I'm getting waiting for my car, he's waiting for his car, and he suddenly grabs me and does like the deep throat tongue kiss, like a stranger at happy hour. I know, right, Kayla. Her face went eh. It's like there was no leading up to it. There was no you know, mutual body language, there was no time. It was just all of a sudden, what did you do? Well? He kept calling me and wanting me to get up to his place in Big Bear as a
ski resort near us. I want to get you up to Big Bear and I originally texted something like I'm not up to it or I'm not up for it, and then he kept hounding me because I was being too nice. Right, and then I finally said, actually that kiss was inappropriate. It made me feel uncomfortable. Good for you, and he said say sorry. He said, oh, oh, I understand. Okay, Yeah, this is a nerdy guy who didn't know better. But I didn't want a nerdy
guy in my life. We're done there. Listen, if you're the person being rejected, I want you to know that it's okay to feel hurt, but don't ruminate about it. Surround yourself by people you love you who love you, your friend's, family, colleagues, right, get that social support you need. Remind yourself that there is somebody out there for you. Just because you're a bad match doesn't mean you're a bad person. Right. We all go out with people where it doesn't work out, and do the work
that you need to do. Be mindful, journal go to therapy if you need to. If you're constantly constantly feeling rejected and grieving and loss, then maybe you're picking people who will reject you unconsciously, not consciously unconsciously you could be picking people who will reject you, and you need to talk to a therapist about why you're always chasing those people who will hurt you. All Right, when we come back, I am going to be taking your calls.
If you have a relationship question, I would love to weigh in on your love life. The number is one eight hundred and five two zero one KFI. That's one eight hundred five two zero one five three four. Reminder, I'm not a therapist. I'm a psychology professor, but I've written three books on relationships, did a dissertation on attachment theory, and I love to weigh in on people's love lives. Give me a call. You're listening to the
Doctor Wendy Walls Show on KFI AM six forty. We're live everywhere on the iHeartRadio app. You've been listening to Doctor Wendy Walls. You can always hear us live on KFI AM six forty from seven to nine pm on Sunday and anytime on demand on the iHeartRadio app.