And we're back with part two. Welcome back to those amigos. I am Wilmer Bodrama. I'm Freddy Rodriguez and uh Freddy, we've been talking about leadership, putting teams together.
Yeah, yeah, let's get into it.
New middle dose transparency. I think it's number one, y right, Like, there's no secrets here. If we're in the telling story business, you know, like we we need to be very much
on the same page at all times. If you disagree with something, it's so important that you do it with kindness, that you do it with with the serenity of welcoming new ideas, and that if you're going to oppose a question, that you should always come with an answer, right, because that's still the thing that like, you know, one thing is be a complainer and saying like, hey, you know it's not good enough or it's not this, or it's not getting there, and the other one is not following
those comments with a roadmap to get it to a better place. If you really do have an opinion that something is not working, you know, then what is your thoughts on making it work? Right? So, so like that's that's where I feel like number one when it comes to leadership, it's important to be transparent with your teams, but it's also even more important to listen to to the team's uh, you know, thoughts and struggles with with such create creative endeavors, right, Like you know, you don't
have to have all the answers right. And somebody said, it's like the best leaders of the ones who don't micromanage.
Right.
The best visionaries are the ones who you know, think of a dream, right, they visualize it, and then they divorce that dream and allow the team to own that and then have that team bring that dream to life and sore in other ways that you didn't even expect for that same idea to do.
Is that why you.
Feel that your company has grown as much as it has and has seen the success that it's seen.
Is it?
Do you feel that that type of leadership skill has contributed to that aspect?
I think I trust and so therefore they trust me, right. I trust my team to do what they're there to do, right, you know, and when there's things that could have been a lot more efficient, or could have been a lot more you know, thoughtful, or things like that, they're very soft quick discussions. We don't have to. Nobody has to feel like, you know, like they got it wrong. Everybody could feel like, great, we try that, let's try this other way, right, So.
Transparency, I think it is because they're human.
They're human and about the way, we're going to make mistakes and people are gonna so I think I think the biggest thing for me is to trust the people you have in your team to do what they're there to do, you know, because otherwise you just do everyone's job, right, Like, the leader is not there to do everyone's job. The leader is there to facilitate, to delegate with kindness, and to create an environment where they feel safe voicing the good and the bad ideas.
Although it may not be intentional.
Do you find and I asked this because I've known you so long, right, and do you find that not that you you try to do everybody else's job, but you're so you're so I've seen you be so incredibly focused and on your hustle. Do you find that you have to sometimes go I got I gotta step back, I gotta not I gotta not do that, I gotta not make that call, I gotta not pick those cables. Dude, I've seen you I've seen you wear like five different hats at one time.
Man, I'm like, geez, man, this guy is gonna.
Well look, I think we all have to be able to wear those hats to eventually not look at that.
Smile, man, look at that smile.
Yeah, you know, I'm speaking the truth here, you know.
Here's the thing. Yeah, and I don't disagree. I think that when you are a creative person and you have the ability to see beyond the idea, when I come up with an idea myself, right, I'm already at like, how is this sitting on the shelves? There's like probably thirty five steps before the shelf, same, right, but I'm already thinking about what the poster looks like before there's even a script, right. And that's that's both a gift and really occurs because there's a lot of steps in
between to get it there. But for all those things to get you to that shelf of that poster idea, there is a team who does that better than you. Yeah, you know, and so therefore, but you do have to have eyes on the process, especially when it's something as specific as like a major ip or something like there's certain things you can just stray away from and you know you're there to steer the ship.
Yeah, you know, but a.
Team is getting it somewhere right, because what you're thinking of is the end go right. You're at point A and you already see Z. And your job as a company owner, as a CEO, is to guide that process from A to Z.
Correct correct. Yeah. And and by the way, that's the other thing you do this long enough with individuals, I mean someone like Leo. Leo, how long you've been working We've been working together. So Leo and I have been working together for fourteen years. For fourteen years, he's understood, you know, the you know, the essence the DNA and the mission statement of the company, and he's owned it himself.
And now it's his vision now the podcast division which he is the head of, and how he manages his relationship with our partners, our iHeartMedia. You know, it comes from his vision or where he feels this company should go next as a podcast division. And what I can do is I can support him. I can, you know,
I can. I can support his ideas. I can give him real feedback, right, but at some point I have to now trust his ideas of how these things you run so most often times or not because we have such a shorthand at this point, he'll come and I will ask him what do you think we should do about that? And he's like, I think we could go here, here,
and here, and I go, okay, go. I don't have to have an opinion about that, because I know that he's probably mad every possible scenario before we make that decision.
Are you Are you out of point that?
Although although let's just say something that Leo brings to you, right, and although you're at point A and you kind of see Z, but Leo has a different opinion as to how to get to Z. Are you at a point where you override your own instinct and allow him to reach Z?
Or yes and no? Yes or no? Because if we both see it a little differently, before I even disagree, I would create space for him to tell me what's the outcome, how does it end, you know, and what is it about? Because there may be things in the initial conversation that I didn't pick up on that I needed in order to say, oh, yeah, it's good. Right, So that's like one aspect of it. But if it is in fact a differential of you know of directions. It doesn't come in the form of critique or disagreement.
It comes in the form of questions.
Right.
Right, So you asked the question, right, what do you think the audience is for this?
Right?
Or you know, what would an episode be?
Like?
What's the structure of an episode?
Right?
And the other one is like, what's the theme of the season? You know, if you have to create a theme for the season, what's that theme?
Yeah?
What are the guests like?
Right?
When you ask all these questions about a show and somebody has an answer for.
Those, yeah, you have to trust them.
Yeah, And wouldn't you say there's also an aspect of humility on both sides, right, because you have to have the humility enough to go although like, and I'm speaking for you now, Leo, I would imagine on Leo's end to have the humility enough that if you're asking him a million questions for him not to.
Let his ego or go go, why is he asking me questions?
I've been so incredibly blessed everyone that has worked and works at WV, you know, and has owned their own perspective departments, because the company now has multiple departments and they're running on their own, right, like the podcast division, right, the podcast division, the alternative division, right, you know, the scripted division, right, the film division.
Right.
Then then you have you know, the product development side. But then you also have h you know, the management company and and and then the nonprofit stuff.
Right.
What I'm saying is that, like in order for all of that to run, there has to be a level of trust. You know, that that comes with time, you know. And I and I would say this, like the number one the number one skill that anyone, no matter what career or what job they're going for, to have is foresight.
Mm hm.
You have to see it before it happens. You have to have an answer before the question happens. Right, And that's one thing everyone in this company does beautifully, right. You know, they know what questions I'm going to ask at some point already, you know, so they checkmate me in ways that like I don't even see coming in.
So there's there's ah that's interesting because they've worked with you for so long they have a sense of what you might come.
But it's in the culture, right, It's in the culture. And in that trust also kind of evolves into you know, into a mutual respect so it's foresight and respect. You gotta you know, you gotta put on your silk gloves when you are handling storytelling because not one size fits all. And that's okay, right, as long as you're telling the same story together. How you get to the last page
that says the end? You know that that is the adventurous exercise that you go with your creative partners, right, like you know, but but the two days like yes and right, and then over time you learn that you what you respect about these individuals goes beyond their creativity, their organizational skills, their their their sense of foresight, you
know it. You start realizing that it takes a very balance and beautiful individual to to you know, to do a job like this, love it and the highs and the lows, and you're not not only respecting it to
become really good friends, you know. But I think in that process you learn to appreciate the friendship and you know, you spend so much time together that eventually you go, oh, well, you know this is you know, we're going to experience life together too, yeah, you know, and that and that life happens, and you know, I've leaned on Leo and Jessica and you know Todao and I mean everybody in my life. Dude, that's just worked on me for a
very long time. But you know, but that could be tricky, right.
Yeah, And that brings up a great point, Wilmer, which I want to ask you about. When you work so closely with people and you develop a relationship over what
over a decade, right right, you become friends. And I wanted to see and want to ask you all on the on the flip side of that, would you ever hire your friends from back home or friends that you grew up with to be a part of your team because you have the first part of that relationship, right of the closeness and familiarity, but maybe not the professional side of that. So would you because you look at
examples like Lebron. You know, Lebron James hired you know, his friends from back home, Rich Paul and Maverick Carter and they're doing big things right now. And so I had that question for you both. Would you ever be open to working with and building a team that consists of close friends from the get go?
That's a that's a tough one. That's a tough one. I think I would imagine. Look, I don't I don't know what was behind Lebron's decision making, but I would imagine that he must have seen something in them that said, well, these are not just like my buddies who I hang out with and mess around with.
Right, there must have been they must.
Have had the aptitude the skill level to achieve the heights that they that they achieved. Right. They were probably not in Corporate America's eyes like the first choice maybe, but he saw something in them that they could that they could get there, and it took someone like Lebron
to give them that chance to do it right. So, So to answer that question, would I, I mean, yeah, if I saw those qualities in someone, whether they're my friend, whether they're my kids, whether they're whoever it is, but I need to see specific qualities in the specific goals and motivation and other and other aspects in them for me to go I'm gonna take this chance on you, because there's always that possibility that they don't they don't
meet your expectations, right, And if they don't meet your expectations, then what then? It affects your relationship, it affects your friendship, or even if you're hiring family, right, how does that affect It's tricky, It's really tricky.
It's very tricky. And I think that that's the that's the right answer. I think that's the best answer. My biggest concern is if you're trying to achieve something, you have to give yourself the best shot, you know. And you know, there's this fantasy of like I'm bringing you know, I'm bringing the crew with me, you know, And I tried it. I tried it the first ten to fifteen years of my career.
I tried. But you were you were like a freaking teenager.
Exactly why exactly why you were?
You were on the biggest show on the planet and you were and it was popular, and I mean I could imagine you must have been.
Like I hired some of my friends as my assistance, and uh, what's the craziest thing that ever happened when one of your friends, well you don't have to name the person.
No, So.
No, all of them I think are stable and doing their own thing now. But I will say, you know, it said, you know form like you know, these assistants giving you, you know, Christmas and birthday presents and use your own credit card.
Wait wait wait wait wait wait wait your assistant gave you a birthday Christmas present, but use your credit card pay for it by yes, okay.
So I bought my own Christmas presents from my assistant, you know. So like I got this really nice dress shirts with my initials on it, and I was like, this is really thoughtful. I love that. WUV either, I mean, w e V. That's awesome, you know, and these are really cool shirts. And at the time, I was wearing suits all the time. I was like, yeah, this is this is really thoughtful. I like that, you know. And then the statements came, and all of a sudden, I
was like, where where are these shirts from? Like I didn't buy this dress shirt?
Was there ever a moment in between that where you were like, I know what your salary is, Yeah, how are you affording this shirt on an assistant salary?
Yeah? No, I mean like the other instances, like, you know, I'd be away shooting a movie or something, and I had my Austin Martin and the you know, my brand new dB nin and Austin Martin in the in the garage and I came home, yeah, like maybe two months later or something. And then I looked in the garage and there was a dent in the front of the garage, and there was only one car that would fit that description, and it was the US Tomorrow that was Parker.
Crossed from that dead no Man.
And I found out they never told me that they move the US Tomorrow or they was taken out or whatever the hell they drove your car away into the no but that they were driving your car. I mean, look, I I'm gonna I'm gonna not rehash that memory and try to be shared like homes over here and try to find out if they actually went on joy rides.
I'm gonna assume not. Maybe they were moving the car by accident they hit it against the thing, but it was like a major dan to in the garage from and didn't say anything, and then nobody said anything about it. They're like, oh, nothing happened to the cars, So I think we're good, you know. So it's like stuff like that.
You're like, come on, man, But then you have people like like Todaw, who I see you still in your enterve my life forever and as far as I've known you, Todaw has always been there.
Yes, Todaw, just to describe Todaw for everybody who's listening or watching, Todao is a beautiful uh samoan of culture man who has been my brother us. He has stood by my side. It was my protector, you know. He was my security for you twenty plus years. He has his own product, he has his own security company now where he deployed.
You know.
So he's doing really really good, and I'm incredibly proud of him. He's got a beautiful family with Nicole and baby. But but yeah, but Todaw was one of those guys who tolerated very zero I mean like zero shenanigans around my life. You know, if you were out here for reasons that were not like minded, you were you were not allowed to be around. And he really protected me in so many ways. So in that aspect, you know, we we were on the road all the time. You know,
you talk about ego zero go. If something had to be done, he would just be the first one to show up. He never I never had to ask him for a favor because he was already seeing it before it happened, you know, and.
So not taking advantage of your kindness. No, he always a sense of respect.
He was the way.
He showed up for absolutely everything, all of it.
But you know what I'm saying, like like because he could, Like you know, sometimes you hire people and they get really comfortable because they know you're cool, and then the respect you.
Don't know, I like, I don't know how to ask for help. I'll just be very open here. I don't know how to ask for help, right and and therefore having real foresight is something I reward in our company because I sometimes would just do it myself right, Like it's it's it's a tough thing. I mean, it's just
always you know, I'd rather show up for people. I never asked anyone to show up for me, and I've had to learn over the years to kind of really lean on the people that I know soulfully really want to be there, you know, and that he brings them
joy to show up for me. Yeah, you know, like silly things like uh you know, like a like a birthday party for Nicano like these are you know, my friends are the heads of the departments WV Entertainment, and and they're showing up and blowing up balloons and like you know, talking to the princess to go through the back to surprise or or bring in the cake, and it's like it's like a real friendship, you know, where.
They could have been like, that's not my job.
Yeah exactly. Yeah, so I don't do that, you know, but as soon as they're gonna be and it's because I also don't. I don't go around to celebrate myself often or you know that, it just doesn't happen. But as soon as they forced me to do it, and I love it, you know what I mean, then I'm like, I'm all about it, right, But they just they really support me, and uh so, you know, so it's a pleasure to show up for for them. You know, what
about you? Do you do you have a pressure? Like do you do you know how to ask for help? Do you know how to make that phone call?
And that's a really good question. I think that because of how we grew up, it's tough.
As do it yourself.
Yeah, man, yeah, I'm a very much do it myself, wear all five hats type of personal and and sometimes that's tough because there are I have a wonderful team behind me that I should be delegating them more of that too, that I often find myself fighting the urge to.
To do it.
Not not to say that I want to do anybody's job by by no means, but it's just it's like what you said at the beginning of this conversation, right like you're at point A.
You already see z.
And I and I want and I want to put it in fifth gear to go to z uh. And people have their own pace, people have their own strategies as to how they reach z uh and and sometimes I have to just sort of sit back and allow people their process to help me reach c you know. But I have a wonderful team behind me. As a matter of fact, I think you and I share uh. Woman and I have both been at this agency called UTA United Talent Agency for god knows.
How long, a long long time.
We've been lifers.
Lifers.
Man.
I go there and I'm like, I'm like office furniture here. I've been heres.
And we also share some of the same agents too.
That's right. Shout out to Nancy Gate.
Nancy Gate. She's another one of my guardian angels, you know. And she's protected protected me and and guided me and advised me. And she's been my big sister for a long time.
She's she's something a lot of love for a lot of respect for Nancy. She kicks.
But but so it's hard to ask for help, right, And therefore, when you put together a team, you have to have individuals whose humility is is part of the virtual how they run their life, you know, having a sense of foresight and in creating a past. Think that assists is the common goal?
Right?
Like that? That that feels like it feels like a lot of virtuals, you know.
You ever you ever had to let somebody go as part of your team because they didn't possess the same qualities that you see in yourself as a CEO or that you felt And here's the let me preface it before you ask it. Sometimes I feel like someone's revenue. Right, they're out on the town, and they're a representation of you, right, and so they're if they're what's the correct terminology here?
I don't want to say value system because I don't want to sound like a for sure, you know, but like I mean, I would say, if they don't emulate what you represent as a person, do you ever find that to be a problem?
Do you ever?
Do you ever? Well?
Look, here's the thing, Uh, when you ever had a company. For this loan, we're going in almost two decades of a company, right. You know, individuals are going to grow and some some are going to find different paths and some are going to find different passions, you know, and that really always happens, you know, it's you some some people also say I want to trust something different, you know.
So for those moments, you're kind of like, you know absolutely and you always kind of know, you know, when someone's either in it or not, you know, and for those moments, you have to just create a space for that to to you know, to be voiced and and you know, and then there's also other times where you have to kind of find a way to to say okay, like these are tough goals, you know, but it's just it's a business, right and everyone has to you know, kind of show up and do their best, you know,
And and it's it's a very tough cut through environment. And you know, funding for companies also are very hard to find too, you know. So there's all the factors that come into that. But the truth is, you know, when I look at you know, the you know, the individuals and the amazing people that have come through our company. You know, through all the last twenty years, whether they're executives or assistants, you know, they always go off to do amazing stuff, you know, and and and there's always
a way for them to full circle come around. You know, We've had multiple executives or assistants that come full circle and they're now a producer, they're now a director, or they're now whatever, and they're like, hey, I have an idea. We're like, bring it in, you know. So we've always had an open door policy too, you know, for those
to return and continue to cultivate the relationship. But you know, we've been pretty fortunate that, you know, so you can see, know, rarely nobody, nobody leaves nobody, you know.
It's like, yeah, yeah, I always tell people like, you know, you know, assistants at agencies or management companies or wherever. They're like like, they're not there to be like an assistant their whole life, man, right, you know, They're there to like eventually become an executive themselves and the total So treat them right, right, Yeah, Now, this has been a really interesting conversation, and I think that it applies
to everyone. Right. It doesn't matter if you're in our industry or whatever industry you're in, your support system is incredibly important. Whether it's the people who work with you, whether it's your parents, your siblings, your friends. Your support system sometimes dictates the direction and your career and in your life. And sometimes people persevere past them not having that. But the majority of the time, it's always good to have a good inner circle.
I mean when you say I do, and to double down on that, I think is even more critical to remember, Like what we always say here on the show, it's supposed to be fun. You know, you want to create an environment where people feel respected, and then you only talk to people with the same respect they give you. You know, I always think it's important that, you know, to preserve the harmony, you have to remember what you love and respect about that person before you even use words.
That goes a long way, right, because that kind of respect turns into an effortless confidence that makes everyone better around a safety that makes them, you know, thrive and sword with, you know, with the tools they need to continue to grow. Right, So absolutely I would say that, and and I would also say that, you know, if you're going to hire your friends and you all want
to come up together, you know. I don't know. There was some director that said something about, like, you know, networking was not like the worst advice he was giving was a network.
Oh yeah, the guy from Moonlighting. Yeah yeah, name Barry Jingers.
Yeah, yeah, you know I had I had thoughts about that. Yeah, I had thoughts about that. You know, I had thoughts about that because in order for you to you know, find greatness, you have to be exposed to enough individuals that had done it before. You know, you have to understand this is a very complicated industry and at one size doesn't fit off of this kind of stuff, you know. So I would say that networking with the like minded is what makes you better.
You know.
Surrounding yourself with individuals that you know that are in search of the same thing, you know, also makes you better and makes that shot even more realistic. So to me, I mean, like, look at this. You and I probably met in one of these network convenience right. We were at in a word show. We're on something. We're like, hey man, hey man, you're doing it. Yeah, I'm doing it too, cool, high five. We should be doing this together.
You know. That's kind of how it happens in our industry, you know, but I you know, I would also say that you know that the biggest the biggest factor here is leadward kindness create a space for people to grow. Yeah, because it benefits the big picture. Right, that's kind of what you want, you know you want. But what about what about you, Aaron?
What do you think when it comes to building a team and networking? And yeah, I think like I read this book years ago called the Five Dysfunctions of a Team, and I can tell them real quick, and it's by this author, Patrick NINCIONI you talked about when building a team, we often neglect these aspects and they are like five
glaring aspects of a dysfunctional team. And so one is the absence of trust, Two is the fear of conflict, Three is a lack of commitment, four is the avoidance of accountability, and then five is the inattention to results well. And so when I was a part of The Daily Show a few years back, we got this book to read and power through it through it and I asked myself, like, what was the one that I was afraid of the most of those dysfunctions, And it really was the fear of conflict.
You know.
And so we were talking about being direct, and you know, I'm a you know, EmPATH, radical impath. I want everybody to be happy. I want to cooon. My dad calls me mister Kumbaya, and so that's my biggest thing. I want everyone to be cool. And sometimes it is in conflict that we find the results. And sometimes conflict is a misnomer. People think, oh, you know, forget you and forget you. Then it doesn't have to be with like that, right,
there can just be these moments of true directness. And then, Wilmar, I love what you said, just moving forward. We don't have to sit in it. We can just move forward and learn from it. We can learn from it. And then because we're all results driven, right, and so for really about the end result, we can get over ourselves, get over our egos, and then move forward and find the best solution for the project at head. So yeah, I think that that's my biggest thing, just holding onto
those five dysfunctions. And whenever I'm entering the situation or collaborating with others like I might myself direct and produce and write as well, I'm always looking out for that, not only within the group, but within myself, right, And so whenever I'm encountering a challenge like, Okay, what am I exercising right here? Is it a fear of conflict? Is it a lack of commitment? Is it an attentiveness
to the result? And usually from within those five dysfunctions, I have an opportunity to nip the problem in the bud and get back to what we're all here to do, which is to make it happen.
That was you said that they gave you that book. Was that part of their leadership style at that show to give that book to all of their employees so that there's a cohesiveness in terms of how you all are thinking at the show.
Yeah, so it was very interesting.
While at that job, it was also a collaboration with Paramount Audio, and so their audio division assigned that reading task to us because they were, you know, trying to get better. You know that they had a very corporate side of seeing things, but they were trying to also
think outside the box. And so in the daily shows kind of like running Gun, you know, we're doing this, we're doing that, And so it was a good opportunity to reflect and evaluate and it was all in the hopes of yeah, just fine tuning some issues and some challenges that we observed, and it stuck with me the entire time. So when we were talking about Team today, I was like, oh, this is a great book that I read that kind of helped me get out of
my own sort of. I don't know if it was malaise or just like the worst part you can be in our lives are in this industry or this job is figuring. It's thinking that you have it all figured out all you constantly want to evolve and get better and fine tune things. And so that really helped me get on a page where I was like, Okay, I'm always going to be looking at these things. So whenever we have a problem fit flair up, I can be like, oh,
we're not thinking about the end result in mind. Oh so and SO doesn't want to be direct with so and so because they're scared about how they may come off.
Yeah.
The fear, right, fear is such a it's such a person absolute fear of moving forward, feared of voicing your thoughts. I mean, it's it's but also like when you fear your job or losing your job or the.
Or your boss or your fear.
Yeah, yeah, I mean not even like fearing an individual. I mean I'm talking about fearing the the energy.
Of your job.
Feeling like there's an expiration date to your job somehow creates this mirage of pressure that somehow it's gonna go away, it's gonna go away, it's gonna go away. And therefore you're only focusing about preservation as opposed to progression. And then therefore, guess what happens. You know, somebody is gonna take a note that all you're doing is trying not to lose your job. And when that comes across and you lose the creativity or the innovation of driving with vision,
guess what happens? Like you're no longer, You're no longer a team member, right, You're not onlyer, you're no longer a leader because you're just only trying to preserve your job the detriment of the team's efforts. Right. So it's so a lot of that stuff is plays a major factor. And but yeah, I mean that's that's thank you for
sharing all those things. We have a lot of stuff to reflect on that, and you know, I hope everyone you know walks away with some little you know, notions, a little yeah, yeah, A couple of little diamonds of of thoughts here putting a team. It's not simple, but I guess that the most the most primitive essence, find individuals that are doing it like you're doing it, or they share the same and values of how to get there, and if they don't, you know, learn from those who
may have other ways, you know. I think that's that's the idea. And uh and leadership, I think. But but Freddie, thank you so much for those thoughts. Really cool, bro, Thank you. Wimer, same to you, man. Yes, this is dos Amigos and uh, tell a friend.
Tell a Friend.
Dos Amigos is a production from WV Sound and iHeartMedia's Michael through That podcast Network, hosted by Me, Freddie Rodriguez, and Wilmer Valdorama.
Dose Amigos is produced by Aaron Burlson and Sophie Spencer Zabos.
Our executive producers are Wilmer of Aaldorama, Freddie Rodriguez, Aaron Burlson, and Leo Clem at WV Sound.
This episode was shot and edited it by Ryan Posts and mixed by Sean Tracy and features original music by Madison Devenport and Halo Boy.
Our cover art photography is by David Avalos and design by Deny Holtzclaw.
And thank you for being in her third Amigo today. I appreciate you guys always listening to those amos.
For more podcasts from my Heart, visit to your heart radio app, Apple podcast, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.
See you next week.