Ladies and gentlemen. Welcome to those amigos.
Yes, and I hearted Myuda destination for voice and ideas.
That's right, Freddie, how are you?
I'm good with how are you good?
This is Freddie Rodriguez, my my best friends and and uh, you know, partner crime here on this those Amigos adventure. We're a lot of episodes in and we want to acknowledge every single one of you who have been watching the show and also listening to our show.
We love you. Guys. Tell a friend that we're here for them as well. And uh, and what are we drinking today?
Let's see a little coffeecito. What's the name of this place? You said you wanted to.
Get Loddres is a local business. We're going to support a local business. Get our friends over there. And I've completely elevated the coffee cafe game here on the you know, here in the valley. So big shout out to them. They roast their own beans and everything. Okay, very strong being.
I mean right right right now.
I've had I remember when we first started this, I remember you talking them up.
Yeah, they're great, they're great.
So a big shout out to us and everybody you guys, and they keep spreading.
They have like a few more opening up, so congregulations. Anyhow, I've been so.
I've been so grateful, you know, through our conversations and you know, we we had a great and then when they asked us, like why did you want to do a podcast? You know, it's a quick reminder that like, you know, for me that you know how much kind of we needed this come. We needed to just talk it out and bring us all together and bring all of our people together in the community to kind of just chat and and be and at a time where it's important to kind of say who we are allowed.
I think this is you know, this is kind of uh was one of the small missions. But but yeah, but behind all of us, there's an amazing team, right and I want to acknowledge our team here and those those amigos.
Yes, we have an incredible team out here.
Leo Klem said, Leo Clem to not say anyone's name for his and I thought it was disrespectful because there's it's like so many more people that make this possible.
Uh. So we going to introduce our amigo.
You know, you you guys know him by now, guess who has returned to the desk of the baron Aaron not.
To be confused with Aaron Sanchez. Yeah right, is that.
How Yeah Burlison, Yeah, burliston, Yes, Aaron Burlson back again. What's going on, Fellas, what's going on?
What's been new with you? Really? Blessed? Really blessed. Indeed, that's a great that's a great update. Thank you. Moving on?
Uh yeah, just you know, excited to get him to this conversation about teams. And you know, I was watching the Oscars on Sunday and everyone gets up there, they accept award, they like to thank their teams, you know, big shout out to my team big, you know this person,
that person. So just wanted to get the conversation started with asking you both, like, what's the importance of building a solid team and having that support behind you because we all know we can't do it by ourselves, And so wanted to ask you about the importance of a team and then what roles and factors go in building the best team?
Rights A great question?
Yeah, I mean Freddie, will you say that it starts out as this kind of solo mission to try to prove to as many be busy can that you can in fact do this, and you have to make believers out of individuals that are going to help you just to continue to carve away at the possibility, you know, because it seems like you're kind of like solo and just tell and everyone, Hey, put me in the game,
you know, right. But then you know, then at some point you need you need to have the support of an infrastructure that's going to support your possible outcome.
Now you do, I've had you know, It's funny.
I just had this conversation with someone the other day from my hometown in Chicago who does not understand the entertainment industry or how it works. Right, And here's the analogy I gave them. I go, what if you were starting a restaurant, right, you'd be the restaurant owner, correct, And they're like, yeah, I go. And then you would hire a manager to manage the restaurant, right, They're like yeah, I said.
And then that.
Manager's job would be to make sure that your restaurant is successful by hiring the right bus boys, the waiters, making sure the plates are good, making sure the menu is good. Right, It's all in collaboration with you as the owner. But it's their job to make sure that everything is running smoothly and in turn to be a profitable business.
Right.
And what I was explaining to my friend is like.
It's very similar, right, Like Wilmer Valderama is the restaurant, right, and you sure have a manager, and you have an agent, and you have a lawyer, and their number one goal is to make sure that Wilmer the restaurant, the entity is successful. Right, And they all work together to make sure that that entity is successful.
Would be? Would that be a pretty accurate? Accurate because you you do have to.
Think of yourself and I say this only metaphorically. You got to think of yourself as a product. Yeah, a product that's to be shared with audiences. And what is this product's claim, right, and how do you, in a weird, odd silly way, how do you sell this product to the masses? And who does the selling right and who puts you in the game to prove that this product in fact could be something you can welcome to their homes and their living rooms every evening before Aftener right, So so so.
That so that's that's part of it.
But but Aaron, your question of like, you know, how do you put together a team or like, you know, what is it?
What does it take to put a team together? Like this is is is.
Very interesting because you know, at the beginning, it starts with the audacity of thinking I can do this. Then you have to find individuals that support that delusion of feeling like you can, you know, and you have to find you have to find people that believe it as hard as you.
You know, end up believing you right.
Because one thing is having an agent that's just sending you on auditions, and there's and there's another having an agent that before they send you an audition, they get on the phone with a cast in director or a director, a producer or a studio and it says, you have to trust me right, putting my reputation on the line.
This is the person you're looking for.
Like there is there is like representation, and there is like you know, a real disruptive belief you know that with he's going to have to work and it's that hustle, right, Like you got to kind of find the hustler and the representation. But you know, but how you get there and all that is that's that's a journey, it.
Is, right. You ever watch Shark Tank.
Yeah you ever you ever seen, for.
Example, like the guy who invented the ring camera, right, you ever seen him on that show or other products that have went on to become successful. It's funny because you watch that and then you watch the people sitting on the couch on Shark Tank, and you're like, how.
Could you not see that?
This is a billion dollar idea?
Right?
And I almost feel like your your team are the people who are up on that stage saying you have to buy Ring. You don't see it right now, but you have to buy Ring. And the flip side to that is that you're constantly facing people like those sharks on the couch who are like.
H I don't see it, right, I don't see it? How could you not see ring? How could you not see the potential in the product?
Like that?
And it's their job to convince the people that they're missing out on a billion dollar idea, right.
Yeah? You know.
I think about the beginning of my career. I had a teacher. Her name was Celes Boyd. I think I talked to her. I talked about her earlier in the It was this was just in high school. I was in high school and I was taking her private class. That's her side Wednesday nice to her house, and you know, she was blessed her heart. She was such an angel. She was such a guardian angel to so many of
her students. You know, every couple of weeks she would bring her friends who were agents, were just looking for new talent, right, these young, cool small agents, yeah, to her class and showcase, you know, and two things would happen. You get real feedback from agents about like you know what you need to cultivate.
In, know to get higher outside.
You know, like what you need to work on right now, so then when you're out there, you get.
A better shot. Right. So, like they give you this feedback.
And she saw me do a scene with my sister and she was like, you're ready. And she introduced me to this agent, and this agent say, hey, I'm not gonna I'm not going to represent you yet, but I'm going to send you in a couple of additions and see what kind of feedback we get. And they send me, I think, on like a couple of commercial auditions. You know, I don't even know they are, and I will get all this feedback, right, They're like, wow, he's so good.
He's so funny.
But you know, but he has an accent, and if you're on television, you don't have accents. You speak perfect English somehow, you know, so he will get this feedback. But he was like, you know something about you da da da keep sending you out, So he didn't really represent me, but he was kind of just trying to take me out and see what kind of feedback I got. I will say that that made me go, how do I work so hard at these at the feedback? Like, how do I get so much amazing feedback that I
can just get him to sign me. Yeah, So my hustle was like I want to work as hard as possible to get him the best amount of feedback so he can hire me.
Because I wasn't booking the jobs. Like I couldn't book.
The jobs right, Like people were like, yeah, it's got an accent, because right, but you know, two and a half years, three and a half years of like auditioning and stuff, you know, he sends me on this pilot and then you know, so he believed enough to put me in this really high profile pilot, which was that seventies show.
What were you doing though?
Because you were saying I wanted to hustle so hard. I would be so good that I'd be undeniable in his eyes to continue to send me. So what were you doing that you were hustling so hard to show him?
Yeah, So if they would tell him, if the feedback was like, hey, he's so funny, then I would be I wanted to be triple the funny the next time.
Ah ah right yeah.
Or if they were like, oh he was adorable, then I try to be quadrup or adorable.
It's like, you know a little and you know it's my glean.
Yeah, So like I would just work on like leefing that up, and uh, you know, may or may not have worked, you know, but I definitely eventually he decided to read because I was getting so close.
But feedback is so important, right because like they know, you're not always going to book the gig.
But as long as.
When they're out there getting feedback that people are not saying, man, that dude sucked or he's super unprepared, I think that that's more detrimental as opposed to not booking the gig because they know they know it's a it's a numbers game.
Yeah, what about you what was that representation finding that first agent?
You know, I feel that throughout my career, I've always had these like guardian angels. I've always had people who were mentors who saw something in me and very much at times that I didn't see things in me. When I was in the seventh grade, I had a teacher named mister Levine who we did a I think I mentioned this in the other episode. We did a talent show and he randomly chose me to do a scene from a TV show and a talent show. I don't know why he chose me, but he saw something in
me that I didn't see. When I was in the eighth grade, I got into my first theater company and there was a tea. There was one of the drama teachers. Her name was Carol Gutierrez, and she saw something in me that I didn't see. And it was because of her that I starred in the play in the theater company when I was thirteen fourteen. It was because of her that I got a two year scholarship to the
National College of Education. It was because of her that she encouraged me to audition for the drama program at my high school. There was another mentor named Ray Moffat, who hired me in this independent theater company called Muan when I was like fifteen. Jeff Garland's ex wife, Marla, who signed me as my first agent when I was like fifteen sixteen at Suzannees a Plus in Chicago, and then coming to La, you know, my first manager, my first agent here. You know, there was always people who
saw something in me. And it's funny because you were saying you were fighting against your action. I was fighting against my accent too. I mean till this day. People were like, nah, he sounds too urban, he sounds too Chicago. I quick, quick side. But I had an audition one time for a role. It was supposed to be a Latino, a priest out of Chicago, and so I went in there. I didn't lose my accent. I just sort of sounded like me. And the feedback was he just sounds too urban.
I'm like, wait a minute, isn't the character Latino. They're like, yeah, I go, isn't he from Chicago?
Yeah?
I go, I'm Latino and I'm from Chicago. So I sounded like myself, So how can I sound too urban?
Yeah?
Yeah?
Anyway, I mean if I had a dime.
It sounds too Latino, right, Yeah, yeah, sounds too like I do.
Okay, But yeah, I constantly had mentors along the way that that continued to believe in me and see something in me and was willing to put their reputation on the line for me.
You know.
Oh quick, shout out, I have to give as we're on the subject Mary Renew.
Oh, Mary who.
Is a director. So I've said this before.
One of my first movies was Dead Presidents, and I was an unknown out of Chicago. I was in La shooting one movie and I auditioned for it and they wanted everybody who was super popular at the time.
The studio did.
And she went to bat for me, and she wrote a personal letter and she said, this is the guy you need to hire. Trust me when I tell you this.
WHOA.
And it was.
Because I'm not surprised going to bat for me that not only did I get that movie, She's cast me in like five other movies. I can't hardly wait because of her. I did this other movie called Inconvenience, I did Harsh Times, Grindhouse.
Those are all Mary Vernew movies.
I mean, Mary is and yes, major shutout to Mary has been very vernew she's Betty May casting and you know, but many many actors can can look at her as that guardian name.
Yeah, somebody who really put them on. She's a champion.
She actually is someone that I respect so much. I've she's mentored me so much about you know, what they look for when they're casting and you know what, talk about a casting director and team. By the way, because the girls on the office are also Yeah, I mean, I'm unbelievable. They they will not let you leave until you have your best work on that tape.
Yeah, dude, that's so rare. Yeah, that's so rare.
And I mean I've I've experienced so many casting directors in my career at the beginning of my career to say where they're just like you know, cattle, like they no emotional investment in trying to find the person because you're at the casting call. You're not even at the producer's called the director's call. So in the casting call or just like filtering actors, you know.
What's your worst what's your worst audition experience?
Oh god, I mean, there's nothing worse than somebody, you know, staring into a laptop while you're here for you or like there's nothing there, you know, there's nothing worse than like, you know, you're in the middle of an addition. Somebody walks in with a message for the director or for the casting director and what and they're just like pretend and then just expect you just keep going with the scene,
whether it just like whispering something. There are excuses that they're filming it anyways, but they don't understand, like the disturbance of there's so many elements you're fighting against when
you're in that room. Yeah, nerves, all of the nerves, right, nerves, preparation, right, you're making sure you don't forget what you have just read landlessly memorized, you know, and listening, you're trying to listen without listening to what's not happening or what's happening on the side of the addition, right, Like you're reading with this person. But there's like rumbling here, there's like whispering here. There's like writing notes sending back and forth.
You're like, you know, like you wonder what are they writing on that or what you know, it's like did they laugh did not laugh at the right part. There's just so much stuff and you just try and you're trying to do such a good job. So I think those are probably the worst additions. You come in there and they're just like they're just filtering through or they know you're not it as soon as you walk in and they just let you go through with it.
You're like, you know, it's like and you can feel it.
You're like, you're like, this is not going well.
Totally, totally. So that's why Mary. Mary is so different.
You know that team is going to spend time with you, and if they brought you in, it's because they you know, they want you to get that part.
Yeah.
The only one of the only movies I produced, I hired her.
She I produced a movie called Nothing Like the Holidays and Mary key sure, and.
I dream of the day of being able to go to marry me, like, would you please help me cast something? Because she's just a master. She just has an eye for people that know how to entertain.
You know.
So for Mary, I'm assuming it was so important to put together the right casting assistant team right that can really bring the best out of these actors and and you know, and therefore the directors get the best you know.
View at who's writing. Who's wrong?
Somebody might be right for it, but they just weren't set up for success in that room.
And they're like that. You know. It's stuff, you know.
But they also tell you you need to be you know, you need to rely only on yourself when you go into that room. Yeah, you know, if the reader is horrible, which, by the way, the readers is so bad. You know, by the way, just for the people at home, a reader is somebody who is at the opposite side of the camera just literally reciting the lines of the other characters in the script while you're auditioning for your character.
So they're the ones that are just like going through the other lines just so you can say your lines. You know, I got to tell this bad audition story, if I may please.
So this was like the mid.
Nineties, mid the late nineties, and this was around a time that I felt that every time you saw latinos on screen, they were sort of encompassing the stereotype, right, And stereotype is a whole other conversation that we could
have and how I feel about it. But I had a couple of pretty prestigious movies out and I was doing pretty well and there was a big movie that was being cast, and the role was a very stereotypical Latino gangster role, and every I'm sure you went up, every single Latino actor went up on it, right, And I was like, nah, I'm not doing it. I'm not
auditioning for it, right. I was taking a stance. However, the casting director was a big casting director, Okay, and it has been around since like the sixties, and cast al Pacino and cast Dustin Hoffman and blah blah blah blah blah.
Right, and so they were like, are you sure, man, are you crazy?
You better go in there and audition. I go, I'm not auditioning for I said, but I do want to meet her. I don't have a general meeting with her. I'm still new in town. And so my agents were like, okay, we'll set up a general meeting.
Right.
So I go into the audition and like I said, every actor that you know was in that audition.
They were all in the waiting room. They all looked the same.
They all had the same like freaking like like plaid shirt on with the baggy pants.
And here I come in and I'm dressed regular. Right, everybody there.
Is going over their lines, and they're their focus, and they're in character, and they have their sides in their hand, and there I have no sides, and I'm just kind of like chilling there, smiling, you know. And so speaking of the casting assistant, I see the casting assistant come out and he kind of, you know, crosses someone's name out. He calls an actor in there, and he kind of looks at me.
Right.
He goes in and brings the actor in, comes back out, crosses another name, gets another actor, and then looks at me again. Right, Every single time he comes out, he has the look of concern in his face increases. So finally he comes to me and he goes, all right, Freddie, it's your turn, right, And I'm walking into this audition, and at a certain point I can see the wheels just turning in his head. And he finally turns around and he goes, hey, are you you are right? Do you any sides?
You know?
And I'm like, sides, No, I'm just here for a general meeting. And his face dropped. He was like a general meeting, and I was like yeah. He goes, wait right here, So he goes in to this casting door. He slams the door. I could hear him talking and I can hear her erupt on the other side.
What And I'm like, oh, damn, this is not going to be good.
Right.
Finally, why was she yelling at She didn't know about the Yeah, I guess the agents didn't tell her that it was a general meeting. They probably just told the assistant assistant did a communicator and they just probably in yeah, oh gosh.
So then they opened the door and you could see it in his eyes that he just I reamed.
Out and he's like come in. He's so pissed off, right.
And she's like sit down, and I sit down, and I'm like hi, and she's like, so here, you're not going to audition for this why? And I was very honest in my response, and I just said, look.
I'm here.
I have a couple of movies out in the theater right now. I think I'm going on a very different trajectory. And I told her honestly about how I felt about how Latinos were being.
Portrayed in the film. And I stood my ground. She heard me, she heard me, and then she was like all right, and then she just sort of dismissed me.
Right, So that was like that was it was? It? Was it a short meeting? Was it a long meeting? It was talking about Chicago Little No, absolutely not.
She just wanted to hear what I had to say, right, And she sent me on my way and I left and I was like, I'm never going to hear from her again. Cut to a couple of years later. I get an audition for a movie called Payback and it was Hegeln was directing it. He had just he had just written Mystic River. I think I think he just won the Oscar for Mystic River. And this was his
first movie. It was a big Warner Brothers movie. Mel Gibson was attached, Chris Christofferson, Lucy Lou It was a huge cast, right, And I look on the sheet and I was like, Yo, she's bringing me back in after that encounter that I had. And she brought me back in.
Was she in the room when you were worked in?
I walked in and it was the complete opposite. It was one of the most pleasant experiences I've ever had. She sat me down and she was so nice to me, and she wanted to know everything about me. And she went on to tell me that she cast al Pacino in this movie and Dustin Hoffman in that movie, because I told her that those are my influences. And we went on and we auditioned, and I got the part.
Wow, that's I mean, what a what a one eighty like? That's that's intense. And do you think you think in whatever however many years? How many years did think happened in between?
Maybe like like two maybe I mean, yeah, this.
Is what I think happened. You forgot no, but this is what I think happened.
Yeah.
I think that in the time that you had left her office, you made such an impression of somebody that then knew who he was that she had to.
Do a little homework.
Okay, right, if you're a great casting director, which she is, right, she's going to be intrigued enough to say, somebody who has a direct response to what they're not is someone I need to know.
So I think she's been kind of tracking. She did homework.
She saw a couple of your movies, you know, you had a couple of things out of the time, and she's like, who the fuck is this guy?
I have the audacity?
Who is this dude?
And I think that she's been waiting this whole time for something that was right for you. And you know, to our luck, there's not a lot of stuff that we were right for in that era, right, Like there's just not a lot.
But I think that's what happened.
I think she kind of like went back and then at this point you're coming back but like major shows, and you're like, I having my movie right, And that's what happened, you know, you know, I I uh, before we move on to you know, how you put teams together and as a producer you have to no, no, but I want.
To kind of fig it back what you're saying. There's so many.
Instances where, you know, where you kind of have to put yourself to the town or and over again. And when I had finished a seventy show, or actually two and a half years before I finished seventy show, I had to go around town and beg my agents had to beg for me to have these general meetings and every WHI What a general meeting is is you you know, you're meeting an actor for the first time, just so
for awareness that this person exists. So if there ever was a role or something that you were rite for, you were top of mind or you were in a shortlist and you connected with individuals, so they see that not only you were serious, but you were somebody to
be trusted. And and so for two and a half years being on the show, like they had to say, hey, you know, Wilmer is more than just Fez, right, And that was the struggle to be able to like go to all and you know, I this is like coming full circle.
We talk about teams and.
Yeah, you know, I think how many how many years into the show was this.
That they I think six years.
Oh, I was two and a half years before it was done, before the show was.
And you felt that you were going in and they were.
Yeah, I mean they were just like there were surprise right, Like but you know, this is big shout out to Shaney Rusens.
Why I go over at UTA.
She she's been my agent since I was like nineteen years old, right, and she fought with the talent for them to see me, ask who I was and for what I could be as opposed to like what they could see.
Yeah, especially when you well especially when you create such an iconic character like that, right, those are the pros and cons. The pros of creating an iconic character is you created an iconic character. Yeah, the con is is that people will only see you as that.
Right, right, And so I you know, so she was just setting me up with the head of casting of every studio, the head of casting a production company, the head of casting of every network, you know, producers, writers, runners, like I was meeting whoever wanted to have me, and when I will walk in, I looked very different.
I sound very different, you know. So people were.
Like, whoa, right, I had no idea that you didn't sound like that I or didn't do your hair like that.
You know.
Yeah, so that's kind of a very funny thing that you know, we kind of have to educate anyone just so I can have a shot at auditioning for the stuff that I wanted to do, right, you know, just for the audition so they can bring me in because it was hard for them to imagine if I could do someone else.
And I think also because you created that, that was the first thing out the gate, right, So it wasn't like it wasn't like you had other stuff to point too. And then you created that character, and then people you know, like Forrest Gump or something, right like, you know, like, oh, it was Tom Hanks doing Forrest Gump.
It was like, who is this guy? I should he's funny because.
In the world's hands wearing bell bottoms. That's how I said hello to people.
And would you say that the punch.
Yeah, the punch trata other area. Yeah, that was that was me.
But you know, you're you're a producer and you know, and and your director before it.
I have yeah, not not on a major level, but yeah, but you're a director.
Yeah, and I you know, I'm very curious about what do you look for in your team? You know when we talk about leadership? Yeah, and then and then follow up that question is you know is how do you know? How do you what do you consider your trades as a as a leader?
Yeah?
And you have to find it over over time. So what do you look for in the team? You know, when you're putting together, who you're going to go to war with?
You know? And anyway, and how do you define yourself as a leader.
Yeah, I'm going to give you two examples before I answer that question. Okay, I've been on some of the most successful TV shows and movies of all time, and I've been in pretty crap TV shows and movies as well. And what I've learned from those both experiences is that it all starts at the top, okay, and the tone that you set on top trickles down to everyone else
below okay. And I saw how that worked. I saw how that formation contributed to the success of a show of a movie, and I saw how it didn't work. And I saw how the person on top did not possess any sort of leadership skills, brought bad habits, came with attitudes that were probably not acceptable everything else under that umbrella, and how them being that way contributed to the show or the movie taking a nose dive.
So you feel all those things other energies were infused into the DNA of the product.
Yes, because no matter who, no matter who is below you, if you're the leader, everyone's looking up to you, right. No matter what integrity those people bring to the table, no matter how high their skill level is, they're.
All looking up to you, right. And if you're a prick, if you're a.
Whatever, if you're coming to work with bad habits, then they're taking a page out of your book. I'm sure there's been other instances where that hasn't been the case. But that's been my experience and so learning that early on. I've learned that if I'm going to be a leader, it's important how I lead, how I conduct myself, what kind of habits I possess, what kind of energy. You know, I'm a strong believer in energy and synergy and vibe an,
integrity and honesty. You know, Like I may sound corny, that may sound nerdy, but I'm a strong believer in that stuff. You know, in an industry where sometimes people don't value those things. Let me tell me something, man, some of the biggest people that I've worked with from a producerial level have all been really honest, very and very straight up and very straightforward, no matter no matter
what the ramifications of that is going to be. And they'd rather be that way and be straight up and and accept whatever comes from that then to be dishonest and to be deceitful and deceptive and to have that blow up in their face and affect their reputation. So I'm a believer in that. Listen, other producers, you know, conduct themselves differently, but I believe in that tactic.
You know.
I I think you're right, and I've seen it. I've seen it in you. I've seen it how you went, you know, when you enter the room, and the energy that you said, you're you know, you're collective, You're you're listen, you're transparent. All those things are important for whoever you work with in your team to feel like they have also the environment to be the same.
Right.
Well, thank you everyone for listening or watching the first half of his leadership conversation, and I hope you guys enjoy part two. This is Los Amigos. I'm Wilmer Valdorama, I'm Freddie Rodriguez. See you on the next one.
Dose Amigos is a production from WV Sound and iHeartMedia's Michael through That podcast Network, hosted by Me, Freddie Rodriguez and Wilmer Valdorama.
Those Amigos is produced by Aaron Burlson and Sophie Spencers Abos.
Our executive producers are Wilmer Valdorama, Freddie Rodriguez, Aaron Burlson and Leo Klem at WV Sound.
This episode was shot and edited it by Ryan Posts and mixed by Sean Tracy and features original music by Madison Devenport and Helo boy.
Our cover our photography is by David Avalos and designed by Deny Holtzclaw and.
Thank you for being their third amigo today. I appreciate you guys always listening to those amios.
For more podcasts from My Heart, visit the I Heart Radio app, Apple podcast, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.
See you next week.