Welcome to denim wrapped nightmares tipsy exchange Podcast where we explore the supernatural series episode by episode.
over drinks, we'll discuss the lore of gore and what we adore about the Winchesters and their adventures.
I'm burly, and I'm a new fan of the series.
I'm LA, and I'm here along for the ride. Now, let's get tipsy.
Hello, la Hello Burly. I have a theory.
Whoa, okay.
I think Ruby is lying about remembering being a human. And she's just using Sam and Dean to kill demons that she wants killed, like a Malleus Maleficarum. I think she's the one who hexed Dean, and then came in and saved the day. So Dean will trust her now. And she's like using them and she used them to go kill that demon. Because she hated it.
Why couldn't she just kill herself.
It was stronger than her. Remember, they got in that fight, and it kicked her ass and almost exercised her and sent her else back to hell, she couldn't kill it by herself.
When she was them. She just take the Colt.
Oh, that would have been smarter. Yeah. She's not smart. That's my theory. Okay, she's a smart ass. But, you know, she's doing all these things to make them trust her and she's going to use them. Okay, we'll see. Anywho last episode was long distance call. And it was not good. Dean receives a phone call from John Winchester from beyond the grave, while he and Sam are investigating a town where other people are receiving phone calls from people who've passed away.
Turns out it's this dude at the phone company, who is supposedly UK ricotta. But he didn't look anything like UK ricotta. And there was a cute hotel room. And at the end, Dean finally admitted that he's scared and he doesn't actually want to die. And so he and Sam agree they're going to work together to try and keep Dean from going to hell, but I gotta say it's not looking too good.
No, it's not. Well, in today's episode, it is called time is on my side. Which doesn't really match up with what you were just saying about Dean. Yeah, I
don't think I don't think I think it's working against him. Certainly wasn't on Bella side.
Yet. Well, yeah, we'll get there. Yeah, we started out in Erie, Pennsylvania. And it's these two guys coming out of it. Was it a gym that they were on?
I think I thought it was like a racket center or something. That is but
they're walking to their cars. It's at night, and this guy pops his trunk throws his gear in. And we see somebody in the bushes kind of lurking about watching him. And then out of nowhere, the guy just jumps up on on like, throws him in his own trunk, locks them in and takes off with the car. And the guy in the truck. You called it I think you right away. You were like, What did you say?
Well, whenever he was walking into the hospital and dripping blood and like holding himself, I was like, oh, it's the urban legend. Where are you like wake up in a bathtub and your kidneys gone?
Yeah, they just shows like his legs walking in from behind and blood dripping everywhere. And this nurse is like, let me see there. Don't be scared. There's nothing I haven't seen.
And then he's like in pain like grimace? There's blood everywhere. And that's totally how this nurse was actually like, Come
on. Let me say he like takes his hands way. And the sounds made it sound like his innards just fell on the floor. Yeah. She she starts screaming unprofessional by the way.
The closed captioning said squelch and thud
Yeah. Not good and hurt. She was very unprofessional not a very good nurse if that was her reaction and that was that so that's just the beginning. And then we're with the boys and they are dousing this demon and holy water. Just kind of interrogating him asking him who who it is that is holding Dean's contract they want to know who what demon it is Who is it? The demons just kind of like toying with them. And he does mention that he is even scared of the demon that has demons contract.
He kind of messes with them a little bit more and then Sam is like, you ready for me to go bro? And deeds like yeah, so Sam starts whipping out his memorized exorcism. Yeah, and exercises that Damon afterwards, Dean comes back from burying the body and he's like these demons right in their hosts hard, random real hard left to die or something like that,
which I appreciate it because we did notice earlier this season that they didn't really seem to be all about upset about just killing people anymore? Yeah, you know, they they haven't been exercising demons as much as they've just been shooting them with the Colts or stabbing them with rabies knife. So I appreciate it that they let us know that maybe these people weren't gonna survive anyway.
There's nothing left of them. Yeah,
written hard, written real hard. What
is it? rode hard and put up with or something? What is it?
Oh God, where do I get that? Okay. Where's that menu?
There's something I don't know. Anyway, then the guys are there. Sam is back to his investigative ways telling Dean about this guy that that showed up at a hospital and was missing his liver. But the weird thing was was that he was covered in bloody fingerprints. And the fingerprints are from a guy that died a long time ago. I can't remember exactly what. And they go to the morgue and personating cops, of course. What is it? The Dean says to him,
he asked if there were teeth marks around the room, right?
The guy at the Borg coroner whoever he is, asks to see their badges and he's what does he say? He's like, Oh, you're cops and moron and morons? Yeah. And so he pulls out the body to show them and says that the liver was actually surgically removed and a Scott like this perfect slice on his abdomen. Because Oh, yeah, the guy died. Yeah. They go my laughing
man who cares? I did like the sassy coroner. I did do Yeah, that was that was fun. Yeah,
they decided to go and try and find some victims who survived something similar. And there's just lo and behold, there's a guy at the same hospital. He's also sassy. He's like, I already told the cops yesterday. All this I don't really want to go over it again. But sweet. Sounds like it's just a couple of questions guy.
I liked that. His name was they called him Mr. Giggles later on. And I don't know if that was his name, or if they just said that because of how the guy acted. But sure, it's how it was similar to what happened to the guy in the beginning that he got thrown into his own car. Okay, I just kept going, oh, like, why can't I remember? Oh, yeah, cuz my fucking kidney got cut out and taken from me. Like, he just kept reminding them. I just went through a fucking trauma, and you're making me relive it,
like, go away. Right? He
was like, you know, it's the worst pain. He was like, I woke up on a table. And the worst pain imaginable. So this guy is not knocking them out or anything. He's just going for it. And he says, Then he passed out again, and woke up in a bathtub full of ice like the urban legend. So they they leave this poor guy alone. Finally, and after some more reading, Sam says that the incisions that were sewn into some of the bodies were done with silk, which was a practice done in the
1900s. And they also will these incisions would get really infected and so then they would use the maggots to clean out the infection because maggots will eat the dead tissue, but leave the good clean tissue.
I can't remember what music video I showed my niece recently. But I showed her something. And she was like, Is that what it was like back in the 1900s? And I just realized, oh my god like to her. You and I were born in the 1900s. You and I grew up in the 1900s to Ernie. Is it is it funny how I?
I never thought about it like that. But yeah. It was real confused at what you were saying and
what I wanted to tell her no, but then I was like, Oh my God. Yeah, it was it was back in the 19 teens.
Were not this far back. No, not
this far back. If we if we had gotten surgery when we were younger, they wouldn't have stitched us up with silk and maggot.
No, no, no, definitely not. We do learn that they are who they think it is as dark been. And he was this doctor that was obsessed with Alchemy and trying to find a way to stay alive and be immortal. And they think doesn't Sam have his little book? John's journal? That's right. So there's entries about what he did. And supposedly I guess, back in the day, John pulled out this guy's heart, but somehow he's back again. Because
he's immortal. He likes to do his surgeries in wooded areas sometimes where a river or a lake is so he can dump all his shit there. Literally, yes, that and the
bile and the fluid Yeah.
So then we see a jogger, this guy jogging at night. Pretty good luck. And by the way, dog comes up on him snatches them, and we see him on the table strapped down. And he looks good. without a shirt on. Yeah. It's a shame what happens to him though, right? And Doc Ben is looking rough. He his face is like just lined with stitches. He looks like it looks like a baseball. Like stitched up like that. That's how his face looks. One of his eyes is cloudy. He's rolled frail. King,
he's, he needs some help. All this stuff he'd work he's doing isn't really helping the way he looks. I mean, I guess at least it's keeping him alive and whatnot. But
that's what I was gonna say like it's keeping him alive. But what about the quality of life here, bro? Because it seems like literally your life day in and day out is just going and finding your next victim, which by the way, what a waste? Why Why couldn't Why did you just take one Oregon per victim and then go? Is this a hobby? I don't understand. He's very wasteful. Why didn't you take the heart from the last guy?
I well, I was like, Well, maybe it's because he doesn't like to kill them. He's just taking things from them. And then just like leave them to go take care of themselves and get stitched up properly. And well, because like he left that one guy in the bathtub. Well, true. So that's why I was thinking maybe that's it. He just doesn't want to actually kill them. But then we see what he does to this drug or, Yeah. He starts using the scalpel on him. This guy is
in terrible pain. And at first I was like, taking another kid. Like he was already hot, too. Like, so I was really confused. And I was like, what is it going to take and then you hear the crack ribcage of the ribcage crack cracking it open and this guy is still conscious. I don't know how doc just reaches both hands in and pulls out that beating heart. It was massive. And it was like a two hander. It was a huge heart.
I kind of knew he was gonna go for the heart because they were the heart monitor that the jogger was wearing was beeping quite a bit it and it was very loud. So I kind of assumed it was going to be dramatic. With the heart and everything.
I was just like, Oh, they're keeping track of his heartbeat because he's, you know, he's jogging and it's up and then he was asleep and he's sleeping now he's scared. You totally didn't get it. It worked on multiple levels. It did. Yeah, yeah. Anywho then we see the guys and I think Sam is on the phone with Bobby and Bobby says he's got a beat on Bella from one of his old friends that they need to go to Canon. Vermont. Was it Vermont? It was definitely
Vermont. Okay. I don't know how you pronounce canon or Canon Canon A in a Canon canon. Yeah. And he tells them to go see him. He's got some info on Bella and right before he gets off the phone with me he tells him also be sure you take a bottle of Johnnie Walker blue, which is expensive if anybody doesn't know. So Dean is ready he's packing up ready to go after Bella because he's got a real you know what for her
hard on you.
And Sam doesn't want to go he says it's way more important to stay here and figure out what this thing's going on with Doc Benton like maybe it can help team you know since this guy's a mortal and needs like no doofus like, Don't you get it like if I tried to squirm around and beat this in some way. That means you die. And then Sam's like well, I'll take it to me immortal together and
learned nothing from the trickster. The Trickster tried to teach you a lesson Sam EULA. Oh my goodness. Did Mystery Spot not happen at all. What is he doing for Sam? Not for Sam. He is just like, No fuck all that.
Yeah, so they continue having the argument and Dean is just like, I'm not you're going like you're you're going and Sam says No, bro.
I'm not. He's like I want to get taught that lesson again.
And so they have another dramatic separation where Dean's walking off and Sam is teary eyed because they're so codependent on each other. So then we're in canon, Vermont at Rufus. This house, Rufus is
immediately one of LA's new favorite characters through and
he's body's friend. And he's very suspicious of Dean. He's like no bullshit. Like, why are you here? Go away. Dean's like mentions that he's he knows. Bella. He's got some info. And he's like, yeah, so so like everything he says he's so and then right when you think it's, you know, done and Dean's gonna leave. He's like, Oh, by the way, and then he pulls out the bottle the box with the bottle and it was like, Is this any good? And then that that's the
only time we see Rufus smile. So of course, he invites him in and they're sitting at the table drinking some of the Johnnie Walker. Rufus is telling him you know, what are you doing? Why are you wasting your time on Bella, you only have three weeks left, which I thought was interesting. Because I this whole time, like how much time are we got here? You know, it's like, how many episodes are we doing this? That it's supposed to be like, what a year. So now
we're down to three weeks. And he also mentions that he knows things. He knows things about a lot of people and he knows ain't no peashooter gonna save Sam. Nope, Dean.
You mix their names up so much time and I
haven't written right in front my face But I liked that line. I thought it was funny. I was like, Oh, no peashooter on the coat late no fancy thing. Okay. Rufus mentions that, you know, even if you do beat this thing, there's always something else that's going to come down the line for us. It's just the way that that it goes for people like us the way we live. There's always going to be something no matter what, even if it's not this, there's going to be
something else later on. It does flash to Sam all by himself in the woods. I'm sitting there thinking like this was not a good idea. And he's looking around and then it flashes back in Rufus tells Dean that Bella is in room 39 of hotel canon. And Dean's asking, you know, how did you get this information? Like, what was it and he guesses that he got her fingerprints? And Rufus says nope. And deeds like oh, no, you got them. But it didn't You didn't get
anything from him, right? She was like wiped information or something. And Rufus says no, she burned him off. And so
we got really excited at that. Yeah, she's
not just like a little con artist. She's kind of badass. Rufus has this like 10 page, dossier chart file on her that his friend sent over from England. Because apparently in England, your ears are very much like fingerprints. Everybody's are different. And I guess he got a really good picture of Bella's ear apparently, and sent
it to this guy. So this guy sent him all this information on Bella Rufus also alludes to the fact that Bella is Bella Talbott may not be her actual name which not shocking so next up we are back to Sam in the woods by himself by himself and he has found this little house just smack in the middle of the woods normal and he breaks in
not at all eerie No not at all a big red flag
totally should go in unarmed helpless. No big deal and then go down to the basement Yeah, the his biggle body trying to fit down this tiny little like,
he's like folded over on his legs like doing one step at a time with the flashlight.
But he makes it through and he finds the joggers body and which I thought was really sweet since you could like See, see that his chest is cut open a little bit. I mean, the blankets over him or the sheath or whatever there it's very noticeable that there's a cut right above
he stitched it back up though he closed. Oh did that. Well, the ribcage wasn't open anymore. So I assumed that he like ditched it back up for whatever reason
while Sam checks the pulse which sweet, sweet thought. As he's looking around, he sees somebody else in this other room which I was like, oh, it's the guy sleeping. And you're like it is based on which Hey, I in my defense, it's not that far off. This guy lives alone. He's fucking weird. Oh, just taking people down there. So he got sleepy. Okay.
Actually could make sense. Again, like it's this chick that all he's taken from this chick is a huge chunk of skin from her. Why could you not have just taken the skin from the Joker? It's like from her wrist to her elbow. All that skin is missing. Yeah. Why did you need enough hair? Exactly. You could have taken that from before you took his heart. Yeah, take your skin so wasteful.
I agree. I don't think this girl even had any lines did she? She went anyway, on her arm, her arm is covered in maggots. But you can see that it's just like, no skin. Sam tells her he's there to help her and she won't shut up because she's freaking out and Doc, we hear doc show up upstairs and he like puts his hand over her mouth to be like, Look off. But yeah, not really. Because Sammy wouldn't do that. Not Sammy.
After the way he was acting in this episode. And how he was acting at the end of Mystery Spot. Maybe there are a lot of things Sammy would do that. We wouldn't think Sammy would do.
Okay. No, I don't mind.
I mean, all the murder is probably not good. But yeah.
We don't need to think about that. Somehow Sam gets his girl out of the house. They're running. He's got this Jeep. He gets a sweet, sweet sweet Sam, as always opens the door for shoves her in kindly.
Before he even gets in the driver's seat. She's like leaning over toward the driver's seat. We were like we'd be trying to lay down in his lap to your sweetie like she's acting like Oh, my arm but like there's a back to the chair you're sitting in you could lean back in that reclining the seat. No, I would be putting my seatbelt on. Yeah, she was totally trying to lean over into the driver space. Like get closer to him. Don't blame her.
And yeah, but before he can even turn the car on, Doc, which I did mention doc looks like a frail old man. But somehow he comes and just bust the shit Out of this, this passenger or I'm sorry, driver's side window, grab Sam. Sam's big ol head, slams it into the steering wheel repeatedly. Yeah, I'm always like holy shit. Just like super strength come with being immortal. So Sam actually gets the car on gets it to reverse Doc is standing there prime real estate to be run over. And that
is exactly what Sam does. rolls back over him and takes off and we see Doc stand up and his next his next a little funky is a little funky. He just
popped it right back into place though NAFTA back. He whipped his hair back and forth. He whipped his hat back and
wonderful. I wonder whose hair he gets? He still had quite a bit of hair for an old male he did. Now we're at Hotel Kenan Bella is entering into her hotel room. But the scenes already they're waiting for. And he is pissed. And he we learned that he like he says like She disgusts him. And she he can't believe how she could could have murdered her parents, which was news does. And they actually did. And she she kind of very coldly was like, just like owns up to it. And just like yeah, I did it.
She even said they were lovely people. And I just did it for the money like, which we find out through flashbacks. Yeah, it doesn't really let you know what happened. But in flashbacks, the assumption can be made that Bella was being abused.
Most likely sexually. Yeah, like, yeah. For
her. It shows her dad come to her bedroom, and she's obviously scared and cry crying and the door shutting behind him. So she lies and acts like yeah, I'm a monster. And I thought that was interesting. Yeah, that she just really didn't want to be vulnerable that she was gonna act like she was this monster instead. And we see that it was a red eyed demon. They weren't at a crossroads. So I thought that was interesting. She was on a swing set. Right? Maybe they were near a crossroads, though.
It's not like we got to see the full scenery. True. Yeah. But it was a red eyed demon that she made her deal with.
So you don't learn that just yet though. Oh, am I jumping ahead? Yeah, but that's okay. My bad. So yeah, we did get the flashback with the dad. And then as we get back to present day in the hotel room, and Dean has her up against a wall gun up to her and he like glances up for some reason. And there are like, little sticks, twigs of some sort that are in the ceiling, like the, in the crown molding or whatever you want is up there.
It's like sitting on top of the doorframe. Yeah, for
some reason after seeing this, he tells her she's not worth it. Like he was going to kill her. Oh, and at one point when she was like ruffling through her stuff. She was like, inching toward the door and he shoots at her, like, just barely misses her and it goes through the door. So he was he meant business, but something about the twigs or whatever. He he was like, You know what, you're not worth it. And he leaves
made him change his mind. However, before that, whenever he looked up and saw the twigs and went, you know what, nevermind, and grabbed her. You got real excited. You thought that was gonna go a totally different direction. I was
like, Oh, here we go. He was gonna kiss her. And I was like, Yes. And then I was like, Oh, no.
Which I kind of thought that at first. To which surprise second, just for a second. Yeah, just for a second, which surprised me because I thought after dream, a little dream that they were going to flip it that Sam and Bella were going to be hooking up and that maybe Dean and Ruby were gonna start having a thing that they weren't, which would have been cool. It would have been a twist unsuspecting, because this whole season it's been Sam and Ruby Dean and Bella
kind of vibe. Right? But then I remembered there's only like, two episodes left. And I'm probably putting way too much plot into the time that's left. So but yeah, I did think for a second he was he was gonna kiss her. Yeah, but he didn't. is disappointing. I mean, she fucked him over. Oh, so whatever you actually think about it, you know, but they do. They do have really good chemistry. Yeah, casting directors. You know. wouldn't mind seeing these two get together to do something
else on another project? Yes, I agree.
So after Dean leaves we see Bella has in her hand a receipt that she snatched from Dean's pocket. And it says the hotel of where their motel where they're at the Erie. Bella immediately calls somebody and tells them that Dean was there and she knows where they are, where they're going, where they're staying. So she's once again, screwing them over. We don't know who she called though. Dean is back on his on his way back to Sam and they're
on the phone. Sam is telling Dean that he He has Doc's little journal book kind of like dad's. And he's been studying it and he realizes that it's not magic or alchemy or whatever it is. He says it's actually science. It's just very weird science. Weird Science. But good movie as suspected. Doc comes up while he's on the phone with Sam's on the phone with Dean and snatches Sam. So Dean knows he's been taken.
He saw him in that car was like I like it. I want this bit I want that bid. I want this part one that
just keep them around. Of course we next
up see Sam on the table strapped down. I didn't like it. Always. Oh, because he had clothes on. Well, that but no, mainly because his eyes oh, yes. The eyes being taped open. I did not like that. I don't think it was rough. I didn't like
it. As Doc is prepping Sam. He is telling him that he saw John's journal and read all about how back in the day. And they the incidents that have between them. It's almost like a family reunion between all of them. And that's when he mentioned that it was a real inconvenience when John cut his heart out, you know,
and that was the only description we were like how did you survive having a heart cut out? Yeah, no, no, no explanation just inconvenient to
really put them out. Well as Doc is just flapping his gums Dean comes in and shoots doc from behind. Like three times it looked like or something. Yeah, it was a lot. And doctrines rounds. Like no big deal. Like you're gonna do more than that. So then Diem pulls out a knife and stabs him in the heart. And once again, Doc is just like he acts like it's no big deal. Like it's just another unfortunate inconvenience. Yeah. that the heart was new. beings like Well, good. It should be pumping,
really going and pumping. And then he pulls out that he has dipped the knife and chloroform and Doc passes out,
which was sweet justice because we did find out chloroform was how he was knocking out all his victims whenever he was kidnapping them. And yes, yes. He got a taste of his own medicine. He sure did. I lucked out. Next up
on the table is duck strapped down. And he is just begging them that he can read the formula for Dean you know, he can help him he can save him just begging for his life. But Dean is not having it.
her usual. Sam tried to convince them to get a
chance. Even Sam I was surprised. It's like Sam really good again. Like he didn't learn shit. Did you get a good look at doc? Yeah, that's
what you want to hang out. That's what you want your life to be like. But it's like the Trickster said like they refuse to let go of each other. They're just constantly willing to sacrifice each other and Sam didn't learn shit. If anything, he's he's taken a hard lean the opposite way.
He's like, You know what? I hear you. But I completely ignore it and do the exact
real far into the opposite of what you're trying to teach me.
Well, Dean wins this fight doc ends up what I thought was a coffin but that we learn it's this. It's an old school fridge that's just been wrapped in chains, and is down in this pit and they bury good old doc been alive. And a an old phrase, which I
just thought was stupid. Yeah. I said why did they not chop him up and salt and burn his ass? Yeah, that would have made a lot more sense. No, they wanted the poetry. You want to be immortal. Have fun with your immortality in this whole forever? Well, he
kind of deserves it.
I mean, he does, but let's be logical here.
Oh, yeah, I agree. Well, maybe we'll see him again. I don't know why I just yelled like that.
Maybe we will.
Well, then we're with Bella. She has broken, which this surprise me she breaks into the guy's room. doesn't skip a fucking beat shoots both of them in their beds while they're sleeping three times each. And I was just like, damn. But of course, she goes over there and they left like sex dolls and the bed, like covered up so she would think of them. And Dean calls her on the phone and informs her that she was a
little too late. That's when we realize what he saw in her hotel room was some sort of herb and it's used to keep hellhounds at bay. So he realizes that she made a deal just like he did. And her deal was that she asked a demon to kill her parents. Not her. She didn't do it. She made the deal. And it was about 10 years to the day. Dean realizes from all the paperwork he looked through. And Bella is starting to cry asking for help deeds and
I have in it. And she tells him that she knows the demon that has both of their contracts. And her name is Lilith, who we. We met in the episode before the last one, Justin Bella. Yeah. And she went, he tells her he's not going to help her, you know, it is what it is.
And what's he going to do with that point, right, three minutes to midnight.
And she's like, well, you know what, and he and he, I think he asked, like, why are you telling me this? And she's like, Well, maybe you can kill the bitch. And he he just says, okay, and then he's like, I'll see you in hell. And she hangs up and you start here. You hear these girls in the background? The howling of rounds, and then it cuts out. I like the the the twigs and weeds and stuff. The dried plants. Dean called it devils shoestring. Oh, is that what it was? Yeah, I
liked that name. Not my favorite. No, but it was pretty good. Yeah, I
like I like Rufus. His introduction. I liked him. I like to work with his character. And again,
I thought it was real interesting to see Sam taking this hard lane. The opposite direction. Yeah, into note. We're gonna stay codependent as fuck, I'm even willing to murder people in order for us to stay alive and keep living together. Keep living that Winchester, Brother Love. Sam was so serious about, hey, like, this could help us. We just need to kill a person here. kilobars in there. He seemed to believe this was honestly a solution for them.
Yeah, even if it was going to be temporary, you know, just until we can figure something else out. That was a very unexpected twist.
Well, I also think Sam is probably terrified of being alone. Like he has no one after Dean's gone. And I mean, yeah, he was Mr. Independent going to college and all that, but he had his girlfriend and his friends. And now it's just, it's just gonna be him. If Dean goes, I think that's also a part of his motivation. I can tell. I mean, I know he loves his brother. But right.
But no, I can definitely see that. Because in Mystery Spot, whenever he had those six months, he knew who had done it, and that they could undo it. So rather than moving on, or whatever, he just obsessed over trying to find the Trickster and make him undo it. But if this thing happens, the hellhounds drag Deena. how's he supposed to undo that? So I think you're right. But even then Sam was willing to like go kill somebody in order to get his brother back. So I guess maybe we
shouldn't be so surprised. Yeah,
I guess so. Let's famiIy
I'd still hit it.
Oh, god. Yeah.
This episode was written by Sarah gamble and directed by Charles Besian. This is the first episode with this pairing. And supernatural. Okay, core. We had some surgical gore.
I think the heart and the liver guy.
I gotta say the only thing that I had to turn away I could not look at the screen was Sam's eyes being taped open. I didn't like that. But I really didn't like it when he took that melon baller looking thing. See? I didn't see that that much. I was and he put it in sales. I No, you could see the eyeball moving. See that? That was the worst. I mean, there were a couple of other bloody Roschin maggot things that happened. But to me the eyeball thing was the worst. Yeah,
yeah. That in the heart, I guess for me. Yeah, UI. Anything,
anything you adored about this episode? Yeah. I gotta say I adored Rufus, as well. And I happen to know because, you know, our listeners know that I know some things that happened in the middle of the series. I know that Rufus comes back. And it was interesting to see his introduction. He seems different. I'll say that much. Oh, really? His character is a little different in this episode from the Rufus that we see later on in the series, like good or
bad. Neither just different. Okay. He's a little more kooky. Okay, later on. Yeah. He's he's a little bit more comedic relief later on. And if I if I'm remembering correctly. I mean, we're coming up on a year since I watched the stuff.
I could see that. I mean, he was kind of funny. I mean, he was so serious, but like he was kind of funny, too, in this one, but just I could see it being more so maybe later on if he's more involved.
Yeah. Yeah. So I liked I liked Rufus too. Cool. I'm excited. I'm more than thinking about it. The more that I kind of do adore this hard turn for Sam, where he's going to it'll help us.
He also looked at he got a hair cut
his hair was with him and he had the sideburns so well. Yeah, the sideburns talking over. There was that scene where it showed him in the car and like, we both went, woohoo. Sideburns here, because we liked it. Yeah, yeah. Sam's hair. For sure. Okay, Rufus Sam's hair hard turn that seemed to come out of nowhere. But as we've been talking about it more, it really didn't.
I feel for Bella.
That was sad or Yeah.
She's obviously had a rough life. Yeah. I mean, I think we are kind of probably knew that a little bit, but I kind of thought she was like a little posh British girl, but she's been through some shit.
And I can't imagine. I know she's not in the series later.
I mean, that's kind of like a lame ending for her though. I feel like if this is it, I almost wish
they showed it. I wish they showed the hounds come and take her maybe that would have been? I don't know if that would have been better, but because I think that was it. But did she survive? Right? How you liked her? I did too. But I don't think that she was gonna get out of it at that point. True.
Yeah. All right. Well, all right. P Bella. Yep. On this are
on to the lore. Man, I did not have fun with this. As you know, listeners, we try to take the supernatural element and figure out is this real? Well, it wasn't really so much supernatural. The main thing in this episode that I researched, was it the fountain of youth? Kind of, but like with organ transplant? So I pulled this from in M in.com. I don't remember what those letters stand for. Forgive me. The article is called can organ transplantation help you
live forever? Starts out. It's talking about like dystopian movies like there's the movie never let me go with Andrew Garfield and the island with you and McGregor, where there's clones of people that are basically grown as a source of replacement body parts for ailing DNA matched clients build millionaires. Yeah, the rich people because of course, you know, anyhoo ethics aside, the premise begs the question, can we live forever if we keep replacing our body parts?
Perhaps since we have the option to become donors, it's more realistic to ask, are there factors of owner book of donor organs that influence the recipients aging process that can make us biologically younger or older. Donor age is a major determinant of transplantation outcomes. Donor young and old cells that are transplanted appear to be capable of regulating age by influencing
the cells in the recipient. On one hand, young donor cells have been shown to have the capacity to promote regeneration in recipient tissue. And on the other hand, old donor cells can induce the aging of neighboring cells and adopting tissue and recipients. What they're doing with organ transplantation is they try to match you to people as close to your age as possible. Because if they give you an older person's heart, liver or what have you, it's going to age you.
Yeah, you probably just need another replacement later on.
Yeah, well, that's why that's why document and was constantly go on for people 20 years younger than him or I guess he was alive for 150 years. I think Sam said so. He was constantly going for young, healthy people. The effects are not limited to the immediate surroundings, but actually work to have effects all throughout the body. Are you going to talk
about how like, people have gotten organs from somebody like weird stuff happened,
though? I didn't do that research. Oh, I just did the image mortality stuff.
It's interesting.
Do you got to talk about it?
No, I was just gonna tell you that like there was a some thing I watched like years ago and like people who had gotten transplants like there was one girl who like her favorite artists was Sunday Sunday is that how you say it? I think so. And she died and he this guy got or rubies vice versa but they got one of her organs. And like ever like shortly after that and like anytime they would hear saw like they would just sob like cry when they heard the music. They wanted to listen to it all
the time. Just like little things like that. And it was like a whole bunch of people who had like had. So what else is Oregon's that like when they talked to their family or something like they met there were like all these like things that had happened that were from the donor that they were experiencing.
That kind of relates back to the lore from our ghost phasers episode when we were talking about residual hauntings, and they were talking about water, water water. I didn't go into all the details, but they were talking about how basically everything has some sort of molecular makeup of water and water retains memory. Oh, so we know our bodies are like crazy percentage of water. Yeah.
1%
If that's true that water maintains memory then
yeah, I was like fascinating that I'll have to find find something on it again and show you but yeah, I didn't research any of that. Sorry. I didn't mean to interrupt. I was just curious. I know what you're saying kind
of that reminds related to Yeah. Now we're gonna talk about heterochronic parabiosis neck re initial insights into the consequences of combining cells from animals of different ages were predominantly investigated in experimental models called heterochronic parabiosis. This is when the circulatory systems of animals of different ages are joined. Okay, in other words to animals get surgically linked together like Siamese twins and share blood. Well, what what, why science?
Why don't we do it to people, not animals?
I mean, we could, let's get some volunteers
just just real animals did not sign up for it. Just read
the article, man. Okay, so interestingly, reciprocal effects occur between the young and old conjoined twins, like we've already discussed. With the circulatory connection, the younger animal becomes older and the older animal becomes
younger. In this conjoined setting, several organs such as the liver, brain and cardiovascular systems undergo age associated changes, pointing to factors in the blood that can influence aging heterochronic pair of eyes studies, and subsequently, more refined studies have opened a new vein of aging research and one with therapeutic potential and obvious potential therapeutic direction involves direct transfusion of blood or plasma alone from young people, which may be sufficient to transfer
factors that confer rejuvenation or aging. So you wanted the fountain of youth, the blood of the young,
so lady Bathory had it right.
She wasn't transfusing it, though. She was just painting it on her face. She's really over time, you know. There are a couple of alternative approaches. One involves identifying rejuvenation factors in blood from young people and supplying those directly. Conversely, we can try to identify aging factors and selectively remove
them. Another direction would be via therapeutics that target non replicating growth arrested since since this, I can't say that word cells as these cells may be involved in the production of secretion of many of these aging and often inflammatory factors.
I don't like the word secretion.
So next, we've got like stem cells and organ transplants, blood derived factors may not be the only way by which aging traits are transferred. grafts from older individuals show inferior outcomes compared to younger
ones. The principle applies not only to solid assembled organ transplants, but also dissociated cells, notably adult stem cells, primitive cells that can mature and replenish certain tissues transplanted into recipients are capable of developing into cells from multiple tissue types, and may contribute to recipient organ and tissue function. These cells depending on their biological age, exert either rejuvenating
or aging effects. It is unclear whether these transplanted adult stem cells or organs impact recipient cell and tissue function predominantly by acting as a local source of secreted soluble factors are in fact by integrating into and contributing to target organ function. Alright, so coming back to the movies and the question of whether organ transplantation can help us live forever? The answer is most likely no. But can it help increase our lifespan improve our overall health and prevent
disease? Theoretically? Yes. Oh, and the meantime, and without an illegal cloning movement, scientists will continue to try to understand the best approach to organ transplantation and ageing. Very interesting. I thought it was LAME.
It's interesting to me because I'm all about lame lame lore and it Yeah. For me,
keeping it young keep it tight keeping
this me young. Right and tight all right to close it out. I already mentioned this but right before the girls come for Bella Dean tells her I'll see you in hell.
Cheers. Squeaky chair. It's gotten worse. Well, yeah, don't do anything to fix it.
Get some WD 40
Thank you for listening to denim wrapped nightmares.
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