Heaven and Hell (4x10)

Welcome to denim wrapped nightmares tipsy exchange Podcast where we explore the supernatural series episode by episode.

over drinks, we'll discuss the lore of gore and what we adore about the Winchesters and their adventures.

I'm burly, and I'm a new fan of the series.

I'm LA, and I'm here along for the ride. Now let's get tipsy.

Hello la Hey Burley. I am drinking a tall cool refreshing. Misha Collins. What are you drinking today?

I am drinking a simply spiked lemonade, watermelon and then I will be moving on to a strawberry

as we speak. We're really into the lemonade stuff lately. I

guess though. Yeah.

What are we what are we doing? Well, I've never had these before. But I know but I want wine. They're pretty tasty. Yeah. Now as of today, we are caught up with supernatural then and now. And several of our listeners, listeners. Several of our listeners also listen to that show. So you're probably happy that we finally caught up with them. Their show is paused right now because of the strike. But to commemorate are catching up with them. I thought it would be fun to do a little activity.

Oh, that's a good one.

If there's outdated 2000s, like early 2000s, humor, early 2000s references or whatever, they could read it the sugar array where it's like, just the chin hair underneath. You know what I mean? Like just just on the very end of the chin, or like the strip. Like Ben Edlund, circa 2006 where he just had like the little

Oh, yeah.

Or Richard Speight Jr. in North Beach, where it was just on the end of his chin was that movie? Oh, if, like, you just don't like an episode, and you don't want to have to explain why you can read it. The dude go t because, you know, that's just like your opinion, man. Yeah, yeah, I got a good laugh. It was cute. Okay, so moving on with today's episode, we're first going to revisit our last

Dun dun dun boom, boom,

boom.

Love. So today starts right where we left off. Oh

my god immediately right away.

It's the name of it is Heaven and Hell 10th episode of season four. It's the mid season finale. And it aired on November 20 2008. And it starts right at this conversation from the last episode

with Cassiel. Uriel, Sam Dean and Ruby. Yes. And they're saying, of course, they

said Anna has to die. And she details them that they're a couple of Heartless sons of bitches without like, missing a beat cast is like, and he's like, Yeah, we

are and yeah, which was like, whoa, okay. Oh, my.

And then Urial. Mr. Mr. King of South. Oh,

my goodness,

I'm in and the

insults those rollers and the insult. Like I said, I feel like he makes up slurs and I don't know what they are. But I know what he means. Yeah, they're not good. He means business. I like

so he tells Dean that, you know, don't worry, I'll kill her real gentle. Yeah, tell her gentle and Zen. Lily Sam is like what are you doing? She's just an innocent girl and they mentioned that Anna is far from innocent. Which is shocking because she seems like so sweet.

I know she's been such a little sweetie pie this whole time

Urial mentions that she's even worse than the abomination of who is Ruby that Sam is hooking up with?

Yeah, a by ation you're sleeping with

Wow. A Ruby doesn't even like she just kind of looks away like not gonna touch that. Well, things get happened fast. Urial charges at them he or no Ruby, I think charges at them. Right?

He just threw Ruby knows throws around like a door. Yeah, Uriel charges them and throws her through like a window or something.

And I can't remember the context. But Dean at some point tells Uriel that he should try J date. Oh, because they weren't giving her up. So he's like, maybe try JD Yeah,

you're you'll was kicking Dean's ass. And Castile goes walking up to Sam and Sam was just like, please, please don't do it. Just pleading and Cass just like took his magical those magical two fingers. Imagine what else those magical two fingers could do. And he just touched him to Sam's forehead and he just went night night. Just passed out just like Bobby in the barn.

Yeah. In the midst of all this fight, all of a sudden cast like lights up like flashes light lights up. And then it's like he's like, pulled through the ceiling and goes way. And then we look and same thing happens to your reel and we're like,

yeah, I was like, No, my favorites. Yeah.

Bring them back. Well, they rushed into the room where Anna was at, and she has like, slit her wrist. Yeah, and drawn some sort of spell on the mirror with her blood. And she so that's what happened. That's how she got them to go away. And they asked her how she did and she said she doesn't know she just she just did it.

I thought it was funny that you and I looked at each other and we were both like Anna just got real interesting. And then the very next scene, I can't remember if it was Sam or Dean, but one of them said almost the exact same thing right after we did

just got real interesting. So they decide they need to hide Anna and Bobby is apparently out of town and the Caribbean. What did they say?

They were saying? Sam was like, is he working a case and Dean was like either bad or he's hedonism.

That's what it was. Yeah. Wearing a

banana hammock and it's trucker hat. Yeah,

they take Anna to Bobby's safe room. Like panic. Fancy. Demon protected. Everything protected room.

Yes. And I finally got my wish Ruby finally did witchy shit out hex bags that she had made as she

throws she will not she can't step into the room because you know, but she's right outside the door and throws her like three hex bags deep and

basically says that that those will hide you from angels. Yes, everything angels, demons, anything which tracks because whenever they were in the it's great pumpkin, Sam Winchester, Castile and Muriel. We're talking about the powerful witches who did whatever to cloak themselves from angels. So which means that Ruby was a badass witch, because they were saying that that meant it was a badass witch. Right. So I hope we can see more witchy stuff from Ruby.

So from our last episode, when I was talking about all the ways that angels speak to us, yeah, I feel like they're speaking to you. Because you keep like saying things that are then and then they happen in the show. That's what the supernatural Angel.

And it's really important for me to know what's happening in this fictional world. Or I'm just subconsciously remembering stuff from that I had it probably was like a year ago at this point, and I wasn't really paying attention. But still, I mean, surely I picked up some stuff here and there. Yeah. Well,

anyway, they I think it's Dean. I can't remember if Dean or Sam asks Anna if she is hearing anything in the midst of Angel chatter. And she says no, that it's dead silence, which I feel like, would tracks and she's in this room. That's so protected from everyone.

Oh, yeah. That other stuff. Yeah. And they know she's listening to them now. So they don't want to give her a heads up as to what they're planning. Right?

Yeah. She kind of looks at all of them. And she asks if they're scared, and of course they've no, no, of course not. But they're terrified. Jean had sent Sam off to go find out more about Anna and he comes back and says that he found out her father was a church Deacon mother was a housewife. And at two and a half years old. Apparently she just like, started flipping out anytime her dad would come near her. And she was convinced that he was not

wait, there's something something happened that like this contributing to me liking Ruby, so I want to bring it up. Before Dean went upstairs and was talking to Sam, he told Ruby watch her talking about Anna down in the panic room and Ruby just kind of was like, okay, and Dean what upstairs? And then while Sam and Dean were talking about this, they were like, you know, we wonder what happened?

It was it was funny.

I thought that was hilarious. Yeah.

Anna tells them that she doesn't know why she's bad how she's why she's considered this way. And so next up, we see that Dean is leading somebody down the stairs to where they are. And it's our good friend, Pamela. Yeah, I was excited to

see her. I was too it was so unexpected. Yeah.

But she obviously is blind now. So she's wearing glasses and sunglasses,

sunscreen, she did lift up her glasses at one point and had solid white eyes and she was like, it's good for business.

She slaps Dean or Sam's ass. Like, I'd recognize that as anywhere, grumpy and all that. And she proceeds to hypnotize Anna. As she's under, they questioned her about her abilities and that blood spell that she did. She still says she doesn't know. Pamela tries to get her to go back to her youth to see who her real father is. And Anna's not having it. She's like, starts freaking out, like raising upper chest and all that

Yeah, because Pamela tried to be like Dean down and like, got his ass thrown over. And the lights were exploding. In hindsight, we should have known what she was before she announced it. I didn't put two and two together until after she announced it. But with the lights exploding and the telekinetic stuff and just being overall dramatic. With everything we should have known.

So well, since she's getting crazy, Pamela like, brings her back. And she said she thinks Pamela because now she remembers and it turns out, she's an angel.

She's a drama queen shit starter.

But she's not like the other. She says she apparently disobeyed and fell from grace to become human. But she says she ripped out her grace. Right? They

explained that grace is like an energy. That I guess is what makes you angelic. Because if you rip that out, you can become human.

And she's she had mentioned like, her mom didn't have kids. And she always called her her little miracle. I guess in the back. She's always kind of knew in the back of her mind. But she lived her life as a human and grew up and all that

people who supposedly had past lives, having those glimpses every once in a while about something. Yeah, I kind of saw it like that.

True. Sam, in his research is discovering these meteors that fell around the time she was I guess she fell.

No, he said, so when you fell like you literally fell. And she was like, yeah, and he was like, is it something that maybe the human eye would have seen? And she said maybe and so then he researched meteors that fell around the time she would have been quote, unquote, conceived. And he found one that died that like was spotted and disappeared in the sky like nine months to the day before she was born. Okay, so it wasn't a comet. It was Anna. Oh, yeah. falling from heaven.

Ruby and Sam are talking and she starts mentioning that he needs to tone up his abilities. They've gotten flabby. Because because she's so scared of Alliser and I guess whatever it is, she needs Sam to step it up. Because they need to take Aleister out.

She was really pushing like, you've got to exercise him right now. Get him out and you know what you have to do to tighten up. I was trying to think back to Mystery Spot because that seemed to be such a what's the word where it means that was like prophecy prophetic? Is that a word? Or am I making that up? Episode? And I remember in that episode, that he was willing to like just go kill somebody for a blood sacrifice. And so it makes me wonder like, is that? Is that what she was talking about?

No. So or is it like he has some other ability to maybe because she says abilities? Yeah. So I don't know.

We haven't really used seen him. You Use his like telekinesis or whatever to move stuff forgot about that in a while. We've only seen him exercise demons. So what else can he do still?

Yeah. Well see. I feel like I say when I say that in every episode to be seeing Yeah.

Changing. TBD?

Yeah, there you go. Then we see Anna is outside kind of by herself and Dean's walking up. And he explains that Pamela opted out. She wants to what she knew Anna was an angel. She's like, I'm good. Yeah, take me home.

Understandable. Yeah. Oh, yeah. Pamela.

She's like, Guys, don't call me anymore. Because every time it ends up an angel, but he, he proceeds to ask and what the angels want with him. And she doesn't know she doesn't, you know, she doesn't know. And he asks her why she would want to be human. I can't remember exactly. But she's like, all the feelings all the hurt. Like everything. She was like, I would do it again. Like it guess it's more worth it, in her opinion, to be human than an

I remember you and I looked at each other and you went Archangels Yes. It's gotta be it's gotta be.

And she tells him that she was stationed on Earth for 2000 years, just watching and waiting on orders and never hearing anything. So she's just like, there. So I can't I mean, I guess 2000 years is a long time. Yeah. So I mean, I guess in a way, I guess you can't blame her.

I did think it was cute. Whenever Dean heard her complaining about her dad. And he was like, I can relate spray, because that was all season one. Right? But he's just out here doing stuff hoping he's doing the right thing. Trying to get in touch with his father. No word nothing.

They'll two peas in a pod.

Yeah. Well, and just just kind of tying back to season one where things began, even though it was like a split second. I liked that.

Yeah. Well, Sam discovers that in union, Kentucky, Kentucky, in Union Kentucky, that there is this miracle tree that happened around the time that she was born or whatever fell, whatever, vice versa.

It's also where that comment that you were talking about where that vanished.

And then when it hit, this huge tree grew. And she mentioned that her grace falling could have done something like that. So they all pile up and baby and take a road trip to Kentucky. And on the way I thought it was funny that the boys are up front. The girls that are both in the backseat and Dean mentions like an angel and a demon sitting in the backseat. It's like a setup for a bad joke. Yeah, totally. Right. They find the tree and Anna goes up to it. She touches

said this was it before she touched it. But then once she touched it, she was like, just kidding.

Yeah, she's like, Yeah, it's gone. Somebody took it. Mm hmm. So the after that all of a sudden Anna can hear the angels again. And she but she says it's weird. It's like a recording on a loop. And all it's saying is Dean Winchester gives us an hour by midnight. Or they're gonna throw him back in hell. Sam's like Anna like, Are there any weapons that you know that can kill angels? Like what what do we do? What do we give me something? And Anna's like, I mean, no, not any we could get

I thought that was really sweet because Dean did look terrified. Whenever Anna said, give us the girl or we're gonna throw Dean back in Hell, he didn't see it at first you have to ruin it. But yeah, he looks terrified. I mean, it was only for a moment but they definitely made sure you saw that he does not want to go back to hell. Yeah,

I mean, I don't think anybody was who right? The even the demons don't want to even Rubio like no

man. Please.

Anna turns like she thinks Dean, you know, they didn't have to do all of this for her. They didn't have to protect her and she thinks them and she tells them that you know what she did? You know falling from grace taking Grace out that's like their their murder in the first like murder. Number one. Lucifer disobeyed. she disobeyed so maybe she needs to face up to the consequences. She tells him that she did hear something about a week ago and he's not

Let's rewind whenever Dean was asking previously, before they went and looked for her grades and all that other stuff, and he was asking why she fell. One of the reasons she listed when he was like, why would you want to be a human? Was sex?

Oh, yeah, that was in this conversation. Yeah. Oh, was it this Congress? Yeah. Oh, my bad. No, you could be wrong. I don't know. Anyway, in one of their conversations, yes. She can't remember what else. Oh, she was like cake.

Chocolate cake. Chocolate Cake.

Zach's Yeah. So spoiler alert. Tina, Nana get in the car and have sex in the backseat. And she like puts her hand on his scar or Cassie. I know.

Why did that feel like like that felt raw.

I know. I was like, Don't touch.

I know. You're not supposed to touch the side. And just the way she perfectly lined her hand up on the handprint. It just,

I mean, I probably would do it too.

But it just felt so naughty. Even though they're like, half naked. Like the naughty part was her putting her hand right. I don't know. We were like,

like, this is fine, but oh my gosh.

We were like clutching our pearls over that. I don't understand why we had that reaction. I don't either. But we did. We both did. Yeah. At the same time, too. So that was odd. Danes back. Nice.

It was a good back. That

was a real good back. I do a little movie did yeah. Oh, Snake thing. Yeah. I do agree with you. Whenever it was over LA looked at me and said rubies and stamps was better. It was,

I guess, I guess they're not gonna have an angel having sex being like real rough. And all sexy. It's gonna be a little more sweet. I guess.

It was pretty hot, though. I mean, we got the hand grabbing her thigh. It's true. Yeah. You know. I mean, it was it was it was sexy in a different way. Yeah. Like Sam's and rubies was more aggressive, like, tension has been building up between us and we have to release it. And this one was it was more tender. Yeah. But there was still some really nice squeezes. There were some good squeezes of the flesh going on. Yeah, I liked it. I thought both. They were both good. For different reasons. Yeah.

I enjoyed them both. Well, and I'm glad they both got laid.

Yeah, yeah. glad about that. The hand on the Stevie window. It was a little cheesy. It was I it was a little cheesy. I could have done without that to be honest.

After the handle the window, Titanic style. We go back to the house and Ruby is there. Everyone's Asleep. And she sneaks out of the house and goes out in the street. She has one of the hex bags, lights it on fire and Aleister shows up. She says she'll give up the angel to him. As long as the three of them walk away her Sam and Dean. She thought it was nice. She included team

she was emphasizing that too. Yeah, me both both. Like she didn't leave him out. So I thought that was cool, too.

I think I missed some of the other insults that were thrown up Ruby in this episode, but she's fucking taken a real brunt of these men saying shit to her bitch

horse. Yeah, Dane abomination like Jesus

Christ and he calls her a devious cowardly little slut. Yeah, and I'm like, why? Unnecessary?

It didn't bother me as much in this episode because we finally got some more is the derogatory the term like they were calling each other prick and doing all this other stuff between the men in this episode. Yeah, so at least it was a little more even.

Yeah. He gives her a counter offer. He doesn't say what it is. We find out later right what his counter offer was

has counteroffer was throwing her up on his right little crucifix. Turn it out.

But we'll get back to that. Because Urial shows up with Dean Dean's in some room of this house wherever they are by himself after having sex with Anna and your your Uriel shows Dean that he has Anna's grace. It's like a little vial that he has on his neck like a necklace and tells Dean that Castile likes him and that Dean is cast yells weakness. And that's why he's there. Oh, and I liked that. He was like Uriel tells Dean that he cut himself a cut of a little cut of angel food cake.

The other thing I thought was interesting is that this was all in a dream like Dean. Oh,

that's true. I forgot about that. Yeah,

Dean was like I'm dreaming aren't I? And Uriel was like, this is the only way I could talk to you because you guys are using the hex bags to hide yourself from us. And I like Shaquille it was like, just like in your war last episode

to talk to us in our dreams. Yeah. But yeah, they're throwing insults back at each other and I like the Dean was like what you've got like some smooth down there something like a Kindle

junk list. He kept calling them junk lists.

And Uriel tells him that they have bigger plans for Anna than they have for Dean and that Dean is replaceable, he can be replaced and Dean tries to call his bluff a little bit you know, go ahead just do it. Take me back to hell go ahead do it. But of course he doesn't. And that's where we flash to see that Aleister is cutting up Ruby trying to get Ana's location. Good on you, Ruby, the hell for not caving? Because she's not the one that gives her up.

Well, she does. She says I won't tell you where she is because you'll just kill me. But I'll show you so she takes Aleister to the location but it turns out that was part of their plan all along.

Who says they'll kill Atlanta or Sam

Urial said that to Dean in the dream we just didn't see that happened so that it was a surprise to find out that Dean gave them up. Okay, but in the dream the way the dream cut off Uriel saying, Oh, I know how you'll break like I know what your pressure points are. You just have to know the right place to put pressure and then it kind of cut away where it was like mysterious as to how did that conversation end and then we find out he gave Dean a

They're all in there, this area together. Again, I don't know where they're at or what this place is, but they're all in or this big area together. And it's Uriel Castillo Castile, Sam, Dean and Anna. And that's where we find out that Dean, Kate, that's he's the one that gave up Anna. And she tells him You did your best the best she could and she forgives them. Castile like tries to apologize to Anna and she does not accept

Yeah. Which is disgusting. And Alastair called him as something something prick. I don't remember what the words were before it. But I remember when he called them a prick. I was like finally, right? They're using a little bit more venom and how they talk to the men. So Uriel

and Aleister are kind of going back and forth. And you're like, Give her to me. I'll make sure she's good and punished. They just break out and fight the fight like everybody starts fighting Well, the angels and demons start fighting each other. And Castile tries to put his hand on Alistair's head, like, I guess Killam

Uriel was putting his hand on like the little sidekicks that were there. He was putting his hand on their foreheads, and then light was shooting out of their eyes and mouths. And I think that's like them, smiting them if I'm remembering from like, later seasons. And so Casio tried to do that. And this was interesting, nothing happened. And Alistair was like, Oh, why don't you go complain to daddy or something like that? And then Cassiel started looking scared whenever he said that. So what's

right? Anna ran over and grabbed the vial from Urals neck and throws it on the ground. It's like this big light and goes into her mouth. She's second in her grace again. And she's like yelling and tells that everybody just shut their eyes and she bursts into this big light shoots, like starts flashing bursts in the light. I don't think she took Aleister out. But he he kind of disappeared with her.

Yeah, I was like, what happened? Did she just explode here? I still don't understand what happened. But I'm guessing she's still alive. Because they said something about like, are you going to go find Anna to Uriel and Cassiel? After all of this? Yes, she's still alive.

They leave to go get her they say

yeah, I did get a little confused because it was after the fight. The demons are gone. The angels take off to go find Anna and Ruby, Sam and Dean are talking, you know, Dean's like great plan to have them despite it out amongst themselves. And Sam was like, yeah, when you're dealing with Godzilla and Mothra, the best thing you could do is just like get out of the way. So apparently everyone was in on the plan. So the plan was to give Anna up to the angels all along. So why was Dean

Yeah, so it ends with Dean finally explaining to Sam what went on in hell. And he says it wasn't four months was more like four years, they sliced and carved him and tore out him in ways until there was nothing left. And then he'd be whole again and they just start over and at the end of every day, or whatever Aleister would come and offer, that if he would partake in the torture, he would take them off the rack, and he wouldn't have to experience it

really good crying in that scene. I liked the performances of not only Jensen, but also Jared paddle lucky in that scene. Yeah, I was really, really emotional scene after all this action and all this story stuff. This episode was jam packed with stuff, man. It was a lot written by Eric crypkey and Trevor sands, and it was directed by Jay Miller Tobin. The only Gore in it that I can think of is the blood spell that Anna did. Near the beginning of

I'm glad Dean finally. kind of told Sam about his experience. Oh, yeah, I did like that. The girl that played Anna, or maybe originally Anna's character? I don't know. But I liked her.

I like any episode with the angels. I like Uriel and Castile. Yeah. Two episodes in a row. With sexing Yeah. I would have liked to see some more squeezes going on and more action the more action like an ass grab or something. I mean, that thigh grab was real nice, though. And yeah, the scandalous shoulder oh my god, I'm still clutching my pearls over it. There's just a lot in this episode. It's very plot heavy episode a lot to keep track with. It's interesting now because I'm kind of curious.

I guess Oh, well.

I mean, come on. Despite their ambiguous nature in Scripture, Fallen Angels have been an interesting subject for theologians. For centuries. Many believe they provide a valuable lesson about morality and free will. And that's all I got.

Nice. To close it out. We've got a little conversation between Sam and Dean. And Sam says she was convinced that he wasn't her real daddy.

Dean says who was the plumber? A little snaking the pipes.

And Sam says, Dude, you're confusing reality with porn again.

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