This BBC Podcast is supported by ads outside the UK. Dej, jag skulle ju köpa några nya palstält. Det kanske blev lite mer grejer. De hade ju allt, man hade en skribord, jag köpte en sån här, och kontorstolar, och sen hade de en skit snygg tippkont. Vi har inredning för hela arbetsplatsen. Välkommen till AI-produkten! Love double circle. Lika enkelt som att ta en kaffe. Eller äta en kors. Men om du inte tycker att det är så enkelt, är det. Vi får se oss nästa gång.
You know how you're about to go on your first camping trip ever? It's a big milestone. I'm Namu Lanta Combo This is Coco. You're listening to Dear Dora. From the BBC World Service. If you were leaving and you were going away What would you remember that I tell you? Tell me why. Wow, you tell me so many things it's hard to keep up with. We've had letters and advice this season. Birthday. Fest broad.
But today I'm looking ahead to one of the big milestones. What happens when your daughter leaves home? What do you think? It would be like to be away from home for like four years or even. He'll be older, he'll be like eighteen, but what do you think it'll be like? It will be confusing'cause I don't think I've not seen you for a long long time. Ever. I mean, I've gone for sleepovers, but I see you the next day.
Uh I would call you every day, I'd miss you so much. For the first few nights I'd have to call you a lot. How do you make sure they're ready? How do you make sure they take the right things away with them? Physically, but also the intangible things. So I was really interested when we got a letter from Listener Shelley about how she dealt with this when her daughter was leaving home.
She was going off to this college so very far away, and We were caught up in that frenzy of being very proud and excited for her, and you buy all of the things, you know, the dorm room comforter and the tea kettle and all of that excitement, and there was this. We're so proud, but you're also Worried that this framework of your family might crumble once that little piece is separate from you. Coco's nearly nine. It's a while before she leaves home, but her world is already opening up.
I wanna climb Mount Kenya and go parachuting and see the Eiffel Tower and go to New York. All the places you go, all the highs and the lows. Bye Dr. Seuss. But Shelley came up with a solution that I find very relatable. In the couple of days before she left for school, I just had to sit down and write down some things that I felt were kind of important for our family. And then I just printed it off and stuck it in her suitcase so she didn't find it for a day or so until she got up to college.
My dear daughter. Hello, how are you? I see you're a plant mom. I am a plant mom. Are you a plant mom? No, I kill everything. I killed a cactus last year and my husband is really ill. He he's fascinated with how that happened. So this is Shelly. She lives in Arkansas in the southwest of the United States. which is uh next to Texas, uh which everyone seems to know.
It's a beautiful place. We have lots of trees and rivers and um warm, friendly people. And all the way from Arkansas, how did you hear about the Dear Daughter Podcast? So when I wake up in the middle of the night and I can't go back to sleep, my favorite relaxation is to listen to the BBC News, um global news podcast. Which is where last year she heard about us.
Now if you have a daughter or you are one, you might be interested to know that the World Service podcast Dear Daughter is back for a third series. Every episode features a low? It's something massive that's happened in your own life. You can email us on deardaughter at bbc.co.uk.
We've also got a brand new WhatsApp number I said, Wait, I have a letter I wrote to my daughter and it it had been a year or so earlier, but it was still on our computer and um I just decided that you might enjoy hearing it as well. By the way, you should do this as well. If you've written a letter you'd like to share with us, please send it in. We would love to hear from you. So Shelley's daughter was leaving home for the first time. Which is a big transition for everyone involved.
I just look back on my first day at uni and I left Kenya to go to university in the UK. I remember making friends and like the going to see who I could meet in like the common rooms. So I remember being excited. But I was with my mum. As you were talking, I was just thinking what she must have been feeling leaving her child in another country. It must be the same as you because wherever your daughter is at uni.
Is it a it's across the country, so you might as well might as well be in another country, right? Right, it is. And it's it's fifteen hundred miles away. If I if I got in my car it would literally take me twenty four hours to drive there. So a similar thing. Yeah. I can't imagine that first week for my mum, what it must have been like to leave your child in another country, as excited as you are for them to start a new part of their life. It's a mixture of feelings because
You you realize this is exactly what you would dream for them. You know, you you're you're getting what you wish for. So it's kind of a strange feeling as a parent. You're so thrilled and excited, and yet there's this kind of loss that you want to hide from them because you you don't want them to feel guilty about leaving. This is what you raised them for. This is this is them thriving. Yeah. So shall we read the letter first and then we can talk a bit more about uh what's in it? Okay.
When I started this, I got mired in the overwrought cliches and sappy platitudes that any mother would bestow on her college-departing child. The sentiments felt generic. You deserve better, since words are our magical pixie dust. Yet capturing our essence is a slippery task. So I zoom out on our mother-daughter path. The peaks have been plentiful, and the valleys of discord mainly short-lived affairs.
We found our way back to happy accord, often by way of peace talk negotiations, brokered by dad, bless him. Our specific family tapestry is woven with the adoration of portmanteaus, delight in stroop waffles. joy in a well placed semicolon and a ridiculous amount of John Mullaney. We've ingrained strong feelings about airport footwear, practical, always, the best shade of blue on the ceiling of that cool palace, and Mexican food, anytime, anyplace.
Our educational vacations that you've lovingly deemed death marches of enlightenment brought useful life lessons. In cathedrals, awe and wonder. National parks, pouty stomp hikes lead to jaw-dropping vistas. And museums arrive early or why even go? We have strong opinions about much, which is fine, but it steers us dangerously close to judgy, which isn't.
You possess my narrow shoulders, and you wheeze because of dad. But you also wield words like a damn ninja, and you're as emotionally buoyant as a rubber duck. You'll carry all of this familial baggage, gifts, or burdens, depending on how you distribute the weight. Rest when needed. It is memories of these shared passions that fill my love tank. Starting this week, you'll be adding non us threads to your tapestry. Words and joys we won't share, but we rejoice in your weaving.
That Technicolor dream coat will be uniquely yours. And as you don your snazzy new outfit, might I suggest tucking a few family gems into your side pocket? Leave behind what doesn't fit or feels too heavy. Ideally, these pocket joys will fill your love tank when it needs a topping. you and as your path diverges from ours, may it sustain your journey. But also take snacks and a light jacket because I didn't raise an amateur.
You have landed in this enchanting place. You have earned this golden ticket. If you use it wisely, it will take you where you need to go, even if the destination isn't clear yet. Meanwhile, we will cheer at your successes. Encourage you in unsteady moments. And always say we knew she could do it. We always knew.
That was beautiful, Shali. How long has it been since you wrote that? Oh gosh. Well, sh you know, she's in her senior year of college. So this was four years ago. And it's kind of strange looking back at it now because I I remember sort of being tearful when I was writing it and it gives me a different kind of tearfulness now because I I think a lot of the fear that I had when I wrote that letter
feels misplaced. I don't think fear was really necessary after all, which is kind of nice. How is she doing now? Oh, she's thriving. It's really been a most lovely chapter. She's a senior now and she's a English writing major. So she loves words and she has found just a wonderful environment to nurture that skill and it's a great path for her that I probably could have predicted from a young age, just because words have always been important to her.
Well, I wonder why. I would have loved to see her face when when she got to read that letter from her mum. What did she say it was like for her? How did she react? Oh, she was very kind and and she's a very empathetic soul. And so I I I think in reading that she saw a little bit about. the reassurance that I might need. And so she was very kind to include us in so much of that.
early adaptation and she would give us updates and things that just would let us know that she was doing okay and that's all we really needed was just that reassurance. So how how have you been able to keep that tapestry that you referred to? even as she adds to it in a different direction, how have you been able to keep that closeness with the three of you and one one side of the country and her on the other? Well technology sure does make it easier. I think about
when I was in college with my parents, I would just call on Saturday and and the long distance costs were so expensive that we would have a very brief interaction and that would be it. And now just a little you know, sent text during the day that just lets you know that you're thinking of one another is just it's so wonderful. And now it's kind of neat because she will send me one of her essays and go, hey mom, will you read this? How does this sound? And so it it's nice to see how she's
maturing as a writer. And not only that, but she really likes sending me things to get my feedback on it. So that that's kind of our our current love language. And it's a little bit of it of a precarious path because now she'll send me things that are presumably fiction, but as a mother, I will see parts of it being thinly veiled memoir. And I say, Oh, I I I have to honor that trust and I'll say, Oh, I
I hope the protagonist has found a way to work through that trauma and she'll say, Oh mom, it's all fine now, it's all good. And I'll say, Oh, thank God. Dej, jag skulle ju köpa några nya palvställt i lagret. Det kanske blev lite mer grejer. De hade ju allt, man hade en skribord, jag köpte en sån, och kontorstolar, och så hade de en skit snygg typ. Vi har inredning för hela arbetsplatsen. Välkommen till AI-Prasser.
Dej, jag skulle ju köpa några nya palsfält i lagret. Det kanske blev lite mer grejer. De hade ju allt, hade en skrib, jag köpte en sån här, och kontorstolar, och sen hade de en skitsnygg tippkontrol. Vi har inredning för hela arbetsplatsen. Välkommen till AI Produktion.
Again, I'm just thinking back to when I was at university and I would to speak to my mum I'd have to get these um like calling cards. So you'd pay a certain amount and then you get a calling card and then you'd go to like a landline. Um And like punch in numbers and codes and then that's how I'd get to speak to her for, you know, five pounds or ten pounds worth of
of time it took it took effort, didn't it? Yes. Yeah. Yeah. And I can remember how my mom, you know, I would call and, you know, get those little few minutes on Saturday and as any self-absorbed teenager, I would unload whatever trauma was going on in my life. And then hang up. And then my poor mom would worry about it for the whole next week. And I would call her the next Saturday and she would say, Oh, I've been so worried. You know, how how how is that situation?
And I wouldn't even remember it. I'd be like, oh no, that that worked itself out a few minutes later. I'm I'm fine. And my poor mom would have to carry along that worry for a week. Yeah. I I get more of a real time update from my daughter now. And that's for better. That's that's so great. And I was thinking just about what it's like to not have your kid. with you every day. For example, with my kids, they're young. They're eight and four but I know where they are.
point of the day, you know, because they're young. Right. But with you, your child is away. And it made me think every stage of parenthood for me has been different. It's like the baby's born and then you think you've figured stuff out for like the first two months. It's like no, another level of parenting is unlocked and it Hello, welcome to regression. And your baby's not sleeping and then you have to figure that out. And then it's a little bit more than a little bit.
It's fine for a few years, even one or two years, and then it's hello. These are the terrible twos. You know what I mean? Exactly. So what's it like? having her away from you and not maybe not speaking to her for two days, one day because she's having fun or she's busy or whatever. Exactly. It's very humbling because I I think every stage has its kind of challenges and rewards. I I feel like those first 18 years for me and I I think for most parents is
There's this certain amount of vigilance that's just present all the time. And I think you better brace yourself because then when you get to teenage years, there's a different kind of vigilance you have of, you know, what you let into your child's life and you know who
who you say yes you can go over to that party or or those kinds of things and it maybe not so much police, but maybe crossing guard. You have a certain kind of regulation of what you're letting into your kids' life or trying to prevent, you know, problems and I don't think I realized that vigilance.
It's a little bit tiring. And so I think I would reassure parents that this next stage, there's a little fear, but it's kind of nice. You you say, all right, I've loaded them up with all the tools they need. And that vigilance, that awareness can just be turned down a few notches. And you kind of can trust the universe to catch your child and everything will be okay. And I
I find that to be a surprising joy that I didn't anticipate. I've never heard that before. No one has ever said it to me in that way. But that hypervigilancy is it's exhausting. I don't know about it. It's exhausting. Yeah. friends that are sort of in the same boat as you at the moment in terms of having
a child that's left for union. What what are you talking to each other about? Yes. It it it's very interesting. We I had a friend once tell me that if you're having worries and you haven't heard from them, the best thing you can do is Snap a picture of your family pet and send it to them because they always will answer that. You know, you you don't want to be up in their ear all the time asking them like, Oh, are you eating or have you done your laundry?
But if you can just send a picture of the cat, you'll always get an answer back from that. Just to know that they're okay. So I I think about that sometimes. I think the biggest difference That varies from many of my friends' kids is a little bit more than a little bit. It seems to fall along gender lines. that the girl children seem to maintain a closer contact with mom than the boy children. I think moms of boys have to sustain themselves on fewer life updates.
Yeah, I was saying to our producer Lucy that I saw this something on Instagram where it said that texting your teenage child, a boy teenage child is like dating someone that doesn't want to date you. So you will You'll say all these things and you'll profess love and ask them if they've had something to eat and if they're okay and it would just be like one word answers like yes, no, thanks. From our son we get a lot of yep.
All we get is yep. Zoe's will like go on for pages and and Sam sends us yep. Just talking about those relationships. You know, when you talk about well, you've alluded to giving her space and, you know, turning down a few notches that vigilancey that you had, you know, while she was back home with you. How has she taken to how you are treating her being away, you know, the level of trust you're giving her and the space? She has really thrived. I think she has found a
lovely tribe of people and the and the school that she goes to has been a lovely fit for her. And I think it's really neat when we go visit her on campus. And this may be a life hack for parents who are at this stage of parenting. When you go visit your kid at college, The best thing we found
is that you kind of want to sequester your child away and soak them up as best you can. But we have found that if you can just invite any of their friends that are interested in having a free meal along for dinner. That is the most magical rewarding time because For one thing, college kids are hungry and poor and they love a free meal, but there is no better peephole into your kids' existence than sharing a dinner table with half a dozen of their friends.
And seeing that tribe and that community they have created for themselves. And so that's kind of fun. It's really rewarding to see your kid in their native environment and you know, doing their thing. It's it's very rewarding. It sounds like, you know, you and your husband you figured out a way that you wanted to parent your kids and you have done so. And it sounds beautiful, but in the letter you say it wasn't always
you know, hugs and kisses. Sometimes it must have been like eye rolls and doors slamming. Um salute And you talk about peace talk negotiations. What was that like? What was she like growing up? And what what were you struggling with in terms of The different stages in her life, perhaps. I think those middle school, junior high years. Those are interesting chapters because they don't even know who they are really. And so they'll they'll kind of try one thing and another thing. And so
A lot of the things that she would ask permission to go do, I would be the, oh no, no, that's that's not for you. We don't feel comfortable with that or you know, you y you yeah, we don't think you should go to that place. I don't know. I I I was probably a little too strict, but My sweet husband would often kind of be the go between to kind of calm us both down. And sometimes it would require that. And sometimes we would just retreat to our corners for a while and then
You know, we always would watch Great British bake-off together. That was often our kind of come back together time or um Pride and Prejudice. We we very much enjoyed that. But I look back now with that we would sometimes get crossways with one another, but at the end of the day it seemed like the clouds would move on and it wouldn't loiter too very long.
The letter is to your daughter, obviously, but what is different about what you'd say to your son, perhaps if he was going away? That's a very good question. Sam is wired up so differently than our daughter. He is he is more of a numbers guy. Um, she's always been more of a word gal. So they're wired up completely differently, which kind of involves different parenting.
skills. And I I think that's well and you could speak to this. When you have more than one kid, parenting to me feels a little bit Swiss Army knife and for different kids you pull out different tools and at different stages you can put that one tool away and then pull out a different one. When you say that about having a son and a daughter, it I sometimes feel like I have, you know, Mary Poppins is bad. And I reach in and I didn't even know I had
this tool in there and look there it was the whole time um I never thought I'd need it. I didn't know it was in there. But look, it's working, so Exactly. Exactly. Have you written other letters, by the way? I haven't done anything else in letter form. I'll kind of write some, you know, thoughts here and there, but I haven't done much else than that. Why do you think you did it then that that one time?
I just had a lot of emotion and I had to put it somewhere. I knew that saying it to her ears directly would be harder for her to process than if I just had it down on paper and letting her read it at her own leisure when she had the had space to process it during a quiet time. Um and I knew that when we would be looking at each other face to face as she was heading off to her dorm room, it wouldn't stick.
I think it's so beautiful to write to your children. As a parent, I think putting into words and being able to see the words just does something where. It expresses beyond the I love you and I'll miss you. And the way you've done it as well. the very expressive way that you've done it and the imagery you've used.
Honestly, Shalid, I can feel what you were trying to say to her and I'm not your daughter. I but it's it's so beautiful. I don't think you should stop. I don't think you're done with letters. I hope that you will consider writing more. Thank you. And I think your daughter will cherish it. Yeah. Thank you so much for listening to this season of Dear Daughter. It's been another milestone for me. My son turned five and we finally had Coco on as a guest.
And and thank you to my guests who share their stories. I really appreciate them being open. I think my final thought about this season is that with milestones, ultimately, as much as they are to be celebrated and marked as moments of growth and success and change, we need to remember that they are moments. And we need to hold on to them and savor them. But we also need to remember that life happens in between the milestones. Playing with your kids and um we shouldn't lose sight of that.
Here's to you and your every milestone past, present and future. Thank you so much for listening to this season of Dear Daughter. If you've enjoyed this season, make sure you go back and listen to all our past episodes and subscribe and leave us a review wherever you get your podcasts. Dear Daughter is presented by me, Namulanta Combo, and produced by me and Julie Borg. The series producer is Lucy Burns. The editor is Claire Fordham. Mixed by James Beard. Theme music composed by Judge.
Hattie Nash is the best of the World Service. And John Mannell is a part of the product. commissioning editor. That's it. Bye. Extra, extra. Det var kul! och mer än tre miljöer. Ett spel från svenska spel för dig över 18 år. stödlinjen.se Jag skulle ju köpa några nya palpställd i lagret. Det kanske blev lite mer grejer. De hade ju allt, hade skribord, jag köpte en sån, och kontorstolar, och sen hade de en skitsnyggkonta. Vi har inredning för hela arbetsplatsen. Välkommen!