Legendary Peter Boyles joins Dan talking Denver radio history, JonBenet Ramsey case - podcast episode cover

Legendary Peter Boyles joins Dan talking Denver radio history, JonBenet Ramsey case

Dec 18, 202436 min
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Episode description

Peter Boyles joins Dan for the first of two hours, welcoming calls and breaking down his 28-year analysis of who killed young JonBenet Ramsey on Christmas night 1996.

Transcript

Speaker 1

This is Dan Capless and welcome to today's online podcast edition of The Dan Caplis Show. Please be sure to give us a five star rating if you'd be so kind, and to subscribe, download and listen to the show every single day on your favorite podcast platform.

Speaker 2

Clear off the mantle. Can it be an award winning show today? Glad you are here?

Speaker 1

Eight five five four zero five eight two five five the number you are going to want to use that number today? Eight five five four zero five eight two five five text d A N five seven seven three nine. We've never had a day like this. Peter Boyles in studio for two hours. If you are new to the planet, and Pete, you've seen all these drones out there, so we may very well, we may very well have Can somebody adjust Pete's audio?

Speaker 3

I got I'm getting a KOA feed I think or a news phone? Okay, apologize you sure that's our system here? Could that just be Pete's superpowers pro that is wild?

Speaker 2

Yeah? Yeah we are.

Speaker 1

Pete is actually getting a Haowa feed and is that which is which is only fitting?

Speaker 4

Right?

Speaker 1

Because how many years did you do on KA I can't remember, Yeah year, it was a lot of years. So hey, yeah, there were you know, all those all those drones flying around everything else. So we may very well have Martians in the audience. If we do, and you are new to the planet, then then Pete boils one of the true icons in Denver radio history. And we were just talking about it off air. Pete kind of rained and ruled from this very studio for twenty three years.

Speaker 2

Is that right?

Speaker 3

I'm worked here and it's you different wallpaper? Really yeah, you wouldn't know. Well, no, man, it's that's changed. But the rest of it, all the setups.

Speaker 2

Everything, Danny.

Speaker 3

I mean, it's first of all, thank you for letting me come back in here and spend a.

Speaker 2

Couple of hours. Well, thank you.

Speaker 1

It's like you know, thanking a guy for accepting a winning lottery ticket. I mean, And all those years at KOA, how many years at KOE And that's where you and l Berg met, right.

Speaker 3

When Berg and I med a k wb Z, the mother of all talk show hosts. It was there was there was once a very small, five thousand watt directional daytime radio station kwb Z on West Princeton Avenue off of South Broadway. And would he Page worked there? Mike Rosen worked there. Wow, I worked there. Berg worked there. I mean, any number of guys that you would recognize their names today. And I always dubbed it to like Saddam member Saddam and the mother of all battles.

Speaker 2

Yeah, so that was the mother of all talk radios.

Speaker 1

How did they attract so much talent to a station with less power than my teeth?

Speaker 3

Because no one took talk radio seriously? Talk radio really doesn't come into its own And I'm writing about this right now. First of all, a lot of credit must be given to Rush Limbaugh. Uh. Yeah, he Limbaugh changes the face of what we do for a living. But no one took us, no one, No one took us seriously. A matter of fact, Back to the uh to the

Ramsey case for a moment. If you recall, I was shown the ransom note, not the copy of the ransom note, before anyone could see it, and I made the mistake of saying on the air that I had seen it, only to be to be subpoened.

Speaker 2

What could go wrong? What could God? What could go anyhow?

Speaker 3

So I was in Jefferson County Jail, Jefferson County Jail, Jefferson County Courthouse, and they were arguing whether or not a talk show host had a press shield if we had a First Amendment protection, and of course now we do. But then the prosecutors who wanted to put me in jail because I wouldn't talk, wouldn't say who had showed me the note, and they said, we're going to put you in jail, and bringing on, come on, let's go.

Speaker 2

What more could you want? I think we both want to, right, Oh kid, Pete old famous.

Speaker 3

Sure, but that that was the That was a three day argument whether or not I had a press shield, and they granted me a press shield.

Speaker 1

Yeah wow, And you obviously you would have gone to jail. You would have stayed there as long as he needed to, right.

Speaker 2

How long do you think they would have kept you? You know, I thought about that, and I knew that we.

Speaker 3

Both knew the share is too much trouble, and I thought this is gonna be one of those al Capone goes to they put furniture in there, he gets a steak, right, Yeah, No, I was willing to go, oh yeah, and you would have if you've never met Pete would have stayed there.

Speaker 1

He'd still be there. You know, we could be thirty years later, He'll be there.

Speaker 3

Funny icing on the cake. I went to a fundraiser with Frank DeAngelis and Tom Tank Cradle, two of the greats, and I'm in a child line getting barbecue and a little guy guy came up to me said you remember, And I said, I apologize, but do I owe you money? And he said, I'm the guy that wanted to put you in jail.

Speaker 5

Wow.

Speaker 2

The prosecute was the prosecutor.

Speaker 1

Wow?

Speaker 2

And I one defended on Yeah, you do me a favor. Yeah. How much was all that publicity you got for that worth?

Speaker 1

I mean, because again Pete built such a huge audience, such a devoted following.

Speaker 2

Stuff like that too. Oh well, we had a fun run until it ended.

Speaker 1

You know, don't you wish I would I ever tell you about how that ended, because Craig and I had it must have been seven plus years. Oh, and I get a call for management one day. Good friend of mine remains a good friend of mine. Got a call for management and they said, hey, man, can you meet me over at Starbucks on the way into the show. Sure, yeah, all good, get there is you know this is going to be your last show? Well, Tomorrow's your last show.

But don't tell Craig because we want to tell Craigs. But no, it was a great run. But you are unique, truly, everybody would agree on that game. You are unique in the space in so many different ways. And you know, there are those handful of legends you can point to, right, who would you put in that? I mean, there's Rosen, there's you, there's some of the guys that I came in afterwards. But some of the giants.

Speaker 3

Oh, you know, remember it's in its infancy and no one really knows what it is. It hasn't taken shape, it hasn't taken form. It's really a function of FM radio. When am Top forty radio, the music moves and the kinds of music moves, and it leaves this gap of top forty disc jockeys. So much like when television had been to television comes along Jack, Benny, Bob Hope, all the big names of radio move to television. So that

leaves a void. And then there's the big orchestras and they decided a big union dispute and that gets blown away.

Speaker 2

What do they do? Disc jockeys?

Speaker 3

And there's this legendary moment a guy named Jack Store and they're sitting in a bar in Kansas City.

Speaker 2

As the story.

Speaker 3

Goes, Jack Store realizes, as big as this juke.

Speaker 2

Box is, they're only playing thirty or forty different songs. Yeah.

Speaker 3

So that's the beginning of Top forty radio was when it was called store Broadcasting and he knew. So that spread like wildfire and they had Top forty.

Speaker 2

Then you had the guys that kind of talk like that. Remember those guys mounds and sounds and wax and welas they do that.

Speaker 3

Well, hey, strained voice and so those guys, why did they talk like that?

Speaker 2

Well there was a word for that. May I use it? And of course you can't. You're gonna use it anyway. But anyway, they were.

Speaker 3

Called puke p uk e jocks, okay, because they when they talk and the talk.

Speaker 2

It was all a Casey case imitation thing.

Speaker 3

Casey didn't talk that way. Casey was more of a straight ahead guy. But when you met the real Top forty guys and where you live in La, you know, they did that and they ruled until two things happened, the Warren Vietnam and Richard Nixon and Watergate happened, and Jimmy Hendrix was not going to be played on AM radio, but they took him to FM. So FM pushes AM out again. So now they're stuck. What do we do

with these signals? And somebody starts out with talk radio, and you know, some of the early talkers in California and of course New York City and Miami, Larry King and guys were making their making their bones. So they just said, well, these radio stations like this had a morning crew of hallan Arlie.

Speaker 2

You remember Poula Charlie.

Speaker 3

They were they were, they become Lewis and Flora Flora Wax and they've they become they become that. So they had this this big void and they want talk, and talk caught on.

Speaker 2

Yeah, and now.

Speaker 3

It's moving to podcasting. You know, it seems to be it's always in flux, yes, but you don't.

Speaker 2

Know where it is. And we've got to hit this break.

Speaker 1

When we come back for twenty one, Pete Boyles is going to tell you who killed John Benney rim right.

Speaker 2

Okay, we can tell yeah, okay, all right.

Speaker 1

For twenty one, you're on the Dan Caplas Show with Pete Boyles.

Speaker 6

And now back to the Dan Kaplass Show podcastay.

Speaker 2

Better than this. Pete Boyle's in studio with us for two hours the Icon.

Speaker 1

He's been in there about fifty years now in Denver, and he's had an impact that rinks up there with the top two three four people I think ever to be on air here, including Allenburg. Who we're going to talk about, Pete want to talk Ramsey's all things Ramsey? Sure, obviously there's some new developments on that front. But Pete Boyles was must do radio each and every day for so many decades for so.

Speaker 2

Many different reasons.

Speaker 1

But as well, thank you, but it was we had a few moments, you had decades long stretches, and Ramsey was obviously one big stretch of that. But let's just start at the end. Who do you believe killed John bann A Ramsey her mother?

Speaker 2

Okay? And what's your best theory on how all this unfolded? Well, because I know is it to do this show with you?

Speaker 3

One got my My Ramsey file and read the headline and I guarantee you that's not in the netflix.

Speaker 1

Okay, John ban A Ramsey murder grand jury wanted to indict parents. Yeah, and that's all been confirmed that's public information. Yeah, yeah, what's And obviously so many people listening, uh were very zeroing at the time or got interested in the story later and understanding this is all just all of our best theories that nobody can prove any of this factually. What's what's your theory as to how it actually came down?

Speaker 2

The little girl was in a.

Speaker 3

Excuse everything I'm going to say between now and the end of the show, she was in essence of show dog and the mother and.

Speaker 2

Her you're saying the parents' attitude toward Oh.

Speaker 3

Sure, and remember maybe remember Aunt Pam, remember pat In the history of this country, there's only been two sister teams to be Miss fill in the blank. One was Arkansas. Their back to back sisters were Miss Arkansas and West Virginia Patsy Ramsey and her sister. Her sister was Miss West Virginia as well, and they were I believe they were prepping that little girl, uh to do much.

Speaker 2

What they had done, maybe to go on to be Miss Miss America.

Speaker 3

Yeah. You and I have talked about the beauty pageant aspect of.

Speaker 1

This, and by all counts, Jeanbinnet was extraordinarily talented.

Speaker 3

She was all this and right, I mean every Yeah, we've seen enough. Well one of one of your many things that we've talked about. I remember one night over dinner where we talked about there seemed seemingly an endless supply of that little girl performing and you and you, you were inquisitive, and you said, where are all of these tapes coming from? Where are all these performances coming from?

It seemed to be every night on television there was another Jean Benet dressed up, doing another song, doing another routine.

Speaker 2

I don't know if you remember the conversation, but I'm not sure. I remember lunch time it is.

Speaker 1

And it's funny because Pete and I will be talking during breaks and I'll talk about these things like a joint, TV, a pair or whatever, and I'm thinking, wow, it is amazing.

Speaker 2

You remember all that. Well, a lot of things I don't remember.

Speaker 3

Yeah, but we ran up against lynn Wood, who becomes this defender of Donald Trump, and.

Speaker 2

Lynn Wood used to leave me.

Speaker 3

I don't know if the desk is still out there or not. And I said, why didn't Why wasn't I smart enough to keep those threats?

Speaker 2

That's what they were, threatening messages from lynn Wood he's voicemail. What would they say?

Speaker 3

He talked like, this is Lynn wood keep it up, you know, and I'm going to own you and words like that. But you challenged him, and you don't remember this. And you and I were doing somebody's television. We seemed to be doing some but he's television show every night and you called him. You called him on it. He said, if you want to sue somebody, and I mean the exact words aren't there, but you called li in what out? And he what a wild ride?

Speaker 4

You know?

Speaker 1

Truth is a defense and I I've always made it clear, Hey, these are just theories. I can't prove any of this. I'm trying to figure it out like everybody else.

Speaker 3

Well, they disliked us so much because if you recall the media divided. Remember there was Paula Woodward and there were this group of beloved by the Ramseys and if you remember they, I think it was in the Bolderado, but they they built a set and then they invited I don't know six or seven. I remember Paula being one of them and Patsy Ramsey. There was a stipulation that you could do. You could talk to the Ramses about anything except the.

Speaker 2

Murder of the little girl.

Speaker 3

An igh wise guide and said, well, we could talk to Patsy about the euro.

Speaker 2

Rex I mean right.

Speaker 3

And then they all huddled around to Ramseys and and it was Division Street. I mean, it wasn't just it was the Ramsey Mountain News was the Rocky Mountain News Channel nine. There's no forgiveness for the game. The game they're playing now was the venicea whaling?

Speaker 2

Oh my lord. Yeah.

Speaker 1

And I don't want to digress, but Polis coming out and saying that it's a figment of Danielle Cherinsky's imagination.

Speaker 2

And then you saw the story.

Speaker 1

Here's that headlines from the Post or Today's or police detain at least fifteen people after gang related kidnapping torture at edge of Lowry apartments. And the story goes on to quote law enforcement is saying it's it's TDA s Yeah, but Polis says, figment of Jirinsky's imagination.

Speaker 2

The Channel nine did as well.

Speaker 1

Before our two are over to day. I want to get your take on Jared Polis. I want to get your take on Donald Trump. I know we're going to disagree there, at least to an extent, I want to get your take on everything under the sun. But what's your take on this Netflix special on Ramsey.

Speaker 3

Now I'm doing something I accuse others of not doing. It's a book I haven't read. I've read the scripts, I've read the reviews. As I said, I do not the best of my knowledge believe that they say about the grand jury in nineteen ninety nine wanted to indict and this was the great work you know, Jeff Charlie Brennan. Oh, yeah, Charlie was a fine Yeah, yeah, great, definitely, and was pretty much the writer of the book Perfect Murder, Perfect Town.

It was Charlie Brennan. He still works for the Boulder Daily Camera. Somebody in that grand jury broke and I think you know more about this stuff, but I think it's called a runaway grand jury. And somebody came out from inside the jury and said, we wanted to indict them both.

Speaker 2

Now, these are.

Speaker 3

The people who sat there, and it was I think it was eight women and four men. Don't hold me to that, but they saw everything. They saw stuff you and I never even dreamt was there. They saw every bit of information and actually your client, man, whose life I think you saved, was can we talk about detectives.

Speaker 1

Oh yeah, what a great man, What a great man, Detective Steve Thomas. I did not save his life at all, but I think I was privileged to be asked to represent him, and I.

Speaker 2

Think what a great man. They were after him, They were after a lot of people.

Speaker 3

And then I think a few years went past, and then I think four four pages got out that they wanted to indict both John and Patsy for the murder of that little girl. And I amazed if Netflix puts that in there.

Speaker 2

And can you hit this break?

Speaker 1

Pete Boils kind enough to spend two hours in studio with us.

Speaker 2

You're up for call stupid question. It's Pete Boils to take radio five four zero five.

Speaker 4

Keep you on the.

Speaker 1

Again that we do have a seven second delay. Get but usually that's for the callers, not the guests, but but here maybe for the guests text yeah, both of us five.

Speaker 2

That's right altogether, you're on the Dan Caplis Show.

Speaker 6

You're listening to the Dan Kaplis Show podcast.

Speaker 1

And Obvious Icon in Denver and Colorado Radio. Pete boyles in studio for two hours with us this afternoon. We've started out talking about the Ramsey case. We have much more ground to cover the phone lines. Let's go start Jane Castlerock, Colorado with Gary are On with Dan Caplis and much more.

Speaker 2

Important than that Peak Oils. Welcome he Gary Grevin.

Speaker 4

How are you my two favorite talk show hosts?

Speaker 2

Wow?

Speaker 5

Heee.

Speaker 4

I had a question for you. What's your take on I saw, you know, one of them one hundred and one different you know, Ramsey Specials or not Ramsey but a jominator. Yeah. Over the years, and they painted a picture for potentially the brother Burke being the murderer.

Speaker 2

Remember he's ten years old at the time.

Speaker 3

Yeah.

Speaker 2

And one of the.

Speaker 3

Obvious lives of the Ramseys is that John and Patsy had been at the whites House fleet in Priscilla White and they had brought her home quote a sleep and they had a jeep wagoneer whitewood sided jeep wagoneer.

Speaker 2

Well.

Speaker 3

Burke Ramsey's favorite dessert was pineapple and cream and they always kept it in the refrigerator. Well, according to John and Patsy, that they had carried the little girl upstairs to her bedroom, dressed her for you know, undressed her, dressed her for the evening for sleep wear, and that

she had never woken up and had never well. When they got to the autopsy and they get into her stomach, they find pineapple and cream in her stomach, which would indicate that she was awake when she came into the house and she did have something to eat, and what she ate was Burke Ramsey's favorite pineapple and cream. Now that leads people went to there's a there's a theory out there, and we shoot the dice right that she had the two marks on her neck that I think

Paula Woodward called a stun gun. Actually, if you take his toy train, Burke's toy train, you'll find that those were the matching marks for a cutolved. You know, here's here's the part about Burke Ramsey. It's it's stunning. We know that when Patsy calls nine one one, she doesn't hang up, and the tape continues to run. And according to people that have heard the tape, and I have not, you can hear John.

Speaker 2

Say go back to bed, that Berke was awake.

Speaker 3

And now why wouldn't you say, I know how much I love my children and your children, all of us, But why won't you say to that boy, did you hear anything last night? Did you see your sister? Did anybody come upstairs last night? Did you see anything?

Speaker 2

Not a word. They just tell him to go back to bed. Is this before John Benny was found?

Speaker 3

Yeah, before before they knew where she was. But according to Pete Boyles, but she was before her body was found. Remember this is early. She Patsy claims to have come downstairs. She's dressed identically because she was the night before at the Whites, and the Whites have pictures of Christmas night at their house, and she has on makeup and she has on a red sweater and black pants. She answers the door UH to the cops dressed exactly the same. She's never changed clothes and.

Speaker 4

But validity to the fecal snaring and the like the mag light flashlight and the the flashlight with.

Speaker 3

The flashlight was wipe clean. In fact, Patsy's fingerprints are not even on the ransom note. Patsy's You can almost like if you visualize a mortar. She would wipe the batteries and then drop them back into the UH into the cell the battery. The the weapon was was the cell phone. Cell phone was the was it was the three or its four celled flashlight. It was on the counter, and it was white, It was wipe clean. There was not a fingerprint either on the batteries. The lenses are

on the shaft of the of the flashlight. And in fact Patsy's fingerprints weren't even on the ransom note, and so her claim to have picked up the note off the stairs kind of goes out the window. But the other part of his And I always thought about this too. If if my daughter were gone and my son woke up, would I not say to him, did you see your sister? Did you see anybody in the house? Did you hear anything? Where did she go?

Speaker 5

No?

Speaker 2

John told the kid to go back to bed. Yeah, strong points.

Speaker 4

They painted a picture that the brother and sister got into an argument and he just went into summer age, and that he had at one point smeared feces all over the house and just you know, potentially kind of said that he had possibly some sort of mental health issues and then that was possibly kind of his breaking point.

Speaker 3

It would have been very hard to be burke. Frankly, I've thought about that. I mean, your sister is the darling she's the she's the show dog.

Speaker 4

Attention, all the clothes, she got everything.

Speaker 3

Yeah, yeah, and you're going to say something, Daniel, Oh no, No, Gary appreciate the call.

Speaker 2

Thank you, my friend.

Speaker 1

Want to try to get all the callers in.

Speaker 2

My own take on this.

Speaker 1

Everything I've ever seen, I've never seen anything that that made me believe that either Burke or John Ramsey were involved in a crime against this this little girl. And I've always had a theory that you've always disagreed with.

Speaker 2

Yeah, I know the night we had the disagreement.

Speaker 1

Yeah, And I do want to run that theory by people in a bit, because I still think it's a pretty strong theory. But I'm the first to say I simply don't know. At this point, I can't prove any of this, but but I know that this is a case. And why Pete in the last minute or two we have before breaking, I want to squeeze it Downe from Colorado Springs. Then we'll get to other callers and textures.

Why do you think this particular heinous crime is captivated in America American in a way that very few others have.

Speaker 3

My answer is your answer, unlimited tapes of this little kid performing the tapes themselves, and Carol McKinley and I attempted to go to one of these pageants and they id'd me in about two seconds.

Speaker 2

You beat it.

Speaker 3

But there seems to be unlimited amount of performing art in some ways you can compare and contrast us to OJ. I think there's a lot of OJ in this, but I think she was such a beautiful little girl, an unlimited performance behavior of the parents.

Speaker 1

Yeah, when you get to okay, why does this with so much awful crime in America, why does this captivate America this way? OJ, You're right, that same question arises there an easier starting point, right because you've got O. J.

Speaker 2

Simpson, sure, a pro heisman, et cetera. Did you win the heisman? I can't remember, but he was all that.

Speaker 1

But with this, obviously none of these people were famous, famous before, et cetera. So I've always believed that you're right, I mean, without the videos to fuel things. But also, you know, the wealth of the parents, Boulder, Colorado, the obviously you know, very talented young lady, all of that. But it's still even today, Oh sure, even today, Oh where you're from, man coll right, somebody will mention the John Benet Ramsey case and.

Speaker 2

It's almost been thirty years.

Speaker 1

Yeah, let's try to get Don in here from Colorado Springs with Pete Boyles on the dan KAPLA.

Speaker 4

You'll welcome done.

Speaker 7

Hey, guys, I just want to say I agree with Peter earlier about the major markets embracing news.

Speaker 5

Talk and all of that.

Speaker 2

But I mean I said to Peter.

Speaker 5

One time, and you disagree with me that Denver was kind of ground zero for the news talk format. Maybe not, but I will say it's probably a middle market at the time, or smaller market than though that was a good breeding ground for news talk. I mean KLA dropping music, kwbzy, you, Mike Rosen being on that station, in the other stations trying when kwbzy bout out, So, I mean, you really were one of the vanguards of Denver talk radio. And like I said, congratulations to you all.

Speaker 2

You're kind. Hey, don don't you think part of it?

Speaker 1

And Pete, don't you think part of it is just like in so many different areas, I mean, Colorado is such a beautiful place to live. It just seems to attract top talent in lots of different fields.

Speaker 3

But we're also a feeder of the city of the format is a feeder. But if you look at the timeframe that the caller is talking about, it's on fire in New York, it's on fire in Miami, it's doing very well in Washington.

Speaker 2

D c LA started off. I mean, were there.

Speaker 3

It's an explosion of a new format because the old formats are failing.

Speaker 7

Yeah, and the Constantine birth help both Triple A. Although you have Kingkin Portland, Oregon and w X in Chicago very more KBCL, but Constantine was helpful in bringing the tiple A format in those stations together.

Speaker 2

Yes, that's very great call man. Hey, sure appreciate that. Thank you.

Speaker 1

When we come back again, Everything under the Sun with Pete Boyles, want to talk about some of the you know, current topics as well. I know there's plenty we disagree on there, which is always fun. We've had fun disagreeing for a lot of decades. That's some important.

Speaker 3

Yeah, that's the part that when we talked about what did happen?

Speaker 1

Yeah, and I'll run my theory by you, because again, just a theory can't prove it, but I still think it's it's probably the most viable theory. So We'll start by disagreeing about that. Pete boyleson studio. You're on the Dan Capla Show.

Speaker 6

And now back to the Dan Taplas Show podcast to the planet.

Speaker 1

Pete, one of the iconic figures in the history of Denver media, let alone radio, and just to be able to sort of tap his memory lane here is a blast and again over the decades, we've agreed on plenty, disagreed on plenty, but just always enjoyed doing it with each other. Eight five to five for zero five A two five five the number text d an five seven

seven three nine if you want to talk to Pete. Pete, quickly my theory, because I know we have callers, we have textures, all sorts of things going on here, and I want to get to some of these current.

Speaker 2

Issues with you.

Speaker 1

I want to get your take on Trump, the next Trump administration, on Polis, on the state of Colorado politics. Just after the top will have poll results in the Democratic Party on who their favorites are for governor now that Polis is finally leaving. But quickly my theory, and I know you disagree with it. My theory can't prove it, don't know it to be true, but it's it's my best take on what happened, just following the evidences I know it is is that, and believe me, I get it.

You know the evidence a lot better than too. I note that you have a job, you have a life studied it in such depth. Here's my quick take. The movie Ransom is out at the time. Remember that Mel Gibson Ransom, this handsome, successful CEO type whose child is kidnapped and mel Gibson takes on the kidnappers, engineers this successful return becomes a world famous hero. So my theory is that Patsy Ramsey wanted John Beny to be famous, and that Patsy Ramsey arranged a fake kidnapping of John Benay.

The intent was that she would be held safely. Patsy would then safely engineer her return. I don't think John Ramsey was involved in any of this, and that something went wrong in the execution of that and the child was badly injured and then maybe killed to cover it all up, but that it was planned as a fake kidnapping with John Beny to be returned safely at some point.

Speaker 2

One piece of.

Speaker 1

Evidence I'd cite in favor of that is and you may say this is all bs, but who is the woman one of the books.

Speaker 2

One of the books talked about.

Speaker 1

A woman close to the family, maybe a family member, who said that Joan Beney had told her that her parents had told her, maybe her mama told her that she was Santa Claus was going to pay a special visit to her late on Christmas night. So that that, you know, supports that theory in my mind if it's true, because Joan Beney is then being prepared for some third party to be introduced into all of this.

Speaker 2

So that's my theory.

Speaker 3

I'm sticking to it well, and that eventually becomes Santa Claus mc reynolds.

Speaker 2

Is there a name out of the past.

Speaker 3

Yeah, But the biggest fact is she's wearing the same Christmas sweater from the night before, with her makeup still on when she answers the door for the cops, and the note, by the way says, if we so much as see the cops, she's dead. She never wants to sleep the night of the murder, and she claims she went to bed and was asleep at the time of the murder. Patsy was very high maintenance, would have never been caught dead in the same outfit twice. She was

the last person to see John Benay awake. The bogus ransom note was found in the house. Was her personal notepad was hidden away in her drawer. The ransom note also was in her handwriting.

Speaker 2

Just flipped. She is who she is.

Speaker 3

And it was never a who done it. It was when the and I wrote a column was called it. They had a phone tree, and the one thing about the oj residents was they kept everybody out, And so Patsy and John started calling friends. They called Reverend Hoverstock, they called the Fernies, they called the Whites, the Rookie Denver Denver Bolder police were in there. Linda Aren't if you remember Linda and Linda Aren't. Was handed the dead body and put the body under the Christmas tree. The

crime scene has and I don't I'm with you. I don't believe John was involved, and I don't believe Burke was. But I think there has to come a time in the middle of the night someplace where Patsy goes to John and they make a corporate decision. And I think we said it either on the air or off there. But in that dark room I think there's a what we used to go a foot locker. She was in there, and so when they hunted in the house, they couldn't

find her. But when finally Linda, Linda Arndt says one more search, John blines down the stairs, followed by I think Fernie was behind him and fleet White was behind him, and he screams. And this is my theory where John can see in the dark, and I think he opens the suitcase. And when they bring her upstairs and they hand her to Linda Aren't, and Linda Aren't puts her corpse under the Christmas tree. And then the Ramsays have the first of their lawyers. I don't know when they

get hal Hadden, but they eventually end up with hal Hadden. Now, and they were going to leave town. He called this pilot and said we're leaving town. And I think it was fleet White that confronts him with John my god, and they let her spend the night. Now this is an irish thing, but she spends the night in the

morgue by herself, her body. Once you have been sitting next to your daughter in that and there's just so many psychological it's and pieces to this but you know, they shopped for light detector tesk givers.

Speaker 2

They did everything.

Speaker 3

And in fact, here's the question that you ask And someone asked me this and it was on one of those final shows that we.

Speaker 2

Did, and I said, what was it? You would really like to know, Peter?

Speaker 3

And I said, I would really like to know what Patsy Ramsey's dreams. We hear every night the Devil must count wow and dancing her dreams. The case that is a acrypt the nation to this day, like very few others have. The Ramsey Case and Pete Boyles covered it from this very seat for so many years.

Speaker 1

They'll stay with us another hour. We'll talk about everything on its sun. Take your calls on the Dan Capler Show

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