In American ways, we fight for truth and justice, and no fight for truth and justice more important than the fight to save these innocent human lives that are being destroyed in such.
Massive numbers through abortions.
So we bring you something I think particularly valuable to you today, and that is the medicine. We're going to have a factual, clinical discussion about the medical realities of prenatal biology and abortion procedures and drugs. And very kind to be with us today for that is doctor Catherine Wheeler. And she's a hero in the life movement because she used to perform abortions and then she obviously saw how wrong that is and had the courage to step up
now and defend life. And doctor thank you for being with us. Obviously, you bring to the table a very unique credibility given your history on the other side of this issue, but also medical knowledge, so you can just lay out for people that the clinical medicine on this and you know will warn folks who may have young kids in the car, et cetera, that because doctor Wheeler is going to be telling the medical clinical truth about abortion,
it is going to be deeply disturbing. In a times graphic, Doctor welcome back to the Dan Kapla Show.
And thank you so much for taking on this issue. And it's such a privilege to be with you and your listeners.
Thank you, well, thank you.
It's of great value to all of us because no matter where somebody is on this issue and what they think the quote policy should be, it's so hard to get just the medical facts.
So why don't we start this way?
And then I hope this will be a regular segment, but but could you just start with just prenatal biology?
How does all this work?
Yeah, thank you for bringing this up. You know, as I talk to people like abortion is a completely add turn to people, So I appreciate the opportunity because we're really talking about only two important things. But they're the things that, oh I'm so sorry for the noise. They're the things that they don't want us talking about. Who is in the uterus?
Is that dinner?
Sorry? No, I'm actually in a place that was super quiet and.
We happen to me a time.
Oh yeah, So they don't want us to talk about the baby. They want us to think this is not a human being, that it's not alive. It's like all the reasons why it's okay to take the life of a human being. Well, it's not a baby yet, it's not alive yet, it doesn't look like us, it doesn't do all the things that we do as adults. Well, they don't until they're in their late twenties, you know, That's when we finally finish maturing. And so it's anything they can do to get us to not talk about
the baby. And the second part is they don't want you to think about what's procedure is and what the intention of the procedure is. And the procedure, as the CDC says, is an intervention that does not end in a live birth. So the intention is to not have a live birth. Well that's kind of a twisted language. The goal is at the baby's dead for whatever reason. So I think that's the most important thing. And we
get so distracted by everything else. And I believe that's intentional from the abortion lobby and industry is to yet us to talk about anything but what we're really talking about, which is abortion. And so to me, because I've been the person sitting in that seat and doing that horrific act. To me, when I hear the word abortion, I think about the baby, what it was like for the baby to try to get away from me, what the procedure is. And for most people, if you ask them what an
abortion is, they say it's a choice. It's you know, we care about women, and people who care about women think that she should a choice. So I'm hoping that people will understand to the two things, who the baby really is. The fact that the baby actually is alive from the very moment of experm fusion or fertilization is what we would call expo fusion. And that literally is true. This is an independent human organism one cell at first, but just miraculously has all of its organs developing within
three or four weeks from a single cell. I mean, what a miracle is that? And it literally is a heartbeat at six weeks. Every organ, every major organ is present by six weeks of pregnancy, so I mean, it's
really an incredible miracle. From the very beginning, you have an independent organism from the mother that just happens to be in a safe place basically in the mother's incubator that she is providing what that baby needs until the baby can be born and can be able to suck food and digest food and do those things independently, but always an independent organism, so we always have a human being. And I think we would all agree that it's always wrong to take the life of an innocent human being,
and that's what abortion does. And so therefore abortion is wrong because of the life of an innocent human being, no matter the circumstance. This is a human being, just like us and doctor two other human beings matters, Yes.
Doctor Catherine Willer, our guests. So let's start from the beginning here, because I'm sure there are some folks listening saying, well, wait a second, how can it clinically be a quote independent organism when at that point you know that the life is dependent on the mother. So what do you mean by the term independent organism?
So independent organism means that the functions of the organism are united for the benefit of that organism. And so even from the moment of fertilization, you have chromosomes coming together in within hours for the benefit of that little psycho, the single cell human being. It's already making proteins, getting ready for the very first cell division. It's miraculous. So it's been a day and a half. You have a day to a day and a half, you've got that
original organism becoming two cells and then becoming doubling. And so by the time you get to around the time of her missed period, you have cell differentiation, the beginning of organ formation. Like it's amazing, from one cell to that. And so all of the functions are for the development of that independent organism that has separate chromosomes from the mother.
And what the mother is doing is again providing nourishment, for providing oxygen, nutrients, for moving waste from the baby, is safe place that's protected from the outside world from harm as the baby.
Develops, Doctor Wheeler, our guests, Now, Doctor that goes to my next question when you say, and I know this is medically clinically correct, that human life begins at that egg sperm fusion, can you put some more meat on the bone there for us? How do we know as a matter of science that human life begins at that point, because as you describe, you're talking about a single cell organism at that point, So how can we clinically say that's human life?
Right?
So we can say that it is human life because first of all, there are human chromosomes and Secondly, they're not the mother's chromosomes, so half from the mom, half
from the dad. So a unique set of chromosomes that will never be repeated, and that those chromosomes then immediately start functioning, so all of the cellular functions, but all of it going into promoting the organism itself, the organism's growth, and then developing different types of cells that become all of our organs within an incredibly short period of time.
So the baby has to have a functional heart by five to six weeks from her last period, so five to six weeks of pregnancy, the baby has to be able to pump blood, or the baby's gotten big enough that it can't just passively diffuse nutrients and oxygen and waste back to the mother. It actually needs a functional cardiac system.
And so this point you made doctor about a unique set of chromosome set will never be repeated.
So is a clinical point.
Does that mean that this undeniably human life, this particular unique set of chromosomes, It means that individual will be gone from the face of the earth forever if it is killed or dies before it leaves the mother before or birth exactly exactly.
I think that's part for me, one of the really sad things is, you know, you tell people you can try again, your baby's not normal. You can have an abortion, and then you can try again for a normal baby, you know, so called normal, but never that child. This is a this is a once an eternity child that these chromosomes would come together from these two parents and combine in that way for that unique child.
And Doctor, when we come back from this break, would like to, I mean, we'll talk a bit more about prenatal biology, but then want to get into the clinical medical realities of abortion procedures, because I think so many people who support legalized abortion just don't understand the medical reality of those procedures.
So we'll be back shortly.
Doctor Catherine Wheeler, who used to perform abortion, she knows the truth about this clinically, and she's sharing it with you on the day Capital Show is now saving innocent lives, and she's here today to talk about an extraordinarily valuable piece of this discussion and this ongoing effort to save innocent human life, and that is to get into the medicine, the clinical medicine, you know what is that? The medical
clinical reality of abortion. So we started talking about prenatal biology, and there's certainly much more to talk about there, but wanted to go on now and at least in an outline form, to talk about the reality, the clinical reality of abortion, the procedures, the drugs, how it is conducted. So doctor, thanks for staying for the second segment, and can you just take the floor, And again warning to those who may have young kids in the car, the
medical reality of abortion is deeply disturbing. A lot of people wall that off they don't want to think about it, as they support legalized abortion, but the medical reality is graphic and disturbing, and that's what the doctor is about to describe.
So with that, doctor, please, the floor is yours.
So thank you, Dan, thank you for the opportunity to share about this. And it is hard because we are talking about how do we take the life of a living baby. So as you think about it, first there's medicine or drugs, and then secondly there are surgical procedures and they change. The surgical procedures changed essentially by how big the baby and the uterus are. Clearly, as the baby gets bigger, what works in the first trimester doesn't
work later. So I will start with surgical procedures, and in the first trimester up until about twelve to thirteen weeks, you can imagine the uterus about the size of basically filling the pelvis. Whole bowl of the pelvis is filled with the uterus by the end of the first trimester, and so the baby goes becomes only about two and a half ish inches overall, but very complex. By eight weeks, all of the organs are present and most of them are functioning. So we have now and bones are starting
to calcify. So early in the first trimester, what looks like essentially a straw that gradually gets bigger size. We call that a section you're rat is placed into the uter in cavity with suction applied here in the United States, usually with the machine, and so a very strong section at least ten times as strong as your vacuum cleaner in your home, and it literally tears apart the baby and pulls it through that section and the placentex. And
so that's the essential procedure for the first trimester. Now, once the baby and the uterus are out of the pelvis is starting to and the abdomen, you've now got a pretty good sized baby that keeps getting bigger. So by the time you're twenty weeks, the top of the uterus is at the belly button and then of course continues to grow upward to the ribcage and then outward. We've all seen the pregnant women, are been pregnant ourselves, some of us, and so now you have to say, well,
how do you get a baby that size out? And so in the second trimester that's done literally by tearing the baby apart. And so those are again surgical procedures. They try to claim that they're not surgical, but they are. And it's called a dilation in evacuation. So you're basically dilating the cervix starting the day before and then actually
using instruments. You break the bag of waters, you can reach the baby, and you're using instruments that are graspers and literally grabbing whatever parts closest to you, twisting and pulling, and so the baby comes out piece by piece, and you literally have to crush the baby's head to get the baby's head out, and then the parts are collected. It's the abortionless job to look and to make sure
all the major parts are accounted for. So you're literally counting arms, legs, looking at fingers, looking at the abdomen, and looking at the baby's head. And then you use a section a bigger suction canula or straw like thing that use to suck out the placenta that's remaining end. So that's a D and E. That's how it's most
commonly done in the second trimester. But now once you're over twenty two to twenty four weeks, you're getting pretty close to the rib cage and the baby is well calcified, really strong ligaments, and it's too difficult to do that.
The other part of it is once you get to these age where the baby can survive outside the womb, which these days is around twenty two weeks in a good facility with a high level nursery, now half of baby's if you just induce labor to get them out, which is now how you get them out as by inducing labor, which is a multi day procedure, so it's just like inducing labors. Of the goal is to have
a dead baby, not alive baby. So now if you just induce labor, about half of those babies in some studies even more will be born alive and they call that the dreaded complication. So what they want to do is to be absolutely sure the baby is dead. That's called feet aside, and they're now again playing with the words to make it sound better. They now call it induced cardiac asistely, which means the heart's no longer beating. We would call that dead, but they're trying to make
it sound better. So they first inject drugs into the baby it's most typical, or into the fluid around the baby. It's a horrific death for the baby. It's an overdose of very toxic drug. It's very painful. The babies have extreme activity during this because it's so much pain for them, and some of them, about five percent of them in big studies, will not die depending on how it's done.
Within twenty four hours and they repeat it again. The other way they kill them is to try to grasp the baby's cord and biblical cord and cut the cord and basically let the baby bleed to death. So they're all horrible procedures. But again this is a multi day procedure to get her cervix dilated enough that either the baby delivers or they use instruments to get the baby out once the baby's dead. And those again are very
they're dangerous for the woman. They're much more dangerous than and induced life birds, although they don't want women to know that. They mostly use first trimester data to try to convince women that they're not dangerous. But they are now moving from that and here in Colorado, abortions are done through the first trimester. They're legal. You know, it's kind of interesting that they'll say they don't the primester. Yeah,
so you'll hear them saying, you know, they're not really done. Well, we have almost five hundred last year.
Oh my lord, third trimester, third trimester abortions o.
Your viability after Okay, okay, so it's not a small number. It's more than an average of one a day, and the majority and they want you to believe that most of them have birth defects. And still that's a horrible way to die if you have a birth effect. I mean, the babies are not suffering in meter up. But it turns out more than seventy percent of them are actually completely normal. They're the same reason, it says first trimester again them, which is mostly financial and social reasons. So
those are the surgical ones. We haven't talked about complications, and perhaps in the future we can the medication or drug induced abortions.
Doctor may interrupt you before going to that category. We're up against our break. Can you stay one more segment? Of course, Doctor Catherine Wheeler a tremendous resource. She used to conduct abortions, obviously a medical doctor, and she's here to talk about the clinical reality of abortion, which doesn't get discussed often enough, and so many people who are pro abortion just sort of wall off. They don't want to know these medical truths. But we're going to pursue
the truth, find it and report it. She'll be back to talk about chemical as well on the Dan Capitla Show. Here on the Dan Capli Show Real Privilege, you have doctor Catherine Wheeler with us. She is a doctor used to perform abortion. She knows of what she speaks and we're talking about the clinical truth, the clinical reality of abortion, which so many people, particularly on the pro abortion side, are not aware of. So this started at five oh six.
We started with prenatal biology and then we moved into
abortion procedures of different types at different stages. And obviously the doctor is giving an overview at this point, it just talked about your point that most recent data about five hundred of these post viability abortions in Colorado be on that point where the baby could survive outside the mother, and so just talking about the nature of that particular horror and the number of those, And now would you take a second please and educate us all on these
chemical abortions now that constitute a significant percentage of the procedures involved in taking human life, particularly at the earliest stages.
Yes, thank you. So some would call them chemical abortions, the abortion industry would call them medical abortions. Others call them drug induced abortions. But we're talking about is most commonly a two drug regimen. The first one is called nifipristone and it is a progesterone blocker. Now, progesterone is an essential hormone of pregnancy to maintain the interface between the mom and the baby. Basically with a placentas developing
that supports the baby. So if you block progesterone, you lose the function of the placenta and the baby essentially dies of not getting oxygen or nutrients. So that's the goal of the first drug. Then anywhere from at the same time, more commonly one to two days later. A second drug is called misoprostol, which is a prostic land in most people that think about that as causing tramping, and it actually essentially causes leads to contract and expel
what's most commonly a dead baby. And that is, according to the FDA, approved until ten weeks of pregnancy. Now the risk of it goes up every single week of pregnancy, and now that we have been through COVID. During that time, it was used as an advantage to push so called telehealth or even ordering it online. It's no connection with a medical person, and so a lot of these women don't know how far along they are. And as I said,
the risk go up exponentially with every single week. So by the second trimesters about a forty percent that's four zero percent complication rate. So they're not getting they're not making sure they don't have an ectopic pregnancy, which is life threatening. It's when the baby hasn't arrived in the uterine cavity and then planted, so the baby implants outside of the uterus, most commonly in the Floakian tube. And it's one of the top causes of death in the
first trimester. So while it's not terribly common, it's about two percent of pregnancies, it's life threatening and you're supposed to, according to the FDA, have an ultrasound to make sure you know how far long you are and to make sure you don't have an ectopic pregnancy because it's life threatening. But people the system is now bypassing that for a lot of people. About seventy percent of abortions in Colorado are now done with these drugs, so that is very significant.
That's the new frontier for the abortion industry. Unfortunately, and their complication rates are about four times the rate of first trimester surgical abortions, with fifteen percent of women actually hemorrhaging and one in five having some kind of a complication. So they're not as safe as Thailan at all. They're actually much more dangerous than first trimester and the women having them experience really horrible, much more pain and bleeding
than they expect. So we're hearing a lot back from the women who believe that they're is safe at Thailand Alms very coercive.
And then going back to where we began the conversation about prenatal biology.
One way or the other, what you have.
Is an independent human life that that will never again exist on the face of the earth is killed. So this procedure, right, and doctor, you had talked at links earlier before I'm sure much of our current audience joined us about these second trimester abortions, these DNA abortions. Can you give us an idea at this point, how common that is, maybe how many a year there are in Colorado? And at what point that the baby feels the pain?
Yeah, So I thank you the way that you've framed it, because the point is we've got a living human being. So whether they feel pain or not, the point is we have a living human being. But it is definitely more horrific when they can feel the pain. And we now know and we know this through fidel anesthesia. We know this from babies who are born extremely early that they and from fetal surgery. We know that babies feel pain much earlier than what the major medical organizations claim.
Some of them claim not until middle of the second third trimester, some of them say twenty four weeks plus, but it's probably as early as twelve weeks that they're feeling pain. So you know, I think that's really significant. Ninety percent of abortions are done in the first trimester according to most recent data, and so somewhere in Colorado, it's close to four percent are done after the age
of viability. So in Colorado, that would leave somewhere in the vicinity of six to seven percent done in that earlier second trimester.
And I thought, how many abortions a year do you think are done in Colorado?
Oh, I wish I had that number still on the top of my head. It's my recollection is it's close to four thousand. Yeah right, what about weight percent coming from out of state?
Yeah right?
And just separate issue onto itself, horrible issue onto itself. But doctor, in the few minutes we have left, and I hope we do a regular visit on this on the medicine, just these medical realities, which I think is so helpful to so many people. Can you, from a medical standpoint to address a few of these things we often hear, such as from a medical standpoint to claim that more women will die if there's not unrestricted access to unlimited abortion.
Yeah, you know, that is such a long answer. I would love to spend a segment.
On you, Oh, okay, Well, let's save that for the next show and do a whole segment on it.
I think that's one of the biggest narratives. I would love to just talk about some of the narratives out there, because there's so many things that are meant to distract people from thinking about abortion and to think, you know, there may be circumstances when it's okay to take the life of a human being, and I think those need to be addressed. May I go back to the drug
induced abortions or chemical abortion? I would be remiss if I didn't say there are people who, if they change their mind, have an opportunity even after taking the first drug, if they haven't taken the second drug, and it's within seventy two hours, there's actually about two thirds of those babies can be saved by giving high dose natural progesterone.
It's the natural pedesterone, the same one that the mother would make, and it basically overcomes the block of the mifipristone drug on the progesterone receptors, and about sixty seven percent of babies will survive. And they can call a local pregnancy resource center here in Colorado. They've made it illegal except for one organization that immediately filed a lawsuit, and that's called Bella Health in Denver. So there are still opportunities in Colorado to potentially save your baby's life.
If that's you, and how sick to try to make saving the baby legal, right that the pro abortion movement's supposed to be a choice, and then the mother decides, no, I don't want to take that baby's life. Oh, you can't have that choice, says that the pro abortion movement. It's just it reveals what they really are. But doctors, so grateful for your time. Why don't we do this the next time we get together, which hopefully will be
in the next week or two. Let's address from a medical standpoint some of these other myths, such as abortion is essential healthcare, you know, which is the argument we often hear. But again, grateful for your medical expertise, grateful for your time, Grateful for your courage as someone who used to perform abortions, you know, in your professional career. To be now standing up for life and using your skills this way is just very inspiring.
Well, I think you know, I've come to realize that most people are deceived and they just don't know or haven't bought about it like I did. I hate the narrative. You know, it's just a hard decision some women have to make and it's just not true. So I love to be able to share and to answer questions and to help people to think it through more clearly than I obviously did.
Well, thank you, Thank you again for everything, and we'll look forward to the next conversation.
Thank you so much.
You take care of That is doctor Katherine Wheeler, And it's been to me one of the real, really cool things about the pro life movement the whole time I've been exposed to it, because I consider my mom to
have been really one of the founders of it. But how the biggest heroes in the pro life movement and within the movement, the way they're viewed by people within the movement are those people who had abortions and are now out there standing up for innocent life, and the people who conducted abortions like our last guest, and are now standing up for innocent life. They are true heroes of the movement. You're on the Dan Kapli Show.
It's amazing that music can do that.
Well, I picked that song one because it's an amazing song Stevien.
X Oh, it's so good.
Edge of seventeen, and it's just it's an age where the topic discussed in the previous three segments could be a very pivotal one in the young woman's life.
That is so true.
And by the way, what we did in the last segments, if you didn't hear it, I hope you get back to the podcast doctor Catherine Wheeler and she used to perform abortions. So this was a very clinical discussion for the most part about medical reality, so prenatal biology than abortion,
et cetera. Because what I've found, because I know so many people who are really really good people and they are pro abortion, and in so many of those cases, I find that they really have not opened their mind to simply the medical reality of abortion, right, because they just decide on a woman's choice and this and that and other kind of slogans out there, and it's easier, right,
It's easier in our society to be pro abortion. And so I just think it's so valuable to make available to people that the simple, undeniable, clinical medical reality of prenatal biology and abortion, because I think that that can do more to change hearts and minds than even the most of other arguments, because I just believe the vast, vast, vast majority of people in America are fundamentally good people across party lines, and that you know, of course, we've
all ended up in our different places in different ways. But if they get exposed to the truth, the medical truth about abortion, that's the best chance to shift, to shift their view, and then you know, shift who they vote for in all of that, so the innocent can be protected. And in fact, proof of my theory is where we're sitting right now with Roe having been struck down.
And the only way Roe got struck down.
It should have been because it was constitutional crap from day one. No matter where you are in the abortion issue row, as constitutional law was, any honest person will tell you just terrific. But beyond that, the only way Roe got struck down is because pro lifers, year after year, decade after decade, fought in the political trenches to get pro life candidates elected, and as a result, you finally got to the point where you had judges who were just going to.
Interpret the Constitution and not legislate.
You know who brought us back to that point where where yes, no, there is no constitutional right to abortion. You may feel that that abortion should be legal, you know, as Michael Bennett does, should be legal through all nine months up to the moment of delivery, if not beyond. I mean, you know that that's where most on the left are. You may be there, I hope not, but you may be there, but you would still have to
acknowledge there is no constitutional right to abortion. But the only way Roe got struck down was by and through these political victories over time. So the more people who learned the medical reality of prenato biology and abortion, well, the fewer people who will get abortions, the fewer people who will push vulnerable women of all ages to get abortions, and the fewer people who will vote for the people who want abortion to be legal through all nine months.
So that's why.
It's so valuable just to get the truth out there, and we've seen it Ryan right, Because the only reason we're at this point of success in striking dumb Roe, which is not the end of the journey but just a critical mountaintop that's been reached, is because of ultrasounds. Because over the years, so many people saw through ultrasounds that they had been lied to that in fact, this is, as a matter of science, human life that's being killed
through abortion. So ultrasounds blew up the big lie from the left about abortion being a blob of tissue this and that. And so through the courageous hard work of all these pro lifers over the years, match to match to people being able to see the science for themselves. Because Ryan, how often have you had a friend come up to you and show you the ultrasound?
Right? And how often have they said, hey, look at my fetus. Hi, who's ever said that? It's ridiculous?
He says that, right, Kelly, what did you say to people when you brought him the ultrasound?
So the first one I had was very little, It was it looked like a p and I put it up. I was working at a hotel at the time, and I put it on my door and I put a big sign over it that says my baby.
Exactly, my maybe exactly. And Dan Rode he says, oh, look at my fetus. No, it's my baby. The gen Z's are coming too, Oh man, it's amazing.
They're the most pro life generation, probably since the Greatest Generation. And right, now Charlie Kirk posted this on X those are eighteen to twenty one. Pole was just revealed they favorite Republicans by almost twelve points.
And this is a big issue for them, enormous.
I mean, you talk about the shifting political landscape in America and these young people, they are driving a big piece of it. People of color, of all ages are driving another.
Big piece of it, right, and so it is a beautiful thing to behold and one of.
I think a lot of different reasons to be optimistic about the future, even for Colorado. Maybe the toughest till the climb, one of the toughest, but that's a privilege, right, That's a great opportunity. Three or three someone three eight, two five five, write it down. Be with us tomorrow, God and management willing, we will join you at four oh six again tomorrow. Bryan tremendous job as always, and don't miss Ryan Show does a great show in the Denver market two to.
Four each day. Kelly, Human Sunshine. I hope you are back shining on us tomorrow on the Dan Kapla Show.