Hello, spooky friends. I'm John, your host. And welcome to another episode of Dairyland Frights, the paranormal podcast that covers everything spooky, creepy, and mysterious series in the midwest. And again, the great guests continue. It is 2024, and I am starting off hot with David from down the rabbit hole. Hello, David. How are you?
Hey, John. I'm doing great. How are you, sir?
I am doing great. So, people who I always call my spooky friends, they may not know a little bit about down the rabbit hole. So could you please tell everyone what it's about?
Absolutely. Down the rabbit hole is an Instagram, Facebook, x threads TikTok account that I created. Basically, I'm mostly on Instagram, but I just love the paranormal. I grew up loving the paranormal. I don't know if you guys are the same way, but if you have a conversation with someone and you start talking about ghost stories or haunted or anything like that, anything crazy, and you just have these long, drawn out conversations, that's what it's all about.
And so my account, essentially, I loved watching all these shows on tv. Discover Channel has a lot of the ghost stuff. It has a lot of the paranormal caught on camera. I love that show. But I kept finding these shows where there are these chunks of videos that I would not have watched by choice. You know what I mean?
Sure.
So I would see this one thing. Okay. There are lights in the sky, right? Ufos. I'm really interested in that stuff, but I'm more like, I want the visitation. I want the abduction stories. I want the good stuff, right. Unless it's something that's, like, miraculous in the sky. So I decided I'm going to create an account, and I'm going to find videos that I want to watch, and I'm going to share them. Right? And so that's where down the rabbit hole was born.
Yeah. And I want to tell you, my spooky friends, please check it out. It is amazing. David does a great job. Also, you said you have an assistant who helps you out. I want to do a call out for her. Is that correct?
So, I'm actually the Co host of one nothing podcast, and that is Amanda Goodwin's show. Because of down the rabbit hole, we found each other and her show, one nothing, our show, it's about we're talking animal tax, we're talking bizarre death, and we're talking true crime. And so you can find us out there on Spotify, anywhere you find your podcasts. It's a great show. We have a Patreon also feel free to join that five star reviews, guys, just like I leave for John right here. Do that business.
Yes, absolutely. And like I said, down the rabbit hole, you did a piece on one of my favorite presidents, Abraham Lincoln and Kennedy. The similarities, it's insane. Please check that. It's mind blowing. I mean, it's just unbelievable. So let's get into. I'll ask you maybe a little bit more once we get to the topic here. And I do my little teaser. David. But do you have. Maybe you don't have a personal favorite story, or maybe you do, and I'd love you to share that if you don't.
Is there a story you've heard recently or have had on your show or down the rabbit hole that's really affected you when it came to a paranormal fear?
Yeah, I definitely have one of those. I also have a personal story I can tell you.
Please share.
Let me start off with the one that has spooked me out the most. And it's called the pantry door ghost. Have you heard of this one?
No.
Okay, this is great. This is great. I have shared it several times because it's probably my favorite ghost story. Now, the interesting thing I'm going to say about this, it looks real. Now, I'm not a professional. I can't video tell if it's real or not, that kind of stuff. And it's really difficult to, if it was real, to prove it. I can't prove it to you, but you have a lot of people that come out and say, oh, that's fake, or whatever.
This one spooked me out because I would say two to three months afterwards, I would still think about it, especially if I got up in the middle of the night to go take a **** and go into my bathroom. And I have a glass shower thing.
I do, too.
Okay, so, great. Okay, here's the story. It is a pantry door in this house where this family lives. And the owner of the house, he would find every time he would come downstairs, the door would be open. When he knows it was shut, he knows he shuts that door. It's always shut.
Okay.
The door is a frame door with a glass center. And it's one of those, like, frosted glass with a little design that goes.
All the way down. Sure.
So this kept happening. And so he was curious as to what was happening. So he put a camera out there, puts the camera records the whole night. And I can't remember the exact time, but there was an exact time every night it would open. I think it was like three something.
Yeah. Right.
So he caught it on camera several times. So he decided, okay, I don't know why it's doing that. I'm going to lock it. So he changed the lock on the door to make it locked so no one could open it.
Yeah.
He records it and something is trying to open it, but it cannot open it. So one night he decides, I'm going to go and watch it at the time and see what happens.
Okay.
And so he's there. He's recording. This is really freaking cool. He's recording. It's trying to open the door.
Yeah.
And then there's like a two or three second stop where it stops, and then you see two little hands press up against the glass.
Oh, wow.
Two little hands, right. And you would think, that's it, man.
I'm out.
Right?
I'm out.
He goes up to the glass. He puts his hands to the hands.
Yeah.
And you can hear him say, it's cold. When he says it's cold, a face presses up right against the glass.
Yeah.
And it's a little girl. It's a little girl's face. Terrifying. Terrifying, man. He has that on camera. He posted that up. He got a lot of people saying it was fake, this and that. So he invited one of the people. He invited one of the people to actually live really close. And the guy came, they're there again, recording. The same thing happens. And he's telling, go, go up there. So the guy puts his hands up and then the face reappears again. They unlock it. Nothing in there, dude.
Nothing in there.
Wow. Creep me out. Goodness. Creep me out. Great. Now, do you have a personal story?
Yeah, I do. I have a personal story.
Great.
It's actually two stories, but I'm only going to tell you the second one.
Okay.
The first one is super bizarre, but what happens is there's a fire in my apartment. Actually, it's the apartment above mine.
Okay.
And so me and my dog were lucky to get alive. It was like the fireman told me, ten minutes more, you would have died of smoking a late.
Oh, no.
Yeah. And it was really bad because I was going to take a nap. I remember it was Sunday, 04:00 p.m. I was, like, watching tv and I was really tired, but I knew if I took a nap, I would screw up my Monday workday.
Whatever. Sure.
Anyway, there was a fire. I'll tell you that another time. But anyway, there was a fire and I had to find a place to stay. And I remember everyone that lived in that complex was in the office. And they're like, we're going to get you rooms. The Red Cross is going to get you all rooms. Don't worry about it. And then my sister.
Okay, good.
Just come stay with me. Come stay with me. All right. So I went to go stay with my sister. Little history on this. Well, let me just go and tell you what happened to me.
Okay.
So she has a guest room. She's got one of these single beds in that guest room. It's the room where she has her crafts and know, or there's a know. So I'm in there. It's bedtime. Me and Charlie are exhausted. My dog Charlie's a little chihuahua mix, white and brown. And we're in bed. We're going to sleep. And I heard knocking, three knocks, very distinctly on the wall. There's nothing on the wall. So I try to go back to sleep. I hear knocking again. And it was at that point I saw there was a
ceiling fan in the room, right? I saw a piece of paper that my sister had up there with a thumbtack. And when the ceiling was going, I could see the paper kind of going off and like, the edge would hit the wall and it would tap.
Yeah. Okay.
And I thought, in my mind, I thought, well, that's what it is, right? I explained it.
Yeah. Go to bed, right?
And just to tell you, I'm a skeptic. I was a skeptic, a huge skeptic, right? I would explain things away and think, oh, well, that's what it was. That's the scientific proof. There it is.
Yeah.
Well, this night I heard footsteps around the bed and there was nothing in the room because I can't sleep with the door open. The door must be closed for me to sleep. And I heard what sounded like shuffling of footsteps, right? Didn't sound like. Because it's like wood floor, so it didn't sound like patter. It sounded like someone wearing socks shuffling from one side of the bed to the other. And I was sleeping on my right, facing the wall.
But there's like a gap of space between the bed and the wall because the bed's kind of in the middle. It sounded like someone had shuffled over to my face and stopped. And I opened my eyes and I didn't see anything. So again, I'm like, I don't know what the hell. I go to sleep. Finally, and it was about one ish in the morning. I felt a little hand grab my shoulder and shake me. I just came from a fire, right? And I'm thinking my sister's waking me up. Something happened.
There's something wrong because my sister's five foot and she has little hands. It's definitely her.
Right?
So I wake up and I look and nothing is there. The door is still closed.
Oh, yeah.
At this point, I am freaked out, man. I know. I felt someone grab me and I'm looking and there's nothing there. And it was at that moment where I'm looking around the room that I heard a child laughing a little giggle from a little boy. Dude, let me tell you something. I freaked out. And of course I did the child thing that you did when you were scared of the child. I put the covers over.
Yeah.
And Charlie, Charlie heard it, too. It woke Charlie up. And so we were both kind of like freaked out. And again, the shuffling. There was a little bit of shuffling, but I was so tired from that whole day, somehow I fell asleep. I fell asleep. Luckily I fell asleep. But I swear, if I would have seen something, I think I would have left for sure because. Right. I want to see something. I do want to see something.
So do I.
That's like a bucket list item I want to check off, but.
Right.
Doesn't mean I'm going to stick around, bro. If I saw something, I probably would have left.
Yeah.
Because I was thinking, it's in my head. This is in my head. I was trying to tell myself, but I experienced it. I definitely experienced. I wake up the next morning and I'm talking to my sister and I said, listen, something weird happened last night. And she goes, oh, you experienced it, too? And I was like, oh, my God. You knew something was going on in there and you didn't say anything.
Yeah.
And she's like, well, mom and dad had stayed there not too long ago and they heard someone laughing. That's what they told me. And every time I'm in there and I'm doing some crafts with Max, which is her son, my nephew. And at the time, he was three or four years old. Things would get knocked off the wouldn't. We couldn't explain it. We'd put it back up there, make sure it's not going to fall over, and then it would fall over again.
And here's the interesting thing, John, my nephew, had been talking to something in the. Yeah. So my sister noticed this a lot. She figured it was like, what do you call it? Like an imaginary friend. That's what she.
Yeah, that's what it was. Right, right.
So she asked him, who are you talking to? And he said, oh, my friend Coco. I'm talking to Coco. He's my. Right. All right, that's. Know. Let him play on. It wasn't until later, this is before I spent the night there, that Coco started to scare my nephew Max. I mean, really terrify him. He would run out of the lot.
He couldn't sleep on his own in that room or his room, I mean, and come to find out that the owner of the house, because my sister was renting, the owner of the house had told my sister, listen, I'm just going to give you this information. Do with it what you will. But any couple that has ever moved into this house, no matter if they were married or if they were just boyfriend, girlfriend, all of them have broken up. Just know that.
And like I said, my sister was married and she had a kid and she's like, sure, okay, well, thank you. Thank you for that.
Yeah, sure, whatever. Right.
Well, they don't live there anymore. And my sister divorced her husband in that house. Yeah. While they were still there.
Wow.
And the guy was a good guy. He was a little quiet, but a real good guy. And I can tell you, John, they got married at my house in the backyard. Very nice man. Very quiet man. You would never suspect anything weird. But when I was staying there, he let me know that he did not want me in his house. He was a completely different dude in that house. My sister would tell me all these stories, like, I don't know what hell is wrong with him, but he's acting crazy. He's acting.
Yeah.
Well, when they finally, they moved out, he's back to normal. He's a nice guy. They have a very good relationship, raising their son. There's no problems whatsoever. But when he was in the house, something had a hold of that dude. I can tell you from experience, because he was completely different. It reminds me of the shining. That reminds me of the shining. The difference between Jack, before he got to the hotel, and the whole shenanigan that he was going through, that's so. I don't know.
I want to do an investigation in the house, but she doesn't live there anymore. But I would love to do like a deep dive in it. See if I can find this. Here's some interesting information about the house.
Okay.
My sister's a nurse, she's a psych nurse, and she was working. There was a gentleman who also worked there. He was in his seventy s. And they got into the subject of where she was living. And the guy says, well, I lived at this address when I first moved here from. Because he was an immigrant from Cuba, I believe. And it was the exact same address. It was the same house. This dude grew up in the house for a number of years.
Okay.
And so he was saying that it was a woman who lived there, and she was fostering children. But the woman apparently was very evil. She was not there to raise the kids know, delightful little lives. She was just collecting money, and she was just one of these evil women. So I wonder if Coco, whoever Coco was, died in that house or.
I don't know.
There's a lot of possibilities. I would love to investigate and figure out what the deal.
That. That is a great story, David. I love that story. There's a lot to unpack there. One of the things, as we know, typically, demons like to be little girls, right? They like to come as something. So, for example, one of the biggest. Well, I wouldn't say it's one of the biggest, but people have heard of it, is the house in Kansas where. Why am I drawing a blank on it? I'll have to look it up really quick. But anyway, I was in Kansas, and people have seen this little girl constantly.
But there's supposedly a portal to hell in the basement. And people who stay at this house, which I want to go to, you can stay overnight at this house. You can do investigations. They're wide open for it, and they claim that this little girl will come up to you and be really nice to you. But when people are in that house, they change demeanor. You know what I mean? And I've heard this, too, where someone. There's a lot of stories out there where people have seen this little girl.
Oh, cute little girl. Oh, something tragic happened to her. But then you see the change in the people, especially husbands, like you said, your ex brother in law and your wife's ex husband, where he gets out of the house and he's like, hey, how's it going, david? And you're like, why is my sister telling me this guy's a big jerk? He's super nice, and we're having a great time. And then we go in the house, and he's like, get the f out. Kiss my whatever.
And you're like, whoa, what's going on here? You hear that a lot. And I agree with you. I would love to do investigating in there because it's always usually a little girl involved in me. It's the. Yeah, the Sally house, named after the little girl that died there. She had, like, tuberculosis or something. A doctor. This is the 18 hundreds. So doctors rub some blood on it. It'll be okay, right? They didn't know what the hell they were doing. She died extremely painful.
A death in front of her mother. Terrible. And so she haunts this house. And if you go on Sally house, you will see all these different rooms and all this different evidence that they have captured there. This is just amazing. But it's a little girl who they believe is a demon. And that's typically what people say. That's amazing. I would love to. Yeah. Wouldn't that be great? You could just do investigation in that house. That'd be amazing.
I've been trying to look up the history of the house itself. It's really hard to find information on it.
Yeah, and it's really funny, too. I have guests on here who have lived in haunted homes, which I just think is amazing. I don't know why I think it's so amazing, but I just couldn't do it. Could you live in a haunted house?
Hell, no way in hell would I want to live in that.
No. And I'm like, you're a pretty big guy. I'm a pretty big guy. I literally would scream like a little girl, run out that house. No doubt in my mind. In my mind, I would do that.
I'll say your house is your sanctuary, right? That's where you relax. That's where your family is. You don't want anything disturbing you that you can't explain. You don't want that headache. It's a headache to have to deal with it. If it's wild, you imagine if it's, like, really bad, forget it.
Yeah. And some of my guests have said, like, oh, the door would open and then someone would sit on the bed. When you sit on the edge of the bed and they're like, oh, here it goes again. They're so nonchalant about it. And I'm like, oh, no way. No way. So that was awesome. I love that story. Before we get into our main topic for today's topic, remember, I will put all of David's information on our show links and our show media.
Please go and go to all his sites and five star and rate them and give them all the love. Spooky friends. All right, so Patreon, too. Please go to Patreon. I got a teaser for you. Always like to tease you, David. So, David, what if I told you there was a cemetery, that if you go there at midnight and count the wrong steps, you're going to die. Okay.
Probably would not do that.
Yeah. You have to do it now, David. You seem like a smart guy. You're a smart guy, right?
Thank you.
So I'm going to tell you. Let's say you say you go, well, wait a minute, John. Like you just said, what the heck? Am I going on the steps? I'm going to die.
You crazy?
I'm not going to do that. But if you try to reach the. Yeah, if you try to reach the top or level ground by not using the steps, you will be pushed to the ground by a phantom hand, which will leave a red imprint on your back for several days. So those who see it can see the mark of the devil.
Yeah, I think I would rather have that than walk up and have immediate death. Yeah, I think I'd rather.
So just the mark of the devil. You're okay with that?
That's all right.
Taking a shower.
It goes away.
I think it does. I'll tell a story related to that. I think it's kind of interesting here. Once we get to that part, I have to mention my sources so really quickly. Indiana ghost detectives, also only in your state with Indiana haunted cemetery. Creepy cemetery. It's a really fun site I found, which just does all these creepy cemeteries. It's like a little blog. It's pretty cool. And the Brazil times because this is in. Not in Brazil. Brazil. This is in Indiana. So cool.
And last but not least, I thought this was super funny. One of the sources was visit Indiana. So, like, your state has like, visit Wisconsin or visit Texas. They list this as like, hey, why don't you check it out? Hey, you could die or have the.
Mark of the devil die.
Come on. Why don't you come over and check out the cemetery? I don't think that's really good tours. I don't know. That's them. So let's get to the spookiness. So this is hilarious because I was like, this is descriptive. So anyone can find this. We have GPS, Google Maps, Apple maps. You can figure this out. Just off 675 west north of Brazil, Indiana.
If driving on Highway 40, if you're heading west, David, just before the marathon station, turn left on 675 west and drive a quarter of a mile or so. And it's around your corner on the left hand side is the 100 step cemetery. Okay, it is located. I've never heard of anything like this. This is so weird. Not that it's located on the hill. That's not weird. But the steps, they start. I'll put pictures out there so you'll get an idea. The steps start on the road. So, like, you drive up, right.
You pull over, there are the steps. Like you open your car door. It's right there. So usually cemeteries have gates or they have stone walls. No, there they are, the steps of death. So little history about this. The cemetery was established around the time of the American Civil War and is still an active cemetery. So that I thought was really interesting. Okay, so an active cemetery, meaning people still are buried there.
The 100 step cemetery, or carpenter cemetery, is considered the most haunted in Indiana. It is called 100 steps because as you probably have guessed, visitors must ascend 101 hundred steps to reach the summit. So you got to get out of your car, walk 100 steps to see the cemetery. So you can't drive up there. From what my understanding is, county officials have installed though a new staircase in recent years because it used to be like this old broken down wooden step.
So people would get hurt, they wouldn't die.
Cement steps, right?
Yes, it's cement.
Yeah, I've seen this. I've seen.
Yeah, yeah. And given the age of the old half buried staircase and the popularity of the cemetery, the new stairs allowed for easier. I don't know why I'm laughing at this. Easier navigation to the top of the hill. So, David, the reason I'm laughing, and maybe you can help me out here if I told you that. Hey, David, there's a hundred steps. So you gotta count them the same number up as you do when you're coming down or you're. I mean, what's the. Yeah, what am I selling you on?
Yeah, see, this is what I'm thinking. Originally there were wooden steps, right?
Correct.
So the wooden steps, I mean, going up a hill, they probably were sinking or breaking or whatever. And so anyone who would go up those steps would probably trip and die. That's what I'm thinking.
That's what I'm thinking, too. Right? Makes sense. Yeah, it makes sense. How can you count the same steps when you're. Some are underneath, some are on top, some are. I don't know if that's a step or not. Right.
There's grass over the wrong place, and next thing you know, you're on the floor and there's this hand on your back.
Yeah, I get to that. So it's like you're smart, right? You're going to go like, I'm not going on those steps. I'm going to run up the hill and we'll get to that. I think that's even more funny. I was thinking, can I walk backwards up it to confuse people? Do I skip up la la la.
So they can't miss.
Serpentine. So here's some two ghostly legends exist for the cemetery. The first is fairly simple, midnight. And again, I love this. At midnight, under a moonless sky, a visitor must ascend the steps, counting as he or she goes. One should count 100 total steps by the time the summit is reached. Then the visitor should walk back down, count the number of steps a second time. At the bottom, the visitors should have a different number.
The mismatch is supposedly David, caused by a supernatural sleight of hand. Or perhaps the fact the visitors are counting stairs in the middle of the night. Who's the judge of that? So in other words, if you really want to die, which I, God, please don't anybody really want to die. Okay. Plenty of good therapists out there.
Absolutely.
Please don't do that.
Absolutely.
Yes. So what you want to do, midnight, go there, go up the steps, count to 100, come back, hit 100. But supposedly you'll never hit that. Supposedly supernatural will make you go 97. 96. No, wait a minute, 97. You know what I mean? That's interesting to me because first of all, it's midnight. You're going up the steps. But what I love is the legend, right? And we both love legends. It seems like with our podcast and we're down the rabbit hole. How do you think this got started?
That's my main question. Do you have any idea of how this would have started? That someone said there has to be 100 steps? Any logic behind that? Why can't there be ten? Right.
Well, it's not steep. It's kind of like at an angle, right?
Correct.
And so I think I would have to assume there's a legend or an actual story that matches up with this legend.
Right.
But here's what's interesting to me. So I actually looked this up, and many, I'm saying, like, a lot of ghost hunters have been there. A lot of them.
Correct.
Because not only is this one of the most haunted cemeteries, it's the most haunted place in Indiana is what I understand.
Correct.
Right. Okay.
Yes.
Here's my theory on it. Because I watched more than a few people do the numbers going all the way up. What was interesting to me is more than five of them would get to the top at 97. So for a minute there, I was thinking, oh, maybe it's 97. It's not actually 100.
Right. But that's not the case.
Apparently it is 100. And then some of these people, when they were coming down, would only count 94.
Right.
Have a theory on that. And my theory is this, let's say, for argument's sake, it's real. Let's say it's a real legend. It actually happened. So I'm thinking that there's three steps and you're going up where something happens, where you actually miss time. That's why you're counting 97, right? That's what I'm thinking. So what's supposed to happen, from what I understand, is once you get to the top, you're supposed to turn around. There's two, actually, variations of it.
You're supposed to turn around and they're supposed to be the original caretaker.
Right.
He's going to appear?
Yes.
Okay. He's going to touch you on your forehead, and then you're going to see in some Sort of ghostly realm how you die, right?
Correct.
And then what's going to happen if you descend, counting the steps again, if you get 100, you won't die that way, but if you descend and you miscount it, that's how you're going to die. And so I think when people descend and they count 94, there's a gap in time where maybe they're experiencing what is going to happen. They're being told in a way, this is how you're going to die. And then they get down and it's gone. Well, they know, but they don't know.
I love it, too.
I was like, love that.
I don't know if I haven't watched all your episodes, but have you done anything like glitches in the Matrix where people have been like, go ahead, it's.
Big glitches in the Matrix. People love glitches in the matrix. There are some weird ones, right? There are some very weird ones that you can see, but the ones that capture the imagination are the ones where someone is not moving at all, but you can see stuff actually moving around them. And so those are kind of my favorite ones because they're very entertaining to watch. Can I prove them? Can anyone prove them?
Not really. Yeah. So very similar to what you're saying is the fact that people get there and then they slip as a time slip. And then who knows, right? I don't. This second legend is far more sinister. Kind of getting what you're talking about in this account. Visitors again should climb at the top of the stairs, counting as they go, arriving at the hundred steps at the top. On the summit, the visitor should turn around and look down the hill. A ghost of the first caretaker will appear. Hello.
And reveal how the visitor will die. In a spectral vision with the ghostly fortune finished, the visitor would descend the steps, counting again as he or she goes at the bottom. If the number of steps is the same as the way up, then the vision is wrong. If there is a mismatch, the visitor will die in the manner revealed by the phantom caretaker. During this process, if the visitor leaves the path or does serpentine or skips. Now, I just added that.
Or gets a sled and tries to sled or doesn't count the steps, a devilish hand will force the person to the ground, leaving a deep red handprint for several days. There you go. So here's my story that matches up with that kind of cool. So when I was a young, foolish kid, every bad story sounds out like that. Right? When you're dumb, kid, right? Well, I wasn't that young. I was about 23. Me and my buddy, we went to South Carolina. He just got a job down there.
Fresh out of college, I went down there. We both love the paranormal. So we went on a paranormal ghost tour. And the tour we went on was very similar to the story of the bell Witch. Okay, if you don't know the bell witch, basically, there was this entity that possessed this house, and it was a switch. And they tried, I'll do something on it, but there's tons of stuff on it if you want to go look up the bell wet.
Yeah, I've covered.
Very interesting, very super interesting. And also the conclusion to it is a little bit of a twist. Some stories have a little bit of a twist about maybe what the father was doing to the daughter, which is gross. And that's a whole different thing. So anyway, we went on this tour, same thing. There was a witch in there. In this time. She fell in love with the farmer. His name was John. And like every man in that age, he was married with kids. And he's like, hey, get away. Whatever.
She did not take it so well as often as that story, right? So she hung herself in the barn. My guide is talking about this, and it's this really nice old farm. Said, you'd never guess that it's haunted. Anyway, so you go into the barn. That's where the most activity is. And the guide is, you know, blah, blah, blah, blah. This is where she hung herself. So basically, John comes out to go to work. There she is, hung from one of the rafters at the barn. And she was this beautiful young lady.
The guide know it's terrible tragedy. So anyway, when you go into the barn, people have complained about being scratched, bruised, pushed. However, there are some times where her name was Sarah, the woman who killed herself, who likes a young man and may do something to him. And when she said that, I was like, 23, I was like, oh, yeah. I was like, hot, sexy young ghost. I'm digging this. And she's kind of like, looking at me like, yeah, shut up. But I'm thinking like, ghostbusters.
There's that scene in Ghostbusters where Dan Aykroyd is sleeping and the him. So I'm thinking that Dana.
Only zool.
Yeah. Okay. Zulie. We wouldn't talk to Dana. It's one of those things. So I'm just sitting there and I'm cracking. But she's sexy and stuff like that. And the guide's like, look at Abby like, you shut up. And all of a sudden she goes, Sarah, stop. And I'm like, turn it around. Like, what do you mean? And she says, sarah, stop. And she goes, excuse me, Sarah. She looks at me and she goes, what is your name, sir? And I say, John. And she goes, it's okay.
Sarah's walking towards you right now and she wants to touch you. Don't worry about. You're going to be okay, all right? And me and my buddy are laughing. We're like, this is an act. The guide's having fun, right? This is all to sell this whole thing. So I'm sitting there and I feel like it's not somebody touched me. I just feel like there's a chill down my spine, right? Maybe because of the story. Whatever. I feel a little chilled on. Okay, great. Go home.
I take off my shirt and there is a mark on my shoulder, on my chest. And I think it's a stupid spider bite, right? So I go to my budy. I show to my budy. I'm like, what the hell? I got bit by the spider. And he looks at it and he goes, yeah, I don't know. I don't know what kind of spider that is. Are you okay? Do you feel sick or something? Do we have to go to the hospital? I'm like, no, man, I feel fine. So flash forward a week. This thing is not going anywhere.
I've showered, I've tried everything. I think it's maybe like, who knows what it is, right? So I've been trying creams and stuff. Not going anywhere. Not going anywhere. I go to the doctors. Doctor goes, I'm not really sure what this is, but it's going to go away. Don't worry about it. I don't see anything wrong with. It's not a spider bite. It's nothing bad. You're going to be fine. Flash forward to two weeks. It's still not gone.
So I'm deeply in the paranormal, and I started asking around people who I know in the paranormal, and they're like, hey, I know a medium. I know a medium. She can take a look at it. She'll tell you exactly what the problem. I said, okay, I'm thinking, I'm cursed by a witch. I'm starting to freak out a little bit, David. I'm thinking, am I cursed by a *****? Like God? I should have made a comment about her body. And so anyway, the medium comes, and she looks at. She goes, oh, you're fine.
I'm like, I am? She goes, that's a protection, mark. And I'm like, what? That's a protection from evil mark. She's protecting you, basically. She goes, basically, she kind of branded you to tell other witches out there and evil spirits stay away. That's my guy. And I went, what? She's like, yeah. When I've been out on ghost tours and everything like that, I know this sounds really weird to say, but when I felt, like, weird or an evil presence to a certain point, nothing touches me.
Nothing. And I can't show it to you now. It only happens when it's cold. But it's still there. Yes, when it's really cold out. When I got married a number of years ago, my wife saw it, and she said to me, she goes, oh, honey, you got to go to the doctor. There's something. We got a bad rash. I'm like, no, that's my protection. She's like, what? And I told her that story, and she was like, oh, my God. Yeah, it's still there. It will show up on cold days.
I should take a picture one of these days on a cold. It's not as prominent. Only when it's really cold out in Wisconsin.
Does that look like a mark, or does it look like a.
How do I describe it? Yes. It's like a brand, almost, of like an a. And there's like a little circle, and then in it is another circle I should draw.
Dude, you got to take a picture of that. You've got to take a picture.
It's crazy. It's crazy. And when I've been around other places where this is evil, whatever, I just feel like I'm okay. Nothing bothers me. It's weird. It's very weird.
Very cool.
But this is several, huh? Yeah, she liked.
She liked.
Wanted to. I've spent, well, not too much time, but I've been trying to find pictures of the farmer, see if I look like them. I don't know if you've ever heard stories, David, where ghosts have attacked certain people who, I don't know, used them or killed them or something terrible happened to them and they think it's the person and so they go after them. There's several stories where people have said I look like the, I don't know, plantation owner who whipped and beat these slaves, right?
And then this ghost slave comes and sees know you're just at a mcdonald's or whatever, just hanging out. And all of a sudden you're, ah, whatever. Or you're near this plantation and it's like something attacks you and you're like, what the heck? And then you go and you see a picture of the person and looks like you. So the ghost is like, there he is. I'm going to get that guy. He treated me. I just thought it was just a really interesting story and I'm really looking into. And it was really fun.
Like I said, it was just really fun at the time. So another thing at the cemetery, getting back to the story, is there are body snatchers at the cemetery. So not only can you die or be pushed down and have the mark of the devil, now, maybe your body is stolen. So anyway, that can happen. What the heck? Why not? So the 100 steps did suffer at the hands of at least one body snatcher in 1892. Body snatching, if you're unfamiliar, was illegal. Of course it was.
But common practice in the 19th century, in the days before, cadavers were donated on a regular basis to medical schools. So in other words, people would, this is crazy. You'd go out to a cemetery, find a skeleton, recently deceased, dig them up, sell them to a local medical school.
And this is before you would sell them, before you take off everything that was worth jewelry, anything that you wanted to sell for yourself. And they would sell it too.
Correct. And people were kind of like, okay, yeah. And then they put an end to it eventually. But there were still doctors out still doing that, obviously, but working in the COVID of darkness, like I said, they would exhume the bodies, give to medical establishments. So I thought that was. And there is a college in central Indiana supposedly called Ashbury College, which is now college, or, sorry, mispronouncing that one, but that was the closest college. So this college in central Indiana was.
They got a lot of bodies from, wow. Understep cemetery. Yeah. So they admitted it. They came out and said, yeah, we did it. Sorry about that. On November 30. The following story was actually reported. This is the actual story, David, in the Indianapolis Journal. Brazil, Indiana, November 19. The citizens of Posey Township of this county are greatly. I love the way they write back then.
Are greatly stirred up over a ghastly discovery made at the carpenter cemetery one half mile south of Cloverdale yesterday afternoon about two years ago. Okay. George West, a wealthy farmer of that place, buried his daughter, Miss Emma. She died of ordinary disease, right? Yeah, ordinary disease. How'd you know? Ordinary disease and nothing to cause any fear of her grave being molested was. So they didn't really find anybody.
It's like a long winded way of saying, well, I'm not sure what happened here recently, though. Mr. West fought a lot in the cemetery and yesterday engaged assistants to help him remove his daughter's remains to a new ground. When the coffin was reached, all present there were startled to find it upside down. And the body and corpse. Missy. So here you are. Your poor daughter dies of an ordinary disease, David. You're like, well, I want her to bury with me.
And then they dig it up and the graves upside down. The coffin's upside down, and your daughter's gone.
No one's in there.
Yep. No one's in there. How would you feel, David?
I'd feel very bad. Very bad. And then I would be mad. I would go through all the feelings.
Yeah, right.
Find that person.
Yeah, it's 1800. So you could pull your gun and start shooting in the air.
Exactly.
I just love the 1800. A ghost investigator said, be mindful, too, in this cemetery, because supposedly I didn't put this in here, but when I was reading it, yes, you do see the ghost of this. People have said they have seen the ghost of this little girl kind of wandering around, like, trying to figure out, hey, where am I supposed to be? Nothing's been caught on tape, unfortunately, but people have said that.
Now, one of the things I thought was really interesting is just remember this, too, again. So I got to make sure so people don't get back at me. You know how it is, is remember, be respectful of the cemetery. So don't be like, run up and down the steps and don't bring your kids there. Right around. This is a cemetery, okay? It is only open from sunrise to sunset. And the thing is, you should not be visiting unless you have permission, like ghost investigators have.
Please give permission and be courteous. I mean, that's just unbelievable to me, that some people degrade cemeteries and just. I don't know if you've ever seen. I've seen, I don't know, a few videos out there where people, I've seen people, like, bucking down gravestones and I'm like, I don't know, man. I don't know what you're thinking on that. So.
Yeah, not all that bright, you know what I'm saying? I have a friend, her name is Gina Black. She has an instagram called she haunts, and she does a lot of videos where she goes to cemetery. She finds beautiful cemeteries all over Florida, sometimes other places.
Oh, nice.
One time in Japan. One time in Japan, she showed some that were really amazing. But she has shown videos of the desecration of certain graves, and she's like an advocate of, please, do not do this. Do not show respect for the dead. That's the whole thing. She's a great ghost Hunter as well. Definitely don't do that. Don't do that. That's wrong.
Yeah, so I just. A quick rule of story I found out, and I was just going to go through it really quickly. Zachary Keller was a sucker for haunted houses, haunted graveyards, kind of like us haunted anything. So when his friend will had told him about the hundred steps at Carpenter cemetery, he knew to go check it out, which I would love to check this one out. I'm in the midwest, so I would love to go there. The legend was simple.
Climb the hundred steps at Carpenter cemetery, then the top of the hill, turn around toward an open field. The ghost of cemeteries. First undertaker will appear. Approach the undertaker, he will reveal your own death through a vision. After that, you must proceed down the steps, stepping on every step. One thing that I forgot to mention, you got to step on every step exactly the way you went. So in other words, you can't go right, left, right, center like you're doing a dance.
You got to be like, you have to go.
You have to go backwards.
Yes.
That's exactly how you win. You have to go backwards, I guess.
You have to go backwards. If you go backwards on the right side up, you have to go backwards on the right side down. In other words, you guys. Exactly. So we do serpentine, David. If we both go there, we both do serpentine on either side. We got to make sure we do serpentine on the way back down correctly. All right. Well, there you go. There's your timely tip for today.
So, like I said, if you attempt to climb the hill up without using the steps, being a smart alec like me and David, you will be pushed to the ground and a handprint would be left on your body for several days. So one of the things he wanted to do was check this out. Of course he did. So good old Zach, wouldn't you? It was a Friday night, and everyone was out at the bars and the clubs, so he wouldn't have to worry about the police patrolling the cemetery.
There were no guards, which again, people just. Even though there's no guards or anything, please be careful. So it was pretty easy for Zach to sneak in. The cemetery was a little way out of town, so Zach rode his bike out there, and there was a full moon. Remember I said full moon, midnight. Got to be there with light and shadows. So when Zach arrived, he scanned the grounds, looking for a grassy hill with steps. Will had told him to find the steps, 100 steps.
And Zach told him where to find it. Which, like I said, it's pretty obvious. You walk in, and basically it's 100 steps. Very simple to find. Zach walked down the dark country road with his bike and flashlight. Then he spotted it a few yards away. He could see a tall hill heading to the cemetery. As Zach approached at the bottom of the stairs that led up the hill, he started to rethink his decision about going to then. This is interesting.
He heard a voice whisper in his ear, but he could not make out what it said. Following the voice, he began up the stairs, taking it slow, one step at a time. Each step seemed heavier than the last. As he continued to climb, time seemed to. Here we go, David. Shout out to David. Time seemed to stand still. Then, after a few minutes, Zach had finally reached the last step at the top of the hill. Following his friend's instructions, Zach turned to the field just to the left of him.
And to his surprise, he saw a tall, dark figure standing among a row of tombstones. Zack's heart began to race. The figure then turned to his direction, or his direction.
Slowly, he is.
This is the part where you got me, Zach. This is like. What are you doing, Zach? Zach approached the very cautiously. Zach, come on, buddy. Don't you watch a horror movie? Come on, budy. Yeah, okay. As Zach approached the figure, he could see the features of an elderly man with a wrinkled white skin, with sacks drooping under his hollowed black eyes. Zach was taken aback. Oh, no kidding. By the man's should have been taken far back.
It's what he should have been taken.
Get out of the bike. Let's go, buddy.
What's wrong with you, boy?
Oh my God. So the man held his hand out to Zach and without a word, touched his forehead with a long, bony finger. Zach was suddenly hit with a vision of himself falling down the steps of the hill, he just climbed, snapping his neck on the way down. Then as quickly as it came, the vision was gone, and so was the man. Overcome with fear, Zach made his way toward the other end of the hill.
He looked. Wait, John. Now he's overcome with fear. Now he's overcome with fear.
What the hell, man? Not the bony finger. Not the black eye face.
Oh, my God.
Whatever.
Sure looks like Grandpa. Oh, man.
So made his way to the other end of the hill. He looked over the edge and saw that it was now a steep drop. Oh, my God. Zach. It also hit him that if he was to survive, he would have to climb down the. So let me make this clarify. So he ran, and he thought, oh, I'm not going to go down the steps. I'm going to go. I don't know. There's another way out of the cemetery, right? And he sees a steep clap. Okay, so he knew. Oh, I got to go back to the stairs.
Yeah.
So Zach went back to the stairs. He looked down at the steps with unease. Really? Okay. Yes. He took the first step, then the second, then the third. Knowing what his fate could be, Zach took each step slowly and carefully. He was about halfway down when the vision hit him again. The vision struck with such force that Zach lost his footing and tumbled down the steps. The next day, someone discovered Zach's body at the bottom of the steps. His neck snapped and his eyes wide with fear.
The police investigated the incident and reported it as an accident. As stated by the police, this is not the first accident. Accident, David, on these steps, people need to be more careful when they visit here, especially at night.
Nothing to see here, right?
I love it. What do you think, Dave? What do you think of that story? Zach? Come on, buddy.
Yeah, I think Zach, when he saw something that wasn't there before, should have skedaddled the hell out of there. That's what think.
Yeah. Get on your.
You. He can't give you the vision if he can't touch you in your freaking head. So don't go there, man. Don't go there.
Yeah, absolutely right. Believe it or not, I searched the Internet for the police report. I did not find any. But I did find some funny police reports where? Well, people would just be stupid. And they were, like, jumping on the steps and they broke their ankle or they hit their head. Yes. There was just stories. Like, there was just stuff like that. It wasn't anything. It was a funny thing I found. No one broke their neck and died. But maybe there is something from this time, I don't know.
So before we wind up here, I ask all my guests, David, do you think this is a real thing? You think this actually happens to people? They do this?
I am going to go on a limb and say, no, I don't believe this is a true story. The reason is, for one, there's no real record of an account, right? Let's say for argument's sake, this was a true thing. So you would have someone have that experience, right, and would descend the stairs, counting the correct 100, which means that whatever they saw was not going to happen.
Right.
We would have accounts of that. They would say, hey, I did it. This is what I saw. I descended. And apparently it was not true. But here's how they said I was going to die, but I know now that's not going to happen. Plus, I have a theory on which this is way out there, but I have a theory that there are an infinite amount of universes that are on top of each one.
And that my theory goes, and it kind of ties into the fire story, but my theory goes that every second you've ever been alive from birth, even conception, but every second since conception to, let's say, 120, whatever, in another universe, you have died in one of those seconds. Every moment as you progress in another universe, you've already died in one of those moments. So it ties to a thing that's like destiny. If someone tells you, hey, I know how you're going to die, you're going to die.
This. Is that, right?
How you're going to die?
Yeah, it will.
In some other universe, more than likely, that's what's happened, right? Like, you and I are talking right now, and a meteor just crashed through my roof and killed me. Right now, in some other universe that's happened, any thought you ever had exists somewhere else. So that's one of the things why I don't think that you can predict, because you make so many decisions in your life that take you to this branch or to that branch. Correct this way or correct way, whatever.
Yes. I love that. I'm a big multi universe. Maybe we'll have to meet up again sometime and do a multi universe.
I'll tell you the story where I have a theory about it, and there's a lot of components to it. We can talk about it.
I would love to do that.
Oh, man, for sure.
That would be fun. Maybe we can talk about it. Would you do an episode on that? So I have this friend of mine that I hate to say I despise it. Of everything happens for a reason. I always lose my mind when people tell me that. It's usually something bad, right? It's usually something bad, right? Like, you find out a good friend of you got a friend of yours got cancer, and they have six months to live. Oh, well, everything happens for a reason.
Then I just lose my mind, and I'm just like, how is that? And then multi universe and whatever. But the other thing, I always talk about random stuff, okay? Because people don't think about it. Think about when you got to get to work. Think about how many things could go wrong, really. So you get out of bed. First of all, you got to wake up. A lot of people die in bed. I'm sorry, but that's what happens. People. Okay, so let's say you live, right, and you get up out of bed.
Well, this has happened to me, and I'm sure to you. You get out of bed and you stub your toe. Or you step on something and you hurt your foot, right? You're like, oh, ****, man. What the hell is this ****? What did I do? You get into your shower, turn on the shower, no hot water, right? Okay. No hot water. I stub my toe. I get up to get some breakfast. I open the refrigerator. Someone forgot to get milk, right? Okay, now I can't have breakfast. I was going to have cereal.
Great. Okay, so now I get my car, I drive my car. I'm driving down the road, I don't know, some idiot breaks in front of you. You don't see it, bam. Hit the guy. Okay? All those things could literally happen at any time. All the time. But we take it for granted, right? You get up in the morning, oh, I'm so tired. I grab my milk. I take my warm shower. I didn't stub my toe. No, idiot. Broken. Jammed on their brakes, and I slammed. And you get to work, right? But think of the ods.
It just takes you to get to work, just to get. You know what I'm saying? People don't think about that. And they just think, like, every day is the same. Every day is going to happen this way and every day. And when people tell me that's the way their life is, I'm like, are you sure? Because you must be in a weird universe then, because that's impossible. And how many times? I woke up just this week to work. I overslept, didn't see the. I set my alarm wrong. Okay, so now I was late.
I had to run and just throw some stuff on and get to work because I was late. I had an important meeting. I was flustered when I did this meeting, you know what I mean? It didn't ruin my day, but didn't start it off good, but it was just because what did I do? I accidentally, or maybe not set my alarm wrong. So, yeah, I'd love to do stuff like that. I'd love to do that. I think that would be an amazing podcast to do. So, yes, I'll have to be a guest.
So just really quickly because we're a little bit over, but that's okay. We're having a ton of fun. Do you have any cemetery story really quickly that may be similar to 100 steps that you've done? Heard of cemetery story, anything like that? Really quick.
I'm thinking back to deaths in the family. I don't have any cemetery store. I know that my stepson, he did pass away in his sleep at 21.
Sorry to hear that.
Yeah, something like seven years ago. I never got to meet him. Me and my girlfriend have been together for five years. This happened before we met. And I'll say this, I've never met him. I've only seen pictures of him. I've seen a video because he was an amazing musician. He would play the piano, play the drums. I'm an it. He was an IT guy. He would like people in Opal's home learn to use their email. He would teach them how to use their email. He would help them with their computer.
He was a wonderful kid. And me and my girlfriend were at a restaurant just a couple of weeks ago. A couple of weeks ago. And I saw a kid walk in to the restaurant. I was one who saw him. And when I looked over, I was shocked because it looked like Connor. It looked just like, sure. And how would I know? I've never actually met him. You know what I mean? But I looked and it looked like, the shape, the hair, everything. My girlfriend looked over and saw him and she said, wow.
He turned our way and she said, okay. I don't recognize in the face. I see a little bit. When he sat down, she said something like, if he would slump, I would probably be able to tell he did exactly that. And I showed her. And when she saw, she immediately started crying. She immediately started crying because she saw it.
Yeah.
And I couldn't explain that. Explain it. How did I know?
How would know? Yeah. How would. You wouldn't, you know. So again, David, I could talk to you for hours. This is awesome. Thank you so much for doing John. My pleasure. And like I said, I'd love to be a guest on your, you know, let me know when you. We can talk about that multi universe. We do that. So anything you want to share with my audience, anything coming up that's really cool you're working on, share it with my spooky friends here.
So I have enough subscribe, I mean, followers on my instagram now. I have about 33,000. And I have subscriptions available now. It's 499. You get extra content? I share extra videos. I actually do a short show called the six questions. It's my interview show. I have about 14 so far. We have three more we're about to upload. I have something called para Rumble, which I have two paranormal videos that go head to head.
You get to watch both of them, and you get to vote on which one you think is scarier. Which one do you think is. Yeah. Subscriptions are available now. I have a merch shop. I have some merch available. Got this. I have little.
Oh, love that. You like?
You like. It's a little, what do you call drink thing. And drink where? And it's at dot store. That's the name of the shop. Deeper down the rabbit hole, as you probably figured out. And we have one nothing podcast, the show with Amanda Goodwin and Rachel Castro. We have guest book all the way to July. So we do it biweekly. And we also have a patreon. We have a Patreon where we have guests there as well. And that's available on Nothingpodcast. And that's pretty much it.
If you want to find me on Instagram or Facebook, it's underscore, underscore. Down the rabbit hole. Underscore, underscore. Or just type in down the rabbit hole. It should pop right up. And it's my guy. You'll see. This guy right here will pop up.
Yes. I love it. I love that. I will put all your links in the show notes. And like I said, I love, you know, even David getting your show out there, getting you to a new audience. Please visit everything David just talked about because he does excellent work. Spooky stuff, especially with the little girl. Oh, man, I got to watch that video.
Oh, man.
Putting her hands up. So anyway, we end the show. Every time we end the show, we end it this way, is say hi to your ghost. Hello, ghost. Because you never know, you might have a ghost and stay spooky. Thanks, David. You're the best, John.
Appreciate it. All righty.