Ep. 109: Backcountry Mule Deer Hunting with Tom Schneider

It's been a long time since I hunted moose, and man, I stayed way longer than I should have.

was interesting, but yeah, I'd say so. I left to Alaska September fifth, and I got back the twenty eight.

And we did a lot of hunting and trying to find a moose to kill, and it was just I think a lot of hunters, you know, have this experience of being just in the wrong spot at the wrong time, over and over and over and over again, and we just it was just yeah and so, but I try to shorten my story up the last day of moose season, I wanted to moose with the boat, but I said,

screw the boat at staying at camp. I'm sorry, hoyit, but yeah, I left the boy at camp and and some like the rifles in the hand, you know, and we could even get we were even having a hard time getting a moose in in lot, you know, within six hundred yards. I was like, how do respects expect to get one with a bow if we can't even get them that close, you know. And I say the biggest struggle we were fighting the area we were hunting.

Without giving too much detail, there just wasn't really good elevation where you can sit up in glass these moose. You're kind of hunting these bottoms. You got a lot of alders, and so your visibility is very slim. And I don't feel there like there wasn't one time, right say, like we were in a good spot where we could glass. There was a lot of moose activity, they just you

couldn't glass them up. And then when when the sun rise and everything would bed down and just everything went quiet, you know, and you'd sit there and you know, hike the mountain and grunt, and you know, Adam is a really good hunter. I'm a really good hunter. But I also feel like, you know, you get two guys that have different opinions on how to hunt, and you know, I left a lot of it to Adam, but there was times where I'm like, you see me, I'm kind

of the skinny guy that always wants to hike. And I know glassing is important too, but I'm like, especially when there's not a lot of visibility, I'm like, Adam, I think we should just hike, you know, right, And he's like, if we just sit here, because it is the rut, He's like, well, if we just sit here, we'll see moose passing through. And I'm like, okay, you know. And after a couple of days of that, I'm just like, I think we should start doing more moving around, hiking

a lot more and stuff. And it seemed like either way nothing was working.

them anymore. And so you couldn't tell where they'd even bet down, you know, because there was a lot of metal. There was small small amount of meadows, but a lot of alders, and so when they bet down, you're like, I have no clue where they betted, and so because they can move another one hundred to two hundred yards into this to the alders and disappear. But anyways, kind of the plan was, because you know, sun Rose, it

was a warmer day, they all bet it down. I was like, I know, Adam, this sounds like a crazy idea, but I think we need to do is just do it. It's a huge loop around, walking through bog, walking through a lot of masts, but to keep our wind in our favor, and I think just waiting that meadow about right in the evening, when all the moose had come back to feed and do there's you know, the cow mooster feeding, but the bulls are rutting like crazy. But

just wait for that last last hour before dark. It's a long ways out from our camp, but I think if we wait there, then I think that last hour before dark, I think we should just grunt the heck out of that, you know. And that's what we did, you know, like I said, Morning wrote the sun rose moose all betted down, pretty much everything was shot for the day there, and so we're like, well, let's just well take naps, trike lasting do what we can. And I kid you, nod. It was so on the last

it was the last two hours before dark. We got up. We're like, let's move. Let's just every single meadow we know of, let's go to it and grunt and see if we can get something to talk. And we got a bowl of talk, grunting hard. And so we worked and worked and worked him. Adam worked him at him has a lot of experience calling moose and he's great at it. And he called that moose in the sixty yards and I blasted with the rifle. Holy smokes, and I was like, and then when I walked up to

the dead moose. I looked at the sun. It's the last day of moose season. The sun is touching the mountains. Oh, it is literally the last day, last out. And I just like, I said, I couldn't be more humbled in a situation like that, because I always looked at moose as a stupid, dumb animal U And I'm like, I had a lot of respect for them. They outsmarted us multiple different times, you know, and I was just like, man, I can't believe the moose are doing this to us.

And Adam even said, he's like, this is the hardest I've ever had to work for a moose, like just to get a moose shot. And I'm like, I promise, Adam, I'm not a rookie. It seemed easier in the past. But but then yeah, then after that, then Tana, you know, because Adam when he was helping me, Tanna has to watch the kids, and Tanna wants to break from the kids,

and she's like, I want a cariboo. So I'm like, well, I better stay for another week or so for and so I stayed with Tana just and so Adam watched the kids and a lot of bears over there and we helped her, but we did help her get a cariboo. And we kind of had a situation though where it was the So it was the days that she shot her cariboo, we saw him, we she wanted to get

it with the bow. We belly crawled for several hours to get in Archie range, and we had a little like there's in this particular area where the caribou where it's just flat tundra, there's nowhere to hide. But this one group finally decided to bed right next to an older patch. We're like, let's belly crawl to that older patch, and as soon as we get to the older patch, we can get up, get up on our knees, get as close as you need to to the caribou, get

your arrow, and shoot that bowl. And because Tana was really selective with cariboo, so there was a lot of that we could have killed. But she's like it doesn't have a bez on this side, or doesn't have a show. I'm like, ken, I'd be sticking that bowl all day with her.

like hunting elk. It was really cool to watch. And they have these beautiful white manes and well, anyway, so they were bedded and we were so we had to belly crawl on another thirty yards, you know, and every every yard do we move, it would take five minutes or so, you know, so it was moving really slow, but you're but those cows were they're on alert, and they were like on a little just on a little knoll, just enough to where they had some pretty good eyes,

you know. And I'm like, and every time we'd move a couple of yards, they'd look our way. We'd stop and they'd look away, and I'm like, we will make this work. As soon as we get to the elders, we're in the clear. The caribou just all got up and just started to run. We're like what and right beside us, we had no clue. Was there a grizzly runs right past us as we were laying flat in the tundra and is chasing the caribou that we have that we have spent so many hours in belly crawling.

And d was just like, give me the gun I want at this point, just give me a gun. I'll shoot the caribou with the gun. And that I said, are you sure like I did the hole? Are you sure you don't want to do it the bout? She's like, Tom, don't question me, give me the gun. Okay, the gun. There you go, And and she got up and shot the caribou. And then then we're like, oh, shoot, now

we have a cariboo that's dead. We have a bear still chasing caribou, trying to get a dead Caribooh so so now we have our heads on a squibble as we're skinning out. But our savior came. Tanna sent an inReach message to Adam's come get us, and he came and landed pretty close to the cariboo, so we were able to debone it right then and there Oh no, that. No,

we didn't debone. That one. We kept the bones in because yeah, we got the got the plane right there, so that was nice and yeah that makes an easy pack when you have a plane that you can land next to, you know. But yeah, no, So that then I finally got back home and unfortunately I missed elk season, so I know, but but I haven't had it moose in a long time. So I'm like, you know, it's

a sacrifice. But I'd say the mistake I made was I purchased the archery tag and I should have got the rifle tag, so because now I'm stuck with the archery tag, right, oh yeah, so I'm like, well, shoot, I should have got the rifle tag, but I ended up having you know, I'm like, I had to catch up with work anyways in October, so I'm like, I didn't really think I had much time to huntoke with a rifle anyway. So that was pretty much the sacrifice. Well, if I hunt moose this year, I'm not hunting elk.

And so I got my moose and I'm super happy. He's a big bull.

a little bit earlier than your planet too? So I had to do overnight flights to get to Alaska and help out him finish packing his So as soon as I stepped foot in Alaska with my crocs, I was immediately thrown in the bush plane. We were backing moose quarters. Oh man, and I literally, yeah, the kid you not went from yeah, Idaho? Yeah, so that was it that well,

I think that was September fourth or something. I don't even remember at this point, but yeah, by the time I made it to Alaska, I mean here it was. We packed out two rears that night as soon as I arrived, and so and then we finished finished packing out the rest the next day, which we were glad to do because we're like, we have the household. There's a big storm coming and yeah, I think that sums up Alaska though.

spirit to it, you know what I mean. So it's but yeah, no, I'm back now in the lower forty eight.

really cold that night. It's been in freeze temperatures at night. And yeah, I'm toasty in here, and so and from here, I'm kind of like to where I can get to my areas pretty quick, you know. And then I what I did. Well, I guess people can't out necessarily, They're not necessarily have a video to watch. But uh, I packed a smaller tent to if I have an area where I really want a camp back there, I have a smaller tent that I can I can pack on my back, you know, and go farther back. But this

is kind of like my base camp. This is like this is where most my stuff is. Okay, and you're hunting mule there and I'm going after mual there.

and to get all my projects caught up. But every evening I've been on the computer E scouting, and I have I have three main trail systems that I'm like, one of these trail systems is gonna pull. Is going to help me get a buck? I know it is, you know. So that's and and I felt like I've accomplished my first mission, which was being able to get my pickup to all those sites because I've I know one thing I know about Colorado. There's a lot of these,

uh these road systems. They look great from the scouting, and I don't care the clarity of the scouting. You know of Google Earth and Onyx or whatever you guys like to use. You get there and you're like, holy crap. I actually can't get a pick up up this road.

more ea scouting. I found another way in. So I was like sweet. I was like, because that was a spot I really wanted to go, but but I found some Like we were talking, well, we kind of just talked a little bit about you know, with the scouting and stuff. And the one thing I really do is I'm I'm trying to get far away from people as I can. That's like my first step.

to that. Oh I used to. I'm used to hunting areas where there's very little numbers of mule there and you're putting on a lot of miles on the ground just to see a couple bucks. You know what? I mean and and so to be able to hunt a unit like this is kind of cool. But the only thing that slightly concerned me is I talk to a lot of guys that have hunted this in the past and are like, the quality is just not here though, you know, that's what a lot of them say, But

I've also take that in my mind. I'm just kind of I'm just trying to make you put you in my own mind and how I how it works. But for me, I'm like, well, are they going far enough back to the big bucks? Are they getting away from the hunting pressure to find the big bucks? And so for me when they when people are telling me, oh, expect between one hundred and thirty one hundred inch or one hundred and sixty inch class muleies, I'm like, I'm not I'm not going to go buy that right now.

I'm just like, I'm just going to pretend I didn't hear that. I'm going to go after one eighty right And then every day a couple of inches will drop, so it's like, okay, So so first day season one eighty inch buck, second day season a one seventy eight inch buck. Maybe the last day season, maybe it is a one sixty.

to be a really hard day mapping it. It looks like it's seven and a half miles back. Uh so. But but what I like is, you know, there's not a lot of elevation gain. But I'm just gonna get up early in the morning. Like I said, I have a lot of energy built up. I had the past couple of days to sleep in. I got a lot of sleep. So I'm just going to get up really early. And there's a big, beautiful place where I can glass

from good eyes on on deer. And you know, in my mind when I when I looked at that spot on the map, like it just it just you know, we all have those spots like with you elk hunting or it's just like, man, that area just looks elky, Like that spot of the mountain just looks like if I was a big monster meal there, I'd be right there in that opening, you know, away from all the

hunting pressure. But the bounce side is there's a lot of horses back there, and so I made the initiative of getting in contact with them and asking them, what hunters are you packing back there? Am I is it if I go back there, is it just going to be am I going to be just you know, walking on top of people? And the response I got was actually good, and so that the outfitter told me, Hey, no, we just do a bunch of drop camps and they're

just they're just elk hunters. So You're honestly going to be the only meal there hunter back there.

You know. I know a lot of people like to call and find people with advice, and I do that too, but it's like the one thing that always goes through my mind is if somebody else knows about the spot, then who else knows about the spot too, right, and you know big bucks are going to get big by avoiding hunting pressure for long periods of time. And so those are the places I want to find, right. Yeah, it could be hard in Colorado.

pick out deer. But then I start I'm glassing and I see a little tiny I'm like it, like eight hundred yards. I picked out a little weasel running across the ground, you know. And I'm like, I'm seeing little things like that. I'm seeing an owl in a tree. I'm like, I'm picking out things like I think I'm sharp eyed enough, but I'm just missing these deer. But I'm not seeing the deer.

of October. And these bulls are screaming all day. I watched three different bulls breed cows and these are five point bowl Two of them were five points well, one was a four by five, one was a five by five, and one was a spike. I seen the spike jump up and breed a cow too, And I'm just like, what the heck is going on with these elk?

I'll see tracks everywhere deer here also deal a lot of deer tracks everywhere, but just catching them there at the right time. Maybe I'm just not on the right vantage point. I do know, like one area I glassed all morning and I didn't turn anything up, But once I dove in a bit, there were some places I couldn't see that I couldn't glass up, and there were deer tracks everywhere in there. So is it just the matter of like finding the right glassing point, the right elevation band?

their numbers a little bit, you know. But for me, a lot of the mule deer that I hunt and kill are are in Elk Habitat, and so I'm hunting around Elk all the time. There's obviously there is. I mean, you can look at any mountain range with mule deer and you can put a big buck just about anywhere on that mountain. But there's always those places where, like like I was mentioning, where it's just like really mealy and what I mean by that, I've always considered, like

mule deer a sheep with antlers. They they love steep. They they they they feel safe out there, you know, naturally you see the big ears. They have really good eyes, and you know there sometimes there's a misconception, especially with the younger bucks when they get shot, people are like, oh, they're stupid. They just stand out in the opening. That's like their actual natural instinct is to see from a distance and see their predation coming from afar. And but

they also have those spots too. They're they're very adaptable. Like you know, I've seen it with hunting pressure where all of a sudden the deer realized, well, they're not safe in those openings, and after a couple of days, you don't see them anymore, and they now they're timber. They're timber animals, and so now you're gonna have to focus on that. But primetime is really important to me. You know the question you ask, It really depends on

weather and what the weather's doing. But primetime is so important to me. With meal they're hunting, especially when you have hot, sunny days, when you have a consistent cool at night, warm in the day. You know, these deer are they have a area, they have a feeding area, especially the Bigger Bucks especially, and if it's before the rut, they're gonna put themselves in a place where they feel safe. And I've noticed not just with Big Bucks, but Big Bull Elk too. They safety is more of a priority

for them than a food source. And so you'll be in these bases just like, OK, right where they're all there's all this feed, and you're like, why aren't the mule there down here where all the feed is. Well, they don't feel safe there. They need this. I've talked about this before, the groceries, shelter and the safety. They need to feel safe. They need to be able to

have an escape route too. So when I'm looking at e scouting, sure like I can look at the top of this basin and you'll see rocks, rock cliffs as far as I can see up the canyon. Then there might be a little timber patch. Well, if a big millie buckles in that little timber patch's I kind of stuck there, right. He doesn't have an escape route because he goes to the rocks here, is going to get killed if he goes in the rocks here. So so there has to be a balance there of the grocery

shelter and the safety. And like I said, a big buck, the safety is the biggest priority. And they're always expecting predation to come from below them. That's one thing I always look at. Secondly, they just like a good escape route. So they're going to pick a spot where if a predator is coming through, they know how to get out. They can get out of the camp country without being realizing. You know, And you got a meal their buck that's

seven eight years old. He's smart. He's actually you know, like I said, people think meaales are stupid, but that's if you kill young bucks. An old buck is no different than hunting an old bull elk, an old white tail. They adapt, they learn there's a reason why they're alive when they're eight years old. And you know, you get that seven to eight year old class, you got a mature mealy on your hands. And so that's what I like to pursue, you know, And you will find younger

bucks in those areas. There's a lot of feed, right, So like you can get the older lower elevation, you'll find young bucks young does and you may not find the big bucks there because frankly, it's not a safe place for him.

I feel like at a certain point those deer are just like, yeah, we've seen enough, We're gonna just hang super tight. You know, they're not gonna they're not gonna expose themselves unless you knew exact the right little exact open patch at the right time and the you know, the first light or the last light at night, you might catch them, but you're not going to see him out on a big open hell side.

last week of your season. And I was like, because that's the time I can also from there in southern Idaho, I can go to Boise, or not Boise, but go to kind of you. I did have to drive through Boise, Boise, Salt Lake, and then into Colorado, but I can make my route through it, you know. So anyways, my first stop was his hunt, and you know he already had a couple of weeks of hunting pressure, right, just like

what you're saying. So so where I was first thinking we're going to see deer, we were not seeing deer, not a lot. But but we are looking on the maps. I'm like, well, as soon as this road ends right here, there's a lot of side by side trails, so's this road ends here. There's a couple draws that just look really undisturbed, and it's something that I would personally think

that someone would overlook. It was funny, as we put in at that time, we were four and five half five miles in and we were just we were hiking. Another time I should have packed a side by side or before. We didn't, but we were crossing from uh, we were crossing, you know, side by side trail, side by side trail, just hiking and we're seeing side by sides just driving up and down glassing and we're just like, man, this is I don't know, We're this is gonna work,

you know what I mean. But in my mind, like I said, I was looking at that map, I was like, if if I was a meal there, and I had a couple of weeks of hunting pressure, this is where I go. And as soon as we left the road system and we got in that part of that section of that unit where there was no roads, groups of does, groups of dos, and this was late October, the next drainage over a bachelor group of bucks. And I handed it was my gun, and it's all dialed, so I

trust it. I handed it to my friend. I said, he's never killed a meal in his life. He smokes a buck. And this thing, it's it's lopsided, but even as being lopsided as it is, it's still scored close. It was high one eighties, almost one.

packing heavy. I'm like, this is going to be a two day trip, like but Sundays, I'm like, I don't want to be back here again. I'm a long ways back. Let's take as many breaks as I have to. I'm getting this whole thing out in one trip. I've done it. It's it's comparable to it. Like I said, it's about comparable to an elk quarter, like a like a big rear, I would say, but if you're on a k and stuff too, like I did that. I packed not last year.

So last year I killed a big buck and they weren't paying much for capes and I was like, it's half the trip, half the hikes up hill, and I'm like I'm leaving the cape. Just just just the meat, just the meat, in the in the skull, you know, and so but yeah, you can do it if you're if you're dedicated, if you can do it one trip, you know, it's just it's extra.

I'm sure everybody has their own special packs. But a qu bag gets me through with meal dear nelk any day just fine. But for but for moose, I need a Barney's like a big metal frame bag. And they got good like you can get the weight high too. They kind of have a big shelf where you can pick the weight up high and stuff, so that makes it nice. My little you see my sister, she's she's a short little girl, and she throws moose quarters on that are just as tall as she is, and she just walks out.

like that. I try to get all my tea's cross and I's dotted. If there's bills I need to pay, I try to get those done. You know. The last thing I want to do with when I go on a trip is feel like half of myself's at home. Like it's really hard for me to focus. I mean, for sure, I still like to. You know, I'm consistently anytime I'm in service, call my wife and kids, tell

them how much I love them and stuff. But when I'm out there hunting, I don't want to feel like, oh shoot, I have all these work obligations at home. I don't have all this stuff I need to get done at home. Like that stuff will make a guy come home early, you know what I mean. And so and also not be prepared either, so not bringing everything you need, not you know, not having a comfortable camp. You know, Like like for me, what I do is

I and I'll rough a camp. But I'll tell you what I did on this trip in which we kind of talked about it. Right, So this right here is so I said, this is like a base camp right here. Got my wal tent and I have power here, which is nice. Yeah, I just I picked a camp site in my unit and close to town. I can get groceries and stuff and then at least in this area, in this you not have that luxury, right, not all units have that. But now I also have a small

little qu tint. So if I have somewhere, I want to spend a couple of days in the back country and not have to wake up like crazierly in the morning to hike four to five miles to get to where I'm actually a mule deer. I can actually pack a little day camp, you know, back there and sleep and then hike tomorrow. I've got a lot of energy to burn off, so I'm just going to do it one day, seven miles in seven miles. It's going to

be at least that's how the trail goes. But you know how it is, you start taking your own routes and stuff, it's probably going to end up being fifteen or sixteen miles by the end of the day.

on the area. But for day hunting. For day hiking, I like places between four to five miles and and four to five miles out, Like if you start getting a little further than that, you kind of want to Typically I'll like to camp it out and just wake up and not and be fully rested as a you know, as I'm starting to hunt me ole deer. But like I said, tomorrow, I'm just going to try to do it all one day. Though it's just gonna oh it's going to be a.

you're missing things at home. I said, if you rough it too much, then I feel like a lot of guys, you got to know your own self too, and what you can handle, because if you're roughing out too much, you realize you can't handle that. That also might make you come home early. So so don't rough it as hard, take your time. You know. I'm the type of guy like I I can live like a nomad. I can just you know, I can spend weeks in the bush

without having any soeul service and I'll be okay. And but but there is something to be said about having a nice base camp. We're comfortable, got good food, and then go from there, you know, especially when you're hunting out of towns.

had some normal food instead of freeze dried. It's like a really good reset, like just getting clean, getting refocused, like okay, you know, maybe had cell service called home made everything sure, everything was good, Everything's good, and it's almost like, okay, round two, we're just fresh as a fresh as a daisy again. Just that means a lot to be able to have that kind of a backup spot or a place to like kind of recharge, clean up,

and then go go again without. You know, if you didn't have that, you may you may just throw in the talent say you know what, heck with it, I'm gonna go home.

there's good weather or bad weather. A wall tent with a wood stove, man, I tell you what, that's a game changer. So if you're able to pack in with lamas or horses and mules, or if you guys use goats, use that, utilize that. If you're going far back, I will tell you right now, you will. You'll be really comfortable at camp. You know, pack some good meals like space those mountain houses or Peak Refield or whatever. Space out those freeze dry's meal. I do my own freeze dried. Well.

When I say I do my own, I make the list of things I want and I give it to my wife. I'm like, make that for me, please, And so she makes packages them for me, and so I just give her the ingredients and so she makes me the meals. And so I got plenty of free dried meals right now. And it's good to feel prepared, you know, like you know, on this hunt, I may you know, you never know it's a hunt, so I may come out without a meal, dear. But the thing is, I'm

I'm prepared on this hunt. I have everything I need. I feel comfortable at camp and I've done enough eat scouting enough to where even like my brother today, I was talking to my brother, He's like, hey, I have another lead for you of somebody that may have hunted that union in the past. I'm like, honestly, it doesn't matter what they tell me. It's great to have more information, but at this point of the amount of scouting I've done, I don't think I need any more information. Like I

feel like I'm ready. I just need to put in the miles. I just need to hunt like you can. I can litter this whole unit with pins and where there's once a big mule there once lived, you know, but it's dead now, so I can't kill that meal there anymore.

I'll push the mealis out. So I'm just like, just go opener, don't push anything out, and go from there.

or whatever you can glass into. Are you just glassing to those midday just trying to like find something or are you kind of recharging the batteries a little bit, you know, and just taking a break, taking a nap.

take a lot of time off the meal there. Hunt. I want to like, I'm trying to utilize the best days possible on the hunt. Like if there's a good weather day, I'm like, this is the day I want to put in all my energy.

I love hunting on a stormy day. When the storms are going on and off throughout the day, it makes like they'll they'll bed down, feed, bed down, feed throughout the day, and you're just like you're getting all day activity. Another thing I like is right after a massive storm and it just cools everything down, they'll just pound the

next couple of days just hard. I'm like, this is all my energy I've saved up for and you know it's the same I see what they'll cunt in Tea where you'll see a storm, Like you look at the forecast, you see a big storm coming and it's like, in the next couple of days it's going to be super hot. I'm like, honestly, I'm not gonna waste my time in

these really hot days. Like I'll hunt the prime time, I'll hunt the evening, but all day on those after that storm hits off's I'm gonna put all my energy in. People burn themselves out before the hunting gets good, and so I like to pay myself sometimes, so I'm not trying to be like a lazy hunter, but sometimes you like to pace yourself to say that you can't glass up a mule there mid day in the hot day.

I'm not saying you can't. Yes, sometimes they are glassy, you know, if you have nothing else to do, to put your eyes in the glass and scan the whole hillside, look under every you know, under every tree, every nook and cranny, every every rock. You know. But my time is best spent in prime time on those hot days. And you know, I see in the weather too, we're going to have some storms next week and I'm just like, bring it barring the storms, and I'm looking forward to it.

I really love a snow background too, So that's always helpful. All of different techniques, I mean, I it's and it's all scenario based, right. That's why it's really hard to it's really hard to say if you do a B and C, this is what you're going to get on D. You know, hunting's very especially hunting the older it's it's one of those things you have to adapt to, right, you know. And I always wish I can give a direct answer for everything, because it's like, you know, You're like, Okay,

in this scenario, time, what do I do. I'm like, well, it depends what's the weather doing. Because if the weather's doing this, I'm not going to do that. If it's doing this, then I will do that. You know, in the rut, I will hunt the rut differently than I'll hunt pre rut. Right so, right now, at this time, it's not the rut, and so I'm gonna hunt. I'm gonna find bucks. I'm going to ignore dose because the

bucks are not where the dos are. Maybe some younger bucks, but if I see a do, I'm likenk like, oh, there could be a big buck near by. No, I'm going to ignore every dough I see. And I'm just gonna go where I think a big Buck's going to go. When the rut kicks in, I my my gears change. I am like, I'm not going where I think a big Buck's going to go. I'm going where the dose are because that big buck he's going to make his routes and he's eventually gonna connect to those does.

focused on dos and they're focused focused on breeding. And you can catch a big buck, you know, and for him the wrong place at the wrong time for you the right place, right time.

And for me, I mean wolves. I got into wolf fund just because I was a pissed off elk hunter, right, So that's how I got in the wolf But Meali's there's just some about mellies that I've always loved and and Mealie's that's my a Mealy Snob's that's that's like, you know, And I wouldn't say there's something about the magic of September and bulan elk, but there's also some about the magic and chasing a big rut and Mealy buck with a swelled neck in the snow in the rocks,

just looking back. I always have this image in my head of a big muster but just looking back at me in the rocks, and and it's just like, as I'm hiking, and I know I have a long ways ago, it's like, how do you occupy yourself in that long hike? I just that image just replays my head over and over and over again, just on repeat, of that big buck just around the corner on the next drainage, you know, and and that's what keeps my blood going.

find a big bull. Like this little thing in my head, Like it's like on repeat, and it's almost like your your your little vision of that of the big mule, your buck is that kind of Do you have that internal monologue that, oh my God, says that same stuff to you.

You can you can prepare yourself physically, right, but I'm going back to like preparing yourself mentally, like for me, Like, I know, some guys that are just really good in shape, are really in shape, you know. And I'll use my little brother for example, Trevor. He's really in shape and he he's he's like a very avid elk hunter, so you know, so just not to confuse there, I have

my older brother Traps my little brother Trevor. Trevor is a very avid elk hunter, and he's very avid in a lot of other hunts, but meal deer is one of those animals he never really got into. And so he's physically in shape to kill a mule deer, but he just like doesn't put in the time right. And not a dis on your brother if you're listening, but uh, he's a good hunter, like everybody in the family is.

But like and even even Travis and even my brother in law Adam, they all say, like, dude, like Travis is a little bit more Mealy hunter than you know with me. But you know, Adam says, he's just like, dude, I just can't do what you do with Meal there, like just putting in the time, you know, like with Mealy's And.

just just say what I'm going to say. And uh, you know a lot of people say that it's about It's just about the whole experience of the hunt. Just imagine anyone playing a sport. They imagine an NFL player saying, I'm just here to have a good time.

I'm not here just for oh I just I'm here for take a picture of the sunset. No, I'm not here for a sunset photo. I'm here for a big mealy buck. And I would love that. I would love to take a photo of a big millied buck with a sunset in the background. That would be nice with you in it, with me exactly, No, not someone else but me in it.

the same way. I want to I'm i'm I want to know, I'm showing up to notch my tag. I want to I want to bring home an elk, I want to bring home a deer or whatever. But I can see your point though, too. It's like, yeah, I have that same mindset or feeling when I go elk hunting, maybe not so much Muldier hunting. I'm not as maybe driven or as as like mad at the deer. Yeah, I always give Phelps a hard time while you're so mad at.

At the end of the meal of their season, I have a lot more new content when I post a hunt on YouTube, and I would do it for the entertainment, I don't really show the whole process when on the meal of their master class, I show the whole process. I show from e scouting to arriving to showing what I do and finding the bucks. I said, most of these hunts, you know, as much as I want to feel like people are giving me way points, that's not

really how I'm finding deer. Like I said, I'm I try to hunt deer that don't have any hunting pressure, and so I'm out going in places where there hasn't been a gut pile in a while, and I'm trying to create a new gut pile with an old with an old, mature meal deer, and I'm hunting, and I guess a couple of questions that I've had to answer, you know, because it's kind of a similar one is does it work in all terrains? And I'd say, yes, it does. You know, when I there was a time

when I started hunting sagebrushed country mule deer. The first time in my head I ever thought was these are a different meal theer that when I'm used to hunting, I'm hunting heavy timber bucks and in the high mountains and not this flat country in the desert. Well, I've come to find out they're the same deer. It's just their habitat's different. That's the only thing that's different. They're

the same deer. If you threw a big, old timber buck in the sage brush, he's going to eventually adapt to the sagebrush terrain and he's going to act like any other sagebrush mule deer vice versa. You throw a sagebrush mule theer up in the heavy mountains, he's going to act the same. Some some migrations are far like Wyoming, where you get so much snow. If the deer stay, they died, right. Some areas don't get as much snow, so they the man the ameaalies pulled to the base

of the mountain. Instead of making this one hundred mile trick, you know, maybe it's as simple of just dropping some elevation. So Maryas don't get snow at all, right, and so so in the meal their Masterclass, what I do is I try to help people understand the meal deer itself. And so that's kind of the first thing I do is we teach. And I'm using this not just on my own knowledge, but it's knowledge from other experienced meal

their hunters. So and I'm talking like old timers, guys that I've looked up to for years who taught me how to hunt meal deer. These are guys that are they're in their seventies and they're too old to hike, and they kind of live through us. They see the big mealies I kill and it just brings them joy because they're like they know they're the they're responsible for teaching me. These things and these hunting tactics and and so so when I'm saying, when I create this meal

their master class. Remember it's not just my life experience, but it's several years, several generations of experience in hunt meal deer bucks. And so this is from covering, you know, and I cover throughout the year, from shed hunting to scouting in the summers, to hunting in the fall, from September hunting, October, November and even December hunting. If you if you guys have a unit where it's a post rut meal there hunt, so we cover everything meal there.

And and as you guys know too, is I have If anyone who's follows stuck in the rut, you would know that we hunt heavy timber a lot too. And so which is a completely different tactic than most meal their hunters know. It is hunting timber, hunting close range to these mealy bucks. You know. For me, I'm either hunting, I'm either glassing for long rain shot a six of seven hundred yards, or I'm shooting a meal there. Like

last year, I'm hunting. I was hunting an area where the mountains nine timber, you know, And as soon as the snow gets deep in the above tree line, above that above tree line. Then they just they pull the timber right and you're timber hunting. There's no glassing, you know, maybe a little glassing, which I explain in the video. And you're but you're doing a lot of observation. You're

you're you're observing scat, you're observing tracks. You know. The one thing I teach about tracks is, you know, tracks always tell a story. You know, when you're when you're all cunning in September, same thing, you're seeing a herd of coug, you see a bull track, you see what you're seeing. What's going on? You're seeing a story right there. And you're trying to put the story together. And what they're doing are they feeding is are they just passing through?

Are they bedding down? Like you know, you're trying to find everything. Like the tracks tell a story, A rub tells a story. Trying to find out if it's a rub line that mealies frequently pass or is it simply just a random rub that a buck made. You know, Yeah, I teach about rub lines. I teach about calling a lot of how many people do you hear of callin mule? Deer.

He's about a three year old, so we'll see this year. I'll see how he looks this year if he crosses my path. But he was like he needs to get those forks bigger. But he had a good frame.

But also the thing that means most of me is these experience hunters, experience hunters that have hunted for years that have said I never knew that about mule deer. Yeah, And I'm like, that means a lot to me for an experienced meal their hunter. You know, I hear experienced Meal their hunter buying the course of like, oh, he's

going to judge, he's going to judge my experience. But I've had really positive experience, or very positive feedback from it, really experienced Meal their hunters, and that means a lot to me. And so and a lot of it too, especially with snow conditions and howp meal their handles snow conditions way different than any animal you've ever hunted, I tell you what.

all about being a you know, observant too. But yeah, I mean it's really I think what really taught me so much about meal there too, more than just a lot of the experienced hunters that, like I said, all these old timers that pass it down is I put it to work, and I put it to work in areas that have very little meal their numbers. Like these are places where honestly, if I had to travel, I wouldn't Like if I had to travel several hundred miles

to hunt these places, I wouldn't go to them. I only go to them because they're convenient, because they're closer to home. And people like other experienced hunters aren't pulling big mullies anymore. And I am, And I'm not saying that in a cocky way. I'm just saying that I think outside the box a little bit with mealies, and and I've learned It's taught me so much, especially hunting meal there in wolf country. It's taught me so much about how to find where there's very little meal deer.

I kind of feel spoiled actually where I'm at now, just because I'm like, there's a lot of deer here, like this is kind of cool. Like I that I'm obviously going for a big one, but I'm just like, I'm definitely going to take my time in this unit, and I'm holding out for a big one. And if I eat my tag hold out for a big one, so be it. But that's that's what I'm after here. And but yeah, you're gonna it's a great course. So I recommend checking it out for sure. Man.

YouTube channel, and so we have a lot there. We start a little late on the Instagram, but we still have a fair amount of followers there and on Facebook. So yeah, I mean, if you want to stay updated for upcoming hunts and events that we do and when we post YouTube channels, definitely follow our instagram because we

keep you updated. And obviously, like every as soon as I kill something and I'm in service, we posted on our Instagram, right, So so YouTube usually it's usually until after hunting season to where I have time to sit at a computer. I've tried the whole let's try editing these videos as we go. It does not work. Just so busy, this is the busiest time of the year for us, with between wrapping up work projects to hunting.

It's like wintertime is really slow for me. That's when I put on pajamas and a hoodie and I just stare at a screen for nearly a month editing videos.

I do? And I gave him just a couple of tips they're calling the wolves, and he brought him right in and he killed no kid.