The NFL Combine

Widman uh is on here. Uh. Then also backstage, Joe, you know you got g still in the building as usual. And then we've got a special guest, uh my daughter Bailey, uh snitching and telling all the stories of of of her being uh my my my only daughter. Um, but take an opportunity to talk to Chris using the UFC and also just his perspective on the You got the NFL combine coming up, um, and there's a lot of things about the combine is good. There's some question marks, um,

just like anything else. If you're saying, hey, question mark, what do you mean a question mark? Just trying to figure out how much of the combine is really usable tangible. We'll see. So I hope you enjoy it. Thanks for listening, and I also enjoy this little conversation with my daughter as well. So this is gonna be fun. Jee, How you doing? Man? We have a guest in the house. Let me introduce her. Me me, me, me, me me,

Harry Aint Harry, Harry A here you here? I got my daughter A K. Bailey Jordan's a K b j a K Bay Hope it's are you doing bad? What's going on? Nothing like you come on and snitch on? Pops. I don't know what there's a sitch about? You are good? All right? How is it being my child? It really depends on the day, do too? Um? Some days are great.

Some days well it's different now since I don't live at home, but what I did live at home, I feel like it would be a little tiptoe and sometimes but oh for all I mean, it's good tiptoe, go go in the detail on this tiptoe. You know, I'm very open on this because this is it's a great it's a unique. I think sometimes one perspective, but it's a because from a father I'm a dad. Yeah, she's a child. The serial thing is a really good example. So we live in this house and we had a

like a home theater. And how old was I like eight or nine? Maybe? Or was I younger? Probably? Probably? Okay, So it was it was probably like a Sunday. I think my mom was out of town. I don't know where she was, but we were getting ready to watch Miss Doubt Fire and I was like, and I was like, Dad, can I go get some cereal? But give the backstory on why you had to ask to bring food in. So she's a spiller. Now, yeah, I spilled. And and when I bring stuff in places that aren't the kitchen,

I don't bring them back down. So like he would come up my room when I was in high school and be like cups downstairs? Okay, I would have like five cups on my nights. Stay, don't make me pop you. How many cups did we find in your vehicle? Of from like we have? You know, it's being a sports guy. You know, you get free stuff all the time. You get bottles, right, you get a water bottle for under arm, a water bottle from Rebok, a water bottle from here.

Everybody wanna throw a water water bottle for the foundation. Okay, okay, but before you say this, let me preface. I am not a hoarder. No, you're not a hoarder. No one accused me. I just want to say, because there were seventeen water bottles in my car, bro I'm not a hoarder. But it just water bottles in her car. Some of them still had liquidin them. Yeah, because I'll like bring one to school, leaving in my car and then the next day get a new one and then I just

never brought any in. Okay, she'll continue with this. Okay, So it's like, Dad, can I bring some cereal while we watched a movie? And He's like, oh, yeah, of course. So before that you gotta understand, you know, I'm a snack guy. I'm a snack kind of sewer. Actually, yeah, I like some snaps, especially when you're watching the movie. And this we had this theater room was over one of the garages, so it was to two car garage, so it was there was a big theater room, right

mistaken in building a house. But it was a theater room with steps motorized. Yeah, and I had to walk up the stairs to get back there. So like, imagine, don't even try. Don't believe victim. Now, I'm just saying that she said what I'm saying. I see where you're coming from. Like, okay, cool. So she goes downstairs, comes upstairs with the cereal. So I bring a bowl of cereal up there. I'm walking in about to go get comfortable. He stops me before I go down the stairs to

gain my seat. He goes, I said something about cereal. I say nothing about no milk, Like, how are you gonna eat Syria without milk? I'm with him on that thought. With the kids with the milk, they're not how to go anywhere with the milk in the cereal. If they just have the cereal, we can talk. But if they have the milk in the ball with the cereal, there're staying on the on that kitchen table. Chris says, the

milk goes the milk. First of all, if you if you have a problem with keeping your containers in areas for a long period of time and it has milk in it, that's gonna that's gonna stink, that's gonna be nasty. So you can't have you know, old milk containers. You know, hanging out of your room for too long. It's all right, I'm not judging you. I've done No, I'm not judging you. I'm just I'm just I'm with him. I'm on the

side right now. As a child, I've been there. But as a father, you know what's the worst thing, finding fruit and milk or anything that has milk inside of it. Discovering that in a secret place or in a car that has been sitting heat in the heat, not for some hours, some days or weeks. It is it since a rage in you as a father, that when that child is not there, you are saying things that you should be ashamed of yourself of saying milk in my car.

I don't drink milk, first of all, that's nasty. And my kids, the smallest, I'll always find some stuff like milk shakes. Milk shakes they leave in the back of my car, and the little cup holders I'd never look at, and so they'll be it'll be like on the door side door, within the little cup holders, and I'll find it like days litter. How uh twelve just turned twelve, nine and six? Yeah, back to the garage one time. That's another good story. He got very mad at me.

I can imagine she broke the garage. Oh my gosh, that's a problem. I don't know anyone that's gonna be congratula after that. Would you ask her why did she back into the garage? I think you just actually there's actually I wouldn't say it's valid. But so, you know, my little brother he's seven at the time, he was probably like four or five, and he had a scooter he left in the garage in my spot and I had to, you know, like do this little thing where I would around it. So I was diagonal in the

garage a little bit. I was late going to work. I was behind going to work, and I went to back up forgetting I was I toward that thing up like it was bad. I wouldn't side. I was like, he was like, what comes outside? Why would you do? I was like that, and I'm still late for work, so I'm like trying to rush him being mad Spike work, and of course, of course the friendship six minutes at

that point. Yeah, and the garage gets fixed the next day and I'm riding around with the dint in my car for the next like it's a couple of months there was a couple and then finally I was like I had enough money to be like Dad, like, if I have have the money, will you go the other have to get my car fixed. He was like yeah, that's fine because he was like if you come with me with what, you're gonna hold up to your end of the bargain, like I'll help you out. And I

was like, okay, that makes sense. But I was my friends even be like I don't know it's your car anymore because you don't have that d it. I'm like, oh man, well you know what we need to have you on here more. I learned from the best great voice. I don't think you all right, Well, good job beach. Alright, what do you What do you think about the combine from from a uh, you know, your football fanatic, your football guy played high school ball, but um what do

you see the combine? And don't show me I played flying football in the mirrors in college. Don't show you know. Let's apologize like five picks. Hold y'all didn't have me. That's my point. We had a real flag football. That's my point. We have a football. Did you have girls on the team? No, that was all guys. I don't respect if you don't have girls on that why because comingo brother, it's all yeah talking about together. What do

you what do you? What do you? What do you think about just the process of the of the combine. I mean it's uh in totality when you think about the whole draft. In this whole process relatively new, you get a chance to see how fast some one is in in some relation, how strong they are, um, how high they can jump. So all these intangibles that are that are measured measurable tangibles. Okay, there's so much that goes into playing football, basketball, whatever sport that are immeasurable

that you don't get a chance to see. So in in that standpoint, I think it's cool to where all right, we can see how many times he rapped you and see how high you your vertical is, and and those are cool. I'm always of the mindset like even and this maybe tails into conversation like alignment running forty yard dash? What is that telling me about him? Right? Like he how many linemen do we see making a forty yard birst? Hopefully not a lot because something we're wrong every single

time something. So that's kind of where I'm at or you know, shuttle drill. Right, that's very I would rather see what alignment does in that because that's more so their movement. So I'm more intrigued to hear your perspective of of the combine, what its usefulness is. It's up and down? Yeah, I haven't. I think it's up and down just because of I think sometimes they put too much emphasis absolutely on the combine and they give a

false narrative to people. Right, I don't think the combine helps It helps some people, and it fills in the gaps of what scouts may not know. Right, you gotta think about it. All these colleges, it is physically impossible covid no covid um scouts, even college scouts are also scouting professional teams too for possible free agents. So it's

it's a constant scouting department measurables that are constantly moving. Right, what do you if if you have scouting in UFC, what do you think it would be and how and how those numbers equate to a successful UFC fighter. So I don't think you'd be able to have a combine

the way the NFL. I just I just taught using a combine concept for for UFC fighters, you would have you would have to look at the like they're how good they are in competition when it comes to if you can look at each art individually, so you look at Brazilian jiu jitsu, then you look at boxing. What what did jujitsu for UFC look like gonna combine? What would you need measurables in that too? I think you would need another guy to be competing with to see

where someone's at. Like so when they did the tryouts for the Ultimate Fighter show back in the day, and I think they still do it, they would have you and another guy do some prison in jiu jitsu. Then they would have you so they'd watch how good you are with the submission in the ground game, and then they would have put you on the pads and they'd have some you know, kickboxing coach hole pass you. So they kind of get a good idea. What hands are

that same thing for linement or d linement? You know, swim moves against it, hitting the guy to get around to sack the quarterback. But do they measure that in the combine the man they measure everything. What do they do they measure like speed or they measure hands size, they measure, they measure you know, they do e K g s. They do physical measurements of heart health, you know wellness. Um. Then they measure hand size, they measure

a wingspan. Um, they measure uh five size calf kneecap. Um. Wait, they have you take your shirt off and you're just in shorts and they take a picture of your front and backwards. Um. Then there's a right up on various scouts that have seen you throughout the year. It's a lot of statements that contradict themselves. Doesn't get in and out of breaks. But then one guy says has a has has a fifth gear on. The guy says he's missing a third gear. Um, I'm not, you know, a mathematician,

but you gotta get to get the five. You gotta go through three. Right. But then you got your you got your broad jumps, you got you got your broad jump. Bench press. I didn't bench press. Um, so you could just say I'm not doing this one. I just I just didn't do it. Like, first of all, when are you on your back pushing up somebody unless you're getting smashed? Right?

Are you getting mushed? I mean the bench pressed by the design of the of the actual exercise is supposed to as you're how strong you are from a core perspective. But to your point, which I agree with, it doesn't show like there are people who can rep out and didn't play, you know, and then there are guys like I remember Tyron Matthew when he did the bench, but he did like six times. It's a great safety pretty so what does it measure at the end of the day.

And I'm not saying I'm against it again, it's it's a it's a barometer of how strong you are, but it doesn't tell the whole story. What's more important though, Like, so you've got a guy who's a star college athletes, star college kid, and he looks like he has all this potential, but then he goes into the combine and he's mediocre. Whether it's athletic or academic. Right, some people are very smart, but they didn't have a great or

some people don't handle pressure, you know, some people don't. Yeah, you take a two, three or four year career when you have accolades and you have game film and everything going through it, and you condense it down into a one or two day process, you know, I go back to when you ran the forty. I know you were a little bit slower than you know you could have four four I was four four one, And you know you are faster than that. You've ran faster than that

I've ran. I've ran faster than that at the team facility four three one. That's the fastest I've ever run, right, but realistically, right, and let's use this if we look at the combine, right, and we look at just pure numbers. John Ross from Universital of Washington came out. He ran the closest to the second fastest time ever. So fast, yes, right, so fast that the Bengals moved up and picked him up. Think about it, when are you gonna ever run that fast?

How many times in the game are you running up? Are you running the nine? Actually? For him zbro I, he didn't play lasting speed like how often are you just running straight? Dator? Actually it's a great indicator. DK metcalf is a great example of a guy who he looks like a Greek guy. He's unbelievable so much that he tested off the charts, bench pressed so much wearing crop tops great athletes. He wears a shirt the dude

if I look like him. Remarkable, remarkable. I'm not joking. However, they had this young man at the count at the draft because of his measurables, he was a guaranteed first rounder. The way they was talking, he invented the wide receiver position. In my life, this brother gonna make He's running twenty

two miles per hour and track down the guy. But yet he didn't get drafted ahead of a J. Brown, who's a pro bowler, some of these other guys, and I'm not putting them down, but I'm just also saying that DK Metcalf because of his measurables at the combine, he became this superstar that actually before he even played. I'm not saying he's not a superstar, but I'm also saying that he did not. He did not invent the wide receiver position. They're still they're still routes to this day.

This young man can't run. When the Seattle Seahawks and Russell Wilson need to play, do you think they go to DK metcal They go to Tyler Locke because that man has a PhD and route running either. There's no route he cannot run. Now, if you're talking about a push off slant, a muscle slant push off, or a muscle hitch and a go route and a deep post. DK is my guy. But if you want a technician, a surgeon, you need somebody to do some work, better

go to Tyler Lockins. And Tyler did not have the measurable that DK has because I think at some point there's only scientifically, there's only so many tests you can take. There's so many gray areas you can fill in. You have to be able to know the game inside out and from the head and shoulders, because at some point, your athletic SAYSM will leave you. So if you're working in the front office, you take off the analyst hat and you were working, you're working in that realm, what

would you draw out of scouting come By? Now, Well, it's funny because I go backwards and I look about three or four years ago. There was a guy, little Caucasian dude, first name Cooper, last name come I was considered an idiot because I said how good he was. People said, Steve's an idiot. What does he know? There hasn't been I guess fifth fift in ten or twelve

years ago. There hasn't been a triple Crown winner since since two thousand in sixteen, there hasn't been a triple Crown winner and then yet now Cooper Cup It's triple Crown winner. Do just a square out of Eastern Washington who almost gave a football? Thanks for listening to my dad and talked a lot. He loves to talk. Just give him a minute and he'll be right back. I love cut to It, and I love it even more when you download us and subscribe, and you can follow

us on social media too, Smithie, where where at? That's at? Cut to It on Instagram? What about Twitter? At? Cut to It? Facebook? Cut to It featuring Steve Smith sing your what about online? And you can follow us at cut to It podcast dot com where you can by merch and you can subscribe to this wherever you listen to podcasts. I got all my answers questions, Um, yeah, I got all my questions answered. That's what I'm here for, a brother, cut to a podcast dot com. How do

you scout out your opponent? Chris? What do you look at? What attributes do you look at outside of what a normal fan like? Oh man, he's big, he's he's muscular. Oh he'sh man. You know, he's his colifilower ears are a little it's a little bit more colifiled than the next guy. Man. A lot, a lot comes down to

each each situation. So you see how he is in the clinch, which is like an overrun the position, and you see the different types of movies he's done in his fice before, and you kind of get an idea of what he's good at, what he's comfortable with, what he's confident in. And then it's either you realize that you he might be better than than you there or you're better than him there, and then you kind of adjust based on that. That kind of goes for all

the different skill sets. Uh. You watch how how they react to pressure. You how how that cardio holds up under pressure. Um, if you've seen them break before, you know they have a breaking point. Um. Yeah. So those are pretty much the you know, making a long story short, that's pretty much it. So when you see the combine, how do you apply what you're watching to say that this is gonna be a good player based on what you're saying, do you have a combine? Do you need one?

Or is it better just to see these guys play out in college, which is unfair for the people who aren't on the big stage. Right. So, but see that's the that's the part of it connects the dots. It should compliment what you already Yes, but but but I think sometimes it short changes people. How so, well, think about this. I look at the combine now and I watched the playoffs. Did you see anything about Deebo Samuel's

prior to the combine, prior to last year? This year, like they're playing Deebo Sammy is all the next superstar. They were playing Deebo Samuel was like seven months ago. No, but watching him play what a young man named Deebo. First of all, right, there's that ball and then there's Debo. The combine helps some of these young guys who are

not looked at. But then the guys who actually are looked at, they don't really perform in a combine because they don't want to risk yeah, dropping down two pegs right in two pegs, man, he may be between the first, the first and the third. He doesn't test well like uh, like a great example, man, third round pick. I think he end up be in the third round. Or Orlando Brown Jr. So him. I was, I was. I was hard on him because he was not He was out

of shape, wasn't prepared. But man in Baltimore and in Kansas City man he covered Lamar and Patrick Mahomes backside. But if you look at his testing, he was out of shape, he wasn't prepared, and the combine actually didn't help it. It hurt him because it showed some of the things that the Scouter report said about him. Family, business, privileged, but just didn't work hard in his first year he didn't, but he worked his way. They got him on a strict diet routine. My man's balling now so much. I

came forward. I saw him Thursday night UM in Baltimore after the game, walked over and I said, hey, I was down on you. I want to tell you I was wrong, and I appreciate you proving me wrong. But I watched him and I seen I saw it like man six ft seven three pounds. I just didn't have the same work ethic that he has today. What's the percentage of UH like physical to mental and technical in the NFL? You think like it because it depends on

the position. I mean, you can you could get guys and I'm not going to mention the name, but you can get a wide receiver or a a quarterback who athleticism, right, and I'm talking about a guy who played for a very popular team. My man had three routes brow a hitch, a slant in the back, shoulder fade, jump ball, and when he started to lose his athleticism, his numbers dramatically changed, to the point of that very popular American team let

him go and he hasn't played well ever since. You go to say that a quarterback in that same division at wore green Jersey. When his attributes started to go, he looked. So you think it's more just age though. So like these guys, you know, you have the combine, you got the scouts, they have this combine. They get

these numbers. So you think those numbers, which is basically your physical right, that number only is gonna last for a short that it has to develop into more technical I think it does only last a short term because it also has to do with their lifestyle. You know, it's a guy party, is a guy taking care of his body. You know, I hate to say, now what kind of surface is he playing on? You know? The grind of the season. What kind of organization is he in?

Is he is a past happy organization? How much trade is on the tires? Right? All of that plays into it, right, guy like um uh? Roddy White played with the Atlanta Falcons. Man talked to Roddy Man the last couple of years of his career. He could play, but he has so much wear and tear on his knee blew up so he couldn't move on to continue to keep playing, even though inside he could, but that knee was holding him back. You know, kind of you using the knee cap is

kind of necessary to run routes. Right, I was rest. I played on grass most of the time, so I didn't have that wear and tear. But then when I went to Baltimore when we had or if I played on turf, are you talking about body hurting? Is that big of a difference between turf and grass? You know it would be like you wrestle on then octagon. How much is it wrestling you know with your kids on grass? Think about it? Or on concrete or on a path?

Is that much of a difference? And now you add running jumping, so it makes you faster, makes you be able to quick be quicker. But as far as injuries and everything like that tonight, So think about this, if I stop running, stop on dime on grass? What gives if the grass? If if if I dig too hard, what comes up dirt and grass? When you do that on turf? What gives joints competite? Gonna say? So what are they doing? Do you do you feel like the NFL should have only grass? I think it's the problem

is every city is different, every city sometimes temperate. Yeah, it's it's hard to really monitor it. It's hard to really you know, it's hard to go grow. It's hard to grow natural grass in Minnesota where no Minnesota where is negative ten? That's like the hot you know, or or the high on the day. I can't wait till it gets negative ten. Yeah, you're you're looking for right, I mean far Ago some of those places man negative

negative thirty. So you mentioned Infantis on film when you was referring to Cooper cup But what if anything would you change about Scott and Combine and maybe help draft process overall outside of just paying attention, Like, if is there anything else that you would that you would change A tweak? Well, I think that I think a lot of people don't understand that come bond is not a place that actually helps you. It's more of a place that it hurts you. They connect the dots and they

fill in the blanks. They you know, for some people who are unprepared for it, they walk in there thinking like oh man, I'm about to and man, you come in there, they're poking project. They question you to ask you know what you do about this? What about that?

What about this? And it's not a place it isn't necessary, yes, but it's not a place where you know you're going through that process and you walk out of the room going they're sometimes man, some guys walk out of the room going that team, that team just tore me apart. That team made me feel. You know, most job or interviews you think you're possibly having a job man. And sometimes in these situations you come in there going, man,

I think I bombed that one. Because they they're connecting the dots, like man, you go through the draft process or the combined process, man, ask you for your socialcurity. Know, they do a credit check on you. Hey, they're looking for weaknesses when they're looking for strengths. Yea, to break you down, Yes, that's crazy. Yeah, I never dore of it that way, Which is these guys going to combine that.

You know, they're they're so excited to show that, but at the end of they have to remember they're actually they had to fish around for your most you know, your biggest weakness is that you might not even know about yourself. Well, I think there's more people. I agree with you. I think there's more people hurt by it than helped by it. Um And one thing we've been talking, you know, minutes is one thing we haven't even brought up, and that's from the league side. The money. I mean,

you've got to think about it. You go back to when you were playing. It wasn't on ABC, ESPN, Main you know, eight pm on a Saturday night where people are trying to watch it. Now it's become an event. People are going there. It's always an indie. I mean, how much money is assigned to that to become an

event from all the spot from all the sponsors. So but then even rewind before that, what do you see with a lot of the main guys when they go into their bowl games if it's not for national champions yet, Man, I'm sitting out I'm getting ready for the combine. So you've had also had guys get injured that that that's really I struggle with that because I can understand and see. But then it's also another opportunity to go against top flight UM competition in which you get to prove and

maybe show he can't play. Right, Because when I was invited to the Shrine Game back in the day, and the only reason I was invited to a strong game because there's a guy from Kansas name Quincy Morrigan deid Kansas State that decided he doesn't want to go. So they called me up and say, hey, you want to come, Gil Brent, you want to come? I said, heck yeah. I was already going to the Hula Bow because I didn't get invited to the UH Senior Bowl. So I'm like, yeah,

I'll go. So I went out there, man, and and I'm running routes and we do one on walls, right, and I'm you know, I'm a kid, you go, And I knew my coach Fred was like, do not run a god route. Run other routes. And I'm also going against guys like from at the time was a big twelve Texas, right, I'm going against guys like that and then do all they want to do is come up

and jam you. Man. I get out there and I'm I'm one seventies six, like after Thanksgiving round, and man, they come up some dude, this dude jam this snot out of me like pile. And I'm playing against in college, I was playing against Air Force, Wyoming, Colorado State, San Diego State, not not not well known, you know, big time athletes, and I was not prepared because I was used to going against guys who can play a scheme, not you know, be handy. So he jammed the snot

out of he couldn't get off the jam. So I rolled back up. Let's go again. Though this I'm on a job interview, so we rolled back up. I mean I didn't get off the line. I'm like five steps and I'm back. Let's go again. So I showed the scouts one I ain't I ain't scared, and I go against it and I go and of course I ain gonna give him no. I'm not gonna gi him no goat route because Fred is telling me, you gotta show you can run routes. They already question you because Utah

is not considered a big school. We were we were. We were the whack that just moved up to the mountain west Bang. I give him that two step rocking and go, and I showed that I had the ability. I wasn't gonna back down, but the ability to adapt, right, And I showed that. But without that game and practice, I was able to show that what the combine can't do. The combine can't test your will, your willingness to to to be backed up into a corner. How how do

are you a fight a flight type of person? There is no machine, there is no you can write a test. They even have tests. Man, they got like the the giants had a test at the time, three fifty questions, three questions. Are you a feline alley cat? Right? Do you consider yourself a coyote or dog? All these crazy questions. I said, first of all, I ain't trying to go to giants. I did about questions and I walked out,

bro I was done. Were they doing like the kind of stuff like this, We're giving you options on route running, like what would you do in this situation? Of course not that would make sense because but now some teams have adapted military testing to know your fortitude right to know how he had, how's this person handles up, So it's it's become very good. But then now you have kids who are going to I amg all these difference where now they are training and mentally and physically prepped

for this because it's a business. And so guys can test well right and with all these big firms and then go out there and the Cooper Cups though like nobody had Cooper Cup on their radar. If they did, the Los Angeles Rams wouldn't have waited to the third round. Someone else who picked in front of them would have picked him. So I sounded like a Cooper Cup. And

who who are the winners? Because we've also we've almost had two parallels as the the guys who are holly ranked, it may not be in their best interest to go to the combine. But then you have someone who sounds like if you're kind of on the bubble and then you don't do well, that can hurt you. So who

are the who are the winners? From a team side and from a player's side, I think that the winners are the teams who actually have a system in which they're able to figure out and decipher testing and the eye tests right to be able to go Okay, this kid may not test well because of the circumstances, but we have enough film to see him, have seen him play well enough that he shown us that he can

play on the big stage. Mhm, right. Or one of the glaring things that I think people don't like to talk about this, how is that young man gonna handle getting all this money? See, there's no test for ignorance, there's no test for stupidity, there's no test for uh, instant fame. Right, I mean, uh, what's the kid that was with the Vegas Raiders? Right? It's a good kid. It's a kid who when his best friends died from a um drunk driver, he made one bad choice that

costs a lot of people of ramification. Costs a woman and her dog and some families members their life. But let's go backwards. There's no test to say, hey, how is this kid gonna screw up once in a lifetime opportunity? It goes back to what we saw. They didn't measure their intangibles. It can't, but we put so many we we put so much stock into it. How do you it sounds like that we've got the winners. That the biggest losers of this whole thing is kids that are

athletic and very good football players. They're but they're on smaller schools. They're not in the limelight. But they also don't test well in the combine. Those guys well, you also could test poorly because the the scout or the coach that's running the drill isn't very good either. Right. I've seen some coaches, especially while receivers, they make them break down and running a route completely and then restart.

That kid is not going to be fluid, and first all who runs full speed stops, slops, decelerates completely and then it starts back up. That's not efficient. That's not a good route anyway, but that's what happens. What I benefit from going to the combine, which I go every year, is talking to the teams understanding what is their purpose there? Why what do they considered a good player? Right, and also connected dots to some of these coaches know what

they're doing. So of these coaches have no idea. Man, there's a coach I'm not gonna name name. He was on He introduced himself as a guy that coached someone I knew very good player, and he gets accolades as coaching that player, go to another team, been there, go to another team, and then both people at the individual he named dropped to ask somebody. He goes, bro, he did not coach me. Then he goes to another team. He's out of there after a year because he goes

another team and I asked somebody else about him. He goes, yeah, he wasn't a good coach, and he's a head coach or this. This is a position coach because when a position player, when if I, when I go to Pro Bowl, I was a five time Pro bowler, flex I got it. So all of that someone had coached me, and that coach gets in this book. He's helped Steve Smith become Pro Bowler. This year. There's probably about three or four coaches that right now, Tytober he's one of those guys.

Fred Grays, one of those guys. Bobby Ingram, who's offense coordinator now with just gotta hire at the offensive coordinator for West University of Wisconsin. Um Ricky pro Man. Some outstanding coaches. Uh. One of my coaches back in Juan College, Mark Payne's good buddy in mir other than that, some Richard Williamson right, challenge me. There's some other coaches. Man, I'm not gonna say they were They're not. They weren't bad,

but I they didn't change you. They didn't make you net like you didn't see like they were statish quo. They didn't. They didn't help me. They didn't hurt me. The information they gave me was like, okay, cool, I take a note. That's the thing though, in the NFL. You that's the difference with fighting is you you don't hire your coaches on the team right there, and they're hired for you, so you're just they get to put you on their resume without you actually saying they should

be on the resume. Yeah, that's that's different. So I got to every camp. I could choose a different coach if I want to, So there's no lying about okay I worked with him this fighter or didn't. Well yeah, I mean I get some coaches that like they were all right. I'm not gonna say he was bad, but I'm not gonna be like, oh yeah, man, he made a huge difference in my life. My man, I dudes, I he corrected me and you know, help me. But they were talking like Ricky pro was one of those

coach is right. He was assistant coach with Fred Graves. He was on there, but Ricky also played, so Ricky would tell me things as a player that when he became assistant coach, I would go to him. That was one time man me and Ricky he was a coach. Me and Ricky got in a heated argument. I said, rick I respect you too much. I'm walking away. I was like, and he was like, good, I'm glad, right, But because he wanted me to do something, I tried my best to do it, but I would just have it.

I just was losing that day and it wasn't. You can't. Sometimes when you're losing, your coach can tell you just do this. You're like, yeah, I know, I'm trying, but like for you, actually, I'm trying to come in there and that left hand just keep bopping me in my mouth. So I'm trying. Usually you know what you're doing wrong. But just like you wants two pieces, well that's what

I wanted to that. That's what I forgot about the ones. Yeah, and it's just it's crazy right and in there sometimes some coaches who uh, there's some coaches man that just do the bare minimum right, and it's nothing wrong with it, but they they're in a position of authority in which they're only there because they're paid their dues. Yeah, they remade it. They were they were like uh the general

manager for the Giants, Joe love them man. In my career, he used to hold up the white uh white erasier board and hold up the place and used to snatch the script from him so he couldn't know what the next play was. I I'm not saying he doesn't deserve to be the head coach, but he to general manager. But he paid his dues. Now. The other part though, is he knows what a football player and the tangibles as from what he was taught. Sometimes I can look at a football player and say he'll be okay, or

he's missing something. I don't need to be trained because I also know what a good football player, what some of the things he does, especially if I watch this movement I've been able to watch. I can watch players and go, here's what he does, here was here's what he needs to work on all that stuff. But for some reason, if you're a former player, you get deemed a hater, you get dem um, jealous, and and and so people like, oh, he doesn't know what he's talking about.

And not everybody is, you know, not every coach or a former player has the ability to have a keen eye. But I watch enough film that kind of know, Like, can he be a good player? Possibly? Like somebody asked me one time and say, said, Juju Smith Schuster, could he have the same impact in our offense that he had his first couple of years in Pittsburgh. And my response was, yeah, he could if y'all ran that type

of offense. And they were like, m good assessment. The type offense they ran did not apply to allowing Juju to be where he is. Good do it. Let's get down to do it. Hey, Gerard, why did you get that T shirt? You mean, Oh yes, I got it from cut to a podcast dot com where we have exclusive merchandise shout out to our guys at seven or four shot. But yeah, you can go on, buy you a T shirt, subscribe to us wherever you listen to podcasts. So what are you looking for right now as you

get ready to go to the combine? What are you looking for? What's top of mind for you? Top of mind for me um as I watched their film, I go one. For quarterbacks ball control, how do they place the ball in a short area? How did they you

know what kind of velocity? Then for receivers, ball play, hand placement, feet, try to watch some of the routes that they're running right understanding that part of what they're doing is their hamstring a little bit depending on the type of receiver that is running the drill and what they're emphasizing. The other part is you never know what guys how they hand up pressure, you know. I remember our first couple of years being on the big stage

of Utah played Washington. I ran a deep post. I remember they threw it to me because Chris uh So, I was at the when I was at the at the Rose Bowl, I went in to win on the other side of the stadium. Man, and they're just due named Christian Christians said, uh, his brother Mike, I just call hi peg leg um just because he all his back leg would always drag. And I hadn't seen these dudes.

And since I went to the league twenty years and man, I remember Christian Chris Christenson, Mike's older brother, Man, I was behind him. There was Cliff Russell, Chris Christen, and then there was me, a boot bendinker, and then there was me. Man. Christian went out and I was scared. I'm man. I ain't never other than the airplane. I got to Utah. First of all, we got to Washington, and I had a headache from the altitude, from getting

on the airplane, holding my breath and the anxiety. And then I got off the flight and threw up immediately right and then I remember Christian got hurt, and I ran a deep post and darniell arsenal through the past. Man, I shore on that damn pass. I was so nervous. I didn't know to dive. Then I couldn't dive because if I dive in uh, I felt like I had to fart. And then I was scared. If I farted, I was going to duke on myself. Bro. I was so scared because I just I'm a kid from l

A that wanted this opportunity. But I was also from junior college and I was the guy. Now I was the number two or number three, and I was so nervous. Man, and I had practice that whole week. We played against Las Vegas John Robinson was the head coach. Then we played against Vegas. Your boys showed out. Man had like five catchers, hundred fifty yards, two touchdowns, still doing punk kickoff return, and my career started this sing after that. If Chris Christian never had got hurt, bro I probably

would have never made it. Was that the hardest part of of your story, going from junior college to to D one or going from D one to NFL because you gave him a small school. Still my biggest part of my worry it's confidence. Yeah, how did you get the confidence coming from a smaller, smaller schools, like going against these big school dudes that you don't know how you really you know, able to compete with them all of that time by myself, right, I didn't work out

with the team. In college. I worked for a moving company because I was on scholarship, so that in the summertimes the only time. So I worked in a moving company. That's how I lifted weights, That's how I maintained my strength. I wasn't a naturally big guy. Um, so that's what I did. Um and then I just I worked on everything. Quick story. I was so scared of being hit because when I played Pop Warner when I was We played Jesse Owens team. I was at l A share If.

We played at Lock High School and I'm playing and I played d N and running back and one of the quarterbacks tried to scramble out of the pocket and tried to leap over me and I and I lunged that him. He flipped and broke his arm and they had to take me out of the game because they wanted to. You know, it's just back community. They wanted to, Oh, we're gonna, we're gonna beat his blankety blank. I was scared. I was scared, right, I broke the kids arm. Wasn't intent.

I would just trying to do my job. And I just remember that. So go to high school. You remember nutcrackers. You gotta do nutcrackers. Nutcrackers is uh, there's a defense. There's a tackler in a ball carrier. Oh, he's called Oklahoma. Yeah you were used later, yes, Yeah, they blow the whistle. Yeah, and then you get up you gotta hit him. It win't called nuck, right, I know you're you're talking about scared. Yeah, that's all. That's always the first one in like Pop Warner.

That's that's the one that that in bulling the ring, and we didn't do bulling. Ringing the ring is the one that that is all the players. Yeah, we didn't. We didn't do that. We were too in the middle. You have to chop your feet and you don't know who's coming. So so my my head coaching pop. My head coach at Jake Jr. Or varsity or j v was mark erri Yamo. He hasn't got my freshman year brown up. Scared, I'm wearing number eighty two, no swag, and so they blow the whistle and I get up

so ginger right, ginger. And so from that point on, I remember that next year, after the season, all that stuff, I was so scared, I just would practice. I practiced as a tackler and I practiced as a as the ball carrier. That next summer, blew the whistle. My man gets up on the ball carrier. What what do you think happens? You, truck bro I got up so damn quick. The defender was still on his knees. Rand him Scott

over it. I didn't because it says I practice out of fear, right, And that's just kind of how I built in and from that point on, I never till this day, even as a when I became refresional, I never trained with anybody as a group. Always trained by myself. So when they when they were doing it, how would you not participate? Go with jail? You were just bound. Yeah, but when you were up and coming, you didn't have

that right or authority or power to walk away. Summer jobs, You're just you were just I'm just not gonna be here summer job. And then when once training, you know, once training camp and all that stuff come, I was ready, man, when I had a summer job, or I used to ride my bike from nine and a half Cambridge to

figure out I was working at the county office. I ride my bike all the way there and back and try to beat the bus riding it and you were on it because you thought it was gonna give you a leg up one it was it was economically sound, right because yeah, and and then because after that, I had to catch the bus to go to practice. But I didn't have money and I was working, so I had to I didn't. I didn't come to any offseason training in high school, in college, and in the NFL.

I only came when I was mandatory. And when I came, you better being shaped and that's where I used to train with. Yeah, that's awesome, that's good, and I just did. And so in college I trained by the moving company. So, yeah, you're doing these movies, you're doing the moving and you know you were confident this is making you stronger than the other. Try to move a helping with a couch like and I'm and I'm with dudes that got penned, you know, been in the pin. I've got dudes, they

got that old man, the old man strength. Hey, you know, hey, you're gonna play ball, you better live up. He can live I think, I think, But I also think there is a part of that that is placebo effact. And I mean that I think that. I think because you think it's going it's it's making you stronger. Your leg up, I'm gonna say, it's making you stronger. It made me. If you didn't think it was making you strong, here's what I think, here's what here's what it did. It

it made me functionally strong. I agree, right like you can do. There were guys that I played against that can bench fresh to fifty. But then they come up and try to tackle me, and I would stiff form them and mush them to the ground. It goes back to the whole conversation around the combine. Yeah, you're strong, but you may not be functionally. But I don't know how much of that is his tanacy and his will. It's both. But this is it. Is he still stronger than you? No? Is he still if there was at

that point in time. He doesn't necessarily need to. I know that. But how do you measure the will? And that to nasty, here's how you measure. If me and you're going at it in football and you grab me and I grab you and I'm dump you, then you lost. Brother, there's a win in the I'm saying. I'm saying in the combine. So you have the testing because we're trying to see who's who's stronger. So we're doing the bench president. But but think about it. You're not laying on your

back on the bench. No, you're running and and and as as one of my great coaches that I love, Richard Williams, said, you Caddy wampus. You you catch your pass and your right foot is here, your left foot is so many degrees to the other side, and you catch it this way, you turn around and there's a defender that comes to you. You no longer that bench press is not effective. And you got the right You got the ball in your right hand, and this defenders coming up with you, and you got your left hand.

And I'm right hand dominant, but I also function with my left hand. Fred Grays had me at Z, which is right hand dominant. I used to fumble a lot, so he put me at X because when if you look at the stuff, I would run with the ball in either hand. But now I do some boxing, and guess what I am? Naturally softball? I should not be a softball. I'm actually more comfortable boxing southball. But when

we're spawn, guess what I can do? Oh yeah, as soon as he starts to tie me up, I'll switch on the right, and then when he gets the right, I'll switch on the left. That's smart. That's that's high level of fighting right there. But the measurables will say, there's no way I could be softball. Yeah, no, I'm with you. Yeah, So there's no way to measure it. There's no way to measure it. That's why I think

some to some degree, testing can be flawed. So you can't always put everybody in this in in that box. What does signs say about us? Abnormal? Yeah? Right, man bowl abnormal? Right? Uh? Derrick Henry abnormal? You know man that should be running that speed and stopping right. Yeah. Yeah, it's the same thing fighting, man, Like you can't you can't really measure it. It's impossible to feel the feel when you're in there with somebody like who's really more

confident in these situations? You know? Again, problem solves better who doesn't get antsie or anxiety? Right? Yeah, learning how to deal with anxiety and not getting you know, not overthinking who learns? Who learns with with with visuals audible like you were saying with when your south ball and you feel like this orthodox fight are is this box or whatever is starting to pick up on your your

south ball? Right, you know, when you're crushing him in the first thirty seconds and all of a sudden, like he's coming over your jab and he's clicking you. So now you're able to see that and now make that decision. All right, let me switch over to this way and go orthodox and see how he how he deals with that.

And you're really just trying to figure out what is making this person more uncomfortable and then you want to stick with that and I think it probably still go and you can't, but you can't measure someone's ability to be able to change and adjust on the fly like that. But we were doing the boxing for the last month. Oh yeah, And he's like, you're a south paw because I was. I was struggling right hand. I was like he was. He said, what are you because I wear

my watching my right hand. The reason I where my watch on my right hand. When I was a young boy, I broke my fingers and I could not move. I couldn't use my my right hand. I could not use my right hand for like two months. And you're predominantly righting on most things other than like not when you're boxing and football wise, you always left with your left leg forward or right leg forward. I'm actually X. It depends on where you're going. It depends on where I love.

What do you feel you get more like if you were running the forty or dash, you're getting like right leg forward. That's a great question. I don't know, but that's the thing in boxing. He was like, why are you struggling? And then he said switch real quick and he goes your south ball but snowboard, I'm goofy, goofy

foot it. What does that that mean? Legs forward or left? Okay, yeah, I'm different too with that, Like I'm everything, I'm righty, but I wrestle lefty, So my left leg was always ward, which happens would be good for fighting because if you're right, your right hand stronger, your left leg wants to be in the front, which is good because with wrestling, you know, it wasn't that hard. But that's one thing that people forget. What when a wrestler comes into fighting, they usually have

their right leg forward their whole career wrestling. There in the wrestling stands, rights have their right leg forward. But when you box and you fight, you're gonna have to put that the opposite. So now you have to learn how to shoot with the leg that you're not used to shooting with your entire life. So it's a lot of, you know, a lot of breaking habits and stuff. I didn't have to go through that because I happened to wrestle lefty my whole life. But also I'm a ready

just weird and worked out. You start, are you thinking about doing a celebrity boxing matches. First of all, you hit me, I'm gonna hit your ass back so you can put the gloves on. Bail or no bail bing back. No, I just really just switch up Cardio. I get bored with Cardio and I took like a this hiatus. I was like, nah, so I've been doing it just more of just to handle give myself, get my heart break on. It's so much better than like treadmill better say, I'd

still do that though. You still so you don't mind doing that stuff, all right, that's good. Yeah, So it just it gives me something else good to do. Yeah, I'll be doing that for the rest of my life, just boxing and kickboxing. Just I'm not even talking about sparring with people, but just hitting the pat I'm just doing to work with my God, I'm not necessarily like we're not just for staying in shape, keeping you know, your hands sharp. Yeah, it's it's it's good. You can

do it forever. It's not like pounding on your joints. You're like getting hurt. Like, I'm not interested. You hit me, I'm gonna go to the car and come back. I believe he's just put it out right, It's been a great episode. Al right, well, hey man, appreciate your time. Man. So you know that's that's our summarization of the combine. I hope you enjoyed it. I'm Steve Smith Senior, Little John, Chris Wide backstage, Joe, thanks for listening to it. Cut

to It. You are a unique person. You are well worth it, you are competent and most of all, your lovable. I'm Steve Smith Senior, I'm Gerard Little John and this is cut to It. Cut to It with Steve Smith Senior. That is Me is a production of Cut to It, LLC Baltol Creative Media, The Black Effect and I Heart Radio. For more podcast from I Heart Radio, visit the I Heart Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you listen to

your favorite shows from Cut to It. Executive producer Steve Smith Senior, co host Gerard Little John, talent in booking manager Joe Fusci, Social media team Wesley Robinson and John Show from balto Creation of Media. Cut to It is produced by Brian Baltaschevic and Meredith Carter, with production assistance by Alex Labrek, Production coordinator Taylor Robinson. Theme music by Alex Johnson. Lyrics and vocals by Anthony Hamilton. You ain't heard about it, then we're about to let you know.

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