DOUG WILLIAMS

A guy that I ad my respect, m VP of super Bowl twenty two, co founder of the Black College Hall of Fame, senior. I are not really sure what a senior advisor does compared to advisor for the Washington Commanders, A father to eight and most importantly, a proud Grambling State Tiger. Welcome to the cut to a podcast. My man, a man, honor and and it's a privilege to call friends and uh and worker co worker. Uh, Doug Williams take food three thread many Yeah. Uh, the senior party

because of the age. Oh is that I didn't know? You know, I'm a senior too, but it's not because my age, just because I want to make sure that junior doesn't take my good credit report as he gets older. It's taken years to get this credit report up. You know what I mean, pack pack bell bills I had to pay from back in the day. Yeah, but you know what, walking around his building, you know, most of the guys didn't look at me and they say, O g Yeah. You know, you know you at that age,

you know ge walking around the building. So you just deal with it from that standpoint. All right, well, let's let's let's get right into it. Man. We have some fun. We're gonna talk some truth. We're talking about manhood, We're gonna talk about you know, job, just everything, every direction you want to go. Um okay, uh and just let you just let your story tell storytell about your life. So we're gonna start off with uh. So little ice

breakers get you relaxed a little bit. Um. You know, obviously you're you know what you said as senior advisor. So seniors, older men have routines. What is your daily routine? My my daily routine? You know, I come here, here's eight o'clock every morning. You come here? Where is here here to the building facility where where all the players are. Okay, and uh, you know, go to breakfast, eat breakfast, and

come into my office. Um, I do have office here, you know, down the hall on the rest of the folks. But I got all that's a good part about it. And I can look out the one I can see my car if I wanted to leave out the side door when I get in my car and I leave. Why you gotta go? Why you gotta Why do you have to hit all of the stereotypes. You gotta make

sure you know our car is just in case. In case. Well, you know what, if it wasn't the truth, I wouldn't say no. But but no, you know, I come in and when the president is here, you know, I got a chance to go sit down with him to find out what's going on for that week. And UM do a lot of zoom with the other people who are part of the sales and tickets and things like that that are not housed here, A lot of them over at the stadium. And that way you got to zoom

in and talk about what's happening daily. And hadn't been on this side. So I'm learning a whole lot because as being on the personnel side a little different than being on the side where people sell tickets and and advertisement and everything else, and you just learn what they do. So I'll be in the zoom listening to them. I mean, I don't know a whole lot that that they do, but I do listen and realize that that has to happen.

And um, you know, being alumnied as organization, um, the president and and all other folks, they depend on myself and a couple of guys to try to lead them into what this franchise is being over the years, and um, you know, trying to tell him what's what's out there from a fan base and what's good for for the team and things like that and what not to do because you know, remember we got everything has changed over

here with with Jason Wright being the president. We got so many new people in here that they've never been a part of this except for the last year. So so like a waking and weapon at home lunch and that we have every year, Well, there's only two three people in this whole organization on this side of the evolve that had been to a weapon at home. Uh, so you got the blind leading the blind. Well, I

can see, so I'm trying to help them. So you're trying to get my idea of what it's like, you know, because everybody got different opinion how we can do this and how we can do that. So what's the best part of your routine, your daily routine that you enjoyed the most. What's your favorite part, you know what going out and watching Like now we're in o T and going out watching the guys and and run around and doing things and see who might be the guy that

we might have to depend on this year. And you know, being out there for anywhere from thirty five forty minutes an hour and just just watching those guys you know, walk around and you know, for me, football has always been part of my life. So therefore going to see these young guys do what they're gonna be asked to, dude, during the season, it's it's it's really the most important part of my job. There's a lot of alumni from

Gramlins State, obviously including yourself. Let's just do a little test. Do you know any other alumni from Gramlin State that is air quotes notable besides your stuff? Ji Harris number one, James Harris, Jack Harris played quarterback for the Rams ye before me. He's one of nineteen sixty nine. Yeah, Buffalo Bills. You know, we got some guys. We just gotta make sure you know. You can't be proud if you don't know.

I mean, if they were with the Grammar I know. Okay, and you got guys who passed on like Buck Buchanan and Willard Davis and Learning Ladder. And then you got the Sammy White who was Rookie of the Year, you got the um, you got Andrew Glove who played tight end, and the Raiders. I'm saying, I'm trying to thank Jake, you gott you had. Jake played wide receive with the Minnesota Vikers, and of course you had Amazon Walls, who played the Dallas Cowboys. How about well, let's read where

I'm going with football. But this is this is my podcast, so I get to snag any name I want to. I'm sorry, Steve, We're trying to We're trying to expound on football, right, who can forget the captain man? Yeah? Okay, how about let me go with the East Coast guy. Okay, yes, he's a rapper beyond me now, but but he's already been around for a long time. You can even throw Eric about doing that if you want. Look at you.

I'm just you know, I got the strong and the stronger one time with the strongest man in the world. I like that. Okay, all right, last one, Charles Blow New York Times. You're writing for New York New York Times. Every time you look at more and he said he's talking about the association, ye blowing. Yeah, okay, cool, I'm good.

I'm gone now. I just I wanted, I wanted to expound on the alumni outside of football, and you know, and and I agree with that, and I certainly appreciate that man because if they went to Grammling and then somebody I know him, and they got some some people that are not somebody that I know Grammling, and you probably wouldn't know. But that's Grammar is all about the manto at Grammar is where everybody is somebody, and that's the most important thing. There's so much about your story.

So I'll start off with where are you from? Um in a place you call your hometown. Good. Yeah, I'm from a small town in Louisiana, zach or Louisiana. That's about twenty minutes, you know, kind of give you some proximity. About twenty minutes north the Batton Rouge I on the half from Natchez, Mississippi. Uh, listen, all town, and you know everybody in that town. Knew everybody in that town. And I stayed outside the city limits exactly, so it

wasn't exactly. I was always outside. There's only two people and Zachary that you probably would would know, and one of them has passed away. That was lay On the Clampets and and Doug Williams. So so we're two people that's from Zachary, Louisiana. And you know it's small town. And I try to get back as much as I possibly can. I still have two sisters down there and three brothers and UM daughters and cousin Auntie and everybody. So you know, zach we gonna always be my home.

So that's that's how I look at it. So growing up in Zachary, Louisiana, what did you experience as as as a young young Douglas growing up? Man? You know, when the old the more I realized what it was like, because during that time, um, it didn't seem like it. It was like that because I didn't know no better. I just knew what the rest of the community did

and what we had to do. And when your mom tell you you can't walk those streets at night, you got to get out, you know, up to we just call it up the road, down the road where you're going busy guys and people like that. But we couldn't do that once dark came, we had to get off the street. And not knowing why until I got older, and then all of a sudden, you know, every weekend,

you you had these guys. I lived in on Plank Road, which was like it was a cross road half a mile to my right, a half mile to my left, and in between that was all. It was all black, you know, everybody living there was was minorgas and black. And they used to brun across every Friday on the corner. And not understanding, being being a young boy, didn't you understand why they told you couldn't go out there. It was a scare, a tactor, you know, it was. It

was more or less keeping them in. They played, let them know where they staying. You know, when I look back at that's why they did it. And a lot of the older men in the neighborhood would take off in their trucks and cars or whatever with their guns, trying to catch whoever set the set the fire the cross burner, because nobody knew when it was gonna happen, if it was gonna happen. So it wasn't like they went down and said at the cross road. I'm sure

if they did, it wouldn't have happened. But they always did it when nobody was around. But but if you know, it's a reason why your mom your dad used to tell you, hey, when you go to certain places, just be careful and not really knowing that when you're young, but when you got older, you realize that people tried to scare you put the scare tactic because so many

things happening you're talking about. I was born in nineteen fIF five Civil rights movement and all that peace movement, so you understood what was happening to young black men and women during their time where we kind of stayed off the road during that time, and they like, come, you know, we were back out there. But at the time, you know, you knew what to do growing up, and

nobody had to tell you how to handle yourself. Because your mom, your dad, your grandmother whoever had already hit you to on them and they didn't stand around and and and go over what it what it was like being black a mom this time a year when Blue Clug claimed everybody else was burning crows. They didn't sat down and tell you that. They just told you to be careful and what you couldn't do at the dark. Hmm.

So how did that shapehim? Mold you moving forward as a young man when you know what, Like, like I said, now that I've gotten older and over the years, I kind of understood what was like, but but during that time I didn't. And the only thing we had to do in that community was to hold on to sports

one night with baseball, basketball and football. And we had so many young men, young guys in that neighborhood during that time, you know, we did and that all day when we wasn't at school, if it was out of school, that's what we did all day. You know. We was even chasing a baseball. We was over there playing touch of whatever, football, tackle football, you name it. We was

doing that, and we was playing basketball. We didn't have like they have today, a a you we didn't have no no Y M c A and anything we played on. We played on dirt court and we didn't have a goal. We took one of them twenty each rim and nailed it on the board. And I mean we we found a way to get it done growing up. So you know, when I look back down and I see all the things that these guys got men, and like, I got

two girls right now, younger girls. Don't know why I did it, but I got two younger girls four teen and sixteen. I don't know if you know. I know you old, but I don't know if you know there's something activities you do to get that now I'm learning. But the thing about that they both played AU basketball and every weekend I'm going on and I'm sitting there, man, I'm saying to myself, I got too. I'm saying if we would have had this growing up, I don't know

what I would have been. But but I'm enjoying watching them, you know, and my my tenth grader, you know, she was lucky enough the last few weeks to get offers from Florida State, Maryland State and a bunch of playss. So to me, that's that's what it's all about. But we couldn't do that back then because we didn't have no swimming pool now the neighborhood, we didn't have nowhere to play basketball into that. So I grew up in a tough era. But you made me and my brothers

and sisters. I think it made us and other people around us better individuals. So you're you're one of eight children, one of eight. You look at it, I'm the I'm the third youngest, or the sixth oldest, third youngest, the sixth. Yeah, depending on what you did, it was either the sixth oldest or the the he was just young. I was just the third younger. It all appears how you look at and um, you know, I look at it now.

The whole clans were all old. My oldest brother just turned eighty one, and um, you know, my youngest brother just turned sixty what sixty three years old? Sixty four? And and I got one that's two years younger than me. So we were all old. We but we we got a bunch of kids. We got a bunch of nieces and nephew that somebody has to take the rein like myself. I got I got seven grandkids. I just had one a couple of weeks ago. I got six boys and one girl, grand grandkids, you know, so I'm looking for

over there. Man. That's that's that's exciting, It really is. So at what point as a young man did you really start to see sports? Was it was the way out? When when did it click for you? You know, I used to be football wasn't in my life. I want to know part of football, Steve. I wasn't as tough as you was. When I was a little boy. You know, I didn't want to get hit. You know. I used to say, hey, if I'm playing football with the boys on the other and something, they always chose me for

some reading. The bigger balls always chose me. And I told him I'm playing wide receiver. And during that time, they're playing tackle football with no path and I would play, why wide receiver. I couldn't run a lick, but I played because I was gonna get in that contact. But but now if it was baseball or basketball, you know, I didn't mind. And and when I was like six or seven grade basketball, it was a player in the l s U during that time by the name of

Pisto Pee Merrick. And you know, I was playing middle school basketball. I thought, I really thought I was Pisto Peak. You know. I used to have big up his socks hanging down my ankle. And when it came to playing, I played no defense. So everybody get a rebound, I

waved down, Hey, throw it to me, you know. So that's what I did, and and and you know, and and grew up and eventually, you know, going to my ninth grade year probably taught me the biggest lesson in my life, which and that was coach Lucas, who was also the head football coach, was my junior voss to the basketball coach, and we were playing the JB game

and we was beating somebody to death. You know. He was about to score to a hundred, and he had the second team and at which I was on the second team at that time, and and and everybody to crowd to my weed want a hundred, We want a hundred, you know what I'm saying. We got to give him a hundred. And the next thing I know, I heard,

I heard the home blowing. He substitute us, you know, with about three minutes left in the game, and game not even close, and he put the starters back in, and you know, I walked by and I said, say, how the war a, you're gonna put a pull us out during this time? And he didn't say anything. So when the horn blew his time, he took me in a dressing whom he said, young man, I'm the coach. I make the decision. So I pulled my uniform off of my shoe and not throw it in his face.

But what did I do that for? Because my oldest brother just so having to be the vossitive basketball coach. And so he came back there, and you know, back then, we didn't have when he took ping pong table, they had what they call a horse that you set the table on top of where he pulled one of the boards off off that table and came back there with that board. And I ain't gonna say it, but he did, but he did behind and made me go in and

beg coach lucas partner, and I did. And eventually, you know that towards the end of year, I ended up being a start. And in that time that was the biggest lesson that I learned. No matter how good you thank you are, you're not as good as you are. And I learned and that at that particular time. And after that I became a mother citizen, a mate student

athlete and did what I had to do. Yeah you know what they say, Yeah, a hard head make a soft off behind period that a lot of time, Me too, I didn't really hear a lot my my behind felt it. Well we did too, But you know, my mom was was the enforcement. My dad was a little nicer. So when he did get you, he reminds you of everything you didn't do when he told you to do it. He'd be whipping you and bringing out all that. You know,

you know what they call that now? What they call it child that childer being what I tell my girls that all times. And y'all talking about child abuse, let me tell you something. Blessing my mama soul, bless my dad is. So if they we had a call and they would still be locked up, Yeah, yeah, they wouldn't get out because underneath anything, my mom hand, her hand would not extend your card. But not even when the

lamp caves a baller, it don't matter. He was gonna get the iron cord before she plugged it in, Like I got a whoop, and before the iron she ironed her close and then with me again or fresh out of the shower, shout if you got one when you was in the bed. Sleep Yeah, I got one of the best sleep listen. Almost cussed out of two because that's how scared I got. I know. And see, my dad used to have a bunch of dogs because he wasn't one of the guys that went hunting all the time.

And he used to tell her, don't you run. He didn't even have to hold and we didn't don't know better. He said, don't you run. I tell my dogs loots on you. And we just stood there and took it. And then when that weapon was over, what you did when got a bun that cover? Because don't wemp man hurt? There wasn't no joke. It would hurt to sit down to school the next day. Were you I ain't go home. I ain't going to school and tell him I got a whip it because I could have took my shirt

off his shoulder man whipped. But but I wouldn't know tell nobody I got a whipping. I thought, let warning them that look good. Good individual. I love cut to it and I love it even more when you download us and subscribe and you can follow us on social media too, Smithie where where at that's at? Cut to it on Instagram? What about Twitter? At? Cut to it Facebook? Cut to it featuring Steve Smith singr. What about online?

And you can follow us at cut to It podcast dot com where you can buy merch and you can subscribe to us wherever you listen to podcasts. I got all my answers questions, Um, yeah, I got all my questions answered. That's what I'm here for. A brother, cut to a podcast dot com. How would you describe your dad? Wow? My dad was was a strong, worlding looking man of big hands, you know, big neck. He wasn't as tall as I was by six feet, but he was. He

was built. You know. He told me, he told me this one time at that time you say, he said, look a white man told me one time, said, boy, your hand is big enough to go for that hunted with your with your fists. And my dad said he told him, and say they got some little bails out there, you know, but that's what it was. And and my man, my dad was a strong straight in the bid, uh you know, on Friday nights. And and I'm gonna say this,

my dad, he'll be all right with this. My dad ran the gambling game and and he he had some thud mentality. He wasn't a thug, but he had thud mentality. And you used to run the Grammar gambling game. I used to come home from from school from Gramming on Fridays and I said, I gotta go see my dad because I ain't gonna see him the Sunday. I'm gonna be gone because he'd be there all night, the night and Friday night and sad night, run again in the game.

So I used to go in there, go in the little room where they'd be packed back there and uh, he made his money by making the cup again he cut and I used to walk in there and look at me. He said you need anything. I said, no, I'm just holding that and he just say okay, see later. He didn't want me to be around anything like that. So even though I knew he did it, and and you know, but I can respect him for that. But he did what he had to do for the family,

and that was the most important thing. You know, back then, Gallant was big at them a little joke. Jakes understood what because because that's where he was. And we had a few of those around the around the neighborhood. How would you describe your mother, man, madel it was probably the greatest. When we all, I'm sure we all feel the same way. But you're talking about a lady who

take anybody in, feed anybody, didn't, Matta. The way my mom cooked was, um, she had an open pot, you know, she cooked with big pot, big bread pains and everything. And if you came to the house, she said, baby, you better get you some neat and she wasn't gonna fix it. It's up to you to go and get your own plate. And and that's what she did. But she But what I saw my mom do two was she raised so many grandkids, and all my niece and nephew, they were rather to be at my mom housing, at

their own house because the way my mom was. And you know, if you came to get get your kids, my mom said leave that, leave that baby along. And she wanted to stay here. You know, that's kind of what she was. She She loved to be around around us, but at the same time, she loved those grandkids. Man. And you know when when when she passed away, you can tell my mom had ated some grandkids and great great grandkids. Man, it was it was amazing when she passed away, to see so many um kids and grandkids

and great grandkids and the funeral that day. What was the one food that she particularly cooked just for you? Does you know it's one thing gonna always stick with me? And and she told me, he is. And I think that's the reason why I am like I am to day as far as being humbled. But one thing she told me, she said, just remember the same people you see on your way up, you can see him on your way down. And and I've never forgotten that. And you know, my mom was one of the mom that

I wouldn't fly. When I was in Tampa playing my mom. My dad didn'tn't rid It wasn't rid of football fan. He was a baseball fan the heart. He watched it on the game and they're on TV and stuff like that. But my mom would get on that Greyhound bus and we begged to catch the airplane. She wouldn't get on it. She'll ride two days the Temple to come to a game. And the only time my mom flew. And that's when you know you you know you got a mom. Is when I was in Washington and I got I had

back surgey. My mom got on the airplay for the first time and she flew up here. And the other time was when I played the Super Bowl. She went to the Super Bowl. And that's because my sister flew with her. Other than that, she wouldn't have flew down and she was watching the TV too. But because when I was hurt, you know, I'm like, I'm I'm just like her baby compared to the rest of them. That that's her baby baby on on his back and she

wants to come and see about him. So you know, when you think about my mom and like we all called it, um m deal, you know that was nobody like my my mom. Well, all the people on your way up impacted your coach, uh Eddie Robinson, head coach for a number of years at Gramdmlin's State to take us through your experience and what you were able to accomplish and do at Grandmar's State that has such a huge impact on you and made you who you are today.

But when number one, I was fortunate to have an older brother who probably and high school probably shaped me more than anything to give me that opportunity to go to grand My older brother Robert. He was the guy that made sure. He was kind of like if I didn't have a dad, you know, he would have been my dad. Him and his wife, you know, because he was he was coaching at at a at a high school. His wife was coaching the high school at Monroe, Louisiana.

And every Friday night at the game, I would get in the car with them, were driving Monro because he was going to see his wife. So I was like, I was a kid that they didn't have, and he made sure that I did what I had to do in in in high school. He made me play baseball, he made me play football. He didn't want who started me in football, because he was the first my first coach. He was a junior high coach. And he gave me an ultimatum and and he told me, he said, you

got two charges. And I actually w worth it. And he said either you played football or you with me, and I en't up playing football. Everything everything else is And his name is Robert Robb and he's named after your your father, my dad. So yeah, so that was that was it was your daddy and then it was

your daddy's son. He was both and there's all there's always one right, I got four, so there's always one that is that was that's always like their dad right to every degree, good, bad or in different and and he's the same to day. He calls me now to two times a week checking on me. I should be calling him checking on him, but he called me, want to know what I'm doing, And you know, him and I talked for a while. But you know when I went to Graham and he was the guy that was

always there for him. And then you know my mom, my mom absolutely loved Eddie Robinson because see Coach rob to be honest with never never ever thought me play a high school football game. We had a guy in our areabody named Adolph Bird who recruits uh Zachary Baton Rouge, New Orlean, that whole area. And Adolph Bird is the one that called Coach Roberson and let him know that we got this boy upon Zachary that we we should sign and one night late one night, and then we

had a party line on our phone. You know, you you're on the phone, you couldn't really be on the phone because we had eleven parties on our telephone back then. That was an old you know, you got that rotary thing. That's why I'm saying that packed bill bill I had when I when I was to come and Coach Rock called the house and I don't know, I was sleeping and and my mom came in and woke me up, and she said, hey, you go on to Gramlar and

Southern Universital, like twenty minutes down the street. I wanted to go to Southern because I wanted to be able for my mom dare to come to the gate. And she just came in and said, you go on to Grammar. And look, I said, why, why why do you say I'm going on to Ground And she said, cause Coach Robbers on the phone on I said, okay. She said, well, he said that you was gonna go to school, he was gonna graduate, and you was gonna go to church.

And she said that's enough for me. I said, okay, So you know, that's one of the best decisions my mom made to Ground. She made that decision. You said, okay, but inside your head he was rolling your eyes, so huh. And at first I was, I was, And then you know, I went to Gramling and be honest with you, Steve, when I went to Ground in the first year was

a tough year because it was two guys. When I got there, that was seven quarterbacks on seven and now all that and and that's where two guys coming in me and got an Terry Brown, you know, blessing soul. He just passed away probably about two months ago. And Terry Brown, let me, let me say that, and I'm gonna give him this problems. I would have given it to him a living like give me to enough. Terry

Brown could flat out throw the football. And he was the guy that coach Rob really wanted because you know, he had his receiver. They had two receivers, three receivers, because both of them came with with him. One went to Louisiana, tag one came to Grammar and then he had a junior that was left that that came in the next year, Carlos Pennywell drafted by the New England Patron in third round and and and Carlos came in. But he really wanted Terry, so he read for me

the first time. But what he did though, he said, but I want you to travel with the team to keep the stats. So I traveled the whole year and kept the stats. But the next year in the spring is when you really go out and see who's gonna be who. Now, we had Terry Brown coming back, We had Joe Como book on the other the other guy who was coming back eight to read your name, everybody using the thick of it. I know you, I know, I said, you had to think of all this stuff

going on, and and I bet you going well. He never told my mom it was it was about ten of him though no nobody knew that. Nobody told us that. But you know, I guess in the sop at that time, a lot of these guys couldn't go I couldn't go to these schools because they didn't want no black quarterback. That's a lot of them got caught up in that situation. And so we always there and every last one of them brought something to the table. They can chuck it,

they can run, they can't do everything. And then that spring, you know, we we went through all the spring and coach Rob coach the quarterback, and let me say that, he coached the quarterback. And we went through every drill that the offensive line, we went through, the defensive line deep. You know, we went through that monkey roll up and down and we're doing all that quarterback wasn't exemp from from from hitting the ground and doing all that stuff.

You had to do the same thing. And you know we're talking about five thirty in the morning, you getting up, going to practice, do on the ground. You know, quarterbacks don't like to get dirty, so we had to do it anyway. But as as the spring went on, at the end of the day, I ended up being the third quarterback in the whole group, per se. But one

of them was a hole over. He was a senior, seeing Joe Komo was a senior, and Terry Brown now is gonna be a sophomore or you can you can see a red story freshman because he didn't play that much. So Terry and I was you know, we weren't Nick and Nick by coach Robbins and standard. So I didn't like Coach Robins a lot. Let me say that my right earlier. I didn't. I wasn't a coach Robins and fan early on, because coming out of spring I thought I thought I had the best frame, you know, because

the spring games said you had the best frame. But when the season started I was third team and we played all coring up and up and know we played in Northwestern State up in Sreport and I did not play. Uh, Joe Coomo played Blessed. It so Terry played Blessed and I'm wondering why I didn't play. We ended up winning the game, like fourteen thirteen, and and I went back to the school the next day. I said, I quit. I ain't telling nobody quit. I just didn't go to practice.

So you didn't you didn't throw no jerseys and and and ninth grade. I didn't do that great. So I said, I'm transformed. I'm going to Southern. And I didn't go to practice that Monday. We had a guy. You would have to know this guy. He was He was the basketball coach at Graham, but he also was assistant football coach at Graham. And he was also coach rob left hand man. They called each other lefty. I'm up in

I'm up in the room watching the big balot. He all them boys, I ain't going to practice you all you you are all out. So when you all out, you watching television, you eat, You're over there eating snack. You go. I'm done. I'm done. I'm doing you. Look you look like you're eating a pecan pie. As you said. If I'm done, I'm done. If I had I was, let me say that. And and I heard a knock on the door. I said, come on in. And when I say that, for because he was done, Coach Hobby

walked in the room. And you know he's one of the guys that can sware up up and down the tree. He looked at me, he said, hell, hell cat, what the hell you think? And I said, I quit, coach. He said quit somehow, He said, you get He said, if you don't get out here and go down at the practice, boy, I put my foot up your ash so so so I went on the practice. Drug yourself.

You got got on the up, drug yourself. I got myself out that room, put on my stuff, and with the practice down the hill, and I went in where everybody was practicing. He was running plays, and I said, you know what, I'm gonna fix them. I ain't gonna say nothing to nobody. I'm I'm Dwayne Thomas. You know, you know Dwayne was one of them guys did say nothing to nobody. So I say, I'm gonna do like

Dwayne Thomas. I ain't speaking to nobody. And what I soon realized was the fact that I didn't speak to anybody. Nobody spoke to me. Yeah, yeah, I was a long range there. I got them and they said we got you. We got to nobody saying anything to me. So after practice, you know, I went on and took my stuff off and went off to the cafeteria to eat to eat that at the training table, and then one of the coaches came to me and say, Coach Roy want to see you. I said, for what he said, he wants

to see you? I said, okay. So I went down there and Coach Rob down there playing George Benson on the on the on the box. That's the only music he would let us listen to with George Benson all day long. So I went down there and as he said, Hell, what's wrong, cap, I said, Coach, I said, I'm I want to transfer. I want to transfer Southern verses. He said, oh, hell no, Cat, He said, I'm not gonna let you tranfer and come back and beat the hell out of me.

He said, he said, he said, the only reason why you ain't playing. Hell, I know, damn well, if I give you that job, them boys ain't gonna get it back. If I looked at him. I say, if you give me the job, they're gonna get it back up. I said, what we're trying to do here? He said, hell that that cat is a scene. Were trying to let him play and and tear it And I said, we're coached. How am I going to supposed to play? He said, hell,

that's alright, cat, You're gonna play. So the next game, two games late, we played Pair of You and and you know that was a whipping. We will beat Pair of You, beat the breaks out of him. And I played my first game. I drove the team down through my first TV pass to who Sammy White? I got that ball to this day at my house and Zachly I got that ball. Wow. And then I remember that Joe Coomo and tear it All played most of the game.

This is four quarter. What did coach Rob do? He pulled me out and put Terry back in there because he didn't want me to look better than Tarry, so he put Tarry back in there. And the next week we played Tennessee State and Joe Como broke his wrist in the first quarter and I hate that, but I mean that's where it happened. And then he put Tared Brown in there, so Terry was in there. Nobody was going anywhere, no offense, not our defensive playing really well.

And then he said, hey, whent that William boy, he forgot you. You can't find your helmet, No, because I wan't expect to the place. Boy, you can't do running around trying to find my helmet. I put my helmet and I went in, and you know what, we end up beating Tennessee State twenty one to six. And then next week, you know, he right into my Hell, I don't know who's gonna start. Hell, I got to confirm with my coaches who's gonna start. And that's sad that

he was up in. It's a SIMPI balance the delta devil. And in the dress room we said, yeah, let me go back here and talk to these coaches and find out, hell who we should start. Well, I knew I should have been starting, but coach Rob didn't want to hurt Terry Fillings, so he came back out and seeing him, he said, damn, will Am, you're gonna start today. But yeah, if you don't play, I'm gonna put Brown trying to make us. I said, okay, so I went in and uh,

that's the game. Then that's the sixth game in my room my freshman year. And after the sixth game, the rest was history. Ground didn't play at all the rest of his career. Hell cat, I like it. Let's get down to it, Hey, Gerard, why did you get that T shirt? You mean, oh, yes, I got it from cut to a podcast dot com where we have exclusive merchandise. Shout out to our guys at seven or fourth shot. But yeah, you can go on by with T shirts

subscribed to us wherever you listen to podcasts. Let's let's talk a little ball though a little bit. Because you've been around football for fifty sixty plus years, you've seen You've seen football at its high as peak as a super bow m v P. You've also been a part You've been part of teams who have struggled, right, you know, you've been part of the you know, the other football leagues, the CFL, the USFL. You've had to like I said, I like to you all, you've taken the scenic group, right.

How has your heart not gotten hard over the way you were treated to get to the National Football League When you look at it from the standpoint if if my heart had gotten hard, what was gonna do because they still the same thing. I got treated that way. The most important thing is to keep going forward, you know, not getting knocked back. I wasn't gonna let things that happened stop me from going forward if I had the ability to go forward, and fortunate enough, I was able

to do that. Like in three when you know when I left Temple, I missed the whole season. I didn't play. I didn't play one down in eighty three. So that was that was the whole season in my whole life. And I was content. Remember I had I had a daughter that was born in the eighty three and my wife had passed away. So the most important thing you need was find a way to raise this this baby girl.

And and if it was gonna be a high school coach, which you know when I went to Graham and that's what I wanted to be, that was all right with me. And then the USF the are calls, the tatams, you know, they called me and asked me that I want to come and play with them, and they treated me like an individual, not like a stocky. All the Canada. You know, they wanted me to be a staple of the franchise,

and they acted that way. You know. I talked to Bill Tatum about three months ago and the first thing he told me was, you know, my dad got your pictures in the living room to this day, you know, because that's how they treated me. And you know, went to the USFL met a lot of good people. Frank Coush was one of my coaches, played with some good people. Play wasn't some guys that wasn't. But I think as a whole, it was a lot of talent in there.

But Joe Gibbs, Joe Gibbs is the one guy who went to who was in Tampa at the time when I was a rookie, told coach McKay that, um, you know, if you're gonna draft the quarterback, you need to draft the kid from Grahamar And you know, John McKay was coming up at the high school. It was on the two coaches I wanted to play for, either Edar Robins and the John McKay. Why John McKay because in nineteen sixty five he played a guy by the name of

Jimmy Jones. He was a black quarterback, so color wasn't his issue, you know, It didn't matter to him because he was in the championship with a bunch of black players on his team, so it wasn't about colors. I got a chance to play for him. But Joe Gibbs was a guy that told him to do that. So he Joe left the next year and we got his

own team. Per se and when you have to fail folded out of all the teams in the league at that time, it was thirty team, it's only one guy called me, and that was Joe GiB Wow And he said he called me Douglas. He said, Douglas, that'd be five people now they have called you. I called I'm I'm counting you that five. Yeah, you're right, okay, I let you get away with that be the last time though. I'm just telling him that's all right, you did. But but anyway, he said, Douglas, and he got coach, got

that little funny laugh he does. Yeah, he said, how you got say good coach, how you doing all right? He said, I'm just calling to find out, um, you know, you know we heard we lost Joe Tiesman last year. I said, yeah, I saw that, coach. He said, I'm just calling the one that could you come to Washington to play back up. And I told him that out, I said, Coach, I said, I can play any up you one because I don't have a job. That was in August eighty six, and I got on there playing.

Two days later flew up to Calisle, Pennsylvania, and that's when I signed and in six got through the one past all of eighty six one pass and I was the backup quarterback. And in seven come around and they traded me. They traded me to the Raiders, and and and you know I got always played played the preseason game in l A at that time against the Rams, and we flew back home. You know, I played the

whole second half, played pretty decently. Flew back home. He said, look, we traded you to the to the Raiders because that Davids tried to trade for me when when my countract was up in Temple, but the owner didn't like Davis, so he didn't trade him. He didn't trade me. So when I got off the plane, coach round, Coach Gibs say, say, look, come to my office, and you know we're talking about this trade. And I said, okay. He said, come by

level thirt twelve o'clock. I said, okay. So I went home, packed my bag and let me in apartment, packed my bag, called everybody in Zachary, little Zach or Louise, and told him that I'm going to the Raiders, that I'm gonna be a raider, you know, let him I all know that I was gonna be a raider. And then when I went to the facilities and to Coach Gibs, he wasn't in the office at first, but the secretaries there.

So I said, there and weight on him. And he came in and said, haven't seen And he looked at me. He said, hai hai, He said, I changed my mind, and I immediately smile. Immediately, I said, Coach, I said, you can't change your mind. And he looked at me and he said, hey, I don't work for the Raiders. I worked for the Red Kids. And I just sat back in my chair. And then he said, look, I gotta feel him. It's the understood true. Coach Gibbs is one of the most spiritual in the visits that I

ever men. He said, look, he said, I got a feeling that somewhere along this line, you're gonna come in this game and we're gonna win this thing. He told me that that day, setting in his office. To be honest with you, I didn't give a damn what he said. I was still thinking about being traded and getting the chance to be a starter. So I just left out this offer and went downstairs the ball with the straight coach, and when worked out with the string coach, and and

the rest of his history. I guess. I guess that old man knew what he was talking about. Hey, he said it was gonna happen. And you know, that day, walking off the field, Coach Robb was was in the tunnel, and I adn't know Coach rob was even at the game. And and as the game we saw each other. We both hugged, we both were throwing snip everywhere. We both was crying, and and he told me, he said, cat,

he said, wasn't about them fol tds. You through. He said, the fact that you got off the turn, He said, you out off the turf and you finished, you know, And that's something you always told us, how you can't stay down. You got to get off the turf. And I got off the turf. And then I left him and went into the dressing room and coach gill was there and he looked at me and he hugged me. So I told you it was gonna happen. And that's what it was. How do you deal with knowing that

you're a pioneer, Well, you know what it's. First of all, it's a lot of respect and and and and I understand you know what what I compassed. But you know, I got to look back at Marlin Briscoe, James Harris, Um. You know, you got guys that came to Joe Gilliam. You got guys who came came before me that got a chance John Walton in the NFL. But you got guys that didn't get a chance in the NFL that

should have. So you know, you talk about taking the credit, you know, I don't think all the credit goes to me. You got so many other people that I was standing on their shoulders just like you. You know you said you was and on our shoulder. You know, I had to stand on some shoulders too, because to this day, James Harris and that just like for me, it's like an older brother, big brother. You know, we talked almost every day, uh daily, you know. And and Jimmy Ray,

who played at Michigan stay back in the day. You know, those guys to me meant so much to what they've done and what I was accompany. And then I look at a more in Moon, you know, the things that he did and had to go to Canada before he came into the league. Donald McNair, Steve McNair, and work Russell Wilson and and and mcmchone is doing Barron Left. There's so many other guys that for me. You know, if if I pay made the path, it wasn't because

of me, because the guys behind me. So we were all trampled down in that area that made the pass a lot wader for the guy that's coming behind us. Why Why is the quarterback position such a demanding pession but yet such a position also it's extremely hard to find the right guy. And you're right about that, Steve. You know, you really don't know when you got one until you got one, or you don't or you or you don't know, or you find out you got one

and he can't play. Yeah, you don't have one. No, And you're right, you know, And I look at all these guys man that play today and how much high hope that a lot of people have on certain guys and and for me and and me and James Has we talked all the time, a boy, certain players. Man, you know, you think about today, Tom Brady was a six round player. They didn't think he could play correct. That's so if nobody wants to admit that, no, but now there's well he's no Tom Brady. Well you didn't

think Tom Brady was down Brady exactly. So it all depends. Uh. Aaron Rodgers was what twenty Southern picked. Damn Marino was a late pick. They didn't think none of those guys was picked. When I came out, I was I was the only quarterback picked in the first round. But they had two guys on everybody board that was guy Benjamin and and Kavanaugh. They've Suppo been better than me. You know,

they made the All American team and all that. But but at the same time, at the end of the day, you know, you got to make the right to see it. And I think today is a little different than it was back then because you had to many people that just didn't want that black quarterback to be the face of my team. And that's the way it was. But today, if you had quarterback, you got to be facing the team.

And I think the whole mentality has changed a little bit, and hopefully it's still changes, because you know, we got some young guys that's gonna be still coming out in the next couple of years. And and this is my prediction. I might be wrong. I ain't been there right on a lot of things, but I'm looking for half of the quarterbacks in this league will probably be a color. And that ain't all bad. That's because they could play and the and the team wants to win. I think

that's the most important thing. The thing I struggle with quarterbacks just as an analyst is just overall as a receiver is um. It seems like every year the intangibles of the requirements to play quarterback seems to alter a very But yet there's you know, I've seen quarterbacks who maybe are inaccurate, still get a job. A guy who possibly can't recoverage this still get a job. Guys who processing system is a little bit slow and dated still maintains jobs. Um. Guys who are enable to just do

the required, just the basic requirements, still get jobs. However, a running back who can't read the whole he doesn't get a job. A wide receiver who can't catch, he doesn't maintain a job. Offensive lineman who cannot block, which is essential to being offensive lineman, he doesn't get jobs. How and why is the quarterback position covered it so much that they discount disabilities of why guys can't do their job and still get jobs and actually get signed

pretty healthy. Well, let me say, you know, I'm I'm I'm gonna refer that mostly to the backup quarterback in this league. Okay, yeah, I out talking about starters, but yeah, let's talk about backup still has a job. I agree, a lot of a lot of a lot of guys who started league can't play, but I'm looking at it from the backup standpoint. They can't play, But what they do better than anybody else, better than we do. They

become budded with the starters. So when that happened, the coaches are not gonna get rid of why they're close to the starters, and they could be there for ninety years. I can't play dead, but because every time the starter come out the field, who's in his phase? And so we don't do that. You know, uh, you know, if you're a black quarterback and you got a chance to be a backup. No, you're not in his face. You're watching to find out what's going on because you're trying

to learn where it takes. But that other guys in his face. And then when it's time your day off, you're going to play golf with him. And now you get a chance to play with the coaches, so that far we keep you around because you're that guy. And then what's gonna happen now and you're gonna be coming the head coach and somebody team somewhere. I just like,

I ain't got nothing against Josh mccow. Yeah like Josh, but but but how are you gonna get George McCown a head coaching job fresh off a team, and you got Jim car Well lest the Fraser bar and left with pud bowls, every being enemy all these guys I who have put in the work, you know, because he's a quarterback, because he's smart. That's how they stick around.

But then, like you said, you've got guys, a lot of guys ever go to the playoffs if you don't have that guy behind the center, and only very few of them, you know, if you get to when you get past twelve or thirteen, you know, it ain't a whole lot of guys that can play quarterback in this league. Well not, and because of what they can't do, and the fact that they can't play at all, They can't throw, they can't do a lot of things Like Chase This,

Chase McDaniels. Chase, Chase McDaniels has been around extremely long time. I know Chase um in passing. You know, I don't know him uh personally, but I know a lot of people speak highly of him. Um. However, I've never really seen anything out of Chase that I would go down down to the local mall and go by, like when they say, oh, Chase is releasing a new shoe, I wouldn't. I'm not driving down there to get Chase's shoe because I really haven't seen Chase doing anything. And there's nothing

against Chase. No, I know, I understand what you're talking about. You know, I remember when when he back up somewhere he's making seven million dollars and I'm trying to find out, h hell did you play? Says Dagon seven million dollars? What have you done? And you hope he doesn't play like he open. He didn't want You don't want to get it. He makes more money not doing anything, not doing anything, than you were doing something. Yeah, but why receiver.

That's why I, as an analyst, I struggle when I'm on television. I struggle because here's what I really love to hear. This is what I would really love to hear. Yeah, he's just not playing well. You always here Like I I was hearing someone say about a quarterback and I'm not gonna say who and all that stuff. I heard somebody say, Man, he's the hardest working quarterback I've ever been around. Stop lying, No, he's not. He's not. And I get caught up in why are you saying that?

But I know why they're saying it. But my struggle with it is you're saying it because it sounds good. It's the just the right thing to say, but you're doing the audience who's believing you because they have to believe you, because they have to take you for your word that what you're saying is succeed is sincere. But you're not sincere. You're instance. You are sincere in keeping that check coming in and not I don't want to say telling, but be honest. He's not the hardest working.

He can't be. Your team is not very good. Yeah. When I when I hear that, what I think is this the guy who who pumping him up somehow, some way. They know that guy and they don't want to bring him down because they don't want to be the one to tell the truth about it, because they're trying to make everybody else believe that he could. But they know somebody connected to him. Because when you say something you

don't know nobody, you're gonna tell the true. But but if you know him, you're gonna try to make sure that he knows that it is not true. But he ain't gonna he ain't gonna say it. He's gonna say something that's gonna probably Like you said, he works behind m I'm telling, which is probably, which is possibly. I believe that's correct. If they're practicing, they're working. They're working

right there are you? If you out especially here in the South, if you d C. Baltimore, Charlotte, UM South Carolina, Atlanta, Georgia, Florida, you out here working a ninety one degree weather, even if you're standing around, you are going to sweat. So you are working, But to say that he's the hardest working quarterback I've ever seen. I really want to say,

where where you last year? Yeah, where's the product? Like, no, he's not and and I'm not trying to say the guy can't play, but I don't say he's the hardest word. I've never seen anyone work harder I have. I've seen several people work harder. I've actually seen several people work smarter. That's the key. Even given bet, I've seen several people have more quality of work. But yet a wide receiver that can't catch, Oh he can't play. Oh he's not

fair man. You got quarterbacks out here that can't hit the bron s eye of a barn. They can't hit a dead cow not moving, and they get a hall pass. The sun was in his eye. I want to told a quarterback one time, the sun is in the same geographical location it was last week. Bro, tighten up. What are you doing looking at this? I five not that's all. What are some of the things you've experienced are just what you've seen being a player, you know, obviously going

to college. Uh, the journey you've had uh usfl cfl uh, not getting drafted, getting injured, Super Bowl MVP back up earning your way. You've experienced the highs and lows, the peaks and valleys of football as a player. What has been the difference now seeing it on the administrative side or the executive side? That really has uh shown you

the complexity of evaluating football? Well, you know Number one, um, not getting a chance to to to to be a genermanic with something that probably my low, but my high was still getting the opportunity to be involved, you know. I mean if you don't get that chair, don't mean you just quit and just walk away. Um, you know, be involved, and you get a chance to see a lot of young athletes. And then when I try to do Steve, when I when even to this day, when

I see one they come down in my office. You know, the one thing I tell them all the time is don't give the money back, you know, And that's the most important thing. You got a chance to make this money. Some of your great great great grandfather didn't have an opportunity to do. Don't go out and blow it, don't do crazy stuff things like there. And that's the biggest thing for me today that I get a chance to sit down and talk to these guys and just just

talk straight to him. Man, you got a chance to make enough money in the next five or six to seven years that you don't have to work them all and you can take care of your family and everybody else if you do it the right way. And and everybody's not gonna make a lot of money. We understand that. But some of these high profile guys, you know, I try to sit down and tell him, man, don't don't

give it back to him. Don't you know when you see a guy go out and do some stuff and all of a sudden, they bonus slips away from him and you took eleven million to a million dollar phone because of something stupid stuff that they did, like my man down Atlanta. Not to me. Man, that's that's one of the biggest loss that that he ever having his whole life, because you're not gonna make it up. You

can't make it up. And he's never gonna be that guy that people gonna value highly because of what transpired with it. Correct. You know, he might be on the team from team to team, but he's not gonna be what he was when he got there, what he should have been, or what he was potentially gonna become. Life is hard. It gets life is hard. It gets even harder when you're stupid. Yeah, that's what I'm saying, because

people don't remember that. And you know, the people at the top got really remember to Their job is on the line. Everybody's jogging on the line, and they're not giving. They ain't giving your money. For the hell of They're paying for a product. And if you producing their paid well, man, this has been this has been awesome. I appreciate the Doug. I appreciate your time, man, and I always respect you. I always love watching you and and seeing you on

the sidelines. Of all the years I was in Carolina, he was in Tampa Bay. Um, I always used to look forward to seeing you on the sideline and hearing the word of wisdom. But also too, I never told you always you were. You were like the uncle um that I never had, the uncle that you would see every so often. But you always knew when when when Uncle Doug was out there, he was gonna be sharp,

he's gonna smell good. You gotta show up. And so I always look at if Doug's out here, I'm at the whoop, I'm about to put it on these boys today. You showed up and you showed up man, well it was it was your smell good. It was because of you. That's your fault. Appreciate it, man, man, I appreciate it. He respect to you, Sir. I appreciate it. God blessed,

and I look forward to seeing you. I'll be working with the with the Pathers for preseason, so I'll be seeing you in the in uh down to training camp when we go down there. I can't guarantee you anything but uh if shure will be entertaining. I appreciate that you are a unique person. You are well worth it, you are competent, and most of all, your lovable. I'm Steve Smith Singior, I'm Gerard Little John and this is

cut to It. Cut to It with Steve Smith singor That Is Me is a production of Cut to It, LLC, Balto Creative Media, The Black Effect, and I Heart Radio. For more podcast from I Heart Radio, visit the I Heart Radio app, Apple podcast, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows from Cut to It. Executive producer Steve Smith, Singer, co host Gerard Little John, talent in booking manager Joe Fusci, Social media teamer Wesley Robinson and John Show from Balto

Creative Media, Cut Too. It is produced by Brian Baltaschevitch and Meredith Carter, with production assistance by Alex Lebrek, Production Coordinator Taylor Robinson. Theme music by Alex Johnson, lyrics and vocals by Anthony Hamilton. You ain't heard about it, then we're about to let you know. It's all