Oh thats are and welcome to the show.
This is the Cult of Conspiracy. My name's Jonathan, and today we are getting a little spooky, a little in the spirit of Halloween, and we're going to be talking about something that most people probably haven't heard of. I do want to give a major shout out to the Museum of Tarot. I follow him on Instagram. Great guy. I eventually would love to get him on the show.
I've talked to him, talked to I talked about him in the past before because he's the one that kind of brought back the Disian and goggles, which are badass. I'm like super impressed that he was able to do that. But he was talking about this story and I thought, maybe I'll look a little bit deeper into it, and holy shit, have you ever heard of Fillip the Ghost?
Fill up the Ghost? Give me an area of the world we're talking about?
I have?
Well, this was like forty years ago ish, I don't remember exactly what the date was, but basically, this group of people called the Owen Group, they all got together and decided, Yeah it was in the seventies, so about fifty years ago now, but they all got together and they were trying to, you know, lab science style, try and figure out what's really going on whenever somebody creates, whenever somebody does like a seance or to try and create a ghost or a tulpa or an egg rigor
like what really goes on, like out of the spiritual mentality, out of the religious mentality, Like we're just gonna document whatever happens and just try and see if there are people out there that are just full of shit, or
if there's actually something to it. Maybe there is something to it, but that people don't understand exactly what they're communicating with and so they're trying to really just completely open minded, third eye all the way open as we like to say, and and just trying to figure out what went down with it. And so yeah, it's it's
pretty interesting, dude. And I think that for anybody out there that is ghost hunting or staying at haunted hotels and haunted houses like actual ones, not like carnival shit, and or anybody that is taken there. What is it called like an EVP, is that how they tracked the ghost shit.
It's not an EMP. That's the electromagnetic poles. I know he's talking about.
Yeah, basically to try and pick up on some kind of ghost sounds. And dude, I actually got a lot of hate from from uh my opinion about what was actually going on with that, because people really they really believe that, hey, we can talk to ghosts, We're talking to disembodied spirits, right, And this basically people that were in like the that are real into ghost hunting and and just trying to pick up, you know, with with their little devices maybe some disembodied sounds or something like that.
Although I do hate met on the cult on the cult, yeah, like in the comments because I mentioned it like a while back, and uh, but that's fine. I mean, everybody's
entitled with their own opinion. But yeah, and and basically what I was saying is is that, you know, I believe that what's really going on is is that you're putting out the energy and the emotion of wanting to connect with something that is outside of you and maybe maybe like somehow, some way, we are the ones that are generating what we're picking up those on those devices.
But doesn't that.
Take away from the validity then And I'm not saying this that's some sort of a matter of fact thing I'm genuinely curious in your opinion. Right, So talk about the double set experiment. Right, molecules and atoms know when they are being watched, and they behave differently based upon this. Right, setting intentions is important because it can literally change your environment if you do it in such a way.
So I get this.
So if you are going out, and you're going let's say it's just some abandoned house and there's some local rumor and legend about what went down in this house thirty years ago, and you go in there with your devices and your spirit box and your whatever else, right, and you are trying to pick up on something, but you are like wanting so hard to pick up on something that any small thing becomes.
You heard it too, right, You just heard it.
In reality, it was like a blip as opposed to somebody who's going in there. Just like, listen, I'm not saying I do or don't believe in shit. I'm just here to take some readings and they pick up on readings. Right, one of them seems more valid than the other, doesn't it? Or am I just kind of making stuff up here?
I mean, and I don't know. I've never been ghost hunting per se, but just as an outsider looking in, I kind of look at that as we're the ones that are the battery that is ultimately creating that, whether it be energy or something that is emitting from us, not necessarily that we're picking something up on the outside. And I actually believe, and I could be wrong on this,
This is just an idea. I believe that it's possible that that's what people are like picking up on whenever they go bigfoot hunting too.
So just so we're all on the same page here, even because you've done this research before, he presents it to me here this evening. Okay, So I have no idea where we're about to go. First time hearing about Philip the ghosts, I thought I might know this is. This is from America, Europe?
What I oh, you know what, I don't exactly know where it is. We're gonna read about it.
We'll get you.
So you are still, even after your research, you're still of the belief that this is basically people manifesting these things. It's not something that's inherent in this house and they are just picking up with their with their readers and shiit as of right now, like I'm saying the person's the battery.
That's kind of like where I lean. I'm not saying that I one hundred percent know. It's just like you know, that's where my gut tells me, and it's and to be honest, whenever it comes to this, this experiment that we're about to talk about, even they left it open ended just so we're clear, like it's not like an open and shut case, So feel free to have an opinion whenever we're we're reading through. I'm not going to have like a gotcha moment or on this because I
don't know, they don't know. They kind of just left it up to like, Yo, this is what we documented and uh, it's not what you thought, you know, like at least the data that they were able to collect on it. So we are going to be talking about how a psychical research group brought Phillip the Ghosts to life. Are you ready for this one?
Dude?
I am, dude, let's fucking go yes, Yes, And so yeah, I did want to say if anybody wants to be able to see the articles that we are that we're going to be alluding to rather than just hearing about it, then come over to Patreon dot com slash Cult of Conspiracy podcast.
That link is down the show notes below. It's the best way to be able to support us, and we appreciate all the good Cult members who have done so already. The main reason why most people come over to Patreon is because it is completely yeah buddy, But we also
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to throw that out there. So now we are going to go to live about dot com. This is my first time ever hearing of this website and we actually got two of their articles today, so shout out to them. So, yeah, how a psychical research group brought Phillip the Ghost to life. Now you might be wondering what the fuck is this
goal research group? That's kind of like if you remember back in the seventies, the CIA was doing a lot of remote viewing shit, and you know all the weird physic psychic shit that they were doing back then kind of the same thing, right, Like Uri Geller was never a CIA agent, He just worked on behalf of them, and like a bunch of other people like that that were super into consciousness and quantum stuff and you know, like the spooky action at a distance that nobody can
really understand or explain like that kind of stuff. So just want to throw it out there. And we also have an article about how Northilpe Grumming is going to say, well you can't do this, We're gonna We're gonna create some electronics that allow you to do it. Okay, so it's gonna get really weird. I had to bring them in because I saw that article and I was like, get the fuck out of here. You want to talk about transhumanists. That's really this is like what I believe
they're really trying to do. They want people to get suit super excited about this kind of stuff and look into it and maybe even try it and then give up because most people are into you know, one or two or three minute videos before they move on to the next one on TikTok and you know, everywhere else, and so they know that the patience that the people have is very thin. It's you need a lot of patients. Whatever you're doing, like this kind of work, right, like
these people. Some people they do it for a couple of days without getting any signs. Most people just move on, right. And so nowadays you have the military industrial complex saying don't worry, we got your back.
So I mean, you tell me we're combining ghosties with the military industrial complex. I mean, you have my undivided attention, sir. Let's fucking go.
Let's go. So but first we before we get to that, So it starts out by saying this, consider these familiar experiences. A group of teenagers gathered around a Wiji board receives mysterious messages from a person spirit who claims to have died forty years ago. A parent normal society conducts a seance where they contact a ghost that communicates by rapping on a table. And I didn't know what rapping on a table meant, so I had to look it up.
Wrapping on a table, happing, Well, it says rapping table rap, but.
That also like hitting or tapping.
So table rapping refers to the sounds of knocking or tapping made on the table, often attributed to spirits communicating with the living during spiritualist sessions.
So I did.
I'd never heard of that term before. You think I would have, but nope, it was my first time. Yeah. I've never really done the whole seance thing though, you know, I mean i'd be interested, I'd be interested, but no anyhow. So, yeah, and continuing, the residents of a of a century old home see the spirit of a young child playing in the hallway. Everybody's heard of these stories and maybe you've seen a movie on it, right, Yeah, so what are
these manifestations. Are they truly the ghosts of departed people or are they creations of the minds of the people who see them? Quite the interesting question. There so many researchers of the paranormal suspect that some ghostly manifestations in poltergeist phenomena, whether it be objects flying through the air or unexplained footsteps and door slamming, are products of the
human mind. To test that idea, a fascinating experiment was conducted in the early seventies by the Toronto Society for Psychical Research also known as TSPR to see if they could create a ghost. They were trying to create this fucking thing right out of thin air. The idea was just to assemble a group of people who would make up a completely fictional character and then through seances, see if they could contact him and receive messages and other
physical or physical phenomena, perhaps even an apparition. So I saw that, and of course I grab my attention right, It's it's crazy.
You got a group of people to create, I guess, for the lack of better words here an imaginary friend, and then they were going to see it. They could make technology to communicate with this thing.
Well, they had the technology to be able to record it, and not even just technology. I mean you're talking about like and we're going to get into it, but you're whatever somebody might experience that is paranormal within a seance, within ouiji borg, within a tarot reading even right, like whatever kind of spooky action that you know, oh my god, that I know that there's a spirit here, right, whatever kind of shit that is, and how they would record it.
This is what they're trying to document. It is the actual physical evidence of this thing existing. And so they were trying to create one to try and see like, all right, are these disembodied spirits or is this something that the human mind is literally creating? And there's it's kind of a perceptual reality, you know what I mean.
So that is where we birth Philip, Oh, Philip the tspr under, the guy of doctor A. R. G. Owen three initials, and then Owen assembled a group of eight people called from its membership, none of whom claim to have any psychic gifts. The group, which became known as the Owen Group, consisted of doctor Owen's wife, a woman who was the former chairperson of MENSA. I don't know what that is, an industrial designer, an accountant, a housewife,
a bookkeeper, and a sociology student. A psychologist named doctor Joel Whitten also attended many of the group sessions as an observer. The group's first task was to create their fictional character real quick.
MENSA is a worldwide IQ group. That is, MENSA International is the largest and oldest high IQ society in the world. It is a non profit organization open to people who score at least at the ninety eighth percentile or hire on standardized Supervised IQ or other approved intelligence tests. If I'm not mistaken, Natalie Portman is also a MENSA member, along with Shakira Oh.
Her hips didn't lie neither, and she.
Also speaks four languages. He's actually fucking brilliant. But anyway, I do love me some Shakira.
So anyway, that person and a bunch of other people got together and they were they So the group's first task was to create their fictional historical character, so literally, a fake character that they built the history off of, like they created history with right. So together they wrote a short biography of the person that they named Philip Aylesford. Here in part is that biography so it says. Philip was an aristocratic Englishman living in the middle sixteen hundreds
at the time of Oliver Cromwell. He had been a supporter of the king and was a Catholic. He was married to a beautiful but cold and frigid wife, Dorothea, and the daughter of a neighboring nobleman. One day, when out riding on the boundaries of his estate, Philip came across a gypsy encampment, shout out to the gypsies and saw there a beautiful, dark eyed girl, raven haired gypsy girl, Margo,
and fell instantly in love with her. He brought her back secretly to live in the gatehouse near the stables of Diddington Manor, his family home. For some time, he kept his love nest secret, but eventually Dorothea, realizing he was keeping someone else there, found Margo and accused her of witchcraft and stealing her husband. Philip was too scared of losing his reputation and his possessions to protest to protest at a trial of Margo, and she was convicted
of witchcraft and burned at the stake. Philip was subsequently stricken with remorse that he had not tried to defend Margo and used to pace the battlements of Diddington in despair. Finally, one morning his body was found at the bottom of the battlements, whence he had cast himself in a fit of agony and remorse. So this is the fake history that they created this for this guy, right, this is.
Very fake history because like, oh, I'm not trying to like poke holes in it because it's their narrative and I'm not trying to shit here. But like English in the sixteen hundreds, then he was a supporter of the king, but he was also a Catholic. That's conflating things here, because like the king was Protestant the sixteen hundred. They're not like King James the First, the writer of the King James Bible, Oliver Cromwell was a Protestant who murdered,
genocidally murdered Irish Catholics. That's why I would say, to the day I die, fuck Oliver Cromwell. And yeah, this dude was a nobleman who was also Okay, it's kind of weird, it's a little out there, but that's kind of.
The point in this case, right, Well, I mean you could also suggest that they that they did it that way on purpose because there couldn't have been this character whoever existed, right, They contradict too much so the Owen group even enlisted the artistic sick talents of one of its members to sketch a portrait of Philip with their creations.
With their creation's life and appearance now firmly established in their minds, the group began the second phase of the experiment contact let's go okayby so, all of that, the history, the picture, you know what he looks like, you know where he comes from, you know what he's about, you know that he was kind of hoeing around on his wife whatever, right like that is cemented into the image that people have of this character that they're now trying to connect with through the use of a seance.
Okay, okay.
So in September of nineteen seventy two, the group began their sittings, informal gatherings in which they would discuss Philip and his life, meditate on him, and try to visualize their collective hallucination in more detail. These settings, conducting in a fully lit room, went on for about a year with no results. A year. Dude, this is how like
consistent they were with the entire thing, right wow. Some members of the group occasionally claimed that they felt a presence in the room, but there was no result that they could consider any kind of communication from Philip, so they changed their tactics. The group decided that they might have better luck if they attempted to duplicate the atmosphere
of a classic spiritualist seance. They dimmed the room's lights, sat around a table, sang songs, and surrounded themselves with pictures of the type of castle they imagined Philip would have lived in, as well as objects from that time period, and it worked during During one evening seance, the group received its first communication from Philip, in the form of a distinct rap on the table. Soon Philip was answering
questions asked by the group. One rap for yes, two for no. They knew it was Philip because well, they asked him. I mean, hey, how else are you gonna get clarification on him? The sessions took off from there, producing a range of phenomena that could not be explained scientifically, though through the table rapping communication, the group was able
to learn finer details about Philip's life. He even seemed to exhibit a personality conveying his likes and dislikes, and his strong views on various subjects, made plain by the enthusiasm or hesitancy of his knockings. His quote unquote spirit was also able to move the table, sliding it from side to side, despite the fact that the floor was covered with thick carpeting. At times, it would even dance on one leg. Okay, what yeah, dude, Yeah, it's fucking wild.
And so this was Philip, like it told them, yep, I'm the guy you've been seeing, Like this is me.
This is yeah. This They were calling him out and and like group meditating and trying to like bring him out right, and like the the table was moving around so much that it got up on fucking one leg, dude. So I don't know, this is much. This is much more than just a Ouiji board kind of setting here, right, yeah, a little bit. So now we get to Phillip's limitations and his power. This is going to be interesting. So that Philip was a creation of the group's collective imagination
was evident in his limitations. Although he could accurately answer questions about events and people of his time period, it did not appear to be information that the group was unaware of. In other words, Philip's responses were coming from their subconscious, their own minds. Some members thought that they heard whispers and response to questions, but no voice was ever captured on tape. Philip's psychokinetic powers, however, were amazing
and completely unexplained. That would be the table moving around, and the little wrappings and whatnot. If the group asked Philip to dim the lights, they would dim instantly. When asked to restore the lights, he would oblige. The table around which the group sat was almost always the focal point of peculiar phenomena. After feeling a cool breeze blow across the table, they asked Philip if he could cause it to start and stop at will. He could, and
he did. The group noticed that the table itself felt different to the touch whenever Philip was present, having a subtle electric or a live quality. On a few occasions, a fine mist formed over the center of the table. Most astonishing, the group reported that the table would sometimes be so animated that it would rush over to that the table would be so animated that it would rush over to meet late comers, to the session or even trap members in the corner of the room. The table
is moving, okay, just so are clear on that. Some people would say there's demons in here. Maybe there is. I don't know.
I want to reserve my own opinions until we get the whole story.
But all right, I mean weird, right, Like, if you'd never seen this before, you would assume that there is a fucking poltergeist about right a little bit so. The climax of the experiment was a seance conducted before a live audience of fifty people. The session was also filmed as part of a television documentary. Fortunately, Philip was not
stage shy in perform above expectations. Besides table wrappings, other noises around the room, and making lights blink on and off, the group actually attained a full levitation on the table. It rose only a half inch above the floor, but it was but this incredible feat was witnessed by the group and and the film crew. Unfortunately, the dim lighting prevented the levitation from being captured on the film. Damn, imagine getting that caught on camera.
Wow, And it.
Says and by the way, I mean, we don't know these people could be full on shams, right, there's like it's hard to get validation and to find out if it's a real story. I'm more inclined to believe that it's real because these people literally they they dedicated, you know, a large portion of their life to try and figure what this, what this is for science? Right, So I mean, do do what you will with that.
So we're gonna keep going here.
But yeah, I pulled up in article actually shows the picture of Philip that they made in all of these things.
So I'm excited.
I am excited to see because apparently they made a movie based off of this.
Yeah, I think that that's what this is, the Philip Experiment.
Oh, this is an actual video of it. So for anybody who doesn't know, if you ever heard of the movie The Quiet Ones, oh, that is based off of this.
As a matter of fact, Yes, I actually have an article that's going to be showing like what parts are from this experiment and what parts did Hollywood take their own liberties too? So anybody has ever seen that?
Interesting?
But this is the actual footage of what was going on, right, And we're not gonna watch it or anything, but you can kind of see how the group is all around this one table and.
Maybe they'll get to it. But it's eleven mites. It happened in Canada, just so we're clear. It happened in Canada. Although the guy uh three letters Owens was from Britain, so like he was from that area, but then he move move to Canada for the experiment, so like the whole the idea, like a British nobleman and all these things like that's where that whole thing came from.
But still interesting.
Oh yeah, dude, so uh and maybe we'll go back and watch a little bit more of that actual the actual footage of it, because that's what they said. They had the film crew there, so all right. It says although the Philip Experiment gave the Owen group far more than they ever imagined possible, it was never able to attain one of their original goals, to have the spirit of Philip actually materialize. That was their goal. Wow, that's I mean.
Like materializing what way? I mean you're making a table move maybe bringing material to me. You may actually physically appear.
Maybe like see a ghost or you know something like that.
Okay, okay, I got you.
So it goes on. It says the Philip experiment was so successful that the Toronto organization decided to try it again with a completely different group of people and a new fictional character. After just five weeks, the new group established quote unquote contact with their quote unquote ghost named Lilith. How about that, But this Lilith, what you know, the the fictional history of this character was a French Canadian spy. So not the Lilith, not the one that was like
Adam's girl or anything like that. But this is something different, interesting, interesting to call that name out in a in a setting like this, though, you know, I was.
Gonna say, but all right, yeah, let's go.
So other similar experience conjured or experiments conjured up such entities as Sebastian, a medieval alchemist, and even Axel, a man from the future. All of them were completely fictional yet produced unexplained communication through their unique raps. A Sydney, Australia group attempted a similar test with the Skippy experience experiment. The six participants created the story of Skippy Cartman, a
fourteen year old Australian girl. A group reports that Skippy communicated with them through raps and scratching sounds, so everybody's getting a little something from this, at bare minimum, a couple of taps on the table, you know, Like that's enough for me. Like that's if I saw that. If I heard that, if I was in that setting, I'd be like, okay, you sold me right, Like what else could explain that?
So I find it interesting that their first go round took over a year before they had any kind of thing happen. Next experiment took five weeks, So it seems like they might have figured out how to correctly perform a seance. Maybe that year's time they were doing an experiment. Okay, for anybody who does conduct seances, keep in mind what
I'm saying right now is completely out of ignorance. Just bear with me, maybe, Like okay, so does the candle need to be at the very corner of the table or does it need to be about six inches in from the table?
Does that matter?
Does it not like they were really giving it a real experimental the old college try if you will. So maybe it took them that long to find exactly what to do to get a response.
I don't know. And I'll tell you this, dude, just from the magicians that I've talked to in the past and stuff like that. They'll say that, you know, the big thing that you want to do whenever you're working with an angel or a demon or a spirit or something on the other side, the main thing that you want to do is try and gather as much information as you possibly can about them, because you want to know who they are so that you can connect to
them like mentally a little bit, you know what I mean. Like, you know, if you're calling on Abe Lincoln but you don't even know that his favorite color was red, then are you really connecting to them kind of thing. I mean, that's more of a contrived example, but you know, you want to try and get as much information about that about that entity as you can because you're trying to almost quantum entangle yourself with them. That's the idea behind it.
From what I understand, so pretty interesting. I mean, it's all mental, is what you know. You're trying to mentally connect. So anyhow, moving on, it says the conclusion is is that what are we to make of these incredible experience experiments. While some would conclude that they would prove that ghosts don't exist, that such things are in our minds only others say that are unconscious could be responsible for this
kind of phenomena. Some of the time they do not, in fact, cannot prove that there are no ghosts, so they left it up to interpretation. They're like, we don't know if it's absolutely ghosts or anything. But everybody that was over there, they knew that they created this fictional character. It was performing as they thought that it would, right. It was giving answers, it was tapping on the table. It was doing literally exactly what they expected outside of
materializing in like a ghost y type form. Right. So, I mean they were led to believe that this could have been something that was kind of mentally charged, which is quite fascinating. So where was I So another point of view is that even though Philip was completely fictional, the Owen group really did contact the spirit world a playful or perhaps demonic Some would argue spirit took the opportunity of these seances to quote unquote act as Philip
and produce the extraordinary psychokinetic phenomena recorded. See this is where it gets a little muddy, because you're like, all right, well, these are just the tricksters. This is somebody who is pretending to be this Phillip character, right, and maybe that's the case. I mean, I don't know how you would go about proving that. Maybe if they kept it around for long enough, and maybe Philip would take a little turn and you know, get inside somebody's mind and say, hey,
let's drive off this cliff together. Who knows?
I mean, right, Fuck dude, I don't know.
I'm just saying, like, sometimes things take a wrong turn. I don't know, but it says so.
This experiment took a wrong turn, though at.
Least not documented.
Right, Okay, okay, right.
So in any case, the experiments proved that paranormal phenomena are quite real, and like most such investigations, they leave us with more questions than answers about the world in which we live. The only certain conclusion is that there is much to our existence that is still unexplained, which is my favorite. I love the unexplained shit more than anything I think. So, yeah, I had table wrapping. That
was the knocking on the table. Now I want to get over because you had mentioned it a little bit early. That's the one I pulled up. Yes, dude, yeah, yeah, So this is actually called Hollywood or history versus Hollywood dot com and this is the Quiet Ones history versus Hollywood, So we wanted to see, like, all right, where do the stories actually match up? Because there is more details to that story about Philip that was kind of an overview. We're going to get to a little bit more of
that story later. But yeah, uh so, where does it actually match up with the story? And for anybody that's ever seen The Quiet Ones, so this is the you know, it just shows the different faces of the characters in the in the story and then in the movie. The questioning the story is the girl in the movie Jane Harper based on a real person? No, because this is literally based on somebody creating a fucking tulpa, right like, So it can't be based on any real character because
it was never a real character to begin with. So it says no, the character is entirely fictional. The real experiment did not involve researching the negative telekinetic energy surrounding a troubled girl in an effort to separate her from it and or stop her from producing it. Instead, the real life research team attempted to manifest to go solely from a fictional character they made up and named Philip Aylsford.
In the movie, Professor Joseph Coopland and his team focus on Ev, the demonic being that they believe is attached to the unstable girl Jane Harper. They perform experiments on Jane in hopes of separating her from the Poulter guy. In the beginning, Professor Coopland believes that the malevolent spirit EV Dwyer is not a Poltergeist at all, but merely a manifestation of the negative energy that produced that produced by that was produced by Jane, much like a cancer.
He believes that it can be drawn out and removed, in turn healing Jane. That's how the movie.
Went, right, gotcha? Gotcha?
So obviously Hollywood's gonna take their little liberties and everything. But so what year did the real experiment? The Philip experiment happened, and happened in nineteen seventy two, and I can't remember there was something else. Oh, check this out. So this is the seance in the actual movie, because I believe in the movie they were trying to transfer the spirit from her into this little baby doll, right.
Of course, because why would you use what kind of container do you use for a Poultergeist? Clearly a doll is the correct answer. I mean, we got fucking Annabelle who matt rifhones.
But whatever, not everybody has a spare pig that they can cast the negative spirits into.
Jacob I was thinking maybe like a crystal ball or something. I don't know, Maybe that's just Hollywood eching its.
Way through my brain at this point.
I don't know.
I don't even know if that would work.
Yeah, I don't know either. But and then this is the real group right here of the people that were kind of trying to bring Philip to life. So you can, man, look at how old school that shit is with the check like the the checker pants right here, and.
They all have plaid pants.
All the women have the short hair weird. Yeah. So yeah, it's just like your grandma's look, you know. Yeah. Sure, So it says what was the purpose of the Philip experiment? So in researching the Quiet Ones true story, we discovered that the purpose of the real experiment was to prove that the supernatural is a manifestation of what already exists in the mind. Proving such a hypothesis true doesn't necessarily
mean that ghosts aren't real. It just means that they are created by us instead of instead of coming from somewhere else. For example, if you grew up fearing an evil old woman that lurks under your bed and will grab your ankles when you step onto the floor, you imagining the woman in detail could be enough to manifest
her into actual demonic spirit. Tell me you haven't thought about that before, Like you've ever been scared to hang a leg off the bed while you're sleeping, or scared to walk down like a dark hallway, and like you start to get like these weird images that pop into your head that only scare you even more. And maybe it's that energy that's scaring. That fear is ultimately the battery that creates, at least the perception of it. That's kind of what they're alluding to.
Well, I mean every kid has had that, right, every ill on them it's an old woman under your bed or something. But the monster under your bed, right, that is a That's an old trope that has been around for forever. But I mean we've talked about how powerful the mind is multiple times. You know, as a kid, I can remember one time my closet was open and
the lights were all off in my room. And I didn't have a night light or anything like that, so it was pitch black except for like what was being shown from like the street light through the blinds in my room, you know what I mean. Cool, And there was something in my closet, and I know for a fucking fact there was and I'm like, what in the hell is that thing? I swear I saw this thing move, and I'm like losing my fucking mind.
I flip on the light. It was a sweater that was.
Like balled up in a weird way on top of a shelf that I had in there. And that's why it was out of the norm, because I'd never balled up my sweaters and put them in my closet. I would throw them in a hamper, right, But for whatever reason, this was there, and I swear I saw that thing move. But once I turned the light on, I could see like, oh, I literally made that up in my mind, Like that's that's all this was. But the mind is a very powerful thing.
Isn't that crazy that that's even a thing? Though, Like, dude, our minds are so much more powerful than we give ourselves credit for. And most I'm not gonna lie. Mostly
it's two people's demise. Like, especially if it's something like this, it's usually something scary because most things that are scary is the unknown because you don't know what to expect, right, and uh, if you're getting you know, steps in a hallway or you know, some kind of shadowy figure at the foot of your bed, you don't know, so you're gonna be scared shitless. And that's what I believe that they're trying to say. Here is that, dude, it is
our mind that is generating it. Now what is even creepier to me, at least, is that it's sometimes, yes, it is only just one person that is experiencing that, but if you get a group of people all with the same all with the same goal in mind, and they're all thinking about it, they all know exactly, you know, like what this character's gonna sound like, what this character's gonna do, what's the history of it? Now that becomes amplified and everybody can experience it.
See, that was what I was about to say. Next.
Now I'm talking about something in my own mind that as soon as I flipped the light on it could see what it was. The quote unquote fear behind it went away. Instantly, and I realized, no, the thing didn't actually move in my closet, I saw it move, but I could see, oh no, because of the way this sleeve was. It like looked a certain way, and my brain made it look like it had moved.
Whatever.
That is very different than a table with four legs getting up and spinning on one of its legs.
Right, that's two completely different conversations.
It is. But it starts with one person, but you get more people. It's just like you know, praying with multiple people, or people that go out and do the CE five shit in the desert. You get a big group of people, you're more likely to see some kind of fucking orb out there or whatever. At least that's what people say, right, Like, you gather more people, it's
only amplifying the energy. And what, in my opinion of what's really going on is is that since they're all thinking it and they're all believing it, they're all expecting it, they're almost all tuned into the same frequency, almost like they're all dialed into one oh two point five on the radio, right, Like they all they're all listening to the same song on the fucking radio, and maybe nobody else that's not dialed in wouldn't be able to see it.
I don't know, maybe that I don't know if that would That would be an interesting test subject, right right to see.
Every day when you perform this experiment, have a rando just who's not even affiliated with this experiment whatsoever.
Just to sit at the table with you, right right, because is it just happening in our mind? And you know, if it is just happening in our mind, how are multiple people able to observe said thing that is just a perception thing? So is it more of just our mind? Or are our minds so energic energetically fused together to the same radio band that somehow it brings it into physical existence. That's the question to me.
Anyway, this is interesting. Let's keep going, dude.
So taking the theory even further. The research is behind the Philip experiment gave the character that they were imagining a full life, including a name, a nationality, a past, and a personality. During their seances, they tried to converse with Philip. They're once fictional character. They believe that Philip. They believe that giving Philip such realistic traits and attempting to communicate with him would help conjure up an actual ghost. So that is and here's the picture that they drew
of Philip, Right, it says, so what it looks like like? No, it looks like the fucking caveman from the Geico commercials, right, get a little bit, a little bit.
So it was a sketch artist and this is a fictional person, so it doesn't have to look like, you know, the greatest self portrait ever or no, you know, I get.
It right, And it says, did they really hold seances to communicate with the ensity? Yes, However the real seances were much more tamer. Obviously, you know, it's not going to be hollywooded, you know, like that, and so yeah, it's it's similar. But I mean whenever some like a movie says that it is based on you know, true a true story, that can mean like zero point one of a percent out of the entire one hundred percent, right like, as long as they're pulling something from it.
And that's usually what Hollywood does.
Based on a true story quote unquote.
But you know it's like that movie The blind Side was Sandra Bullock, right, like that took a lot of creative liberties for that one. As a matter of heday, Yeah, dude, Michael Orr won't talk to them like he hates them. He's like trying to family to the family that adopted him. Yeah, because he found out that they were using him for a ride to get him to the NFL and they were trying to mooch a lot of his money, which
they did. So it's like, you know, Hollywood has their liberties of making people more, you know, so, which is sad because you know that that was a really heartfelt movie, but it was great. So it says, did they really videotape the experiments? Yes, like the Quiet Ones movie. The True Story confirms that the seances were often filmed. Watched the footage from several Philip Experiment seances, which we were going to do a little bit later as a matter of fact.
I think.
And so it was doctor Owen's son, Robert E. Owen, often took the photos and did the filming. So pretty interesting. I mean it was kind of kept in house in that sense. But yeah, So.
It says, is it possible that the Philip experiment was a hoax?
Let's find out. I mean, I'm open, I don't know. I mean, this is just what I was able to find.
So.
In an interview conducted in the nineteen seventies, doctor arg Owen's wife, Iris Owen interesting name, an English born social worker and a leading participant in the seances, admitted that they were initially suspicious of one another, as most people are. You ever get in front of a ouiji board, You're like, I know you moved that fucking thing. Come on, stop fucking with I've never done it, but you hear about
these things. And she said that they admitted that they were initially suspicious of one another, believing the possibility that someone at the table was sliding it. It says in quotes. The first few months, we were watching each other like hawks, says Iris, And if anybody's finger moved the slightest bit, they would say, you're pushing. So they were holding each other accountable, which is good, you know.
So.
Joel Whitten, an observer and psychiatrist, says that they went as far as to place paper dout doile's. How was that word, paper doile's. I've never heard that word in my life under the hands of the seance participants to ensure that no one was moving the table. He explained that if someone tried to move the table, the doiles would slide instead of the table and everyone would notice. It's a good idea, so you do is.
You ever like it looks like lace, but it's paper. It's like a little round thing like this you would set a plate on, oh.
Like a like a plate coaster, basically whatever they're.
Called basic, But it's not fabric.
It's it's literally a piece of paper that is cut to make it look pretty. It's like for like, you know, if you're doing like a big Thanksgiving dinner at like a school or something, you put these on the table to make it look nicer, but in reality it's just it's whatever.
Oh like the paper that they have over a like TJ ribs. Yeah, okay, okay, the rib place they always have the paper mats or whatever so that you don't damage the tablecloths with with your barbecue fingers. Right right, right, makes sense. I used to work there, you had to dude. It was actually pretty fucked up, not fucked up. It was. It was interesting, but it was hard, so you had to learn. So I used to serve over a TJ ribs. I don't I think that's just a Louisiana thing right.
I don't know. I mean I do fuck with TJ. Ribs. I mean, I'm also a whore for Ribs, let's be real.
Same. So anyway, it's I mean, it's a really awesome restaurant if anybody's ever been. But whenever I so I was serving over there. This is one of my first jobs. And so I was serving over there, and you had to learn how to write were name incursive, upside down and inverted. Right, Why that was just like a signature of the restaurant, of the people that were serving. That's just what everybody does over there. And so obviously I have a pretty long name, Jonathan Is. You know, it's
a few more letters than the average goat. And and so I would always just simplify it to John j oen right easiest, and and even that, like dude, learning how to draw your name incursive, upside down and inverted, dude, that took a little while, but anyway, that was on that that doile paper or whatever. So that's my experience with it. No, yeah, so where were we all? Right?
So here we go. Although the group eventually believed that Philip could accurately answer questions, he was still a creation of their collective imagination, which was evident by his limitations. For example, he was able to answer yes or no to questions about his time period by responding with Knox, but both question Both the quest questions and the answers were not information that the group was unaware of, at
least not the whole group. Essentially, this means that Phillip's responses were most likely coming from their own minds, either their subconscious or, if it was indeed a hoax, their conscious minds. But they were holding themselves accountable though, so I'm just kind to believe that it was a hoax.
Yeah, I mean, I'm not even saying like I'm trying to call a hoax on this. I I can at least appreciate the experiment that was done. But again, they already knew the answer because this was a fictitious character in their own minds. So whenever they say, uh, did you live to see the year eighteen hundred, well, they know that the answer would be no before you even asked this question. So whenever you you know what I mean, it's it's sure, but I'm certain.
That doesn't Like where did the Knox come from? Then? Is the question is the main question, right, Like maybe they were projecting the answer to this you know, this spirit or whatever, but how did that spirit know how to for yes or for no?
See now, I really do want to watch some of this video to see, like was there even a knock or was it any small noise like yep.
That was him.
He said yes, y'all heard it, and it was like, yeah, yeah, I totally.
I don't know.
It's very possible, like they said it was in their own mind, So any small noise they took to be confirmation. Maybe there was a legitimate like a heart like a legit knock that they I don't know.
Yeah, I don't. I'm we're gonna get to it, you know what, fuck it, We're gonna watch the whole video once we get cover a little bit more information about this and these type of of things that transpired even coming from it. So so yeah, it says have any other experiments been done that were similar to this the Philip experiment? It says the Philip experiment has been replicated
several times. The most notable of these effort efforts is the Skippy Experiment, sometimes called the Sydney experiment, conducted in Sydney, Australia in the two thousands. The researchers devised the story of a fourteen year a girl, which we kind of already alluded to. She was impregnated by her Catholic school teacher Jesus Christ.
They had to go with the worst possible scenario, not like she died in a car crash and it was nobody's fault.
It was just one of those things.
No, no, no, Yeah, Catholic school girl impregnated by her.
Priests, so she had to die.
Wow. Not only was she impregnated by her Catholic school teacher, but that school teacher later murdered her so that the church wouldn't find out.
I love a fuck what is wrong with these Australians.
You couldn't have just kept it semi g rated, just a sad tragedy, just one of those things, though, you had to go with the fucking whole movie plot.
Well, because the idea is what most people believe is that whenever there's a ghost, it's like an energy that is trapped here because either a they don't know that they've died, or b they don't accept their death like it's usually one of those couple of things. And so if you're killed, you know, unknowingly, like maybe you're I don't know, shot and you didn't know that you were even in a gunfight kind of thing or whatever, like your life almost taken from you. Then you're and you're like,
what the fuck is going on? And you go up and you're trying to talk to your mom, you're trying to talk to your dad. You can't really get any of their attention because you're just a disembodied spirit at that point. And so that's what people, I think would
attach to that. And so maybe what they're trying to say is that, all right, we're gonna try and make this girl as real as possible, and by making her as real as possible, we're gonna make her like believe that maybe she didn't even die kind of thing.
Jesus Christ.
Okay, So I get the ideology behind it only because I like, I'm always obsessed with all the ghost shit. I mean, it doesn't matter what you think of it, it's still exciting to like look at and watch all the what's that that ghost show that I always talk about on YouTube? Danny Fantom, No, No, that's a Disney thing, isn't it.
That's a nick thing man Nickelodeon. But hold on on YouTube.
Yeah, it's like two dudes and they're younger, like early twenties.
H didn't didn't have them on the show.
Something in Cody, Cody I think is one of them.
I want to say Zach and Cody would know that is a Disney thing. It's something in Cody. I know the dudes you're talking about. Yeah, Rogan had them on his show like last year. They seem to do pretty good dudes.
Yeah yeah, but yeah, I mean, no matter what you think about it, it's still like pretty entertaining to watch if you ever go check them out. But so, yeah, so she was murdered by the guy so the church wouldn't find out that she got pregnant. And after the initial table used by the researchers didn't produce any results, they found success sitting around a light, three legged card
table a light three legged card table. They reported similar knocking and scratching sounds heard during the Philip the Philip experiment. They also said that the table moved and spun around on one leg. However, they never managed to capture any audio or visual evidence, so Pixar it didn't happen kind of thing.
Well, hold on, what wait a card table with three legs? I know what a card table is. I've only ever seen.
A four legged but okay, word, yeah, that's kind of strange. A three legged card table, that's what it says.
Maybe it's like a circular table. I don't know. I guess we'll see.
Yeah maybe, so yeah, yeah, this is the actual Oh damn, they got a couple of them here. So they got the quiet one's trailer. But then you have the actual Philip Experiment documentary. Oh damn, I'm gonna have to watch that later. I wish I would have watched that in preparation for the show.
But I mean, how long is the Is it a clip or is it the entire documentary?
I'm sure it's the whole damn thing. M Oh, they're not even letting you watch it, of course, not those whores. Yeah, but the the other one will watch. It's like ten or eleven minutes. So this was something I was like, all right, they're kind of what they're alluding to as far as our mind's creating. You know, whatever energy or action is going on is known as psychokinesis Okay, So Psychokinesis can be defined as the ability of using mind
over matter without any physical intervention. The term psychokinesis comes from Greek meaning psych mind and motion. Basically, so, yeah, my.
Entire documentary is forty one minutes long, So yeah, we ain't watching all that.
Oh it's actually shorter from what I expected though, so anyhow. It was coined in nineteen fourteen to psychokinesis by American author Henry Holt in his book called on the Cosmic Relations. Psychokinesis is sometimes abbreviated as PK. The study of psychokinesis falls under the field of parapsychology. Obviously, psychokinesis refers to influence of mental forces upon the physical realm that would
not otherwise be subject to ordinary physical causation. The term PK refers to the ability that appears to rely on the conscious intention of the human operator, which influences a physical system at both the macro scale, which is detectable with the naked eye, and the micro scale, which would
require an advanced machine to detect. So, okay, I mean, I'm more inclined to believe that this is some I'm not maybe it's not one hundred percent of what's going on, But to say that at zero percent that has to be wrong, right.
I'm still kind of piecing it all together in my own mind here and assuming that it is not a hoax, right, assuming that the information that we are getting from the experiment itself exactly happened, as they said, I'm really trying to take it all in here, So I don't want to just cast judgment as of this moment.
Okay. So I actually have the Philip experiment completely documented right here, and so I was thinking, you know, it'd be pretty interesting to read a little bit of it and we'll see how it looks and how it sounds. But this is everything that they documented. This was reprinted in seventy five, seventy six, and seventy seven, it says so the New Horizon Journal. It says Philip's story continued. The abstract is a brief account is given of a
further year of the Philip research and variations thereon. The group has developed new PK psychokinesis abilities, including that of bending metals bending metals because they believe that it's coming from them. As so, they were looking a little bit farther, like, you know, like in the matrix bending spoon dog like the spoon bending Yeah, yeah, so it says. The story of the creation of Philip the Imaginary Ghost was first published in the newri New Horizons in January nineteen seventy four.
This was followed in July nineteen seventy four by an article attempting to explain some of the underlying psychological skills required in order to generate the phenomena that occurred. The experiment is continued and grown, and it seems appropriate to record what a happened since those two reports were written. The response to the experiment was fantastic. Philip seems to have caught the imagination of everyone who has read about him.
We had a correspondence from physicists, psychological psychologists, spiritualists, parapsychologists, as well as reporters, television producers, et cetera from almost every country in the world. So they really impressed. I mean,
some people got that information. They saw the footage and people everybody was reaching out of all of all shapes and sizes, right, So yeah, everybody was reaching out to them so much so that we that we have felt the necessity to record the whole experiment in book form. And this was This is with the publishers right now, and hopefully we will be available in the fall of
nineteen seventy five. The book will be a full and factual account of the whole experiment, together with some discussion on the relevance to various aspects of the field of parapsychology and spiritualism, and speculation as to its poss future applications. But for the present record, it will probably be best to give a blow by blow account, so to speak, of what the Philip Group has achieved since the report
of the experiment in January nineteen seventy four. So, in January of nineteen seventy four, concurrently with the writing of this first report, it was suggested that a short at a short factual film of the experiment, giving the details of how the experiment was conceived and what exactly happened, together with some wraps and table movements, should be made. This would effectively record the whole thing and dispose once and for all any allegations that the phenomena were in
any way subjective or the result of mass hallucination. The group itself regarded this as a challenge to perform under the light of film cameras and in front of people whom they had never met before. A member of our society, Bruce Raymond, who was a filmmaker and distributor, generously offered to arrange to have the film made and to back the production financially. The film was to be made professionally
and subsequently be available for distribution to trade. The film was made during the course of one whole Sunday, a fantastic day in every respect. The members of the group were able, under the direction of Ian Brims, to completely recreate the experiment, and in spite of being under the glaring lights and somewhat restricted space because the film cameras were everywhere, Philip produced raps and movements entirely to order.
It is a very interesting fact that, however skeptical new however skeptical newcomers are, when they actually hear the raps, they are immediately convinced it is quite clear that under those conditions there is no possibility of fraud whatsoever. The group were delighted with the film, which is available for commercial distrib distribution, and in fact, at the time of writing and has been shown in many countries of the world,
the latest being in Finland. Of course, the film being available for distribution attracted the attention of the media, both newspaper newspapers and television, and we had to cope with the fact that this was not just regarded as a scientific coup by those seriously interested in the subject, but it was also a very remarkable, a very marketable form, very marketable from the entertainment point of view, and the
group had made much trouble with this aspect. Basically, as parapsychologists, we shy away from publicity that takes the form of popular entertainment. People who are not well read in the subject do not understand the issues involved, and generally there
is a more misunderstanding and misconception than justifies the publicity. However, parapsychology is also a people subject, and without people, no work can be effectively accomplished, and sometimes as a result of media publicity one has found people very valuable to
work with. In the event, the group found itself, almost against its will, involved in giving a half hour performance on a local television station, a talk show with doctor Owen, Doctor Whitten and a local United Church minister, the Reverend Ndsey King, was arranged with the Phillip group in a corner of the studio, ready to perform. Philip would deign to appear, and of course he did, even with a fucking reverend there and all these doctors and everything. Crazy right, wow, okay,
so and he did. The group were beginning to realize that there were that there was nothing Philip liked more than to appear in public, and the bigger the audience, the better. You wouldn't expect that maybe it would from a trickster entity.
I guess, uh yeah, yeah, I mean, but.
Yep, that's wild. That's some wild shit. I mean, I if this was all fake, how do you rope all these people into it not? I mean, you know, we all have our falls and our fallacies, and I guess anybody can be fooled. But these people don't seem like they're coming at it from that angle. They don't seem it.
No, But to answer your questions, so you mean that when it was time to show up, the entity.
Would always be sure to show up.
That does sound a little bit more of the hoax variety to me, But again, I am not trying to throw that at this moment.
I don't know.
Yeah, well, it says it is obvious there is a bit of ham in all of us. Whatever that means. Philip quickly.
Whatever that means, due to say that, oh, that kid's a ham bone, that means that he's like, he's a little jokester.
Oh I got you all right? Yeah.
Uh.
Philip quickly made it obvious that he felt his place was on the das deos whatever that word is, with the speaker's panel, rather than in the corner of the studio, and his efforts to mount the dais uh and take his rightful place. We're hilarious, to say the least. Both the audience and studio staff were in fits of last fits of laughter as the table lifted its first one leg and then another, and then swung around, wriggling and pushing to get to the forefront of the show. Could
you imagine if this is real? If this is real? What the fuck? Man?
So everybody was laughing when this went down? Well they, I mean, I guess they adored old Philip. They thought nothing harmful of it. That's were they laughing because oh, such a playful spirit. Or were they more like, sure, dude, sure that's what you're doing here.
Well let's keep reading. So it says yeah. Eventually it succeeded, and the moderator, Reverend Lindsey King, who had been watching with some amusement, was asked to say hello to Philip. Whoa they got a reverend involved on this one. So and he did so, and a very loud rap in
response came from the table right underneath his hand. His facial expression of surprise was a picture until he had probably not believed the table would talk to him, or until then he probably didn't believe that the table would talk to him. He carried on a conversation for several minutes, and the table, as Philip, responded with loud and clear raps. All of this, all this, of course, is recorded on both camera and sound, and the show was so successful
that the television station regularly replays it. Later on in the year, at the special request of our where was I oh, of our president of the company, I guess Alan Spraggett Okay, the Philip group gave another similar television performance for Alan's show. The highlight of this performance was that the table flipped upside down completely, as it does on occasion when the group knelt around it. The raps came loud and clear from the table, which had its
top flush with the carpeted floor. Again, the rappings were reportedly or were recorded loudly and clearly. So during the year nineteen seventy four, the Philip Group proved that they could produce their rapping phenomena in any table, under underblazing lights, anywhere and with anybody present. Oh man, they went on a little tour with this. It sounds like a little bit right. They got took that show on the road.
I mean, why not, you know, if you can make a couple shekels along the way, it's yep, so all right. So to go back to the actual phenomena. Following the making of the film, on that same evening, the group felt that they were particularly charged, if that is the right word, and had a private session after the film had stopped. Doctor Witten made a strong suggestion that at this time they could get the table fully levitated. The table did actually leave the floor about one inch above
the carpet and glided for four to five feet. Doctor Witten and Robin Owen, which is the wife who were in the room both witnessed this, but unfortunately, although Robin had his camera in hand, the lighting and positioning were such that an adequate picture could not be obtained. I'll so you gotta think about it. The seventies, How good of a camera you're going to really have back then?
I mean, allegedly we had good enough cameras to see the man on the moon.
Yeah, ok, right, all right, buddy, I mean that's only because you had the man, the myth, the legend, fucking Stanley Kubrick shooting that one. Indeed. Indeed, so, although on occasion the table has appeared to be floating, it has never lifted sufficiently for the group to be sure of this. Generally speaking, the group has continued to concentrate on production of rapping because this seems to be the most easily
measured phenomena. A conference was held in June in Toronto, and the proceedings of this were reported in the last journal. But it will be seen from this that the Philip Group have felt through most of nineteen seventy four that they should continue to produce raps as their first priority. However, on one occasion, on a very hot night, they decided to concentrate their energies on producing a cool breeze and succeeded in doing this. They were wonder whether this was
in fact subjective. When Georgia Owen walked into the room, somebody said, put your hand in the middle of the table and tell us if you feel anything, said one of the group. George did so and remarked, it feels like a cool breeze, as if a fan were blowing.
So if it was subjective, it had affected him. Also, following the visit of Matthew Manning and the work done with Yuri Geller, who we mentioned earlier, the Philip group were interested in metal bending, and in November, at one of the meetings, a light metal medallion was placed on the table and Philip asked to bend it. It was left there during the evening and the group members did not touch it, and at the end of the evening
it was bent slightly at the edges. All right, here we go, baby, So the group generally felt a little disappointed and left it lying on the table when they went out. I was the last to leave the room and switch off the light. And switch off the light where was I and it was still only slightly bent. The group members went straight upstairs and left, and George returned to the room to check ashtrays and noticed that
the medallion was completely crumbled up. He thought that it was a chocolate wrapper and didn't bother to move it. I went downstairs the next morning and found it still crumpled, so it had apparently continued to bend after the group left. The following week, under the same conditions, a key was bent slightly, but this did not continue to bend after the group left, and the group decided to discontinue the metal bending attempts. Oh my god, these are some wild claims, though, right,
like really all right, so it says. However, in January of nineteen seventy five, the group were visited by a journalist from the National Inquirer, mister Bill Dampier, who had been given permission to write about the phenomena. He proved a very pleasant pleasant visitor and quickly related to the group and Philip, and was soon part of the circle, asking his own questions and getting answers under his hand. He asked about the metal bending and was told of
the previous efforts. Will you try and bend my house key? He asked. The group somewhat reluctantly agreed to try, but warned him it might not work. A professional photographer was present taking pictures continually, and the room was in bright light. After about half an hour, the key was bent very slightly, but quite obviously. Pictures had been taken of it beforehand, quite flat on the table, and now further pictures were
taken of the bent key. Mister Dampierre replaced it in his pocket, and he was told that it might continue to bend. The next day, at about three pm, he telephoned to say what he had difficulty in getting his house opened the previous night owing to the amount that the key was bent, but had left it lying around during the day, and now it had bent considerably, more so much that he had sent the photographer to come and take another picture of its present state. So even
not on the table, it continued to bend. Like if this is real, what do you make of it? If it's imagine if it is, I would like to see how much it has bent? Right?
Are we talking about like a slight like where like you know, oh, I just didn't notice it before. We're talking like full on, just like the Matrix movie. This spoon bent to like a ninety degree angle kind of thing.
I'm just curious.
But even if it's meant just a little bit. What do you explain that as.
Maybe that's the thing.
See again, I'm not trying to I'm not trying to poke holes in it at this moment. I'm trying to really take it all in. I don't really have a clear answer at this point.
Yeah, I don't either, other than just to believe it. I mean, That's where I'm at, sonnyhow In December of nineteen seventy four, the Phillip Group was invited to Cleveland, Ohio to demonstrate before a group of psychologists and physicists. Unfortunately, being just before Christmas, only four of the group could go al Dorothy, Bernice and sid However, this did not matter.
The group was able to give a superb demonstration, so much so that some of the physicists present declared that this would mean that they had to completely rethink their theories on physics. What's over that?
Then?
I don't understand how this would disprove or prove the like the laws of thermodynamics and shit.
Okay, well it says the table used there was an antique heavy wooden chest table with wheels on casters, one of which was broken, the other three needing oiling and squeaked when the table was pushed. Nevertheless, the table glided around the carpet floor without the wheel squeaking and without making tracking, without making track markings on the carpet. My god. So it says on two occasions one of the men present sat at the table and was thrown off once,
quite violently, thrown off of the table. I don't. I mean, for this to be fake, a lot of people have to be in on it, right, Like the I mean, they're.
Bringing how many people in this experiment?
There was like what six of them, eight of them that were like all a part of the experiment.
Yep, and then you and then they started presenting it to a physicists and the reverend, and they started taking it on the road. I mean a lot of people saw what was going on here.
But my point is, from what I could understand here, it wasn't like a newcomer or a bystander that was thrown.
Off the table.
It was one of the people that was a part of the experiment consistently.
Right.
Well, it says on two occasions one of the men present sat on the table and was thrown off quite once, quite violently. So it doesn't I guess one of the newcomers. I'm guessing it doesn't specify one way or another. It doesn't unless we misread it, which I don't think we did. But anyway, let's keep going. So Also, a drawer in the table, which fell out very easily under normal conditions when the table was moved, did not move at all
when Philip was moving the table. As a result of this and the fact that some of the physicists had seen some of Uri Geller's metal bending, a serious attempt to study these phenomena is being made at Kent State University in Ohio under the heading of teleneural physics thing. And they just made that up.
I feel like they might have.
I've never heard of that combination of partial words before. But I mean, we're also talking about something that doesn't fit neatly into science that you might have to come up with a new field of study to really explore it.
I don't know, well, I mean, tellneurophysics is I mean, I would imagine that the definition is not very far different from psychokinesis. It's just the same same It's referring to the same thing, I think.
Exactly the same thing, like I had never heard of psychokinesis before this conversation, so I guess you would have to come up with new words to describe what the fuck you're doing here.
If you don't know any better, you're just gonna make shit up, which is fine. So it says to return to Toronto for a few further facts are worth reporting. A second group of people completely different from the Philip group, decided to attempt the experiment as their imaginary ghosts that they invited a personality quite different from Philip, Lilith. Now we're getting to Lilith, the French Canadian. Yeah, so she was a French Canadian girl who was in love with
an officer, Da Da Da dah. We already know the whole story about that. However, she was betrayed and captured and lost her life at the hands of a firing squad, a story full of love and drama. As Philip's history, The group attempting to produce Lilith very quickly had some success they as they had the experience of the Philip group to draw on and had seen Philip in action
many times. Unfortunately, once they had taught themselves to produce the phenomena, they had become somewhat bored with the procedure and decided to switch to trying to produce voices in the manner of the row dive experiments. All right, that's something new. How you spell that r a udived ive the road dive roative experience or experiments rather? All right,
so while you're looking that up, I'll continue reading. So interestingly enough, they are still continuing this type of experiment as they have been having results that seem to explain in any rational e. They have wait, well, let me read that again. As they have they have been having results that seem difficult to explain in any rational manner. Okay, So their experience and other shit too, even doing with the roative experience.
Okay, so also real quick on the road of experience here, we were talking about what's that thing?
It's EVP. Oh, I think that's what I yeah, I know.
But earlier we were trying to figure it out, we had said, like e MP or something like that. It's EVP, so electronic voice phenomena.
Right.
So, within ghost hunting and.
Parapsychology, EVP are sounds found on electronic recordings that are interpreted as spirit voicing. Parapsychologis just constantinous Jesus hold On Constantin's Constantin's Roe Dive all Right, who popularized the idea in the nineteen seventies, described EVP as typically brief, usually the length of a word or short phrase.
Long story here.
To do.
Spiritualist religious movement became prominent in the eighteen forties to nineteen forties with a distinguishing belief that the spirits of the dead can be contacted by mediums. New technologies of the era, including photography, were employed employed by spiritualists in an effort to demonstrate contact with the spirit world.
So popular were the idea.
Is that Thomas Edison was asked in an interview with Scientific America to comment on the possibility of using his inventions to communicate with the spirits. He replied that if the spirits were only capable of subtle influences, a sensitive recording device could provide a better chance of spirit communication than the table flipping and Wuigi board mediums employed at the time. However, there was no indication that Edison ever designed or constructed a device for this.
All Right, Cool, cool, cool, Moving on, so the rod ive voices.
Constantine constantin, it's spellweird, It's like it's k O S T A n T I in constantin. Rod Ive, a Latvian psychologist who had taught at Uppsali University, Sweden, who had worked in conjunction conjunction with Jurgensen, made over one hundred thousand recordings which he described as being communications with discarnate people. Some of these recordings were conducted in an RF screened laboratory contained words Rodive said were indeli fual in, indefit, indefiable,
Jesus as words. In an attempt to confirm the content of his collection of recordings, Rodive invited listeners to hear and interpret them. He believed that the clarity of the voice is heard in the recordings, implied that they could not be readily explained by normal means.
Wrote.
I published his first book, Breakthrough, an Amazing Experiment in Electronic Communication with the Dead, in nineteen sixty eight, and it was translated to English in nineteen seventy one.
Okay, so they took it a step farther with the EVP device, or at least the initial early EVP devices.
Yeah, so it seems like EVP devices really became what people are using today in the late seventies early or yeah, late seventies, early eighties from what I get, which.
Makes sense because this Philip experiment was in seventy four, so people, those people that created those EVP devices learned from this initial experiment.
They were running in the same kind of circles around the same kind of time frame. So yeah, you know what I mean, Birds of a feather kind of get I get.
It right, right, So to continue, The Toronto Society for Psychical Research has an annual Christmas party, which is one of their main social events. This party was held on December eighteenth, and almost all the members were present. The party spills over the whole house at headquarters, and it was natural that a number of people would drift down to the basement room where the Philip experiments are carried out. There were party goodies and decorations, and the pictures of
Philip and Lilith were on display. A paper Christmas cover was on the table. Someone put hands on the table and said is anyone there? A loud rap came in reply. The rest of the people present joined in and the table continued to answer and move around. However, as the group around The table consisted of a job lot of members, some of the Phillip group, some of the Lilith group, one or two from a new group that was just starting, and some who had not even seen the phenomena before.
It was difficult to know who was responsible for the phenomena. I would imagine you get a bunch of different, you know, personalities over there. Somebody wants to see something, somebody wants to spook somebody. You can't be sure I get.
It right, especially if you're talking on this group of academics. Right, they're at a university, so it's people who are all up in the academia and the scholarly debates of things. So how many of these are people just trying to fuck with their colleagues?
How many of these people were like Okay, no, seriously, I want to hear what they got to say? Like, who's to say?
Right? Yeah? I mean, you know, we weren't there, and there is not any film footage of it, so you can kind of only rely on their word. But at least from them documenting all their prior experiments, you know, you're inclined to, you know, kind of take them at their word. So it says it being Christmas. Somebody said, I wonder if this is Santa Claus. Are you father Christmas? Said another Yes, came the reply. The group then continued to such questions as have you finished packing all the
children's presence? Are you tired now with all that work? Is it cold at the north pole? And are your reindeer with you? They were under the table. They were under the table, said Santa. It was a perfect example of childlike approach to the phenomena that is recommended, the complete belief, and a beautiful example of the fact that in this situation you get what you expect.
Okay.
While they were expecting to hear these things, and then they heard these things.
And it was projected yeah, well it was a knock. Yeah, I mean whatever it is, a knock, a whisper, maybe
a breeze or whatever. However, they were able to get confirmation, you know, to the questions most of the time, yes, a knock, but it says later after Christmas, the third group of people that were working on this experiment, again a completely different set of people, having produced wraps and table movements in a somewhat random fashion without having made a clear decision as to who who they should have for their imaginary character, suddenly decided to have a literary ghost.
One of the group, obviously a classics fan, asked the table, are you a character from Dickens? Yes? Came the reply, I know, are you the artful Dodger said the same person. Yes, came a loud and clear rap. Thus the group had acquired their imaginary character. Some of them were familiar with the original story as written by Dickens, and they all knew and loved the musical Oliver. The raps were loud
and enthusiastic. Dodger, as they quickly called him, admitted to loving to pick pockets, but, on being asked if he would like to pick theirs, seemed hesitant. It soon transpired that the fact that all the ladies were wearing slacks confused him fashion or fagin. Oliver, Sykes and Nancy and even the dog were with him. He said, okay, these are all the characters of the Dickens story. Predictably, he said he dislikes Sikes and felt very sorry for Nancy.
He had been very fond of her. He liked music, particularly jolly songs and typical Cockney ditties. He agreed to have his picture drawn, and on saying good night. A whole series of raps were given. At the time of writing, this group has only been going on a short while and it remains to be seen whether they can continue. So you kind of see right here that it's like, there's no way that Santa Claus is showing up. There's no way that fucking the Artful Dodger is showing up,
or Lilith or any of these other characters. It is seemingly a projection. If it's really happening, which I mean, this has happened in the seventies. We for all we know they were all tripping on fucking acid, right, But if we are to believe the story as it's being told, then maybe there was something extra actually going on there. And and it seems like it was some kind of energetic projection. I don't know.
It's it's getting more and more interesting the more we read, honestly, and I can see how it may all be hoaxism, but I could also see that it could be based in some reality of things that are happening.
I don't know.
I'm interested to hear more.
Let me just ask you, like, first of all, do you believe in ghosts. So if this were happening in front of you and you could definitely say, yes, I see it, nobody's flipping this table over, nobody's knocking at this table, you were able to confirm it, what would be your first assumption as to what it is.
I don't want to. I don't want to go that route just yet.
I mean, we have enough information on it so far, so I think that it's okay to to give a supposition on it.
So I believe that demonic forces are at work at all times as much as angelic forces are at work at all times. Right that being said, per my own beliefs here, you know why they say and by day I mean like my religious book says to not deal with divination, sorcery uh those a deal in chance i e. Taro uh or or seances or trying to communicate with the dead.
It's not that these things aren't real.
It's that something's going to answer you, although it will probably not be what you think it is. Essentially, if you know the same reason why you fuck with Luigi Board, like something's answering you, you just open the door. Because this side is clamoring to get to our realm, So if you open the door for them, they will appear. So this also kind of leads me to believe, especially whenever we're looking at them, these dudes were approaching this
as a scientific experiment, not as a spiritual encounter. Right at least for the first the first experiment for a year, they had nothing dead silence, no taps, no wraps, no nothing, because they were approaching it from a scientific angle, and the spirit realm doesn't give a fuck about science.
Right. So, and again, if we are to believe that everything that they're.
Seeing, the spoon's bending and the table flipping and all these things and do getting thrown off the table, if we are assuming that there was no hoaxism going on here and that these were in fact, real, credible stories, what that tells me is that they figured out eventually what the proper chain of events is needed to make
a response happen, and something was answering them. No, I don't believe if again, if this is all true, I don't believe it was Philip, and I don't believe it was Lilith, and I don't believe it was Santa Claus. And I don't believe any of these things I believe that something was answering them, and per all of my understanding and knowledge based off of spirituality, here, angels or things from the good side don't answer in such ways.
So take that with whatever grain. It's all you would need, so.
You're less inclined to believe that this could be any kind of projection from the individual in the form of psychokinesis, of which you know they're inclined to say.
Uh, just Jacob speaking on behalf of Jacob.
No interesting, Okay, all right, well let's read a little bit more, because I mean, this is fun. You know, if you believe it's demonic, or if you think it's hoax for or if you believe it's a projection, or you believe that they're actual ghosts that are just taking the names of whatever is occurring, it's still fun, you know, at least not imagination. And I'm not. And that's the thing I did.
I was afraid to even bring it up, like my thoughts on this, because I don't want it to seem like I'm just trying to shit on the entire thing right now, cause I mean I am. So this is an opinion of mine, and it is subject to change.
With new information.
That being said, I and I mean, we've talked about Tulpa's and Edgar Gore's and things like this before. You and I have very different opinions on this. I don't believe that that's possible. I don't believe that you can imagine something into existence if you believe.
In it hard enough.
You, on the other hand, believe that if enough people believe in the exact same thing, and they believe it hard enough with their whole heart of hearts, then very wild things can happen.
And you and you have very different perspectives on this.
So again, this is just a This is just one of those things. So again, I'm not saying that this is guaranteed has to be demonic forces at work, Clearly, I'm saying that, as of the information, as of this moment,
that's just what I believe it sounds like. However, if if it is possible, if you can get eight people sitting around a three legged card table and they believe hard enough that some wild, inexplicable shit's able to happen, and then they're able to take it on the road and it becomes almost like a party trick to people that it's you see what I'm saying out loud, like that's that's a little bit less of the scientific experiment and a little bit more of the party trick variety,
which does then leave me to believe that it's more of the hoax variety and or grifter variety, especially if they were charging for it, making a couple dollars along the way. But I mean, who's to say. There's people that make dollar bills off of absolutely talking and communicating with demonic spirits, and they are very open and honest about what they're doing and why they're doing it.
So I don't know, I don't know, so would and no judgment here, I mean, it's just interesting to tickle your pickle in the homo. But like the idea of the idea of the people that go out and do the close encounters of the fifth kind whenever they're they're all gathered out in the desert and they're all collectively meditating on seeing some kind of activity in the sky,
maybe an orb maybe fucking something inexplicable, inexplicable. Do you believe that that would also if it is real, do you believe that that would also be a demon?
Then not necessarily possibly, yes, possibly, but not necessarily right. I don't believe that like every single orb in the sky, because I believe that UFOs are real. I believe that aliens are real. I don't believe those are demons or angels for that matter. I believe that both are happening independently of each other. Could they be one and the same thing, Yes, that's possible. I just don't believe that myself.
But that to be said, if you get enough people out in the desert, meditating hard enough to see something, and then all of a sudden they see sothing.
Just from my.
Own perspective, that's very much like me when I was a kid looking at a monster in my closet that, come to find out, was a sweatshirt. But in that moment, I believed it was a monster so hard that that bitch totally looked at me.
You see what I'm saying.
Yeah, But whenever you get multiple eyes on it, that's whenever it's like, Okay, you're not just tripping, you know what I'm saying.
No, No, but especially at night in the dark, when you can't see much around you.
Have you ever been in the woods at night?
Yeah? Well, and This is why they do it out in the desert, so it's clear and open, so you ain't got, you know, any kind of fucking slenderman that's gonna creep up on you or something like that, right, right.
Right, But just saying like you've been have you ever been like walking through the woods at night and then heard a fucking loud crack that sounds like it's like ten feet away from you. In reality, I was probably one hundred yards away from you. It was probably you know, a squirrel dropped a corn to hit a branch or something, and it made a little bit of a rustle. But in the night air, it sounds like it's so much more. So you take off running because you know you just
heard that bitch here. It's it's kind of that thing. It's because the mind is going to fill in the gaps like thunder.
You know, it travels at the speed of sound, so the time you hear it isn't even the time that it happened, right, It's a it's a rippling through Well.
Yeah, but my point is at night, whenever it's dark and you're you're left with not as much of your spatial awareness and not as aware of your surroundings as you would be if it was high noon. Your brain in your mind, which is the thing that plays tricks on us NonStop.
We've talked about that a million times.
Is more likely to fill in the gaps with a fight or flight scared response more often than not.
Right, And that's not a negative thing.
That's that's how humans have survived for so long is because our brains do look out for number one when all else fails. So if you get enough people even and again I'm not equating being scared in the woods to meditating in the desert. What I'm saying is if you are collectively as a group in the desert and you're setting out all these intentions and everybody there where it's five people or one hundred people are all there to see something like That's the entire reason they've gathered
out here. And they are aware that it's possible they don't see anything, but they are just out there believing it that they're gonna see something eventually. Yeah, they'll see something. Whether that thing was real or not is beside the point. I saw a monster in my closet that was not real, but I saw it.
You see what I'm saying, right, But what happens if you know, everybody is out there meditating or whatever they do on a CE five kind of experiment. They're out there in the desert. It's a clear night sky. You know, there's no sounds run of rumbling, thunder or anything like that. Let's just paint the picture here. And they're all going around and they're thinking, we're going to see an ORB, we're going to see an alien, we're going to see
an et. We're trying to connect with you, you know, and whatever your thoughts are towards that, right, And then they all open their eyes and they see something out there and they're like, holy shit. Now it's one thing if one person sees it, it's a it's a raisy coincidence. If two people see it. But if you have six plus people all out there with witnessing not only just an ORB, but they can all describe what color it was, how it made them feel, how it levitated in, which
way did it move, how close, how far away it is? Right, and then you have somebody taking pictures of it. Now, what happens if you get it on camera? Like, because that is something that has been talked about and has been documented on CE five things. So and if that is true, let's just suppose that this is all you know, no bullshit, you know, no hoax. Let's just assume that they all sat there, thought about it, opened their eyes also the same thing, and a picture was taken. Here's
the proof. What's your What would you say to that?
I honestly don't have a clear answer for it. I don't believe that's demonic. I absolutely do not believe that's demonic, and I don't believe it's spiritual either. It could be that it is, in fact in extraterrestrial or an interdimensional type of entity, like that's very possible. I'm unfamiliar with a case where because there's cases of mass hallucination, it's very rare. And by cases, I don't mean like, oh yeah,
you could just look at it. No, I'm talking to like there might have been one case in the last one hundred and fifty years where you can actually say this, many people saw this thing and then an outsider walked up and it's like, what the fuck are you talking about?
That's not what you're looking at.
That's what they try to say. The fucking phoenix lights.
Was okay, but like, that's my point.
There are some throughout the course of human history, some examples of mass hallucination, but especially with the CE five. If this is something that's repeatable and enough people are able to see it and explain, they're not just the way it feels like, I'm sorry, but science doesn't give a fuck about feelings, right, So just say that you're
documenting this. There's picture of evidence, there's video evidence, there's radar scans that we're taking, or something along these lines, where it's documented that something was here this day, whether it made you feel happy or sad or scared, has.
No amount of fucks given into the equation.
Right. I love talking about hard and fact.
Unless, however, that emotion is somehow projected outward and is causing the experience to happen in the first place. That's why I brought it up was because they seem not exactly identical. They're not sitting around a table, but they are all sitting around in a circle together. Like both groups, both the people that are performing the seance and the people that are doing the CE five thing, typically are
surrounded in a circle. They're sitting down, they're meditating on the same thing as these people are, they're all meditating, thinking about trying to manifest this thing, whatever term you want to use, and something happens. Now, these people didn't see something, you know, Remember they said that they couldn't get a manifestation of a physical form like a ghost or anything like that, but they were able to allegedly witness knocks and shifts on the table and table being
flipped upside down. Not exactly what for what's going on out in the C five as far as seeing things, but collectively all coming together for one true purpose and being able to, I don't know, maybe energize it enough to where everybody can see it somehow, you know, would you say that those two things are similar or completely different?
Different personally, I mean, I've I mean not to take it to this level, but also like willpower alone is not enough to do certain things. Okay, And I understand that, yes, the Bible says faith the size of mustard seed. I'm I'm talking keep spirituality out of it, Keep religion out of the conversation on this one.
Okay.
If you've got a kid that's dying of cancer and it's got like six months to live, you know, every member of this kid's family can believe and just in their heart of hearts believe that this kid is going to be healed of this inexplicably gonna be healed.
Yo.
Their willpower is not going to and make that cancer go away.
Interesting, Well, I mean it's they're not saying that they're carrying cancer with this. They're saying a table knock, contrived example.
I understand that.
But what I'm saying is willpower and want and belief are not going to make physical things change like that. That's just not going to happen.
Interesting. Actually, most people that are into you know, wicca and witchcraft and magic would highly disagree with you on that.
But that and keep in mind, let' say I'm not talking about prayer, Okay, I'm not talking about spells. I'm talking about just want and hope.
To actually hope is the worst thing you can do, because at least psychologically, I can speak on this that whenever you hope for something, you in your mind are already like agreeing to the fact that it hasn't happened and it won't happen, but you hope that it does. It's kind of like a it's like a fart in the wind. It's like it's eventually gonna get taken away and dissected and all the molecules are gonna float away into nothingness. Right Like, it's not a concerted effort. Hope
alone is not enough. And I mean to put a different term on it, not to get religious here, maybe faith.
Like I said, no, no, no, I'm not saying prayer. I'm not talking either to put it to another term, a spell or whatever else. I'm not talking about doing any because I believe that prayer is action. I don't believe that's intention. It's the same with a spell. I don't believe that that's you want something hard enough, you know you're actually doing something about it, You're actually taking steps and putting forth action.
Okay, So I'm talking about.
Just mental things and believing that the okay, same thing.
Belief, not faith, not hope, belief.
I can blindfold myself and believe that I can walk across I ten and.
Not get hit by a car.
And I could believe that hardcore believe, and I know I'm gonna make it to the other side.
You know, I probably am not making it to the other side, even and still at a subconscious level, belief is not full on faith because you're like, I'll give you an example. You know your parents exist. You don't have to believe that right like you know it.
And so everybody alive knows they have parents, otherwise they wouldn't have been born.
Right right like. It doesn't take any belief like you know it. And so I think that it's kind of taken it to that step. And I will say that it's not just a matter of believing or you know, all your will or anything like that. Most people will say that it is like quite literally drawn on your intention, like it is emotion. Your powerful will plus intention could equal some kind of results like this. This is just what I've learned in the past that intention, it plays
a major part. And so if you think about it, all of these people they have the intention that they're going to speak to Santa Claus, to the Artful Dodger, into you know, all these different characters. They they're intending on communicating with this.
Okay, I'll put it to another example.
You don't have to tell the kids of America that Santa Claus is real for them to believe that he's real. Right, they believe they know for a fact that Santa Claus is real, but he's not.
He's not.
And like even if a eggar gore Tulpa kind of thing, fine, cool. There is no physical dude on a sleigh that's going to fly the skies on Christmas Eve night and deliver toys to the kids.
That's not a real thing.
No matter how much belief and knowledge these kids have the fact that he's real, it doesn't make it real. It makes it real to them, but that doesn't make it real in physicality in the real world.
Well, let's take that to another step then, because most of the time, literally every moment of your waking life, your mind is feeling in the blanks. Like we can
agree on that, right, sure. And so whenever somebody tells you that Santa Claus is coming and is reindeer, and you know, if you're still awake, maybe you'll hear the bells, and maybe you'll hear them coming down the down the chimney into the kitchen to eat the cookies that you made for him the night before, and maybe he'll grab the carrots for the reindeer meal, drink that whole fucking glass of milk that he has to do a couple of billion times, which no wonder he's so damn fat.
But if you think about it, like those kids, they they're not awake, so they're kind of just accepting that their proof that Santa Claus exists is whenever they wake up, those presents are under underneath the tree, you know what I mean. Like, so kids don't kids don't need all the information in order to believe. They just need a tiny little bit that that same kid that whenever they lose a tooth they believe in the tooth fairy. They've never seen the tooth fairy, but every morning they wake
up there's a dollar bill underneath their pillow. That's all the confirmation that they need, right and so sometimes and that's why they say that, Like you know, a lot of spiritualities and you know, religious books will say that like you need to take on the mind of a child. You don't need to know all the details or anything, but just to believe it takes you a lot farther without needing to know all the nitty gritty about it
in order to believe. It's like believing and seeing rather than seeing to believe.
No, no again, And I'm not trying to go to a religious scale. I'm saying that, like, the kids believe and there's even proof, they see the proof and they wake up Christmas morning, but it's not real. And they could believe it all they want, but it's not real. That's my point. So when it comes to the conversation of Tulpa's and Eggregre's and all this, yeah, you can believe whatever.
I personally don't believe.
That that's gonna manifest Santa Claus into existence.
That's not how Let me give you another example that maybe isn't too contrived, because kids are pretty fucking gullible, right like, and a lot of times, you know, we take advantage of that by saying that, oh, if you don't behave then Santa Claus is gonna bring you a lump of colt whatever. Right, But let me get heard.
You even say that Santa Claus is a tulpa or you've said this before.
One hundred percent he's an eggre gore.
Yeah, but he's not real though, that's my point. No, No, it doesn't matter how many kids actually believe this. They're not going to make a physical Santa Claus manifest based off of their belief.
That's not how reality works.
Yeah, but we're talking about the for a lack of a better term, the spiritual realm here. This is the realm in which you don't necessarily need physical proof. It's like, I'll give you another example of an aggregor right, like, and this is this is strictly no, no, no. Let me take it to even a more contrived example. Okay, let's say I don't know, uh, let's say that Christianity not to bring religion to just listen, just hear me out. I'm not I'm not judging on any of this. This
is just a fun example. Let's say, for example, that Christianity is the only religion that actually has real God, a real God, and a real Jesus, and every other religion is not real, right, that people kind of just made it up, and it's it's not real, right, it's not confirmed, you can't confirm it whatever. Let's just suppose
that for a second. So now you have every other religion out there, whether they believe in fucking four in Odin, or if they believe in Mohammed, or they believe in all these different you know, other kind of savior archetypes or whatever, those people still believe it, right, And some people even see the manifestation of them, like, you know, maybe they'll see a Mohammed Avatar show up somewhere. Maybe it's in a dream, or maybe they literally.
See a uh what do they call those great flying spaghetti monster whatever it is, right, And So, what I'm saying is is that sometimes belief is.
Enough for you to see something and like because there are you know.
Yes, there are the monster in my closet conversation. Yes, belief was enough for me to see this thing move.
It didn't actually move right, but you know, I'll give you another example. So, can you prove that the emotion of love exists?
Yeah, they scientifically can can track that based off of the chemicals that are released in your brain.
Okay, so why do you feel so.
In the pheromones and shit, there's there's a lot of science that actually goes into it. You can actually like mathematically break down what we would call love.
Okay, Okay, So then you would have to properly describe what love is. You know what I'm saying because a lot of people have loved many people. I mean, you know, I have had many of girlfriends in the past that I at the time felt like I loved, but I'm not with them anymore? So was it really love? Was it kind of a confusion kind of thing? Did I fall out of love with them? You know? If it's like, what is the definition of love?
If?
If? If love can be kind of uh, I don't know documented right, Like what would the definition of that be outside of just chemicals firing off in your brain?
Short term infatuation?
And this is where I'm gonna get weird with it. So you remember the first time you fell in love, right, not even the first time. The first time you fall in love with anybody is always awesome, Like it is the best feeling. It's a fucking drug.
Right.
Like you go around and you're like, oh my god, I can't believe this girl is interested in me. Holy shit, I have gone above the bar. I don't deserve this. She is she she said she likes me. That's crazy, right, And now you go to work and everybody, everybody at work is like you like them a little bit more now. The food that you eat taste a little bit better now, you know, Like, uh, it doesn't matter if you're watching
your favorite sports team. If I'm watching the fucking Steelers, knock on wood, if I watch them lose tomorrow against the fucking Brownies, which God, God forbid that. But let's just say I fall in love.
What are the chances of that actually happens. I don't know football this year.
I mean, any any given Sunday, you know, but especially with the Steelers, you never know. But anyway, let's just say I'm in love and the Steelers lose tomorrow. It's not going to affect me that much because I'm in love. There's nothing that can beat that.
Right, right, because your chemicals in your brain are released to make you happier overall. You got way more serotonin, way more dopamine.
Yeah right, But do you see how that carries on you're in the rest of your day or however long that feeling, I mean it, it eventually fades away, you know that that like exciting kind of feeling.
Yeah, there's love and then there's a real shit when rubber meets the road.
Yeah right, right, But in that moment, nothing can go wrong. And what I'm saying is is that you believe that all of life is love. Now, that is kind of like what you're experiencing, right, And what I'm saying, and you believe it because not only you feel it, you know it. She's into you, You're into her. You're imagining a beautiful future together. Maybe hey, maybe one day we'll get married, Maybe one day we'll have kids. I can already imagine me proposing to her. Your mind starts getting
a little crazy. It's just so overfeeling full of love, right, that emotion is I think, I don't know how do you document that? Could that be? You know, in a sense, the emotion that these people are feeling, that is projecting outwardly because you got multiple people feeling that enthusiasm that wild like bewildering, bewildering belief that somehow it manifests in physical form. And what I'm saying is is that I believe what is going on here is that emotion sometimes
manifests itself in some forms. And I think that's what they're alluding to.
I'm not disagreeing that that can happen, yes, but especially when it comes to human to human contact. Right, It's the same thing whenever, I don't know, you ever work with somebody that you can't stand Oh yeah, right, for whatever fucking reason. Maybe it was something that was said once upon a time, Maybe it's the way this person smells,
whatever it is. You can't stand this fucking person. And you see the schedule and you know that you're gonna be working on the same shift and something, you're just like, God, fuck this guy. Like you go to work and you're already pissed off, right, and then what you know, it's just about the worst day at work you had. Even if this guy wasn't there, it would have been the worst day because everything's fucked, and then this guy's just making extra worse by by Yeah, I see what you're saying.
But at the same time, that guy had no bearing on what kind of day at work you had. You had the mood that made it what it was, and yeah, possibly the day would have been fucked even if this guy didn't show up. It's very possible maybe him being there made everything fucked. I don't know, it doesn't, but it doesn't matter. The reality of the situation is the reality of the situation. You can control how you handle it, but that's not going to change it one way or another.
Right. My point is is that that energy somehow projects outward and everything about your day. If you're working with this dickhead at work, every single thing, every call that you get, every action that your boss asked you to take, every single little, tiny, little minute thing that you need to perform, just sucks that much more. What I'm saying is is that there is an emotional override that is
projecting outward, at least to you. Now you multiply that by five, six, seven, eight people, and I don't know, maybe that's what they're talking about with this whole psychokinesis thing. I'm not even saying that.
I know.
I'm just trying to imagine, like what's really going on.
I'm trying to figure it out too, to be honest with you. As we're hearing these stories and reading through this, it's getting more and more wild and again I can see a possibility that this is hocum, you know, just more and more of it. I could see it possibly being something of a demonic nature. I could see that too. I'm trying here, I'm trying to see the possibility of them creating a ghost from scratch and believing in it hard enough to where it's moving the table and shit.
I'm here though. At least that was their goal, right, So let's see. Let's continue, because it goes on, We're not going to read the whole thing because it's quite long. It's like fifty pages long or something like that. I just kind of wanted to get a little taste from the horse's mouth, right, So it says they feel talking about this group, they feel that the experiment is undoubtedly a group experience with value in the realms of group therapy.
They continue to function as a group in their social relationships. There is a strong family feeling of affection and friendship, and during the Christmas period when they took a break from meeting, they felt impelled to keep close in touch, and we're obviously very glad to be back together again. Quite a degree of telepathy has grown up between some
of the members. Interesting, I mean, telepathy could be anything, you know, like there's been times where I thought about you for some reason that is not homosexual, and whoa and then hey, all right, right, I'm a straight man, dammit. But anyway, let's just say I thought about you. Oh that's that reminds me of something that Jacob said. And then like, weirdly, you text me, you know, like something that most people would probably deem coincidence until you experience it.
Thirty or forty times and you're like, all right, all right, statistically, what are the odds?
Right?
So that's kind of like maybe that's what they were talking about as far as the telepathy thing goes. So it says since the Philip experiment started, the metal bending feats of Uri Geller and Matthew Manning, as well as many other people, have caused the physicists to look at the whole field of psychic energy from a new standpoint.
The Philip group, while providing only a limited amount of that energy, nevertheless can produce phenomena to order, and so are ideal sub jects for experiments, and this is why they have been invited to take part in experiments at
Kent State University in nineteen seventy five. From that, from the point of view of spiritualist belief, while the group still realize that one batch of experiments is entirely inadequate to attempt to enter into the question of the validity or not of spiritualistic belief, nevertheless they have become more and more convinced that in a seance situation, it is quite possible that the physical phenomena which often occur and are ascribed to the spirits of departed friends could often
be only the result of the intense desire of the part of the members of the circle to hear from a particular person in their own mental image of that person, basically just a projection they believe, so says. However, one is quite aware that there are many instances on record which would not be attributable to this theory, and obviously many years of research into these areas lie before us. Finally, to the members of the Philip group, this remains the
most exciting parapsychological experiment that they have ever done. It continually opens up new ideas and gives rise to continued speculation. Especially especially have the group speculated on the relationship of the force generated by Philip to faith healing, for instance, seeing perhaps a tenuous connection between it and the work done by doctor Grad and Sister Justus Smith on the alteration of the molecules of enzymes by a faith healer.
Do advances in the knowledge of healing methods lie with the secrets of the PK force? If we could learn to control the force, what practical uses could we make of it? Could it be the answer to the energy crisis? We just don't know. In what direction it could be used or if at all, But the finding out is exhilarating and challenging. So I think that's probably all we'll read from that, and you know what I'll send out. I'll have that down in the show notes below if
anybody else wants to read the entire thing. But man, that that is, that's that's a lot to say. And they're speaking from at least they're speaking from a point of view as if like they full on believe it. Whoever's writing this believes it has experienced it, and they they have taken, you know, countermeasures to at least try to prevent some kind of fuckery by a hoaxter in the group, right.
I mean, they're doing their best here. I get it, I see it.
Right, right, So just wanted to throw that out there. There is some other things that I did want to share here too, just alluding to all of this, because I mean, look, some people would say that it's it's this or it's that, and maybe this is just kind of like a counter argument. Could it be something that is, you know, exerting from the individual rather than the individual perceiving something outside of them, right, Like that would be what they say is psychokinesis. So then I was like,
all right, does this connect to Tulpa's. You know, no matter what you believe about Tulpa's, a lot of people believe this kind of shit. Not everybody. I mean, I'm not even saying half of all people believe it, but there are a lot of people within this kind of community that believes in psychokinesis and levitation and you know, the magic of the mind that maybe that's what we're talking about here. So I figured maybe we'll give a little brief overview as to what tulpas are. We've kind
of gone over them before in the past. What was that? Remember that video that the Spirit animals shared of that thing being born out of the egg? That wasn't a tulpa? That was what was What was that again?
You No, that was a camera which, again, for the love of God, for people who believe that that's real, do like even a quick cursory understanding of how genetics work. You can't insert your jiz into the egg of another creature and get some sort of a hybrid. That's literally not how genetics works. Whatsoever? How many things does dogs hump? So you're telling me if a dog humps a cat. We're gonna get a cat dog out of it. That's not how.
It actually works, dude, Jacob, have you never seen the cartoon?
Obviously it works clearly. Nickelodeon was on one.
You're correct, by bad. I was so in my understanding of what this psychokinesis is and what they were saying about some kind of group energy projection, I thought that kind of sounded very similar to what a tulpa is. For those who don't know a tulpa, I have, Marv the octopus from Metamisteries Metamistics now is supposed to be inside of this crystal that I wear around my neck. Sounds crazy, sounds woo woo, whatever, but it was created
by our boy lord Byron Jester. He believes that that energy of that tulpa that we created, of our logo is inside of this, and so I wear it every day. Who cares if it is it is, if it isn't, I mean, it still looks pretty cool. But either way, So tulpa's a history and example of living thought forms. So we're not gonna read this whole thing, but we're gonna see if it rhymes a little bit, right. So did anyone ever have an imaginary friend? Jake, have you ever had one of those?
I can't say that I have. I mean not in the way I guess. So at one point in time, you ever seen the old show Foster's Home.
For Imaginary Friends.
It sounds familiar.
It's a cartoon from back in the day.
Anyway, inspired me to like create one, But I think it I created it and then forgot about it, like within a couple of days, because I had like actual friends to go hang with.
Well I and I could be wrong, but if I'm not mistaken, this is also similar to whenever children give imaginations to their toys. So like Barbie, you know, this is her favorite food and this is her favorite place to go, Like it almost takes on a little personality, right, And I don't know if that's exactly tulpa, like Tulpa mancy or whatever, but Tulpa mancy is that the word for it. That's what you know, if you're trying to create a Tulpa. Yeah, be considered Taupa mancy.
Gotcha?
Okay, So because and the only reason I thought about that is because back in the day I used to have one of those. My buddy Dolls. If anybody any of the nineties babies out there, you remember my buddy Dolls. And I used to chase my friends around the neighborhood with it because they thought it looked so much like Chucky, right, because it was like the nice version of Chucky. It looked like it was just this little, this little blonde, white baby doll looking thing that had overalls and a
hat and very friendly. My buddy, My my buddy. However, the fucking song went, and and that was I carried that thing with me everywhere, and I gave him a little personality, and this is what he likes, this is what he doesn't like. And so I wonder if that's kind of like maybe the beginning of a tulpa being created.
But that was all in a physical thing, right, That wasn't like you created in your mind. You gave this ananim an objective personality.
Fuck.
I played with g I, Joe's and yeah, I gave them like little personalities and all of these things, for sure, But that's not me creating a tulpa. That was me having a vivid imagination, because fuck, every time we'd play, there may be different personalities associated with each of these things. Maybe it'd be the same one, it'd be a continuation of the last toy that we got together and play.
I don't know.
I mean, if that's the case, then you could say that everybody that believes in a tulpa is really just a believing in an imaginary kind of made up thing, right, which, yeah, let's read a little bit about it, because I don't know. So someone or something that you played with and told all of your secrets talking about your imaginary friend, a friend that you were so sure could be real if you only believed hard enough. What if all of your
beliefs and intentions actually made them real. Some believe that this is really possible, that if you put enough careful thought and intention into an imaginary being, you can will it into existence. Once created, this being is essentially a living thought form called a tulpa. So what is a tulpa? By most definitions, a tulpa is a being or object created of an out of intense spiritual concentration. Typically, these beings are created for a specific purpose or to help
their creators accomplish a specific goal. The idea of a tulpa was first introduced to me in what I now realized was a little known Disney Channel show called So Weird. In this show, I don't know if I've ever seen that one.
Oh dude, wait that one and don't look under the bed. That was the other one, whereas like the Boogeyman was actually her imaginary friend come to life whenever she stopped believing in him too early and all this shit, which is also really fucked up for kids to watch. That was way too scary for five year olds to be watched. And let's be real. Yeah, but uh yeah, So Weird was uh it was kind of like a paranormal esque show. You remember, Brink, Yeah, okay, we're on So Weird. Yeah,
I think that I remember it now? Is that the one?
Like the logo was like this big smiley face or something like that.
No, no, no, the logo is like these kids looking scared as fuck at the camera with a UFO behind them.
So here's here's the backstory to that one.
So uh, I forget the other dude's name, but two of the dudes that played him Brink Old Peter, the one that finally pulled off the inverted five forty at the end. He and Brink were the older brother and the cousin of the main character chick in it, the mom from the Basketball movie who as a matter of fact, weirdly enough, you ever heard of the band The Mamas and the Papas.
Yeah, okay, this.
Band had a weird Oh god, that's a whole conversation now remember this.
Yeah, yeah, so the mom from so Weird. Yeah, yeah, there's the two dudes so Ericvon didn't and then your boy Peter that pulled off the five forty. Yeah, the mom standing next to the chick there that is the daughter of two of the people from The Mamas and the Papas.
That was like a swinger vibe thing.
She was really fucked up for the longest time, but then she broke out into acting and Disney gave her a couple roles as a mom. So yeah, the show was actually not a bad show. Gonna be completely honest with you. It was kind of like a kid's version of like a paranormal esque show.
It was supposed to be like.
Super creepy vibes, but like, yeah, that's the logo that I remember.
Seeing so many times.
Wow, damn, what a dude. Talk about a flash to the past.
Yeah, it's a deep cut look at the Disney logo at the bottom right. You want to talk about a deep fucking cut that used to that was the thing?
Uh huh?
Like that went away in the late nineties. I know.
Man, Oh I miss old school Disney. This is back when it was like Imagine or that and all that crazy shit. Yeah, good old ep Cot was like the newest thing that Disney had as an attraction.
It was like it was wild things.
Good old days.
Dude.
But anyhow, by that.
Logic is speaking on Disney here, does that make Woody a tulpa for Andy?
Because the cowboy asque vibe of whatever.
That's one thing, but he gave what the personality to make him all these things?
Right. I'm if if we are to believe that tulpas are a thing, then it would fit the bill.
I think so if you believe hard enough, your toys can't come to life when you're not around and have entire story arcs in and of themselves.
Dude. I used to believe that whenever I was younger, especially after watching Toy Story. Yeah, but you know, a Toy Story came out and I was like four or five when that came out.
You know, every kid, every single kid alive. Like, we go to school and think, like, bro, what if toy stories reals and my kids are or what if toy story is real and my toys are playing around in my room right now without me. Every kid has had that daydream.
And every time you'd come home hoping that your favorite toy was in a different place. Yeah yeah, oh shit, yeah yeah, just to prove it. Uh right, So anyway, yeah, they bring up so weird. In this show, the main character, who is a girl who encounters the paranormal on a regular basis, meets a young boy who created an imaginary friend as a way of coping with bullies. The imaginary friend became real a tulpa, and had the ability to
move things and affect the world around it. It also had a mind of its own and became very overprotective of its creator. In the episode, the young boy eventually had to stand up to his tulpa and banish it. Wow, I don't remember that part. I remember being fascinated by this concept that we imagine that what we imagine could somehow take on a life of its own. So how and why would someone create a tulpa? This is where it's gonna get pretty weird, okay. So tulpa's are typically
created on purpose to fulfill some sort of need. Today, there are certain magic practitioners that incorporate tulpa's into their practice. Only they may be only They may be called servitor, which is technically what my necklace is called. These servitors are created to perform a task, whether it is to whether it be to protect their creator or their home, or to go out into the world and bring things into the life of the creator such as love or money.
There are a number of uses for these beings, and one practitioner may create multiple servitors for different purposes. Tulpas or servitors basically the same thing are typically created through intense concentration. As mentioned previously, a person may write down the purpose of their tulpa and list out the characteristics that it needs to have to accomplish their purpose. The creator may even draw an image of what it should
look like. For example, if a tulpa was being created to protect someone's home, the creator may imagine a very large being with strong arms, perhaps even armor or sharp teeth or whatever the creator feels is a protective feature. They would then focus all intent and belief on this image or whatever they had written, perhaps even entering a
meditative state to bring the creature into existence. So you see how it's kind of similar to the imagination of a child, which is why I think they kind of bring the imagination of the toys and shit like that into it. Right, So all right, this is where I thought it was gonna get awesome. Okay. So the word tulpa originated from the Tibetan sproll pa, which means to let emanations go forth? Could that be if we are to believe the Tulpas and the Tibetans obviously believed it,
that they created a term for it. That Could that be that that's what they were experiencing whenever they created this fictional character as the ghost. It's kind of what I'm trying to build here. So in nineteen twenty nine, the word was used by Alexandra David Neil to describe a practice that she discovered when traveling and learning about
the Tibetan culture. In her book called Magic and Mystery in Tibet, David Neil explains that she met that she met the Dali Lama in nineteen twelve, and he explained that in a state of perfect concentration, he could create many phantoms otherwise known as tulpa's of himself in any form that he chose, So Dhali Lama believed it. It says the limitless power of creation of the of the
Dali Lama was attributed to spiritual status. However, she also references tolkus tolka's to tolkus whatever, which we're described as a shorter lasting manifestation that any human had the power to create. It seems that the strength of the tulpa depends on the strength or level of concentration. A similar being in Jewish folklore is called a gollum.
That's right, How is that similar?
Gollum is a clay creature that you carve a certain word into the forehead and then speak a spellover.
Well, I think the idea is is that you sit there, you think about it, you concentrate on it, maybe you man meditate on it while you're also doing those other things. It's not just the physical steps that you got to take. That you almost have to apply your intention and your imagination to it at the same time, I think, is what they're referring to.
Yeah, but that's completely different than a tulpa, which doesn't have any physicality.
This you have to physically carve it yourself. I think gallums take it a step farther in creating the actual physical form of it. But as far as the for a lack of a better term, the consciousness of that gollum would have been created through intense concentration and whatnot, I think is what they're trying to talk about here. So, according to Miriam Webster, the term gllum originally meant shapeless mass.
Gollums are creatures created from inanimate matter such as mud or clay, and brought to life to serve their creator using a charm or sacred word. The main difference here is that gollums are actually created from matter, where a tulpa is created purely from intention, although if strong enough,
they may have a physical appearance. So I'm not trying to get too far into the weeds on that, but basically my point was, you know, them communicating with this other thing that is going on on may very well be what the Dalai Lama would call a tolka a sproll paw, which just really means to let emanations go forth, essentially saying that there is something that is coming out
of you. Your belief, your intention, your imagination, all of that is charged up and somehow, I don't know, coming out of you in one way or another, emanating right, like the sun emanates onto the flowers right in that same way, a light emanating onto your table right now, right, and like it is coming out so projected outward is what the Tibetans believed and ultimately what the Dalai Lama believes.
Not saying that anybody any of this is real or false, I'm just trying to say, you know, I'm trying to come up with, like what's the explanation? How is this possible? Right? So then there's the history of Taupa mancy, which we don't need to get into. That just kind of wanted to bring that up here. So I don't know if we even need to talk about this. But how to Yeah, this is a conspiracy show. I'm not going to say how to conduct a seance.
I mean I'm curious, like how much of the movies have you know, how much of that spot on or not? Because these people that were conducting this experiment were performing seances correct, Yes, yes, they were performing seances with the intention of making contact with a fictitious character that they created completely from their own imagination.
M h, I mean out loud.
That would be like saying that I am going to go and start this car that I'm making up in my mind, completely fictitious. I'm going to go outside with this key and eventually one day I'm going to turn the ignition on a car that I've made up in my mind. It's not even a car that really exists, Like where it's from is a place.
The name of the the manufacturer is a thing.
Uh, you know this car has always had an engine knock problem, you know, coming up with a whole backstory for it whatever, and then one day going outside and sticking the key into an ignition and like it starts, and you're like, whoa, I made this happen. It took a year of figuring it out, but like I got it. Like that's that's insanity.
Yeah, But there's also there also seems to be limitations to this. So like they they could get all the knocks, they can get the table moving around, but they couldn't get any kind of physical emanation of it, right, Like, so there seemed to be that there were definitely limitations. Otherwise they would have done other things rather than just proving that this thing is knocking at this table. Right.
So so anyway, and it's it's actually not a long article, so we can we can kind of just burn through it. So why not? And this is from liveabout dot com, the article that was talking about the Phillipic experiment earlier. But so it says throughout the Victorian age, parties that featured a seance were all the rage hosts would gather together to contact the dead. In recent years, there have
been increased skepticism towards seances. However, a lot of people continue to believe that making contact with the dead is possible. So as far as the supplies you'll need, it says, if you're planning to hold a seance in your own home, you need a few like minded people and a few vital supplies. By the way, I just want to put this out there. If you are a devout religious person,
maybe just skip ahead a couple of minutes. Okay, this is getting into performing seances and toulpla mancy and only I only decided to even bring this one up because I saw it earlier and I was like, ah, fuck, it. It's Halloween. It's Halloween season, so let's get spooky, right sure.
Sure, this is not an instruction guide that we want cult members to follow, right, Like, if you do this, you know, if you feel like you want to, but it is not us telling you to do this. As the resident Christian, I need to at least make that statement known. We're not sharing this information hoping that all of our cult members are going to start going out there and performing salance.
Is that they're kitchen table.
As a matter of fact, I don't want any of you to do this specifically because the Bible, in the Old and New Testament said don't fucking do this.
So just so we're clear, but moving on, and as a self proclaimed mystic and philosopher and wonderer of all things, if you do happen to dabble in these directions, reach out to me at metamistics at yahoo dot com. Okay, just let me know what your experience was. I want to hear about it. I'm into all the weird, I'm into all the wu wuo, I'm into all the fucking unexplainable shit, So reach out to me. So that is kind of funny though about how we both kind of
have very separate ideas on that. But no, I believe this shit's real.
Like I mean, I'm I'm not saying that even this article is going to actually tell you how to do it correctly. If very well may it very well may, And it's one on the money, It's very possible that this is like one person's interpretation of some stuff that they found once upon a time. I don't know, but like the Book of Deuteronomy is very clear on these types of things. And then in the New Testament, Jesus and his disciples reference the Torah, which is where deuterontomy
is saying that this is truth. So like, just don't it's telling you that, like this is real, Like Katie with the Dead is a thing that you can physically do, it tells you not to do it specifically.
So yeah, like that's that's where I'm at with it.
You on the other hand, But that's the other thing, right, unless you acknowledge the book to be truth, then like it wouldn't matter to.
You, which is why it does.
So I mean, I get that.
And also I come from the understanding all two that you know, one person's grimoire is not everybody's grim war, you know, just want to throw that out there, so you know, it could be somebody looks up a spell or a magic potion or something from a grimoire and maybe it works for some people, maybe it doesn't work for you. Everybody's different. So anyway, outside of that, it says, so if you're planning to hold a seance in your own home, you need a few like minded people and
a few vital supplies. When choosing participants, select people who believe in the possibility of communicating with the dead. Skeptics can harm the seances chances of success. And I will say that's not the first time something like that has been mentioned, right, Like I talked about the time that I was out, you know, camping with the kids. We saw a bunch of for a lack of a better term,
orbs up in the sky. Maybe they were fucking, I don't know whatever, they were right, And I told my sister, hey, come out and look at this. She said no. Eventually she ended up going out to her car to go charge her phone. She and whenever she came out because she didn't believe. She said, I don't believe in that stuff. I'm not even gonna look up because she didn't believe. Whenever she was out there, nothing appeared. Whenever she went
back in the tent, they started appearing again. So there's something really strange about everybody needing to be on board. I mean, skeptical, fine, but absolute disbelief. It's not going to work for one reason or another. Interesting And and also Chris Bledsoe says this as well. So for anybody that goes out there and does the sky watches with them, if they have a night that they're not seeing something, they're like, all right, who's the disbeliever? They just assume
that that's what it is. So anyway, so it says, and because the experience can be intense, it is usually best to keep young children out of the circle for obvious reasons. Otherwise, all you need concerning supplies is a round or oval table, a candle, and some food. Both the candles and food are believed to attract spirits who are looking for worms and sustenance.
So wait, what the fuck?
Okay, sure worms is in like the heat from the candle.
I guess not that. What the fuck is a ghost he gonna do with food?
Can't take it with them? I don't know. Maybe it's an offering.
Like that's why I stop myself. It's like, never mind.
If they say it's what you need to do, then fine, I just I don't understand the reason, but I ain't got to.
So I mean, hey, Santa needs his cookies. You know what I'm saying. It's an offering.
You ever present Tulpa of Santa Claus?
Yes, yeah, buddy. So it says how to hold a sayance. So once you got all that doesn't require much. Couple of like minded believers, a candle, a table, some food, you got it, that's all you need, right, It says, so to hold a seance and increase the chances of contacting a spirit, follow these steps and there's only fourteen of them. So only fourteen but there they seem pretty easy.
So I mean, to be fair, it could be like a one hundred page step by step guide. It's, you know, fourteen steps releasing that bad in the grand scheme of shit.
I mean, I've I've carried through with a thousand steps to build a fucking ikea chair before, right, Like fourteen steps to contact the other side. All right, So number one you need to assemble the participants gather the people who will participate. Some say the number of participants must be divisible by three, but this does not seem to
be an absolute role. No fewer than three people should attempt a seance, So you need at least three, is what they're saying, as it can be emotionally and physically exhausting on a small group.
Interesting, I've heard stories of two being able to make things happen.
I don't know that for a fact, but okay, for a seance, I gyeah.
I mean yeah, they always say that like the more the merrier when it comes to this kind of thing, the more people around, the stronger it is, and all these things. But like I sure was under the impression that, hell, I thought you could do this solo.
Well, I mean what it That would probably just be like a meditation or a spell at that point.
And no, if you're communicating with the dead but you're alone, I figured that, like, that's like our boy who does the sacrifices to the demons and shit, to my understanding, he does this alone.
Yeah, I don't know. I mean, this is just this is what it is, So I don't know.
Yeah, I'm not trying to argue with you on this. It's just all right like that. Maybe I've never heard that there was a number associated with this kind of thing.
Maybe it's called something else. If there's only one or two people, and whenever you get three or more, it's called a seance. Maybe it's something like that. Okay, So then you would want to choose a medium, it says, you might want to choose a medium among the participants. This could be a person who has had experience with seances or someone who has displayed that they've got psychicability. So you need you know somebody who is who you
believe is the most capable of hearing messages or whatever. Right, it says, then you would use a round or an oval table. This helps create the symbolic circle believed necessary for the ritual. A square or rectangle table would make it more difficult to join hands, so that's why you would need an oval or round table. Then you would set the table in the center of the table, place some simple and naturally aromaic or aromatic food such as bread or soup. This is believed to help attract the
spirit who still seek physical nourishment. Oh interesting, Why would a spirit that is detached from the physical realm. Okay, yep, because the article here kind of like what I was saying earlier, that these could be ghosts that like they haven't given up on being physical. Maybe they got their life taken away too soon and they don't even know
that they're dead or something like that. That's actually what I've heard in the past is that typically some people don't want to quote unquote crossover to the other side, right, And so that's how you get ghosts, because you know people who were addicted to drugs or alcohol or sex or food or whatever physical things, right, And that's why you would have spirits that don't want to cross over,
because they're still attached to those things allegedly. Okay, So it says, then you would want to light the candles. So also in the center of the table, place no fewer than three candles, or a number divisible by three lit candles. The more candles, the better. Spirits still seek warmth and light, all right, So that's how you're gonna,
I guess attract them in. So it says, then you want to create some atmosphere, dim the lights and eliminate any distractions, turn off all music, and quiet the television. Then you'd want to join hands, So seated around the table, the participants must all join hands in a circle. Then to some of the spirit, so the participants must speak these words together, are beloved. Whatever the name of the spirit is, we bring you gifts from life into death.
Commune with us name of the spirit, and move among us.
Oh spooky yeah.
Then you would. Then you would wait for a response. If no response comes, repeat the chant until the spirit responds. Then communicate. It says. If and when the spirit responds, either by rapping or some other means through or through the medium, ask your questions. So it doesn't have to necessarily respond by a rapping. It could almost I don't want to say channeling, but maybe that person would be able to speak on behalf of the spirit. Whatever it
is what they're saying here. So then you would communicate. And then you begin so ask the spirit yes or no questions. At first, ask the spirit for one rap to communicate no, and two raps to communicate yes. For example, it says, if a spirit chooses to speak through the medium, you may ask any kind of question. It says, if the seance seems to be getting out of hand, end the seance by breaking the circle of hands, extinguishing the candles,
and turning on the lights. And if you want to end the seance, it says, when you're done with your line of questioning, thank the spirit for joining you and tell them to go in peace, break the circle of hands, and extinguish the candles. So it says hosting a seance can be an emotional yet satisfying experience when you're hosting your meeting. When hosting your meeting, proceed with caution and patience to get the best results. Damn, Jake, you want.
To try it?
Dude?
No, I really don't. I could I do?
You only like quote the verse to tell you not to do this shit? Nah, just anybody wants.
To look it up.
Rules are for squares, Jacob, I disagree, respectfully. It's the cult of fucking conspiracy. Baby.
We literally just read a list of rules on a seance. Rules are for squares, this fucking guy. I mean the rules are only for squares if you don't like them.
I mean some rules, I like, you know, some rules are Okay. I'm not a complete renegade over here, So all right, now we get to the craziness by Northrop Grumming Okay, So if anybody is out there, you're saying, there's no way a seance could be real. There's no way of tulpa or you know, a thought form or projected andation of myself or a ghost or anything exists. I don't believe in that. Shit. Will fret not because Northrop Grumming of the UH military Industrial Complex is here
to serve you. So it says, what is the difference between psychokinesis and telekinesis? Just listen to this shit, okay, right, So it is hitting on some things, but you're gonna see how they try and persuade you at the end. So it says the key takeaways, which we're not gonna read that because we want to actually read the whole thing and not just read the spark notes of it. So it says, our psychic ability is the next step on humans evolutionary path. Brain research says that this is
an unlikely outcome. Oh no shit coming from the military industrial complex. The wants to be able to provide fucking technology for you to be able to achieve that. But it says, but it's all it's not all bad news. Emerging technologies may pave the way for human telekinetic abilities, which risingly are different than their close cousins psychokinetic powers. Here's a look at how these two techniques differ, what parapsychology has to say about human potential, and how tech
could make these powers possible. Okay, yeah, buddy, relying on our tech overlords.
Obviously, that's obvious.
We need to We need more AI in our lives, clearly.
Yeah, I mean, look, who needs the hold a seance? Just give me that brain chip, you know what I mean, like, give me, give me a little bit. Pretty much the same goddamn thing.
Interchangeable dialogue At this point I was also I misspoke a moment.
It goes Deuteronomy eighteen. Anyway, moving on.
Moving on, So what is the difference between psychokinesis and telekinesis? For starters, both rely on the power of your mind to control the world around you. Where they differ, however, is in what exactly your controlling Put simply, in the case for psychokinesis, your powers influenced someone's mind to take action. With telekinesis, you have the ability to manipulate objects directly. Here's an example to highlight the difference. It's been a long day, and you finally sit down on the couch
to relax with your partner and watch some TV. The show you're watching ends, but you don't want to watch what's showing next, And wouldn't you know it, the remote is out of reach on the far side of your coffee table. Sure, you could get up, walk all the way over there, get the remote, and walk back, or you could use your powers. If you've got psychokinesis, you introduce a small suggestion into your partner's mind they should get the remote, and while they're at it, they may
as well grab a snack. Yes, so hey, if you've got telekinesis, your power lets you directly manipulate the remote, levitating it off the table and into your hand. Then you open the cupboard, bring out a bowl, fill it with snacks, and gently float it over to the couch. In both cases, the outcome is the same, but the mental mechanism differs. That's kind of a crazy example, bud Well.
Well, I mean no, but that's what telekinesis is.
You know.
It's like Matilda shit, yeah exactly.
Yeah, yeah, yeah. So a parapsychology primer, so it says parapsychology is the study of psychic powers and other extrasensory phenomena. According to Psychology Today, efforts to scientifically assess the human capacity for psychic powers began in the nineteen thirties at Duke University with Joseph Banks Rhine. Along with his colleagues, Ryan conducted experiments why with card guessing and dice rolling to see if it was possible for people to predict
outcomes in advance. Common areas of areas of study of para psycho psychologists sorry include precognition other like seeing the future, telepathy which is communicating mind to mind, and clairvoyance, which is the ability to perceive things happening in distant locations, along with telekinesis and psychokinesis. Despite nearly a century of study, however, parapsychologists remain largely empty handed when it comes to evidence.
According to Psychology Today, some studies, such as Daryl Bem's ex expeeriments with word recall, suggests that people could feel the future, but subsequent research could not replicate the results. This is a consistent problem for the discipline. Although one off experiments often show promising data, repeated trials under the same conditions don't produce the same outcomes. Work on both
telekinesis and psychokinesis has delivered similarly underwhelming results. While body language and emotional intelligence can help humans influence the minds of other humans nearby, this fits firmly into regular psychology rather than parapsychology when it comes to moving objects with our minds. Meanwhile, supposed magicians such as Uri Geller spent decades trying to convince audiences that he could bend spoons with his mind. Spoiler alert, he could not, so, he says,
so they say. A piece from Medium points out that our thoughts themselves can be considered telekinetic, and that the activation of neurons causes them to move. Since these neurons have mass, they affect other pieces of matter in your brain,
meaning you've effectively moved something within in your mind. Okay, but you see how like we just gave a huge example, whether you believe it or not, and this you can kind of tell where this is starting to go, right, Like the idea is we want to diminish the idea that you can achieve this on your own so much so that we can sell you on you know, kind of like turning you into some kind of robot with some kind of technology that you can you know, that
you can wear or put inside your body. Like this is how you sell something, right, Like the idea is is that, hey, you know what, I see that you got a I don't know, maybe I'm a car salesman, right, Like you come over and yeah, I see that you want that Honda Cord. But have you checked out this fucking Lambeau? I mean, how many RPMs you think that Honda Core can get up? How fast? In zero to sixty do you think that Honda Core can get up? Oh? It can? It can? It can reach sixty miles an
hour and six seconds. That's cute. This Lambeau can do it in two and a half or something like that. Right, It's like it's diminishing the other side to help prop up what they have is what I think is going on here. So oh, here we go. So telekinesis goes tech It says, while there's no evidence for parapowered telekinesis, technology offers a way to make the dream of moving things with our minds a reality, known as brain computer interfaces.
BCI's Baby Scientific American explains that this tech relies on grids of electrodes implanted into the brains cortex. More chips going in ready.
To your head.
Terrifying, But okay, I mean this is fucking Elon. Well, Elon produces something similar, at least I'm a fan of it. Me neither, I would never get that shit. So these electrodes record the behavior of neurons as they fire, and then translate this neuron behavior into thoughts and actions. And this isn't just speculation. Bcies allow patients to interact with
software applications or move prosthetic devices. New research from Caltech shows that advanced bcies can predict a patient's inner internal monologue. It can predict the internal monologue. Holy shit. So you have sixty thousand thoughts in a day, brother, this shit can read every single one.
Of them.
And predict you, predict what you're about to think before you think it.
I mean, you no longer have any sovereignty anymore. There's no more free will of anything you're now being. You're a controlled, fucking robotic puppet.
Man.
This is some black mirrorshit. This is black mirrate is, in my opinion, black magic shit.
But yeah, yeah, for I mean, I would say even worse. I mean, you ain't got to rely on a wish and a hope and a dream and a faith. I mean they got the fucking device. It's working every time, baby. So yeah. It says that bcies can predict a patient's internal monologue, the things that we think but don't say, with a high degree of accuracy, which could help develop devices that let non vocal patients speak. Oh see, this is what they always do. They make it like.
See.
It helped this paralyzed person. It helped a deaf person. Here, it helped the blind person. See right, It helped this person with no leg have a legged walk. Let them feel normal. This is they pull out your heart strings, right. This how they pass it at first. So moving on, It's worth noting that BCIs are a work in progress. Consider that currently accurate BCI readings rely on cutting a
portion of the skull to implant electrodes. Efforts are underway, however, to produce non invasive alternative alternatives capable of collecting brain data through layered materials such as skin or hair. There are also concerns about the impact of BCI development on human behind at scale. Oh my god, they want to do it to everybody. Yep, fuck yes, this.
Is this is this is the future that they want for you. This is the transhumanism that they're after. And no, we don't mean trans is in like trannies. They mean trans is in. Like, oh, well, you got a little bit of robot in you, a little bit of human in you, and we could upload your consciousness into the Internet and you'll live forever. Fuck all of that, dude, I'm out, count me out. Fuck living forever too, Like this body wasn't meant to last forever. This thing has
a heartbeat. Like I was having this conversation with my son the other day, like, your heart is only good for so many beats. Yeah, okay, it's like a motor is only good for so many miles. Sure you could do a whole engine swap at some point, but that then you have to start swapping other components to match the new motor. And it's just look, everything is going to die eventually. That's how this whole thing is built. That's the whole purpose.
And if you're lucky enough, you do get every beat out of that heart, right, Like that's that's the ultimate goal, is to to die of old age or maybe in your sleep or of natural causes. Right, But what this is saying, Well, it's not saying that you can live forever. It's not saying that rate on this article, but it is definitely alluding to potential moving forward.
Right yeah.
Yeah, So it says while existing frameworks are highly specialized and training out and training algorithm models take years, mass produced alternatives can could make limited telekinesis an option for almost anyone. Tell a fucking kinesis with a brain chip in your skull or on your hair or on your skin, to where now you can send a thought. I could send a thought without having to speak to.
You, So like I could send you a text message by thinking it.
And sending it. You don't even need to send a text message. You send whatever you would send in a text message via thought, and I receive it via thought. That's telekinesis.
Well, they're they're saying limited, you know what I mean.
So I don't know if they're saying, like, Okay, this chip in your brain will be uh, let's see compatible with all Apple iOS devices and maybe you know Samsung and Amazon and shit too, maybe to where it would be a thought to text conversion or something along these lines because not everybody's gonna get the chip, and maybe you want to send a grocery list to your wife at the store, or she wants to send it to you while you're at the store, and she's thinking of damn,
we forgot to get toilet paper. Next thing you know, you're getting a little on your phone grab toilet paper. It's like, oh shit, okay, I forgot all about that. And then she's like, oh, I didn't even text you that. No, but your neurallink sent me the message. Oh that's cool. Like I could see them trying to make it seem like it's convenience.
Oh, one hundred people fall for convenience every time, every time. We are suckers for convenience.
Humans are lazy creatures by nature, you know, I get it.
We would rather do nothing, absolutely absolutely, Yeah, dude, So it's going to get crazier. Let's read on. In an article for The Conversation, which I guess is a newspaper or something like that, philosophers John Kendall Hawkins and Sandy bouchet Or Butcher of the University of New England discussed the emergence of the list wait for it technological singularity, which sees AI technology and humans irrevocably intertwined.
Yeah, I bet they do.
They contend that BCIs could be the first step on the road to this singularity, in that there's no going back.
I agree. I agree with that second part of that sentence. But you know, we could in fact, just like not fucking do this and then we don't.
Have to worry about it. It's totally an option too.
I agree to see. Wouldn't you rather just people do fucking spells and seances rather than this fucking advanced bullshit in which they entrap and train everybody?
Do I have to choose between one of these two fucking options?
Just be normal people, just saying if you had to pick, you'd pick not the latter, right, I.
Wouldn't pick the seance option, But I also wouldn't pick this option.
Fuck.
I honestly didn't know that this would be my only two options moving forward.
Hey, at least the people that are performing seances are not government controlled robotic puppets.
I mean that's fair.
At least the lily talking with evil demonic forces and things, and that's not good.
Well, you can't say absolutely.
I mean, for my beliefs, for your beliefs.
Yeah, so anyway, it says, to sum up, while there's no evidence for latent psychic abilities that empower psycho or telekinesis, new technologies may offer a way for human minds to connect with and control the world around us. Doesn't that sound nice? You know, A big shout out to orthrope grumming, big shout out to the military industrial fucking complex. They only want what's best for you, Jacob.
Okay, it sounds the most dystopic, like, holy fuck, No, big brother, doesn't you have to watch you anymore.
Big Brother knows what you're about to think before you even think it.
Big Brother gave you that thought.
Broh, What the fuck are we talking about right now?
Yeah? Well, and let me tell you a little something extra. I think that you don't even need a chip in your brain for them to be able to control or at least send you some thoughts if you really look into you know, some of the beliefs behind the five
G or the coming six G towers. I mean, you're talking about sending short wave I don't even know what they're called, short wave little energy forms or something like that, literally to everybody, and they're they're very disruptive to the the energy and the physical body of the human right. This is why people talk about like, oh, they're they're sending me thoughts and I'm having thoughts I don't want to have, or I'm feeling this way. I didn't even need anything bad or you know what I mean, like
weird shit. And and those people that are saying that sound crazy right now, they do. They do sound crazy right now. Wait till it's happening on mass then who's gonna be crazy?
You know?
So, I don't know. It could be a hair bang conspiracy. But what I am saying is is that big tech absolutely is looking to enslave humanity through the use of convenience, through the use of AI exactly.
So for everybody who thinks that AI is not a threat, yeah, it may not be a threat right now as of October of twenty twenty five, give it another six months, year five ten, it's not going to get.
Better, oh one hundred percent. Yeah, Like, and I use AI like.
I know it fucking kills me, Jonathan, and the way that I'm mean it might end up killing you other what we're talking.
Don't get too crazy. The aim that's what we just talked about. There are various forms of AI, just like there's various forms of fire. You can light a lighter, you can light a match, or you can fucking you know, uh, I don't know, fucking bomb an entire country with fire, right Like, there's different levels to this ship and the way that most people are communicating and you know, using AI. It is not to the level of which the military industrial complex and the powers that be are going to
use it. However, Yeah, there's a big However. The however is is that I know without a shadow of a doubt that they are absolutely collecting data on all of it. There's they would be dumb if they're not. Right, there are huge data farms that are that are in Texas right now as we speak. Right, you know, we talked about uh what was it called Oracle, right, the the one that that's the one that's in uh in Texas, the one that is running your algorithms for TikTok and
Facebook and in and everything like that. So that now the United States is in control of the algorithm that you get. And so if you're wondering, man, why is TikTok so whack today? Why is Instagram suggesting this. Why is YouTube, you know, trying to show me things that I've never even thought about? Right, what's the algorithm that is being literally created by our government? This is the plain Larry Ellison, fucking Larry Ellison.
Yes, God, my TikTok scrolling is just ass today, thanks a lot, Ellison.
Basically yeah, yeah, and some people have tried to figure a workaround around that. I don't think there is one.
There isn't.
So, yeah, it's not just TikTok, it's all of them. I mean, whatever you are looking at on your phone, they are collecting data off of It doesn't even need to be Chat, GBT or grock or any of that. These are all different companies that are collecting your data. They are data collection fucking centers, right, just like just like Safari Not Safari, but just like Duck Duck Go, and just like Google and if ask Jeeves is still
around whatever, right, like they're all in SuPAR. Yeah, it's it's all data farming, is my point.
That's my point.
Though.
You're saying that this isn't to the level that we're talking about with the military industrial complex and all these things yet, but it will be and so many people have lost the sense of how to do research on their own or how to find information now on their own. It's like even even if you look in college these days, it used to be that you would copy and paste someone else's work and change a couple of words here
and there and plagarize it that way. Kids these days are just doing AI prompts and that's how they're writing their essays and shit. And it's like they're not even now, I'm not saying that every single essay is going to be critical to their education and all that. Most of these kids are getting degrees and shit that they're not even gonna use like let's let's just be real here,
and I get that, but now take that to the macro. Right, They're gonna have doctors eventually, real shit, who actually didn't retain any knowledge from their medical school. It's just okay, you're gonna come in with a list of symptoms and this happened. They're gonna plug it into an AI prompt and the AI prompts gonna tell them what to do.
Dude, I don't know who you like, let me tell you something. They're already doing that without AI, Like every time I've gone to the doctor, which I have not gone very often over the last ten years because I refuse to get any kind of insurance outside of car insurance only because I have to. But every time I've gone to the doctor and they're looking up a symptom for this, or why is it like this? Dude, they
go on their fucking computer and google it. Like them inserting it into AI is just an advanced form of what they're already doing, most of them, but most of them are. It's too much information for them to remember everything. It's not like Gray's an atom or or your fucking doctor house, Oh you have this kind of itch? Did you drink that? Or did you come in contact? Like not everybody's a fucking genius, so they got to look it all up, right.
And what I'm standing is to be if anybody is gonna be the genius, I needed to be the doctors. But no, I'm not against them doing online research for so especially obscure shit that you know you may only see three of these cases in your entire medical career.
You know, I get that.
And again, AI, as of this moment that we're having this conversation isn't a threat, but what's it going to be in ten years. Whenever the AI is giving them prompts to kill the person.
I mean, hopefully they will not abide. I mean literally, it's it's within like you know, do thou shall not fucking hurt or whatever the fuck the Oh they're hippocratic oath. Hippocratic oath.
Yeah, yeah, because yeah, that's a thing.
I mean, look, already the leading reason for most deaths in America is medical malpractice.
Right, yeah, but I mean we have other governments that are currently right now helping people commit suicide, like real shit, And you could go to an AI prompt then it will just show you how to do it and give you options on how to do it and.
Not like this is this is the way that they wanted to go down.
Hey, look, just to give you my perception of AI, AI is advanced Internet. That's all it is.
Bro hold on, we were just talking about the dangers of AI with the military natural complex, and now you're defending it.
No, no, no, no, you won't have your cake and eat it too. What I'm saying it is the natural evolution of the Internet.
I disagree.
AI couldn't have been created without the Internet, not without all the collection that it datted via that it that it gathered via the internet, like it it takes the Internet to do these things.
Once again, the Terminator Movies were talking about this quite a while back.
I mean, obviously that's the worst possible case, right Like.
I see it as an inevitability at this point.
It's very possible. I'm not even sitting here trying to defend AI. I don't need to defend it or you know, be on its side or you know, or anything like that. I think that what's going to come is going to be inevitable, and it doesn't regardless of what I believe it's going to be. All I'm saying is is that, I mean, hey, I is doing decent. It's not doing terribly horrific things just yet. But I will also say, maybe we just are not privy to everything that it
is doing yet. And eventually it will come out as to what they're even using. Even the baby form of what it is right now, compare it to what is going on five years from now, people will look back and say, man, that's probably a fire we should have never lit. Most people will will say that, and I will agree with that. But right now and it's infant stages. I'm having fun with it. People are creating like funny
videos with it. Shout out to the Big Grimbowski. He made a video I don't know with some other famous person. He's smoking a bong with some famous person. It's hilarious videos right now. But that's how they fucking pull you in anyway.
Right there, Baby agreed.
It's always fun, it's always convenience, it's always something to pull you in. I'm not even saying and that it's entirely good or entirely bad. I'm just saying that there's multiple roads of which it could go. But when we're looking at our government, they always want to use it militaristically.
And if there's anything that we have learned throughout the damn near nine hundred and twenty some odd episodes that we've done, is that the government is not on your side, right and if they can find a way to militarize something, they fucking.
Will, I'm gonna stick with my I'm trademarking this shit New Ajamish. You know, I believe the Internet is where we should stop our technology. Anything beyond the Internet is probably just to our own demise.
Honestly, so very well.
Look, I do want to watch the video, and we have a video of the sale list or that we're going on with the experiments. It's not a long video, but I do want to watch it so I could see for myself because I'm still on the fence here whether this is just in my opinion based off of what we have heard thus far, and if it is real and it wasn't just you know, for the showmanship of it, it sounds like it could.
Be Dark Forces slash hokum.
I'm not sure which one yet, and there may be a third option that I'm just not considering.
I don't know.
You brought up Tolpa's and egger Gore's and I mean, I broke down my opinion on these things, so I mean, I'm kind of pretty stalwarts in that one.
But I am interested to.
See the actual video evidence that they have of this. However, like we read earlier, there is no video evidence of the knocking or the table flipping or any of these things. So I'm curious what this has on it.
You know, it is interesting to see the different perspectives here because I'm looking at it as wow, holy shit, like humans can can do this. This is crazy, like because I personally don't believe in ghosts either. It's very interesting how we have these two different opposing kind of views where one is looked at as either obviously either a hoax or demonic, and whereas the other view is
looking at it as holy shit. It the America. The the human mind is capable of so much, right mm, which I agree with that for the record.
The human mind is is capable of doing incredible and terrible things.
Both can be true at the same time.
No doubt. So let's let's uh, god, damn, I'm getting choked up over here, dude, what did you do? You swallowed spit down the wrong hole or something? No, just out of nowhere? Then help me, baby, it's gotta be so yeah, let's check it out real quick.
An unusual experiment is about to be filmed in the studios of City TV in Toronto. At the stars of this show are eight people sitting around a table. Off to the side, on a raised bench are three men observing the experiment, Reverend Lindsay Kate, psychologist Joe Elwigen, and the doctor George Owen, scientific director for the Toronto Society of psychical research. The studio director gives the signal that the experiment may begin. The participants lay their hands flat
on the table and begin calling out a name. Soon, the table begins to rise as if it had a life of its own, to the surprise of the participants. Shortly afterwards, it seems that Philip no longer wishes to remain in the middle of the room. As he heads toward Reverend King, the table moves with him, and the eight mediums have a hard time keeping their hands in place. Once the table stops, one of the participants suggests to the clergyman, did he say hello to Philip?
Hello Philip?
The table rises in response. The only problem is that the Philip doesn't exist. Never did Philip Page hold on. This kind of seems like a reenactment, doesn't it.
I'm glad that you said it on me, because I was about to sound like a real dickhead over here, because we heard earlier there was no video evidence of any of the wild shit happening. Yet they just said that in this experiment there was cameras rolling when the reverend was there. Now, obviously this is a reenactment. If not, then if you believe this is a real thing that just took place. I hate to tell you, but Santa
Claus is in fact not real. Like we need to have more conversations here obviously, but uh yeah, so were the camera's rolling when wild shit happened or not? Because the article that we read from their own admission said.
No, okay, yeah, because if it's this well, let's see hold on, let's uh, let's listen.
George Owen George Owen was a mathematician and geneticist. He studied at Cambridge University in England.
At Cambridge, he also had an interest in poltergeist or cut portageist.
With the assistance of three men and five women who had no particular gift for communicating with the spirit world, doctor Owen conducted one of the most significant experiments in the field of parapsychology in the twentieth century. They created Philip the Imaginary Ghost.
So the Imaginary Ghost was at an attempt by the Toronto Society for Psychical Research to prove that paranormal events could be created without the help of spirits.
From another plane.
Is a persic or instead of assuming that all physical manifestations were caused by the spirits of the deceased. A spiritualist claimed lispirites cursus.
Ready, doctor Owen saw a more natural explanation, Pluto opte pour later pratsion. He wanted to show that living beings, through some mechanism that has yet to be explained.
Could project their energy onto material objects.
Doctor Owen asked the group of eight as they were called, to imagine the fictitious character with a name, age, gender and nationality. They came up with Philip, a thirty year old aristocratic Englishman living in the seventeenth century at Diddington Manner in Warwickshire, England. Believe then they invented Philip's life story. He had a wife, Dorothea, who was cold and frigid. He fell in love with Margo, a beautiful young gypsy.
Dorothea discovered her husband's in fidelity and accused Margot of witchcraft. Margot was condemned and burned at the stake.
Okay, obviously a reenactment, right, because this is all anyway, Just want to clarify, all right, all right?
Heartbroken, Philip took his own life jumping off the battlements of Diddington Manor. He was only thirty years old. Of all these biographical tidbits. Diddington manner was the only element that was real, and of course it had never had an occupant resembling Philip.
We took them several months before they had worked out the details of the character they were going to create, so it was nineteen seventy three, I think between eight and nine months later that the experiments actually began.
They met on a weekly basis in a designated area of the society headquarters which we call the Philip Room, and this room was not used for any other purpose, had a card table with eight metal chairs around it, and they met once a week for a period of well over ten years. The group sat around in a circle with a picture of Philip in sort of a meditative state, trying to produce an apparition. And after a year nothing happened, no phenomenon, no apparition film.
We're looking for you, Philip, give us a sign please.
At first, the members just developed a friendship with each other, so they spent months together with no occurrences of a psychokinetic or telekinetic nature.
Then at some point they changed their strategy and suddenly they.
Began to see results like raps on the table or under it, and the table began to shake and move.
These were physical things that could be recorded.
Give us a sign, Philip, Philip, are you there, Philip.
Within a month or two of talking to this imaginary ghost Philip, people started to get raps on the table. In turn, each person would say something like good evening, Philip, up, Hello Philip, and there would be wraps underneath their fingertips, Or if a visitor came in and identified himself and said hello Philip, there'd be a rap underneath the visitor's hand.
These wraps were audible, were tape recorded, and had a characteristic sound envelope, and we've published the results of that auditory study.
The tapping eventually led to the table being shaken, shaken, eventually moving, and eventually actually turning right on its side. Those were really the proofs that they had in fact accomplished their experiment.
The Phillip's manifestations were far from what they had hoped for, but still the group of ask a question and Philip would answer. Surprisingly enough, the answers always corresponded to his alleged biography. As the seances progressed, Philip became more enterprising. After a few wraps on the table, he would raise it off the ground and make it dance on two or three legs.
We were very careful to try and avoid hoaxes. On several occasions we had what are called Doyley nights where we would put Doyley's paper doilies under the hands of the members, and if they tried pushing the table, the doilies would simply slide across the table. So clearly the
table movements were not caused by anyone pushing it. And the cameras when we had those opportunities to videotape it, it was clear that, say, two people sitting on opposite sides of the table, if they both lifted their knees, might lift the table up. It was clear that that was not happening either.
Philip, Are you there? Philip?
Encouraged by the astounding results, other groups around the world tried the same experiment with other imaginary characters. The results were all basically the same.
They told themselves they had found the magic formula La strategy, a mix of spontaneity combined with weekly meetings and an experimental.
Framework a or.
Experience.
They thought this was the secret to being able to produce this kind of phenomenon.
It will, but they realized that this strategy alone.
Was not enough.
Strategy.
It also took a lot of tenacity on the part of the members.
It would appear that the hereafter is not the only explanation for manifestations of so called spirits. However, it's been nearly thirty years since the original Philip experiment, and parapsychologists are still just as puzzled now as they were back then as to what was producing these manifestations.
It is interesting that the scientific community has never followed the Philip experiment or in the many other experiments of a similar nature.
Why I can't answer.
I myself am fully convinced that there is a level of psychic ability that is obtainable bias if we knew how to reach it. Also, let's face it, the scientific community is always a little behind the human experience, and I think the I don't think it's any more profound than that.
Really, because that's what whether you approached this from the spiritualist angle or the parapsychological.
Angle, it's impossible to come up with scientific proof because that proof requires that you not only be able to observe the phenomena and reproduce them. It will you must also come up with a theory to explain the phenomena.
And predict when they will occur.
So since that was impossible in this case, the matter is still not settled.
Let's go dude, all right.
I mean, it's interesting.
There's got to be something to it, unless all of these people were absolutely hoaxes. I mean, at which you can't count out of course. I mean you're talking about, you know, experiments that were held back in the seventies.
You know, people got a little crazy back then, But then again, so did the fucking CIA, right, So it's like people were interested in this kind of stuff, and it is interesting about you know how he was saying that, you know, science and governments never really seemingly tried to take this information and push forward with it. So either A they debunked it or B they're carrying on with it and not letting anybody know, which I'm not gonna lie.
You know, you look at all the crazy experiments that the CIA and the government we're doing back then, especially even now, you know you got Project Artichoke and mk Ultra and you know, the remote viewing programs, and you know,
they were interested in it for a reason. And you could say, well, that's just because the Germans were interested in it, and that's you know, that's the Germans were so interested in it, and they must have been on one and so they brought over a bunch of you know, a bunch of Nazis, Operation paper Clip, and they continued the process. Here's my thing. I don't think, I don't think that there's nothing to it that I mean, of course,
that that's what I would say. I mean, obviously I'm the I'm the the woo woo guy here, but I just I personally believe that the human mind is capable of a lot more than we've been led onto. And most of the time they'll have you believe that it is demons, it is you know, disembodied spirits and disembodied ghosts. But what if it really is us? Like what if? What if all that really is coming from us? Like what And and obviously, like you think about the governments,
you know, they want to poison you. They want to they want to poison your food and your air and your water, and you know, all your media and everything that you watch, and they want to dilute you in every single way. And it makes you wonder, you know, what kind of human would we be if we weren't diluted and we could actually achieve everything that, like the the the untouched human could achieve, makes you wonder, That's all I'm saying.
So all right, And granted, yes, we just saw some very poor recreations of the alleged events.
That took place with these experiments, right, remaking do what? It was a nineties remaking of the thing.
They for sure, for sure, but even remakes aside, And let's just assume that, And for the conversation here, let's assume that all of the claims that were made and the recreations, let's say it was even close to that, right, because the people that conducted those experiments are still alive when this recreation was made, so they'd be able to say, no, it happened just like that, or they'd be like, ah, that's a bit much, dude, it wasn't that crazy.
Well, two of the guys, we were the ones that were speaking, right exactly, that's a point.
Right, So assuming that they are being forthright and that this wasn't a hoax, I'm gonna just take it that way so I could understand what the doctor doctor Owens's theory was on this. He's basically saying that the human mind is way more powerful than we give it credit for. So powerful in fact, that even if you were to create a make believe ghost story, that you can in fact make some ghost like paranormal experiences happen when there is no ghost present, because this there is.
You didn't believe in ghosts. They made this thing up.
Nothing about the story was real, but the people believed it strong enough to where things started to take place. Okay, but they heard the knocking, they asked it, questions, all these things, so their belief was strong enough.
And they met for over a year.
Right, They said, they conducted these experiments for ten years, at least once a week. They got together for ten years to conduct these experiments. And I'm gonna I'm not gonna call them fake seances. I'm gonna call them real seances. Although I saw no candles I saw in the reenactment.
Yeah, you probably wouldn't.
No, even in the video like they had cameras and stuff. You think they have done this the right way. They said they didn't use wegi boards. We saw no weigi boards. They said they use the paper doilies to make sure nobody's hands are doing shit. We saw the paper doilies, saw no candles. But that was the point. He is saying that you don't need this because he believed that
this wasn't a spiritual encounter. He believed that this was the human mind making things that weren't really there but they are there now kind of thing.
For the record, I will say that most people who are into this, magic practitioners or what have you, will say that every single one of those physical items that you're using are really just tools for your mind anyway. So if you know that's not true, if you have I'm just saying, what, dude, I've I've read a lot of books on this. I've read a lot of articles on this. I've had conversations with magicians. These are all these people, and especially even the the Magickian book also
alludes to that. By the way, that was Philip Cooper, who, like you know, studied deeply. He wasn't even a studier, he was a practitioner of the craft itself. And most of them will say that if you get comfortable enough, you don't need the chalice anymore. You don't need the wand anymore. You don't need the fucking all these different
tools because they're tools of the mind. What they believe, and this is actually what I've grown to believe, is that we're capable of projecting these things and the tools that you use are literally just symbols for your mind to accept.
And it's then why does the sacrificer need to physically draw out the pentagram and physically kill an animal and use the blood If it's all just things of the mind.
There's more than one way to skin a cat.
Not according to the dude who does it professionally.
I mean, look what he was saying, that's not exactly what he said. What he was saying is is if you want to guarantee it to happen, because the mind is a fickle thing. You know, maybe you're having an off day, maybe there's something in the back of your mind that you just can't let go and it's not allowing you to connect with whatever you're trying to connect with fully, and so then maybe you, I don't know, you do something extra. But what I'm saying is, and
you can't say it's not true. I mean, you can say I don't believe that, but to say it's not true. Is that's a misnomer. Like there's no way of you knowing that it's not true, is what I'm trying to say.
And there's no way of me knowing that the sun's coming up tomorrow morning with Okay, are we just conflating things here?
You're conflicting belief with possibility. And your belief is you believe in stuff that you've never actually tried yet you have a belief toward it. What I'm saying is is that I've tried, and I've talked to other people that have tried and succeeded in what I'm saying. What I'm sing, I'm speaking from experience and speaking to those who have experienced. Whereas you know, you're kind of just kind of looking
at it from the outside. And that's what I'm trying to say, is is that you know, as far as the colt and magic and witchcraft and all that kind of stuff, people can say that, oh, you're messing around with fire, You're you're playing with demons, you're playing with the devil, you're playing with the gin. Whatever your beliefs are, right, But like if you don't try to understand what the enemy is doing. You're never going to understand whenever they are doing something to you.
It's kind of like you want to understand. You should understand what they're doing. But that doesn't mean you have to delve into it to understand it.
Well, sometimes you need to experience something rather than just watching somebody do it.
I respectfully disagree, So.
I mean, would you disagree? Like for me, I'm more of a hands on kind of guy. I can't just watch somebody change oil. If I've never changed oil, I got to put my hands on it.
And so that's kind of like we're talking about, is like, Okay, let's say that the enemy is changing oil and it's it's telling like I don't need to change oil to learn how the enemy is doing it.
If that, oh, but like this the enemy is making IEDs.
I don't need to make an IED to learn what to look for to tell if something might be an ID or not right.
But what if you had to learn how to make an IED? I mean would you? I mean why why?
What?
Why would I need to learn that?
Well, I mean, look looking for the principle of spirituality. Yeah, if the.
Enemy is playing with sorcery and divination and all this, Why would I need to learn sorcery and divination.
I'll give you an example. I played football for a long time, and you know, every so often, well every week, what we would do is Monday was always film day. We always watched the film the day after the game. Where did we fuck up? Where could we get better? How could we sharpen ourselves? And and and also you know the next day was also all right, now we're going to watch film on the team that we're facing this week, so it'd be back to back film days.
You still need to practice, like you can't. I just watched the film. You need to practice, and you need to have that scout team, that Scout team defense going up against your offense. That Scout team defense needs to represent the defense that you're going to be going up against next week. Otherwise, if you're just watching it on film, Yeah, that's a facet of it, you know, that's that's a part of it. But you need to get an actual
physical look at it. And I'm not saying that somebody needs to do a you know, needs to create a tulpa in order to know that it's real, or needs to do a seance in order to know it's real. You can look at it from the outside with and make your judgments. But unless, but unless you actually do it, you won't know exec necessarily to the extent of what
it is and what it's doing. Is kind of like, because I think that a lot of people look at this kind of stuff and you'll say, yeah, I believe you know the Bible said, Hey, Bible said it's it's a real thing, right, But unless you do it, you're not going to understand the process in which it works.
And that that was kind of my heroine will ruin my life. I don't need to explore it to know that it will ruin my life. Sure, yeah, that's fine, but I look at it from the outside end. I can take other people's word for it and just take it on good faith.
Sure, but this is not the heroine of conspiracy. It's the cult of conspiracy. So I want to know what it's all about. So therefore I want to take it to the extent of trying it. Now, Am I going to sacrifice a fucking animal? Now I'm gonna take his word for it?
Right? No?
No, But like you said, you bring in people and interview them.
And talk to people who have done it so that you don't have to same thing with heroin. You could talk to a former junkie and a former addict. You don't have to go and live on skid road to learn how that will ruin your life.
Sure, yeah, but it's not because I don't have to. I never said that. It's so that I can get multiple, multiple different understandings of how it works from different angles. And obviously you're gonna learn different you know, modalities, and different techniques and different thoughts on the whole thing, and you learn. You know, that's just something that I'm interested. I'm not scared of the occult. I'm not sired of seances. I'm not scared of of doing a fucking magic spell like.
That, nor am I. Nobody should be scared of these things. And I'm not trying to call you out in particular. I'm saying to any person person a speaking on behalf of person a, they can just kind of look at these things and be like, hey, probably shouldn't fuck with that, and they don't have to like get their hands dirty to learn. Hey, wait a minute, that's why I shouldn't fuck with it.
You can just like make a judgment call.
Yes, but why you don't fuck with it is because of your prior beliefs. I don't have those, so therefore I don't have that wall up that says, hey, I probably shouldn't do it. That's where we're different.
At Is it true?
Yeah, so now it's a preconceived notion of which I don't have.
It's not as preconceived Okay, yeah, yeah it is.
It absolutely is, because it's not your thought that says that that's something that you learned, that you believed to where now it's what you think.
Well, yeah, I mean because it's out of truth.
Yeah, I mean according to believers, for sure, but it's not I mean, it's not what everybody believes. It's not what I believe.
And it's the same thing with like heroin.
Yeah, I know, you could take prescribed medication myth you could take adderall and have no negative side effects for years and years and years.
Yeah, there's different modalities to that.
But you also don't have to like explore meth to learn like, hey, that could fuck your whole world up.
It may not.
It very well may not what it could, So like, why tempt it?
I wouldn't say that people that are have different spiritual practices. I wouldn't compare them to heroin and meth addicts though, No, I.
Would to people that are delving in dark arts for sure, different spiritual practices, different religions.
I'm not comparing that to this.
I'm saying that, like diving into specifically left handed path and delving into the dark side, knowing that that is the dark side, Yeah, I would.
I would make that comparison, sure.
Yeah, I mean to each their own. I'm not trying to convince anybody that they should be doing this. I'm just showing why I don't believe that it's necessarily dark for you to create a fucking ghost and try and connect with it. That's all I'm saying.
No, no, And so getting back to that though, did these people in fact create a imaginary ghost and get these experiences out of it? Still kind of torn on my answer on that, to be honest with you, I don't.
I'm still let's assume that it's not a hoax.
There is at least that small chance that everybody was in on it, the documentary crew and all these things, because then they started traveling and made a couple of dollars to do these things.
Similar dollars for it that was never documented.
I mean, what they just they were traveling out of their own back pockets to do these things for people.
I have a hard time believing that.
Well, I mean, I'm not saying that they absolutely did or didn't. I'm just saying that it's I would say that it's probably wrong to instantly assume that.
But even still, it's a same way that having a gypsy lady come to your party anywhere from eighteen forty tonight eighteen twenty to perform a seance is like a party trick to your people, right, or some of those grifters, sure were some of them actually doing real divination in front of these people also, sure?
Right?
So I'm even if you are getting paid for your time, your boy that does the demonic sacrifices, I'm not calling him a grifter. He's getting paid for his time and his services, but I do believe that he is physically doing things and speaking to demonic entities like one hundred percent, just because money's being exchanged does not make it instantaneously fake. So before I even say that I'm not saying this,
let's assume that they are not hoaxing. And again, yes, there's that small possibility of it, But just I don't necessarily believe that the fact that they went on for a year and saw nothing got no response. And I'm sure they didn't do the exact same thing every single day, right, because again, these were academic types. They're gonna try different things, They're gonna see if they should sit in this kind of configuration, Should we put our hands this far away?
Should we do so?
For them to do the experimentation and over the course of a year, And I do not know how much research Owens did into seances, right, Like, for instance, according to the video we just watched, there was no candle present. Was there a candle present in real life? I don't know, but at least in what we just saw there wasn't. And I don't remember hearing about any of the articles
that we read, Okay, So just throwing this out. So did they maybe try a candle for the first three months and then they swapped up to something else, and then they swapped up to this other thing after that didn't work.
I don't know.
But just assuming that it was blind trial and error, right, which is fair. It's fair, especially if you're an academic type. That is making an imaginary ghost. There's gonna be some trial and error, bumping around in the dark until you can figure out something that works for you. So that makes sense that over the course of a year, once a week at least, these people are getting together and they're doing these things.
So is it possible that it took them.
Over a year to finally figure out the right configurations and things to get a response.
I could see that as a possibility, sure, which is what they say.
So I don't believe as of this moment that they created a topal or eggregre or anything like that to make a physical thing happen in the real world. Just from what I heard and what we read here today, is it possible that they were accidentally channeling or speaking to a demonic entity?
And because these things are deceivers?
So like, is Philip here and like, sure, my name's Philip, totally bitch, Like it could that be because that's what demons do, They lie and shit, Yeah, I could see that as a possibility as well, but it just yeah, I don't know, I don't know how to call this one, brother.
I mean, I respect that from your point of view. I mean, that's what you know, most probably most religious people with a stupid beliefs would tend to believe. Yeah, I don't come from that, So I kind of just look at it for what it is, without any predisposed suppositions or whatever. Right, Like, I'm looking at it for what it is, not what somebody told me what it is, you know, Like, all right, here's what actually happened. Can we assume that it's a ghost, No, you can't assume
that it's a ghost. Can you assume that it's a disembodied spirit, No, you can't. You can't prove that, right. Can you prove that it's a demon. You can't prove that either, right, But what you can potentially prove is is what they were trying to prove is that they painted a picture of a character. They built a whole past, they built a whole history. They got the name, they got all the attributes of this character, and every single question that they asked it were all the things that
they built to that character. So to say that what they were experiencing was nothing more than an emanation of the projection of their imagination infused with belief and intention, that's what I think is actually going on. And that's what I think is actually going on. Whenever people go ghost hunting. I think that's probably what's going on. Whenever people are talking to spirits and angels and deities and all. I think that that's all that it is. And now
that's not to you know, diminish people's beliefs. I mean, I'm only one person. That's my belief right, right. That's not to say that what you're communicating with on the other side, whatever it is, maybe you think it's an
ancest or whatever. It's not to say that like you're silly for believing that, because obviously there's something that is going on, Like there's something that's happening, and multiple people can sit there and see it and document it and feel it, and they know that it's real somehow, some way.
So that's what you gotta take, right, Like, if you just take it for what it is, for what they said, for what they were aiming to do, you have to boil it down to this was something that was emanating from their own imagination somehow physically, and so that's all it is.
But you also keep in mind the same a clause example, these eight people like truly believing that Philip was going to come there and do something I would. I would wager that out of the millions of children every Christmas Eve night that believe that Santa is gonna be real and they don't get real Santa responses, I feel like their belief is a little more powerful than eight grown
ups who are doing this knowing that it's imaginary. So if one's gonna create a tulpa and one's not, I feel like the kids have a way better shot of creating a real life Santa Claus than these adults do a flipping a table.
Have you never felt this Christmas spirit?
That's not physically manifesting Santa Claus. That's not at all what that is.
But have you ever felt the Christmas spirit?
That's not the same thing.
No, have you ever felt the Christmas?
Yes? What's your point?
My point is is that the Tulpa doesn't need to show up in any kind of physical emanation. Sometimes it just shows up as a fucking energetic thing.
But they're saying that it showed up and knocked the table and flip didn't things that's physical things.
They also called upon Santa Claus, and Santa Claus did the same thing.
My point is didn't.
That's what they said. We read it.
No, Santa Claus doesn't physically do things.
He's not real In the document that we were reading, they called upon Santa Claus. They asked it questions, it was responding. I'm not saying it was fucking Santa Claus. What I'm saying is is that they named something that they thought that they were communicating with out of fun, and it responded, was it Santa Claus. No way of proving that most likely wasn't. Not even saying that it
was the egregor of Santa Claus. What I'm saying is is that because they believed it was in that moment as a group, that somehow that energy emanated from them and caused some kind of physical manifestation. That's all I'm saying.
Okay, I feel like you're missing my point. I feel like I'm missing yours. I'm gonna be honest with you. If they were calling upon a thing they made up and they got responses, there are millions of children that call upon something made up and get no response, And I feel like the millions of children have way more belief than these eight adults.
So if of the two, I feel like the children.
Would be more likely to get a real Santa Claus experience than these adults did with flipping a table.
Sure, sure, I mean how many people. I mean, if we're gonna take it there, how many people you know they they got hands on them.
By I'll say it's going religious, I'll bet you.
I mean, look, if we're gonna call one thing dumb and regarded, we're gonna call something else dumb and regarded to you know what I'm saying, we're talking about made up things only here we're not talking about religious experiences.
This is where you get to the insulting side of things. We're keeping it to imaginary things. Santa Claus imaginary.
It's how I'm the only one that can insult. That's that's crazy to me.
No, No, you insulting an entire religion is different than me saying Santa Claus is a real dog. I'm talking about Santa Claus and Philip. You said something about laying hands, and that was about to ask you were you about to go to religious and you know you were, you know you were.
Let's say, fucking I don't know the name any other sect of group that what that claims that if you put hands on somebody and you say a prayer and you get healed. What is that If it's not a religion, If it's not a religion that you agree on, and you're not going to agree with this all, I'm just
making a point. What my belief is is that that power is that is coursing through one's vadan's whenever they lay hands on somebody to heal them, not even saying any specific religion, because they probably all talk about it, right, certain medicine men and medicine women of old, right like they all talk about it some kind of fucking human to human healing or just human healing. Right. I believe this is my own personal belief. I believe that that
power is coming from the individual. It's not being called upon a spirit, it's not being helped by an entity it is. It's not aliens, it's not ancestors, it's not fucking cats a quattle, you know what I'm saying. Like
I'm not, I don't believe that. I believe that every single thing that we're talking about is capable within us, and I believe just personally outside looking in this might be an oostic point of view, I believe that this is what Jesus was talking about whenever he said that you'll be able to do all these things and more. Just my personal take on it. I'm allowed to have a take on Jesus.
You are you are, which that's your That is your opinion, and you have a right to have that, for sure.
I see.
I think this is where you and I differ in a lot of ways as far as humanity is concerned. You think that the human being is way stronger and way more powerful than what we previously have thought. And I can agree with that to a certain extent. But I also believe that humans have certain limitations. Believe that this flesh suit that we currently are living within is very weak and it's gonna.
Die and it's going to go back to the earth.
And I believe that our soul, while it is inside of our body, is disconnected from our body.
Right, we are souls having a human experience.
No, I actually I don't agree with that. I'm not even saying that the human can do it. I'm saying that the soul in the human has those capabilities. I'm not saying that a fucking meat suit can do this. I'm saying the magic that is attached to the meat suit can do it.
But we're talking about the laying of physical human hands, right, That's this is flesh suit hands touching on flesh suit body to heal the flesh suit body.
The energy courses through. This is what fucking they talk about with chi right, like it's prana, it's fucking it's you can't scoff on it. I mean thousands of years of privacy people doing that.
No, No, I know, I've been talking about I have been harnessing my chia lately, and I do have a video that I'm gonna shoot here soon. But that's that's a conversation for another day. But anyway, anyway, but yeah, there's I'm not saying that the soul is not way more powerful or even the human body, even this flesh suit is way stronger than what we think realistically.
Whenever, and there's so many experiments that have.
Been done on this, Right, whenever you're running and you've been running and running running, and you feel like I'm done, my muscles are going out, I can't breathe whatever.
In reality, you're.
Only about sixty percent of the way maybe to what your body's physically capable of accomplishing your mind is going to tell you to stop will before your body is actually going to quit on you. That's That's an example of how this flesh suit is way stronger than what your mind allows you to believe about it.
It depends on the individual, because there are individual individuals
that push it even past the limits. Like look at Dale jargons right, like you can, like you, your mind even beyond your mind, the thing that is observing, the thing that is controlling your mind, which is not your mind, the you that is you that always has been right before and after human fucking incarnation, whatever you want to call it, whatever that is is capable of having a will and a spirit to push and exceed whatever your human fleshoot is capable of. Like for sure, that's you
would agree with that, right, Yeah, for sure. What I'm saying is is that that power, that energy, that fucking spark, whatever it is within you, has the ability to do these things. I'm not saying that the human can. I'm not saying that somebody without any No. It has to be guided, it has to be intended, it has to be practiced. It has to be like something that you harness. You know, you can't just wake up one day and say, oh, I have chi stright here in my hands. No, it's
something that you got to like meditate on. You gotta you know, eat healthy and all the whatever you gotta do to attain fucking chi or whatever that is. Like, what I'm saying is is that it's beyond what the human is. We are beyond what the human is, and whatever that is, I think is what makes these fucking emanations happen. That's what that's my suggestion to this. I'm
not saying it's demonic. I think that people and this is where we differ is that, you know, most people will say, oh, we're just people, we're just humans, We're
not capable of these kinds of things. I disagree. I take it a step farther and say, well, I think that these things can be achieved by somebody who practices, by somebody who continues, by somebody who is constantly trying to you know, build the best version of themselves, and you know, the whole spiritual practice whatever it is, sure right, sure withholding seed and whatnot, right like all those things.
That shit kills me, dude, which like I can understand what they mean by it. And I'm not disagreeing with it, but some of them people take it away too far, and you'll get these guys like, yeah, I withhold seed and that's why when I walk in a room, women notice and it's.
Like, yeah, that's why that's no.
There absolutely, there, absolutely is something to like the whole idea of no November, right, Like that's that's probably founded on people who said, wow, I like, man, look at
the rest of this world. Whenever I'm not constantly thinking about fucking something like no, yeah, that's there's something to that, sure, And I think that that's why probably kids are you know, a little bit more powerful whenever it comes to like this kind of shit in a sense, like their imagination is a little bit more because they're not they're not concerned with what adults are concerned with, right, they don't have those limitations, like the the imagination is limitless, which
you know, if you say that there's a fucking Santa Claus that is flying with flying reindeer and he's delivering you know, to billions of homes in one night, they don't need proof. They just fucking believe it because there's not borders on their imagination and that's I don't know, I'm not trying.
To get that's also sometimes to their detriment. Right, there's examples of people using children in their naivety toward to for the adults means, for example, shit viet non war or Afghanistan. You give a kid a hand grenade and tell them, hey, go in that tent and pull this pin, and uh, it's gonna give you candy.
Sure, And I'm not saying that you shouldn't have some kind of growdedness, But what I am saying is is that sometimes the walls that people build in their own mind are to their own detriment as well. Would you disagree with that?
What do you mean?
So most of the time when people have anxiety, that shit that they built up on the inside, like that is a that is a thing that you built up anxiety All all an anxiety actually is if you really think about it, and this is something that I've heard from Saguru. Whatever you think about them, but it makes sense to me. All anxiety is is a fucking worry
of the future of something that hasn't happened yet. And and like all a depression, whenever you feel depressed, all it is is you are trying to bring the past to the present. And that's technically what people are doing whenever they're depressed, is that they're they're focusing on a past event, of which makes them sad and it makes them feel that in this moment didn't even happen right now, happened a long time ago, maybe it happened a week ago,
a year ago, ten years ago, whatever. You're essentially fucking time traveling that energy to this current moment right now. That's the idea between depression and anxiety, which are the walls that we build up in our own dan minds to prevent us from becoming maybe what we're meant to become.
I think there's something to be set for that for sure. So I mean inzach Guru, you've even talked shit on him before. I mean, he wants to reduce the world's population and he's been like very open about that, and the dude's a fucking nut job in so many regards.
Oh yeah, I'm not even saying that. Like dude, I mean he's Hindu. I like some Hindu beliefs, just like I like some Christian beliefs. I like some Buddhist beliefs. I like some fucking daois. I like I pick and choose a little bit from all of them. That's the idea of you know, like my philosophy, you know.
Like they're very eclectic, that's for sure. The coexist sticker is really where I like to go.
So so anyway, yeah, I don't know where I was going with that, but I don't know. All I'm saying is is that it doesn't always have to be evil, you know, because most of the time evil is just what you don't understand.
Well, I mean, and to that point, this is where you would usually go to the whole test, the spirit conversation, but with this one, they pretty much had no spirit associated with it.
That that was the whole point, was to keep it as neutral on.
The spirituality side of things, on even the real life ghost side of things. It was an imaginary ghost start to finish, right, So the experiences that they did have, and assuming that it's not a hoax, right, assuming that these things physically did happen as they say that they did, I would say, well, if we are in a binary world and there is only black and white, and there's a good and a bad, and all these things, and
even if it was human interaction whatever. So did this thing which side of the conversation did this thing further?
What do you mean?
So, did this experiment make people double down on their beliefs or did it make them start questioning their beliefs?
Did it start?
Uh?
Well, it depends on what their preconceived notions were and if it aligned or didn't align. And so if something aligns with what you believe, then you're more inclined to believe it. If something doesn't align with what you believe, then either a the thing that you're questioning is wrong or you think there's something to it, and now it's battling up against what your beliefs are. So that's kind of like the mentality around it is what preconceived notions
are you taking in there with it? If you're looking at it as if this is real, it is demonic, then of course whenever you go in quote unquote test the spirit, it's going to feel demonic because that's your preconceived notion. Whereas if you look at it from an open minded point of view, I'm not making any preconceived notions. I'm accepting it for the data that is being collected then now looking at it for what it is, a
table knock? Is that scared? Is it demonic? Does it instantly assume that there's monsters in some kind of ethereal realm that are only out to, you know, harvest your fucking loosh. That's a that's that's that's a lot of fucking assuming. That's what I'm trying to say.
The whole lush energy thing also kills me, but that's a conversation for another day. But yeah, I guess what I should think is did this make anybody want to get closer to God or further away from God? That's what I mean by testing the spirit?
Well, it depends on what your belief of God is, because there's there's multiple Like, my belief of God is not your belief of God.
Right, you don't necessarily believe in him?
Well, I mean I don't believe that God is a hymn or her personally.
Okay, you focused on the hymn moniker of that rather than that you don't necessarily believe part.
Well, No, I believe in God, but I also don't believe that God is separate from me. You do, and nothing nothing against you. It's just you know, most religious people believe that God is outside of them.
This is true.
I believe. I believe that we all kind of have, you know, essences of God personally. That's just my belief. I'm not trying to shit on anybody else's belief No, No, the love of God, don't fry me. I'm an individual. I'm allowed to have my own opinion on things. No, you absolutely are you absolutely?
I didn't take it as like you insulting on that one.
What it means I know, but some people would.
Yeah, So I don't know. Is it possible they were talking to a demon?
Maybe?
Is it possible it was all a hoax? Also?
Maybe is it possible that they imagine something into existence and that's what was doing the things and stuff? From my vantage point, no, but I could also understand, especially from somebody like you that does believe in Tulpa's and eggregres and things like this, you might take it more into that conversation. So I get it, And honestly, I don't know what to call on this one.
Dude.
Yeah, I mean, hey, that's why I wanted to bring it up. I thought, Hey, you know what, we're in spooky season. Let's get a little spooky. Let's get a little weird. You know, a lot of people were, you know, probably watching a little bit of Halloween Town, if that's still a popular fun thing.
I tried watching people watched one, two, and three this week.
I tried watching it with the kids. They thought it was boring. I was like, damn, this shit was awesome in my time. Halloween Toime was the shit while I was growing up.
Fucking right, it is, dude, get down on that shit.
Just earlier today, I was watching the new well, the newer hocus Pocus, and I still believe that it's better than the first one. That's just my personal belief. But you are crazy for that, I know. And normally I do like the original more like Toy Story one is always going to be the best toy story in my opinion. And I've to be honest, I haven't. I haven't even seen the I don't know the last two or three of them. I've only ever watched the first and second one.
I'll say this is far the Toy Story thing is concerned.
It stayed to the original character arcs very well, and like each newer edition plays off of the last one very well. There's not one that goes way off the rails. So it's like, wait a minute, what, what the fuck are you talking about? Not a single one. They've all done very well in keeping with the line of the story arcs.
Except which the newest Buzz Lightyear movie, who are they just had to make I haven't seen it? Well, yeah, they made him gay, which is.
Weird, which is crazy because he's all into Jesse, like he's trying to get some cowboy cowgirl ass over here, So.
Like, why why would they? I haven't seen it, which is kind of funny because they he's a Buzz like your space ranger. I mean, if he was gay, you'd think navy right, clearly, clearly right.
But no, he's over here. He sees them red the redhead with the freckles. He's doing backflips and ship He's like, whoa like that, that's what he's into.
Buzz is a freak, but not that kind of freak. But I, you know, gotta hold things for the time anyway, good could members let us know what you think about all this. I honestly can't believe that we even went as far as we did. I wasn't expecting it to go this far. But to be honest, I'm actually happy that it did because maybe hopefully people are able to look at this in a different lights, maybe even look
at me in a different light. For the people that think that I'm out here playing with demons, maybe this episode proved to you that I love demons. I don't know in that case, you know, smoke methan in hell Satan, but in any other case, But in any other case, I do not worship the dark Lord. I do not care about the dark Lord. Just because I don't believe what you believe does not mean that I'm automatically playing
with the enemy. Okay, it's okay to you know, not necessarily look at everything as if it's black and white, because nothing in life is black and white. It's all shades of gray, right, Like that's that's my personal opinion. Like I don't know anyway, Good Cold members. As we said, the best way to be able to support the show is come over to Patreon dot com slash Cult of
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Silver is a little bit over forty dollars an ounce right now.
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We're not talking.
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Do what you want with it.
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