Ladies and gentlemen, Welcome to Wednesday Service, Episode one, brought to you by Cult Conspiracy Podcasts. I just want to thank Jonathan and Jacob for this opportunity. I really appreciate you, and I also appreciate everybody that has been reaching out to Jonathan and Jacob, you know about Sunday Service. It was they were nice enough to actually invite me to do Wednesday Service as well. So I just want to let you guys know, I really appreciate you guys. And
my show is Josh Monday Christian a conspiracy podcast. If you don't know me, my first name is Josh, last name is Monday, just like the day of the week, and I am your host of the show. And today is gonna be a little bit different. One thing I haven't done and haven't showed you guys on Sunday Service or you know this new Wednesday Service is me debating. So today I want to show you guys a debate that I did with a TIK talker named Peter Markley. He is a glober and he is a Christian and
I am a flat earth, Biblical cosmology and Christian. So it's a pretty interesting debate. I want to give you a little history before I start. So I talked to him and he told me, you know, we both know that the Bible does not teach a globe, but you know, I don't want to do he said. He told me he didn't want to do flat versus globe biblical cosmology debate. He wanted to do a debate on whether the Bible teaches cosmology period. So I was like, all right, cool,
you know, I'm down to do that. I know the Bible teaches cosmology, and I'm ready to go, you know. And I started doing some research on him. I listened to a debate that he did on modern day debate with a flatzoid. Flatzoid's perspective is this channel, and they were going at it, you know, they were basically fighting and arguing, and it didn't really I didn't like the
way it was meshing very well, you know. So I knew to come at this debate in a loving way and to try to make it so that I soften Peter up a little bit, you know, and try to be super respectful, full and super nice to him. And I didn't want our debate to look go sideways in any way. I knew that on the show that we were on is called Uh, What Matters Now? And on that show, I knew there was a den of atheists in the comment section. There's a ton of atheists that
that go to that show and watch that show. So I knew that I wanted to make sure that we represent as Christians the right way. You know, we're not getting divisive. We're not divided, We're just not agreeing on a subject and just debating. So that's what I kind of.
Wanted to do.
And Peter at first he came out with guns blazing. You could tell. I'll show you guys, you know when I when I play this, he came out with guns blazing, and uh, you know, we were we got passionate, but it was just a fun debate. So what I want to do is show you guys this debate. It was on What you Know Matters Now and it's about an hour and a half. If you guys could do me a favor, okay on Spotify, I don't really get to see your comments on the Patreon, I don't really get
to have contact with you guys too much. So one thing you could do if you want to talk to me is go to my Instagram at Josh Monday Underscore Podcast and send me a DM and you can ask me for prayer. You could tell me, hey, I listened to this show, I like this part. Want I'd rather you do more of this less of that. Let me know, And I would love to have you guys's input. That way on the show's going forward, I can make sure that I'm providing you with the content that you guys love.
I definitely love to do the Bible studies. That's something I definitely want to do. Then this Sunday, I'm going to be going over Exodus seventeen probably through twenty one. It should be very interesting. That'll be Sunday service, and on Wednesdays, I will be showing you guys some of my debates, and I will also be doing probably more New Testament stuff. That way, I could teach you guys the New Testament as best of my ability. I think that'd be very amazing. And I will definitely try to
have guests on whenever I can. If I don't have a guest on it, it'll be just me and I'll just be teaching the Bible. Sometimes I'll have my brother on. He's the co host of Josh Monday Christian conspiracy podcast and he enjoys digging into the Bible, and it would rather obviously do who would honestly rather do Bible than conspiracies. I was the one that wanted to do the Christian in conspiracy stuff. I love conspiracies and ifacly I love the Bible and I love the Lord. So anyways, thank
you guys so much for tuning in. I really appreciate you guys. Right now, I am going to play my debate, so big shout out to Osion from What Matters Now for allowing us to do that debate. I really appreciate it. I want to go ahead and share screen and I will play it for you.
You're fie.
One.
Welcome to Matters Now.
We are going to be having debate between Josh Monday Christian and conspiracy podcasts, which I'm sure is not what he goes by, but I read the whole thing and Peter Markley and the title of this debate is does the Bible teach cosmology?
So we're gonna try to focus on that topic.
We're gonna have opening statements from each of our two debaters. Once they have the opening statements, I'm gonna give each of them time to interrogate the points of the other debater. So we're going to head and jump right in to either one of you want to volunteer to go first.
I probably should have resolved this first.
All but either of you care about who does their opening presentation first.
I don't mind. Uh, do you want to go first, Peter? Or do you want me to go first? It's it's up to you. I don't mind.
I don't really care.
All right, Peter, why don't you go ahead and start us out? Then?
All right, let me pull up my presentation and press the present button share screen.
Mhm see.
Uh okay, Josh and I can, you know, talk about something else while we're.
Getting Yeah, no worries, all right, So.
I can't really see stream yard anymore? Is this working it is we're seeing?
Is Biblical cosmology a thing?
Yeah?
Perfect?
Right ahead, start your timer and get your going. Okay, here we go?
All right? Uh? Sorry, a little bit of a flood there, okay. Is Biblical cosmology a thing?
No?
There are no Bible verses on cosmology. Josh only thinks there are because he has certain starting assumptions. I'm only going to give two Bible verses. The rest of my time, I'll spend correcting false assumptions. Assumption one geocentric equals flat wrong. By the time of Jesus and the New Testament, the dominant cosmology of everyone in the known world was a geocentric spherical earth. In order to prove a globe, we do not need almost anything from modern science, physics, gravity, space,
or heliocentrism. Then those things all you want, and it only only set you back so many centuries. Modern flat earth is a form of denial that is much worse. Assumption to globe equals starminism wrong. If you try to derive any cosmology from the Bible, you're trying to balance on a toothpick. It's just not there in the text. There's room in the Bible for a flat earth or a globe. The Bible doesn't care. Not so with Darwin's
Descent of Man. The Bible gives an explicit historical narrative that is deeply tied to core spiritual doctrines, and Darwin tosses out all of that for a contrary historical narrative. Young Earth creationism has a strong basis in scripture. Flat Earth does not, if needed I'll say more on that in rebuttal assumption three flat earth is historical. This one is super dupor wrong. While most ancient cultures believed in a flatter Earth, it turns out they still had eyes
and brains. They could plainly see that when the sun sets, it goes below the horizon, so their cosmologies had universal night time and universal daytime. Today we know the sun is always up somewhere, So nowadays the idea of flat earth can only exist by adapting. That started with this guy right here, Samuel Burley Robot and who had the bright idea of saying sunsets aren't real. In his eighteen sixty five book, he wrote, and I quote, although the sun is at all times above and parallel to the
Earth's surface, he appears to sink below the horizon. This arises from a simple and everywhere a law of perspective. In other words, don't believe your eyes. Sun set is just an illusion because it gets too far away. This idea was completely new. It started with Robotham, so I call it robothemism. I researched extensively to find any ancient cultures that believed this. Besides a few tenuous scraps I found absolutely nothing. On the contrary. Sumerians believe the Sun
traveled through a tunnel under the earth every night. Egyptians believed the sun god Raw traveled in a boat through the underworld every night. As texts believed the earth goddess felt to cootely Is swallowed and threw up the sun every night. And the Book of Enoch talks about portals in the east and west side to the firmament that the Sun entered and exited. Despite this objective consensus of history, the confusion here is immense. Flat Earthers use a bunch
of these diagrams about Biblical cosmology. Well, who drew these diagrams? This one is from a scholar named Michael Heiser, who, with others like Paul H. Sealey, said the Bible authors believed in a flat earth. What kind of flat earth? Well, an ancient one, so non robothemist. If Michael Heiser were still alive today and we asked him to ancient Hebrews, where did the sun go at night? He would look at the Book of Enoch or the Epic of Gilgamesh and say, well, to them, it went outside or underneath
the world. Heiser was not a flat earther, and once wrote this blog entry titled Christians who believe the Earth is really flat? Does it get any dumber than this? Those are his words, not mine, as far as I know. Because Heiser was so dismissive, he never took more than a cursory glance at modern flat Earth, so he never discerned the depth of exploitation that his work was suffering
at their hands. Josh, these diagrams do not support your cosmology, and neither does any part of their historical basis, because you espouse robothemism, not an ancient cosmology. I don't like the term robothemism. While I give you the same offer I give every robothemist if it give me another neutral term and I will use it. Biblical or Hebrew are not neutral terms for your view. By insisting on these terms, you are trying to conflate two ideas so that you
can claim false legitimacy and false authority. And Josh, this is serious. I hope you don't double down on this like Flatsoid did. If a person knowingly claims that his ideas are from God when they're not, that's a sin. Please consider yourself warned according to Titus three ten. So now that we have all that cleared up, we are finally ready to tackle assumption for the Bible reflects ancient
nearies thought wrong. This is also a relatively new idea, and Josh, maybe you don't realize that it's pushed by skeptics, apostates and only a very modern group of Christian scholars. Let's look again at Michael Heyser. He believed the Bible is God's word, but that it also reflected wrong ideas from the time. This is a weird conundrum. To explain it, Heiser told a story of one adult using a child
to convey a message to another adult. In this analogy, God is the first adult and the Bible authors are the child. So who's the other adult? Us? That's right. In Heider's parable, he put modern man not just above the sacred writers, but on the same level as God. He takes this from a secular approach called historical criticism or higher criticism, which is where we get things like
scholars saying Moses didn't write the Torah. It assumes the Bible authors were first and foremost a product of their time, the same as other ancient people. But wait a minute, whatever happened to the idea of the Holy Spirit giving them special knowledge. There's a hostile form of this that openly attacks Christianity in a more naive form that Heiser likes, which only compromises on divine inspiration. When the Bible authors are silent, higher criticism says we can still read their
minds by looking at secular sources. Basically, Joe Heathen thought X. Therefore Bob the Bible author thought why. That's the historical critical approach. The hostile form actually flips this upside down. Bob the Bible author only thinks why because he got the idea from Joe Heathen thinking X. Josh. Whenever you use Heiser's diagram or a Bible translation that says Dome in Genesis one, that's the bedrock of ideas that you
are in brain. See the problem. If we believe that this is God's Holy Word, then we should reject this secular bias in all of its forms and simply ask what is the inspired author really saying? Which brings me to assumption five. A globe requires taking versus as metaphor wrong. Under the heading of literal, there are at least two subcategories, phenomenological and ontological. Phenomenology is the study of human perception.
A phenomenon is anything that we perceive. Ontology is kind of the opposite, the study of reality itself, for the absolute nature of things apart from our perception. So these are big, fancy words, but the idea is very simple. We use phenomenological language all the time. Some examples, Joe stood on the roof and looks down the streets below swarmed with people the size of ants. Judy looked out the car window and watched the trees zip past. No matter how high you go, the horizon rises to your
eye level. There's absolutely no reason to call this kind of statement figurative or metaphorical or lying. There are descriptions from an observer's eye, and it goes back to ancient times. Ontology is only eclipsed it in the last few centuries. So if he read verses from Joshua ten or Job thirty eight, is absolute descriptions. Whether you know it or not. You're reading through a modern lens. There is nothing in the text to even hint that it's ontological. The Bible
describes events as they seem to the eye. That's it. It's really not that hard. And if you don't believe me, there's verses to prove it. Matthew five forty five and Ephesians four twenty six. These are my two verses right here. They clearly say the sun goes up and down, which if taken ontologically, would contradict robotemism, because you believe the sun doesn't go up and down, that it just comes and goes horizontally. So here you have no choice but
to agree with me that it's phenomenological. Uh oh. If scripture can use phenomenology here and saying so doesn't mean we lack faith, then what about only your flat earth verses? Well, Josh, I think that's just about sinks your boat. If we account for a phenomenology, then you got zero verses left except maybe Rakia in Genesis one six, and without higher criticism, that really just means expanse more on that in rebuttal time. So, Josh,
I have two challenges for you. Number one, your cosmology is robothemist, not not biblical, even by Michael Heiser's standards. If you disagree, show me one Bible verse that describes a robothemist local sun just one number two without being selective. Explain to me how the sun goes up and down in Matthew five forty five and Iphesians four twenty six. I want you to apply your own logic to yourself.
If saying that's how it appears denies God's word in Joke thirty eight, and then it does so here as well. Give me a consistent terminudic not a selective one.
Thank you, all right, great job. About eight minutes and forty seconds. Just want to be clear, there's no like saving time for later or anything. So you got your ten minutes and then no, so if Josh would go two minutes, he can't later in the bait saying I got eight extras I didn't use, give ten minutes for the opening, and we go from there.
Josh, did you get his main points down? I assume? And are you yeah?
Yes? And Peter, great job, man, great job. I really enjoy the way you debate, and I think you do a great job on your presentation, brother, just letting you know that well.
I certainly love the throw and the Titus ad on Peter, holyw going hard.
I had because of flat flat.
I know is that it's okay? Hey, it's okay, brother, it's a good.
Let's go okay.
Josh, hopefully I can hopefully I can present my screen because my this is on one screen like of my internets, and then I have like another one that I had like perfectly for this, So we'll see present what I do. Just share screen.
Yeah, click on that present at the bottom share screen.
Oh, I see, there's a whole bunch. Okay, maybe I shouldn't have had so much. Oh, okay, you know what, I'm just gonna go off. I'm not gonna even do a share screen because I have too many screens open right now because I have a podcast I run and I have a bunch of stuff that I always pull up. So it's okay, So let me know when you're ready for me to start.
Go ahead and get a start right now.
Okay. So this debate is actually, does does cosmology teach the Bible? It's not I mean, does a Bible teach cosmology? Not not a flat versus globe. But that's okay too. But so what's the definition of cosmology. It's this science of the origin and development of the universe, right, So science is knowledge and then it's the knowledge of the origin development of the universe. Okay, so we have that origin that means the point or place where something begins
or rises or is derived. The Book of Genesis, the word is actually beta sheet it's Genesis. It means the beginning or the origin. So right there, it's already it's already letting. God's already letting you know that He's going to teach you the origin of the universe, or what the I would say is the heavens. Right, So the definition of teaching is ideas and principles taught by an authority. Right, So let me just legitimize the Book of Genesis before
we go there. And John five forty five, Jesus actually says, Moses spoke about me. I'm kind of paraphrasing here, and he says, if you do not believe the words of Moses, how you're gonna believe my words? So he kind of m legitimizes Moses right there. Numbers twelve, verses four through eight. The Lord is speaking to Aaron and Merriam. And what the Lord says to Aaron and Merriam is I come to prophets and visions and dreams, but when I come to Moses, I speak to him face to face or
mouth to mouth, is what it says. In the New King James, which is interesting. Titus one two it says God cannot lie, right, and in Hebrews six eighteen it says that it's impossible for God to lie. Okay, I'm just letting you guys know that. And then in the Book of Genesis two four it says, this is the history of the heavens and the earth when they were created in the day that the Lord made the earth and the heavens. Okay, So I just want to let
you guys know that. So it's already telling you right there that this is the history or the origin of the heavens and the earth. So God is already telling you that we And in the book of Genesis, we have the who that's gonna be the Lord God. He's the one that created the heavens and the earth. And we have the what day one God he separated, he said, he said he created the light right instead, at the beginning, God created the heavens and the earth, and the earth
was the foreman. Boy. Darkness was upon the face of the deep. Spirit moved upon the face of the water. So now we have the Holy Spirit there, and we also have God, God the Father. In Day two, or he said he actually created light, separated light from the darkness. That's day one. Day two he created the firmament, right, So now we have the firmament created that the word
is Rakiah extended surface. He does say expanse Peter. Whether you believe it's an expanse where God put the moon, sun and the stars in and it is space, or you believe, like I believe, where God put the moon, sent and the stars in the firmament, It doesn't matter. He's still teaching a cosmology here, right. So the word that I would have for the dome, it would be the CJB. Bible that actually says God said, let there be a dome in the middle of the water. Let
it divide the water from the water. God made the dome and divide the water from under the dome from the water above the dome. So biblically speaking, there's water above the dome still, but that doesn't matter we're talking about does it teach cosmology, Yes, it definitely does. Day three. God created the oceans, the dry land, plants and vegetation,
the dry land being the continents okay. So now we have the continents, the dry land, the vegetation, and then day four, okay, we have God creating the moon, sun and the stars also, and guess what he did. He placed them in the firmament. Okay, so that's what it says in the Bible. It says he created two great lights, the greater delight rule today, which is the sun less delight to ule the night which the moon. And he created the stars also, and he placed them in the firmament.
Whether you believe the firmament is an expanse of space or you believe the firmament is a dome, they're placed in not inside of the firmament, but in or under. But you could say that it's an expanse of space as well, if you want to believe either way. He's still teaching a cosmology here. Okay, So now we have now we have so that is like the what he created. Right, So now we have when I believe, like Peter believes, that it's a young Earth, I believe it was created
sixty six hundred years ago. And the why why did God create the moon, sun and the stars, Well, he says, and God said, let there be lights in the firmament of heaven to divide the day from the night, and let them be for signs for seasons, for days and years, and let them be for lights in the firmament of heaven, to give light upon the earth. And it was so so he created them to He created the moon, some
of the stars to give light upon the earth. He created it for signs for seasons, for years, you know, for time. Right, So we have that. So basically we have the who, what, when, where? And now we have the how. How did he create it? He spoke it into existence, So he's teaching you exactly the who, what, when, where, and how? Which is going to be all principles and ideas cre spoken from an authority. Now, when it comes to the Book of Genesis, I would say that it's
a first hand account from God. It would have to be, wouldn't you agree? So all I'm going to say here is that this debate is whether the Bible teaches cosmology. And right now, I just went through everything just in the Book of Genesis, not even going through other stuff. But you want to talk about robothemism, right, I'm okay with calling me that. I do believe that the sun does does circuit the heaven, just like it says in Psalms nineteen, verses two through six. Let me go there
real quick so that you understand what I want to say. Oops, my God, why did I do that? Okay, all right, I'm gonna go to Psalms nineteen two through six really just so I could shut this down real fast. And first of all, it says, the heavens declare the glory of God and the firmament show it this handiwork. That's the first thing you need to understand. If you're taking away the cosmology from the Bible, you're taking away the glory from God. And if you're saying there's no firmament,
then you're also you're taking away God's handiwork. If you click on that word, it's actually God's achievement. It says, day and today utter a speech to night and tonight show acknowledge. There is no speech nor language where the voice is not heard. Their line is gone out through all the earth, and their words to the end of the world. In them, He has set a tabernacle for the sun. The word tabernacle click on that. It means
tent or it means Jehovah's tent. So God's tent, which is as a bridegroom coming out of his chamber and rejoices as a strong man to run a race. He is going forth to the end of the heaven, and his circuit is to the ends of it, and there's nothing hid from the heat thereof. So what it's saying is is the is the sun is not going down underneath the earth like you're thinking. What he's saying is that the sun is going forth and doing his circuit in the heaven. Do you understand. So what it's saying
is it's moving in a circuit in the heaven. There's three heavens in the Bible, Okay. First heaven is where the moon, sun, and the stars are located. The second heaven is called the firmament, that's Genesis one to eighth. The third heaven is where God's throne is located. If you go to a second Corinthians twelve, you're gonna see Paul talking about going to the third heaven. Okay. So also if you go to I don't know how far I am in time. I'm sorry, I haven't even been
watching Doctor Jay. How much time do I have?
Left, you have about two and a half minutes.
Okay. So if you go to the book of Ezekiel one twenty six, it talks about God's throne being above the firmament. If you go to Ezekiel ten to one, it talks about God's throne being above the firmament. If you go to Amos ninety six, it's talking about God walking in the layers of heaven, right, and it says that God planted his vaulted dome over the earth. That's the nasb That word is actually called it's binding. It's
binding Heaven to the earth. Okay, So when you talk about that the Hebrew cosmody conception, there's no portal for the sun to go down into Okay, there's nothing like that in the Bible, and there's nothing like that even in the Book of Enoch. Any ancient cosmology you're talking about, there is something about portals, Peter, but it's not talking about going underneath the earth. I don't know where you're getting that from. There's ancient cosmology that might have that,
But the Bible's cosmology is God's cosmology. It's not ancient cosmology. These people are this is a blank slate that Moses had from God, and God told him exactly what he created, when he created it, how he created it, and why he created it. So if you're saying that cosmology is not teached in the Bible, no offense to you. I'm not trying to say that you're trying to be bad or you're trying to sin or anything like that, but you are taking the glory away from God, and you
are also taking away God's achievement, you know. So I think it's very important, and it's the cosmology of the Bible is very important because there's there's conversations like we're having, and also when we have to go against atheists and debate against people that don't believe in God, we have to show him the glory and the power of who created it, why he created it, when he created it, and what he created. So there's my time, go ahead, all.
Right, Thank you so much about nine minutes. So both of you did a nice job. Really appreciate you guys having a presentation for us an intro. So if you want to get your questions in, please jump those in right now. We want to go ahead and get those going so we can answer those at the end. If we get too many, we do not finish them all. If you give a super chat, of course we will get that in. But if it gets too long, we will cut it off and we won't be able to
answer all the questions. So get those questions in early Peter, we able to any questions about specific meaning. Do you know the points that Josh was able to make and are you ready to go ahead and respond or do you needy clarification on any specific I.
Have some notes on my own, but I would, I guess, appreciate if Josh could give any like summary of what.
Is point you can just put like the who, what, when, where, why, and how in the book of Genesis. I basically stuck with Genesis because that's the origin, and that's the beginning of who created the heavens in the earth, why he created the heavens in the earth, what he created? And also in the beginning I did a definition of what cosmology actually is. It's the origin in the beginning of the universe, right and in the Bible it would be called the heavens. They don't have a word universe in
the Bible, but it is the heavens. So my point is I'm not trying to try to tell you, like if the Earth is flat or if it's round in the Bible. That's not this debate. If we had this debate, then I would be in a total different ballgame. I'd be going over verse after verse. But this is more of does the Bible teach cosmology? You know what I mean? That's what it is. This is not about whether the Earth is flat or not.
This one that sounds good, So Peter, you go ahead and be ready to respond to that. I think this might seem a little bit intuitive. I'm actually gonna let Josh go ahead and grill Peter's points first. So Peter, Josh, if you want to go grill Peter's point, let him respond.
Let's go ahead and do that.
Time guys, I'm going to start a timer, and how much time you take, I'll provide Peter that same amount of Okay, I'll.
Just say geocentric, not flat. That's absolutely correct. I definitely agree with you. The Bible does not say that the Earth is flat. If the Bible has a dome and it connects to the Earth and and everything that the that like, if I go if I went verse after verse after verse, which I'm not going to do right now to you, because that's not what it's about. But I'm absolutely okay with the with the Earth just being
geocentric if it were a globe, okay. But I do believe the Bible teaches the Earth is flat, with the dome with the moon, sun of the stars in the dome with the with the moon and the star and moon and that over the earth.
Can I interject I'm confused. It sounded like a moment ago you said the Bible does not teach that the Earth is flat, and then just now you said it does.
I know what I'm trying to do is this is not about whether the Bible. This is not about whether the Earth is flat or not. This is not that the debate. The debate is whether the Bible teaches cosmology. So all I'm trying to do is your argument. You said, geocentric, not flat. I said, I'm absolutely okay with geocentric. I do believe the Earth is centered. And if the Bible, let's say the Earth wasn't flat, and I'm totally wrong, I'm okay with it just being geocentric. Okay, That's what
I'm gonna say. Globe people's Darwinism very true. But if you talk about like the scientific trinity, like the Big Bang, like evolution, like heliocentricity, those all are kind of get together. Okay, So what you have is the reason why people bring that type of stuff.
I'm not arbitrary.
Yeah, I'm not going to bring it up because that has nothing to do with whether the Bible teaches cosmology. But it's it's an arbitrary grouping. But that is like a package deal. If you believe in heliocentricism, it's really no problem. But if you don't believe that, it's okay, no worries. But biblically speaking, we if it's not. If it's not, okay, the Bible's not gonna it's not gonna be like way off of what actually reality is. ATLA,
I'll tell you what that is. That's anything that God says, anything that's in the Bible is real, Anything that science comes up with that's all phenomenological because that's all from Earth trying to find out what perception it is. It's not all it's not going to be real or one hundred percent for me, biblically, the Bible is real. Anything else is phenomenological. Because that's their perception from earth. But God has given us a perception from heaven and He's created it.
Forgive me if I'm wrong that it sounds like you are. You have the impression that ontology is somehow more true than phenomenology. Well, because you're saying you're comparing like things that you disagree with to phenomenological and you're saying God's word is ontological. Did you not see.
All I'm saying is ontological means what is real. Phenomenological is like a perception of us.
Our perceptions are totally real.
They can be real, but they not all the time. If you're looking at the there's also a refraction and stuff like that and perception. So if you're seeing something, it could be off your eyes seeing it. And now I'm not saying that it's not real if you see it. But what I'm saying is I believe anything that God says. No worries. Okay, let's go to your next stuff. Then no worries. We don't need to talk about that. Okay. So flad Earth is historically wrong, bro, this is okay.
Flat earth is historically wrong. So are you telling me that Moses didn't believe that the Earth was flat. Are you saying that all the people back then didn't believe the earth was flat? Or do you believe that they believed that there was a globe spinning through you know.
I am saying that anytime, we have a record of what ancient people thought. By and large, they thought the sun went away, gone like, not not too far away to see, but just outside the world, maybe under it or outside the firmament somewhere, so that it was there was universal nighttime in universal daytime. Moses is not one of those people. Moses did not provide enough detail about the physical arrangement of the cosmos for us to assume
that about his mindset. And that's where I think Michael Heiser and like him are wrong, you know, because they look at other ancient sources and assume, oh, well, Moses must have been similar to these people.
We don't know.
We can't read Moses's mind. If he didn't write it down, then we can't. It's not our place to assume what was in his mind. So, okay, that's my position.
No worries, No worries. Okay, So sun going into the earth. We kind of talked about that, there's nothing in the Bible that talks about the sun going into their whatsoever and anything that any like Pagans had and all that stuff. I don't I'm not concerned with anything that they believe. Like an Egyptian talking about the sun going in the earth. I don't care, Enoch. I'm not saying that that's that's canon.
I've never even provoked it, would invoke that, but it is something that is interesting, and it's a really good history like to read for history to find out the way that people spoke back then and to understand stuff. But it's not like I could say that it's canon from God's word and two Timothy it says that all scripture is inspired by God. Right, So I'm gonna read the Scripture and the Bible as if it's inspired Holy
Spirit breathe. And that's the way that I take it serious, bro, And I know that you do too, because I heard you say something earlier where you felt defended by something I would do. But I'm just telling you the Bible says nothing about that, so that doesn't I don't need to argue that. I don't care about that, So I'm going into the earth whatever, Bro. Doctor Michael Heisner is not God or the Bible. He might have had had a presentation on this, but he does not believe the
earth is flat. And I do use his diagram. Do you know why I use this diagram because he's he's being honest with the text, and he's showing a diagram if you took the Bible.
Think he is. He's using the historical critical approach, which is not honest with the text, not at all.
Well, okay, So being honest with the text is reading the text and if even if it challenges your unconceived biases, your preconceived biases, you still believe it. Bro That's what it is. And there's a lot of that with me because I didn't believe in flat earth or anything like that.
When I did you absorb anything about my point of regarding historical criticism.
All I'm not. I'm not absorbing that part because you're talking about what you're trying to do is you're trying to not make the Bible God breathed or or or not. You know, you're not. You're not making it like inspired by God. You're trying to make it like I'm Moses and I'm writing the Bible myself. But he's not doing that. Bro, He's writing the Bible. God is inspiring everything he's writing, and he's not gonna He's not gonna inspire him to write.
A lot, Josh. That is not what I'm saying. Okay, please, that's what I was saying that people like Michael Heiser are saying.
Okay, no problem, I don't.
Take the historical critical approach. I reject the historical critical approach. I'm saying that the anytime you use Michael Heiser's diagrams or the Complete Jewish Bible, or you know, any kind of modern scholarly resource that uses the historical critical approach, that's what you're using. Unwittingly, I think, but you're you're accidentally embracing this bedrock of ideas where these scholars took
this historical critical approach that rejects divine inspiration. I'm trying to I'm trying to draw your attention to that, because I think you would you would reject that reasoning if you understood that that's what it was.
I would, so I will reject these you know.
See that that's where this is coming from. When these Bible scholars say, you know, the he the ancient Hebrew scriptures say that the Earth is flat, or they teach this certain cosmology, that's where that logic is coming from.
Well, that's not where my logic is coming from. And an interpretation is different than definition. So what happens is I went through I mean, because I don't want to be teaching something that's wrong. I mean, I'm a god fearing Christian. I fear God, you know, I don't fear man, and I let God be true in every man a liar. So when I'm reading the Bible, I don't want to be teaching anything on my podcast or to anybody. I've probably done fifty shows on biblical cosmology. Okay, I don't
want to be teaching it wrong either. But I do go through the definitions of the Hebrew. I do go through the Greek, and I try to I'm trying to make sure I'm teaching it correctly. I'm not hysteric historically going back to like the Egyptians and the Mayans and all these different people. I'm literally going back to the Hebrew lexicons. I'm going to the strongest recordance and I'm trying to make sure I'm teaching it correctly. And if
I am teaching it correctly. All God can say to me is, hey, at least you are being true to my word because I'm not trying to move it. I'm not trying to take the words and try to twist it like the devil would do in any way. I'm really trying to be honest with my audience, and I'm trying to be honest with people. And Peter, I respect you, bro, and I think you're super intelligent and you're super smart. I think you have a great brain, dude. You know,
I'm just being honest. I listen to your stuff, and I'm like, I think you have a great you have a great amount of knowledge, and I think that you're you probably are really good at taking information and then regurgitating it and doing it well at that. You know, I think you do good at that. So let's go with your Let's go with your no no, no, no, no, regurgitating in a in a in an awesome way. Bro,
you it's not good. I'm sorry. I wait, all right now, Look when you're talking about you're talking about that the Bible verse, I think I took a picture of it. We're talking about the sundown and dango a picture of that.
You talk about.
Okay, So I did a study on this, bro So do you know back then they did not speak Greek. When Jesus is on the Sermon of the Mountain, you know he's not speaking Greek, right, right.
But the well language Matthew and Paul to write Greek.
Okay, So when Jesus was on the Simmon of the mount he spoke uh, galley and Arabaic. So if you go to Galley and Aramaic and you click on sunrise, it could actually mean sunshine. Now I know that the Holy Spirit inspired them to write that. I understand, okay,
But the Bible is not going to contradict itself. So if it's talking about the sun moving in Psalms nineteen two, right, and then like if you go to if you also go to Ecclesiastes one five, it talks about sun arise and sun go down, right, and then to King James click on that. It means the sun goes away from you. It's go forth and come forth. It doesn't mean to go down. So when it says arise and go down Ecclesiastes one five, for example, it says to come forth and to go Yeah.
The case words are more ambiguous than the Greek. I agree with you.
We're trying to and I know that the Greek is super at its own point. I don't know what we just came up, so the popped up. Anyways, I understand that. So those two are are good. I'm gonna have to take those verses and probably do like a bigger study on that because I don't I don't have any answers for you at this very moment, and I don't want to act like I do. But I did kind of study it a little bit because I did see you bring that up in the Flatzoid debate, and I was like, hey,
that's a great point, Peter. And if it's and if I study it to all ends and the sun is going down, then I'm gonna have to change some of the stuff that I'm thinking about biblical cosmology. But everything that I've gone through basically in the Old Testament the New Testament, there's no there's no contradictions there at all.
Well, we are gonna have to talk about it when on offense, we are gonna have to talk about your okay.
Go ahead offense.
That was about eleven minutes. So, Peter, if you want to take eleven minutes on offense. So this is the time where Peter kind of controls. So, Josh, if you're talking and Peter kind of want to redirect or interrupts, you know, he's kind of in charge.
So we're gonna let him set the let's.
Go maybe all respect and all glory to God, let's go. All right.
Well, I think a key point here is when you said that cosmology is the origin of things and and everything, and and that's fine, you know, but I don't want us to get like sort of lost in a semantic gutter here. Okay, So there's a difference between a historical narrative of where things came from, like how the universe came to be historically, versus and onto logical description of the shape and arrangement of the cosmos as it currently is. Now,
do you see what I'm saying. There's a difference between those things. Obviously, if the Bible is making a historical narrative about the origin of the universe, then that's going to touch on some cosmological concepts. When I say that there are no Bible verses on cosmology, what I'm saying is there are no Bible verses that describe or endorse, or give whatever word you want to use here a specific physical model of what the cosmos is. There just aren't any Bible verses on that. So yes, most of
the Bible verses you were citing. I was just yep, yep, yep. I agree.
You know.
It's it's the difference between historical narrative versus an ontological description of a model, you know, or or of the arrangement of things. So, like I said, there's room in the Bible for a flat earth or a globe. And and I really I want to spend a minute on some nineteen. Did you have a response first before we Yeah?
Okay, So what's your definition of cosmology? The definition, the literal definition of cosmology is the science of the origin and development of the universe. That's what the literal cost, That's what the definition is. So I believe that I met that by giving you the what, when, where, and why of exactly how when the Earth was created, who created it, how he created it? I don't understand how that is not that that is the origin and development of our heavens or universe to a team.
But what about the what like what did he create?
Okay? The what did he create? I went day by day, day one, day two, day three, day four. I could go.
Those are just the details that it gives, like individual parts of the cosmos. At no time does it say God created a globe or God created a flat en closed dome.
You know, it says that he created the foundations of the earth. Okay, this is not this is talking about in Isaiah forty twenty two, he said in the beginning, II laid the foundations of the earth. Right. So when it says in the beginning God created the heavens, which is the Shamaim and the eret, which is the earth. God could have laid the foundations, then he could have created the light the darkness, right, and he could have created the heavens to heavens, not that firmament yet, because
that doesn't come un til day two. He could have created the heavens where He's gonna put the word the sky is going to be, and his heaven where God's stone is located. Right. So he laid the foundations of the earth in the beginning, right, So that is like the foundation all right. He says that he created the firmament, which is a solid dome, and in Hebrew. It is whether you believe it's not, you believe that it's space. Whatever you believe it is, He's still telling you exactly
what he created day by day. And even in Genesis two, verse four, he says, this is the history where he could say the origin of the heavens and the earth on the day that the Lord created him. He's telling you exactly what he created, where he placed them, and also the greater light to rule the day.
Why he everything I said again, He's given a lot of teaching cosmology tail mostly chronological detail because it's a historical narrative, but nothing in that disambiguates between a flat or a globe.
It just doesn't.
This isn't about whether it's flatter globe. This is about whether the Bible teaches cosmology. Bron we could have had a debate, if you want to do a debate on flat versus globe. Let's restart this thing up brow and I'll go to different dates.
But where I'm at right from maybe what happened here is that we agreed on you know, does the Bible teach cosmology? And in my mind that was does the Bible endorse a particular cosmological model, and in your mind that was does the Bible ever reference and concepts pertaining to cosmology whatsoever?
There's only one cosmology available at all, Doctor j you're Christian, Peter, you're Christian. I'm Christian. The only cosmology I'm gonna follow is exactly what the Lord God himself would say. Why am I gonna listen to cosmology from flight fight the flat Earth? No offense Osian, Osian or all these people that are scientists. I'm The only cosmology that I have available and I'm gonna go with is the one who created it, the Lord God. Bro. That's the cosmogonist.
So God manded us to subdue the earth and have dominion over it. He gave us. He told Adam to name the animals.
It says, the earth no worries. So what does that have to do with the cosmos.
It's our job to study God's creation.
Yeah, okay, oh, I'm sorry what happened here? I like Ozian man, He's a good guy. So okay, hey, this is what this is? All all I needed to do in this debate, because this is does the Bible teach cosmology? All I have to do is define what cosmology is, and I have to define define teaching. And when I define these two and I go through the entire book of Genesis, I'm showing you, dude, there's there's no debating this, bro,
there's no debating this at all. Does the Bible teach cosmology? Yes, it teaches you to be.
Technicality.
I'm not telling what I wonder lost. That's not what it's about. What I'm telling you is God wanted God like me.
Where we've gotten here is Peter was understanding cosmology is something different than Josh, meaning Josh understood it slightly more broadly. Peter, would you agree that the Bible teaches cosmology if defining it, Josh, but you don't think it talks about collegemology defining it the way you did.
Does that sound accurate?
Yes? I I agree that the Bible teaches a historical narrative about the cosmos. Yes, I don't believe the Bible endorses a particular cosmology cosmological model.
Okay, do we need to go with what cosmology? Does the Bible teach? Is that what we need to get into? Because all, okay, there's no way you can.
Thought that's what we were getting into.
No, No, no, no, no, you're talking about physics now, astrophysics. You're not talking about cosmology. The cosmology is is the origin of the universe.
No, no, okay, if you're going to make a distinction there, the correct term for what you're referring to is cosmogony.
Cosmogony, okay.
Cosmology is the study of the cosmos as it exists currently.
And didn't I lay out exactly where God placed the moon, Sun and the stars? Where you put the sun, the moon, exactly where you put the star.
Up details cosmogicle.
You said there's not one verse that has to do with cosmology in the Bible. I just named like maybe at least Genesis one.
Yeah, Peter agrees with your definitely, if you use your definition.
Let's try to focus in though, on discussing whether the Bible teaches a particular cosmological model. Let's use the word model, right, Okay, thank you. So I'm not saying your definition was wrong or anything like that. I'm just trying to kind of keep the conversation going, Peter.
Peter did not want to go flat versus globe. I asked him, let's talk about does the Bible teach flatfirs globe, or we could do geocentric or whatever.
The reason that I tried to steer away from that is because it is almost a universal tactic of flat earthers to say, well, show me a Bible verse that says the globe. That's a straw man. The endorses a globe cosmology. I don't think it endorses any cosmological model. So I wanted to specifically avoid that straw man, and that's why I had that emphasis. I'm sorry if that caused confusion.
All that caused me to do is just study it does a Bible teach cosmology? And I was like, yeah, exactly, I could tell you exactly what's wrong with that. Bro.
It's just unfortunate because it seems like there was a silly misunderstanding. That's why I keep laughing.
The misunderstanding is you wanted when I asked you if you want to do flat versus globe biblically. I had no problem doing that. But I understand that the Bible doesn't teach a glow but you can try to, at least I don't know. There's probably maybe a few Bible verses you can try to pull, but I have no interest in doing What would you like to start, bro, Because we're already like forty minutes in and we've we've
already kind of done our thing. I mean, what do you what do you want to ask me any questions? Let me ask you a question. Let me ask you a question real quick about about the model that you're talking about. So in the Book of Revelation, it says that all the stars are going to fall to the earth. Okay, if you have a dome with the moon, sun of the stars in the firmament, and then you have a flat earth connected to the dome, all the stars can
fall to the earth, no problem. In your model that you're talking about, it's absolutely impossible because the stars are actually bigger than suns. You know, they're they're all going to fall to the earth. How does that work for you in your model?
Well, there's a few things things that come to my mind, but I have to be totally honest, I don't know. The Revelation is full of prophecy, and the thing about prophecy is that very often it's not even intended to be understood until in retrospect. It's like it's like it's like God saying, I'm gonna call this right now, that this is gonna happen, and you know, and basically it's a sign for us later when it does happen. But we can't decipher that ahead of time all the time.
Sometimes we can if he means for us too, But I don't believe that revelation is fully decipherable beforehand. It is prophecy, and most of it is visions anyway. A lot of it is like clearly metaphorical or symbolic imagery, and so you know, I really don't know what it means when Revelation says that all the stars are going
to fall to the earth. One possibility is that it could be referring to a meteor shower, because I believe in the understanding, like in the in the language of people in ancient times, meteors were the same as stars, you know, shooting stars. We still use that phrase today, So that could be an answer, But I don't know. Yeah, it's prophecy.
It's in also, it's in Mark thirteen twenty five. Jesus is speaking, it says, and the stars shall fall, and the powers that are in heaven shall be shaken. Isaiah thirty four to four says and the host of heaven host another word for host of stars shall be dissolved, and the heavens shall you rolled together as a scroll as the hosts shall fall down. And also in second Peter, it talks about the stars falling as well, So those
are not those are prophathetic. But Jesus is speaking there and then Peter is speaking as well, saying the stars are going to fall. So that's something you should maybe take into account and study because that's very interesting. Then because a heliocentric which is heliocentric model, that'd be impossible, right, all the stars falling to Earth. I mean if that
was true. But if you have a flat Earth with a dome with the moon sent and the stars in it, all of them could definitely fall to the Earth, no problem, right if they're not the same as defined in science.
Right now, I mean, those are all prophecies. So everything I just said about revelation applies to those verses as well. Okay, and maybe you could say that, Okay, you know, here is one verse where my cosmological model makes a little more sense than yours. Okay, you know you can take that point. I don't mind. I don't believe that there's enough to win the battle.
But let's let me ask you this. Okay. So, uh, talking about like the Earth being fixed and immovable, there's verses that are like that. Okay, Now, the earth does shake, right it It talks about it wobbling and shaking. Earth can also mean a few different things. It can mean land, it can mean foundations of the Earth, or it can
mean the earth. Okay, So when it's talking about the earth being fixed and immovable and cannot be moved forever, or it says that the fix the earth is fixed and the world cannot be moved, or there's there's about five verses there in the Book of Zachariat also says that the Earth cannot be moved. Yeah. I don't see anywhere in the Bible. Not only that that you know about the globe and flat thing, but this is more like of the heliocentric thing. I don't see anywhere in
the Bible where the Earth is moving. Can you give me a verse that it talks about the Earth moving?
Well, no, you just gout covered it. And this is why, like again I said, the Bible does not teach a globe cosmology. You know, we get that from science, not from the Bible. But I'm really glad you brought this up because this is kind of cool to me. Okay, So number one, it's phenomenological, like I said, so if you're standing on the Earth, to you, the Earth does
not move. Okay, It's it's that simple. But number two, and this is where things get fun for me, because I I was I would read the Bible as a teenager, you know, and and and connect this in my mind with what I know about science. Okay, the Earth is in an orbital orbital path around the Sun, and the Earth is like I don't I don't know, something like trillions and trillions of kilograms. Okay, it's no one is gonna move Earth out of that orbital path. Nothing and
no one in the whole universe can do that. Only God can do that. And it's it's just like it's absolutely fixed in its orbital trajectory, and that orbital trajectory is cyclic, so it's it's got a path and it follows that path and nothing can deviate it. It is so firmly established in that sense that like I would just feel warmth every time I read those verses, knowing what I know about science and think yes, knowing what we know about science, these verses agree God established the
earth and no one can move it. So I mean you might watch in like sci fi movies where oh, no, you know, the the bogons have come and blown up the earth. No, that's not gonna happen. God has firmly established the earth. So that's my take on that.
And so you believe it's just fixed in the orbit. Okay, well, hey, that's well.
And also theogal.
Okay, so all right is there? Okay, So do you know that in the in the Mormon Bible, which I do not follow. I don't I don't believe scripture whatsoever, it says that the Sun stands still and the Earth moves around the Sun. It actually says that in that Bible. Right, So that's the only Bible verse that goes along with what you just said right there without adding because I don't add to the you know what, you know what
Jesus says in Revelation. Do not add to the Bible right in Revelation, or else you're going to be a race out of the Book of Life. So I don't like to add to the Bible. So if you say that God says the Bible the Earth is fixed and immovable. I'm going to take that as it's fixed and immovable, not in its orbit at all or anything like that.
Well, now, but you're forcing it onto logical reading there it like I said, it could be phenomenologically.
I'm just taking the Bible serious, bro, like I'm taking every world that was placed serious too. Okay. Anyways, that's okay. So now I just want to get your I'm picking your brain here, Peter, because I want to find out what you believe. Anybody else's listening out there, I don't care. I want to know what Peter believes. So if you say that that's what you believe when you read that verse, then at least I'm I'm knowing now what someone that believes in the un.
Again, we don't get helio centrism from the Bible. We get it from science because God commanded us to fulfill the earth and subdue it to have dominion, and that's what we do with science, and we study his creation, we learn how he made the world. That's our job, not his.
You know, the people that are giving you that though those are trying to a lot of the people that are like kind of give you this, this heliocentric, all this stuff. They're trying to give you a world absent from God, though you do.
All two of them are trying to not all of them.
Not all of them.
I'm not saying most of them are trying to do their best and from God. There are obviously there are worldview biases, but I'll tell you what, Josh, I believe worldview biases are much more. They have a much bigger impact on questions of origin and history than they do
about observable science. So I actually tend to believe any random science fact that I read from like atheists and evolutionists and everything, if I know that they observed it with their own eyes or calculated it from direct observations. So you know, I question radiometric dating, I questioned the Big Bang cosmogony, I question Darwin's like narrative of how we got species because none of those things are direct observations. Because scientists today don't have to lie to think that.
You see what I'm saying, it's in the past, so it's filtered through their worldview they are. They look at what they see in the present and then they interpret that using their worldview. To make a narrative about the past, and that's where they go wrong. But if it's something they're observing in a laboratory or through a telescope today, they're generally pretty spot on.
So let me ask you a question. You know that it says in the Bible, and if he's in six twelve that we wrestle not against flesh and blood, where principalities of evil, host of wickedness in high places. Right, So there is a devil waiting to prowl on for
hundred pounds. So don't you believe that the devil can influence men to create a cosmology that is separate from the Bible, that's completely inverted, like an earth that is moving, like a non firmament, like the moon sent of the stars, being in some infinite space where where God's thrown is getting further and further away because.
Not even physically located in it.
Okay, it's let me tell you something. I just want to tell you this, Peter. The Bible says this, and first in Ezekiel one twenty six it says that God's thrown is above the firmament, and Isaiah it says that God is basically above the fermaent looking down on us like grasshoppers, you know what I mean. So God's throne is above the firmament, whether you like it or not, the Bible says that.
Well, actually I think it's Ezekiel is talking about a different firmament. It's not even the one in Genesis. It's because that's a vision that is equal.
The vision from who who is the vision from? Yeah?
From God?
Is God able to lie?
I didn't say he was lying.
No, I know, I know, I know, But think about it this way. God, It's impossible for God to lie. So if God says that his throne is above the firmament, and he doesn't say anything again, look again, it says am if he's giving a vision, there is only one firmament. The Bible doesn't talk about firmaments that God the Bible.
Okay, actually, maybe this is a good time. Maybe this is a good time for me to share my screen. And you gotta get out this other presentation I had on this rebuttal point.
On the Okay, let's go all right, So, and much respect to you, peter A. I think you're doing a great job so far. Man. I just want to give you a big thank you.
I want to say, also, I really appreciate where you're coming from and how you're approaching this. You are such a breath of fresh air after Flatzoid any flatzoid.
Hey, I love you too, Bro, And I like Flatzoid too. I think he's cool. And I love you Peter and doctor J I love you too, brother, God bless you all right? So and Ozan, how you're still doing?
Did you have a presentation? Peter? I'm not seeing it to be able to put it up on.
The I tried to share my screen. Is it working? Oh, I guess I have to Okay, now I now I see what I did wrong? Okay? Is that working?
Sure? Is okay?
So rakia means expanse and we could we could just bring out strong dictionary rakia. This is a noun form of the verb raka.
Spread end.
Yeah, So like a rakey is something that has been rock God, if I can sort of mash together Hebrew and English. So what does raca mean to like you said, to pound or figuratively to expand by hammering, like like you know metallurgists might do as a sheet of metal. Yes, sometimes the thing rock cod is metal like in Exodus thirty nine, number sixteen, Isaiah forty Jeremia tenth. But not always. There are a number of things that have been rockd
in scripture. There's metal, there's the earth. There's some uses with no direct object at all, and it says just raca with with one's feet. It says in Job thirty seven that the clouds have been rock cod And this is this one's really interesting. Right here, in second Manuel twenty two forty three, it says that God racause people. Okay, so let's look at that verse Second Samuel, I actually have the interlinear earth right here on the next slide, twenty two forty three.
It's very hard to see for me.
In the English Standard version, it says I beat them as fine as the dust of the earth. I crushed them and stamped them down like the mire of the streets. So looking at the interlinear here, it says, and I beat them as fine as the dust of the earth, like dirt in the streets. I trod them and and here's where the word rockey is used. I spread them out, okay, spread as one.
Yeah, you're right.
The really interesting thing to me here is that there are three different actions in this sentence. There's beat, crush, and stamp, and you'd think reading the English, oh, this one might be raka or this one might be raca. But the first two are not raka. Those are different verbs, even though they sound similar. The first one is shahak. I think, is that how that might be pronounced? And then duck hawk And it's like, these are different verbs.
They refer to like a different type of action. You know, they might be synonyms, like there are situations where they might have a similar usage. But the only time in this verse that God uses the word raka is when he's referring not too dirt, not to Mayer in the streets, but to people. And I just thought that was very interesting. So I had Flatzoid bring this up in the Blue Letter Bible concerning Rakia, and he was like saying, oh, look, it says, you know, solid expanse firmament flat as a base.
And then you know down there in the bottom it says considered by Hebrews as solid and supporting waters above. Well, where the heck does that come from? Brown driver Briggs? And this is an element of higher criticism. You know, this does not appear in the ancient sources and no scholar prior to the rise of higher criticism in Germany in the seventeen hundreds ever believed this this comes from
higher criticism. So I reject that. You know, I respect Brown driver Briggs in general, but this specifically is an element of higher criticism leaking into their work. So let's look at some other Can.
I respond at all? Or are you just going to do the whole presentation? Or how does that work? I could?
That?
Can pause?
And so this is what we're gonna do.
Josh, why don't you respond to the Peter talk for quite a while there, So why don't you go ahead and talk?
Okay?
So I'm going to go to some closing statements.
We're getting about to an hour, so Josh this up with Josh.
Okay on this, and then we'll do something.
Okay. So first of all, Peter, good job, because what you're doing is what you're supposed to do. You're supposed to be like the Brians, and you're supposed to study. Bro I love it. You're studying the words and you're studying what they mean. And I really appreciate you doing that. Man. It's really smart to do that, and it's really good for the Christian community to start doing that. I like that you're doing that, bro, and I give you big
ups for that. Okay, So hast thou spread out the sky which is strong if you click on strong and the strongest recordings, that means solid or firm. I don't know why you believe that's clouds, but that's okay as molten looking glass, right, So we have that. Also, the word firmament when it was translated from Hebrew to the Greek, and the Greek's step tuogen, they use the word stereoma, which that also means solid, and then they did firmament.
It's not called the softman, it's called a firmament because they're staying true to the word and they believe that it was solid. Now you go to the complete Jewish Bible, which are Hebrews, that these guys are like, I am not going to mess up the Hebrew because I want to stand true to the word.
They said, any modern Hebrews.
Yes, yes I have. I've had. I've had modern Hebrews on my on my show twice already. One of them that is really great in Hebrew and he believes that that the word dome or firmament is perfect to use. But what I'll say this, you ask.
Him if he believes that Moses wrote the Pentateuke.
No I didn't.
I didn't ask him that that would be an interesting thing to ask him.
Yeah, let me let me continue with this. So also in the Book of Proverbs, it says that God made the sky firm. Click on that. It means solid firm, Okay. And when you go to the complete Jewish Bible, they chose the word dome. And then if you go to Joe twenty or thirty seven eighteen, it's firm instead of strong. Dude, I'm telling you wrote that. There's something to the Bible saying that the sky is solid or firm or it's
holding back from waters above. Now, when God made the firmament to separate the waters from the waters, that's not separating the oceans, you know that, right, because the oceans are not made until Day three. He's separating waters from water. So there's there in the Bible. The reason why it says that it's a fat flat as based support or supporting waters above.
Uh.
The reason why it's saying that. They's saying that in the strongs Coordance is because the Hebrews believed Moses said. Okay, so the one that you've brought up on the screen, Yeah, okay, so it said the Hebrews considered it's you know, supporting waters above, because that's what Moses said in the Bible, that it's supporting the waters above. That's probably why where they got that from. But also there's there's different.
Parts of the Bible work critical interpretation of what Moses wrote. That's what I'm saying.
Yeah. So so another thing I would say is like Abos ninety six, this is the one who builds his upper chambers in the heavens. And if you click on the word chambers, it actually means layers. Like I told you, there's three heavens. One is where the moon's and the stars are. The second one is the firmament. The next one is where God's throne is located, it says, and this is the nasb. Okay, it says he has founded his vaulted dome over the earth. Does that mean vaulted dome?
If you click on the word it's binding heaven to the earth. Okay, it's binding, So it's connecting heaven to the earth. So heaven being in the you know, if you look what heaven is. If you look at Genesis one to eight, it says that heaven is the firmament, right, So there's that, and then another one would be Isaiah forty twenty two. I just want to read this and then we'll wrap this up, Okay, Isaiah forty twenty two. Have you not known? Have you not heard? Has it
not been told to you from the beginning? Have you not understood from the foundations of the earth. It is he speaking of the Lord God who sits above the circle of the earth, and its inhabitants are like grasshoppers who stretches off the heavens like a curtain and spreads them out like a tent to dwell in. So besides the circle and the spear thing everybody fights over, it's talking about God. He sits above the circle of the earth.
He's sitting above the circle. Liric, I know that you probably say, well, there's no throne up there, like God says, you know, But it's talking about God's throne and Heaven and Paradise being in the third Heaven being above the firmament that the Bible speaks of this. But anyways, go ahead, I wanna let you talk. I talked for a while.
Okay, let's go ahead and move to closing arguments. Guys, really appreciate you kind of adjusting here. Obviously, Josh won the debate he came to have, and Peter won the debate he came.
To have, so you both won.
Yeah, you transitioning here to try to hit each other to make sure you're kind of arguing about the same things. I think you did a nice job with that, so appreciate that, even though it's a little confusion. But let's go ahead and do some closing statements. I'm thinking just like three minutes for closing statements.
Is that enough?
I assume you guys don't have long prepared closing statements.
Is that? Is that correct?
I have nothing prepared, so yeah.
Okay, so let's just do two minutes. Let's just do a two minute.
Summary wrap up type thing, and Josh, why don't you get it started, and then Peter will close a set on these closing statements.
Okay, Oh, so I'm starting it. I'm sorry. Okay, So closing there's definitely a difference between the Bible's cosmology or God's cosmology and the science that we see today. Okay, what I like I talked to you about. To Peter, there is a devil. They're influencing men, and demons influencing men, fallen angels influencing men to do certain things. And to me, I believe that the modern cosmology that's happening today that we see is completely inverted from the Bible. Okay, I
see that the Earth is fixed. I believe there's a dome above the Earth, and that the moon some of the stars are in the dome, and that the sun is moving overhead and the moon is moving like Joshua ten twelve says, I believe that Earth is not moving whatsoever, and we are at a geocentric flat with the dome, with God's thrown above the dome. That the model that that they came out with, they say thirteen point eight billion years ago or thirty four to six million years ago,
the stars came. Then they said the sun came. Then they said the earth came, completely the opposite to the Bible. The Bible says the earth came first, then the moon, sun of the stars came on day four. So it's definitely inverted in opposite. But anyways, I would just want to say one thing thank you Peter for this discussion because I think that we represented as Christians the right way. I think we handled it greatly, and I love that
because we're in a den of atheist right now. There's a lot of atheists right now listening to this show. I know I was on the show before, so we're in a den atheist. So I think we handled it the right way.
Yes, I just want to go on record. I told Flatzoid that he's an embarrassment to Christians. Josh, you are not good job, good job.
All glory to God. I love Flatzoid, though he's not an embarrassment to Christians, but I like, I love, but go ahea. I'm done with my closing statement. Everybody that's listening out there, I love you guys so much and I really appreciate you your time and doctor j thank you for your time too, minute of moderating the debate. You're welcohad Peter.
All right, So no single verse you shared, or any passage or anything that you shared from the Bible disambiguates between models. Okay, everything is explainable with modern science according to a globe healing centric model. The only thing that's not explainable is historical things like big bank cosmogy or Darwinism, you know, things we do not directly observe through our microscopes or telescopes. And that's the thing, is like, when you say that there's you know, a devil out there
trying to deceive men, I agree. I just think you've misidentified his tactics because you know, he's a lot more subtle than you seem to griven credit for. In Genesis three, it says he's the most crafty, he's the craftiest of all the beasts or whatever. And I think he's you know, he's he's pushed the lie into the past where it requires interpretation because he's not he's not interfering with scientists'
telescopes when they look into space. He's not interfering with the laboratory experiments to make sure they accidentally come up with a you know, a different like model than is taught in the Bible. That's not what's happening. He's he's giving them a cognitive bias against the history that the Bible teaches. Okay, so that's my my belief on that. And anyway, I didn't start my time, so I don't know how much time I have left.
You got twenty seconds. Sounds like you're about to the end, so we'll stop it there. Well, the super super Chats few things. Hey, thank you for some gifted memory for ships from at Shirky, So thank you so much.
For doing that.
If you want to get your questions in, of course, super Chats will jump to the to the for the line, So let's start with those first of all, taking back eatam for two dollars.
When will doctor j go flat Earth? Thank you, Josh, you're awesome.
I am watching the final experience close experiment closely, so if that goes how flat Earth has been predicting for a long time, that would go a very long way in convincing me that flat Earth is correct, because that would go against my understanding of how things work. Next question, when will Max go flatter thanks to maximillion Villa.
Uh, thanks Max, You're awesome.
And I happen to know the answer to that as well, And the answer is never, because he's a filthy atheist and so he will not be not be doing it. So well, now, Max is a proud filthy atheist.
Just look in the chat. I'm sure he'll tell.
You he cleans. I watched him take a shower yesterday.
Okay, for two dollars, Peter, Why wouldn't Satan lie about Earth?
Think?
Because he can't. God made God made our eyes, and God made the world. He can't make that process go wrong because God made that process. You know, God made the world. He gave it to us to study. He gave us eyes and brains to study it. Satan can't mess with that. What he can mess with is our cognitive bias, our spiritual beliefs, our worldview. Satan just can't. He's not that powerful.
Okay, Josh, welcome, make a combat.
Oh yeah, well, okay, it's very easy. All Satan has to do is take Genesis three point fifteen and when you click on that word where it says beguiled Eve, that word is nashah our Nasa Nasa.
All you gotta dosh hold on.
This is just act answering this question. He said that what couldn't Satan lie about the Earth? Of course, all he has to do is send you pictures from space and tell you this is what the Earth looks like. And people are gonna believe it because our normal perception that we see with our eyes when you look at the horizon and everything you're seeing it being flat. The only reason why we believe it's a globe is because we've been told it's a globe. Go ahead.
That's not the reason I believe it's a globe. I believe it's a globe because I measured sunset myself and it only works on a globe.
Okay, Well that's okay. I'm just saying. I'm just saying about the question about Satan. He could definitely make SciTE. But go ahead, doctor j Next question.
Peter, any last comments, So I'll give you the chance that it was to you, but otherwise I'll head head on to.
I had a thought that it escaped me. I'm sorry.
We'll assume that it means it wasn't that important, all right. Five from Maximilian Ville again, thank you so much. Five SGD from Beheaded Kamakazi. How do you account for the phenomena of black holes and supernova with respect to the Bible? Why don't you each give your opinion on this particular question.
Start with you, Josh.
Okay, so if you can tell me that that's a one thousand percent fact that there's black holes and supernovas, then you know, then then I would understand. But this is just coming from man teaching us that there's black holes and supernovas and to give us artist depictions of what it would look like. I'm not actually seeing it with my eyes, so Maximili though, it doesn't disrespect the
Bible in any way. And the Bible says that the host of heaven are complete and the after the Seventh Day, he said that the stars and everything is complete and finished. So it does go against the Bible if you think that supernovas are happening and new stars are being created, Dude, they're already finished in the complete. So this is just what man is telling you, and you're not actually seeing it with your own eyes. They're just telling you what it is, a black hole and supernova. It doesn't go
get the Bible whatsoever. I don't I don't really care about it.
Yeah, so we do observe black holes in supernova. That like when when we're when we're monitoring a star and measuring its brightness. And when I say measure, this says what scientists do. They use instruments that are more capable than our immediate bodily sensations. So this is not a
scientist just staring through a telescope with his eyeball. This is him using like a light meter to actually measure the brightness of a star and it will, you know, jump way off the charts all of a sudden in brightness and this spectrogram will go out of whack and then poof, in a few weeks, it's gone. Okay, that's the observation. You know, you can try to explain that a different way. But that happened in God's universe, Okay,
you know that that's something we observe. And as far as far as black holes, there, they were a little more theoretical for a while. But I actually did a video recently on the first image that they took of a black hole and my theological interpretation of that, because I think it's such a cool subject. Black holes are terrifying, and in order to observe those, we actually needed to use interferometry across like a huge array of telescopes all
across the globe. So it's very much more difficult than observing a supernova. But I don't see any issue with reconciling that with the Bible. The Bible, like I said, does not prefer a cosmological model. It doesn't say the Earth is flat, so there's no issue. We're studying God's creation when we study black holes and supernova.
Okay, sounds good.
A couple different ways of understanding that appreciate it. Next, does may be supposed to be due? Josh and Peter know the Ten commandments? Do either of you what to demonstrate your memory skills?
To try to the top of my head or not?
I I before me, no graven images. Don't take the Lord's name in vain, remember the Sabbath.
No, no onto thy mother and father.
Yes, thank you, you have no see.
Do not steal, murder, do not murder, Do not lie. Yeah, I think that's about how many do we cover? Like seven, do not covet, do not covet thy neighbors.
Cove It is number ten. There's also don't commit adultery, and.
That's another one.
Yeah, we're good, we got that number seven. I think nine.
Don't lie about your neighboring court or whatever.
Yeah.
Yeah, yeah, that was that was our shot at it there taking back he did very false.
Wit is the phrase do.
Not does I'm a Barbie girl in a Barbie word? Or no I got it, dude, Why do.
I get feel like this person is not taking us seriously?
That's that gentleman, that's the host. That's another host that you guys have.
Is no, no, this is a different guy.
Okay, get ten free memberships if you sing it so you know, do what you can.
I sing the parody version, give it to us, give it to us. I'm not I'm not really really good. Okay, I'm too shy.
Thank you so much, Max for for doing that.
Okay, two dollars taking back eating again, Peter, Can you feel the Earth's tilt?
No, no, no.
No, there's no reason why you would be able to feel that in your body. That's just an argument from ignorance fallacy. If you think that means that it is that it's not true. We use measurements, you know, in science to figure that out, not our bodily sensations.
Okay, Peter, a show well, I hope you know what that means. Conformity XP three fourths goes against sense is don't make sense to you? Oh, Oz, can you help us with this question?
Do you know what it means?
I do not, Peter Osh, conformity X. I feel like this is a video game XP three fours go against you get it figured out, jump back in and help us out. But we got a few other.
Take me and let me know. I'm taking back your john. What you mean conformity experiment? Oh, I think there's a conformity experiment where people in authority precitions.
Oh, it's like a psychology thing, right, yeah, okay, yeah, yeah, so I don't know if they go against senses, but people.
Yeah, so people will conform to authority and what they tell them is true, and that is true.
That's just not relevant to me understanding and studying science, like because I'm not taking it from authority, Like I understand these concepts. I measured this on myself. You can go look at my profile on YouTube or TikTok and see the experiment that I did and I made that. I devised that experiment myself. I did not consult an authority. I did not get that from someone. I thought of that myself. You know this is not it's not about authority at all.
All right, So thank you Max. Also, so we get some gifted memberships from him. Really appreciate that. Thanks so as much. That was five memberships a little bit earlier and then ten memberships, so really appreciate that. We did have a few other questions I want to jump into, and then we'll see if we have time for mine, because I had a couple.
Uh.
The Bible does mention stars in constellation, but does provide specific locations for them. So can I locate them in the heavens for viewing?
Does the Bible does?
Man, it's called the Mazaroth. So if you're saying, does the Bible mention stars and constellations? Yes, it's called the Mazaroth? Okay, And yeah, you I mean, are are you asking? Can you locate them like to like line up with the Bible tells the truth. I think that's what they're asking, right.
I don't think the Bible gives us a star chart. You gotta get stilarium or something for that.
Viewing.
Yeah, that was a good old college Try next one here. Why didn't God plant his magic tree, the Tree of Knowledge on Pluto to avoid all the suffering?
So this would be a question about the problem of evil?
I think, Okay, Peter, you want to pick on the problem of.
Evil because God wanted to reveal the majesty of his holiness and his goodness through the Gospel of Jesus Christ by sending his son to die on the cross for our sins and give us eternal life. There was no way to do that without introducing, without allowing evil to enter the world through Adam and Eve's sinning.
And also, we're not robots. So if God had robots, come on, this is this is okay, I want you guys. I if I had a robot that was like my housekeeper and then it kept saying I love you, I love you, I love you, it's programmed to say that. So for us to you know, faith has to be tested for it to be real faith. Right, So that's what that's what I believe. I believe that our faith
has to be tested, and that's the way. And what God does, He's like basically shaping you to be able to make it to heaven because in heaven it's sinless, so you have to go through trials and tribulations for you to have real faith, you know, like like you have to put the full armor of God on which is the breastplate of righteousness, the helmet of salvation, the belt of truth, and you have to have the sandals of the gospel, and you have to have a sword, which is the word of God, and you have to
have a shield of faith. The bigger the more faith that you earn, the bigger faith, the bigger the shield is going to be to dodge the wiles of the devil. So it's going to help you to fight against the devil. So you do have spiritual weapons that God will give you to fight against it.
Well, we started a cosmology debate, and we might have the problem of evil debate.
Yeah.
Can I ask a follow up question? There's a bunch of chit chat in the chat about that. Are you saying that the fall was it by design?
Peter?
Are you asking me?
Yeah, both of you. It's a fall eating the apple or the fruit good and evil? That by design God.
It was according to God's plan. God did not design evil, but he planned for it.
Forget.
Yeah, I apologize for interrupting you, Josh.
I just uh, it's okay.
I have so little patience now for the robot analogy because it's a cliche of like basically what I would describe as shallow pop apologetics for Christians like from you know, like Frank Turic and people like that. I'm a Calvinist. I believe in predestination. I don't believe in ultimate human free will, and I don't believe that that's a good answer at all, because it ends up basically making God seem smaller, like he doesn't have sovereignty over you know, the course of history.
Maybe I need to start a different channel where we argue about.
I think the robot analogy has done a lot more harm than good.
It's it's it's all good, yeah, I think. Okay, no worries. What's the next question?
I think you meant well though, and so I I am meaning well.
Man.
I just wanted to let people know that God gave us a spiritual you know, weapons to fight against them.
Okay, next question matters Now for Josh Max, this is the Max from our channel that you probably know.
He would love to do a debate.
I'm sure you know how to get a hold of him through discord if you're interested.
But Max, would Max debate.
Much less to you. I don't debate the topic of flat Earth. I only debate biblical cosmology due to the fact that that's that's all. I like that. That's all that matters to me. Flat Earth like fighting, like you know, there's there's so much intensity there. But you're an atheist, so any anything that I brought to you would probably you probably wouldn't believe it anyways, because I would be
bringing Biblical verses and stuff. So, but I would love to debate you on flat earth, if you want to do flat versus globe biblically like I did with Ozian, But I don't. I don't debate flat earth because it's like beating a dead horse, you know, honestly, there's already been out there so much. I like to debate what the Bible says because I think that's the true, inherent of everything. I think it's true.
But he says he will debate biblical cosmology. I'll send him your discord.
Yeah he can. You can get a hold of me, bro if you want to talk to me, and I've listened to you.
Stick him to the robotism.
A couple of questions I had.
I think we'll have time and then we'll wrap up unless someone shoots a super sat chat in otherwise these will be the last ones. What is your guys' understanding of what are the best Hebrew and lexicons Hebrew and Greek lexicons that one should use when arguing about the meanings of words I can.
I can go grab the one that I have. If you'd like it, I could show it to you. Hold on, real quick, give me one second, Peter, if you can answer that for one second, I'm gonna go.
So my answer is that I don't know. I am not a scholar. I engage in basically what amounts to armchair like scholarship on these things. You know, I don't know hardly anything about Hebrew or Greek from what I from what I know, like from what I've heard. Okay, Like, there is a lot of merit to the brown Driver's Briggs lexicon because and I know that just because that's what I was studying this week for preparing for this debate.
Before this week, I didn't even know that that existed, which it might be silly, but it's a lot more in depth than Strongs. And you know, some go even so far as to say that Strong's is not even a dictionary or lexicon. Brown Driver's Briggs is more of a dictionary or lexicon because it gives the actual definitions and comparisons and everything. So it's probably very good for
a lot of kinds of study. I took specific issue with its definition of Rakia because I believe it demonstrates influence from higher criticism according to the arguments I shared earlier. But that's so far almost all I know about Brown Driver's brigs and the only real flaw that I see in it, So the rest of it could be gold and totally fine.
I don't know.
What do you use? What's it? What is this one?
This one is a expedition. It's an expo expo expository dictionary of Bible words. This is one that I use right here, and I do use it. Uh, I do use This is by edited by Steven D. Wren. This is one that I use. But also, like he talked about, uh, also I like the strong succordance. The Blue Letter Bible is an easy one to go to because you could you pulled up on your computer, and it's a lot easier. This one you have to you know, you still have
to physically look through. But it's good to compare notes on each one and find out what you feel is the best. Uh as far as the but yeah, I just think it's good to just look through all of them and just just study as much as you can. I think it's the best to do because we don't speak Greek, we don't speak Hebrew, and uh, I think it's best to just study as much as you can and make sure that we're teaching correctly.
Really is one I over these words.
Okay, if you really want to argue over the meeting of these words, and you want any academic to take you seriously, you have to use b dag for grit for Greek and haylot for Hebrew. I'm not saying they're perfect in every way, but those are considered the gold standard. I don't even own haylot because it's expensive. I used it in my when I was writing my PhD dissertation,
I just used the one from the library. But if if if I was going to write something serious in the Old Testament, I would need to at least address a lot.
Can it's h A l O T H haylot, But I can the B dag B d A G.
But BD purchases to buy good stuff isn't free unfortunately. Okay, Another question I had if you met each other in person, would you greet each other with the Holy kiss? And if not, what reasons would you have to not greet each other with the Holy kiss? The Testament says the Great One and not with the Holy Kiss.
We could figuratively just like hug. You know, I would the culture that we have.
If I met Peter, I would try to I would try to be as nice as I can possibly to him as Christian brothers, because I do respect his work and I have no issues with them, So I would definitely give him a hug. Nice to meet you, Peter, and I would try to get along with him as best as possible, and maybe we can bounce ideas off each other. Why do you believe this? Why I believe this and have a great conversation. It would be no issues at all, for sure.
Yeah. And I see comments like trying to sexualize filo love, This is just nothing to do with you really really have to get away from the over sexualization of stuff in our culture today.
What what I mean was, notice how fast you guys moved away from the literal interpretation.
In that verse, right, because that's not our costantly ran away from it.
So just notice that you notice that.
Notice that we have a very different culture now than they had in the New Testament.
So anyway, when you go to Europe, you go to the Middle East, and this is common practice between men, and it's not considered sexual. It's not considered almost sexual for two men to hold hand and brotherly.
Wasn't there, guy?
Like My point wasn't saying your your interpretation is wrong, because I'd probably take a similar one maybe, But I just wanted you to notice how you didn't take it literally at all. It you directly twice and you didn't do it, and neither one of you will ever literally do it.
Oh well, now, if we want to play some antics here, Paul commanded his direct audience to do that literally. He did not plan us to do that.
Just say, notice that interputation move you did there, that hermoneutical shift, and then you do it every time you read anything, because you just did it right there.
Like I want to say that, like Andrew Cuomo got in trouble for that kind of thing, like doing it when like people had a different culture and didn't take it the way that he intended and stuffed it. Wasn't that something.
I'm not I'm not saying we just I just want to point out the hermoneutics, That's all I'm saying.
There, noticed interpretation there.
Anyway, we are at the end of our time, thank you guys so much for joining us.
Great job you two.
Good job, you know, kind of shifting around once we got our definitions better. Thank you all so much for joining us for matters. Now you're looking forward to more content. I think we have another bait just coming up soon tomorrow. It's on flat Earth and versus globe, So keep track. I'll be doing another book review here soon. I think I'm gonna do on economics, and I think I'm going to do a book review on a book called Uh.
It's on the It's called a deficit myth.
It's basically arguing that the federal deficit does it matter?
And so I will be explaining why.
This particular author argues that the federal deficit doesn't matter.
I'll be explaining her argument.
So if you're interested, if you're looking for that, coming up the next week's again weeks as well. Thank you once again, Josh Peter for coming. We wouldn't have a show without you, so thank you so.
Much for being here.
Can I shout out my babe?
You bet? Josh, go ahead and shou out your stuff, and then Peter, if you have any I want to, and then we'll get out of here.
My podcast is Josh Monday Christian and Conspiracy podcast. You can find that on Spotify and all audio. If you go to my YouTube, it's Josh Monday Music and Podcast. If you could subscribe, if you have any questions, if you need prayer, any episode you've ever seen, If you have any questions, you can always DM me on Instagram at Josh Monday Underscore Podcast. And I also have a TikTok too, but I'm not really too active there. I do mostly myself on Instagram. But everybody that's listening, God
bless you, Thank you, and Peter, thank you so much. Brother. I really appreciate your time, and I think it was it was a fun debate. And doctor j thank you for your time. And thank you for your time. Brother Peter.
We got where where can we find you?
So I'm on YouTube and TikTok and a few other places, but that's mainly where I post content. The sometimes the social media kind of chooses you instead of YouTube. I've only been on TikTok for a few months, but that's for some reason where my stuff kind of started taking gaining traction. So I guess I'm a TikToker. Just look up my name Peter Markley and A. R. K. L. E.
Wyan.
You should find it, Josh, Thank you, h this was a breath of fresh air. I came into kind of like white knuckled, expecting something similar to like with Flatzoid, and that didn't happen. So this was a this was a delight. Thank you, and thank you as well that doctor Jay and jes In.
You are welcome in.
Some of that information for their socials and whatnot can be found in a few of their links can be found in description and if you want to.
Find it there. Thanks again for joining us, and we'll see you again next time.
Sa Us.
Oh man, I think that actually my microphone might have been on mute. Oh no, oh no, okay, guys, hopefully that my mic was not on mute. If it was, I apologize, you guys will have to forgive me. Oh my gosh, I think my mic was on mute. I think that was like about a good five minutes of talking. I apologize, guys. I don't have an editor to edit it out either, but anyways, what I want to say is thank you so much to Jonathan and Jacob. I appreciate you, guys. Appreciate you guys. Having me as a host.
I just want to tell you guys. I don't know if you guys heard anything I said, because I think my mic was on mute. I apologize, but anyways, I just want to tell you on Wednesday's service, I want to try to start doing some New Testament versus going over Matthew. I'll start there probably, so I'll start doing sermons. I wanted to let you guys know when I do have a guest on the podcast, I am not able to. I don't want to be bringing people on that I'm
not equally yoke with. I want to make sure that when I'm doing Bible studies with somebody, I trust them. I know that they're one hundred percent Christian. I know that all the information that they're putting out is equally yoke with what I put out, you know. So that's why I have only a few guests that come on, and I don't want to get too crazy and have a bunch of different guests that are not that don't really walk with God, if that makes sense. So I
try to do my best. But anyways, I apologize for the mute, I really do. I don't know how long that was. Oh my goodness. I really feel embarrassed. But hopefully you enjoyed the debate and I hope you enjoy Wednesday service. This is the first episode. If you want to hit me up on Instagram, it's at Josh Monday Music and Podcast. Thank you guys so much. I really
appreciate you. And uh, let's end this in prayer. So, Father, God and the name of Jesus, thank you so much for everything you do for me and you do for us. Anybody that's listening right now, please, I just want to ask I pray over this podcast. I pray that the people listening open up their hearts to you, accept your word as true. I want to help people get closer to you, Lord, and I want to help people get saved. That's the whole point of this podcast. There's that there's
Christians and conspiracy theorists out there. There's conspiracy theorists out there that are lost, that are that are digging through all these different conspiracies and they're trying to find the truth. What they don't understand, Lord is that the truth is on their nights dand the Holy Bible. I know the truth is there. Lord, So if you could please motivate these these people that are listening to start reading the
Word of God. Lord, please and you know, help them assist them to you know, if they if they do sit down to do the Bible study with this show, uh, you know, have them pick up their Bible and kind of fall along and help me to teach the Bible the way you want me to teach it. Lord, Sunday service will be Uh. I'll be doing on Wednesday night.
And Lord, I just asked that you assist me to teach Exodus seventeen to the best of my ability and help me do some studies the next few days, so I make sure that that is prepared and help me prepare for when I do start teaching the New Testament for Wednesday service. Lord, thank you for the opportunity. I appreciate you. Lord. I'm going to ask you that you break the chains of any person that's listening right now
that's having any issues with anything, including myself. Lord, break any change if there's anything that's stopping me from moving forward in faith, if you want to, you know, anybody that's out there that's that's the maybe like, hey, I can't stop drinking, I can't stop doing this, can't whatever kind of addiction that's stopped with them. Lord, I want to ask you break those chains. So thank you so much,
and I appreciate everything you do. Lord, thank you in Jesus name, Amen, and everybody that's listening, I really appreciate you. Sorry about that pause right there. I was talking all confident too. That's hilarious that that the bike was muted and that's never happened before. But anyways, thank you so much. Yeah, when the debate was playing, I just wanted to make sure that you didn't hear me talking or anything. I was sitting there listening with you guys the whole time.
But you know what, thank you guys so much for your patience with me. And I love you guys, and God bless you