You're listening to the back home network presented by home field apparel. Welcome back to Crimson cast Galen clavius, got Caulfield joining you. It is the 9th of January is a Monday.
We had an inkling about recording yesterday and discretion was the better part of valor there is, we did not angry pod We left that to our friends at assembly call who I wish they were able to do more happy potting, but they've been doing some angry potting here over the last eight games by and large, but hopefully you tuned in. You remember, you can tune in to listen to assembly call after
every IU game home. In a way, we are the snail mail version of podcasting, where we generally, we've learned about ourselves, Scott. That it's best that you not hear us immediately after any game football or basketball. So we here, we are on a Monday, we're going to talk Are you basketball for about the next 25? 30 minutes? Good to see you again. It's not been very long since we last talked. But how are you doing now? I'm good. I feel like we should get give out free.
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So again, home field apparel.com, be sure to check them out as well on social media at Twitter on home-field apparel and Instagram as well. Anyway, Scott we talked before the the Northwestern game about, you know, Indiana might have a tough sled here, a little bit. I was myself thinking primarily about about the Penn State and Wisconsin games.
The Penn State game coming up on Wednesday, the Wisconsin game coming up on Saturday, not that I didn't think there was a possibility, Indiana might lose to Northwestern, but I, it was the least likely of the scenarios given how bad northwestern's been on offense, thus far this season, I thought, I you especially coming off that Iowa loss would be galvanized ready to go. And gosh, that was not the case at all the Hoosiers came out. Late, a gigantic.
Egg through the first 35 30 while 39 minutes of the game and then try to make up for it at the end. It was like your classic case of not going to any of the class sessions and then trying to cram everything into the exam at the final. And sure enough. They got an F, Plus, instead of a d-minus as they lose by one to Northwestern, northwestern's fifth win against Indiana in the last eleven times they played, which is just not good business. If you're Indiana basketball lot.
Do we can talk about with this. This. So we can still, we can go micro and then go macro, how do you
want to approach things? I just want to go macro but I will say it's it. This was a game where I feel happy to podcast because you know, you pull me deep into analytics and you do a lot of analytical research, which is really good, but this is one of those games where the numbers kind of like because you look at the end stats, it's like a one-point game and it's like, as you mentioned like a lot of
that. At the end, you know, this is also a game where, you know, our defense wasn't great but it's like it's worse during those runs and the start of the game like and the numbers kind of even out and even when you look at and they talk about the assembly calming to reference a couple things, they said they do a great job. I thought about even texting Jared like this is kind of like welcome to you know, what it's like when Gail and I do
football. But I realized they did that, you know, losing 12 out of 13 Romeo Season 2. So they've been down this road. Fortunately, we've all been down this road but they mentioned this that, you know, You could look at him like aren't we took 18 3 is like, that's pretty good, but it's like seven of those were from Jaylin. Hood Shafi. Know what?
I would say most of those were like MBA style threes, where he just kind of created a three out of his own which isn't really like the team trying to get more sets to play to get threes. It's just one-on-one basketball, getting threes, which is a problem, we can get to. But overall this game really, when we look back on it, the stats are not going to remember what we saw with. Is that Northwestern kind of
came in, kicked ass around. And unfortunately, like we've seen so many times this year since the Northwestern, the North Carolina game, we just kind of looked defeated and we just kind of look like we didn't have a pulse to come back and you know, there's I hate you know, getting on, you know, players and you'll college kids for playing hard and effort because I know it's tough. But on the flip side like this, we've seen teams in the past that hustled for entire game.
Ezra for the majority of times. And when you have, you know, most of the guys on Northwestern diving after all the 50/50 balls and us, you know, iut not getting them, you have to wonder. It's like all right. Well, other people are able to do this. And why do we seem so kind of not up for the moment.
Not understanding how important this is, you know, not utilizing Assembly Hall for what it is like you know, the crowd is ready to get you there and then when you just go down by 12, Northwestern. It's kind of like, yeah, like it's hard to get that crowd back and so it's all of those things. The micro is kind of what I took away from the game. And I would say to, you know, this is a really tough spot because you had two games in a row that you lost where I would
say. Trace Jackson, Davis, and Jalen Hood Shafi. No gave you as much as you could ask for. Buy me like hit Ruffino had a couple more turnovers me like he's also handling the ball 95 over here. Ask him to be the the distributor and one of the leading scorers and offend one of the guys other your best guys who have G, like you're asking a lot out of him, so I'm okay with some mistakes, but it's like you're getting almost, you know, 50, 60 points from those two,
guys, two games in a row. I don't expect them to keep that up and you're kind of looking around, like, right, does anybody else, right? Wanna hop in? I understand we've had some injuries. I understand, you're kind of getting deeper in the lineup, but these are all guys, who I would say, almost everybody on our bench would have been recruited. Northwestern and may or may not be starting for them. So it's kind of like, unless they transferred going on here.
Yeah, that's a fair point. You know? So I want to say this before we get, bigger picture. Yeah, it's this is where it gets tricky, trying to talk basketball because there's so Trace Jackson, Davis, and Jalen Hurd Jaffe. No, in particular. Trace Jackson. Davis is clearly hobbled.
He's clearly got some kind of a physical Vehicle ailment and yet in his last two games, he's scored 35 points and pulled down nine rebounds against Iowa and he scored 18 points and got twenty four rebounds against Northwestern like those are Herculean efforts under any circumstances, let alone circumstances where you're injured. And so, you know, you it's hard to like, what do you get? You know. Can you criticize Trace Jackson? Davis for being kind of average or worse.
And simply you can, but let's be realistic. His job out there really is score points and grabbed rebounds, especially with race Thompson out. And I think he deserves a tremendous amount of Applause and I think you can excuse some of the defensive lapses, you know, because it's a guy who despite being injured played 78 of the 80 minutes in the last two games, like that's, that's nuts. I mean, that's he hadn't done that in any two consecutive games this year.
I don't know if he's done that in two consecutive games in his FireEye ordeal is 40 minutes a game. Just you can't do that. Like you just had I know you needed a win but it's like that. You almost make you need to rest him more than the win. Almost, yeah.
Meanwhile Jalen Hurd Ruffino not just in the last two games, but really in the last four, really coming out of that Kansas game, which keep remember was the first game he had played after missing three consecutive games due to, you know, what was classified as back spasms. I think it might have actually been more serious than that. This is a guy who in that
four-game stretch starting. Ilan has played at least 30 minutes every game, and in fact, it played 37 minutes and then 35 minutes has raised his offensive rating. His offensive rating was hovering around like .89 or point nine points per possession, which is not great. It's now over one point per possession used. He's also if you take conference play only he is the third-highest assist rate in the entire Big Ten Conference through the four games that have been played.
He's been dishing out a cyst like crazy. Nationwide. He's top 200 in assist rate, which is tremendous. He's also increased his three-point shooting. Now to her, he's 39th in the country in three-point percentage at for almost 48 percent. Like so I know there's been criticism and I understand the criticism and I don't disagree with it about some of his defensive lapses as well.
He had a couple of plays in that Northwestern game where he lost the ball and didn't run after it, you know, and Northwestern ended up with easy layups. But again like You know, somehow gentleman Jaffe knows managed to absorb most of the assist related items that we lost would save your Johnson's injury and has elevated his offensive play. I look at these two guys and I say they can't be super men, they just cannot be. They are they both of them? And I've had my criticisms of
both over the course of time. They both have performed at an otherworldly level offensively and IU has desperately needed that. And the fact that they are also essentially being Expected to play at another worldly, level defensively, highlights something that you mentioned, which is where is the rest of the team at this point. And this is where it's really, you know, to me, I think a real concern and some of it is personnel and some of it is schematic. This is not going to sustain
even to the level that it has. I mean Indiana. Yes, they've lost three of their first four big, ten games but they've, you know, in, you know, the last two they lost them by a combined three points. Not Both the Northwestern game
was especially not acceptable. In the Iowa has its own in its own, special way, losing a 21-point lead but it highlights the paucity of contributions coming from their teammates and this is where yes you have to acknowledge the injury to Xavier Johnson. You have to acknowledge the injury to race Thompson. Those are, those are tough things to come back from. But a home game against Northwestern should not be a showcase for a bunch of players
standing around, on offense. It shouldn't be a Showcase for a lack of energy on defense. It shouldn't be a showcase for subpar rebounding effort. It shouldn't be a situation where you have a starter playing 28, 6 minutes and picking up five points. When that person's primary role is to be an offensive threat, it shouldn't be a situation where a starter Place. Ten minutes score, zero points, commits three fouls and is a negative 16 in the ten. It's that they played in plus minus like that.
You know, on the one hand, it's easy to blame the stars because they're the ones that are most visible, but where, where is the
collective effort? And yes, I realize you've got some younger players and players that are missing some facets to their game, but we're not talking about playing against Purdue. We're not talking about playing against Arizona, we're not talking about playing its Kansas, we're talking about a home game against an offensive ly crippled on most days, Northwestern team and it looked like some of the Players really struggled to even be bothered
with competing at times, except at the very end, by which point it essentially didn't matter. And that is, I think a real concern agree. Well, and the other thing to they mention this on assembly call, you know, for large stretches of the game. Four of our five players were, you know, top 35 recruits. Yep. You know, whether it's Trace, Jackson, Davis, jail Hood, she knows you mentioning Malik, renew and tomorrow, Bates. And then whoever the fifth person was, you know, it's you
have more toys. This is where it gets frustrating because like, I'm okay saying like and I'm not, you know, we both talk about, you were kind of the one be like, hey man, Rucker, that's a tough road game. It's like, okay, it's like Arizona. It's a really good team and you're right, it's like Kansas tough environment. Like, you're writing all those things but then it's like, you know, we can't continue to be.
I'm not saying you're saying this but you can't continue to a car while it's tough place to play. It's like all right. Well northwestern's like at some point. Again not saying you're saying is look at some point. It's like yes. And I know like Malik renews a freshman, he's hit the wall but it's like he's better than guys. Northwestern, like he just is and we have this is not a talent efficiency.
This is this is, you know, this is where I get concerned about the coaching and where we're at and I guess I'll just go macro here is, you know, it's, you see a lot of this, you know, we this was a concern going in is there's not been a lot of success of NBA guys, coming into college because it is just a different style of basketball. I bring up the JLo Hood Cioppino thing because you know, in the NBA you just kind of like hey Going to shoot more 3 since I call.
Right, Tyrese, Halliburton can just get a three or buddy hield can get a three. Like guys can kind of move around and get their own threes, doesn't work that way in college, but you just can't tell Miller cop, like, hey, man, go get some threes like you need to run sets for Miller, cop to get threes. We don't seem to be doing that Jalen who Cioppino again. Got seven threes.
I would say six of them were created by him because he's really good at creating Three's. A great we're not going to we obviously aren't very good at getting a A lot of guys who can
do that. So we need to run plays to get guys more threes because as crazy as it sounds this team is actually not a bad 3-point shooting team but I'm harping on this because it beliles a bigger issue which is like we're not we don't seem to be running set to seems to be and when you hear Woodson talk about things the end of games, I know it's a press conference and coaches are never going to give stuff out but he's like, guys got to play better defense.
Like guys, guys just play better offense. Like, all right. Well, that's kind of the MBA mentality. You also need to run sets for them to do things and I'm, I'm getting concerned because the other thing, too, that you look at is, you know, if you look at our Big Ten schedule this for game stretch, Iowa Northwestern Penn State. Wisconsin. Would you go off the Ken Palm ratings?
This is the easiest stretch. We're going to have like these next two games, Penn State, Wisconsin are really the only two back-to-back games. You have teams above 50 and can pom. We just play the stretch, Iowa Northwestern were, I think it's the only other stretch where we have two teams that are Of 40. And if you add them up, you living Minnesota. Kind of throws things out because they're 191st. But every other matchup of two teams that don't involve, Minnesota, is a tougher matchup
than what we just went through. Yeah. And we lost both of those games. And, you know, we're kind of at, like, you know, we gotta start hitting, you know, panel button, if we can't go to an do in the next two years. So, I'm with you on all of this and I think you know what?
And we talk about these stats on the last podcast about what Indiana stats had been since December first because you know, you look at Indiana stats before, they were like a solid top 25 team on both offense and defense, which equates and ultimately to being like a top 15 team overall, because very
few teams do both. Well, when you add in what happened against Northwestern since December 1st Indiana's defense, Efficiency, the amount of points that they're giving up per Possession. It ranks 140 First in the nation in that time. Period, adjusted for opponents
that is comparatively speaking. Nebraska's averages 25th in the nation, they, they are letting a tenth of a point less per possession up than Indiana is at this point in the same span of taught Indiana's, defense has fallen off a cliff as much as the offense is a problem and I agree to sets are a problem. Indiana does have more Talent this year.
They have shown an ability to kind of brute force their way into points at some point scoring opportunity because they do have better Shooters. Their spacing has been a little bit better, not great, but a little bit better and Trace Jackson Davis has been better on the average with it. What resilient falling down though has been the overall defensive effort of this team now. Yes, you'll also save your Johnson but the team wasn't playing great defense before. Xavier Johnson went down.
You lose race Thompson. Playing poor defense before race
Thompson went down. There is a real effort issue, right now with this team and, you know, this is where, you know, you can, you can criticize effort, you can criticize, you know, I look at it like this and I think we talked about this after the podcast when we were having kind of our post podcast podcast that we always have on Saturday, when you look at most of the really successful teams out there right now, you'll You look at the teams like UConn Tennessee, Houston Kansas, who
we've already seen Purdue Xavier, you know, teams that really like pop by and large. They are demonstrating a level of activity and energy particularly on the defensive end where they are. They look like, they're really into the game. They look like they are really going above and beyond Indiana. Looks catatonic. Oftentimes defensively or they'll Of one or two possessions where like someone Dives on the floor for a ball and Assembly Hall erupts and it's like who effort?
And then that's that's the last time that happens for like five or six minutes and then maybe it'll happen again. It's so inconsistent and you know you look across at you know and this is something we're again. I'm loathe to criticize. Trace Jackson, Davis in jail and rufina right now because they are carrying so much of the offensive burden on this team. But you look at the rest of the
contributors and there either. Making low energy plays or they're making, not very smart plays defensively. And that combination is just not sustainable under any circumstances. And again, I don't think that's entirely players. I don't think it's entirely coaches. I think it's a joint effort. Where something is not penetrating. I have a hard time believing that like, Mike Woodson and his staff aren't telling their players to play hard.
But the way that they're doing it is not penetrating and for the players, I have no doubt that they want to play hard. But somewhere along the way that is not translating into actually playing hard. And, you know, Irish, I've always resist, I hate the word like soft. I think that that's always an an inconsistently applied term, that doesn't really mean anything. There's normally like far more precise things. In this case, it's like, where's the effort?
Why is it feel like you have to be bothered to go do something like, you'll play that way against, like a Purdue, but you won't play that way in an average like run-of-the-mill game. You know, there's no reason why you're up 21 points in a game home or away, and you should come away losing. That game is no reason for it whatsoever. Except that mentally you take
your foot off the gas. You stop defending you stop doing what you need to do. And yeah you can point to individual players here and there and say Well they're making a lot of stupid decisions. There's other players on the bench like there's other ways to go about things. Like, why are those buttons being pushed and or why don't you see like, more concerted effort? Don't lie. That's really what's threatening the season at this point?
Yes, the injuries. Do not help but injuries I mean that's what that's what separates you from title Contender versus, you know, a team that's going to be like in a 6789 seed range, not title Contender and might miss the tournament which right now is where Indiana is at. And, and that's a, that's a hell of a turn around in a five week span of time. No, it's been Sinbad five weeks
Bob, no question. And I think, I think what's giving everybody the heebie-jeebies and again, I'm I'm as guilty of this is like, you know, we're gonna beat just because you know you know produce ranked sixth in can bomb doesn T we can't beat them. But like I mean it's we're not going to lose to everybody who's ranked above us and beat everybody's right below us. So there's going to be some more wins this year. God hoping. But we've seen you know this you've mentioned it.
I heard Jared talked about an assembly call like we've all seen this a couple of years ago. Like this really looks a lot like the Romeo Juwan Morgan season.
We're that team. Some talent but kind of just Sleepwalk through and what can happen is you can lose it, can get off the rails real quick and next thing you know, you're losing 12 of 13 and it's like just the entire season summary and that is what concerns me is. Especially with the way the Big Ten schedule is this year where you're talking three or four days off and you're traveling every single week now. There's no back-to-back home games. There's no kind of get right moment.
You know, this could go off the rails quickly. Yeah. Well that's what that's what concerns me and then. I've won more Huger macro thought, but I'll leave it at that and I'll go to that. This might lead into that macro thought, I don't know. I we do, we never check what we're going to talk about before these things. This is all on the Fly France, it is very own brand. Um, there's a, it's clearly, there's a disconnect with this coaching staff and I'm
disappointed about that. Because last year, it looked like they were making progress towards establishing a team that didn't have the issue. Is that prior IU rosters had demonstrated about not being able to finish games, you know it always we you and I talked on the phone yesterday during the Archie era and and the end of the Korean Air, it always felt like well if Indiana was going to win, it was going to be a
grind. There were very few blowouts in favor of Indiana but Indiana was capable of getting blown out and it happened on on multiple occasions because there were just be days where I you would not show up. And this stretches across three coaches, it stretches across what 40 plus players. The the if you take the record this year that I use a crude in the Big Ten and you add it to the record that I you is accrued starting with cranes final
season. This Indiana team in regular season Big Ten play is fit, I don't know his foot and right now and the podcast now I don't want to know it's 50 and 69 it's a 42% win percentage since the start of Big Ten play in 2017. If you add in Big, Ten tournament games there 54 and 74, which is So 42% like there's no percentage difference there. This is who Indiana is. What's fascinating?
To me is cert is certainly that you know, you have this situation where there's there's a lot of fingers that you can point at the way that the coaching staff thus far has handled this team. You know, they took a nosedive back around the first of December, where they were simply they went from being a really good team, like a Top 15 caliber team at the beginning of the year to being essentially, a team that would be on the outside looking in.
I think if the tournament draw were to happen today. So you can certainly point the finger at the coaching staff this year, but this is a multi generational problem. Now, with IU basketball stretching back to when crane was still here where I you just doesn't seem like they care at the end of the day on the floor as much as many of the teams
that they play. Now, some of that is stylistic some of that is There are teams that are, I think recruited for a particular system that works in the Big Ten better than
Indiana has. And that's part and parcel with having three different coaches, that's three different philosophies that you're trying to construct but it's just curious that I you of all programs, the the Blue Blood of the Big Ten would have a 42% win percentage that stretches over an hour six and you know almost six and a half years span and they're not be a Real like accounting for that. Like what is it? Like, it can't be this Coach Sucks. Therefore that's the problem.
Because again, it stretches over multiple coaches. It stretches over multiple types of players. There isn't really a Common Thread other than this is always, this is now suddenly always happening at Indiana and that's both not acceptable, but it's also really curious like why that would be he like what like what's the root cause of it? Because it can't just be one thing. Yeah, I don't you are 100% right? I don't have an answer.
I will say this and this is kind of the we've gotten into like sometimes our discussion after the Pod is is deeper than a dirt like, so I'm just going to bring some after pod discussion to on the Pod because that's what the whole point of this podcast was is that this is a freight. Everyone likes to be right in retrospect, but it's harder to be right in the moment and not saying I'm, right. And by the way, I caveat this, I'm not saying anybody should be like fired or any of that now.
Just like just hear me out. But you know, a common frame that we hear a lot is, you know, he got again. We kept creating, you know, just too long, we kept Archie too long. Well, okay, Creed and 2013 had the number one ranked team. Like that's he's going to be fine after that, but he was here, Four Seasons after that 14 15 16 17. And so if you're going to say he stayed around too long, like that's a three-year window.
Like if you're going to say like because obvious you're not going to fire him after, he was the number one team in the country. But the, you know, and I've heard that a lot like crane was here too long. II don't disagree. But it's like that's three years of mediocrity. See, Archie was here for years. We're like some people like Archie was here. You got me messed up? We left him here too long. It's like, okay.
Then we've been using that logic, you should have made a change after three years knows, obvious and noticeable. I think what concerns me and we need to realize this real-time is a lot of those warning signs are things that we're seeing right now, like getting blown out, losing to Northwestern, hoping all the things we just talked about. And so both of those guys, Create an Archie. You could also say deserved a little more benefit of the doubt
because they were younger. So like if Archie were been able to turn it around or be good, it's like well, now we got a guy in his mid-40s. You can be here for another 25 years, Woodson. Just by the way, time works doesn't have that as an advantage. And so, I would just say again, I'm not saying not that I have the power to call for anything, or we should be calling for
heads. I'm just saying that if you're retroactively one of those people who says, we kept crying too long and that screw things up, we kept our chew too long and screw things up then, and if this Season continues to go down the tubes and we don't turn things around very quickly and make the tournament then, like, honestly next year should be, you know, a culmination year to either get the grade or not for Woodson. And that's just, that's kind of
what's been rattling around in my head is that, you know, that's, my concern is that people are going to be kind of like, well, it's give them a couple more, like give him a couple more years again and suddenly he's here, 34 feel for 56 years, it just looking back. Everybody that we say was here Long. It was for years and it's like time goes by quickly, like data this year will be at two years, so it's just, I'm just throwing that out there or something to
think about that. We got to get this back on track very quickly because you missed the tournament this year. You know, that's, I don't want to keep going with that thought, but that's just the thoughts of rattling around my head. I mean, it's tough because there's clearly it's an injury affected team but as we just talked about the issues are she had an indirect in season? Well, I mean well and issues aren't that the injuries as much as they are. The Bert. And the plan because it doesn't
seem to be a plan. There doesn't see. I don't know what the identity of this team is, I really don't like, I know, I've been saying that for a while, even we were doing well, that's kind of a question we have. Yeah, it's like well. Okay. What direction are they going to go with this and look?
I, you know, Woodson, you know, so much seems to be hinging on what he's does in recruiting and I look and I'm predisposed to like Woodson, I think I'm predisposed to like the idea of Woodson coaching I think That he brings a lot to the table. What does you know? What's interesting about this era? Is, it's hard to use the excuse of? Well, I don't have my guys in yet, when you look at the roster, okay?
Trace Jackson Davis is clearly an Archie player, but then you start going and race Thompson's in Archie player, but you start going down the list. Like we all liked them, too. So that's not a bad thing. Jalen, atrophy know. That's a, that's a Woodson guy. Xavier Johnson. That was a Woodson Guy, brought him in the transfer portal. Renew, that's a Woodson guy Banks. Woodson By tomorrow Bates, Woodson guy was brought in as a recruit pick up when Shaka left. Texas.
Jordan Geronimo. He's not really a Woodson guy, but they had an opportunity to let Geronimo walk in the portal this year and they actively told him to come back. At least that's how it was presented. CJ gun, Woodson guy, cop, Woodson guy Galloway. I mean he's a he's a he's an Archie guy. So I guess he's kind of in the middle but he's starting right now, you know, it's just like you go down the roster.
Not like it's populated by a bunch of guys who would send didn't bring in it. You know, I'd say it's probably slightly more guys that Woodson brought in either, you know, through the portal or in recruiting. Is it a younger team? Well, yes and no it is now because they're having to play a bunch of guys that weren't expecting to play, but even then it's not really. I mean, like, Tres Jackson Davis is in his fourth year.
Like tomorrow, Bates is, you know, middle of a sophomore year, like that's not what I would consider a young guy, man. It's like and and it's like, okay, you can make that excuse, I think, okay, you losing it Iowa, whatever, but you're at home against Northwestern like this is a Northwestern team that while they're not terrible. They're, they're also, as you mentioned, that's essentially probably maybe the third worst team that you're going to play in Big Ten.
Play clearly Minnesota's worse than them clearly. And maybe coming out of Nebraska is clearly worse than the but they're worse than them. Statistically that's that's about the bottom of the rung. Rung of the ladder and it does worry me. And I think, you know, what, you and I were talking about yesterday that I don't have an answer to, but I do think it's important just to just to make sure those of you were listening.
We're not advocating anybody getting fired when advocating at changes in Direction per se, but it is an interesting thought,
process. When you look at the successful programs that are out there right now, Most of them not every single one but most of them has a coach in place that has been there for a while now that has built up structures that has a direction and I don't know that you're going to be able to get to that point with Woodson, given his age and given the fact that he's not a coaching lifer on the college level, this isn't exactly what you know, like this is not the
world, he came from, this is a difficult model to get your head wrapped. Around because it is different than the pros. You're doing different things, you need different things out of players, you know, your program needs to do different things and it just it's very tricky to look at that and say, okay, this is sustainable.
And if you if you're going to miss the tournament this year in a year where you were expected to contend for the Big Ten title, yes, certainly injuries are creating problems but It's one thing to not contend for the title. It's another thing to look like you can't contend for anything and you know, if the team rights the ship and wins two games this week, we're not talking about any of this.
What is concerning though? I guess is this, you know the what led the team to lose both of the games was an attention to detail and as much as, you know, bob Knight and his disciples of always preached. This idea about preparation, being the key and is as much as we still have this memory of night, coached teams being better prepared and having the will to win as well as the will to prepare to win.
You know, the reality is more often than not thus far with what we've seen out of Woodson's teams is very similar to what we saw out of Archie's teams and very similar to what we saw out of a lot of those Korean teams which was teams that look like on some days they're ready to roll and on other days look like they can't really be bothered and what I see in a lot of new hires. And hires with older coaches is if it's going to change that changes pretty quickly.
You know, it's and it's why I got excited about the first month of the season because it looked like that and changed, it looked like oh this team really looks locked in this team looks like yeah there's some flaws that have to be fixed but this team looks like it's going to fight for 40 minutes. That's what that's what we saw in that game at Xavier and for it to just categorically disappear, the way that it has doesn't bode well for what is likely to be a very difficult.
Big Ten campaign, I would love to, I love this, Woodson thing to work out, and I just wonder why this team looks like, it's just reverted right back to where it was for the bulk of the regular season last year, and where it was at the previous season and where it was at, for a large part of the Season before that, as well, that doesn't, that really should be setting some Panic alarms off because that is that's not going to work. It hasn't worked in the Big Ten.
That's why you missed as many NCAA. Tournaments as they did in a row and it's why they're at this point early on in the Big Ten granted.
But it's why at this point, they, you look at them versus most of the other teams in the conference that would be NCAA contenders and it's like, I don't see a lot out of Indiana right now, that's making me think they're gonna be able to rise above not, you know, not just the Purdue's and the Michigan State's but like Maryland who has sucked the last month, you know, lost five out of seven games lost. Just, you know, got destroyed by Michigan on the road.
Got destroyed by Rutgers. They turn around on Sunday at home and they beat an Ohio State team by seven points. That was you know, that's top 15 and Ken palm. And, you know, took Purdue down to the wire. Like that's the response that you need. And I you doesn't look like they're up to the task of answering it even against a Northwestern and yes, again injuries, caveat it. But that's a real problem. I think. And I don't know what the answer
to that isn't. It doesn't sound like in the postgame press conference that Woodson had a whole Out of answers for it either, and that really does concern me. Yeah. I mean the pot I'll put want to end it on negatives but I will, but that the positive is you know, if you can go to and own your next games all this changes, you know, there's this is a little bit of, you know, like shot. React, we go forward, one in.
Your next five games that changes, I would love to see the IU fan, who's willing to bet a thousand dollars on those results. Because I think that's why we're doing this here, you know, the things that do that also concern me, that give me a lot of pause is, you know, I really Like you know, coached on Sony on assembly call. And this is I'm not knocking him at all.
Just when he said this, it freaked me out in the in the post game yesterday is talking about how you know, you know, we'd see more probably CJ gun some more Loken Duncan because he's like, this is a Reba, this is a training year or rebuilding year and I don't, I'm not it's whether he's right or wrong, might even go ahead. It's just like the idea of like, wow, okay, I respect what he sees.
And for him to just be like yeah like we're this is not even a year, we're going to compete but we're just we got to get young guys, some reps, we can be better next year. It's like it was a shot across my bow. It's like I am not here to say agreed.
This was like, wow, like that. Could be what we're looking at is like this is like and what's frightening is with the Woodson idea again it's not like you're hiring a young guy who like going to take some time, like all right, we can kind of, you know, so to speak, piss away a year on training because we're building something here, it's like the whole idea with Woodson is like Like he'll come in, get the Indiana thing.
Get a couple recruiting like we'll get some quick hits of a couple years just making the tournament being good. Then it's like then we can hand off a respectful program to somebody else. The idea of a guy who I think even in the best case we're all thinking has six or seven years here. It's like to just be kind of like we're going to piss one of these away. Like early cream years is like that was never anything. I thought was going to be in our options here and I'm not saying
it's happening yet. Yeah, but it does when you look at the schedule and you look at where we're at, At it, we are still in the tournament if they picked it today but we're trending in the absolutely wrong direction. And you know this is where again this you know it's this is this is really where you were in your money and it's really tough to turn these things around and you really got to dig in and put an absolute ton of work in to get a team turned around.
And this is where it's like I really hope Woodson and the staff is able to do that because I'm concerned. Well yeah. And on that. Yeah. No, I agree and I guess I'll just come back to a different version of the same roof ain't refrain. Which is that your best win in the last month. Since you know since December 9th is a 14-point win against Kennesaw State a team that you struggled against were trailing for a bit.
You just were down by double digits, for most of the game against Northwestern. Team that I is going to struggle
to make the tournament. I don't know what you're supposed to feel good about and I don't know what the excuse would be with those sorts of performances, because it doesn't feel like this, you know, it's not like you're missing your for top scorers, you've got an All-American candidate and you've got a starting guard, who is at this point, probably a fringe first round second round draft pick. Like, is certainly in the Pro conversation.
Like there are teams that would kill for that level of talent. Who are outperforming that level of talent. Talent and and it just, you get such inconsistent contributions from the rest of the roster. Is that the roster you thought you were going to have. No. But why do you need an ideal roster for guys who are out there to give the level of effort needed to win games? This has been the problem with Indiana, the lack of consistency
of effort. Again, it stretches across multiple coaches multiple rosters. It's not pointing the finger at any one person, but it is at this point. It's Mike Woodson's job. It's this coaching staffs roll. And I I'm certain they are doing everything they can to try to fix this but I'm very fascinated by why it is not working like what what is the disconnect it
shouldn't be? Like the the level of and we've seen this with certain players and is no point in naming them because I think we've all watched the games like why are you having to like Kajol? And I felt this way at the end of the night are, you know? And it's not like it's a limited here. I mean, you go back and watch
those tapes. Tapes from 96 97, even into 98 a little bit and it's like, why is it such an you know, a huge undertaking to try to get a level of effort that exceeds your opponent when your opponent is generally an inferior, talented team, probably you know, a team that we would, you know, in our arrogance is IU fans would look down our noses upon. And it's like, well, that's all well and good. But they won the game and Indiana didn't, and it's worse now.
Because, at least those teams were Finishing 500 or better in the conference Indiana's, a 42% team in the conference for the last seven years. I think of the greatest quote for you know the the night you know, 1985 when he's pissing the locker room screaming I'm tired of F and losing to Purdue and I'm tired. It's like yeah. We're to point out is I'm tired of losing Northwestern, right? Tired of losing to Rutgers like. Yeah.
I'm tired of losing to, like, half the bottom of the Big Ten know that that stat is, is frightening. I want to end on this question for you. A question. I never thought I would ask this season. And, but how important is it for Indiana to make the tournament this year? Now let's not talk about if they will or Camp it. Like you know, what is, how is, how important is that if we miss a tournament? What does that do? I never, well, we need to be thinking about that.
I mean, look, it's Indiana. It's important to make the tournament every year. I mean it should be. And the that's when I look at the roster, I guess here's what concerns mean. First of all, this is an arrow that nobody knows. We don't know exactly. We how college basketball works? Now, because with the portal, it is theoretically possible to bring a bunch of new players in change over the roster. What concerns me is, you know, even if the expectations were slightly too high or moderately
too high. This is a team that went on a run at the end of last season. They made the tournament as it turned out. Barely there in the play-in game, they chose to bring back a bunch of players. Is that they could have moved on from with the idea that this core was going to be a core that could move things forward and get Indiana back to a level of respectability. Like they chose to have all of these players on the roster.
There was a lot of excitement among the coaching staff among others around the program about how good this could be. It is to me, it's vitally important that they make the tournament, and they very well, might still, I mean, Ken pom is projecting them at 10 and 10 in the conference, you know?
So it's not like the, you know, it's not like the season's over or anything like that, you know, now it depending on the thing that you're looking at, in terms of like the projected record liked, or Vic's already got Indiana dropped to nine and eleven. That's, that's starting to get into danger territory. But going back to your point about what our friends over at assembly.
Call said, if this is somehow turning into a rebuilding year or a building toward next year year, you're going to have an entirely different roster or a largely different roster in terms of who the primary people are next year, most likely, if that's the case. So what are you really building? Like it's this is not like, hey we've got this core of like baby Hoosiers that we have to grow and cultivate as you said you've got you've got a lot of experience on this roster.
You've got a lot of guys in roles that you're relying on and what bothers me is. You know you've got Certain players who by this point should have been able to step into full-time roles, who should have been antsy to get out there and be full timers. And then when they've gotten the opportunity haven't been able to actually provide the requisite performance on the offensive and defensive sides of things. And that's to me like if that's the case, what are you building
towards? Because a year-and-a-half essentially of prepping people and getting them in that direction you should have either been able. To get them to the point where they could contribute when they come in now, or if you couldn't, you probably should have moved on from them in the offseason and gotten some people in who Could because we've seen programs across the country, do one of the other. And the fact that Indiana at this point is struggling with both injuries taken into
account. With that I don't think anything excuses, losing the Northwestern. Barely beating Kennesaw State blowing a 21-point lead at Iowa like that. Those are things that I refuse to think that will Oh gosh, we're just too injured to have kept any of those things from happening that, if that's the case, then I am really concerned. And I'm just, I keep holding out hope in my mind that this was just some big Swoon, but you get hit in the face with, you know,
Visual Evidence enough times. You start to wonder if that's actually the reality as opposed to the exception. I'll just one more minute. This is an after the Pod discussion on the Pod, it your stat boggles my mind like again that just going through those that that's that. I'm just playing and Ken Palm right now. Kind of being like, you know, when was the last time we were?
Because we always say we're projected at 10 and 10 this year it's like what was the last time we were above 500 in the Big Ten and looking back? I know you're like encyclopedic knowledge, you know, but it's like I will say my son, Grayson, who I love who's in first grade was born in. He's six years old now, he was born in June of 2016. He's never seen Indiana. Finish above 500 in the Big Ten. It was 2016 Yogi's Big 10. Here and then what's weird is
going back. I'm just, like while you're talking, I'm also playing around on Kenta I'm listening to you and Tenley 99% of attention to you 1% to Ken bomb.
I'm like, how many years of the, you know, since 2002 have we finished above 500, the Big Ten and again there's a crean, there's a gap there with like we were really bad ever say I'm saying, like, you always have to factor that in but what boggles my mind is that you get down it's like oh it kind of changes like near the end, there were a bunch of years above 500 like the end of the day. The Sarah Davis finishes in 05, he's tenant. Exit and 07 in 06.
He's nine and seven and it's like, nobody would sit here and say, you know, Mike Davis is at that point. His career was the best X's and O's coach. And a great program manager, like not here to kick on Davis. But it's like it at Indiana with what you have and with what we have on this roster, it's not. It shouldn't be this hard to go 500 in the Big Ten like we're not asking for national titles, right? Asking for a blue blood unless
you're big tent. Titles like for f sake, going 500, the Big Ten and I continue to look at that Samson years, it's like two years back to back just you know, somebody who comes in who obviously knows what he's doing were 10 and 6, and then were 14 and four and that's without him finishing a year. It's well, it's even mind-boggling again. This is crean Archie Woodson, like it, this is a cross, but it's like, why is this so GD?
Hard for us to just get Above 500 in the Big Ten because right now, it looks like we're going to claw to get to 10 and 10. Well and this is what I was going to mention real quick. Like, you look at each of the last several years, you look at the high watermark for Indiana in the conference. This is what I think really, what concerns me the most both about both about Woodson and about the players, it's not one
or the other. Yeah, last year Indiana's, high-water Mark in, the conference was, they were seven and four. It was at the end of January, there's 16 and 5, overall, they beat Maryland that Maryland, they were on it, they won four out of five. They were seven and four. They finished at Big Ten season 9 and 11. They lost five games in a row. After that, you go to the covid year Indiana's, high-water, Mark in the Big Ten that year I guess, was seven and seven.
They beat Minnesota at home Wednesday, the 17th and then they lost their next five. Finished 7 and 12 and then lost in the Big Ten tournament in 2020 there. That's like somebody who drowns is like the your high water mark is right before. Well, your last Gap severe? But yeah. In 20 in 2020, their high water mark, they beat Michigan State at home. They were five and three. They finished that season in the Big 10 9 and 11 in 94 neuro after that high water.
You know, in 2019 they were 3 and 0. They beat Illinois at home in January 3rd and then they proceeded to lose, they proceeded to lose 11 of the excuse me, 12 of the next 13 and they finished eight and 12 in conference play that year the previous year. They're high water mark, they were five and three. They beat Maryland at home January 22nd and then they finished Nine and Nine. Now you can do you want to argue that their high water, mark was actually nine and seven fine.
They lost their last two That season, you know, in creams last year, their high water mark was Four and Twenty they finished 7-Eleven, you know, that season. So this is become unfair, and I'm sorry if this is depressing the listeners, but it's cathartic for me and I think, maybe for Scott this is, this is Indiana. This is the DNA of Indiana. It is it and I it's it is again, it's not one coach, it's not one player, it's not one roster. This is the DNA of Indiana right
now. It is a program that loses a bunch of games in conference against better prepared, better coached higher effort, higher energy teams and what's yes Indiana's had injuries. Guess what a lot of other teams have injuries as a lot of other teams out there that lose starters and it is on the one hand, we try to be supportive, you know, as much as we can. But we also try to be realistic,
it's unreal. It's unreasonable to expect fans or people like us that have to follow the games and try to come up with comment on them to just be like, oh you know, we'll get them next time. That's that's not realistic. Like your yes. Certainly you're gonna have people do that but this happens year after year after year with all of this change over it's like what's the real problem? Why is this continuing to happen? Why, Why Can't This be addressed?
And I don't think there's a good answer. I know you don't have an answer. I see people debating this all the time. I don't think that they have answers either, maybe it's all just one big coincidence, but it makes it so that it's essentially not a very fun program to follow because, you know, you just you keep you keep banging your head against the same roof over and over and over
again. And you keep getting told, oh, it's different this time and it's not and there's never any explanations given as to Oh, why? It's always going to be better next year until it's not. And then it's just well, we're gonna have to wait next year. This is essentially Cubs fandom in the 70s and 80s in basketball form and it's certainly not what people like to, like, claim Indiana, basketball is, but I got news for people, This is Indiana basketball. No, you're, you're right.
Like, this is your right. And then, what, what concerns me is again. I want Woodson to work. I like it but it's like, this is a Herculean effort. This is something that's going to take a ton of work. Like you said, you probably got to tear this down to the studs without going forward. 13 in the Big Ten.
It's like, find a way to change the everything that's been going on. It's like is a guy who's, you know, in his mid-60s, have the effort and interest in doing that and doing a full system rebuild on the Fly. Is he able to not knowing it? It's white. Like, I mean, yeah. It's it's clear. It's clear. Yeah. It's clear. He's able to recruit players like jail and put your fee. No, that's good. But there's more to it than that as we're seeing where it's like
for this to work at any program. It's like how have you constructed the collective will. And and what I guess what, I'm getting irritated with Woodson about as inclined as I am to be supportive of them. It's every time this team loses, its like, I just got to get these guys over the hump. What's the hump? Is the hump giving a crap about the game is the hump executing. What's I mean? Tres Jackson Davis in the postgame press conference.
After this Northwest It was like, I thought coach had a good game plan and we didn't follow it. Well, that's a real problem. Like that's that's your captain. That's a guy who's been there for five years saying, well, we didn't execute the game plan, the coaches gave us now, maybe the game plan wasn't great, but for a captain to come out and say that, I mean, I admire Trace Jackson Davis for coming out and saying that. But my God, like that's a real
issue. And so I don't know what the answer is because it's not just about going out and picking up some recruits which I think Woodson has done to his credit. It's not just about Grabbing guys out of the portal which he's done you, you know, I'm not this isn't rocket science but you got to like there has to be a collective energy and cohesion and you know, for all the people that salivate over the program that painters got at Purdue, that's what they salivate over.
I mean it's not, it's certainly not the final four appearances, but it's but it's but it's this, this Collective will that Purdue is able to demonstrate and yes, you're going to lose game. You're Gonna Lose a home game to Rutgers occasionally but you're also going to win a game when your backs against the wall. Ohio State, you know, you're funny, you mentioned Purdue and I thought of the injuries. I just going through, you know
you always know. Just I remember just you know the Hummel injury it's like oh God you know he could never stay healthy but it's like they still never finished under 500 in the Big Ten, even the years that he was out for an ACL, the entire year. Like I know, I know they had a really good team around him, but I think that's the point here is that show. Do we like, we still, you still have an All-American on the court and Trace Jackson Davis, who is playing it at all at all American level.
Like you have a freshman who's playing I'm at the highest level. I've seen a freshman play. She's probably Eric Court. Well, I'm like in the last three games, like he's at the highest. It's just like and it's not an in have those pieces there and it's not an NBA thing, Juwan Howard, and his four years, you know, the his first year, they would have been a succeed. If there had been a tournament as second year, they went to the elite eight and we're a one
seed. In this third year, they were in 11c that made it to the Sweet 16. I mean, it's like it's again another program where you look at them and it's like you know, there's some collective will there, there's there, you know, and I mean, Michigan wasn't great. Sure. But hey. Guess what they did? They finished over. 500 in the Big Ten. Yeah. So I mean they beat us in some hell yeah. And we beat them in the big in the Big Ten tournament and then watch them go to the Sweet 16
and then beat a Tennessee team. That was better than they were and I mean, it's again and I'm just using them as an example. You could point that example at with a bunch of other teams as well. I am fascinated. Always the the intellectual part of me is like why is it why is it become that? In Indiana is essentially the team we all laughed at 25 years ago.
It's wild but that's where they are at and until something changes and I thought that this year from the evidence of the first month it's like finally we're on this pathway right back to where Indiana was last year and the year before, and the year before, and the year before, and the year before it is funny to think. I don't know this happen but just hear me out. It's filled. It did seem to change so much after the North Carolina.
It'd be funny if you're like, you know, Scot Olson on, you know, after that game is a guy. I'm just gonna take a month-long Cruise, like, I know, I got a Tom, Tom Allen problem, but like, I'm just gonna take a cruise, but come back and like, we're just gonna, you know, get my head right. Cuz I gotta deal with this Tom Allen thing in the next two years and like, but everything else is going to be a basket. Everything else is good, you come back.
And it's like well there's three alarm fires everywhere. It's like like, Mike, Mike and use you to keep stuff together, like, I can't deal with both of you, my programs needing Possible Cochise has to say we're like, can one of you be the good kid like please. I need one of you to be the
good. It's just it's just, you know, it's disappointing because I know I and I look I know everybody on the program was really excited about this year and, you know, I'm the fan base was certainly excited about this year. You know, interest is it was through the roof and I've yet to hear any good explanations as to why things have gone off the rails because I just don't buy that. The injury situation is that severe. Because again it's like teams
deal. This stuff, you know, it's not it's not helpful, but it does, it does shouldn't like, result in what we've seen and that, you know, maybe it turns around like you said, and hopefully they're they beat Penn State on the road and that starts a. Yeah, but I mean, I just I'll say this like, Rutgers is really good and, but like Iowa went into Rutgers and one, there's like that and we lost at Rutgers back when we had raised Thompson Xavier John Suite of jail his
feet. Oh, it's like We had most of the team they're like and we still got not only lost. We've got like just demolished at Rutgers. Yeah. And it can be done and you know we had. Yeah so I'm you know we anyway. Yeah. So then not a whole lot else to say we've probably talked too much anyway at this gas but anyway, we'll be back. Will, you know, obviously I you plays at Penn State Fast and Furious. I mean, like now it's like your help.
You know, you're in it, you've got, you've got, you've got Penn State coming up on Wednesday, you At Wisconsin, at home on Saturday, you're at Illinois on Thursday, you got Michigan State at home on Sunday, and then you get a little bit of a break, kind of going to the barn and playing a pretty hapless Minnesota team, but then you got to come right back and you got Ohio State at home. You're at Maryland, you got Purdue at home and you got Rutgers at home.
Like that is, you want to talk about the potential for things to, you know, go off the rails over the cliff and into the ocean. This is when it will happen. If it's Going to happen and that should be really concerning and I think I guess the if there's a there's a main theme of this podcast this episode of the podcast.
It's that if this team plays like they did against Kennesaw State Iowa and Northwestern against that slate of opponents, they're going to be like one in seven in that stretch. And, you know, we're just talking about this on Saturday, where it's like, well, you know, the Northwestern the right, the ship and if they can go 500 in this, Maybe that's a win.
Now you're really talking about this is where you could be 11 and 11 during at the end of this stretch, you do for your overall record and I hope it doesn't happen and I hope that some stuff gets figured out between now and when the team gets on the court in State College in a couple of days so we'll see what happens. Yeah, anyway on that jury. No, we're done. Thanks to our friends at home. Feel the barrel and the rest of the back home network. Thanks to you Scott. Thanks to my wife.
I blew off cooking some pasta tonight, so hopefully I get forgiven and get a chance to eat. We'll catch you. Folks on the flip side, be sure to tune into the women's basketball show with Amanda Foster. That'll drop on Tuesday. I said, we'll catch you on the flip side, I'll say it again. Bring back the Bison, so everybody, Thanks to my wife. I blew off cooking some pasta tonight, so hopefully I get forgiven and get a chance to eat.
We'll catch you. Folks on the flip side, be sure to tune into the women's basketball show with Amanda Foster. That'll drop on Tuesday. I said, we'll catch you on the flip side, I'll say it again. Bring back the Bison, so everybody,