You're listening to the back home network, presented by home field. Apparel, welcome back to Crimson, Cask ale and clavius got Caulfield joining. You once again, it is the 13th of December Tuesday night here as Indiana in the midst of a lull.
In terms of men's basketball coming off that loss in Las Vegas against the Arizona. Wildcats, they get a week off and then they face the Kansas Jayhawks coming up, this Saturday. We're going to talk a little bit about that game or talk a lot about the game, and the overall experience in Las Vegas. And we'll kind of see where things take us from there. Scott, how are you doing?
I'm good, we're both back. We made it back from Vegas and one piece we did indeed make it back in one piece and it's nice because it was a Trip enjoyable. A lot of I you fans out there and buy you fans, you know what was obvious not just I you fans out there but so much home-field apparel out there and just a reminder that home field apparel is a presenting sponsor the back home network. I mean it was it was like an I was like a home-field apparel convention.
It really was. I mean, you saw pretty much everything in the home field IU catalog about ten times over. And what was great was you saw a lot of Designs, you know, the same designs, the Bison hoodie was pretty popular, but then you had people, I you fans in the IU diaspora coming up and be like wow man, that's cool that what a nice retro design and then you got to I got to tell the home-field story and all of that
and that was, that was great. So we had a group more home field gear than I saw Arizona face. Yeah, I do not kidding. It's true that there were, there were probably, I would say, at least for home field shirts for every Arizona fan. In Las Vegas during that time period and maybe some are maybe some home field are are you know, home field, sellers cells, Arizona also but I joked it's
like the thing. I saw the most it was Rodeo greater than I. You fans greater than I should add home-field apparel greater than Arizona fans. Yes. And it was one of those things where you looked around and the people that weren't in home-field apparel, it was like you need to get in the home
field apparel. And so, if you're one of those people who is does not own a home field piece of a Peril that with Indiana stuff on it. You can go to home field, apparel.com use the code home 15 percent off your first order. So be sure to do that home field apparel our presenting sponsor here at the back home network, and with Crimson cast, so Scott, you know, we'll talk about the game in a second, but let's talk about the ambience of this event.
This was, I guess it was called The Clash or something along those lines. It was a to, Game event. Both of them happened on the same day on Saturday. Indiana was the second game but it was a lot of fun just in
general. I mean there was a really cool Vibe not just in the MGM Grand in Las Vegas but really kind of anywhere you went on this trip, you saw I you people, you know, I there were we went to the the Michael Jackson Cirque show my wife and I did and they do this thing before that show, where they've got like this kind of Paparazzi, like tab, Floyd
theme. And they would they take pictures of just people in the crowd and they kind of super impose their faces Behind these kind of mock, laugh tabloid headlines. And there was like prominently a guy with like an IU shirt in one of these, he kept popping up and I didn't I didn't like connect with me at first is like wow like how how did how did an IU fan?
Get that prominently in a tabloid but you know, obviously was part of the show but it was all over the place crazy to the point that after the game, I was at a restaurant listening to an Arizona fan. Playing bitterly about how many IU fans, they saw all over the place but we got a chance to see a lot of friends, a lot of people who listen to the podcast and so you know, hopefully if you got a chance to come up and say hi to one or both of us, we got a chance to say hi back to
you. Just a really cool Vibe all the way around for I you fans out there during this thing. No, it was, it was awesome. I was there with one of my best friend's Teddy. I don't get to see very often. He's a listener of the Pod but also A great friend of mine from high school from La. So it's fun hanging out with him. It was wild like we're having
dinner the first night. I think it cube steak and MGM and then a guy I know comes up and like, we're talking and he's like, oh yeah, you know, Dean Garrett around here. I'm like, oh, that's interesting. And then we walk out, we're walking through the coat casino and it's like, there's Dean Garrett. Oh my God, deidara like hey dude, what's up and talk to him for a couple minutes, we went to a pregame thing.
We're both Dean Garrett and Jared Jeffries were there, but he said there was Fats. I was actually coming out of my the elevator and That's when the the mob of like IU fans, was rushing to the lobby, to watch the team walk out. That was kind of cool to see this like IU mob moving. No, it was the minute we landed. It's like, wow, there's just a lot of people with IU gear to the point that I was telling my
buddy Teddy at some point. Like, not, I think I assume they all went, but it's like, not everybody. I'm seeing, can go to The Venue because the seat the spice doesn't seat 35,000 people, but not a lot of fans, I get to give to shout outs there as one my butt. Teddy. And I were talking about how the one thing home field needs to sell. I was wearing the new IU jacket which is awesome.
I wish they would start selling the the shooting shirt so you can see by the Candy Stripes like both heading our lamenting, like I love the shooting shirt, the red with the IU and the script in the back, like, Adidas sold it for like two and a half weeks and then they just stopped selling it shocking. So we're talking. Yeah, we're talking about that. And then I see a guy, a guy in his I'm assuming girlfriend or wife, but if it wasn't either, I'm sorry for selling you out.
But Go like she's got one like I hate. You're wearing them the crazy guy yelling at everybody gave like that's the shirt. Like where'd you get that? And she's kind of like my sister gave it to me that he's like, are you Scott from Crimson cast of like? Yeah. It's like the voice. Like the voice. I heard it. I'm like, well good because I'm just some crazy man yelling at your you're frightened. And what's funny is like then
that night went to dinner set. Oddly next to Gus Johnson like two seats down from Gus Johnson. At the bar did not talk to because I do you think this are I would have like two more minutes you Think it's like a cool job. Like you did, you haven't broadcasting but it's like it's 10:00 about East Coast times, like I'm wiped out. I can only imagine Gus Johnson and like he's just sitting at the bar of Gordon Ramsay's restaurant there.
And like just trying to eat like used tell he wants to eat like every single phase. Coming up to him a gas from the game. Was that a goaltend? It's like I felt bad for the dude. Like, I wanted to talk to her. Like I'm not a dick, let the man eat in peace, but he couldn't do that. And then it's like I'm tired. I think about my buddy. I get in the elevator. I'm just like, I am. As close to e is I'm going to be and then the guy just the elevators, like your scarf from Crimson cap.
It greatly. Hey, family. Hey like this. So, like I'm not a celebrity. This is like, hey, man, I'm so happy you listened but it's like, who's that guy? And he's from Iowa, but I'm just like you saw me at my, that was the least amount of a couch just about to fall asleep in the but no, it's so nice to talk people who listen to the podcast. I also had a guy at a bar who was like way drunk like talking about how he needs to get on fentanyl or something else like what podcast.
Are you like I'm typing it in and his phone. So it was it was everything you expect from Vegas and more and all I say, if you haven't traveled for an IU event, like, do it, it's fun. Like, I've got a bunch you and I've been to a bunch, you know, gator boy with the thing in Brooklyn. And while back like I haven't seen a lot of wins. I was thinking about like, but it's still a ton of fun being with your eye, you Brethren.
I love how you casually just blew off like maybe breaking a guy's marriage up in that last vignette there. It's, that's that It gets good, good form on your part. No, it was great. Actually. It's funny. I was leaving the arena which that was story in and of itself and one-star Yelp review. I do question I suck. I was walking by this group of younger, I you fans and I said something.
And one of them's like your Galen from Crimson gas and immediately like where's Scott and like we travel is it as a pair or something like that. I guess maybe that's what people think the other Rosencrantz and Guildenstern of the IU podcasting, seen throwing him off - I said you're with Your wife like this is Scott like he's had a major change. No, that's wild for her keys, but no, it was a great time and I really enjoyed getting a chance to see everybody having.
It's it's just it's just kind of cool all the way around. So anyway let's talk about the the game itself. Because obviously yeah go ahead Arena. Just 3 4 p.m. what were their you'll appreciate this, but those who aren't you, can just like the MGM Grand Garden Arena.
So first off Watching, there's the first game which is UNLV versus Washington state, which I feel bad for because we had tickets for everybody who was there at tickets for that game and everyone, there was an IU fans, they must have played in front of nobody, kind of bad, bad set up there. But we're at this pregame party watching that game on TV and it's like the court says Mandalay Bay and but by putting Teddy's like, aren't we going to the MGM for the game?
Like, yes, it is. Were walking to the game. He's like, are you sure? We're going the right place. I'm like, I was 100% sure. I'm now 80% sure the axis app to use the tickets you and I were both concerned to the minute that whether you're going to get there.
But I've been in a ton of Arenas, you've been an even more Arenas. First off they ran out of beer like we're in Vegas. They ran out of beer before the game started, which is Bonkers. I've never been to an arena that does numbering where you walk in, and it's like, even numbered sections are on the left odd. Number sections are on the right. So, like, left side was like, Sections 8. I think it was actually odd. It's like sections 357. So we are in section 19. A buddy. Texted me.
Like we're in section 20. I'm like, yeah, you're not next to me. You're a cross. It's the weirdest system of numbering for an arena I have ever seen in my life and PS it doesn't work. Well, yeah, it was. And I tell you the worst part was getting out of there after the game, they took the entirety of the arena and had them go through essentially, two doors, to get out. I would just Just do the garage.
We would like there was a back door like an emergency exit that people to start of funneling through. So we were lucky, we went out the garage and came out like a side street and walked up edge of the MGM Grand outside and got away but it looked like it sucked. We see we tried that and then they chased us back out of the fire. The, the emergency exits.
So we had to we got stuck in the big morass of people getting out of there but anyway, between them running out of beer in pregame and us not being able to leave the arena. There was a game. And so, we talked about that, obviously a disappointment for Indiana as they end up. Losing this game, 89, 275. This was projected to be a much closer game and honestly, if Indiana, I think had been able to play defense at the level that we've seen them capable of
doing. So I think it could have been a really good game, but Indiana, it kind of got flattened right off the bat in this one. Arizona came out and really just seized control. It's funny, Scott. You know, two weeks ago in one of our classic Crimson cast, you know, jinx's, we talked about how this team wasn't allowing big runs and and sure enough, though, in the Rutgers game, they allow a huge run. And then in the Arizona game, Arizona comes out and goes on a 3:35 run within.
I mean, that, right. I mean, I you was leading 4 to 2 and I think at the Run started in, I think it was like the middle of the 17th minute of the first half. Haven't ran all the way through to the 11th minute. It was just a massacre and honestly you know it was 27 28 you know. I you down 19 less than 10 minutes into the game. We're all looking around like well I guess we will get to our dinner reservations on time because we're all leaving it half.
Now you know, to Indiana's credit they call back and they get it all the way back to. It was 3325 with about six minutes to go. Go in the first half and they got it back to about 10 at half time. But really, you know, Arizona deserves all. The credit they came out, they established what they wanted and basically made Indiana do exactly what they didn't want to do. They spend the tempo up, they lived on the offensive boards and I you just kind of looked lost offensively and defensively.
Now it did get better. I you continued to claw back. They started off that second half really well.
And look like, you know, at one point, it was 59 256, I you'd gotten it down to three and then of course, Arizona went on a 12-2 to run from their kind of put the game not definitively Out Of Reach and Deanna hovered around it being 0, being close to Five Points that a little bit, you know, once in a while there in the second half but just never really looked like a true threat to come back and tie the game or whatever so it was disappointing. You know it wasn't, it wasn't
Magic by any means. And I think there were actually some good Lessons Learned, but a lot of the things we thought were just maybe isolated to the Rutgers loss kind of reared. Their ugly head again for Indiana in this one. The one stat, that boggled my mind having watched the game and not really paying attention. No stats. And that Arena, I will say it's actually a pretty good Arena to watch a game. It wasn't bad at all. Once you're in there and you didn't want a beer but it was no
stats. And so like I'm having dinner and kind of start flipping through Ken Palm shocked, like you could have, I would have gotten this wrong and million times out of a million. We shot the same exact same from three as Arizona. We both went 10 for 25, which I thought we shot poorly. I thought, Arizona shot the lights out. It does go to show that a like sometimes your view of a game can be different than what the
stats be to say. But it also shows I think, at one point cracking, I'm wrong and think Indiana was like, 1410 43 and it does and it's during that that, you know, 25 To run or whatever it that shows, how important when you get those threes are met. When you get those threes matter as much as how many you end up with.
I was also thinking too that we have, you know, and rightfully so if there was a time when Jordan Geronimo took a three and you got your like no no no and it's like it coming into the game. Jordan Geronimo shooting 15 percent from three, which is a fair reason for you to say that. But it's like before the game before coming into the Game, race Thompson was shooting. 14 percent from three that he first was like, oh no. And then he starts hitting him.
And I realized like our entire team used to be Times. Like, Jordan Halls, like. Yes. All day long, like, even if you miss five like I know you're gonna hit your next one. We basically have a team full of no no no yes guys from three. Like basically you know Xavier Johnson and tomorrow Bates honestly it's pretty good stats from three this year and a couple others.
But I would say for the most part even like when tomorrow's shooting, I'm always a little bit nervous with his going to make it. Your I think gets people in the same boat, like, we have a team full of no. No. Yes guys. From three which, you know, I'll take it from race, but it definitely felt like that was not something.
I'm going to count on Gaiman game out, but no, I'm with you, you know, it. I also left the game, top King will get into that, but I did leave that game with a higher thought to that, like, this is what frustrates me with the Big Ten in that, you know, the that big guy. I about Ballo from Arizona was just elbowing and just pushing around but it felt very similar to ways that NCAA games are raft and it does feel like this is why Big Ten teams struggle in
the tournament. A lot of times is we're so used to getting all of these touch fouls in an 18 game league and then you play a game like this, where it's like, oh yeah, like this is the way that most other teams are officiate. There were some definite, officiating issues we can talk about, but for the most part, It was much more physical than a
Big Ten game and it did feel. None of this cost us the game and it just did feel like again, this is why you know, we struggle sometimes the tournament but again this is also why this game was so much more useful than we'd ever get out of the crossroad. Classic for that exact reason, like, you went against the team. Yeah, it's a bummer. I mean I'll finish with this sit at the bar lamenting with my
buddy, Teddy like there. I don't know how to say this the right way, there was a Feeling And you and I saw this for years with bob Knight where there was moments where he was kind of like you guys go out and take your beating like just go take your Beating and then we're going to use this as a lesson for the rest of the season. Again, I don't feel like what's a never gave up or stop trying but they're, they're did feel like, you know, the positive way to spin this is like this does.
Now give Woodson, basically a chip to use the rest of the year. So like if they win two or three in a row and they maybe they get too big, it's like, hey Xavier remember that game where you just got completely on door.
Hey, Trace. Mary's got completely beat down against Arizona. Like that's what a top five team is going to do, like, let's like, let's not forget this and it did feel like, I don't know, say Woodson, like, took his hands off the wheel, but it felt like he was just like, all right, you guys got to figure this out partially because of foul trouble. But to me, that's a positive way you can spin this out. Is we now know, you know, this
is what an upper echelon team. You know, a top one, two, three seed in the tournament is going to look like what an you know, big offense is going to do and what a physical team is going to do and so there's room. To grow 70. That's a positive way. I, it's bombed, like I was bummed that we got, our kind of our doors blown off to start and it felt like we never really had a shot back in.
But I would say to anybody else, like I'm not, the doors are not falling in, and I've been saying this all season, I say it again. Where I think we're going to finish the season is still where I thought. Now, I know, none of the nothing changes. I'm not concerned at all, but those are some of my high-level thoughts. And let's not forget, we're missing, you know, Jalen Hood fito who wall like one player doesn't change anything.
Thing it really, really is a parent when like Xavier gets to fouls and he goes out you're just like wow we have no one who can bring up the ball consistently and really run this offense consistently and I feel like that's the main thing you're missing. Well, I think it's a thing that you're missing. You it is there. I mean no but with him not with him, not being there. So clearly him not being in this game was a huge difference.
As it really made a lot of what Indiana wanted to do offensively, which is get the bullet racetracks and Davis and use that as the fulcrum point of the offense, just made it a not work. And I, you struggled mightily for that first 10 minutes of the game because they could not get anything going in the post and, you know where I think.
I can look at things from a negative perspective on but offensive ly on the whole I you did okay in this game when you think about how teams have done against Arizona so far this year, this was not like the Rutgers game where Indiana's offense just completely abandoned them. This was a game where I think if Indiana plays significantly better on defense, they've got a shot to win with the offensive
output that they have out there. And you think about what they got offensive ly in this game Miller. Hop was 4 for 8 from three and, you know, it was really like, you know, spotting his shots and was confident. That's what you want to see. He drove and actually hit a shot, which they do that's surprising race Thompson was, you know, willing to shoot from three, and was able to hit it. Like, these are important things. And as much as you know, you can look at Xavier Johnson and say.
Well, we'll gosh man, you know, you went 3 for 13 from the field. That's not good enough but he also dished out 11 assists, you only had two turnovers. Like you really did a great Great job of for generally when he could the problem. And let me not forget tomorrow Bates, who we were having a running debate about during the game. But Bates put 13 points out on the floor. And this is another game.
Now, this month that we've seen him, be able to contribute offensively, and I think that that's huge. We're Indiana, fell down was on offense, Trace Jackson, Davis frankly was not a, I don't know if he shrunk from the moment or wasn't able to figure out what he was supposed to do, or are you just wasn't able to get him the ball in the right spots, but he Absolutely, smothered by the post defense that Arizona put
out there. And look, this is this is going to be a problem that I don't know that Indiana can fix without Jalen Hood safiye. No? Because when they've been able to you know make like punish teams for doubling Trace Jackson Davis, it's been when they've been able to quickly reverse the ball, get it around the perimeter. You know, once it's passed in, they're able to get it back out again. Reset what they're doing or exploit what's going on on the
opposite side? But I really only works with that second ball handler and right now they don't have that like Xavier Johnson, can't do that by himself and Trey Galloway. Just not built for that. Like that's not his game, that's not really what he, what he can
do out there. And so I don't know if Trace Jackson, Davis has yet figured out how to be the most successful without that particular setup and it sucks because I really would have loved to have seen Indiana at full strength with the offense that they had been playing
against Xavier against. Carolina against, you know, the early slate of games with Jalen. Hurd Jaffe know what that would have looked like, maybe it's better, maybe Indiana scoring, you know, basket for basket with Arizona and it's just a track meet. But look I'll put that aside. Nothing else other thing I'll say yeah. Just want to say to that is like the other concerning part to
that. Is you now have, you know, two out of three games where traced action Davis just has numbers that are just unlike what he normally has. Like you know, Rutgers he's offensive rating of. 79, Arizona, and offensive rating of 90 for both, well, 5 for 11 from the field for 410. And like, the, the really concern is basically the teams are the smothering him. You do worry like, did Rutgers run some stuff that Arizona saw?
No. Yeah, we can try some of this stuff but I also think there's some of that but I also think what it is is when you have Hood Shafi? No out of the lineup and you bring, you know, Galloway in to the starting lineup. The trouble is you just need more of these. Games of Miller cop consistently shooting, 30, 40 percent from three and it's the points help. But the reason it's a three-point shooting thing is, if you have race Thompson, if he can continue doing this, it's
great. But like tomorrow, Bates is on the bench where that starting unit basically, it's like everyone's a, you know, inconsistent or a sub 20% three-point shooter in that starting unit when Hood chiffino's not there. So it's like yeah we can triple team, you know, we can triple-teamed Jackson Davis, because No One's Gonna Hurt us from three. Like, if you're going to take two dribbles in, it's like by the time you get there we're going to be able to you know
help on defense. So that's where the three-point shoot you just you have to have somebody who can hit at least. Keep the defense honest what even you're rotating the ball. You got to have somebody who keeps them honest and unfortunately with hoods Ruffino out and some of the shooters still being streaky. You can just start the game were like we're going to Triple team Jackson Davis. Well the other chance well the other the other issue and this
actually, it ended. Rearing its head, not just in the Arizona game but the Nebraska game two is that Indiana has suddenly stopped getting to the free-throw line. You know, they shoot nine free throws total in this Arizona Game and you know, they made seven of them. They deserve credit for that but they only made it there nine times. And against Nebraska, they only shot eight free throws against Rutgers. They only they shot 14 free throws.
They only hit 8 of them. They've been out shot from the free throw line. Now in three consecutive games and there. Free-throw rate, which is basically a percentage of the amount of times that they end up going to the line. It, it was 25, which is not great against Rutgers, it was 13.3 against Nebraska and 13.0 against Arizona. That's, that's a real troubling sign because what's happening is not only they having trouble getting traced, Jackson Davis the ball but he's now not able
to draw fouls. And I you does not seem to be able to drive against these packed zones and Look, I you hit lots of shots from outside in this Arizona game but they were so far behind that Arizona, never really needed to come out of that. You know the it wasn't technically zone defense but like it played like his own.
You know, this really tightly packed defense on the interior, that made it difficult for IU to it'll find driving lanes and deal with contact as it was coming in at them and that has got to be a bigger component of things for Indiana, if they're going to be successful this season. On the whole, it's been fine. The problem is that in the last
few games, it's been bad. And I think it's exactly what you just said, Rutgers really gave a blueprint, essentially for, here's how you make life, much harder for Indiana offensively, you locked racetracks and Davis down. And even if they shoot over you, I you if they can't get the ball inside, just seems to stop trying to go inside and that's something that has to be fixed. And I don't know what the fix to
that is right now. But they're going to see a lot more of that as they go into this Kansas game. And certainly as they get into the Big Ten season, if they can't figure out a way to, you know, do more in the lane and get Trace Jackson. Davis to a point where he's drawing fouls consistently and punishing the interior Defenders, because, right now, he isn't doing that. But the biggest thing to me, Scott?
And I guess the thing that gives me the most pause with that, Arizona game was how poorly Indiana played on defense. You know, the the adjusted efficiency numbers don't look that bad. But in this game, the raw efficiency numbers, they allowed Arizona to score almost 1 Point 3 points per possession. They shot 57 percent effective field goal percentage and I think the worst thing and this is again something we saw in the Rutgers game over. 40%
offensive, rebounding rate. For this Arizona team in that game, Arizona. Just they could have shot essentially with impunity because even if Missed. They were going to grab the rebound and probably lay it back in. And that, you know, as we can talk about Jalen Hood, trophy know, being out. And that certainly affects the offense jail and Ruffino being out is not affecting their ability to rebound or play
defense. And that is really something that I find concerning because it against a team, like Arizona, a really good offensive team and they're going to run into more of those this season, they do not look up. Up to the task right now and frankly that's surprising like I expected the offense would still struggle. I was expecting the defense would be a top five top ten level defense and it does not look that way right now that's not a bad defense. It's still top 25.
It's still it's about the same level statistically as we saw last year but it is underperforming pretty significantly. And that really does concern me because what I think about this team they're going to have shooting slump. They're going to have situations. Where Trace Jackson Davis gets shut down. They have to be able to rely on their defense, has the primary weapon in their Arsenal.
That's why I thought they might win this game against Arizona and they essentially no showed on defense for most of this game. Yeah. Now and they also let Arizona, like you said get more offensive rebounds. And that's the thing that concerns me over the last three games is it's okay.
If you're going to have bad three-point shooting kind of the Hidden Gem with this team is they were really Lee doing a great job on the offensive boards and that you go into Rutgers and you only get nine offensive rebounds but you you have a negative 8 to Rutgers, and Rutgers had, you know, 17 offensive. Rebounds to r9u outrebounded Nebraska on offense with seven but that's only three more than
them still only seven. And then, you know, Arizona had three more offensive rebounds and you look, you can't continue to get let the other team. Get more offensive rebounds while. Also, you know, if you're not shooting a the 3s A level that you need to, which just this far this season, the Arizona game feels like a bit of an outlier. Like I'm not sure we're going to shoot 40 percent from three game
in game out. So, you know, that's the other concerning part two, is that on the again, your I agree with you on the defensive side, on the offensive side that you can, you can do bad, three-point shooting if you have a lot of good offensive, rebounding, your kind of, now, in a spot where you're getting your now, getting out, offensive rebounded by teams, but I agree with you on the defense, you know, the only thing that I would say is this is Probably one of the most
elite offenses you're going to see ya this season and they were also playing at a pretty good pace. And the officials were also kind of calling the game in a way that definitely benefited Arizona, I agree with that. My concern is that they also let Rutgers get that level of offensive rebounding against them, you know.
So it's like it just feels like it and I'm again, I'm not like not sounding an alarm or anything, but it is concerning because, you know, you're if you're if you have aspirations Beyond like the fifth seed, in the Big Ten tournament and Beyond the second round of the NCAA tournament. This is the type of Team you're going to run into and, you know, I think free for a team that is, you know, as got as many veteran players as this Indiana team does especially in the post.
It's been disheartening in these last two of these last three games to see them underperform to the way that they have in defense and in rebounding and you know they got to play Kansas next. It's like okay they got to snap out of it then and play a much better game there. That is something. I'm really curious to see some other. That's what's funny with.
Like you'll start the year and it's like, and I get, I get sucked into this to like, oh my God, we're so deep and then that's like, you play the Arizona game and it's like, all right, if Trace Jackson Davis, can't guard Bellow. You know, it's like we had nobody, who could develop we had, nobody could guard him like, Malik renew, definitely looked like a freshman playing against those guys, and then
you'll hit your feet owes out. It's like we have no one who can bring up the ball like You get real thin real quick. When you start playing some of these games were just two and a half weeks ago, I feel like even on this pod. Yeah, I was kind of talking about how deep we are, like, it's so great. We have so many different options and suddenly, it's like you and this happens every year I was like, but just remember how quickly you become a seven-man rotation before, you know it?
Well, that's the thing. I mean, not having jail Hood, Ruffino changes. What is essentially a seven and a half or an eight-and-a-half man rotation into a seven-man rotation and It's that flexibility that having him in their provides and it's, you know, it's interesting because you know, they lost tree Galloway for a few games. It didn't have the same effect because Galloway is a nice complementary piece but he's not a core piece.
He's a guy. You want to bring in as a guy that's Off the Bench. Not someone who's starting because it cuts down significantly on your options to bring someone in to replace him. But also forces, Miller cop and do a different role at forces, race Thompson to be more in the post all the time. And look, I mean, you're right, like renew and I think we're news gonna have ups and downs.
He's a freshman. He's a very talented player physically, he certainly got a lot of skill, but there have been moments thus far, that have been too big for him. And I think it's going to be interesting watching and kind of round into shape and, and get his sea legs under him. So to speak and not be as daunted by some of these situations that he finds himself in Jordan Geronimo is one of those players where you just ask I was going to ask you about
him. Because I think a lot of people were expecting a huge jump this year, but you look at it now and like it's, he's feasting on some bad teams and when the games are important, he just hasn't hasn't had the numbers or really hasn't been playing more than seven or eight minutes. Which tells me, you know, the staff doesn't think he's contributing at a level that needs to be in these games.
It's interesting because he's playing, you know, his minutes thus far as about the same as it was last year, now, that was for the whole season, you know. And where I think everybody myself included was hoping that we'd see Jordan Geronimo take a leap. It was he got you 20 minutes against Michigan in the Big. Ten Tournament, he played 19 minutes in that game, against Wyoming, he played 13 minutes in
the Purdue game. Like, you looked at those games and you say, wow, if you could get 15 to 20 really solid minutes out of Jordan Geronimo, that totally changes the equation. And, you know, it's as you said, he's, he's Formed well against minnows, but then really as struggled in all of the meaningful games and at the end of the day and this is not so sound like a criticism and it's more just a realization like, Jordan geronimo's, a great
athlete. He's not a great technical basketball player like he really struggles with his defensive positioning. He struggles with rebounding positioning. He's, you know, he can, he's capable of hitting shots, but a lot of times in the speed That you must play in against top level competition who really
know what they're doing. He gets lost very quickly and, you know, from from a basketball IQ perspective, there's there's not much of a comparison between him and Malik renew, like renew is clearly a much more yet natural basketball player. And renewed has played more minutes already this season, but
you can't play all of renews. Many can't give all of Jordan geronimo's minutes to renew both because you need that extra body in the rotation in the The post and because, as we've seen Malik renew is not ready to play that number of minutes, he maybe later on in the season, but you did hope that Jordan Geronimo would be making more of a contribution given the flashes he showed at the end of last year and I'm sure he'll have some great moments down the line.
But I don't think he's going to be a decisive piece for this IU team against bigger competition. Yep. A great. So I think I think I fell into it, too. Like, you kind of just thought, like, maybe he had figured something out at the end of last season. When Reality seems like maybe he just had a couple of good games, which is great, but it's like
I'm with you. He doesn't seem like the guy who's like going to be fighting for you know the starting spot anytime soon which is above our because like we're you know, kind of hitting the court past the quarter, Mark of his junior year like it quickly gets to be a senior before you know it. Yeah. Well look I still have hopes for Geronimo that even if he can't be a guy that plays more than you know regularly eight to ten minutes against Tom competition.
Look You can get him in there and he can, grab rebounds and he can commit her tactical fouls and, you know, make life miserable. That's really what I want to see out of him. Like I just want to see him become more of a body in the post that makes it difficult for opponents to do what they want to do. And that's that's probably the thing that seems like it's most
missing. But look overall, when I look at this I you team it's there's still a lot to like it's just at this point you're not seeing the full IU Team without Don't let your Fino out there and I do worry, I mean, this is a number of games that he's missed now. We know we're told. It's back, spasms. And you just got to keep your fingers crossed and that this isn't something that recurs throughout the course of the entire year.
I know he would like to get back out there but, you know, even though he doesn't provide a huge amount in terms of scoring, he just had such a different dimension in terms of passing
and defense. And, and, you know, that's I think the thing about Trey, Galloway's minutes thus far gallop He was really struggling on defense against that Arizona team and and again, like you said that's a great offensive team that Arizona's got, you got to give them a lot of credit but it's it's just this is the kind of match up that is a measuring stick. And, you know, so I would it was, it was interesting because talking with most of the IU fans that I talk to you after the game.
There were quibbles about individual player performances and we talked about Trace Jackson Davis. Like, this was the kind of game, where if Indiana was Win. Trace Jackson Davis had to be the alpha out there. He had to take control and he looked completely beaten down by the end of the game. He and that was that was the thing that people have probably mentioned the most. It's like, you know, fourth-year player, you know, All-America
candidate. This is a guy that really has to be more viscerally engaged and be on top of things and grit out, you know, the kind of play that you need and lead, by example, I don't know if he's a killer. Actually that player but we've had those questions about him for a while but we're I think that this game is really important and this Kansas game that's coming up is that as you said you know earlier on these are things that now players have
in their heads. It's like well I remember how I felt at the end of that Rutgers game or at the end of the the Arizona game. I need to play at a level higher or two levels higher because I don't want to feel that way again and you just hope that that's Thing that sinks in and if it'll get me sink in and it may just be that maybe Indiana isn't capable of playing at that level.
You know? That's as much as we've talked about this team in the Big Ten. It's you know now now I guess this is where the rubber really starts to hit the road and you know, now that this is not a horrific lie down year in the Big. Ten Purdue looks never as Purdue looks very good. Maryland looks very good. Illinois, looks very good. These Are all teams that Indiana is going to have to beat you know, throughout the course of the Big Ten season and you know look at this point statistically
they're there. But the question is going to be, does this team have mental toughness? Do they have physical toughness? Are they going to allow themselves to get shoved around? Or are they going to be the aggressor? You know, I think that that's the biggest lesson that I've learned so far. From these games in December, is that you? Look at the Rutgers game, Indiana was not the aggressor. You look at Care Arizona game Indiana was not the aggressor.
And in both of those games they let the opponent dictate everything. And yeah, they made Valiant comeback efforts. I was really pleased in the Arizona game. In particular, with how Indiana was resilient, didn't quit, you know, didn't just get satisfied with going out and losing by 25, or 30. But that only takes you so far because you got to go back and say, why didn't you play that way from the beginning, why you
did, you look? So, shell, shocked, when Arizona came out, just To doing whatever they wanted on the floor and that is where if this Indiana team is going to hit that next tier and really be competitive in the conference. They've got to figure out how to come out and immediately impact games. Not wait for the game to come to that. Yes. Yeah. Agreed with all of that.
And the other thing that we touched on earlier, but I'm going to touch on again that is drove us both Bonkers in the Archie Miller era and I thought was gone. But it needs to be addressed that you know in the Rutgers game you have in the second half a 17200 run that Rutgers had over basically a four and a half minute stretch in the Arizona, gave you at a 3:35 run in the first half at a 12-2 to run. Second half the 3:36 Run was like a 25 to 40 is like, another
45 minute run. Like you just you, that's has to stop. Like, we can't have these runs that lasts for 45 minutes. Like, this isn't even a, you know, a Kentucky team that's like blitzing, you with full court pressure and like, steel, three, steel three. Like it would almost be better if it was like a 12-2 run in a minute. It's like, oh my God. What you guys got blitzed? Like, these are extended.
A 25-minute, just you stop scoring and it's as its as much of a run as it is like the other team is just continuing to play a game of basketball and we're not scoring and that was infuriating in the Archie. Miller are because you, and I was joke, like there was one of those every game. Like, I don't know when it was going to happen, but we were not going to score for four minutes. Could we lived through it. You can't as we learn to four years in Archie, it's really
hard to win games. The Big Ten. If you're just having a four-minute stretch where you're not scoring and this is now two out. Three games where we have these big droughts or not scoring. And so something has to change, whether it's changing things up defensively, whether it's just savior Johnson's, got to drive to the basket, whether it's the coaching staff needs to call all
their timeouts. I mean, some combination of everything has to happen, because we can't slip back into where that happens again and we just all get used to that, like, that has to stop. And so that's the thing that I take from these two games that, that worries me. The most is, I don't like seeing that Seat back into our basketball play, because it will submarine the season? Yeah, I mean. Well, look, there's a lot of
season left to play. And yeah, it's going to be interesting to see how I you responds to this. And, and what the other, can I look future for a sec? Go ahead looking ahead to the Kansas game, you know, the thing and, you know, the hood sophina things, as I look at the schedule, like you said, you know, it's a back thing. We're not sure when he will be back on, think it's been announced if he's playing. For Kansas or not.
We probably won't know till Gabe of the thing that does concern me is like if he's still not good for Kansas and it probably makes sense like all right, just show them for Ilan and Kennesaw State but which makes sense. But then it's like, all right. He hasn't that he will not have played for a month and it's like you're going to have to get back into gameplay and really there's
only one nice landing spot. It's not even that easy but like, you know at Iowa's tough but maybe you bring him back for the The Northwestern Penn State Wisconsin Trio, which isn't exactly easy, but it's like after that it just, you're, you're in the meat. Like after that, it's like, do you want your first game back in a month and a half to be
Illinois or Michigan State? Like maybe could be Minnesota but then it's like, you know, Ohio State, Maryland, Peru Rutgers. It's just there really isn't an opening here, so that's my other Hood should be no concern as we're getting to that point. Where even if he comes back, we've had enough time off that. He might need two or three games to acclimatize. I'm not sure where that is. Is soap. Anyway, just just a thought on the future and Pacino as well. Yeah, we'll see what happens.
It'll be II mean. I have a, I have a suspicion will see him sooner rather than later. And this is where right. You know, if he's able to contribute a little bit in the Kansas game or even if not, you know, the hope is get him out there against deal on, get him out there against Kennesaw State and then you've got another week and a half basically of resting them up before that Iowa game. So, yeah, it'll be interesting to see how all that plays. He's out. Anything else you want to touch
on? I mean, you know, going into the Kansas game, I guess we'll give a little bit of a preview of that. You felt you felt confident against Morgan's Kansas than Arizona. Well, let's put it this way. I think physically, speaking Kansas is a lot less intimidating than Arizona. I mean, you know that Arizona Frontline like you said, is not something that Indiana has dealt with, you know, a 7-footer, a 611 guy and then a bunch of really athletic players.
That. Yeah, I mean, the Off the Bench, I mean Visa or the finished kid is a seven footer as well, you know? So I think about it and I'm like, you know, Kansas is a very, very talented basketball team. That's a team that is chalk full of top level talent, but I don't think there's anybody on that
team. That's so physically overwhelming, that Indiana is going to shrink from the moment, you know, Kansas is not dissimilar to Indiana in terms of overall statistics like thus far, they are a bit better. Better than Indiana in most things, but there's a lot of similarities between these two teams. You know, it's interesting. The looking at the like, shooting numbers. They're very even Indiana. Actually is shooting slightly better from the free-throw line.
They both neither than get to the free-throw line, as well as you'd probably like to see. So I see some Mirror Image items here as far as this this Kansas team is concerned, but clearly, you know, they're playing at home and you know, you look at what they've done so far this season. They had the nice win against Duke on a neutral floor earlier on they just wiped the floor with Mizzou at Mizzou. That's not a huge accomplishment because mizzou's not that good.
You know, they they beat Wisconsin down in Atlantis, you know. So they've got I'd say a similar slate of Victories right now as to what Indiana has. So I think you know look ultimately I use biggest issues in this game are going to be, you know, are you able to contain it? Kansas from an offensive perspective. They have a lot of players who are really good at scoring the basketball. Jalen Wilson is a top level player. He's, he takes a lot of shots, he's also very active on the
boards. He draws a lot of fouls. Grady dick who's a freshman as been kind of a sensation for them. You know, he's shooting 46% from three, thus far this season and then you got diwan Harris KJ Adams. I mean, you got a lot of players that are concerning If you're Indiana, this is where Indiana's really got to spend the whole week figuring out. OK, what makes this Kansas team tick?
And defensively? We have to give an effort beyond anything that we've given up to this year, better than what they played against North Carolina, better than what they played against Xavier. I don't know that it would necessarily be enough. And what I've seen out of Indiana defensively so far leads me to believe, you know, I might a lot of my optimism about that Kansas game was based on the idea that if Indiana goes in and play the defense that we think
they're capable of playing. A against Arizona that's going to travel well they didn't and I am a bit worried that Kansas is going to overwhelm them offensively and you know the one Saving Grace for Indiana in this is that fog Allen Fieldhouse is not going to have the students in huge numbers likely because it's the day after finals and I'm guessing a bunch of people are going home but it's going to be one of those games where the atmosphere is going to be problematic for IU.
I think it's gonna be a lot of Kansas fans that are really fired up to play against Indiana. And Indiana while they did win a game on the road at Xavier and a hostile environment. This is a whole nother level beyond that. I don't know how they're going to handle that situation because we really have never seen them outside of the conference in that kind of an environment. Correct. And you look at like, you know, Tennessee did beat Kansas. You know what was Tennessee able
to do? You know, they didn't really out your, they outrebounded them defensively, they outrebounded them offensive lie but they held Kansas to shooting based, you know. They shot 23% from 35 421 asthma. Kansas shot in that game. They lost, they shot 37% from to. I didn't watch much of that game, but, I mean, you know, Tennessee is good defensively. They held Kansas 250 points, that, that we've seen Indiana play that kind of like this is
to your point. This is where Indiana has to be as Elite as they've been all year in rebounding and defensively because you can stop this Kansas team. It can be done, you just have to get up there. You know, the good thing is, they don't shoot free throws very well, Miller shot 64 percent and that loss to Tennessee. But over the season I think they're only shooting the pull back up here. They're only shooting 66% from the line. So you can file them, they're not going to make a ton of, you
know, a ton of free throws. That's the blueprint is you basically have to play the elite defense that we know this Indiana team can play. They just have to get locked in and really make their own aggression on their own, you know, they can't, they're not gonna be a crowd there to fire them up. Obviously, well, so it can be done. But I'm with you. I'm concerned whether it whether we can actually do it.
This is what we thought the formula was against Arizona was well look you know, Utah, not that great of a team pretty, you know, decent top 45 top 50 can Palm team held, Arizona 2.86 points per possession and it's like oh well you know gosh they kind of like what you just said like they held Arizona to 44 28 from three. They held them under 50% from to which now you've gone and That Arizona team in person are like, like, what did they poison the water before they play?
Like, how did they do that? So, that's where you look at Tennessee. And Tennessee, was able to absolutely neuter. Kansas is offense? So I go. Yeah. Indiana should be able to do that. I think it's going to be that simple because a that game was on a neutral Court. Be Tennessee, might be the best defensive team in the country this year.
And see Indiana has yet to show that they're able to actually play that level of Defense. So, Look when ddl else is like, that game was in Atlantis, like in a ballroom which is a weird place to shoot versus. Yeah, they're playing on their home court gasps. Oh look a lot of fan and again though I'll say we said this is the beginning of the year. If Indiana loses the Arizona game, if they lose the the Kansas game it literally cost you nothing.
It's funny that Arizona game not only will it not hurt Indiana. It'll hurt Indiana even less because it will get discounted in the eyes of the selection committee for seeding because they didn't have Jalen kitchen. Now, that does get factored into it, you know, we'll see what happens with this Kansas game. But the, I do a lot of IU fans are like well, you know, gosh, I'm tired of just like, we're doing it for the experience.
We need to just win these games, and I really think the the development of this team is not at yet. I think you can get there, really fast by playing these types of games, but it's not yet at where it needs to be to really compete. Now, we'll see a lot mentally from this Indiana team in terms of how they handle, Well, this week after the Arizona loss, that will tell us a lot about what the actual ceiling of this Indiana team is, I think.
But I'll also say, you know, if you go in and get wiped at Kansas, it's I mean, well, join the club. Like a lot of teams have done that over the course of time, it doesn't necessarily imply that you're not going to be able to do, you know, good things moving forward. It's just going to be kind of a, you know, a fascinating thing to
watch. Kansas is not unbeatable at home Kentucky last year went in and beat Kansas in fog Allen Fieldhouse by 18 points that that Kansas team, turn around and only lost three games the entire rest of the season and won the national title. You know, so you can catch teams on bad days. I'm just really curious to see how Indiana does in this and I'm excited to get a chance to watch some play in it. Yeah.
No, I agree. And I mean, this is something you and I and I think a lot, a lot of people talked about, like there was these four key games, they Savior, North Carolina, Arizona, and Kansas. And I think you and I both said, like there's a world where they could go and for and I still don't think it's bad for the team and I said, you know, one in three is possible and that's not awful, we're going to be two and two, no matter what happens. We could be three in one but
we're at worst. We're going to be two and two and there are some concerning things that are starting to take trend on this team. The things you and I talked about but I will reiterate I still look at this team as a team that can finish. Top three in the Big Ten and, you know, have a shot at a sweet 16 and that's nothing of that has changed is the only thing that happened is, I look at
Arizona, Mike, right? That's a team that we might play in the sweet 16 like and this is why I think the ceiling of this team is probably right in that. Sweet 16 level.
The question is, do we learn enough throughout the year where, you know, maybe in March, we've learned enough for we can really take down a team like Arizona, because again, that game sucked and we had a run against it, but we got to within five, More than a couple of times when we were there it wasn't a complete just you know, shellacking. So you know take that I just would tell people calm down.
It's a long season and you know in the end of the year God forbid Purdue doesn't win the national title like more than likely. They're going to you know shit out in the mid in the the elite any of the sweet 16 or something like Purdue always does. It's like who cares if you win December? Like Purdue is 1 December they 1 November. 1 December, that's great. It's December 13th as I see it now, like, it doesn't matter what happens. Now, this is the model of
Michigan state. That I feel like we've always talked about. Like, this is what they do. Is they get their butts kicked for a while, they play a lot of tough opponents, they kind of go in hibernation, you don't see him for they get off the top 25, you'll see him for a while, and then suddenly, you look up in the Big Ten and it's like, oh wow, they're 13. And one like what happened?
And I'm not sure, we're going to be at that level, but You know, I can see this team doing that where we get into the Big 10 and we can suddenly rattle off. You know, we can be 82 in the Big Ten. It's like, oh yeah, Indiana's legit. And they've got some Battle Scars and they're ready to go. And so I'm, you know, I still, while I have concerns, there's things that are, you know, little lights on the dashboard. They're starting to twinkle
making me a little nervous. I still think in the end, this team has the exact same trajectory that I had at the beginning of the year. So I feel okay and I'm excited to see what they can do against Kansas. On that note, we'll wrap it up, good, good chat and looking forward to it, and we'll be back next week to talk more IU basketball as we head into the holiday season.
Be less to talk about. Because if you were games after this Kansas game, Indiana doesn't have a lot going on during the holidays, the getting some time off, which will be nice for everybody. Ourselves included with the reset button and a re reset, I guess, as I just said it starts, that's if you're just, you're right into it. Like, there's it. The Minnesota game is the only respite from January to the end of March.
Yeah. It's it's one of those deals where you're you're going to have to just kind of take a deep breath because that whole month of January, it's like every three days. With one exception, you've got a brand new game. You got 115 day break between the Wisconsin and Illinois games, but it's like 5811 fourteenth, nineteen, twenty second, twenty, fifth twenty
eight, thirty first. I mean, Whoo, so going to be fast and they're all against teams that are in the top 60 and Ken pumpkin Galen. I thought the big tent was down its I do you do every year big Ten's down, who do, what's going on confusing? I've got my fainting couch, I'm so shocked. Anyway, all right, for Scott, I'm gala. This is Crimson cast.
Thanks for listening and folks will be back next week with more podcasting goodness, or thanks to home-field apparel, or thanks to our friends Elsewhere on the back home network. Be sure to tune into assembly call after the Kansas game for immediate insight. It's will catch you folks on the flip side, bring back the Bison. So on everybody. It's will catch you folks on the flip side, bring back the Bison. So on everybody.