You're listening to the back home network presented by home field apparel. Welcome back to Crimson Castillo and caviar joining you once again.
You know, big stuffs happening. When we're doing like five podcasts in one day, this is normally something reserved for IU. Men's basketball coaching searches, but this is about as big, it's certainly got a lot of facets to it. And we got a lot of people to talk about to try to get a better idea of what to expect of what's going on up to this point and what we should expect or maybe think about expecting over the course of the next days weeks months. What have you?
Of course, I'm talking about USC. And UCLA joining the Big Ten which went from not on anybody's legitimate radar to actually having happened within about a five hour span yesterday, and we've got Zak Osterman Insider for IU athletic stuff for the Indy star joining us on the show. Zach, how you doing? That is supposed to come up and visit for like, four days starting yesterday and he actually postponed until like Two to three days ago, postponed until Sunday.
And then when everything happened yesterday was like, thank God. Yeah, I mean, this is the summer, is the offseason, right? It's like the one time when things are supposed to be a little bit calm since things really ramp up in August and September for you, but yeah, definitely some fascinating changes going on in college sports. Let's start from the beginning. So you heard the rumors first start to pop up yesterday. What was your initial reaction when you saw the start to
reverberate around social media? Yeah, I mean it's funny because in this is just me complaining but I'll do that. Like two three months ago near the end of the season. My boss Macklin desks and we should just have some sort of like state of in il story you know after one year and I started reporting that and then I kept reporting it and I kept reporting it and 15,000 words of know.
Later, it's become five stories and I was finishing the second of those five yesterday thinking that this was going to kind of dominate my week before I take some time off for the holiday next week and then somebody texted me, I guess, probably run noon. It was like, do you think this is real? And I was like, doing what's real and then, you know, and I made this joke on Twitter but I wasn't really joking in, in less time than Than a long baseball
game. We went from nothing to, you know, USC and UCLA are in the Big Ten. And I don't think it's been said a lot. At least, I haven't seen it said a lot, I think Kevin Warren deserves, tremendous credit for this. I do believe in everyone says that these things are School driven because nobody wants to get sued, but I do believe based
on people. I've talked to you based on everything, I've read everything I've heard that this was really instigated by USC and UCLA that The best way to describe it is that the Big Ten wasn't actively looking to expand, but ever since last summer, Kevin Warren has just sort of had like the Big Ten in like expansion mode. So if an opportunity ever presented itself, the path from point, A to point, B would be
about as linear as possible. You wouldn't need to go through weeks of politicking and wrangling and whatever else you would just be able to just be like plugging into the machine and we just go, we do it. It'll happen fast just to be. Ready. If something like this presented itself, and when it did, you know, I mean that this is literally the first conference expansion, that touched the three, big TV markets, in this country. And yet, nothing leaked, until it was basically done.
That's why I wasn't it. I mean, like, you know, he got one anemone back. Not that you wouldn't, you wouldn't expect a unanimous vote, but remember where the Big Ten was and fall of 2020, you know, fighting over the football season and Hades going rogue and coaches going rogue. No big tent, your Kevin Warren. Got a lot of that back yesterday. Like you got a lot of the sort of the Harmony and the idea of the Big Ten as the grown-ups in the room back yesterday and and in doing.
So he also basically ripped the heart and lungs at the back 12. So it's been you know, of all the things in terms of just like System, Shock of all the big sort of seismic changes. We've seen in college athletics in the last 24. Months, Texas and Oklahoma, and IL, the elimination of Divisions, all the discussion of playoff expansion. This one is probably the biggest System Shock. If nothing else. Well, yeah, because it's got both future implications but it's also got a lot of past
implications. I mean, if you study the history of College athletics, it's almost always been the Big 10 and the pack 10/12 versus the rest of college football, in terms of who's got control of the steering wheel and to The Big Ten kind of wait for the right moment and then as you described it, rip the heart and lungs out of the Pac-12. Been basically business partners with them for 120 years.
At this point is really, it's not shocking because this is what happens in college sports these days. But it is a bit of a shock to the system to watch that transpire. You know, you mentioned the school driven thing and obviously we're not going to hear the actual truth on that. It may be that USC and UCLA were the ones that that made the calls. Initially and really kind of tried to move things along, but the Big Ten, you know, had to have done some due diligence
ahead of time on this. I mean, we only heard about this for about four hours before the decision was done. That's not how things are done in college sports. This was clearly something that the groundwork has been laid on for like weeks or months in advance. Well, and the theory of this has been other for a very long time, particularly with you see, USC. But like, you know, UCLA is, is
a pretty strong brand in itself. I think it's probably the second, No, everybody gets excited about organ and Nike and all that. But like, UCLA ultimately is probably the second strongest brand in the packed. Well, certainly, if you're pairing it to USC, bringing the two historical Rivals out of that that conference and shutting off the capital of the West Coast to the, what the the only West Coast Power, five conference in Los Angeles.
Like USC is almost certainly more popular and UCLA May well be more popular in San Francisco than Stanford the you know than cows. Oh Again, it didn't all just happen in one day but I think where Kevin Warren probably deserves. A lot of credit is, I do genuinely think like Last Summer the Big Ten was standing.
Pat obviously, there was the alliance and now that's become a permanent punchline but I think the alliance served its purpose at the time which releasing the victim's perspective, was to block the SEC from railroading, everybody else into a college football. Playoff scenario that no one else was sure worked for them. I suspect Kevin Warren woke up this morning a lot more. Medically aligned with the SEC as it pertains to the college football.
Playoff then maybe he did a week ago but it was more about I think having the conference ready for that process if the opportunity arose, if the opportunity If the opportunity presented itself, not basically saying. Okay, now we start from square one but having like, you know, having all the pieces in place to say, oh we have this, we have these schools that are interested. Well, here's the information. We need. Here's who we need to present it to and here's the process.
This needs to go through and here's how we can streamline it. So that everybody gets what they need through that process with a minimum of fuss and a maximum efficiency and I think that's where he deserves and his office deserves a lot of credit because You know, it again, like, when Texas and Oklahoma left, it didn't happen this quickly. But it did happen a lot more quickly than, like, the whole Nebraska Colorado, Utah, like the the summer of 2010, which is just like a long soap opera.
But when that happened, no one was surprised that the Big 12 wasn't going to last. I mean, what was the joke about the Big 12, that it was like a conference built on oil, futures or something like that. And it was and it was all these schools that had never trusted each other to begin with. Like it was all these schools that had been No.
Cheating and lying and double-dealing on each other for 50 years that were something like well and we need to conference so we're just going to kind of figure this out. But as you said like I mean listen in the formative years of college football in this country like the Big Ten in the Pac-12 with Notre, Dame kind of you know attached on the like that was the thing. The SEC was not the thing. It was he was Notre Dame, you as see it was the Rose Bowl.
It was USC, Stanford. It was Michigan, Ohio State like that. The Those were the national, what's the word of the national sort of products, right next, that meant the most and moved the most. It's essentially, it's essentially what the NCAA built itself on was you know big brands in the Midwest and then you've obviously got you know the LA and San Francisco markets and with the Rose Bowl is kind of the big exclamation point.
At the end of every year. Obviously college football was very different back then, but those were the population centers and the Financial Centers it's really only Last what, 40 years that we've seen the ascendancy of the SEC as a national entity and it's just interesting to watch these political connections, kind of disintegrate as the New Order comes in yes. And again, you know, I mean, it will be the convenient punchline forever but you know, the whole
we haven't signed anything. It's a handshake agreement among gentlemen. We're not going to pose. Ouch. We're not we're not. We are we are hand in glove. We are the alliance and we do not need to contractually CNN. Like listen again like it's ruthless but like more some credit for that too. Like he got he got the other two people that he needed in the room to look him in the eye and believe that he wasn't going to
be like, oh, that was fun. It's yeah, it was good while it lasted but it, I mean, it is tearing down the old way and I'll listen There's a lot of like this is going to ruin college football. I get that it met. The forward pass was also supposed to ruin college football. You know, the the introduction of signing limits in recruiting classes so that Bear Bryant couldn't just get the 50, most talented kids in the South and screw everybody else in the SEC so much.
So that Bobby Dodd just took Georgia Tech independent to thumb his nose at them or things of that. College football, hit hit no longer being allowed to sign like a 75 member freshman class was no longer write 60 of them were enrolled and worked at the steel foundries like it, you know, it like all these things were supposed to ruin college, football, college, football is doing fine. And I suspect college football will find its equilibrium here.
But I think the other thing about yesterday, Again, like so many of these, these forces have kind of been positioning themselves for a big like a really big sort of maneuver to something new, you've got in il, you've got all these people, discussing the idea of just moving football away from the NCAA entirely, putting it under the playoff. You've got, I mean just just all kinds of things going on here.
The yesterday felt like the last Domino to really like, like, when Texas and Oklahoma moved and in the Big Ten didn't counter, it was like, okay, you know, in these War analogies, forgive me are clumsy, but this is best I have ever it. Is every light, I'm sort of like everybody. Put their guns down for now. And in il has prompted, all these discussions of like maybe the the current government structure of College athletics. Particular usual, college
football and big-time money. Making College athletics is not really fit for purpose anymore. We need to explore something else, but we're talking about it openly. But like it's, it's it's, it's still just kind of. Yeah, you know, it's it's still sort of theoretical this Kicks Down the door. Yeah, this, you know, this this is the this removes the last obstacle like the dam is down now. The water is over it.
And what comes next? We can debate but I think this is when you can finally just sort of say, like we're off. Yeah. And and let's talk about the
reason why? And it's because you know, the the order as it had reformed itself after the 2010 expansions was essentially five power conferences and you know famously the Pac-12 or the pac-10 at the time, almost added Texas in that round of expansion that was going to be Larry Scott's, big move, and then ESPN trying to avoid the four super conference line up. What's that?
But this essentially, as you mentioned, it cuts the heart out of the Pac-12, the Pac-12 without the LA schools is essentially not a financial entity that can command much of anything in terms of the television market place. You know, they are now relegated to being at the level that the current Big 12 is at and that's not a very good place to be. And it further garnishes, the big Ten's television rights which still haven't been completely signed. That's supposed to happen. At some point.
It now makes the the Big 10 that much more attractive, the SEC with Texas and Oklahoma already attractive. And now the big question is, you know, the financial gap between the Big Ten and the SEC and what those schools individually will be making is now entirely separated, like there was still a chance, potentially the Pac-12 might be able to figure something out and be like, hey, we have the LA Market, we have Seattle, we have the Bay Area, maybe we can get some kind of
package that works. Now that's completely out the window and now it ends up being a Should have what other Domino's can fall because anything keeping college
football. From going to essentially a to conference super structure is basically gone out the window, as you said, Right. I think I think what's, what is next to me. And, you know, I know you and I were having this discussion yesterday, I was trying to remember, I was like, who's having this discussion with yesterday, because I think I had about 80 discussion yesterday.
It was you, I know your sort of advocating for the idea of basically consolidating now like with the the the line from that wonderful Clive Owen movie The Inside Man, when there's blood on the streets by property, I think ultimately wants Texas and
Oklahoma were off the board. Were basically three brands that were left, USC, UCLA and Notre Dame, USC and UCLA because of their strength and because of their location Notre Dame because they're Notre Dame. If Notre Dame is interested and I will not profess to be at all the most tapped in person on this. But I am confident that Notre Dame is considering the idea seriously? Now of, we may need to join a conference. Like it, it may be time basically to use the leverage
while we have it before. We are forced. Just to dive in and, you know, we don't and we have to accept someone else's terms. If Notre Dame's interested, obviously, obviously you have to listen for me.
Other than that. I think the Big Ten should stand path for the moment and I think the Big Ten needs to get in a room with the SEC and discuss a sensible playoff future because all of a sudden, the terms around that of change, like, don't think you need to give anybody don't think you need to give Efforts, Champions automatic qualifiers anymore. If you don't want to, you know, like that. Does that make a lot of sense for the SEC or the Big Ten right
now? No, not to say you won't, but then maybe what you do is you go to Big 12, you go to the ACC, you know, whatever's left of the Pac-12.
And you say, if you want that, you're gonna have to agree to a 16-team leak or your or a 12 2016 gameplay, 04:12 team, playoff, you know, you're going to have to accept that you just Gonna have to live like live with that because ultimately we hold all the cards now and then at that point, once you figure out if you're the Big Ten of the SEC, basically, what the most favorable structure would be for you under the new.
Playoff, that's when I think you start having conversations, serious conversations about Clemson or Florida State, North Carolina, or Virginia, or Washington, or Oregon, or Stanford or whoever. I think the thing is, if you're the Big Ten, especially Big 10 right now because the You always being renegotiated you don't need there's nobody else out there. You need organ. Does not change the math for you.
Enough. Washington does not the one school that does is Notre. Dame, even the schools in the ACC really kind of don't. Like, I saw you talking to the blask about this on Twitter. Like, okay, yeah, you could go get, Georgia Tech, but like, Georgia Tech is so irrelevant in. And I say that, as someone who grew up in Georgia Tech fan, like, when I was a kid, my granddaddy went to Tech my aunts and uncles went to Tech. Like I was a tech fan growing up. It is so. Irrelevant in that town.
That town is a Georgia town. If the Braves town, it's a Falcons town, it's a hawks town. It's a high school sports town. It's an everybody else in the SEC town. It's an atlantian night in town and then it is a Georgia Tech town like that like that. There is, you would, it would be even cheaper than getting Rutgers to open up, New York. Like, trust me, it really would, there's also the complication of like, apparently it's very hard not that, you can't be done.
But apparently, it would be very hard to Kate, I think in particular, I don't know about Notre Dame but I think I'm taking the full ACC members from their grant of rights deal right now, which runs through 2036. So again, if you're the Big Ten, your whole thing right now is we're all about to make a hundred million dollars a year and meteorites.
You don't want to look at your members and say, but we're going to need to spend 20 million of that every year to get Clemson out of the just so we can be in the Charlotte market like that, that doesn't make a lot of sense, nor frankly if I'm the Big Ten does trying to go south and fight the SEC when you're not going to win. We're at you just opened up a
brand new Corridor out west. I think that's the avenue to explore, but I just think that in this moment other than Notre Dame there's nobody, that moves the needle enough that you if you're the Big Ten, can't just say, let's take a breath, let's figure out because the next, the next Golden Egg to crack. Open, is the playoff and figuring out like, where are the economic levers. That's everyone's favorite phrase, these days. I see it. Around Barcelona tweets all the time, the economically.
A where are the economic levers in the plan? How do you make money off of the playoff? If you expand it, then you take, you take the answer to that question and you overlay it on your conference. It's okay. To 16 make sense, does 18 makes sense. Just 20 makes sense. What makes the most sense at that point?
And then you go from there. You know the interesting thing is going to be this because I understand all that you're saying and you're probably going to be right because I think you're thinking is more in line with where College presidents. Are at right now. What's going to be fascinating? Let's say the let's say, Notre Dame is looking at this and they've decided, look, we need to jump. Now, as you mentioned that does move the needle from a financial
perspective. What's going to be interesting is much as we saw with you as see who's looking at Northwestern. And Vanderbilt and saying, wait a minute. Northwestern and Vanderbilt are making more than double in television Revenue, what we're making and we're USC. I look at these ACC schools. Who, as you mentioned, have a Grant of rights with the ACC for television with ESPN, but it's only paying them.
I think something like 17 million dollars a year through 2036, if you're a Florida State or a Clemson or one of these schools. That's that's had a lot of national success that looks as itself as a national brand, it's going to be a hard pill to swallow when Mississippi state is, or South Carolina is earning a hundred million dollars a year
plus from television contracts. They have through the SEC with When so, I do Wonder at some point, those schools are not going to be satisfied with just sitting there and taking it, which might end up with ESPN pulling the chain oniy on the entire ACC television contract to begin with.
So, you know, as you mentioned, if you're the Big Ten doing exploratory, stuff in the southern markets, where you're going to have to pay money, to get those schools in, probably doesn't make a lot of sense, but you do have to be ready. If and when the ACC or ESPN, Pulls the plug on itself with that contract and decides that. Hey, now is the time we need to consolidate. There's going to be some brands that aren't just going to want to March into the SEC and be
like the 11th or 12th. Most important brand there. No, I think that's probably true. You know, again, the question is just like, what is the near-term future? What is the long-term future? I know there are people that really believe kind of in this idea of of a Super League II, don't I'm not sure I'm as ready to buy into that as some other people but like, could we, is
there a 20-year plan? Where we wind up with a sidecar competition, like the Champions League, where ultimately, we do give something to the the the ultra Elite that is sort of reserved for them with with at least the illusion of the idea that like IU football could play its way into that because you can you for I'm sure we have several listeners, who don't know what the champions league is or how it works because you give a thumbnail sketch of it for everybody.
Basically it involves all of the what is it? Like 4750, something looks like 53. Yeah, national soccer leagues in Europe. In what's called you a phone, which is the union of European football. Association's participation is waiting on the strength of your league. So England gets more teams than Hungary. It's teams get more favorable position. Mission than Hungary you know England gets 14, Spain gets four
teams, France gets three teams. A Holland gets two teams or you know whatever these things change based on basically how competitive these leagues are annually in European competition, you qualify for it out of your league position. And then you play Champions League games, you play your League season and then again sort of sidecar to that alongside that you're playing Champions League games, get you qualified or Europa League games as well.
It's that sort of like their second level competition and And basically what it is is just an additional like enormous Revenue stream. Like I think using Liverpool is the example. I think Liverpool's expectation for their leak, their Premier League finish would be about 150 million pounds this year, something like that. I think their expectation for playing all the way to the Champions League. Final would be like another 75
million pounds. And in theory any team that plays in the first division in England can qualify for the Champions League in practice nearly no team. Will it will be a, it will come from a live exclusive list of no more than maybe seven teams you know out of the 20 in that League. Plus the 24 in the league below that plus the 24 of the link below that plus the 22 in the league before that are below that.
So the point is, there is the illusion of the idea that IU football or Illinois, football, or Purdue football, could someday be in this. This this sort of top-tier competition the likelihood is that because the resources are built the way, Built there will always be a ceiling that those schools. The vast majority of them cannot break through to get into this Elite competition.
But I do reject kind of this idea that we're going to wind up in a place where basically, all the good schools are just going to go off and do their own thing, and just because number one, nobody wanted that, like, European soccer tried that last year and there was such a, an immediate and emotional Revolt that it didn't last a week. Number two, Television Partners
one inventory. Like at the end of the day there are like 600,000 living IU, alumni who will sit down and watch a game, you know, watch Indiana play, Michigan State on a Saturday under the illusion that it may matter even though they know ultimately it's not going to get them in the playoff in all likelihood they're still going to watch it and they're still going to make the broadcast Partners more much more money than the broadcast partners are going to spend
putting that game on in terms of, you know, putting talent in the booth somewhere and run. The cameras and you know, turning on the broadcast signal. So I just I still think there's going to be a need for that product but again we stratify it somehow. As time goes on, we can't answer those questions until we know where the Big Ten in the SEC.
Now, more than ever, as you said, I think you said it a minute ago, it is really the Big 10, the SEC, and then everyone else we can't really answer that question. Till we know where, what the Big Ten in the SEC thing makes sense. Is it? 16 is at 18, is it? 20, is it to just to Super conferences? I don't know. And then, and then there is listen, football drives this bus, but basketball is the only other billion-dollar sport.
It's not like basketball is still gonna be a factor in this because it's not like any of these schools are going to be like that we'll just leave that money on the table. We don't want those millions and millions of dollars. So then that that kind of layers into it as well. If you start really shaking up the conference's, do you change the way your basketball season Works in particular your postseason? But week, I mean, you know, we could get into these weeds in any number of directions.
It's a giant swamp or standing in the love right now. I want to pick up on something that you mentioned there a little bit it, because it corresponds with concerns that I've seen people voicing, and it's that we're going to get three or five, or seven years down the road, and the big football schools are going to kick, everybody else out and just form a super league and that, you know, for Indiana fans remain. Okay. Indiana is no longer involved. I don't think that's very likely
for a variety of reasons. Not the least of which is you just don't see those big teams wanting to be in places where they could potentially lose more than one or two games in a regular season. And if you've got nothing but big brands in a league, that's essentially what would happen.
What's your take on? All of this, is this something Indiana fan should be concerned about I think I mean first of all in the near-term know like in the in the near term this is all still going to look pretty familiar. We're going to expand the playoff you know whether Notre Dame gets added or not. Whether anybody else gets added or not. We're going to see probably a
scheduling model. I would guess similar to what was already coming which is you have a couple protected Rivals and then you play everybody else home in a way on a rotating basis, in the long term, I think there are a few things.
Number one, basketball will still matter to, Extend in some respects, it may matter even more to have schools with strong basketball Brands while the football schools just Hammer football and know, like, yes, you will feel a little bit like a second-class, citizen at basketball is your main contribution but it is still, like I said, it's still a billion-dollar sport. It's still the only other billion-dollar sport in college athletics. They're not just going to throw that away.
Number ever wear, this was number two. Number three, Indiana is Still still has a lot of just physical power as a fan base. It's a large fan base. You're talking hundreds of thousands of people that will tune in to watch out, you games, that will travel to IU bowls. That will do those. You know, you won't get 100,000 people traveling valuable because you're saying what I'm saying, and sort of concurrent to that and don't see a world where we tear down that whole structure like the bowls.
Again, it's not free money but like the Bulls make money, the bowls make everyone money. So are we really going to do something where we just tear 25 teams away and everybody else is just sort of left playing for scraps.
And ultimately the value of all that is is just submarine because everyone knows that like you Illinois on a Saturday afternoon doesn't have doesn't mean anything because there's no. So like, we're not going to throw away the Music City Bowl because it makes people money. Does it make them as much money as well? No, but like, it's still makes money like it's still that no one's leaving money on the table. No. No One's Gonna Be Like, no. We don't. We don't need that money.
We only need this money. Like this is all about money and they're not going to leave some of it on the table, simply because maybe it's not quite exclusive enough. The other part of this too, is, it's on level and this is going to sound flippant about. All you football more than, I mean it too. But like the Yankees need the Orioles to lose 100 games, so they can win, 100 games.
There will always quite frankly at some level be a need for, you know, that, you know, for there to be have-nots for there to be happens. And like, seriously anyone who's not familiar with the European Super League because they talked about it for years, like they taught mean the idea of a super league that takes just like the 20 to 25 best, you know, football clubs in Europe and we can name them all here.
The big six in England, Manchester United City, Liverpool, Chelsea, Spurs Arsenal, Bayern Munich, Rocio, Dortmund, maybe the big four and in Italy, the toumelin teams Rome and you've a real Madrid Barcelona athletic. Madrid, you know, PL in the Gap PSG, he forgets. He didn't see the filling the gap of the few others Leon. Maybe, you know. Yeah, that idea has been around for like 30 years. It's been around as long as the Premier League is existed. That was 1992.
If not longer than that frankly. They did that last year and it literally didn't last a week like they announced it. There were huge, protests outside, stadiums all over Europe, Manchester United fans, The biggest game in club football shut down. They're supposed to play Liverpool on a Sunday afternoon behind closed doors, there weren't supposed to be fans in the stadium and they invaded the stadium. Got onto the field in the thousands and would not leave, and they had to postpone the
game. They had to play it like three weeks later. And the point I'm trying to make is everyone almost immediately rejected that I don't necessarily think that the, the attitude would be dissimilar here. That's why I wonder if what what
maybe makes more sense. Long term is some sort of stratification of competition where the Indiana's the Illinois. If we go to other conferences, the Ole Miss has, you know, the the Mississippi state's, the South Carolina's, the, I don't know, the Is whatever are still in the room but there is like an exclusive table that it is highly unlikely. They will ever get extended access to maybe. Maybe once every 40 years Indiana will have the kind of season they had during the covid
season. And they'll get to sit, they'll get one year sitting at that table, whatever that looks like. And then that's won't be sustainable. They'll fall out again. Yeah, and they'll just kind of fade back into the pack you know, in the way that we've seen, any number, you know, newcastle's done it Lester's done, it takes to in Spain all the freaking time.
I think that probably makes more sense to me, but like we are, I want to also be clear like we are in You know, like this is just like Ultra hypothetical territory but I don't see a world where all these broadcast partners that are shelling out literally billions of dollars for the this inventory. Suddenly only one Ohio state Alabama every week because it
loses a level of exclusivity. It loses a degree of importance because all of a sudden it doesn't feel like it means that much if they're just Do it again next season. There's, there's no sense of like, you know, already we were probably destroying the idea that college football is unique to the NFL because you have to be perfect when a national championship or damn near close to it, like the days of 12 and 0 are probably in an end or very close to it.
In the big conferences is just it's just gonna be too hard but the the idea of just like the the elite of the elite basically disappearing sort of off the, you know, over the edge of the cliff by themselves. I just I don't think there's too much demand for total inventory here, for that to be something where that's the that's the only good football on every afternoon. If you understand what I'm saying? Yeah, well and I think there's even more inventory. Demand now.
I mean we saw the report yesterday from Sports Business Journal After the news that USC and UCLA are going to join the Big Ten Apple TV, which it backed out of the Big Ten rights negotiation suddenly called and said, hey we'd like to get back in on this if we can, you know, you've got NBC with peacock. You're looking desperately for inventory that they can stream, because at this point, they don't have a whole lot of properties on the sports front and sports still drives the bus
so much in terms of advertisers, in terms of demographics. you're reaching, you know, the the 18 to 36 male Marketplace in a live setting and that's just so impossible to do in almost every other phase of television or whatever you want to call television these days, the to some degree, the demands going up, not down, which is, I think something that people aren't used to because as I've seen a lot of the arguments against this, it's well, you know, there's you need this media
marketer that media market and those are frankly, arguments from 10 to 12 years, Ago. It's already a different media landscape in terms of where the games could be showed and what kind of inventory there is than that then there was no you're not going to make this move to LA and San Francisco just to choke off your inventory. Yeah. Like that. Like that's why like I said I think either the idea of like a crazy expanded playoff.
Like I think maybe the thing that makes the most sense to me if we're if we're talking 15, 20 years down the line like not in the next five years. But you know, 2030 to 2040 to Guided you know the planet is not superheated by then the thing that makes the most sense to me is like you know like a 10 11 game regular season you know two or three super conferences like like maybe the Big 12 finds a way to bring the remnants of the Pac-12 and the ACC and or something like that.
And then we have kind of like the big 12, the Big Ten, the SEC 3 super conferences, And expanded like a hyper expanded playoff that's like 32 teams or 20, like 24 teams a teams get buys and those eight, you know, the whole thing is structured such as those eight teams that get buys are nearly always going to be Alabama LSU, Ohio State USC, like, like the thumb is on the scale to make sure that those teams are first in line to
get the Primo spots in the play of every year and then the rest of the field. Is a little bit is a little bit more. Egalitarian is a little bit more like Iowa will have an opportunity to get in here. We'll find a way to let you know, one or two group of five teams in. So, then again, we're sort of maintaining the illusion of access and if there is a Cincinnati out there, they can come in and they can play on our oven will see if they can cut the mustard.
But it, you know, the playoff becomes this thing that's not fully exclusive because you need to add like ultimately the playoffs expanding because again Broadcasters TV Partners Distributors, want more inventory, they want more playoff games, and one put more playoff games on TV, you know, three is not enough for them, they want more. So you find a way to expand it while still keeping the top end of it. Relatively exclusive.
You don't lose all the other inventory, so, you know, Purdue Michigan State still gets one and a half million viewers on a Saturday afternoon because those are two big programs or big, you know, alumni basis and you'll sell 50,000 tickets and you'll get, like I said another million people watching on TV. Particularly the Big Ten in the SEC. I heard of Staff yesterday that like of like the 70 most watch college football games last year or something like that.
Like, 66 were 65 or in the Big Ten of the SEC. And it was, it was a relatively even split between them, but the point is, like those conferences don't want to lose that inventory. Like Nuttall. All Miss and Mississippi state will never be playing for a spot in the national championship game. But like, the SEC does not want the Egg Bowl to suddenly not matter. The I mean it's good TV makes the money. I don't think that's going away.
I think what's going to happen is we're going to long-term see further conference consolidation further sort of move not maybe not just to the power of 5 but like of what we call F BS in general away from the NCAA, if not away, from the is entirely and then some sort of system that theoretically gives everyone access to a national championship. But puts the thumb on the scale for the top, you know?
Six, eight, Ten teams, Alabama. Oklahoma USC, Ohio, State, Notre, Dame, and then don't forget, you exist, don't forget to Texas and maybe, you know, that I didn't put my boy in there. The point is something that something that makes it highly likely that those schools are going to be first in line for the elite level of access to the conference, the college football postseason and all that money.
We may see, you know, like we surprised if we get to a point where the Big Ten stops Distributing money evenly the way that it does right now. But or again, at least maybe at form something else that doesn't, you know, this money gets distributed evenly, but this money doesn't. It's we are really just like, through the Looking Glass in terms of trying to sort of forecast, a lot of this.
But I think that is the most likely thing because ultimately to your point, people want more inventory, right now, not less. And there will probably come a point where we reach a critical mass and people will say, yes, that is enough college football. I don't I don't need more but they won't want less. Yes, and they certainly, won't want substantially less. And I think that the reason why the Super League gets rejected is number one, culturally, everyone hated it.
Everyone said this is going to destroy, you know, football European football. But number two, everyone said, we prefer a model similar to what we have, which is that in theory, everyone has access in theory, you can be You know, Sunderland in League one and if you get a rich owner and a smart series of managers in eight years, you can get promoted twice solidify yourself in the Champions League or in the Premier League and then qualify for the Champions League by
finishing in the top four. That will never happen obviously, you know, what was it? It was like, what, like, two thousand to one that Lester was going to win the league when they want it in 2016. But the point is the illusion is there to satisfy everyone else while still creating this this mechanism that allows the elite teams to make an extra amount of enormous money enormous revenue. And that's that to me, makes the most sense if we're talking
about kind of the long term. You know, the long terms were future of this long term structure of this. Yeah, as you mentioned, it's almost impossible to predict at this point because there's there's so many moves to be made. There's contracts to be signed on the television front and elsewhere. And so, we will keep an eye on it and see what happens with everything fascinating times in college sports. Any final thoughts before we wrap up, Zack.
I mean, it is it is fascinating and it's one of those times we hear a lot of people say it's destroying the game. I think it's remaking college sports. That doesn't mean it's going to be better or it's going to be worse and I'll say what I've always said, which is long as seven and a half million people tuned in to watch Ohio, State Penn State on a Saturday night in October, this will all still be there. Just may look different to what
you expect. I do think you know and again, this is this is just me trying to make an educated guess. I really do think borrowing borrowing Notre Dame, doing something unexpected based on 100 Years of precedent. I think the next move is playoff expansion and then in the meantime there's a lot that can go on around the periphery. If I was the big 12, like I said, I would be hammering at least half of the Pac-12 right now and sit, like, you know, just calling the Rocky Mountain schools.
There's an example, Arizona, Arizona, State Utah, Colorado, let's bring in Salt Lake City Denver, you know, Phoenix. And let's just be, you know, the Go West Conference. You know what, let's be the conference of pioneers or whatever. I don't know what you call it, but, you know, the Oregon Trail conference basically, because you'd still be able to lay claim to Houston San Antonio Dallas on
the city. Now, you again, you'd be adding Phoenix, you'd be adding, you know, I mean they're be secondary markets in there like Tucson and Reno. And I mean, to some extent Las Vegas and, you know, certainly I mean, Denver is the big fish in Colorado, but it's not the only like populated area of Colorado, so there will be stuff that happens on the periphery. But this is, this is going to be driven by the SEC in the Big Ten and I think both of those schools, both of those conferences.
Unless Notre Dame does something is open to doing something? I think both of those conferences, what makes the most sense to me is to wait for the playoff to figure out what you want to play off to look like possibly tear up, the old contracts and just sign new ones. Then go back and say, okay, under this structure, how big shark conference be? And who do we need? Do we need Clemson? Do we need North Carolina? Do we need organ? Doing in Washington?
That's what I think you get. You kind of go, you know, maybe a little bit further afield that way. And not, you know, I mean it's going to be fascinating. I've also seen that 40 wrote this and, you know, I trusted Pat knows more about some of this than I, a lot of this than I do. You know, he's sort of threw out the idea of like, what if there's gonna be a lot of really academically oriented schools here, that may wind up, cut adrift, you know, Duke, like Forest potentially Notre.
Stanford Cal. What if they try to go do some try to be some sort of, you know, ivy league on steroids and and it's not going to make them the money that the SEC of the Big Ten will make but you know, maybe it allows them to re-emphasize academic somehow. Like I said, the big thing for me was just that this move felt like the last one that knocked down whatever the remaining sort of barriers were to college.
It's just just tearing it up and starting over in a lot of respects and I think that's, I think. Now we are going to see like the root and Branch change that is, I think we are now seeing going to see the root and Branch change that people have been sort of theorizing for the last 10 to 15 years. And certainly last two years, I think we are going to think now that stuff's going to become
reality. Step by step, we'll keep an eye on it as it moves forward and we'll probably have Zach back on. It has some point soon if additional dominoes fall, as we'll keep an eye on what's going on in South Bend and elsewhere here over the next couple of months. Zach awesome and thanks for joining me on the podcast, as always looking forward to talking to you sports with you in the future. Thanks for having me is always good to be back, it's never
never dull, never not once. Thanks all you folks for listening in and thanks home-field apparel our presenting sponsor here on the back home network for Zach. I'm Galen this is Crimson, cast will catch you folks on the flip side? Bring back the Bison. So long everybody.