You're listening to the Back Home Network presented by Home Field Apparel. Welcome back to Crimson Cast. Galen Clavier joining you right now. Scott Caulfield will join us later. I talked to IU football 1st and then IU Basketball second. We got Taylor Layman from Bite Sized Bison back joining us. Taylor and I were just reminiscing about how it's been too long since we were on together and talked football. So Taylor, great to have you back.
It's an opportune week to do this as the IU Spring Game is happening either tomorrow if you're listening on Wednesday night when we're recording this, or today, hopefully not yesterday. Hopefully you caught us before then. But Taylor, great to see you again. How you doing? I'm good, I'm good. Galen I I'm a little heartbroken today. Actually, I don't know if you saw that the they erased the Mad Ants. Now it's not the Noblesville Boom. It's that that tears up my 26-O heart so much.
Yeah, that's so that's like Fort Wayne erasure, right? You know, I mean, you still got the tin caps, I guess, Sure. And the Dons. But yeah, no, it's that's a tough one. I I have not seen that news, so my apologies on behalf of the ownership group. Yeah, yeah. No, the I, I, I, I've been joking with some folks about that from back home. Yeah, it's I. Also realized we're both wearing
some Oval content. Yeah. You know what, I think we did not talk about this beforehand, but hey, some days you just got to wear Oval I think is the answer to that. Sometimes it's the five, yeah. It is. So before we get started, just a reminder folks were brought to you by Home Field Apparel. Your place to go for the finest in college fashions, the softest fabrics, the coolest designs. Excited today by the Home Field news that they're launching a new baseball collection.
I don't know if you saw this Taylor, but really sweet looking IU cap and hoodie. They're not a hoodie. A pullover is is a pullover part of the 2025 Diamond Classics collection, which will be dropping Thursday at 10:00 AM Eastern. And they hit these out of the park. Great script Indiana pullover. They got the nice almost football esque, I would say the, you know, baseball cap going and just delightful colors and
whatnot. So 20 different colleges Indiana one of those and that will be dropping as we mentioned, Thursday at 10 AM. So be sure to head over to home field apparel. Use the code home 23, get 15% off your first order and get yourself one of those. Maybe pick up AT shirt or it's we're almost out of hoodie season at this point, not entirely in Indiana, but almost out of it. But now's the time to get a little three quarter tee action going.
Get a short sleeve, get a cap. You're going to need it while you're out there in the summertime. So head over to home field apparel.com, follow on socials as well. They're a great follow there. All right, before we get to the main part of the pod, just a quick reminder. We are also on YouTube. You can watch the podcasts. More and more people are doing this. We did a live emergency podcast last night with Assembly Call. Actually it was with X's and Joe's. We just, it was weird.
You had the Crimson cast host and the X's and Joe's guys. It was like we were doing it from Assembly Calls living room without them knowing we were there. So it was fun though and we had a bunch of people join us live on video and we've had over 4200 people watch that episode in less than 24 hours on videos. We covered Lamar Wilkerson's commitment to IU and we do that all the time on YouTube. So be sure to head over there, subscribe.
You get notifications whenever we start a podcast or get one scheduled and we we use it regularly. We've also got Spotify. We've also got apple, but consider subscribing to us on YouTube and also subscribe to the Crimson cast sub stack. Subscribe to the bite sized bison sub stack. Ours is free. Taylor's you should just go ahead and subscribe to because it's a little bit of money for a huge amount of information.
If you want to be informed about IU football, as I know all of you do, that's the place to go get the info. So with all that, Taylor, you had a post the other day previewing the spring game and we wanted to talk a little bit about the spring game and just everything that's going on this week. It's it's quite an interesting time for IU in terms of where they're at.
It's been a pretty quiet spring. Only one major injury, which was an unfortunate one obviously, as Indiana ends up losing, you know what looked like one of their premier imports in the portal and needs to do something to fix that. Is Tyler Morris out with a knee injury for the entire year? But the rest of it's been pretty pretty on the down low. And other than Kurtz Signetti getting real mad one day about a lack of effort, there hasn't been a whole lot of other
noteworthy news. Which I would argue coming off of a season like Indiana had is a good thing. You kind of just want to let this thing simmer on the stove for a little while, unmolested. Yeah, Yeah. That that Chris Dignity press conference made me feel like I was back on my high school football team. Yeah. But yeah, I was, I was like, OK,
I like this. I like this coming from the coach, you know, because, I mean, you hear all the time, like great things from all of these press conferences, which is understandable. Everybody thinks their team is the best team in the country right now. And hearing that honesty from him is, is, you know, not surprising, but also a bit refreshing in in some regards.
But also, you know, what he was talking about and kind of related to what you were saying is there's a lot of time between now and and, you know, the opening week, week 1. So there's still a lot to learn about this team behind closed doors. And they're the, you know, player movement is, is not over. That's going to, you know, that's kind of speeding up now again with the spring portal.
But yeah, yeah, the the spring was, this seemed to be pretty, pretty uneventful, which is honestly, yeah, like you said, a good thing. Like you, you don't most of the news coming out of a spring camp is, is probably bad news. So I think you have as little news as possible as good. If you're not having to publicly announce that you're moving on from your starting quarterback over an nil dispute, you're probably done fairly well for yourself in the spring
circumstances. You mentioned the portal, and this is I, I feel so bad for fans who aren't like sickos like you and me who have to keep up with all this news because it's got to be confusing. It's like, wait, we just had the portal. Why do we have another portal? Well, part of the issue with this whole situation is, is the NCAA tries poorly to balance. These are just students.
Therefore, they need to be allowed to move with the realities that these are really employees that are earning money for this. In many cases, you have to have a second portal window and coaches, I don't think hate it in terms of like it allows them to plug holes that they maybe weren't able to fill the first time. You get a a whole spring of evaluating who really should be
on the team and who shouldn't. And it's, it's a short portal window, but there's going to be, I saw some figure the other day, they're estimating like $50 million minimum in NIL money is probably going to exchange hands over this one week of portal window that's coming up. It's nuts. But this is an opportunity for Indiana, who's more appealing now as a destination certainly than they were last year.
And now Kurt Signetti and his staff have had a full 6-8 weeks to really dig in and evaluate what they've got on this roster. Yeah, you know, the, the people that you hear complaining about the portal the most are, are coaches, but they use the portal
to their to their gain as well. You know this, it is concerning with the spring portal being after spring camp and you see a lot of programs doing away with their scrimmages, their spring game scrimmages so that they're not showing other other folks their their talent. It would potentially open themselves up to poaching. I'm not. I'm not sure exactly how much of that goes on, but but I will say
I'd. Also say I don't I hate the idea that it's called poaching 'cause it's like it's just player movement like this happens. But anyway, go on please. Yeah, Yeah. No, totally I I agree. But, but when I look at what happened after the spring game last year and some of the departures, obviously there was still a lot more work to be doing with this roster at this point last year for Indiana. But the major loss that they really had last year was Kobe Minor.
He was, he was the the one that left after the spring game, which was, and at that point they hadn't, they hadn't gotten DeAngelo Pollens yet. So there was a minute there. We were like, who is the quarterback 1? And so, so you know, so there's a lot of movements. I mean, when you look at the the guys who arrived, and this is kind of what I'm talking about. I'm not like pointing to cursing Neti or anything like that, but this is how it can benefit a program and coaches involved as well.
The guys that arrived were DeAngelo Pons, CJ W, Andrew De Pape, then Salomon Van Horst, Tyreke Tucker, and then a couple old deaf guys and Naji Logan and Sidarius Dawes. Those were big additions for that 20/20/14, especially CJ West and DeAngelo Pons, of course. But yeah, so you know, the the player movement, it it benefits
both sides. And then like we like we see with the Tennessee quarterback, Nico, he you know, he that that would that I, I don't, I don't know, obviously it was about money that, but I think it could also be about Tennessee offense. People are saying it has to be one of the other. I think it could be both. It could be both. Yeah. Well, and and and you know, and again, it's like, was that an upgrade for UCLA at quarterback from what they had probably is it better for Tennessee that
he's not there anymore? Sure. You know, these are these are evolving processes is how I would look at it. And I think especially for a school like Indiana where there's reasonable amounts of questioning, like how sustainable was what happened last year as you move forward, you know, you, you have to trust the evaluative processes of the coaches because they clearly did an amazing job of, of both sets of portal additions that they
did last year. But you know, it's, you mentioned this in, in the bite sized Bison preview of the spring game. You know, it's interesting 'cause we're starting to see some names pop into the portal that were supposedly really highly regarded by the previous coaching staff, stuck around for that first year, and now they're no longer here. So I think you can you can, you
can take some things from that. And given that you still have a roster that's kind of part Tom Allen, part Kurt Signetti, James Madison, part Kurt Signetti Indiana, that's a lot of
different things. And it's better that there be processes by which you can move players out that no longer belong or didn't measure up to expectations or didn't develop and bring in new guys rather than just what we got to keep those guys on the roster for the next year or two years or three years or until they decide to transfer there.
This allows for a little more of a mutual settling of where the roster is and who's on it and and what positions you need to focus on. It's interesting too, Galen, because when you look at this, there's a note that I first saw Zach Osterman make, which was that there are three guys, 3 high school guys left from the 2023 class. There were only 17 in the, it's kind of a small class in the 1st place, but you know, 3 left is, is a little jarring.
But then when you look at the scholarship chart, which I, I maintain a scholarship chart isn't the, the latest BSB is linked there. There's six sophomores and so so they are and, and those six sophomores are, you know, they're some of the some of the guys that they recruited
directly. And when they came in in 2024, that's that's like Daniel and Duque, Mario and Dino or Elijah Hardy. Those guys were all guys that they brought in. And then of course, the the three ones, Nico Radicich. So, you know, so there's a these guys, our guys that they clearly felt, you know, fit their standard and and their system and then they're going to build up behind them. So this is going to be, I mean, it might be a reality every season.
It's hard to project where college football is going, but it seems like this is clear that, you know, they're going to work their way through the transfer portal like this, build each each team as it goes, try to find as much longevity as they can with these guys and then kind of work their way up to the high school ranks. I think this 2026 class is going to be a huge part of that process as well.
But yeah, like you were saying, Galen, like, you know, there's there's some guys that they're pushing out that, you know, had they were getting some praise from the previous previous regime and, you know, but I think they're trimming some fat from the roster to build up muscle in other places. That's the way I put it in the in BSB. Yeah, it's, it's I'm, I'm glad that they waited on some of them because I think you do have to give players a chance to develop
and grow. But if it's not going to work or, you know, if it's a mismatch in one way or another, I think we've seen it's best to move on and figure out something else. And there's plenty of players out there, as we've seen. You just got to, you got to hit on the right guys and that's always the big question mark. And that's what makes the spring game fun, albeit inconclusive in terms of what you're actually
going to see. So I think for the and, you know, I don't know, there weren't that many people at the spring game last year. I'm hoping there's going to be more people at the spring game this year. I don't know if there will be. It's on a Thursday night. They moved it from the original date on Saturday. It's not going to be televised, but I would hope there'd be more people out, particularly students 'cause you could tell like student enthusiasm for football this time last year was
at an all time low. It's significantly higher than that. There's been some promotions to try to get some students out there, which I like to see. What is it that people, you've obviously, you've covered spring games at IU, you've covered spring games at Ohio State.
What should people be looking for when they go to watch this half of football that's going to be scored oddly and you know, it's going to really be less of a game and more of a showcase of where players are at at a moment in time? Yeah, I think it's hard for people to get a foothold if they don't know a lot about football strategy, you know, so.
So the way that I always approach when I'm looking at when I'm looking at offenses, like we've watched the whole season of of, of Indiana's offense, you know, so you'll be able to pick up on some differences because there there is carry over from the previous season, the previous system. So, but the way that I always look at it, I, I targeted the tight ends last year. I wanted to see how they used tight ends because I didn't, I didn't think they used them very
well in in previous seasons. And so that was a big, a big clue into how this offense is going to be ran in in 24/20/24. I think the same thing is going to happen in 2025 because the Titan position is really interesting right now with this Indiana offense. So watch the Titans because obviously specifically for this season, but also Titans can show you a lot about how an offense is ran.
I think last year it was, it was difficult because the, the running backs looked like world beaters last year, but there were like hardly any interior defensive lineman in that game.
So it was difficult to know. So when, when you're looking at like a, like a, a system, you know, when you're, when you're considering like offensive lineman and running backs working together within the running game, that might not always get you the best, the best clue into how that that unit is going to perform or how that phase the offense will perform. Because we just don't. We don't know, you know? Who the what's?
Experimentation and what's not. And so, you know, I, I look at the Titans on offense and I'm going to be looking at obviously defensive line rotations and then safeties on defense and seeing, you know, how they kind of maneuver defensively. I don't think there'll be too many changes, but the biggest change I think is probably going to be along the defensive line. Who plays defensive end. How does you know, how does Mikhail Kamaro look at stud if if, if he plays much at all?
And then, you know, how do they rotate on that interior defensive line? But honestly, the spring game is great for just seeing the guys on the field together, seeing Fernando Mendoza throw some passes, seeing what the receivers look like compared to last year. But I think one of the big things that I'm also looking for is just an opportunity to see the young guys play because you're not going to see them on the field in 2025.
So if there are particular young guys that that you like that you want to watch, you know, you take this opportunity to do so because they're probably not going to be playing much in 2025. Yeah. I mean, yeah, I don't know if. I answered your question. Oh, you did. Look, I think I, I think for a lot of people, again, we, as we've talked about many times, there are people in the IU football fan base who understand what a, a true college football culture is like.
There's many other, the majority of people in the IU fan base that this is the first offseason I think they've gone into really psyched up about football and wanting to know. And so I, I appreciate you breaking it down as far as maybe some things to keep an eye on. I, I think it's also worth noting and you did a great job of, of bringing this up in, in the recent bite sized Bison newsletter. Don't take too much from performances, particularly at
the skill positions. You mentioned the running backs look like gangbusters last year and they ended up being very good, but in a different way than we saw in the spring game. And everybody was excited about Tave and Jackson and everybody was a little skeptical about Curtis Rourke. And wow, that we we saw how that went. You, you had one guy who, you know, without the injury, well, you know, might have been, you know, a mid round draft pick and you had another guy who isn't here anymore.
So there's there's there's just some you don't want to read too much into anything with this. As you said, it's great to see guys on the field, but the statistical performances are probably not going to be anything that you would want to bet on going into August and September. No, I remember Lincoln Murph, though, a walk on cornerback had a had a pretty solid game that, you know, he was, he was on for
some some important reps. I think he ran with the twos at one point and then we didn't see him at all the regular season. I remember Alex Rodriguez, the running back. I can't remember what season it was. We had a great spring game, you know, several years ago and just
nothing from him. That's just that's just the way the spring games go. But yeah, I, I do remember being, you know, I, I knew that it was going to take a minute for Curtis work and wide receivers to kind of gel and for that offense to work 'cause everybody just getting into town, they will see you something a little bit more advanced now. But in, in, in the end, like it like this could be an even better passing attack than than last season. And it could, it could look
worse than it did last year. And in the spring game, there's just, it's just really hard to tell. I remember also on top of that, another example is Drew Alar at Penn State. He has some terrible looking throws for during their spring game last year. And people thought Penn State was going to be, you know, not very good because he couldn't throw the ball. But then, you know, we saw off our Penn State when he wasn't exactly, you know, fantastic. But he wasn't bad.
He was, he was good. Yeah. So just just some things to keep in mind for everybody because ultimately this it's it's odd because it's like it's a lot of hype in terms of like, oh, it's the spring game and then it's a half of football and it's at 8:00 at night and and then it's over. And then then you're done with football for a while, except for the Portal editions, which obviously we'll be tracking. I add one thing, Galen, it's, it's really hyped also because it's a big recruiting event.
So they they want it to feel hyped. They want people to be there. I remember last year you were saying this. I remember last year it was mostly just like family of the players. I remember sitting in the stands and I'm like, it's mostly just like family and friends. But yeah, the it's it's definitely important to kind of take a lot of these things with a grain of salt and just kind of enjoy what you're looking at. There's not a whole lot of analysis you can really do.
Yeah, you know, but but you know, it is some of the positions you talked about probably not things that you're going to focus on initially as a a spectator. I mean, who goes to a game to watch the defensive line specifically in the rotations? Taylor Lehman is that. Person, by the way, mentally ill folks like me. But these are, I always liken it to it's, it's like a prototype
of a car. You're probably going to make some engineering changes to the car, but you got to make one first and see what works, what doesn't, what it, what's in conflict with something else. And this is a nice way to do that as a, as a fan, you know. And again, you may not have a carryover personnel wise down the line, especially since there's probably going to be some transfer portal additions that could change that. You mentioned tight end being a
good example there. There's been a lot of buzz about tight ends in the portal. You got the Cal tight end in the portal. You got a Wisconsin just lost a tight end to the portal. So you've already got some pieces that are floating around. But Indiana's certainly going to
be evaluating. This is perhaps an opportunity for them to get those people in the building, see how things are done, and be able to make a sale, so to speak, on what they could do here at Indiana. And then obviously, high school recruiting still very important. And you're still building from the ground up with that, like you're still forming those
connections. If you're Kurt Signetti and his staff, you're, you've only been in the, the job now for what, 16 months, 17 months, whatever it is, you're you're there's a lot of layering that has to go in with that. And this is it's why it was what the frustrating thing about Tom Allen not wanting the spring game, you know, because it's like that was the regime that couldn't afford to not have a big recruiting event to bring people in.
And yet they went away from it for reasons that we've speculated on on the podcast before. So it's it's a welcome change. And it's nice to see Kurt Signetti recognizing that and not taking the mat rule approach. You know, there there's it's not like, well, I can't be held accountable if they steal my players. It's like, well, no, we're just going to go do what we need to do and get what we need out of it. And then maybe we can add some additional people to the mix. Yeah, absolutely.
And, and you know, I, I also, I like that, you know, the spring, the spring games almost seem like a party when, when you're not. Like, I remember when I was covering Ohio State and covering their spring game, it felt almost more like a, like a party than a scrimmage. And, and it was because they, they, they want those vibes for the, for the recruits. And now, now you can have transfers, like they'll probably have transfers visiting for the spring game. So it's not just high school
recruits. It's also, you know, transfers to potentially come in the spring. So so yeah, I think I think there is multifaceted. It's not just what you see on the field and what the what the fans see. There's also a lot of things happening behind closed doors as well. So there are a lot of things going on that the coaches are thinking about and, and, and maneuvering. So it's an exciting time, but we don't see all of it, right?
And, and the transfer portal thing is going to be interesting because having it on a Thursday, one of the benefits is you're not going up against a bunch of other people's spring games on Sunday or Saturday or Sunday. So you could kind of squeeze one in, perhaps get people here who might not otherwise have been able to come because they might be being courted by other schools and they'd rather check those out.
So yeah, it's going to be a lot of fun. 8:00 kick at Memorial Stadium. I think doors open at 7:00. I'm going to be over there. I got a press credential for this one. So I'll be, I'll be up in the box watching from, from the from that seat. And I think are you going to be up there too or are you down in the stands? I'm going to be down in the stands. I actually prefer to be in the stands because I can see the players a lot closer. So that's that. That was really fun last year.
I don't know if I have the same opportunity this year because there might be more people there, but I was like right, right up there and watching them. It was it was, it was a good time. It was really enlightening to yeah, if you can get as close to the field as possible, I'd definitely I recommend it. Well, come see Taylor or me or both of us at the spring game tomorrow at Memorial Stadium. We'd love to to just say hi. I'll, I'll, I'll see what I can do.
I'll try to get down to the stands a little bit because I always enjoy watching from the stands as well for many of the reasons you just mentioned. But Taylor, thank you for joining us on the show again, Bite Sized Bison is the newsletter. Go subscribe right now. If you would like to be informed about IU football. It's pretty much the best place to get that. And we'll look forward to having you on again soon because we got to talk some basketball at some point as well.
Yeah, yeah. No, I was really excited about the Lamar Wilkerson edition too. I I would stay on and talk with you and Scott. But I gotta go. The man's got places to be. Taylor Layman bite sized bison buddy. Thanks so much for joining us. We'll catch you soon. Thanks for having me on. All right, Taylor hopping off and guess who's joining us? It's Scott. Hi, Scott. How you doing man? Yeah, we're doing fine.
You know, I've been. I scheduled myself very poorly because I do, I have another podcast that I I produce and I'm a guest on and I did 3 episodes of that before this podcast. So even by dude, I don't talk to my wife about my other wives. So you can just leave this. You know, you shouldn't be talking to me about this. I like how that's where you went and not wow, Galen's been podcasting for two hours straight after doing an hour Long live podcast yesterday.
You know, you were just like, I don't want to be jealous. Yeah, that's exactly, exactly it. Enjoy the practice tomorrow. It it reminds me of a Zoolander with is this a school for ants? Because the press box is so far up, you're going to be looking down and like who who is, is that Mendoza like, oh, no, that's a wide receiver. It is if you've not been up in the Memorial Stadium press box. It is, It's it's up there, man. It's not a great view.
Yeah, it's, it's, it's pretty, it's pretty wild. But you know, it's one of those where I think it's good to have multiple perspectives, you know, watching the game and it's it's the closest you get to coaches film without actually watching coaches film is how I look at it. So. Totally true. And I will just say for the spring game, you, you, I heard you listen to the end of that. It's so awesome to be excited about a spring game at IU football.
I mean, this is one of the few times I can remember having this and we haven't had a spring game for years. But just the the excitement that I feel talking to people, it's like, wow, I actually kind of want to watch the spring game. I can't remember a time I've been I've been like that. See, we're just gradually changing hearts and minds here. I think that's important. So I'm glad we've gotten you on the bandwagon. It's great. So I'm there, but we we're going to chat some basketball.
Obviously, big news yesterday, which we covered on the Emergency Pod with Mike Weemuth and Bob Motz. Lamar Wilkerson from Sam Houston State has announced he's coming to IU 65 shooting guard, one of the best shooters in the portal and really, I think kind of put some people's minds at ease, including yours. You had texted me earlier in the day complaining and joking about how a lack of players on the
roster. Only what, 4 hours later to have the announcement coming that Wilkerson would would be here. I gave you credit for essentially. You know, Jedi mind tricking the recruiting process into reality, But we haven't had a chance to hear your thoughts on this yet, so please take the floor. Yeah, no, my, my text was like, I, I, but a lot of caveats, like I'm not freaking out. I'm not, I'm scared. But like, it would be nice to
get some players on the roster. I was thinking more about it and I listened to the, the, the emergency pod, you know, I, I think I'll speak for those. And again, I was not freaking out, but for for those who have been concerned, I, I think it does come from a place where we've had eight years and then a hyper amount of four years where, you know, up to this point, we've had no real information about recruiting coming out with this groups thus far.
And we have up, you know what, 4 players on the roster as of yesterday. I think we have 5 now. But you know, there there's a long history of eight years of not a lot of recruiting success and then four years of a lot of stories about, hey, this guy's not recruiting or this guy, this coach doesn't know the name or this coach is on vacation during recruiting time. And so to then suddenly just be told, hey, have faith in the process, it's going to be fine
and then have no news. You know, eight years tells me like I'm a little bit concerned when I don't hear anything because the the previous regimes have been nothing's happening and nothing happening meant nothing was really happening. In this case, it's really nice to know that nothing is happening, but actually a lot of things are happening like work is being done when I'm going to sleep.
I know that my IU basketball coach is still working and getting on planes to go visit recruits and doing the things that a functional basketball coach should be doing. So all I say is I think people have the right to be a little concerned as days kept on ticking and nothing was happening. I understand it's, it's a new regime. We know that. But it's like 8 years of, you know, stories like that. I think we're we're, people have been in that spot. Yeah. I mean, we talked about this a
bit on the podcast yesterday. And one of the things that if you've been following closely the goings on around the program, most of the leaks, pretty much all of the leaks are gone. And, and that it was a purposeful choice, it appears by the athletic department to reset the relationship between the basketball program and the media, the basketball program and the fan base. Because this was I, I believe this when I said it yesterday, I
believe it today. I mean, I think those things really hurt the perception of IU basketball.
The fact that you'd hear about recruits four or five days before they got here and you'd hear about this guy didn't do this or this guy didn't do that, or you'd hear about what we could have offered Aaron Henry, but we got Demizi Anderson instead because he was, I mean, it's stuff like that where it's I, I, I think a lot of the information that IU fans online, IU fans have gotten used to was not information that should have been provided, but it was information that was being
leaked. And so it is refreshing to me at least, that IU seems to have cinched that up now. I certainly can understand the perspective that some folks have in the fan base about, well, gosh, if we're not hearing anything, nothing must be happening, why aren't they doing XY and Z? And I do think that the Wilkerson commitment gives a lot of cover for the idea that people were starting to form, which was that, well, we're not going to have a roster or we're going to striking out left and
right. You know, I've tried to explain this on the podcast. We've talked about it a little bit. The last show that we did. These things are neither linear nor do they happen all at once. And most of the pressure early on to sign deals was based upon the the, the the house settlement and whether that was going to go into effect. It hasn't, it's not going to in
the next couple of weeks either. So that extended everybody's timeline, but it's also one of those where you do, I think have to have some evidence in terms of players signing and like this is going to be the roster before people really start to get comfortable with things. So I understand the skepticism, but I do think, again, like my my recommendation to fans, if they're feeling as you were feeling, is you can't carry the same level of skepticism and cynicism into the new regime
that dominated the old. And I know that's easier said than done, but you really do have to almost like be like, well, we're going to, we're starting fresh. And I have to assume that the coaches know what they're doing until I see incontrovertible evidence to the contrary. And. Certainly, I don't think we're anywhere close to that. No, I agree. And I personally wasn't feeling that way.
I was kind of speaking for those people and kind of joking about it. But I will say that this signing it, it does put my mind that he's like, all right, if we don't hear anything for another week, I, I now know that we have a real grinder there. And, and we've seen it by, you know, you, you mentioned this, the the field of 68 interview.
The thing that that stood out to me was the quote of, you know, oh, Devries flew back out to see me again to kind of basically close the commitment, which was like, wow, I don't think. And I guess that was my point. Like, I don't feel like that's been done in eight years. Well and so well, hold on, let me. I can't believe I'm going to do this, but I, I will say clearly that him saying that was, as I think I described it was catnip to IU fans yesterday.
I don't think that you can assume that that never happened. And I think part of the problem, and again, this goes back to the leaks thing is the there was there were clearly some mistakes made. There were clearly some, some poor judgement in terms of, of things that were done. I don't think we can assume that nothing was ever done because clearly Indiana was still bringing in talented players.
They were still doing the, you know, whether it was Archie Miller or whether it was Mike Woodson. It's more like either the system didn't work or the core philosophy behind which the program was was designed around was just inadequate to the current environment of college basketball. So I guess that's the one thing I would say it's like, I think it's easy. And I've, I've, I've been as guilty of it as anyone. It's easy to be like, well, now things aren't great.
And it's kind of like that scene from Hoosiers, you know, where Jimmy Chitwood walks in to the church. You know, it says, you know, I think it's time for me to start playing basketball. And, you know, George is up there saying, I told you as soon as he got rid of him, pointing at Norman Dale. And then, of course, the next thing, next line happens. You're like, oh, there's always more than meets the eye on these things.
But regardless of how broadly applicable the arguments were that Woodson wasn't recruiting with vigor or, or that Archie Miller was making the wrong decisions and certain things or, or, you know, or what not, just showing Darren Devries being able to to have that happen and having the player come out and say that as being a major factor is, is such a nice change of
pace. And it does feel like there's a little bit of of healing happening already with IU fans if they've seen that aspect of this story. The other thing that I that that's been calming to me through this is and, and part of it just has to be, you have to have faith in the new regime. And it's just, you know, you do like if you're a fan, you can't immediately be like, all right, well, we haven't gotten recruits like this guy sucks.
You have to have faith and it doesn't always work out like Signetti, but you have to have faith in it. Will, you know, But you, it does feel like, you know, Devries is putting together A-Team and you mentioned like, you know, shopping at Whole Foods on the last pod, I think was a really good analogy. I, I, you know, that feels like a very good way. And it feels like that's going to take some time and like you're, you're being very
selective of who you're picking. Whereas, you know, the last two years under Woodson, it just, it did feel like, Hey, let's just who's the biggest names, who's the biggest bag we can throw out? Like, let's go get that. You felt that way. I felt that way a lot under Crean. When it's like, Hey, the top 20 recruits we've offered all of them. It's like, are you think they are they all good fits for our system? Like this can't be the way that it works. And it does feel like it's the.
Reason being, very selective girls in my high school class out on a date. Yeah, it's, it's like the hey, you know, I mean that and that guy normally is kind of successful. That's not how you build a basketball team. Just hey, there's everybody who said yes, welcome guys. What are we going to play today? So I, I do think that, you know, there's a it does feel like he's being selective and I do have faith that he's building the team that's going to be there. So I'm I'm excited.
I also, you know, I'm hitting on some of the things you guys talked about, but I do think the other piece that I absolutely love here is you got this guy from Kentucky, you know, and it's somebody that Kentucky was actively recruiting. It wasn't just a Kentucky throughout one of, you know, 12. Like it's like they took that kid to the Preakness. Kentucky fans were all pissed because like, we, we were going for this and I was talking to somebody today.
Not the Preakness. If they flew him to Baltimore, no wonder he committed to Indiana. Fairpoint in a horse race. But the thing that I was talking to some friends about today that kind of it's like, Oh yeah, and and we're playing Kentucky this year. Like this is great. Like let's get it going. Like this is a great little poll from Kentucky as well that I absolutely love. And it's like now we're going to play them. We got some hatred, like let's go. I mean, we'll probably still
lose and rough, but who knows. Well, they just set the date for that. They didn't know if you saw it, but they they originally scheduled the date for the Rupp, the Indiana game and Rupp for the 20th of December, which is going to be the first. They moved it. Now it's the 13th of December, which is great because after Indiana wins the Big 10 title in football up in Lucas Oil on December 6th, the same day they're playing Louisville at
game bridge. Then the next week they can go and beat Kentucky and Rupp prior to their first round game. Actually, no, they won't even have a first round game in the College Playoffs because they'll have a bye. So actually we'll have a two week break after that Kentucky game to get ready for that that next College Football Playoff game. So am I. Am I handing off the fever dream torch to you?
Is this Peyland's? Fever dream as as as as one of my close friends would note I'm I'm big into manifesting at this point, we're going to we're just manifesting all of this happening, you know right in a row so that that would all be all yes, I will take all of it here we go yes. Give that to me in a syringe. No, this, you know, I, I will go back to this. Does it?
It's kind of that idea of like now I, I do know that the, the coaches are, and I always believed they were working, but it's like now you're starting to see some of the results and it, it's going to take some time and you know, they're going to pick and choose. But I, I like the team that it looks like Devries is building right now. You know, you, you guys mentioned how this was, you know, all the schools that this got you, all this other schools going for this guy was, was SEC schools.
And it is interesting, you know, you talked about that, you kind of talked about around this in a couple other areas. And we see it with, you know, how dominant the SEC has been and how unlike Big 10 teams, the SEC teams look, you still look around the Big 10 and like, Purdue's going to be good, but they're going to be a traditional Purdue team. You know, Michigan State is going to be good.
They're going to be traditional. You know, there there's something cool about like, hey, let's let's go get all the SEC guys like, let's do what Auburn's doing and let's do it here because it doesn't seem like a lot of other Big 10 teams are either trying or have the resources to replicate it. So, you know, this is something you taught me years ago.
It was in the Korean recruiting, you know, we would get guys and you're always like, look who we're going up against because that that's more of a barometer than what their ranking is or what they you know, how many stars they were. It's like, oh, guy's a four-star, but like he was being recruited by Belmont. But the something doesn't jive here. You know, this is a guy who was, you know, Wilkerson was recruited by Kentucky, Auburn, and those are the three and us Ole Miss.
Thank you. Thank you, Ole Miss Ole Miss, but all SEC schools. Well, and it's funny 'cause my the original process of evaluating the offers as the barometer of the player actually came from watching IU football for so many years. When you're, you know, you're, you're seeing like IU. Yeah, they're not recruiting the same athletes that Michigan and Ohio State are recruiting, but they're also not recruiting the same athletes that Illinois and
Michigan State are. They're recruiting against Akron or they're recruiting against Toledo or or Western Michigan or Miami of Ohio. And you're just like losing, by the way. And, and yeah, in many cases losing. And you're just kind of like, there's something not right here.
And so, yeah, with basketball, I mean, look, we've talked a lot over the course of the history of this podcast about the fundamental issues that Big 10 teams have had because they have not been attracting the types of athletes that really make differences at the. You know, the in NCAA Tournament time, in many cases, because you're having to recruit a different type of player to succeed in the Big 10.
And to some degree, you almost have to break that cycle of dependency and say we are going to run a system that is focused around something other than power and brute force, and we have to focus it on something that's based more on athleticism and skill. Well, then you got to go out and try to get those players. Yeah.
And we'll see if it works out. But as we saw with Michigan, you know, Michigan was able to be a successful program in the Big 10 under John Beeline while running a a diametrically opposite system for what most of the teams in the conference did, one that was predicated on offense and predicated on shooting. And yeah, they didn't always win the Big 10 title, but they made two national championship games. So I do think that there is
value in that. And I think we are probably due at some point for a paradigm shift in the conference. And you can't help but look at the SEC and say they have some top like top, they are top loaded as a conference, but they have a lot of athletic skill throughout the course of that conference. That's what you really have to try to do. So yeah, I'm with you on that
100%. And I think, you know, it is yet to be determined whether you can make a roster up almost entirely of players that are coming in from 2nd and 3rd tier conferences. So that's where the I could see a little bit of trepidation or a little bit of concern if you were a fan and you're like, I'm not going to get too excited about this. I want to wait because it's like, well, OK, it's a guy from Sam Houston State.
It's a guy from Davidson, you know, hypothetically, a guy from Troy, a guy from Idaho, a guy from North Florida. Like why aren't we pulling players in from power conference teams? You know, why aren't you going all after the, the guy from LSU or the guy from Maryland? And we talked about this a little bit on the emergency pod yesterday. Like some of it is budget where even if you got a ton of money, you, you've got to be judicious with how you spend it because you want to get good depth
players. You know, there's an interesting analysis that I will not read directly off of because it came from a, a, a subscription site. But the summation of a player, for instance, that just got projected to go to IU. This guy, the guy from North Florida who was visiting today is, is now our projection to go to you will wait until it's official before we go in depth on him. But the idea is like this isn't an elite player, but it's a good player. And that's what Indiana needs.
They need good players like 1. Like you want to have one or two guys who you would classify as a lead who or who can grow into that elite role. But you where Indiana has often struggled is that they haven't had even players that would classify as good in spots 789 or even 6789, sometimes even into the starting line up to some degree. And so it's a different method of roster construction. And I think it's got as good of a chance as any, but you're
still kind of adding to nothing. The nothing will start to build into something and then we'll see what we've got. But it is an interesting thing to kind of watch the process of go through because it is very different and hard to get your head wrapped around as an IU fan. Because you're referencing essentially a blank roster page to start with. And you can't really see how all
the pieces will fit together. Nor have you seen the system that they're being plugged into being run at Indiana in any recent memory. No, it's all sand. You're you're you're building question marks on question marks. The things. The other thing that I've been thinking about, you've talked a lot about, you know, resource allocation or the budget. But one other way to that I was thinking about this to look at this is there is resource allocation based on the team.
You know, there's let's just pick a number. Let's say IU has 10 million even number $10 million to spend on NIL this season. You can't give 10 million to one player and then have nothing for everybody else. You know that you have to have kind of a salary cap like that.
Again, nobody wants to talk like not professional, but it is the the other piece that I will say, and I'm being kind of very overarching on this, if you'll forgive me for not having a perfect analogy, but you know, the, the Pacers have to do the same thing that the difference is they can agree to pay Halliburton 35,000,000 a year because they know they're going to make 140 million from TV revenue every year the next 5 or
6 years. Like there is a steady stream of money coming in. The other piece of this that is also kind of sand and a question mark is the money that IU has to spend year over year. It's not like it's based on a fine an amount, it's a finite number that can change in that. And what I mean by this is the last two years, again, this is kind of a generalization, but the last two years Indiana kind of went after big name, big target spends. You'll go get Khalil Ware, don't make the tournament.
You pay him, you know, probably a hefty sum, you go get Omar Barlow, don't make the tournament. At some point you can't keep going to that same donor, like, hey, I need another $5,000,000 to go get a player. At some point they're going to say, hey, you got to do something different or, you know, or that donors like I'm done. You go to another donor, like at some point you run out of donors. Like the NBA isn't going to run out of money.
Like they're going to continue to get TV contracts. They know for the next 10 years they're going to fund. And so I do think a change of Strat. So I do think there's also resource allocation where IU has to be understanding that you can't keep pissing or taking donors money and having no results. And so the idea of instead of maybe going after one or two huge names, like huge splashes in the portal, let's build a lot of smaller players and maybe this will work better.
You know, that could also keep the the war chest going because I think that's another piece of the allocation of resources is that it's not just an unlimited supply of money that comes in. At some point donors are going to say, I'm kind of tired of this. Like I, I don't want to keep doing, you know, big one time spends for players. So I both agree with your premise and disagree a little bit. I, I think you're right.
I mean, I think just constantly taking swings at big players or trying to get the number one or #2 player in the portal. I I mean, there's nothing inherently wrong with getting the number one or #2 player in the portal, just like there's nothing inherently wrong with getting like a top five recruit, our top 10 recruit, Romeo Lankford, for instance.
But if you don't have a system in place that allows you to maximize the talents of that player in the context of the accomplishments of the team, then it's wasted money to some degree. And that's where I think donors get upset. I think it's why Mike Woodson's
no longer the head coach here. Just same as same with Archie Miller, where it's like it, I mean Archie Miller in a three-year span, he got Romeo Langford, who I forget what his ranking was, but he was I think a top 15, top 10 recruit and he got Trace Jackson Davis, who while not ranked quite as high, was a generation of player with Indiana, made the tournament 0
times and got fired. Not because he got those guys, but because he a, didn't surround them with the right personnel and B, didn't have a system that they worked in, especially offensively. Mike Woodson basically had a different version of the same problem where he he, he, you know, he did a lot to maximize what Trace Jackson Davis could do on the floor. He got Khalil Ware, he got Omar Barlow, he got Miles Rice, who was a pretty hot commodity in
the portal last year. It didn't matter, you know, like the, the, those, those signings were empty because as we and I think your NBA analogy kind of works here in a different way than you intended. The number of NBA teams who have gone out and splashed the cash on a big free agent signing and then put nothing around them and have gotten locked into horrific contracts. This is the Bradley Beal phenomenon, you know, and we've seen it dozens of times in the
NBA over the last 20 years. You know, Mike Woodson, I think his philosophy was I need a star in the post because that's where my offense is predicated around. That didn't work in college because that's not how the college game works at the NBA level. It's like, well, we need a star. And half the time the star is needed, not necessarily even just for their play, but we got to sell jerseys. We got to get, we got to sell tickets. We got to get people in the arena.
It's what makes the Luka Doncic trade such a bizarreity. I like that word. A bizarre oddity is that is that combining those two, I. Like that minting vocabulary here on if you don't have a coherent vision and philosophy as an organization, it doesn't matter how much money you spend, your roster construction is going to suck. I mean, this was the problem with the Pacers, you know, post what, 2008, you know, for about 3 years until they were like, oh, I know what we're going to do.
We're going to settle on this collection of players and that's going to put us in contention to be, you know, maybe going to the NBA Finals. And they were in contention. They just had very bad timing luck. But it doesn't mean the philosophy itself was wrong. Whereas there's plenty of teams I could point to, they didn't build intelligently like the New York Knicks for many years and they paid the price over and over again and seemingly never learned their lesson. And that's where.
And Mike Woodson. Well, but he wasn't picking the players. I know, I know I'm just but, but if it is, that is an interesting tie. So I I look at it from the perspective of the college level. It is interesting because the the other complication is that the in the pros, there are limits on what you can spend on players, There are limits on how much you can spend. You can go over those if you really want to get into the luxury tax. They don't really exist at the college game level.
Your limitations are what are your resources coming from your donors? What, what is your revenue share allocation going to be with your athletic department? And then from there, how good is your talent evaluation? How good is your your system that you're plugging players into and what is the end goal with everything?
And this is where I think the roster construction for this IU roster for next year is going to be fascinating because they're going after right now like, you know, Wilkerson's going to have one year left, right? They're. Debris, seniors, they're going. After Debris is going to have one year left, you know, if Luke Goody comes back, he'll have one year left. And look, that's that's a choice. Now, you could try to get some younger players in the portal. But I think the idea here is
kind of twofold. And again, I could be wrong. This is just me trying to evaluate from a distance since I'm clearly not in the meetings. I was not on the plane with Darren Devries going to visit Lamar Wilkerson. But I look at it and I say, OK, Indiana clearly needs to have some initial success. And there's a couple of reasons for that. A, they need to win the fans
back. If you were in Assembly Hall the last couple of years, you recognized a real growing problem that has not really been publicly identified, which is that the connection between the program and the and especially the students. But I think a lot of younger fans, fans under the age of 45, it's not there. It it like it's, it's just not there. And you can look at the empty seats in the balcony. You can look at the the the rampant booing in the Illinois
game. You can look at the kind of unsettled nature of some of the home games down the stretch, even games that Indiana won. And you can say to yourself, there has to be some success, something for people to latch onto. And you're going to have a better shot at that if you've got a more veteran team, especially a team of hungry guys who are coming together in a system that's going to put them in a position where they can be
maximally successful. So I think part of it, but I also think because of the portal, you have to make yourself an attractive landing spot. The fact that Debris with with no tape of him in Indiana and one year at West Virginia that did not result in a tournament bid was able to come in and convince the second best shooter hypothetically in the portal from three to come to Indiana.
As opposed to going to Kentucky, who you know was a top 15 team for part of the year or going to Auburn who was in the final Four. Instead, they're coming to Indiana. Like that to me says, all right, there's already a good sales pitch here. There's already a pitch that is appealing to to players like that, but that's only going to last for so long.
You're going to have to show results in this first year to convince the next wave of players that you're bringing in, whether that's recruits from high school or whether that's portal players. That Indiana is a place you want to go not just because of NIL, but because you can achieve your goals as a basketball player. Whether that is I want to go to the pros, whether that's I want to lead A-Team to the Final Four. That's why I think there's this
bias towards older players. And it's also like, unless you've got a dynamite player who you're going to have for a couple years, what's the point in bringing a developmental piece because you might develop them for somebody else. Yeah, no, I agree. What I also think part of the portal is just most of the guys like Wilkerson played like JUCO, JUCO and then Sam Houston, like a lot of guys in the portal have that story where they've they've gone up one or two levels.
You just you do that, you're going to be a junior or senior. There's not a lot of sophomores in the portal that are that are of note. I guess Khalil Ware was No, I I agree with all of that. And I think this also, you know, this I I think it's smart. I mean, obviously early success isn't bad. Like no, no coaches like, you know what, I doubt arts like we're going to lose the Indiana State, like that'll show them, that'll show who's boss.
You know, I think all coaches are trying to do that. But I do think, you know, that this is it's a smart approach. I agree with you. It also gives you time to kind of build your ground game in the recruiting and say, all right, now we can build, you know, build that slight pipeline in there. I would also throw this out
there. I was kind of thinking as you were talking about this and forgive me if I'm just completely missing on somebody, but, you know, different eras with Archie and Woodson, cuz we're just in a different era now. I, I don't remember Woodson or Archie having a really killer recruiting offseason before their first season. Now I know it's totally different. Like neither of them had the portal. So it's a different scenario.
But I, you know, we're, we're talking about, you know, Archie getting Romeo and then Trace. That was after he had success on the court like you're talking about, you know, Woodson, he did his work in the portal. The portal wasn't there his first year. I'm aware of that. But his his work was done, you know, with Khalil Ware and Balo after he had tape to show like, hey, I'm a post guy, I'm going to do this in the post. It's just more to highlight your
point. There's no tape of debris in Indiana and he's still having this success. We haven't seen that. You know what the other two coaches had it based on the tape that they had. Again, it's not a great comp because neither Woodson or Archie had this kind of portal opening. You know, the first year they started, but just making note of
that. I don't know if I totally agree in as much as like so you think about like when Archie came in, there was a class that was that was brought in there, the 2017 class, which was Race Thompson, Justin Smith, Clifton Moore and Al Durham. And, and that there had to be some, I believe, you know, that was that was, I always look at the first two classes as something worth indicating or, you know, like kind of reading into.
And I think people forget like the the first full class that I would attribute as far as like Archie Miller being at IU, that class according to the recruiting rankings, had the, you know, I had five players in the top 150. It had Romeo Lankford, Jerome Hunter, Demise Anderson, Rob Phenisee and Jake Forrester. And that was a group that people
were pretty excited about. And all I'm saying is that that there was tape of Archie coaching at IU at that point when he signed Romeo. OK, I'll give you that. It it. But yeah, you're right. The paradigm has changed quite a bit, You know, and and I think ultimately it's almost and that was but I think it's worth noting. It's like a different sport to some degree from that perspective.
Like how, how do we interpret the the reality of the situation within the confines of like, well, we're, you know, not only are we not focused as much on high school recruiting as the end all be all like the only place to be, but in some cases, especially like this. If if we were, if we were truly looking at 2017 in 2025, you'd be starting with a brand new roster. This would almost be 2008, 2009. First year again, I'm just a bunch of.
Freshmen, yeah. So it's, it's a really interesting thing and, and look, you don't, again, you don't know how it's going to play out because it, it could not work. It could work really well. You know, what I told people at the end of the podcast yesterday was if you're skeptical, I get it. But maybe don't automatically leap to skepticism as the primary method by which you're
going to interpret all of this. Maybe instead think about it from the perspective of, hey, I'm I'm excited that the fact that Indiana's starting to pull in players, I can start to see if I look at the roster, how all these pieces might fit together. If I go back and watch tape of what I know Devries's offense and defensive done at his previous two stops, I can kind of get a sense of what it might look like in Indiana uniform.
Like, lean into those things. As much as we'd like to look at and react to and live within the emotional and mental confines of IU basketball over the last 8 to 9 seasons, the reality is, and this goes back to the leaks thing that we talked about when you jumped on the podcast, a bunch has changed in this offseason. And I mean, you know, you've got a, you're going to have a brand new strength and conditioning coach. You're going to have a brand new
trainer. You know, a guy who's been there for what, 45 years is no longer going to be there. You're, you've got brand new assistants, You got a brand new head coach. You've going to have like all of these changes that have taken place. This is essentially IU basketball molting and and re emerging with a new skin. And yes, you still got the the the red and white uniforms and you still got the candy stripes. But realistically speaking, it's a brand new program.
And so I would just caution people about taking the pain and the frustration of the previous eight or nine years out on what you're seeing right now when it's clearly the beginning of a process as opposed to being the process. I agree that the positive way that I look at it is when you look at football, you know, nobody right now is saying, I don't know about Signetti and the guys he's bringing in. Like, I mean, everyone's like you trust the process.
Like there's nobody who's like, I don't know if Signetti knows. Did he get the right guys in the portal like his Mendoza, really the quarterback he wants? Like nobody's saying that Signetti has proved he has a system that works that we trust in the process. Does that mean we're going to the College Football Playoff? I mean, in your favorite dream now, Yes, we're we're doing that.
But on our our great weekend of IU, you know, triumphs, but you know, does that mean we're going to be when the title don't know, but I think we'll be on the right path doing that. The the positive thing that I look at is going back to Devries did all of this last year in West Virginia. And the question is, you know, how how will he do? You know, he did the same thing. He built a roster from literal zero to 100, you know, a full roster.
He West Virginia was able to field the team like they they had enough players. They played in Atlantis like they were fine. Devries has already done this once. The question always is, how is he going to do when you give him more resources? And to me, it's like the question has kind of already been answered is like, well, he takes the IU jet and goes meets Wilkerson again and probably UPS the UPS, the NIL offer and he signs the player against Kentucky.
And like, I'm I'm sure Devries is like, wow, I didn't have those things at West Virginia. Like when I when I asked for the jet, they were like, no, we ain't got no more money in mortgage. Like it's he's showing to me that he's doing more with the resources IU has and again, trying to trusting and trusting in the process. Like the guy just did it in West Virginia. He knows how to do it. He's showing me not going to
show me anything. He's showing that he can use the higher resources at a higher school to do what he just did. Just do it at a better level. And I guess I would just put a slightly different spin on it and say it's less about the resources and it's more about the culture of college basketball as it has to be addressed by the head coach at a major program. And I think that, and again, not just a Mike Woodson thing, also an Archie Miller thing, also a
Tom Crean thing. On and off there, more on than off at the end. There are things you have to do in recruiting, in player development and player relationships. And I think Darren Devries looks like he's off to a really good start with that, better than perhaps what we saw out of his predecessors. But it's early, so we'll wait and see what happens. Yeah, but I'm excited. It's, it's a good start. I'm glad Scott's excited folks. That's that's a key, key element
as well. So anyway, all right, well, that'll wrap it up for us. We'll be back with more. If you are not planning on going to the spring game, go to the spring game. You know, and if you've not driven from Indianapolis to Bloomington since the Interstate opened, it's it's really fast. Like my sister lives in Zionsville. I live on the southeast side of Bloomington. It is an hour from my door to
her door. So this honestly, this is like driving downtown, you know, for for a lot of people in terms of the traffic. So take advantage. And I've been saying that for a year now, like it's been great. It's been open the whole football season. It's fantastic. I was in Bloomington today. It was an hour. I bet you Caulfield 2024 it's
like driving downtown. So anyway, just just yes, please come join us for the spring game and we'll we'll keep an eye out for you and try to say hi. Anyway for Scott, I'm Galen, this is Crimson cast. Thanks for joining us. Be sure to check out the entire roster of shows on the back home network and we'll be back maybe this weekend with some spring game thoughts, maybe some more recruit signing. Keep your eyes and ears open for the emergency pods as they emerge. We'll catch you folks.
As I said, on the flip side, stay never daunted. Bring back the bison. So everybody.