You're listening to the Back Home Network presented by Home Field Apparel. All right folks, welcome back to Crimson Cast. Got here with you. Excited for this podcast today. Before we get going, just a quick shout out to two of our friends. First off, we have Upland Brewery with the Hoosier game day Logger. I got a couple of more cans of the Hoosier game day logger filled up my fridge. If you listen to last pod you know I was drinking it on the patio watching IU beat Northwestern.
So definitely check them out. They are at all Upland locations. You got a week off time to stock up and then when we pack the rock in two weeks against Nebraska, you can buy it at Memorial Stadium. Upland Brewing Company reminds you to a drink responsibly go Hoosiers and also our friends at Home Field apparel, all kinds of good stuff. They have the new Indiana script like 90s throw over. The thing is awesome.
Check them out. You can save 15% off your first purchase by using the promo code HOME 23. So check out home field apparel. All right, business time is over. We are excited to bring to our home and home. We're bringing Alex Bozicz from inside the hall onto Crimson Cast podcast. I was on his podcast a couple weeks ago. So Alex, welcome to welcome to our stadium, man. Thanks for coming over. Thanks for having me, man. As you know, I have the utmost respect for you and Galen.
You're the the pod fathers of podcasts for Indiana University sports. You guys do a great job over Crimson cast and you know, it's been awesome to see the, the response that you've gotten to the football podcast this season, because I know there's been a lot of long dark years of podcasting about IU football, a lot of terrible seasons. So I I, I'm happy for you guys that you actually have a good product to talk about it. I know it's exciting for you and
Galen as well. So just wanted to put that out there. I know your listeners are thrilled about it as well and and I'm personally am just still that you guys are getting a legitimate football team to talk about this year. I I appreciate that. It's definitely fun. It's funny to hear you say that. I've heard this from a lot of different people and it's, we joke on the last part. It's almost like having a kid that's like graduating college feel like, oh, I'm so proud of
you. Like he's walking like he's done so well for himself. And it's like you put in so much time and effort and it's just almost like the, the, the proud father at graduation as my kid is at least getting it. I wouldn't say it's validatory, but at least like getting a diploma is where we're at right right now. Yeah, they move up the rankings a little bit more. You could be talking about valedictorian, right?
There's there's talk of being a contender for the for a playoff spot, which is incredible to think. About it's incredible. I think it's legitimate too. And I think they've they've done it. It's it's funny. We started Crimson cast because we were both obviously big bat. I mean went to IU always a big bat, big basketball fans. We started right at probably the nadir of Indiana basketball. Like I think I have to go back and look at his like the end of the Kelvin Samson.
I think right when Samson was fired and we brought in creams like that's when we were like, this is the time. This is the time to strike. IU is hot. And then within a year or two, you know, both Galen and I were going to football games or I had season tickets. He was working his way back and we both had he's like, well, let's let's talk like no one's talking football.
Let's start that and end up become more of our brand than I thought it would be for starting this in kind of a, a basketball mode. But no, it does feel like we're on the precipice of something, which got me thinking. Have you thought about, you know, you have inside the hall? Have you thought about inside the rock? Like let's let's get a a subsequent page going like just what you need and a whole other website to run.
You know, it's funny, somebody at IU when Kevin Wilson got the job, talked to me and said, you know, we think you should start doing football stuff. And I, I just my interest level in football is more from, I would call it more of a recreational interest. I'm not, I'm not a die hard football person, never have been.
I've, you know, I grew up in southern Indiana, New Albany, and I was kind of, you know, in the middle of, you know, Louisville, KY, Indiana, and it was always basketball for me. And you know, I, I guess my formative years, IU football wasn't really something that that drew a lot of attention. And so it's harder for me to get interested in. I will say that this year I have made it a point to watch the
games. I was at a party with at some friend's house over the weekend and made sure they had the IE Northwestern game on, was watching it. And so it's also nice for me to kind of be able to, you know, for basketball, you know, I go to some of the games, I'm on press row, I've got a press pass. I can't really root for any outcome. You know, selfishly, I wanted to do well for the the business, but from a football perspective, you know, I'm not a member of
the media. So I can actually enjoy the success, you know, I of, of the program and it's, it's been fun for that perspective, but it would also kind of feel weird to just, you know, jump in now. It's like, you know, you waited, you know, you had this website for 17 years and all of a sudden how you football is good. You want to jump in like I, I don't, I don't think people would be running to read my
thoughts on IE football. So, I mean, I'll leave it to you guys like you and some of the other, you know what, Hoosier Huddle's one of them. Hoosier huddle, I mean bite side Bison Taylor does a great job with his sub stack. There's been a nice little, you know, we had Punt, John punt for quite a while and those guys just. Kind of, yeah. I remember those. Guys, those guys just tapped out. They were. Like they were asking me like
they were super nice guys. I think they were just trying to figure out how to grow a following. And that was a long, long time ago. And I, you know, I tried to help them as much as I can. They were, they were out there towards the end of the Allen, you know, right? They kind of stopped doing stuff. They did they they've shut it down. We had them on a couple weeks ago. They shut it down about two or
three years ago. Yeah. By the way, for those who are wondering, like this is actually this podcast is going to be a little bit different than the one Alex and I did because I figured the Venn diagram of people who listen to your pod and my pod is probably pretty similar. So I, I don't want to do just another, let's preview IU basketball at some point near the end. We'll talk about the upcoming
season. I just I wanted to talk to you just kind of as another player in this sphere about these kinds of things, just, you know, starting a website covering IU basketball all these years, 17 years. So, you know, that's what kind of go back to the free flowing conversation. That's that's what this podcast is going to be. So people are like, man, what are they going to talk about Balo? What are we going to talk about the season? Like what we'll get to that at the end.
But I also think we, if you want that, I would go back and listen to the podcast that you and I did a couple weeks ago on your feet. So I think we hit a lot of those topics. I will also say we're recording this Monday, October 7th. I'll probably save this and release it later on in the week. Just kind of a dead period with IU football not having a game this weekend. So if something wild happens like between now and then and I and I release it and we don't talk about it, that that would
be why. So anyway, back to this. You know, you you said inside the hall has been around 17 years. Like the first thing is just I'm curious and and by the way that the respect goes both ways. I I love what you guys do. I think you guys obviously are one of the first you know, I don't say blogs out there, but websites doing it. You guys nailed the name like just on naming is such a hard thing.
You guys nailed it. But you've had, I've always thought the kind of the most like pointed view of Indiana basketball, like a very Fairview of of what you're looking at. There's been a lot of other sites out there. I think some of them take either a way too positive you a way too negative. You you you guys have felt like you've always been the most objective, I should say about it. And, you know, you kind of call it like, you see, it's like, I've always appreciated that.
But I'm just curious, you know, why when you know, tell us about like starting inside the hall and like, why? Why did you decide to start that when you did? Yeah. How, how long do we have, Scott? Do we have? Or Crimson cast, baby, we can go, We can go 90 minutes, two hours. It's yeah. OK, well, I'll, I'll try to give the most concise version of this. So, you know, I just kind of on my background a little bit.
You know, I, I started, I, I went to New Albany, which is obviously in southern Indiana. I started my college experience at IU SE, which is the regional campus down here and went to IU then for a year and a half and then actually came back and finished up at IUS. So I kind of a disjointed path to a college degree. I did, I did graduate in, in four years. You know, I wasn't a big, I was a college basketball fan growing up.
I wasn't a big like necessarily IU fan, you know, I followed the program, but I, I, I just loved college basketball. I remember some of my earliest memories of, of watching IU games in the early 90s. I remember some of those teams were, were great fun, fun to watch teams. And I still remember, you know, the year Alan Henderson got hurt and IU could have definitely done some, some damage had that not happen. But anyway, just kind of give you a little background on, on that.
Obviously, my dad's been a sports writer for a long time, started out at the Louisville Career Journal. I think it was maybe the Louisville Times at that point in the late 70s. And so I grew up in a house where, you know, we had the Hoop Scoop coming in the mail with the recruiting rankings. We had the Sporting News coming in the mail. We had every morning I was reading the newspaper. So sports were always kind of just like ingrained in me from an early age.
And I was more of also my dad's a huge White Sox fan, so I was a baseball fan too. But sorry for this year. Sorry, sorry for your, your loss this year. Horrible, horrible. But anyway, you know, so I, I always was interested in sports and, but when I came, I got out of college, I graduated with a political science degree. I had no idea what I wanted to do. Like, I thought I wanted to go to law school. I didn't obviously end up doing that.
And I I started working kind of nights and weekends at the Courier in Louisville, taking like high school scores, like they would call in the games and I would write a little blurb up. I was like just trying to break into the industry and went have any way to get involved because I love sports and I didn't necessarily want to do exactly what my dad was doing, but you know, I was interested in it was something to do. So I did that. And I kind of saw like, you
know, I followed pig. I knew pigs before I started inside the hall because a friend of mine that I'm Matt Dennison down here in southern Indiana does a radio show was was friends with pigs. And so I've met him a couple times and had a ton of respect for what he was doing and followed a lot of the other IU websites as well. But you know, so so I, I come out of college and I, I knew
Eamon Brennan a little bit. It was at IU and Ryan Carazza, who's now still with me at inside the hall through my sister who went to IU and worked at the daily student with them. And, you know, I, as I just kind of watched what they were doing. They were blogging and other websites and I was like, there's really no place like where there's just guys writing about IE basketball with maybe not with a press pass, but just like
kind of giving their thoughts. I'm like, this is not a terrible idea to start this up and we'll see what happens. And that's kind of how the idea was, was born. I reached out to them and we, we kind of started talking about it and they, they were in that, you know, they, they were still young, interested and wanted to do something like that. And we, we talked mostly via e-mail, which I still have those emails and look through them from time to time.
And we started trying to come up with a name. I'll give Eamon credit. He did come up with inside the hall. So I always joke with him. Don't ask for any royalties Now. It's been been too long. I'm I'll keep. We're keeping the name. Yeah, it's like. The Nike swoosh. Yeah, he, he, he obviously started it with us, the three of us, and he moved on pretty quickly because he was, you know, a superstar in the career. He went to ESPN.
It was like, all right, we started inside the halls like in the December, 10th December, I think, or later in 2010, he wrote a post like, all right, guys, I can't, I really, I can't really dabble on this anymore. Like I'm going to work for ESPN. I'm writing about college basketball.
So we're still for him, obviously, but me and Ryan have kept at it and it's been like a learning experience for me because I didn't really start it with the idea of like this is going to be my job or my business. There was a lot of, you know, there was 3 or 4, three or four years when we first started it and wrote everything. And I don't think earned any money from it. It was like just a hobby. And so it's, it's grown into obviously a business and some days it feels more like work
than others. But I still kind of go back to the fact that it was something that I was just interested in and had a passion for sharing my thoughts on on the subject. And I think that's in any business, that's kind of the best path you can take is, you know, try to do something that you have a passion about, passion about or are interested in and and usually doesn't feel like work. Yeah, and it's, it's funny, we have, I, I feel wild saying
this. We have younger listeners because I don't feel old, but we're old. Sorry, but it's, you know, it's it's weird to go back to those times when you're right. I mean, you know, outside of pigs, there was just no place for anyone to go who was into IU basketball. And I kind of, you know, that's that's a little bit how Crimson cast started.
GAIL and I had that background, but you know, I was living, I moved to Houston out of college and I lived in Saint Louis and it was like it was a struggle to get information on IU basketball. You'd like search ESPN. And it's like if we weren't ranked, it kind of sucks. It was like, damn, we're not going to be on TV. No one's going to write about us. Like, I had to have my parents send me stuff for the Herald Times, like their website. It was kind of OK.
And it, it, it's amazing to look back and think that, you know, now we live in a universe where it's like, well, of course this makes sense. But it's like there was just nothing. Barely getting scores, let alone like, you know, recruiting updates or, you know, a Big 10 perspective from an Indiana point of view that just didn't exist before, you know, 2009 or so.
Yeah, I mean, there was Hutch was doing some stuff I remember as indie * and he had like A blog, but, and there was at one time there was a, there was a blog on like I think the Courier Journal's website had like A blog for IU, for U of L and for UK that they updated. But yeah, you're right, there wasn't a ton of other resources out there. And I didn't go into the idea was like, I'm going to compete with Peaks. Like I knew Peaks was already. And he'd been doing it since like 1998 or 99.
It had a really dedicated following. And I was friendly with him. I was, I always, it was always weird like when I first started it because I would see him at different things and I didn't want him to think I was like trying to like step on his toes or anything or like I had, I have a ton of respect for him. And you know, I still see him at from time to time at different events. Like last year he came home for or he came to a game at in Bloomington and got a chance to talk to him.
Like I, I just respected the hell out of what he did and like in terms of just building that community and everything. And I figured that the fan base was such that, you know, there was enough interest if if we put our thoughts out there, we were just hopeful that somebody cared about what we had to say. And I feel like with anything, you have to like do it for a consistent period of time and show people that you're serious about it before they'll take you seriously.
It's not like you can just start writing something and then like six months, all the sudden you have a ton of followers, a ton of readers. It was a lot of time where we're writing stuff probably that nobody read and but we just kept over and over a consistent period of time. And I think that's how you kind of build a following and build trust with your readers. That's, you know, the, the, the people always ask me like, you know, how do you build a following? And I'm like, you got to be
consistent. Like you can't post like for Crimson Cash, right? I mean, if you posted 3 podcast episodes this week and then you didn't post another one until February, people would be like, where's the podcast? Like you're, you're consistent. Like you, you got to show people that you're, you got some skin in the game. So that to me was and it still is like the the consistency is a huge part of it. No, I agree. And that's something I get asked that every so often too.
Like, you know, how do you get into this? And it's like, well, like I, I think I'm very tangentially in, but it's like you, just you, you start doing it and like, if you do, you want to write about IU basketball or you want to do a podcast or a video cast or like whatever, like start doing it like just, there's nothing stopping. And I'm, I'm with you, do it. And I think the key is also like there's probably going to be some lean years on the start.
Like it's very, you know, we, we had, you know, I our, our first couple of years, we were probably doing it just for Galen and I like we actually found, we went back. I was going through my Google Drive and I found the first like year or two of Crimson cast audio and it's wild. It's just like, it is so wild to listen to it. And it's like we're doing this just basically for ourselves and just kind of testing out and trying things.
I think the other thing that you said that I think is I've always felt too is you know, people ask like, you know, you know, somebody starts a new podcast, you feel competition like no, like I the more people in the space, if they're doing it with their own perspective and they have something there. Like to me, it's like I I want more people in the space because it's great and I love what you do.
I love what we're doing. You know, there's like the hysterics came in, they had a different viewpoint and it's like, all right, that's that's cool. Like I the more people in is better. You know, we we're obviously big fans like Taylor Layman and bite sized Bison. You know, he's looking at it from a different, you know, football from a much different perspective. You know, I think if you're just coming in trying to copy someone else, that's a little bit.
But like, you know, if you come in and you have your own voice and you just start doing it and you you're consistent. You know that that's how you start. I found it interesting, you know, with all of these tools available, but now it doesn't feel like there are more shows and websites popping up and or maybe I'm just not searching it
out enough. I feel like little ones pop up here and there, but for a fan base that says devoted and for students who are as into it and have all of this stuff at their disposal, I'm surprised there are 25 other websites like inside the Hall or 30 more podcast doing this. Not that I want more competition. I just, that's one thing that I've been interested in the last like 10 years is that there isn't a lot of other people out there doing it. It. I don't know. I just.
I find that interesting. Yeah. I mean, I think now it, it's, I think the hard part is breaking in and I think that you might, there might be things you never see because they were started and then somebody did it for a couple weeks or a couple months and then kind of gave up because they weren't getting a creating any traction. And it's harder now than it was when, you know, when you started with Crimson cast or when I started inside the hall.
It's a different completely. I mean, look how much the internet's changed over that period of time. I mean, it's Twitter wasn't even, we weren't even on Twitter when inside the hall started or X, whatever they're calling it now. But I think that was I was looking at. I joined in 2009 and I'm like, I can't even really remember a time before that. And there was actually a couple years and it's just the way information is exchanged now is just completely different.
And it's going to continue to change. So that that's the other thing is if you don't continue to evolve with the market, then someone else is going to, you know, pass you or take take from your readers. And I agree with you. I'm not. I think the competition's a great thing because you give people an option of finding kind of what they what they like and what they enjoy. And you know, it helps make
everybody else better, right? If it was just if you were the only podcast talking about IU football or I was the only website or, you know, Ryan and I were running the only website that talked about IU basketball, It's like how how is that helping disseminate, you know, information to people? Because, you know, it's just one perspective. And I think it's good to have as many perspectives as possible. So it's, yeah, it's, it's a lot of fun still, but it's also,
it's just. For me, the, the biggest challenge is like learning the business side of things, because when you start something like this, you don't you do it as a
hobby, right? And you're not, you didn't, it wasn't like I was formally trained and like how to run a small business, how to, you know, organize that and all the other stuff that kind of comes with that from that perspective are things that I'm like, that's not, I just want to write the I just want to write stories and share my perspective. But now there's so many other things that come with it that I have to think about that I'm still learning those things
everyday. Yeah, we, we never took that next step. We kept it in hobby face.
We didn't go business. I'm curious early on, what was the process like getting press credentials from, from IU and talk about maybe some of your first experiences like covering IU as part of the media, because that, that's something, you know, I, I think for what you guys were doing, obviously, you know, you, you wanted that access was going to make it, you know, you weren't just going to be like from a fan's perspective and just you, you want and having that access would
definitely help. It's something I know for us, we just always kind of took the approach of like, I don't, I don't think that helps us at all. And I think it'll, you know, we can be a little bit probably, I don't think it affects your judge mental ability, but I just, I don't know something we just never went down that road.
So I'm just curious what that process was like early on when you're just like a website who's writing stuff and you know, you go to IU and like, what what the hell are you talking about? I'm assuming they're probably like a little bit dismissive from the get go. Well, it was, you know, when we started out, we didn't use our real names like we had nicknames that we wrote on the site. And so that was like the 1st 2
1/2 three years. And we, we finally got to the point where I think I got to the point where like, I wanted to start going to some stuff like going to games. And so I don't remember if it was JD Campbell reached out to me or I reached out to him. But to this day, you know, JD has obviously moved on from IU, but we still talk like this is a relationship that was built over a long period of time.
And in many ways, JD was so, so helpful for me in terms of just kind of getting me in the door there. And he was very receptive of what we were trying to do. Like once he knew who we were and what we were, what we were about, what we were trying to do is very receptive of what we were doing and was what to give us credentials. And so it wasn't like a, there wasn't ever a time I was like, I, you was going to say, no, you, you're not welcome here,
you can't come. So I think, I think putting our names on everything kind of helped kind of solidify our legitimacy. And then once we did that, we started to to cover games and, and then obviously, you know, with me not living in Bloomington, I think really the thing that helped us was being able to, and Galen helped a lot with this and still does now from time to time with like helping us identify students at IU that could work with us.
Because obviously I'm not going to be, there was a time when I went to every game and that that's kind of old after a while, like. A lot of driving. Driving home at 2:00 AM and so we've got students on the ground there in Bloomington that are doing a lot of the game coverage and, and being at press conferences after games and things like that. Now that that really help out from that perspective. But no, they were IE was great.
You know, Fred Glass was always super nice to to me and had him on the podcast a couple years ago. Dolson's been on the podcast and it's always nice and friendly. And obviously JD and now the Sid now Charlie Duffy, Jeff Keg there. They've always been super accommodating. So I think they've been no, I can, I can say they were far more welcoming than a lot of like the schools that we like, we try to go cover Rd. games
for. I can tell you a story one time from it was the Oladipo Zeller season where they were number one for a lot of the year. So the 2000, what 1213 year? Yep, Yep. And and we, I was pretty, we were pretty deep into coverage by that point. Like, we had a established following and we were, we were, I was a member of the Basketball Writers Association and I had, you know, other people vouching on my behalf. But Ohio State for some reason didn't want to let us cover the
game there. And so Cream found out about it. And he was like, you couldn't believe like that they didn't want to let me in. And so he somehow working with JD, JD was like, we're going to get you in. Just don't worry about it. It's not a not a big deal. So I show up at the arena and I, I send him a text or whatever. So he sends somebody up there with like this, this ticket. And I'm sitting like directly behind the bench with my laptop
right there, the IU bench. Yeah, this is, I'm like, JD, this is like, I remember somebody sent a screen grab like on TV and like, what are you doing behind the bench? Like I'm sitting there next to Marni Mooney, who was like the at that time, the director of like the academic and all the parents and stuff were behind me. And I'm like on my laptop right there, like trying to like do things. And I'm like, this is great,
like great seat. Like I'm in the building, but I'm thinking to myself, how am I going to get in the press conference? Like, how's this going to work? And so they handed me this pass. It was like this, you know, whatever, all access type thing. And I and I went in the media, remember the game and filmed the filmed the press conference. And so that was, it sounds like the only time I can remember like that somebody didn't like want to let us in.
But other than that, I feel like there was a process at one point, like from the Basketball Writers Association, where they kind of saw where websites were going and they made this task force to identify websites that were in their eyes, legitimate in terms of being being able to get credentials. And we were we went through a vetting process and us and there's an AUM hoops, which is Michigan site that we're really close with. They were on the list and some
other websites. And so once the Basketball Writers Association published this lit this list, anytime somebody kind of gave pushback on credentials, it was like I kind of was able to point to that and say, hey, like we're not just some 5 by night site that just popped up, like we're actually trying to cover the team in a legitimate way.
And you know, where we are a website, but I think it took a lot of time for people just to kind of understand like the IT was for a long time was like, we don't credential websites. Certain places like Ohio State was like, you don't credential websites and they've let us in since it's no big deal. But that was, you know, 11 years ago.
So I will say from an IE perspective, though, they were kind of one of the first schools that really kind of looked at websites as something that was legitimate. And they they let a ton of them in to this day. And that they've, they've been pretty cool with with credentials and everything. And like I said, they've they've always been willing to to work with us and be accommodating, which I really appreciate. Yeah, I know.
I know like coach with assembly call goes, goes the games on a credential pass and I think it's I, I, it's, I think it's good. And like I think it shows that the universities are understanding that the changing media landscape. I'm curious from your perspective, having done this for so long with the IU fan base, what what drives the most
traffic on the site? I mean, obviously when when the team is good like that 20, you know, 20/12/13 season, I know traffic was probably up, but I'm just curious like is it pregame, postgame, Is it recruiting? Is it postseason? Like what? What? What do you know, you know, really drives traffic when you're going to put it up there? Well, winning is number one, like a successful season. That's number one there.
I always think to myself, I've been doing this since 2007 and I used been to what, 3 Sweet Sixteens in that standpoint, they've not been like to the Elite 8 at all. I've never been to the Final Four. I'm thinking, what could this be like if they actually were competing for Final Fours or winning the Big 10 regularly?
It could be a lot different. And I think it's a testament to the IU fan base that I've been able to do this for so long despite the relative lack of success for the program because it just shows that these fans are going to support the program unconditionally. Things could be, you know, as bad as they were under Archie Miller for those four years and people are still supporting the program. You know, coaching search obviously is up there too. I remember when they got rid of Archie.
I remember actually this is when they got rid of Crane. There was like 3 or 4 days where our server was just completely like messed up. Like we, we couldn't do anything and there was like nothing we could do because it was like every time they tried to change, fix something or change something, if the avalanche of traffic just kept coming in. And that was before we kind of had the technology side of it figured out a little bit more. So there was nothing we can do
from that standpoint. We just kind of had to let it let it die down a little bit and and stabilize things. That's funny you mentioned that. That was one of the highest stretches we ever had too. I mean, Galen went on like a podcast tear. He had like five in a row. But I I think at that point, the Korean firing it is back when iTunes used to have like a ranking. And I think we made like Crimson cast was in like the top five for college athletic like just sports podcast.
Like it was wild. Our numbers just blew off the roof. So, yeah, coaching searches definitely do. And that, that Korean one, for whatever reason, really, really lit things up. Yeah, I remember driving down to Georgia Tech for that NIT game and then driving back and I'm thinking, when's this going to happen? Like I got to make sure I get home before I this can't happen. Why? I'm somewhere along 65 in Tennessee we can't have. And luckily I made it home and I think it was like a day later.
The NIT game we sold, by the way, we should have. It should have been an assembly hall. Yeah, that was that. Man, that was weird. That was weird going to that press conference with Crane afterward and people were asking questions and I don't think he fully knew for sure what was going to happen, but you could just tell like his demeanor and his the way he talked about it, He he was very concerned like about his future.
But you know, getting back to your your question, just in terms of what drives interest recruiting still to an extent, but I think recruiting like traditional recruiting has changed. Like the portal this past offseason was huge. Like it was some of the best traffic we've ever gotten. And now obviously you'll get like small bumps for things like Trent Sicily committing and I think Braylon Mullins coming up will be a pretty big deal
regardless of of where he goes. But I just think the recruiting coverage in general has changed that. People are more now, I think invested and excited about the portal, which is just kind of weird like you used to when the season ended in late March, things used to die down pretty quickly. And I think this year like through like the end of May, things were pretty hot and heavy in terms of the traffic that we were getting. So that that, that that's obviously a big one.
And then obviously when when there's things like, you know, NCAA investigations or bad news, things like that, also kind of Dr. negativity also unfortunately drives clicks. I mean, when they had that accident, you know, like it was a 2015 or 16, 2014 maybe with the Devin Davis thing. I don't remember that being a big thing. And but overall, I think the number one thing is just winning, like when I use good and the team's winning a lot of games, which I think everybody's hopeful for.
That's going to be the case this year. I think it could be good for everybody involved. Podcasts, websites, social media, following I. Agree. You talk about recruiting, is there 1 recruit over the years that you wish we would we would
have gotten? Gary Harris, I would say, OK, that that was that's probably the one that I'll look at and say I don't know how much he would have changed things for that one season, but because they already had OL Depot, obviously, but just imagine him on that team with Yogi and Oladipo Zeller, Watford, she I mean, like, what if he's your 6th man? I mean, he's I thought he was just a tremendous player as a high school high school player.
And you look at the rest of that recruiting class, it was largely, I mean, it was talked about as like the movement, but it was largely a bust everywhere else. I mean, Perea was a guy that I thought was going to be really good just from CM and AU with the tools, but it never really worked out. Peter Jerkin clearly didn't have a big role. Ron Patterson signed and then never really, I don't think, I don't think he lasted through the first summer. I think he went to like school
after that. And then Jeremy Hollowell was another guy that had to go elsewhere and to find like his role in college and didn't play a huge role. I think 2 years he spent in Bloomington. So that to me looking back at that class, but but yeah, just think about Gary Harrison and Yogi for multiple years in Bloomington. That would have been a lot of fun. So that that probably the one I look at least since I've been covering the team that I guess the one that kind of got away. How about you?
Is there any that's a good? One, it's a little bit before both of our times, but I and I don't I mean this is the the the reporting wasn't quite the same back then, but just Greg Oden still kills me. I mean that probably keeps Mike Davis here for a while. So that's a whole nother like,
how does that roll out? But you know, the the the rumor always was that, you know, he just wouldn't recruit Davis, wouldn't recruit Mike Conley, which is funny because like Mike Conley still playing in the NBA and was was I mean it's not like he sucked in college either. He was a huge part of that. But it's, you know, you, you look at those teams. I mean, I think that was like it would have been with like Marco Killingsworth and I I'm not sure who else is on those like teams
that it would have been. But you know, that was an Ohio State program that was kind of just going along. And then like they add those two dudes and it's like they're in the final four just like that. Like it just happened.
So that's one that always hurt. And then this is very personal for me. You know, with football there is right when my wife and I moved back pretty shortly thereafter, Demarlo Belcher was a wide receiver for football who went to North Side where my wife went to high school up in Fort Wayne. That was always like really cool to root for a player who went to her high school. As I've mentioned many times, my wife is a teacher at Westfield up here.
She had Braden Smith in class and it's like he's right up here. I'm watching him play high school basketball like it's Westfield and I think he's also a great player to watch and like embodies everything. And then just like not only doesn't go to IU, goes to Purdue, like it just it sucks all the way around.
Like I think Braden is awesome. I don't think he's a program changing player like maybe Harris or Odin is, but it's it's very personal to me that it's just and it's still going on that it's like, damn it, that would have been perfect to have him somebody I could root for. And it's not. And then seeing all everybody around here being huge Purdue as they like Braden, as they should be.
Fans of Braden Smith because we live in Westfield and he's a great example of of, you know, what we produce. But it's like, but there weren't Purdue stuff. So that one's it. That one is continuing to hurt Alex. Did you see him at all in high school? I watched him a little bit, yeah. What'd you think? I thought he was a good play. I mean, that was a good. I didn't see this. I, I didn't think this was going to happen. I thought he was good. Yeah. And I thought he was really
good. I couldn't understand why Archie wasn't on him more. I I would agree it. Didn't It didn't make a lot of sense to me. Like now breaking news here. I mean, everything that I heard, he was he, he, you know, his, his family was, was fans of IU and I think he would have would have been very receptive to any kind of recruiting. But my understanding is he wasn't even got a sniff from Archie. Another one, another one that just popped into my head was Kyle Guy. Oh yeah, yeah, yeah.
Because everything you heard with him was like he was receptive to IE too. And I know they recruited him and offered him, but it was almost like they didn't go 110% after him. Then he goes on to Virginia and look at the success they had wins the national championship so. Yeah, As we talk about this, it leads to another question, something that me and other friends talk about when we get deep and IU basketball, something GAIL and I used to talk about a lot more.
But I'm just curious to ask you like I have my answer to this question, but I will obviously ask you first. You look at all these other programs, you know, UCLA, North Carolina, Kentucky, teams that, you know, we're blue bloods or still blue bloods or teams that kind of have gone up and down.
You know, do do you think there's anything inherent holding Indiana back from being elite or do you think, but I'll, I'll leave it there, Like do you think there's anything and what would it be that's holding Indiana back from getting back to an elite program? Wow. It's a tough question and I'm not thought about it in depth, but like off the top of my head, I think what you see as some of the other programs is maybe less patience in terms of when things go poorly. But looking back in North
Carolina, when was it? Dardy was there for a couple years and it was bottomed. Out. Years, right, I think he bought bottomed out like pretty quickly and I was like, all right, this isn't going to work. We got to make sure we go get the guy. I I think, I think they've actually not done a terrible job with the hires in terms of who the coaches are.
Going back to Samson, he was a really good coach, obviously a proven guy that went to the final four at Oklahoma and now look at what he's doing at Houston. You kind of look at that and say, man, if you could have just kept off the three-way calls, what what could he have built in Bloomington? I know there was some off the court stuff, but he was actually a pretty solid hire.
Tom Crean, when they hired him, he'd he'd gone to a Final Four at Marquette. He had Dwyane Wade and had some really high moments, but there was just not the consistency. Archie Miller looked like a a slam dunk to everybody. He was the the hot name in the coaching carousel that season.
And you look at that coaching cycle, if you would have told me Archie was going to be the worst of the three Big 10 hires that year, which were Chris Holtman, Brad Underwood and Archie, I would have told you probably you were crazy. But Brad Underwood now to me is the top three for coach in the Big 10. Holtman was really good early at Ohio State and made a lot of NCAA tournaments, but again, they didn't that wasn't good enough. So they made a move with him and now he's at the Paul.
And then Archie obviously got four years in Indiana, never makes a tournament. So I don't necessarily think there's anything holding the back, but I do think like you've got to have the right hire at the right time.
And I don't necessarily think they've had that with with Woodson. You know, I think a lot of people, I think maybe he thinks based on I'll listen to an interview with him over the weekend that he did up at Big 10 Media Day with CBS Sports. I'm not sure if you listen to it. Yeah, it was a Matt Norlander. It was like 11 or 12 minutes. It's on YouTube. If you cannot watch it, check it out.
But he he was asked like a couple questions and he like brought up the fans in the media like a criticism a little bit. And it's like, you know, I, I remember like after Woodson's first couple years, I was like super complimentary of him from the standpoint of, you know, bringing in the pieces that he did, going to the tournament for two straight years, retaining Trace Jackson Davis, you know, making, you know, the tournament to me was a big deal over two years.
And then last year was a step back. And I think a lot of this like basically acknowledge that it wasn't the the results of Indiana should have had and they should have been a much better team. So I think this is very much like a year where he's going to have to prove a lot of things to a lot of people. I think there's people are optimistic in terms of just the the program and the pieces on the team.
But I think I think there's a lot of people who want to see, you know, a much better product this year. So kind of not, not to go on a tangent here, but I don't think there's anything inherently holding IU back. I just think it's all about getting the right coach at the right time. And I don't necessarily, I mean they've had, they've made some. What looked like at the time, solid hires, But you know, Billy Gillespie also looked like a really good hire Kentucky until he wasn't.
And there's countless other examples of coaches. I mean, you would have told me after Chris Holtman's first couple years at Ohio State that he'd now be coaching at the Paul. I would have told you you're crazy. So it's it's hard, you know, these everyone wants to kind of go play revisionist history and say, well, they should have hired this guy or they should have brought in this guy at that time. But I can't look at any of the hires that they made.
You know, Woodson was interesting just because I don't think anybody saw that one coming. But at least you could see from the standpoint of, you know, he went to IU and they had gone outside the family for what the last three hires prior to that. And they wanted to get an IU guy. And I don't think a lot of people had a strong appetite for Brandon Steve Alford. And there was he was probably the next logical candidate
beyond that. And like I said, done, done well, did well his first two years. I think he took a step back last year and got a lot to pre release it from a wins and losses perspective this year. But I think he knows that and I think the team's going to be much better. But I don't I don't know that anything's holding them back per SE.
I think it's, you know, if you had the right coach at the right time, I think there's nothing stopping Indiana from getting back to that, you know, top five, top ten program status. Yeah, I, I agree with you. I mean, so real quick Fact Check, it's Matt. We, we screwed up Matt Doherty with North Carolina. But I, I always look at Matt Doherty and Gillespie. You mentioned those two guys because it's funny, because you people look back as well.
They sucked in like, you know, North Carolina and Kentucky don't screw around. They make changes. It's even more than that. I mean, you look at Doherty at North Carolina, he went 8 and 20 his second year. He was 19 and 16, 4:00 and 12:00 in the ACC, 6:00 and 10:00. But he was showing improvement. It's not like they were awful. They went to the NIT his second year and it's like not good enough. He's out. Gillespie had two years of Kentucky.
He was 18 and 13 and 22 and 14. He was 12 and four in the SEC his first year and then eight and eight his second year. So a little bit back, but still 22 and 14 his second year. And it's like that's not good enough. And I think it's, you know, people sometimes give Indiana this cred of like all their fans are unreasonable. They don't give enough time. It's like, I, I think sometimes we give too much time. And I'm, I'm not speaking about
current coaching at all. I just, I think when you look at, there's more of a longer term discussion. You look at Archie or what we did with Crean or even Davis, You know, we, I, I don't think we are an unreasonable fan base. I, I think you look at some of those where it's like man 22148 and eight in the conference with Kentucky. That's that's pretty good. I mean, they just they're like, we're done. That's two years when he was the
hottest coaching prospect. But I, I agree a million percent with you. I don't think there's anything holding IU back. And what I've always said is it does, you know, when, when you have the right hire at the right time at the right place, things just click. And I, I think honestly, that's where I would say maybe IU just needs to be a little. And again, I'm not speaking
toward this year at all. I just think at a high level, they probably need to be a little less patient and a little more aggressive with what they do. Because, you know, the, the Archie thing to me again, is a great viewpoint. Like if Indiana would have hired Underwood, it would have been like, you picked the wrong guy. Like, that was the third option of the three coaches. And you know, in the end, you want to pick the best player.
But there is a piece as an AD where you have to kind of understand that you're you're playing a political game here too. So if you're going to, you know, it's a fantasy example here. If you're like playing fantasy football, it's like if you don't take Christian McCaffrey first this year, like you better know what the heck, you better nail that pick or else everyone's going to rail on you. And even then, they'll still make fun of you.
And you know, same thing with drafting in the, in the pros. Sometimes you just have to take guys because it's like, I, I look stupid if I don't take this guy, even if I think he's not the best pick. Long story short said, it's like it's really hard to know how to hire the best coach in a cycle. Sometimes you pick a cycle and like you look at that Archie, you know, the, the, the Archie Underwood and Holtman cycle.
It's like there wasn't maybe Underwood will get there, but it's not like there is a, you know, Bobby Hurley in there or you know, Danny Hurley in there. Like there wasn't maybe a generational coach there. I, I look at this more as like you just maybe as an, as a staff, just need to be more aggressive and like we just need to take more shots and get more
at bats and just have more. And, you know, again, you just look at other programs, they maybe have a shorter hook than we do. And maybe that is what is slightly holding us back. And again, I don't, I'm not saying anything about Woodson this year or even next year's. I just, I think that that might be, you know, sometimes maybe you get a little too complacent. And just like we got to give
this more time, more time. It's like if you get it right, it doesn't, you know, it's going to be right. I think it's really hard to figure out who's going to be a good coach. And so to me it's like the way to solve that is you just take a bunch more cracks at the apple because it's really hard to tell.
I don't know. Yeah. The other thing I think like right now with IU and specifically, I think that it's kind of a double edged sword from the standpoint of realistically, if you have to make A, and I'm not, I'm not saying anyway there's going to be a change anytime soon because I think there's a really good chance that Mike Woodson has a great year and this discussion
is completely gone. But you know, people that people that really pushed last spring for a change like in the fan base, I looked at what happened at Louisville and Kentucky in terms of what they were able to hire and I said what Indiana fans have actually been happy with either of those hires. I think people would have been complaining about both of those hires because Pat Kelsey and Mark Pope, I believe, have combined for a grand total of 0 NCAA tournament wins.
Now you think about this, would you ever believe that Louisville and Kentucky would have to go into a hiring process and end up with a coach that had zero NCAA tournament success? Do you think Indiana fans, when there's a, whether it's, you know, a year from now or five years from now when Mike Woodson retires, do you think they're going to be happy with a, hiring a coach that's never won an NCAA Tournament game? It's, it's just different. I mean.
Well, and I guess I guess that would be if I had to say what is holding Indiana back, that might be it. Is there in this kind of weird no man's land of they're they're like an elite team, but they're not really able to hire their. And and what I mean is like, you look at what will take it to IU football, you look at what Signetti is doing with IU football and it's like, dude, this is a home run hire.
But again, going back to my like, you also have to win the press conference a little bit if you're the AD like in the offseason. There's no way Alabama could have hired Signetti. Like it's just I mean, he he had Alabama ties. Like if they would have hired Signetti, that place would Tuscaloosa would have gone nuts. Like are you insane? This guy JMU Like it would not have worked. I mean, Caleb De Boer is a
fantastic hire. I think they only were able to hire him because he took Washington in the national championship game. I mean, if, if Washington kind of shits out middle of the year and doesn't make the College Football Playoff, you know, you're talking about two losses for Washington last year that let's just add 2 losses to their schedule. It's like, that's still a really good year for Washington. I don't think Alabama could have
hired De Boer as a team. And so you're, I, I do wonder if Indiana's kind of stuck in the spot where they're not able to take a shot at. Like, you know, I think it was the year before we went for Archie, you know, Nate Oates was available at Buffalo. It's like, I don't know if Indiana fans at that time would have been like, the hell are we
doing? Like we're So I don't that that might be that might be we might be getting to our answer here is that could be part of the problem is that, you know, some of these smaller schools like Alabama in basketball, they're able to take a shot. It's like, what do we have to lose? Like, let's let's just keep rolling the dice. And sometimes, you know, the the guys like Signeti or Nate Oates are the ones that, you know, no other high level team would have taken them.
So they're able to make these runs at places that, you know, we're able to kind of take a a shot. I don't know. The other thing is these coaches can stay where they are when is just as many games and not deal with the scrutiny that they would deal with that, IE right, like a Scott Drew, for example, he turned out Kentucky. He's at Baylor, He's won a national championship there. They gave him they gave him a new arena. They've upgraded his practice facilities.
He's got all the money he wants. He's basically the mayor of that area. He can do whatever he wants from, you know, resources perspective. I'm sure he's got whatever NIL he needs. Why would he want the aggravation of going to Kentucky or Indiana or Louisville when he can just stay at Baylor and win
as many games? Same thing with I mean, Hurley's a little bit different, but I think a lot of people, if you had told people at the end of the season that the Lakers and Kentucky were going to make a run at Hurley and he'd basically be like no to both. I mean, that's what other basketball coaching jobs are more hope high profile than than those. And and he turned those down because he realizes, you know, I can do everything I want to do from a wins and losses perspective.
There's not as much pressure on me at this place. And I do think there's a probably you have to have the right mindset to take the Indiana job. And I mean that in the way of you're going to be the most recognizable figure in many ways in the entire state. You're going to be every move you make, you know, every recruit you don't get, every game you lose. It's going to be talked about on a podcast like this or it's going to be written about on a website or social media.
You got to be pretty thick skinned. Like you can't worry about what's being said on the outside. And and that maybe that's not everybody. I mean, I, I think that was one of the problems with, you know, it would have been fine for Archie if he would have won more. I think he would have been completely fine. But I don't think he understood when he came in, like what the job was like from responsibilities, like with the fan base and engaging the fan base and the media
responsibilities. And I can remember like times when I saw him out at like high school games and stuff and he like looked like completely like, I don't want to say annoyed, but just uncomfortable that people like even wanted to come up and talk to him or take a picture. It's like, man cream, he was eating that stuff up. He was like hugging people and taking pictures of that. Like he understood that part of it.
So it's just a really complex job too from that standpoint, because there's these crazy expectations, which I think is great. The minute Indiana basketball loses its expectations is the minute you know that it's going to go even further down the the pegging order where it is like right now, I'd say you look at Ken Palm, I think it's like a top 25 job, which is still pretty good, which I think we all believe it should be a top ten job just based on performance. I'm not saying job, but
performance. That's the Ken Palm area. That's where they're ranked. So it's, yeah, it's it's just a really, it's just one of those jobs where you got to have the
right person. And I'd say there's only a handful of those in the country where it's finding them right, right ingredients and mixing them all together and find the right person is not easy to do. And you've also still got, you know, a large portion of the fan base that's grew up watching Indiana be dominant in the 70s and the 80s and into the early 90s. And those people are still hoping and wishing that any and I could get back to that.
And I think those are expectations that are unlikely to be the the run that Knight had in Bloomington and what he did. I just, I don't know that there's anybody you can hire and be able to do that because look at all the Big 10 titles he won, winning three national championships. It's a different era now,
college basketball. So I think the thing that Indiana needs to get back to is just, we talked about this a little bit on the on the podcast, on the Brink episode is get to the tournament every year and give yourself chances to advance. Like that's where what's missing is they've just not been at the table enough. I mean, you're not going to, if you're not sitting at the table, you're not going to get fed, right? I mean, you got to get there and they've not gotten there nearly
enough. The thing with night is and basketball was wildly different at that point, but you had, you know, Branch McCracken, you had the years with, you know, two titles. Indiana basketball had also fallen off at that point as well. And I think they were at that point where they were willing to take a shot at a young up and coming coach in night.
You know, I don't and again, this is obviously way, way before my time, but it's it's almost like the the the seas leveled with like, all right, you know, they realize the time like, all right, we're not the same program we were before. We can't get the best. I don't say bad, like we're willing to take a real gamble here on a guy.
And that's that was you mentioned the run Knight had like that was always the when when he passed away and we did some kind of retro about a year ago, almost just from retrospectives. Like the thing that I was amazed by was, I mean, I kind of knew this, but really looking at it,
just how effing young he was. Just he was so young and, you know, everyone saw, you know, he was I, I think, you know, he, he won his second or third title before anybody else had ever won like 1. I mean, he was like 35 and you know, he, he looked older as a younger person. I think he was only like 46. He's like my age when he won an 87. I mean, it was, it was wild, just insane how young he was. And I think he was 29.
I'm doing all of memory, but you know, right around there when they hired him, like again, it's like I think Indiana had gotten to that point where they were willing to take a risk. And maybe that's, you know, we as a fan base, if and when we have a new coaching search, at some point, maybe we have to be willing to like, look, let's let's take that risk, but knowing that it may not work either.
I'm going to go off this, we'll kind of wrap up with with this, you know, changing IU. There's always been talk about, you know, the, the the silly things, the traditions and stuff. I don't think any of that stuff matters for like the program, like, you know, doing any kind of change or anything would, would get us a title.
But I'm curious, what's 1 tradition you wouldn't never change the Indiana basketball and one tradition that you're totally fine changing because I, I have, I have, I have a couple answers on this. I'm, I'm asking you blinds. I didn't give you time to think about it, and I'm happy to go first if you want time to think too.
I would say the one that I wouldn't want to change would just be the the candy striped pants, because I think it's something that people associate directly with the program. And you know, you see kids and you see, I've seen kids as little as three or four years old and I've seen like grandfathers and wearing those at the games.
Like it's something that everybody like looks at Indiana basketball and says like this is what it other, other fan bases like, like to make fun of it, which is like that's my reason for like keep it, right? Like it bothers other people. They get mad about like the candy stripe, like looks so stupid or whatever. I'm like, it's Indiana's thing. Like keep it, it's fine. Like the thing I was, and this
could be controversial. The thing that I don't really care too much about seeing change will be having names on the back of the jerseys because I, I just don't like I, I, I don't think it's as big of a deal maybe as some people make it out to be. It's always like, well, we play for the name on the front, which is true, but that doesn't mean you can't have a name on the back of the jersey. And now with NIL, I mean, imagine, excuse me, they, I know they've tried to sell like some jersey.
I was in Bloomington a couple of years ago when I saw I think it was like a hood gifino like jersey that had for sale at this Kirkwood place and it looked like terrible because it wasn't like a actual jersey like. I know I see those around like I see Isaiah Thomas Jersey. He's like that. That doesn't exist. That wasn't real.
Right, right. So I, I, I wouldn't have a problem with it. I mean, I know a lot of people would probably disagree, but I just, I think times change from some of some things change and a lot of programs, there's probably a couple other ones that don't have the names in the back of the jersey, but they're few and far between. And I, I just wouldn't have a problem. Or maybe you 110% disagree with me, but I I just I wouldn't have
a problem with that changing. No, it's, I mean, it's more fun if we completely disagree, but we don't. Those are my exact. I, I have a couple of the things that I'll change that I'll get to. I completely agree. I think, you know, when I went to IU, you know, I, I mentioned this, I did some media IU and like, it was wild how uncoordinated IU was at the time. But basketball was like its own. They had their own script logo. They had their own, you know,
Trident logo. They they just, they had everything on their own and everyone else had a different, they had different colors. I mean, at that point, you know, football was doing the Oval and the black, but literally there was different variants of the IU Trident across all sports. But basketball like had their own. The kind of the rounded version was like that was theirs. They had their own shades of colors.
It was wild. But you also, you know, looking back, the candy stripe was just basketball. That's all it was. Now I and I love to see how IU is kind of taking it, marketing it in a lot of other sports. I know swimming and diving always had this candy stripes too. So I, I, I rephrase that for a SEC, but like, now you see it, you know, in football, like all the sports, kind of take the candy stripe as, as, as an Indiana thing. I think it's great.
So I agree with you. Like that would be the one thing I don't think you ever change because it's a great marketing. It's a great differentiator. I agree with you on the names of the jerseys, especially in the NIL era. It's it's a bit of a bygone era. It it Harkins to that was a that was really a night thing And you know, Knight had his time and he was great, but we've we've moved on. Not moved on is the wrong thing, but it's like it's just it's a
different era. I I don't know you have to have names in the jerseys on all games, But I I also think kind of like I'm cool with monkeying with the jerseys a lot more. I mean, in the in this world of secondary and alternative jerseys into being a cool thing and having, you know, sales opportunity for that. This is partially our, I think our deal with Adidas. I don't think they treat us like
a high level program. So we get kind of garbage stuff, but I've always been really unimpressed with our secondary and you know, uniforms, the times we change, it's like the little flowery stuff. It's like, dude, just go with black uniforms, like try the Oval on a basketball. Like let's really go nuts. Like try some really wild like stuff like I, I'd be so cool with that and just see them, you know, try that. Maybe a different court design.
I know I'm getting way off the rails here, but like that I the other. Two well, aren't they going to have like sponsors, sponsorships on the court this year for the first year potentially? Are they? I thought I read that. I think so they, they, they solicited, we got an e-mail a couple of months ago they were soliciting like business opportunities for I get a name on the court. So I think they're at least open
to that. I mean, I'd be, I love the, the center court design is iconic, but like you could change that up every so often, like have the block I have Indiana, you know, spray painted across or something like kind of like, you know, maybe you'd do candy stripes down the lane or something. I, I think we need to be open to some of those changes. The other two things I would say this is a real minor one. It's a shout out to my buddy Tom, who's been saying this for years.
The the under 8 flag timeout is really cool. I think they they need to move it to the under 4 minute timeout. It's just, it is, it's always been something that the fans get hyped up for and they're kind of like pumped. And then it's like, all right, we still got 7 minutes a game. And then it's like kind of like it feels like the energy dies down. Like I've always I agree with my buddy Tom, like I think that should go at the under 4 timeout.
And then it's like maybe you stand for the rest of the game and that becomes a thing. We're like this pumps us up and then we're just going to own it for the last four minutes. And then I would also say, you know, they've done some renovations. They can keep it for a while, but I, I don't think the idea of building a new stadium should be off the table either. I think assembly hall is a unique environment. It's a really cool environment.
I think the, the sound is I, I like that it's different than all the other places, but I don't think that we have to I, I, I'm always open for a discussion of a new arena as long as it's not something like funny. Let's bash on Ohio State a little more An arena like that seems very like the value city arena just seems boring and antiseptic and kind of like doesn't have any character like maybe build AI don't say a replica, but something unique
like assembly hall. Maybe have some more wooden bleachers, but build it in a way where it's easy to get in and out of There's more concession. There's a little more, you know, luxury suite options. I I'm I'm not anti let's look for a new arena as well. So I'm those are some of the things that I would look to change as well, but I think we're pretty much in line with the two main ones that we had.
Would you have a problem if it was something like the Field house but a little bit smaller like game bridge? No, I think Game Bridge is a great place to watch a game. I love, I love going there. I will rephrase. Game bridge is a great place to watch a game if you're in the low level or the mid level. This is sounding like, you know, elitist. Yeah. But it's not like the upper, it's not like the upper level. And Assembly Hall is great. Right now.
No, no, you're no, you're right. Game bridge is better. The upper level and game bridge is can be rough but I think upper levels in all stadiums suck. And to your point, the upper level and assembly Hall is, is really rough and the balcony is like a whole nother level of, of seats. And that's that's something that always bugs me when people that, you know, Memorial Stadium is different. There's a lot of good views and even the high level in football is OK.
And like Memorial Stadium was a pretty, pretty intimate area or intimate arena. People who don't like, who are like always bitching about, man, the students aren't showing up in the balconies or we're not filling the balconies. Assembly Hall, I'm always like, have you sat in the balcony? Have you sat up there? Because I've been there a lot as a student and like, they suck. Like they are awful seats if you're even slightly drunk, of which most students probably
are. Like I'm worried I'm just, you know, I'm, I was worried I was going to just completely go over the edge and just fall down those stairs. Like it is, it's a rough hang up there. And even this, you know, the, the seats up in the upper corners, I used to, I remember going to games with Galen, we had to bring notebooks because the small scoreboards, you couldn't see the scoreboards in some of the corners of Assembly Hall. They've now made the scoreboards
bigger. They have some TV's and stuff up there. But those, there's those corner seats where you feel like you're in a different arena because you can't see anything on the other side. And it's just, you feel like you're in this little cocoon of stuff. So I, I mean, I, I would always use that as my argument to people who are just and I, I love assembly Hall. It's a totally one of a one of one place, but it isn't the best basketball viewing experience.
And you're always going to have trouble filling those 4 to 5000 really bad seats if unless the team is just like absolutely elite. Yeah. I think if you built a new stadium to, you probably maybe want to go a little bit smaller, right? Yeah. In terms of the seats, I know Louisville built this, the Yum Center, and I know they've had some terrible teams the last couple years, but even some of those years, I think they've it's like 21 or 22,000.
Even when they've been good, they have a hard time filling that. I know simply Hall's not that big, but maybe you build it to 15 or 16 instead of what, 17 or something? Make it a little bit smaller. When you can re engineer where the students go too like that, that's something. Exactly like have the students all on one side, like down close to like make it a little bit more of a intimidating atmosphere.
I'm not saying I mean I've been to a lot of the big 10 venues and assembly Hall when it's on fire is as intimidating as it gets. It's like Mackie and Assembly to me are like, right, like in terms of the noise and how loud I can get are one A1B, however you want to put them. But when things aren't going so well and the students maybe aren't as enthused there, there can be times too where it's just
not as lively. And I think if you can do something to kind of get people a little bit closer to the action and get I'm not saying the students aren't well represented now because they've got a ton of seats of it. In terms of the seats allotted, it's as much as anybody in the country, but like align them in such a way to where they're making a little bit more of an impact.
Like, you can put them like down around the court in a new place and then you still give the people who are your season ticket holders and have a lot of skin in the game really good seats, you know, in the lower level too, so. Yeah, no, I I agree. All all, all hypotheticals that
we probably don't have to worry. About yeah, none of it's going to happen, but you see at Memorial Stadium they changed the students section seating this year and they they put them kind of wrapped around the back end zone or the North End zone, I guess. And it is really made a difference. Like it's amazing. Just the same number of students just in a different, different setup has really changed the vibe and the sounds of that
place. Yeah, it's just, it's too bad the students have lost a lot of the good seats they used to have in Assembly Hall. But it's, it's, it's money. It's, you know, and it's, it's, it's what they got to do. It's just, it is the realities of the of the new world. Absolutely. All right. Any final thoughts on this coming season? Season? I mean, we did most of it already. This has been a fun
retrospective. But do you, are you since we last talked or are you any more or less excited for this upcoming season? I'm, I'm just as excited as I was before. I'm, I'm just excited to see Miles Rice in particular because I think since we talked, maybe maybe I'd already gone to, I used media day. I don't remember exactly the day. It was a couple weeks ago. So maybe I used media day had already taken place, but not sure how much we talked about this. But he was the guy at media day
that I was super impressed with. Just his demeanor and the way he presented himself just in terms of taking on that leadership mantle and the fact that they took him to Big 10 media day in Chicago. And I believe he's one of the captains for this year's team. That tells me a lot about it, just how he's being viewed internally. And he also plays the most important position on the team, in my opinion. When was the last time I you had
a great point guard? You look back, it's what I mean Hudshafino there for that that year was kind of a combo guard, but probably Yogi. Yogi, right. So everyone is talking about Balo and Renew and Imbacco and Balo got the, I think the preseason first team all Big 10 honor to me. I'm looking at Miles Rice and saying if he can be the player that he was last year at Washington State, which was an all PAC 12 first team performer, the PAC 12 freshman of the year, and build on that.
I think it makes Indiana, you know, look at what the point guard play was last year. And this is nothing against Scape Cups, but he even admitted to us that immediate day when we talked to him that he struggled last season and has a lot of work to do to the kind of get himself to where he wants to be as a player. And I think Indiana really
shored up its guard guard play. And couple that with what should be a really good front court, and I think there's no reason that this team can't be competing near the top of the Big 10. When you're seeing the the projections come in, I mean, we're it's like us and Purdue 1212 kind of that's that seems to be the the consensus and the Purdue thing it, it feels like that's more just on inertia and you know, what they've done in the past, just kind of giving it
on very good, confident, you know, very good reason, but kind of being like, all right, well, painter does this every year. So we'll do it again with this group. So, you know, it does feel like we have a real shot to be in that top three. Yeah, that's why I picked Purdue in part was just because I've seen it before, right? I mean, it's hard to, you know, it's hard to take away from what they've done now over a sustained period.
I remember those teams that he had like the the two years Randy was really good with cream and they just beat the doors off Purdue. It was like a game in a Mackey. I remember going to was like 97 to 60 or something crazy like that. And I think since then painters figured out like what he wants to do from a program perspective and how he wants to build his teams. And I think the ceiling some years may not be as high as some of the other programs in the Big 10.
But the floor, I think you pretty know what you're going to, pretty much know what you're going to get, which is going to be a solid competitive team. And there's just so many question marks with a lot of these other Big 10 teams like UCLA, they were really bad last year, but they they really upgraded via the portal. Some people have picked them.
Oregon's another team that I think a lot of people are high on coming over from the PAC 12. But we haven't seen these teams as as up close and not as familiar. A lot of the people from the media picking these teams. Same thing with Illinois. I think that's kind of more of a pick for Brad Underwood too, because look at I think they have two or three scholarship players left from last year's Elite Eight team. And So what are you basing a
projection on for them? You're basing it on the fact that you you trust Brad Underwood to put together A-Team. It's kind of the same thing with Painter. Same thing with Izzo. How long have we given him the benefit of the doubt? And he's underperformed now for several seasons in a row. I think this year's Big 10 race is going to be fascinating from the perspective of there's a lot of really solid teams.
I don't know that there's a dominant 1, and we had that last year with Purdue. I think it was a foregone conclusion that Purdue was gonna win the league. This year. I picked Purdue to win the league, but if you asked me if I'd pick Purdue with the field, I'm taking the field, so. Yeah, maybe that makes. Sense more, I'm out with it. Well, Alex, we've gone over an hour. We we gave you the time, dude, it's been great talking to you. This is always fun.
I like kind of doing, doing something different than just a normal preview. But let's try and get together before maybe the end of the season and we do a little priests, you know, postseason preview. Hopefully we're, we're looking at a protected NC double AC and we have some fun discussions with that that. Would be nice, thanks for having me as always. Like I said, you all do a great job with Crimson Cast. I look forward to listening to whatever the next episode is
over there. We got some football coming up, but no, you guys, I I look at inside the halls, the gold standard. So it's a it's awesome having you on. I appreciate it and thank everybody for listening. And until next time, this is Scott for Crimson cast signing off.