You're listening to the Back Home Network presented by Home Field Apparel. Welcome back to Crimson Gas, Galen Clavier joining you here. It is Monday night, the 20th of May. Happy early birthday to everybody's either favorite or second favorite Golden Retriever, Nelson as he turns 8 tomorrow. So happy birthday buddy. Where he's chewing something
over there. So we're gonna leave him, let him be. But anyway, we are 2/3 of the way through May, and if you didn't get a chance to listen to our show from a couple of days ago, Scott and I walked through a bunch of things with IU basketball, IU football, touched on some IndyCar. We got the Indy 500 coming up. We got the Pacers knocking off the Knicks so now the Pacers are in the Eastern Conference finals.
It feels like like springtime has come to Indiana like literally and figuratively with sports. Lots of good stuff going on. You add on to that IU football and all the positive momentum there and like people actually
paying attention. You got national like podcasts and and and you know writers coming in and talking to Kurt Signetti and just really shining a light on this program and who better to talk about the current state of IU football than Taylor Layman, a bite sized bison coming in to join us once again. It's been a while Taylor. Great to see you again. How you doing? I'm I'm good. Galen. I'm good.
This is my first time on video. I've I've, I've been I and and my quality on here is based on your teaching as well so. I, I, I, I mean that might be a positive or negative depending on how the quality maintains throughout the court. I'll take it one way or the other. You know I'm either doing a wonderful job or I need to do better, right. But no it's it's good to have
you back. And yeah we've been for those of you who've been wondering, we have been trying to do more in the video format because quite frankly that's where podcasting has already headed and and the parts of podcasting that haven't headed there are it's it's kind of like if you ever played Grand Theft Auto Vice City and and you listened to the the wave like Wave 103 like that radio station. There's that whole segment I I forget which song it's leading
into. But the DJ, you know, is lamenting the fact that music videos have taken over. And you know if for more or less like the paraphrasing on it is like, you know, for for physically unattractive people, this has seriously hurt their careers. So you know, somehow we're still going on Crimson Cast despite the fact of the pivot to video, but it's it.
Is the reason I write. You know, I, I, I the moment that I saw like, you know, Mad Dog Russo on video regularly and nobody freaked out, it's like that's not an attractive man, you know, and no one really cares. And so I do think that there is there's hope yet for for most of the people out there doing podcasts. And so we're trying to get on video more often. For those of you who are listening to this on Apple or on Spotify, you can also watch it on Spotify.
We've been trying to upload the videos there. We've also got the back home network YouTube channel, 6400 subscribers and growing and you can comment directly there. Then some nice back and forth with people, some not so nice back and forth with people too on there in terms of questions. But hey, it's all for the engagement, right? But check out the video if you get a chance folks.
Also a couple quick reminders. First of all, we're part of the back Home network and the back home network is brought to you by Home Field apparel. Your place to go for the finest and college fashions, the softest fabrics, the coolest designs, tons of IU football gear and they just keep adding to it. I am certain they will be more Signeti inspired apparel coming at some point in the next six
months. So head on over to home field apparel.com get what's already there which is tremendous and incredible. Use the code Home 23. Get 15% off your first order. Again home field apparel.com. Give them a follow on Instagram as well. And just a reminder, we're on sub stack as is our friend Taylor with Bite sized Bison. You just launched your sub stack and it's doing quite well as it should.
As you are a tremendous resource for all things IU Football Taylor, tell them how to find your sub stack. Yeah it's bisys bison.substack.com.
I just kind of a it's not yeah I thought I should have thought about this when when I was coming up with the name of the of the sub stack it it it should be a little bit easier to understand and and type you know Crimson cast is is pretty clear you know how how to spell that it's it's bite sized bison like kind of like the bite sized candy bars you know but with a bison. And not and not bite size which is a A I've made that mistake before bite sized with AD.
Yes, exactly. Yes. And and that was with the intention of making these short and for anybody who reads bite sized bison, it's it's definitely not short. So I'm trying to figure that out still. But no bite sized bison.substack.com. Or you can follow me at by Taylor L and on Twitter and and access it that way.
Yeah. I mean you got to say like compared to an actual bison and the weight of a bison, which is, you know, we're talking tons, even a long article on bite sized bison is bite sized in comparison. So I think you're doing OK from an adjective perspective, really. I appreciate that, GAIL. Absolutely. Also we're on sub stack as well. crimsoncast.substack.com, free subscription, over 900 people.
Now we hit the 900 person barrier in terms of subscriptions, which was awesome And it's free to sign up, get the podcasts and other items, articles, links to other podcasts, things that we find interesting, delivered right to your inbox. We've also got AVIP section that you can subscribe to. It's inexpensive $5 a month, $50 a year and we do produce VIP videos.
Scott actually put one out today for those of you who have been there you go. So Scott explaining priority points, I believe in that one, and we'll have some other ones coming up here relatively soon. I got some stuff to get off my chest, so that's where you get to hear me get stuff off my chest. More so than on the regular show, which who would have thought that was possible? But anyway, head on over to crimsoncast.substack.com. Thank you. Anyway, let's dive into it.
We all heard. Oh, sorry. We all heard how you felt about the Northwestern. Game, right? I was shocked. That had such an impact. I who knew, right? I guess I need to. I need to freak more often on the podcast. It gets gets, gets that engagement again, right? So Taylor, before we get with a bunch of questions, we're not going to get to all of them but with several on Instagram with several on on Twitter.
But let's you and I start off by hitting couple of things that you are most interested in. I I guess maybe first of all, I don't know that we've gotten a chance to get your recap and thoughts about the spring game and some of the roster moves that happened thereafter. So why don't you hit us with
that? I know you talked about it a bit on on Bite Sized Bison, but for the folks who haven't read that, what were your overall takeaways from that game and what we saw in the couple of weeks afterwards? Yeah, I thought the running backs were super explosive. I think those guys are going to be a real asset this year. It's kind of hard to tell what the offensive line was like or really what the running game was like in general, just because the defensive line was kind of not in great shape.
You know James Carpenter wasn't playing in the 1st place and he's the number one defensive tackle. Marcus Burris was the only one playing who probably will play a lot of minutes or a lot, not minutes, a lot of snaps this this season of defensive tackle. But then they added CJ West and Tyree Tucker there after the game. And I think the defensive tackle is actually kind of a strength, one of the strengths of the defense now. But cornerback really jumped out to me as a concern.
That's probably my biggest concern on the roster right now, even over defensive end. I just, I don't think there's a lot of proven production there and we might be able to get into that later. But you know, I I I thought the quarterbacks were, you know, a little, a little messy and wide receivers too, a bit. But that's just kind of to be to be expected. I know everybody took the Anderson Kobe thing and he looked good.
But I will say, you know one of his one of his catches was over a a walk on and and that same walk on gave up the Donovan McCauley touchdown. That's just how it is in these spring games. And so, you know, it's it's kind of tough to gauge how how good these guys really are, especially in open space. In in a spring game, I was mostly looking at the line of scrimmage. And yeah, I mean it, it kind of felt like a typical spring game.
But honestly, it was just great to be seeing a spring game here. Deanna, I can't. Believe we're We're allowed to have a spring game. Who knew, right? Yeah. And everybody seemed to be having a great time. The energy was there was great there. I I had some things to do.
I'm like should I go to this? But when I got there I was like oh man, I'm I'm so happy I came cause the energy was awesome and and it was so worth it. I I was really happy I ended up going, but yeah, no. And I know you were in the press box for it. Galen How was that? It was good. I mean I, you know, I'm in the press box about once every two years covering something or whatever and I'm always shocked at how far away it is from the
field. It just it feels it's like it's almost like you're you're in a like a Zeppelin or you know some kind of dirigible like hovering over the field. It's like I kind of see down there there's I think there's football players and it's it's it's a really, it's a disconcerting for someone like me who likes to be close to the action. It's not a great way I think, to to watch the game, but I I echo a lot of your thoughts. I mean, I thought the running backs looked really explosive.
I thought there was some good athleticism. It felt like, to a large degree, you know, there it was. What was interesting to me was kind of watching the quarterback interplay with the receivers and with the lines. And it's clear that they are a ways away still from the timing and from the things you need, as one would expect. But I was, and I think this was something that was brought up, I was pleased with how Tavin Jackson played. You know, I think Curtis Rourke still rounding himself into
shape. It'd be great to have competition, like actual competition at the quarterback position and not bias the system so heavily one way or another that it overly favors one quarterback, like I think you could argue we saw last year. And so to look at Jackson, being able to step into a whole new system and actually have some zip on the ball and and look like you knew where he was supposed to throw, it was good. And you're right.
You know you don't get too bent out of shape in terms of getting excited about the receiving performances given who they were going against. But overall, I was happy to see that it looked like it was at least a plan. And I think that that's a really important starting point, especially since there's still plenty of time before the season
starts. Yeah I agree and and and one thing I forgot to mention too was just the the main thing that I was going into the spring game looking at was offensive philosophy and scheme and how did that differ from the previous one and it differ quite a bit and primarily I've I've always thought the the difference that we were going to see coming into this season from last season and maybe even the season before that was tight end play and how they use Titans and
I just thought the way that they used Titus even Trey Walker putting him in like a trips formation at one point and running him across the the field and and a mesh concept I was like what Trey Walker and so you know I I and I think Zach Horton's very good tight end too so I liked what I saw from that and I thought that was the greatest sign of some sort of creativity offensively and schematically. So that was honestly probably my my favorite take away from the
spring game. I I think that that's all fair and look, I mean obviously at maiden voyage a lot of things that need to be done in between now and when the rubber hits the road at the end of August. But an encouraging start and I agree with you on the tight end front.
I mean the IT always felt like that was a bit of a wasted position in all of the years after Caitlyn De Boer left and it doesn't have to be. I mean that is that's a that is one of the most important positions in offensive football these days because of its versatility with either you know, pass catching, pass blocking, run blocking. I mean there's just all the all these things that the tight ends can do if you're utilizing them correctly.
So we'll see as we move forward with Indiana and and Mike Shanahan decide to do on that front. Let's also talk a little bit about some of the the changes roster wise that we've seen since then. We've seen IU add a couple of notable players on the defensive side of things and that was if we had some concerns roster wise. It really did feel like a lot of them were there. How well has Indiana done since the spring game in plugging some of those holes?
I thought they've done great you know especially a defensive tackle adding CJ W from Kent State and Tyree Tucker from James Madison. I I was always I was always wondering why they didn't add Terry Tucker earlier and I guess they must have thought you know we we have enough defensive tackles there probably isn't room here and then you know what happened happened with Phil Blitty and things so so they're like yeah OK there's room now and and and he you know he has
three years left and and he played a lot of snaps he played over 300 snaps and at James Madison is a true freshman or maybe he's a red shirt freshman I can't remember but he's a freshman regardless and he has three years left and you know I I I thought adding a defensive tackle was awesome and and I think they're gonna be really set there and it's really important that position's really important if it's a tackle because if you listen to the under the hood episode with Pat
Koontz he was saying that they want to attack ball carriers from their inside shoulder which means they're gonna be pushing guys to the to the to the perimeter a lot and you know that might that might you know result in some you know big plays potentially But he said that that's just kind of part of the scheme which is sometimes you might blow run fits but there's technique that they can teach to respond to that that's particularly from like the linebacker and safety.
Positions. So defensive tackle is gonna be really crucial for this team and having four guys that can come in and play is is really good. And then as far as like defensive backs I I don't really know you know what cause they've added DJ Warnell from Arizona and they added Sedarius Doss from Austin P and I think they had added him like the day before the spring game. So he wasn't available.
But you know the I I don't I I said it you know I I released the depth chart recently and I was like I don't really I don't really know exactly where some of these defensive backs are going to be playing cause Nicktoomer's supposed to be a strong safety but they have so many strong safety types in the roster right now and not a lot of free safety types. And then the nickel there's like 4 guys that can play the nickel and I think Sedarius Das is a good fit at the nickel.
But also it's like Terry Jones was playing there and he played well there during the spring game and and Amari Farrell played well at the nickel. Also, you know, I I think they have a lot of talent on the defensive end. It's just getting them in the correct position and not even just position on the field, but just like putting them in the right spot to make plays I think is is going to be interesting.
Yeah you know and the defensive backs and and that room in particular kind of it's an it's a thing you've been talking to me about text about over text and I and I think it's something that has been brought up by some other folks right. Lewis brought it up as well. It's like the coaches have got to figure out how to manage that transition for the guys who haven't played in the Big 10, who who have been playing at at power at a group of five schools or whatever they're calling it
now or or lower FCS. You know, how do they translate up to this level? And we don't have a whole lot of of Power 5 experience. You're kind of rolling the dice. I mean, you can look at a guy's measurables, you can look at how they played against group of Five competition and you can say we think that this will translate, but you don't really
know. Now, the one thing that I've been fascinated by with IU's roster in particular is this idea that there I feel like I've been guys on the roster the last three or four years who probably weren't Power 5 caliber anyway.
You know, if you can, then we've talked about this is this should not be news to anybody who's followed the podcast, 'cause you look at the recruiting that Indiana's done, they've generally been beating Mac schools for players here over the course of the last three or four years, not everybody, but quite a few, especially in those depth positions defensively. And so then it's a matter of well can, if you can get someone who's coming from that level physically.
But is is more a culture to the system. It has played at a higher level. At that level, maybe it's a Washington or maybe it's slightly better, but it's really going to be one of those things where we won't know probably until the UCLA game, how these guys are going to stack up against players that did get recruited and have been playing at that Power Five level at other schools. Yeah, yeah, that's that's a really good point.
Honestly it's probably my greatest concern about the the roster entirely is is how it does that talent because not not everybody's going to hit you know and so getting the majority of them to hit his is the the goal and so you know I I I'm doing a there's there's gonna be a bias bias in soon about I try to find some data about you know making the transition specifically from group of five to power five.
It didn't really go into the FCS to FBS, but there are actually far fewer defensive players that make that to that specific jump than you would think like in the last couple years. Last year it kind of blew up and there were more. But like even in 2022 there weren't that many guys who were playing as a starter at that group of five level and then moved to the power five level and also played as a starter.
Andre Carter was one though and and for most of them I mean for for every position there's a drop off. And so like you were saying if we compare that to Indiana's you know grades and and how well that they played, it's, it's fairly comparable. But I would say that there's there's probably an an increase in talent with you know if if if everything forecasts correctly, which I don't think it's a perfect model or anything like that.
But you know, I I think that they are increasing the amount of talent and I think also increasing the amount of depth. Yeah, that's the thing. I mean, ultimately, I mean you're not going to hit on everybody and and what, what, what is it now? 35 or so players that have been brought in through the portal by Signetti and his staff. That is not quite half the roster, but almost half the roster and the. But the depth is the most
important thing. And you know, look, we're going to probably be surprised at how well some people rise to the challenge. We're also probably going to be disappointed by some folks that don't. But it's all part of the process of trying to flip this roster over and that's not going to happen in one year. And that was really kind of what Scott and I talked about in our last podcast was this idea of managing expectations a little
bit. You and I have talked about it I think on this podcast before as well. There's just so many unknowns that, you know, it's it is.
I will never be critical or be like, gosh, I wish people weren't paying attention to Indiana because what's fascinating is. Despite all the attention that's been paid to Indiana and and all the the buzz that Curt Cignetti has has attracted and clearly some of the positive aspects that it's it's providing Indiana on the recruiting trail, They are still right now projected at under six wins that I think they're 5 1/2 wins. So it's not like Vegas has caught on and be like you know Indiana.
That's it. That's the team. You know it, but you did. On the flip side, you had that that that article from the other day about Indiana having like a top five roster from a talent perspective in the Big 10 coming into this year. That seems that seems like fanciful a little bit. But the fact that it came from a not IU person does give you pause for a second and it's like, I don't know where all of this lands. Yeah, yeah, that that was an interesting article.
I I I thought that was yeah interesting but the but I think I I do think expectations are you know if you've if you've been reading bite size bison like I'm I'm I'm not trying to rain on any parades or anything you know I I think it I think it is important to temper some some expectations because year one is like I don't I don't you know I personally don't care that Chris Cignotti says he wins in in year one. You know, like winning at Indiana is very different than
winning at other places. And so, you know, I think what they've done is very impressive. But historically, it's really tough to win in year one. And like you said in the last podcast, Galen to to Scott was that culture change is really difficult and that has to change before you can win. Like winning does not change before the culture change. And so it's clear that Cignetti wants to change the culture at
Indiana, which is necessary. And it's good that he's even talking about it. But, you know, I think that, you know, I think it's gonna be a good season and and even with that, I think it's gonna be a good season, but maybe, maybe not quite where some people think it could possibly be. I mean Cignetti is is correct. He won seven and three his first year at IUP and eight and four his first year at Elon and 14 and two his first year at James Madison.
Now granted James Madison that he took over was was a powerhouse already in in FCS at that point but he's not wrong and that he does win in those first years. But as you said, I I think it's different if he's taking over for a team that was, you know, 5-6, seven wins, somewhere in that range. There was clearly a changeover that had to happen from a cultural perspective. And it actually leads us into our first question from JD Gabby, longtime fan and and follower on Twitter.
We've heard a lot about the new business like mindset from Coach Sig and this staff. I no doubt get that feeling. But can you share some specific examples and differences between the regimes that demonstrate this? I've got an anecdotal 1, but I'm curious if you have something more concrete that you've observed either in those Under the Hood podcast or stuff that you've just seen in general, like what what shines out to you in terms of that business like
mindset? It depends on how you define business like I guess if like aggressive and and direct is is business like I think that's I've seen a lot I've seen a lot of that particularly in their recruiting strategy which is that they're not recruiting in fear at all and and they they they they seem to. I I think the way that a team approaches recruiting says a lot about the way they approach organization and and if you can have positive internal organization then you can be productive.
And so recruiting is really important in that regard.
And the way that they have systematically gone about building an approach to in state recruiting I think has been really impressive to me. And then not only that but then allowing Tino Sincerity to you know recruiting a quarterback he wants to and and and not not be fearful of who else is involved in or how young the kid is. I mean they're offering freshmen in high school right now and and there just seems to be an understanding about college football through recruiting in
particular that I don't think existed with the last regime. And and that's the first thing that comes to mind mostly because I was a recruiting reporter when I was covering football. But also you know, it does show a lot about a program based on how they're recruiting. And then I will add as well, you know, getting Dolson to buy into the idea of investing more into the program, it is also and I think that's more businesslike than anything I just said.
But but yeah, I think that's that's that's huge too. Yeah, I'll say having I've had a chance to talk with a couple of players and and some other folks related to to the program and staff and you know what they've said is you know they almost to a person that I've talked to like they they liked Tom Allen. They thought Tom Allen was a great guy.
But they've all said like it is all business with Signetti and it is, you know, that here's the, here's the task, here's what we're going to do, we're going to go do this, you know, until we know how to do it. And the implication from those conversations has been that isn't how practices have gone up to like prior to Signetti getting there, that there was a lot of switching around in terms of, you know, you'd go from one thing to the next without feeling like you necessarily got
everything done that you needed to get done. And the the drilling was, it almost seemed more like, OK, we got to do these things, not we're doing them for a particular purpose. And I think to be honest, that tracks with a lot of the concerns we had when we were watching Allen teams where it just kind of felt like execution
was lacking. And it felt like that execution lacking came from a place of where they they haven't worked on this to the point where they can do it without thinking about it. And you know, we'll see.
Anybody can say that. But multiple people on the team that I've talked to have have said there's a notable difference in the way that practice is approached in the way that you're interacting with the staff where you know Signetti is kind of this the he's the CEO like you're you're not going to have a direct relationship.
The relationship is is a a rung or two down the ladder, which again is pretty businesslike if you think about it like you're probably not palling around with the CEO unless you're in an office that's got fewer than five people in it. So that I I found that all pretty fascinating cause like no one, no one really wants to talk bad about the previous regime. But they have noted that there's a real difference in the way that that the conduct goes with the current regime.
So yes. I agree Gayle and I and I, I actually thought about you and I have talked about it a lot too and I think we've noted it on here. That's why I didn't mention it either. But you know the way that he does act as the CEO and and within within his structure and the way that that has been talked about that outside of Cignetti, I think that's that's
promising too. Yeah. You you mentioned this in your answer to that previous question, so I'll ask it. This is from our our old buddy Eddie Cotton. What happens to Tyler Cherry after we land Julian Lewis? I like where the I like where the head's at with this. What do you make of this Julian Lewis recruitment in general? I mean, this is the the fact Indiana scored one of the visits and the only other wild card team in this group of visits is Colorado with Deon Sanders.
It like it is. This doesn't feel perfunctory anymore. Like it feels like there's a comfort level between Sunseri and Julian Lewis that I mean it it it I would still, it's still probably a 100 to one shot that he chooses Indiana given the rest of the teams in the group. But the fact that it's even 100 to one shot is pretty wild to me. It's closer than I thought. You know, I when I thought when it was when it was going to come to the visits, that's when Indiana was going to drop out.
I know that there are some teams who have lost interest in in him and I think part of it might be because he is not particularly. I wouldn't say he's particularly athletic or doesn't have particularly have the biggest arm or isn't you know the tallest or the biggest quarterback. And you know in an era where you kind of do need some athleticism in some size as a as a quarterback and I think a lot of his, his skill set is rooted in the intangibles.
And that can be a real concern when when like when you get up to this level of picking a quarterback, a lot of it is just personality. And you know everybody knows that you have a skill set but but they're trying to reduce risk and and then also try to make you fit into their program, 'cause it is more than just a a fit as a quarterback, as a fit as a person too, which I don't think takes anything away from Julian Lewis. I think he's probably a a fine
kid. But you know I think that when you're Indiana and there's a five star quarterback interested in you at that point you know you're not you're not you're not you're not picking that that that you're not picking that many nits. But you know the I think, I think it is more serious than than maybe I had thought in the beginning when I was saying that you're just marketing through recruiting, which I think it's still you're doing that indirectly because the relationship with sincerity.
But I mean, once these schools start dropping off, and then if enough of them drop off and they're not interested in him, I mean, yeah, maybe, maybe the relationship can transcend some of these things. This is how this is how you you pick off four and five stars in the in the video game for
college football. Like if you stay in long enough, eventually someone else commits at that position and you know then you're sitting there and they we've got a four-star quarterback or five star quarterback.
And also the fact that there's still very good teams in the pool with Julian Lewis. This is not the the Galen Klavio hypothesis of Indiana and five star recruiting in football, where if Indiana, anytime Indiana gets a four or five star, it's generally because something is scared off. All of the other teams that had a shot at that player where they would normally go to that level and they end up here. This does feel like a little bit of a different category.
So we'll see. And you never know who that would be a tremendous, it would be a tremendous marketing win and it might be a tremendous football win if they got him. And even if they did, I think Tyler Cherry's going to be just fine at IU. I'm still very intrigued with him as a prospect. So let's hit a couple other questions here. Who's your 98 asks if you have to pick just one of the following defense, offense, or
coaching? What keeps this team from being more than just a bowl eligible team, assuming it's a bowl eligible team, I guess in the 1st place? But of those 3, defense, offense, or coaching? Like, which one do you feel like could be the greatest constraint on this team? The OK the greatest constraint I
would say defense. I I think I I think a lot of a lot of people have been noting that you know they don't they don't know how they don't know if Cignetti and the staff can coach at the Big 10 level and and I don't think I'm as
concerned about that. I I think that they've shown that they can coach a really high quality and form a really high quality system that pulled a group of five team up into the 20 top 25 and and and the FBSI think that's that's enough for me. I I would and I think the offense is going to be the strength of this team and so I I would say probably the defense and I am still a little
concerned about the defense. I think that you know that it's probably going to be a more of a two or three-year thing before that defense is really where they want it. Yeah I'm you know the the whole thing about Signetti and and can they coach at the at the at the Big 10 level. I mean look you never know but I always I'll, I'll use an example from Indiana's rival Purdue. When Joe Tiller got named he came in and had a first year offensive coordinator and a first year defensive coordinator.
Both of them came with him from Wyoming. Tiller had never coached as a head coach at at the Power Five level and I think as I look back he had been a Purdue associate head coach for a few years and they've done the same at Washington State. But I mean those are not exactly the cream of the crop of of power conference teams and they came in with a system and a plan and they inherited a pretty bad team from Jim Coletto. You know all things considered a
team that was that never. I don't think they made a bowl in the four or five years that that he was there. And the first year they went nine and three and six and two and finished 15th in the country. So I I don't, I don't look at the lack of experience. I think it's a much bigger deal. If you're in your 40s and you you've done a meteoric rise to like the Mac or something like that, and then you get hired in the Big 10, that's a huge leap.
But for Signetti, a guy who's been at Alabama, who's who's had all of this experience as a head coach, I'm a lot less concerned about that from a translational perspective. That's why Dan Dan Landing was so, so surprising to me in the success that he had at Oregon because he did have that meteoric rise and and and he and he's still young and and found a way to to get that team to a really good level. You know, I I know it is Oregon. It's not Indiana, but you know.
It's a it'd be helpful if Indiana like had a a lum that had started a shoe company that made billions of dollars. You know Oregon does a little bit of a built advantage. But hey, we've seen coaches not win at high levels at Oregon historically not not even in the last 20 years. But you you there, I agree with you that landing was a bit of a surprise but even like I mean it, I think more and more scheme and understanding what you're doing can trump experience.
Kailyn de Boer might be the best example of this in what a, a four year span, you know, goes from the lowest levels of college football and you know it goes to Washington and has his team on the doorstep of the national title or five years or whatever the the period was like. It it can happen, and it is really fascinating to watch the whole system kind of unfold itself with a guy who you wouldn't look at the pedigree and say that's a guy who's going to take his team to unheard of heights.
I cannot make I wanna make one unrelated point and then add to it. So the the in 2019 I saw recently that there was a statistic that Peyton Ramsey ranked 13th in the country in ESP NS QBR rating. And then that same year in 2019 Mike Pennix before he was injured, was graded 7th in the country by a Pro Football Focus amongst quarterbacks. Kaitlyn De Boer was he was the man. That's that is amazing to me.
But but no I want to add to your point that smaller school coaches are starting to really rise to to like to pretty great heights in FBS football right now And and that's something that Kaitlyn De Boer was actually interviewed about a few months ago actually I think right before the the national championship. And he was just saying, you know, there's a humility that comes with it, that that you know you like you. You're forced to think about things that maybe some others aren't.
And and I think part of that is like, you know, building an IO and using your resources and organizing your resources in the best way. Well, not just that, but also doing more with less at a higher level. You know, I mean, you know, 'cause, I mean a lot of it coming out of FCS, you're coming from the lowest levels of FBS. I mean you're not dealing with full complements of players and sixty walk ONS or 100 walk ONS or whatever Nebraska has.
I mean you're, you know you're you're you're dealing with with less resources and so you're you're learning how to win with fewer resources. And I think that that does help in today's game where especially with the transfer portal, you just can't count on parking guys on the bench for two or three years and then being able to bring them in and having that that ultimate reservoir of experience.
It almost has leveled the playing field out and I think made the jump a little bit less daunting for a lot of coaches. Let's see from our old friend Patrick, what position group are you most confident in? Wide receiver, that's what Patrick said. Well, yeah, yeah. Wide receiver, yeah, most confident in wide receiver just because the experience and and what I saw in the spring game, my miles cross really impressed me and that's the the the amount of talent they have there is just insane.
There's gonna be rotating guys in and out constantly. What position are you most unsure or concerned about? Cornerback, for sure. Cornerback I I I think it might have been kind of a hot take but I have Jamir Johnson starting over Jamari Sharp just because we don't really know exactly.
We didn't get a chance to really see Jamir Johnson last year then he played well when he when he played but he was injured and coming from Texas you know Texas recruited him out of high school that's you know that's impressive So it just like he needs to see the field and and Jamari Sharp you know he's somebody I hope is is really good and I hope he develops and but last year was just not a great showing for him and and you know he's a red shirt freshman so that it that's
acceptable but but then DeAngelo Hans and being 59 and yeah I I I I I think he's great I think his instincts are incredible he he he has great ball skills and and obviously a great athlete but being 59 and the big 10 brings its own challenges especially with the wide receivers that are in this conference So cornerback is definitely overall my my biggest concern. Patrick's answer is offensive line, which I get, although it feels like the depth of the offensive line is more of the
issue than the starters. It is still kind of a wait and see kind of thing, but it does feel like another year of continuity under Bob Bostad and the fact that they retained, you know, they retained Kadik, they're they're able to kind of like do some things in order to to strengthen that. It feels like it. It might almost be worth it.
Looking more at the defensive line is a point of concern than the offensive line, even though both are going to probably be a question mark throughout the course of the season.
Yeah, yeah. I think, I think you have three points that if you have some weaker offensive lineman that you really need to have success at that's if you tackle positions in the center position and they have they have you know a great tackle duo and they have a really an an experienced center but but you know an A guy at center who is experienced and so you know he's seen a lot of football so and then and then you have Nick Kidwell at right guard.
We don't really know how he's going to translate but left guard's a really big concern for me honestly. But the the offensive line I'm not I'm not as concerned about. I think BOP post act can get that under wraps. Most excited position to watch or position you're most excited to watch. Oh man, I might have to trade out some answers here, 'cause I think wide receive, I think, I think, OK, OK, I'll, I'll switch this. I'll say wide receiver is my most exciting to watch.
I think the one I'm most excited about is quarterback. I think that's I I know a lot of people weren't super excited about what they saw in the spring game, but I'm. I'm actually really excited to see because there's competition there, like you said, and when there's competition that breeds good play. So these are talented. And it feels like there's a there's two players that can play the the position can start effectively in the Big 10.
And it does feel like the offensive system will be designed around them this year, unlike last year where the quarterbacks were designed around the system, which made zero sense. So that's. That is, that is my hope with things. OK, let's get to some other questions here. So, Hooperazzi asked, is six wins still the ultimate goal? The standard set by fans for decades has been just make a bowl. Should we expect more or less
wins? Well, I'll say this until Indiana wins six games two years in a row or maybe three years in a row, I guess, 'cause they did technically win six games two years in a row in 19 and 20. I think bowl eligibility
absolutely is the standard. Until that ceases to be something that's special for IU. And that's the this is the thing, I think, I mean, and this is where the offseason sucks in a way, because you you get all this, you get the hoopla, you get all of this, focus on XY or Z and like what? You know, Signetti doing it, this and that, and recruits
coming in and Portal people. And at the end of the day, it's hard to win football games and there are good teams that don't win 6 football games in a regular season all over the country. And so to me that is the standard. Now if Cignetti comes out and wins 678 games in year one, hey, amazing. I would still say the standard the next year is six wins. Because the hardest thing that Indiana's had to do has been be
consistent with winning games. You know you think about 2007, they get to a bowl, they you know they they win seven games that year and then it was 2015 until they won six games again. You know you you think about they they they could make that bowl in 2007. The previous time that they had won that many games was 1994. So until Indiana, again until you see that trend line like get lifted so much that now you can set your sights on seven wins a year.
I think that yes, that is absolutely the, the floor that I would be looking for as well as the ceiling. I'm kind of, I'm kind of curious what the expectation would be if it wasn't a bowl game. Like I'm so used to like at Indiana, like being like, OK, a bowl is a successful season, you know, and maybe even five wins is a successful season. But like, but I I don't know what the expectation would be after a bowl. Would it? Would it? Where do you stop? Would it be 8 like? I don't know.
I think this is where you almost have to measure and program. You know I I kind of look at it like you know what is the program that Indiana could reasonably point to in terms of relative success and and where it goes and like that would be a comfortable living. And and to me it's Minnesota. You know, Minnesota football and Indiana football are very similar I think in a lot of ways in terms of, you know, not a great natural recruiting base, you know, and Minnesota League
has history. Granted, that history was 60-70 years ago, but at least there's something. But if you look at what Jerry Kill was able to do there and now what PJ Fleck's been able to do, I mean people are mad at PJ Fleck, but it's taken five years for them to get mad at PJ Fleck for not moving it beyond whatever. You know, I think if you took PJ Flex record and superimposed it on Indiana football, people would be like, wow, this is incredible. Why can't we do this all the
time? And so, you know, to me, I think that the, the next expectation would be OK Are you in the mix for like a New Year's 6 bowl, like, you know, like the last bid or something like that? I I. But at this point, they're such so far off. I don't think that you could even. I can't even envision that, you know. Yeah, yeah. Not I agree. I agree and I think you know when it being in the Big 10 is
also going to make it difficult. I think some of these teams that were so used to maybe not prioritizing football, not investing in football. Minnesota's a good example of that. I think they're going to start and and so it's gonna make things a little more difficult and so this in the same way that Indiana's investing in in their
in their football program. So at the same time that Indiana is, is really starting to invest, I think some others are going to as well, maybe not immediately, but you know eventually. It's it's hard to see most of these teams not investing in football at like this. Seems like the worst possible thing you could do given some of the financial things going on with college football right now.
But let's sit let's sit a few more questions here with the time that we've got our our buddy Mason Williams recently retired from from his role with rivals covering IU. But ask the question, with much rightfully being made of the current rosters overhaul heading into the 2024 season, what aspect of the future of the program as IT projects forward is most enticing, and why, I think. What kind of exactly what we were just talking about I think the investment is, is really encouraging.
I wrote I think it was the first, the first thing that I wrote when when I pick back up, when I pick buy size buys and back up which was the salary pool And then that's kind of what I what I've kind of been engaging and like Indiana's nearly at the average salary pool for the Big 10 and I I should probably go back and recheck that.
Now that the the four you know PAC 12 teams are coming in that's probably a little bit higher but it's it's I mean it's it's approaching average and it was down it was the second worst and so that like it boosted its salary pool by $1,000,000 and and I was texting you about some of the salary stuff earlier but the you know they're actually paying some of their assistance.
The Big 10 average for for an assistant in in this conference and you know and and and I think the the continued investment in in that manner I think is is probably the most enticing thing to me even as I know it's not necessarily on the field but that's gonna that's gonna be so helpful for the infrastructure of the program. I mean it's hard to argue with
that. I mean if you know anything about football and the way that things get put together, I mean it is so much of it is the infrastructure and what is being put underneath. And it's not just, oh, we have the salary pool. It's making it sustainable.
I mean you, you know, big programs and even middle sized programs that are regularly successful, they get guys poached all the time from them and they find ways to replace those guys with other good guys who can do that job as good if not better, can maintain the culture, can maintain the
system. And I agree. I think that that is one of the most exciting aspects of where things are at right now is that it does feel that IU has said we are, we're pushing our chips into the middle of the table with football. We're going to invest in the coach, we're going to invest in the assistance. We're going to invest a little bit more in the facilities. I mean to be determined how much obviously and that's going to have some knock on effects and we're already I think starting
to see that a bit. Now, what's going to be interesting, I think to kind of tackle maybe another aspect of the question that Mason asks. To me, the most intriguing thing is something that you've mentioned a couple of times here, which is the recruiting without fear and also the recruiting with like a solid plan for how things are going to
fit into the scheme. And it just to some degree has felt, and this is not just a Tom Allen thing, it felt this way with Kevin Wilson. It felt this way with with basically every coach that Indiana's had, maybe going back to Mallory, maybe not including Mallory, but certainly in the latter years, I think you could argue it did.
Indiana has always felt like it's scrambled for everything and you know, felt like itself, you know, kind of was relegated either by its own attitudes or just by reality to picking up the scraps that had fallen off the back of the truck after it drove away from the warehouse. And in this case, maybe that's still the case. And obviously we've yet to see. You know, Indiana hasn't pulled the top 25 recruiting class or anything like that. They did this is the thing.
It's like you know they they look like they were recruiting so well under Tom Allen there for a couple of years and yet that yielded no fruit. And I think the question is going to be no fruits, probably a little strong, very little fruit. You know what, what fruit it yielded was not enough to eat off of. And so it does make you wonder like was that a a talent MIS evaluation where the recruiting service is wrong, was it a
developmental issue? Was it something that the coaching staff couldn't turn those guys in. I I feel like if it was the former the the the ponds that Indiana's fishing in right now are a bit different in in who they're going after and it feels less like fool's gold. If it's the latter, I have a lot more faith in this staff and what they have demonstrated at their prior stops in terms of being able to develop lower ranked recruits into guys that
can perform. So either way, I'm excited about that whole Nexus of like we're recruiting and development meet and again it all ties back to what you were talking about, but that's a little more kind of concrete on the ground stuff I guess I would say. Yeah, yeah, what? What? And that kind of reminds me of a specific recruit that they had brought in the wide receiver Rayshawn Williams. That was like 2019 or 2021 of those two classes. And I remember him having some
really impressive offers. Like, we're talking like Michigan, Michigan State. He was getting looked at by Ohio
State, I believe he was. He was at a camp in front of Brian Hartline at one point and all those schools had taken their or had made their offers uncommitable for him and then and and Indiana offered him and and and made theirs commitable and and he didn't really end up you know doing much here and then and you know I don't know if he ever saw the field actually and and that was just another example of kind of what you were talking about like the the the scraps from from others.
And even though that that that, you know that strategy isn't a terrible strategy because you can still get some talent and some talent that can keep your floor higher, it didn't work out in that case. It didn't work out in many others either. And you know, I I I think, yeah, I I don't really. I guess I I give the staff the benefit of the doubt that that type of situation won't happen as often as it has for Indiana as soon as the way they've carried the recruiting. And we won't know.
I mean, Indiana has broken a lot of of football coaches and coaching stabs over the years. Like, you know, we're not, We're not talking about the fountain of youth when it comes to your career. So there's always maybe a better than average chance that it won't work out. But it does feel like the pedigree here is a little bit better and more consistent. We'll see. Couple other questions. Gigi asks Which class of 2024 high school recruit are you most excited for?
02024. You can even you can even say 2023 if you wanted to. If you wanted to go with the the incoming freshman that you're most excited about for this time around, I'd be fine with that too. OK, OK, OK Oh man. I I like. I like Quinton Clark. I like well, OK, I like 2 actually. I like Quinton Clark the the
linebacker. I I watched his tape and he is so fast and strong and he was somebody that Tom Allenstaff had had recruited and he he was he got an offer from the staff and to stay in in the class and and I I like him a lot I I think he if he's developed right I think he could he could be he could be good I think he could be one of those guys that kind of like plays on on an edge and and and is able to play out in space.
Like he just has a bunch of speed and I think that's kind of a linebacker that like I would say like maybe a Cam Jones was but but sometimes we don't really get to see that but I like him a lot. I also liked Andre Henderson the cornerback we saw a lot of him in the spring game his cousins Jair Alexander the cornerback at Green Bay and and he had 32 pass breakups and five interceptions in his junior season. Like one season he broke up 32 passes and he's he's I think
he's going to be good. I I I like he made an open field tackle for this in the spring game that looked impressive So those two I think are probably sorry I hadn't thought about the 2024 class in a second. I was. I was so focused on the transfer portal. What we'll do you know what we'll come back to that the next time we pod we'll we'll we'll carry that over couple couple other quick questions then we got to wrap up.
I I don't think we're going to unfortunately get to to any of of Ryan's Memorial Stadium improvement questions. I think we'll do a special episode where we do nothing but focus on facilities because I think that topic deserves it. But these are two kind of interrelated questions Amanda asks what do you think our conference record will be? And CSW Hoosier asks, could this finally be the year of nine Indiana? If so, what has to happen for IU to get to 9 wins? So let's start with Amanda's
more conservative question. Like what? How do you see the Big 10 schedule playing out for Indiana in terms of total record? OK. So I'm looking at the schedule now and there are there are there are a few toss UPS honestly and I think there's I think there's one that I I might like call my shot on I think they might beat Michigan this year like I think that game is I think that game is really winnable.
I I have no faith in what Michigan has done after Harbaugh left and I think it could be a a pretty devastating result for them even though they still have talent. I think yeah no I I think I know that I know we we literally were just talking about expectations but but I think that I I I think and it's not really I don't know it's not really a reflection of like Indiana necessarily more of a reflection of like Michigan and how they've handled hardball leaving.
But that I know that's just a complete aside but I'll still probably consider that a a loss But no Galen. I think they win. I think they can I I don't know some of these games that I was a little more confident about before like like in the beginning when the schedule was
released. I'm a little bit less confident in one of them is UCLA, another one is Nebraska so and another one's Northwestern simply because I think that game's gonna be weird like it's it's like any it's in a weird setting but but and we don't know how good Northwestern's gonna be either. So I mean I think just this is something that I've I've gone back and forth with a lot so
that's why I've. I sound indecisive but I I mean I think they beat Purdue. I think they beat Maryland and I think they beat Michigan State and I think that they can beat one of Washington or Nebraska and and then I think they get one more out. I think a five wins. Yeah. I, yeah, I mean I I'm going to say I'm going to be a little more conservative. I'm going to say four and five in conference plus the three non
conference wins. Now that I might revise that down the line, but I think four or five wins in conference is a reasonable projection. And to answer that, I'm thinking about that, I will say this, the schedule and and this is what you know to address CSW Hoosier's question real quick before we wrap up the the this is actually the most favorable 9 Indiana schedule that I've seen because of the road games. The only one that looks unwinnable, unwinnable is the
game at Ohio State, every other Rd. game at UCLA, at Northwestern, at Michigan State. I mean they're they're all winnable. They're they're all winnable games. That doesn't mean they're going to win all of them. It just means they're all winnable. And the home games, Yeah, I mean you know you got the three non cons. You got Maryland which is a tricky 1. Nebraska's going to be tricky. Washington's going to be tricky.
Can you win two out of those 3 Michigan's, you know, I mean if you're going to pick off Michigan, this is a good year to do it. And then obviously Purdue at the end of the year you should win that game just given the relative talent levels of the two teams. But the route for Indiana to get to 9 wins is you lose the Ohio State game. Fine. You lose one of those Nebraska, Washington games at home and maybe you lose the game at UCLA and you win the rest of them.
And maybe if you trade one of those and maybe you you lose the game at Michigan State or something like that, Hopefully that doesn't happen. But that would be that's the trade off that you're looking at. So where you winning where you win eight games in the regular season and you win the one bowl game that you get and that's how you do it so. Yeah, exactly. I was I I had seen that question previously and I I had gone to the schedule and I was like man, how do they get to 9 wins?
I think they would almost have to start eight and one like to to start to start the season and I don't know if Indiana, I don't know, I don't know that's not really in Indiana's DNA. No. And I I. I don't know. But again, no one really knows. There's so many questions. Like no one knows what post Talia Maryland's going to look like. No one knows what Northwestern is going to look like playing on
that postage stamp size field. No one really knows how year two of the Mount Rule era is going to be at Nebraska. No one really knows how Jet Fish is going to integrate at Washington. No one knows what the Hell's going on with Michigan State, you know? No, I mean, 'cause that's the first year for a new coach and obviously things have not gone well in East Lansing over the
course of the last 12 months. No one really knows what the post Harbaugh era at Michigan's going to look like, and no one really knows what the Hell's going on with Purdue like, is Purdue heading back towards Hazel territory? It's quite possible so, and no one knows about UCLA. It the the there's so many unknowns that it really makes projecting difficult and I think Indiana no issues there.
In terms of like, yes, of course we know that we don't know things, but at least we know what we'd think we know, even though we don't actually know it. If that makes any, it's. A lot of knowing, No, I agree. There's so many question marks, so many question marks in the Big 10 this year, I have no idea how it's gonna play out.
Yeah. So anyway, that'll wrap it up for us. Taylor is always a pleasure to have you on. Be sure to go to bite size to bison.substack.com or follow Taylor on X at by Taylor L Be sure to follow us on Sub Stack as well. Check out the rest of the Back home network and we'll be back with more podcasting. IU basketball, IU football, all kinds of other fun stuff going on. For Taylor, I'm Galen, this is Crimson Cast. We'll catch you folks on the flip side, Bring back the Bison
candy stripe the rock. That's all everybody.