This episode MA contained content of a graphic nature, including descriptions of physical and sexual violence against adults, children, and animals. Listener discretion is advised. Hi, this is Tanya.
Hi, this is Shannon, and we are.
Crimes and Consequences, a hardcore true crime podcast.
Hey Shannon, Hey Tanya, how are you?
I'm doing great? How are you?
I'm doing pretty good too.
I know we were talking before we started recording, but just like to let everybody know that I'm building my lexicon as we speak, my own personal vocabulary, and I'm hoping to impress you with my expanded vocabulary someday soon.
No, I was.
Telling Shannon how I need to expand my lexicon as well, because my reactions in the podcast are pretty much, oh my god, right exactly. I mean, yeah, that's the range of my emotions that is so funny.
I feel the same with my especially with exactly exactly.
I'm like geez a, Luciana, and pick another word.
You know, any word I know precisely, precisely. No, but there's a bunch the surface lexicon is our our fifteen hundred words that for sure, we every day we say it leaves these same lexicon and then there's a lex kind of words that we know, but we just don't use them.
And I was like, outside of the.
Articles, like the A and so that's gonna fill about forty words of my surface lex on our articles. That's how much I speak. And then the other ones are like, fuck that, fuck this, what's the shit? I really declined in my oratory? I don't even know if oratory.
Is a word. It is, Yeah, thank you, I'm glad to hear that. Be guys, I liked you expand it, but good things ahead.
Yes, yeah, fuck is definitely in my fifteen hundreds acon.
Noun, verb, ad verb. It very very useful.
So tell me, girl, what kind of story are you bringing us today?
Well, before I get into this week's episode, I would just like to remind everyone to hit subscriber follow and whatever app you're listening to. And the episode that I have for everyone today is a pretty well known episode. It is about the murder of Gregory Smart And if you're not sure, maybe you can't place the name. Once I get into this, you're gonna be like, oh, yeah, okay,
I remember this story. So our Stories begins on the evening of May first, nineteen ninety around ten ten pm, a woman named Pamela Smart was pulling under her street making her way to her condo that she shared with her husband Greg. When her headlights hit her condo windows.
She thought that maybe something was amiss because Greg, who was home, he usually turned on the porch light, like if he got home from work first, like they had this you know thing, like whoever got home first would turn on the porch lights, and it was off, and she noticed he was home. After Pamela pulled her car into the garage of the condo and walked inside the home, she turned on the foyer light and saw her twenty four year old husband's body laying in a pool of
his blood right near the foyer of the home. Pamela said that on May first, nineteen ninety, that day started off carefree, like any other day that she's lived. She went to work, she went to a meeting, she left for the day, and she found her husband's dead body when she came home. Wow, his body was laying in a dark hallway and he was still wearing what he had on when he left for work that morning. It
was a gray suit jacket with dress pants. Under his body was his wedding ring, his keys, and his wallet. Most of his body was on the dining room blue carpet, but his ankles were in the foyer and his arm was bent backwards at the elbow in an odd way. His left foot ended up kind of twisted because it had been caught in between a brass candlestick and the stairwell wall by the back door of the condo. A small television and two sereal speakers had been left behind
by whoever assumingly attacked Greg and the family dog. His name was Halen. He was found hiding in a dark place inside the house, and this dog was scared shitless. Oh so, when pam discovered Greg's body, she began screaming for someone to help her, and she's ringing the neighbor's doorbells, she's banging on their doors. One of her neighbors answered the door and pulled Pamela quickly inside because you know, they don't know if there's still an attacker on the loose.
God knows when this happened. So she's saying that her husband been hurt and that he's lying on the floor and Greg had been shot. He was shot execution style. The bullet entered his skull above his left ear and it was a thirty eight caliber bullet, so he was dead like as soon as he was shot shot. At this point, most of her neighbors had heard the commotion and had stepped outside to see what was happening. They lived, like I said, in a condo complex, and they were
attached condos. They lived on the end. But all of this commotion is happening. So two calls were made from two different neighbors placed to nine one one. One neighbor just assumed that she had been beaten by her husband, so I guess that's probably on the nine one one. Another neighbor came to see if he could help, and when he asked Pamela where her husband was, she pointed
toward the condo. The neighbor then started frantically looking inside all of the cars parked outside the condominium, and he's screaming, well, where the fuck is he? And Pamela's like, he's inside, he's inside. So when the neighbor ran up to the porch steps to add her through the front door, Pamela screamed for him not to go outside, just in case. You know, the intruder was still there. Right when the
neighbor opened the front door slowly. The first glimpse was of the brass candlestick, since the foyer light was twinkling off of it. As the neighbor inspected further, he could see Greg's twisted foot. He opened the door a little more and he did see Greg laying face down in his own blood. It didn't take long for the cops to arrive, and at first this killing seemed random. Greg was pronounced officially that at eleven nineteen pm, and the
crime scene tape went up. Police started investigating immediately, looking around, and they noticed that the entire condo was completely ransacked. Although the murder of Greg looked a lot like a burglary gone wrong, when police Captain Jackson got to the scene, he immediately noticed some serious red flags. He said, a lot of what was visible just didn't make sense. There
wasn't a single sign of forced entry. The burglary quote unquote, took place at night in one of the most heavily populated areas in New Hampshire, and the method of the shooting was execution style. The police captain didn't believe for a second that this was a burglary, even though the condo was ransacked. He said there was no sign of a struggle. And burglars, though, don't usually fight. They don't
usually pack guns. They usually like are in and out, you know, they steal whatever they need to steal, and they leave.
Out no contact.
Yeah, and if they do commit murder, it's usually because they panicked. Yes, And the police captain noticed that it just seems staged somehow, it just didn't seem right. So let me tell you a little bit about Greg Gregory. Greg Smart was born to his parents, William and Judith on September fourth, nineteen sixty five, in Nassau, New Hampshire. So that makes him a viurgo, Yes, that does. Greg had two brothers growing up, and he went to Londonderry
High School and graduated in nineteen eighty three. He had a pretty decent childhood and some would even say that it was picturesque more idyllic. On family vacations, the Smart family would go voting on Lake winnip Poseki, which is a gorgeous lake in New Hampshire. When he was little, Greg played Little League baseball and he even helped his
team win a championship in nineteen seventy seven. While growing up in the eighties, Greg fell in love with heavy metal music and he was really passionate about it, and it was a passion that he would later share with his future wife, Pamela Voyas. Pamela Voyas Smart was born on August sixth, nineteen sixty seven, making her a Leo, Leo, Leo and Virgo to her parents, John and Linda, and she grew up in Coral Gables, Florida, with one brother
and a sister. Her mother, Linda, was a stay at home mom and she ran a tight ship, doing everything she could to build a happy home for her family. Linda was the best of the best as far as moms go, and she was always there for her kids while her husband was working as a pilot. And even though her father, John was home irregularly because he was a pilot, Pamela had a very close bond with her dad. So as far as childhoods go, Pamela had a really
good and loving childhood. She came from an all American family. She was a happy child with lots of friends.
I think carl Gables is a really nice area. I do too, Yeah, I think you're right.
Eventually, the Voyas family moved to New Hampshire and shortly thereafter, Pam started college at Florida State University. She was extremely intelligent and graduated college a year early despite working three jobs while she went to school. And I have to say she must have really been really smart, because I was college full time. I didn't go in the spring and summer semesters. But it took me five years.
Yeah.
Job, Yeah, and worked three jobs. One of them was a forty hour a week job. She was she was hustle on. It was hustling and her family called her an overachiever and I.
Completely blound like that.
Yes, she received her degree in Communication arts and her life school was to get into television journalism and be the next Barbara Walters. While trying to work her way up in the media, she worked as a college DJ on the local Telehasse radio station WVFS, the voice on eighty nine point seven FM. While at the station, she hosted two different shows. One was specifically for rock music, and she called herself the Maiden of Metal Oh. Her radio show is called Metal Madness. Her favorite bands at
the time were Motley Crue and Van Halen. One day, though, around Christmas nineteen eighty six. That's when she met Greg. The two met while Pamela was home from college on Christmas break, you know, in New Hampshire. She had a boyfriend all throughout high school, but according to her, nobody else mattered after she met Greg. She said, initially she wasn't attracted to him, but getting to know him, that's when she fell madly and passionately in love with him.
She loved how happy and fun he was. He was always smiling, he was just so much fun to be around. He also loved the same music as her.
Yeah.
Shortly after getting to know him, she told her family He's the one. Pamli's family loved him almost as much as she did. He had a rocker look to him and had like big eighties hair. He was everything that she'd ever dreamed of for herself. He was about five foot ten, He was athletic, build fit, and he had these different hobbies such as hiking, fishing, and skiing that kept him in shape. Pam was very petite and had a vibrant personality, and when they met it was just sparks. Well.
Pam and Greg fall head over heels in love, and Greg moved to Florida to be closer to Pam while she was finishing her degree. The two of them tied the knot in nineteen eighty nine and together they moved to Dairy, New Hampshire after Pam graduated. They also got a dog, a Shitsu, and his name was Halen, Like I told you after Van Halen.
That's adorable.
Yes, you know. Van Halen was the rock band that brought them together at the beginning of the relationship, and their two favorite songs were You Really Got Me and Hot for Teacher. That know, I love that song Hot for Teaching.
I had a huge crush on David Lee Roth in nineteen years and I had the poster of him where he was leaning over like a makeup tha like with the lights to get ready. He's leaning over and assless leather chaps, you can guys kind of catch from the lighting, big old bottle of Jack Daniels. He just looks so freaking delicious. My mother hated like that poster. She would look at me disgusting. Yeah, you mean if you mean hot when you say disgusting, Yes, he's very disgusting.
Funny, I know, and I can totally picture it with that description right with that hair and yeah, oh gosh. However, not even six months into their marriage, things began to sour between the couple. According to Pamela, the downfall of their marriage was due to the fact that Greg had admitted to having a one night stand right at the beginning of their marriage. Now, I don't know if that's true.
Mm hm oh right, because that's his first story.
Yeah, first story, right, So I don't know if it's true. I really, I don't know. I don't know Greg, I didn't know. I don't know if he had like a guilty conscience about it. But Pamela also seemed kind of bored and tired with Greg, especially now that his battle head image faded. When he got a grown up job in insurance, he cut his hair and wore suits to work. She had compared him to looking like John bon Jovi, but when he cut his hair, he looked so basic,
and that wasn't the man she was attracted to. She wanted the rock star version of Greg. Pamela quickly wondered where the man she married had gone. Like I said, he got a job working for an insurance company. He needs to support his wife, and he wants to start a family. Somedays, so he's getting a real job. And at the time, she was working for winn Ackoonant High School located in Hampton, New Hampshire, as the media director. Gregg had worked his way up the business ladder and
he became a very accomplished salesman for insurance. While she was working for the high school, Pamela was able to dabble in broadcasting and continue on her passion for music. Her roles at the school included producing educational videos for students and they were distributed districtwide. Pamela believed that this role was a stepping stone toward her dream job as a news anchor. She had her own secretary and student
intern to help her in any way she needed. Wow Every student at the high school looked up to pam She was one of the cool people on the staff and she spoke to the students like she was like a friend. She would always talk to the students about music, and she told them about meeting Eddie van Halen and getting backstage passes to one of the van Halen concerts. From the outside, though, the marriage between Greg and Pamela seemed to be peachy to everyone that knew them. Pamela
described her marriage with Greg as picture perfect. So I don't know when she said that, but she so red flag.
That's the huge red picture perfect.
You're perfect, okay, unlikely? Yes, yeah, And by all accounts, Greg was completely dedicated and truly devoted to his wife. He was looking forward to starting a family with Pamela and Haylen. But Pamela was a little different. She seemed to care tad more for the dog more than Greg. It would make the dog home cooked meals and instead of Greg. I'm sure though you know Greg got home cooked meals too, But.
That is a little prioritize wise, a little red flag there.
She's not feeding the dog dog food apparently right. Pamela thought herself as a typical Leo who was always looking out for her own best interests no matter what. She loved to be the center of attention and said about herself quote, everywhere I go, I'm always attracting attention for some reason or another. I'm loud, very outgoing and stuff. And as you know, I'm a Leo. And she said, Leo is a bad name.
At this moment, she is not portraying Leo's in a very good light. No, not at all. No, I love the attention either.
I will always be positive when I say, oh my gosh, you're such an attention whore, Like if I said it to you, that would be hilarious because I know how much you love it, and I love that about you. You know what I'm saying. I genuinely love it. I'm just like, look at you go. You are in your element and I love.
It just like print.
But I don't think like I do it on purpose exactly.
You don't come across like, oh this, but I can.
When you're in your element, I just sit back.
I'm your biggest cheerleader.
Oh thank you.
Other people can make it look ugly. You know what I'm saying, like, oh, look at me. Everywhere I go I get attention.
Yeah, like I would never say that I might.
No, thank you.
Class, It's called class, girl, learn it.
While Pamela was working on various different projects at the school, one of her more notable project was something called Project Self Esteem. This was about drug awareness. Participation in the program was mandatory for all freshmen students, and she was able to get them on board pretty easily with how she talked to them like they were her friends. And pressed the program's participants. But one student in particular grew completely infatuated with Pamela, and that was fifteen year old
Billy Flynn. So let me tell you a little bit about Billy. William Patrick Flynn was born on March twelfth, nineteen seventy four, making him a Pisces to his parents Billemy Lane. His parents' marriage was considered to be turbulent and chaotic, and Billy seemed to always be put right in the middle of his parents' constant arguing. He grew up with two brothers, and Billy took the brunt of
their father's anger. Billy, his mother later said, quote, if things were going my husband's way, he was a great guy to be around, but as soon as he had to deal with any inconvenience, forget it end quote Willy Yeah. Eline finally chose to leave her husband after she found out that he had been having an affair and had been cheating on her for years. After his parents divorced, twelve year old Billy moved to New Hampshire with his
siblings and mom. He never wanted to move, and he felt a lot of animosity toward his mother for making him move. When he was about two weeks from his thirteenth birthday, his father passed away in a tragic car accident. A car had pulled out in front of him while he was driving, and he had to swerve out of the way to not hit the car. Unfortunately, he swerved into a gasoline tinker that was carrying nine thousand gallons of gas and there was a massive explosion and Billy's
father was burned alive like ferociously. The only remains left to help identify his charred body were his teeth. After Billy heard the news of the accident, he shut down socially and spent the majority of his time by himself. Billy's mother said that he was always acting out while at home, but he was never violent. Any little inconvenience would send him into a spiral, and talking to him in general was extremely difficult until he would finally calm down.
His mother said quote that was one side to Billy, that he projected to people that he wanted to impress. He wanted to be liked, because she said he was charming and very mannerly. Inside the family is where he took out his anger like a volcano, waiting to erupt end quote. Billy became smitten with Pamela almost immediately. His infatuation got pretty serious as he became Pamela's number one help on Project Self Esteem. He also visited her office
every single day. The first time you saw her was at a meeting for the project's discussion leaders, and after Pamela was introduced to speak at the meeting, Billy turned
to his friend and said, I'm in love. It was the fall of nineteen eighty nine, which happened to be around the time when Greg made his supposed confession of adultery to Pamela, and Pamela said that around this time, Greg also encouraged her to hang out with her friends that she had made while working at the school, which I really find weird because she's hanging out with a bunch of teenagers.
Yeah, my friends are students. So when you tell me to go hang out with my friends, yeah, I he meant colleagues, Yeah right, and she was like fifteen year olds.
Yeah, fifteen year old's great. When the work for Project Self Esteem was done, Pamela and Billy kept working together on a video for an Orange Juice video competition. Like I think it was like a commercial like you had to submit a commercial about it. Billy was a shy kid with big eyes and shoulder length hair, so picture the hairstyle that Greg literally had just chopped off a job to look more professional. Billy wore a leather jacket and an earring. He played guitar and people always compared
him to a young Paul McCartney. He had a passion for music in his favorite band was Motley Crue. Billy had two close friends, Patrick who they called Pete Randall in Vance Jr. Vladimir Junior. They were often referred to as the Three Musketeers, and they did a lot for the community of South Seabrook and Seabrook is considered blue collar, but they would do things like shoveling snow for their neighbors, running errands, doing odd jobs for those who needed them.
They even gave free services to the elderly, and people in that area called them, like I said, the three Musketeers. The three of them met when they began middle school, and they were inseparable. Jr. Was two years older than Billy and one year older than Pete. He had dark, curly hair and wore very thick glasses. Which made him look intellectual. His life goal was to join the military
and become a marine. Whenever he had any free time, he visited his grandma, who lived in Haverhill, Massachusetts, and he always helped with holiday dinners with his local church to help those who were in need of a hot meal. Pete, on the other hand, was a bit of a handful and his life dream was to become a professional hit man. Yeah, but his mom described him as being a loving kid.
Pamela was obviously not supposed to fraternize with the students like she did, but she began to quickly overstep her bounds. Even with her student in turn, named Cecilia, they became the equivalent of best friends, and Cecilia knew everything about Pamela's personal life. The same and worse was set about her relationship with Billy. The three of them even used to hang out together. When she was beginning to learn how to drive, Pamela would take Celia out in her
Honda CRX. We would also let other teenagers drive her car to which you know that made her super cool.
I can imagine that is some cool shit right there.
The friendship between Cecilia and Pamela began affecting the teenager's life negatively. Though her school work, her other friendships, and home life were affected, but Cecilia didn't care. She idolized Pamela. Cecilia's mother said, quote, as this relationship went on and on, I liked it less and less. I was actually getting
really angry end quote. Right after Cecilia met Pamela, her grades began to get worse, and her mother even had to speak with the administration because of how much time Cecilia spent at the high school's media center, where Pamela's office was. The assistant principal agreed with Cecilia's mom, but
nothing ever came of the conversation. Pamela was so excited to be able to hang out with her students outside of school, and since most of them were from Southbrooks, she would invite the kids over to her condo to work on school project. Greg was spending more and more time with his own friends and Pamela with hers, and this is when she also developed an infatuation with Billy Gross. He's fifteen oh boy. One day, when Billy was in Pamela's office, she asked him flat out, do you ever
think about me when I'm not around. Billy responded back by simply saying sure. Pamela said, well, I think about you all the time. After Billy heard that there was no stopping his romantic obsession with her, Pamela told him that she didn't understand her feelings for him, and she said she didn't know what to do with all of these feelings for him since she was a married woman. She couldn't shake this kid from her brain. And not even a month later, she found herself in his bedroom
kissing him while the two lay on his bed. The whole time they were making out, Motley Cruz's Starry Eyes was playing over and.
Oh my gosh, this is a romance on Bizarre World.
Fueled by Motley Crue.
Yes.
Sometime in late March of nineteen ninety, Pamela invited Billy and Cecilia over to Ricondo to have a little bit of fun while her husband was out of town on business for his insurance company. Rather than watch a movie that was age appropriate, Pamela decides that she's going to put on that movie nine and a half Weeks, starring Mickey Rourke and Kim Bassenger. Yes, have you ever seen that? I?
Was too young and was forbidden you see it.
And then by the time the window was closed, I was like, no, baby, did you see it?
Did you? Oh?
Oh yeah I saw it and it was very steamy.
I remember he at that time, right, he was.
Super sexy and Kim Bassenger was beautiful. Yeah, yeah, I just remember there was one scene where they were in front of the refrigerator, like just basically making out and feeding each other like whip creamy.
Yes, I do remember that little hot scene.
So you know, she puts on this movie for the teenagers.
And he's so impressionable. My god, he's fifteen right.
Shortly after the movie ended, Cecilia went outside to walk Halen the dog, and when Pamela and Billy were alone, she asked him to come upstairs to her bedroom that she shared with Greg. Once the two of them were upstairs, Pamela put on a turquoise colored lingerie piece that she had bought specifically to wear to seduce Billy. For the first time, the two had sex, and while they were having sex, Pamela blasted her stereo speakers with Van Halen and Sammy Hagar songs.
Wow.
After this, the two of them met frequently over the next couple of weeks for secks. It was sometime over these sex filled weeks that Pamela said to Billy, you have to get rid of Greg, otherwise we can't keep on seeing each other. Billy asked Pamela she couldn't just get a divorce, and Pamela told him that Greg was basically obsessed with her and she was convinced that he would never allow her to have another relationship with someone.
She added that she would also lose the condo, that's the real reason, I think, beautiful furniture, and their little dog, Halen. She couldn't bear the thought of losing everything, especially Halen. And she told Billy that Greg physically beat her on a regular basis, so the only way to get rid of him was for Billy to kill him. And just to defend Greg, that's never been proven that Yeah physically
abused her. Pamela knew Billy would have done anything to be with her, and he agreed to kill Greg for her. Later at trial, when he was on the stand, Billy testified that he tried to kill Greg two times before he actually went through with the murder. When he aboorded the mission twice Pamela threatened to break up with him and scolded him. According to Billy, she screamed at him, if you love me, you'd do this. Yeah, that was
when things took a serious turn. He began talking to his friends Pete and Jr. About his plan to kill Greg. Pamela let Billy know that the day of May first would be a perfect day to go through with their plan to murder Greg. Greg had appointments later in the evening and Pamela would have an airtight alibi with a school meeting to discuss salary review. She even told Billy that she would pay him money from Greg's life insurance payout.
Pamela and Greg were basically roommates at this point in their marriage, and people began to notice the strain and their relationship. Cecilia even testified at trial that she overheard a conversation while Pamela was on the phone with Greg and said, quote, she was saying something about getting a divorce, and then they started fighting over who was going to take the dog in furniture and everything, and then she said fine, take the dog and hung up end quote.
In the month before the murder, Greg was consistently coming home to an empty house, and he was eating every meal alone crazily. Billy was in the house one night to kill him, and Greg suddenly experienced an overwhelming feeling of danger as he walked into the condo, like his sixth sense went.
Off, you know, his spidy senses. Yes.
Greg told a friend that as soon as he felt this, he turned right back around and left the condo. Greg said that this feeling was unexplainable, but he just knew that he was in immediate danger and needed to leave the house as soon as possible. In the days leading up to Greg's execution style murder, Billy was talking with Jr. And Pete regularly walking through the plan, which was that all three of them are going to wear their darkest clothing they could find, and that they were going to
park it a nearby shopping mall. Pamela was going to leave the cellar door open along with the back door. Billy was going to enter the condo through one, and Pete was going to enter the condo through another. They needed to stage the house to make it look like a burglary, and Pamela told them to take anything they wanted, such as any electronics that they could carry an expensive jewelry. Jr. Was going to wait at the plaza at the mall
for them to return. Billy had three specific rules for me. First, one, they could not turn on any of the house lights. Pam said, Greg is a real whimp. If he sees the lights on, he won't come inside. Two, nobody could hurt the dog, and they were to place Halen in the basement so he didn't have to see Greg get brutally murdered. Billy said, Pamela didn't want Halen to be traumatized. And three, Billy wasn't to use a knife, only a gun.
A knife would leave way too much of a mess, and Pamela didn't want any of her husband's blood to get on their beautiful white leather couch.
She has some long game thinking, she's writes, apful the dog.
I don't want the big mess. Mmmm yeah, Oh my gosh, this monster of a woman I know.
On the morning of the murder, Pama left the house in her silver Honda CRX that had a vanity license plate that read Halen. Her plan was to be home well after Greg's murder. Later in that day, she met Billy at his locker to tell him the doors were unlocked. All of the jewelry that she didn't want the boys to take was warn to school that morning. Around two thirty in the afternoon, Billy called her to let her
know that there had been a small problem. They needed a ride to pick up their getaway car, Jr's Grandma's nineteen seventy eight bright yellow Chevy Impala, which was going to be their getaway car.
Awesome, so Pamela.
Agreed that she was going to drive them over to jr. Grandma's house. Around eight thirty pm on the night of the murder, Billy and Pete entered the house as Jr. Stayed at the shopping plaza. Next, the boys tried to move Halen. As soon as Billy went to scoop his little ass up, he began growling and barking while he ran away. Billy chased the dog around the house and
finally caught him. Then he literally threw Halen down into the basement, and the two boys laughed later on about hearing the dog slump as he tumbled down the stairs. The two boys then went on to completely ransack the house, scooping up jewelry along with CDs and taking apart pieces of the entertainment center. Everything's tall enough was placed into a black pillowcase. After the place was torn apart, they
waited in darkness for Greg. When Greg arrived home and walked in the front door, he called out, hey, len on cube. Billy jumped out from behind the door and grabbed Greg's the shoulder of Greg's sport coat, and just like that, Greg was overpowered. One of the kids told Greg to give them his wallet, which he did, and Pete told Greg to give him the diamond encrusted wedding band, which said no, I can't do that. My wife would kill me. Right before Billy pulled the trigger to kill Greg,
Billy uttered the words God, forgive me. Billy and Pete then ran out of the condo as fast as they could to get to the getaway car. Well Pamela was on her way home. She told Billy later that she had actually seen their getaway car while passing them on the road, and she flicked her lights on and off to say, Hi, oh my gosh, this woman huh so fucking delusion?
Oh man, just cold yes.
During the next few weeks of the police investigation, Pamela was telling the police that her husband was probably killed by quote some jerk, some drug addict person looking for a quick ten bucks end quote. The town of Dary hadn't had a murder in quite some time, in actually nineteen ninety. This was the only murder that happened in the town, so everyone was thinking, you know, it's gang
related or some outlanders story. Yeah, right, But the police had a haunch that somehow Pamela was behind her husband's death due to her detachment over the whole thing. They got their break two weeks later when the police received an anonymous tip about Greg's murder. On May fourteenth, the police received a call from an unknowned woman who told the lead detective that Pamela had been involved in the murder.
The caller was a friend of Cecilia's, and Cecilia had confided in her with this bit of important information.
Right Oddly.
There were also rumors around Dary that the murder was committed with a gun that belonged to j R's father, which was true, Oh yeah. After his father looked at the gun and noticed that it had been cleaned, he gave it to the police and it was placed into evidence. Not long after, the gun was turned over. All three boys were arrested for the murder of Greg Smart. The police later arrested a fourth guy, a nineteen year old
named Raymond Fowler. After the boys were arrested, they all sung like a bunch of canaries and told police investigators that Pamela had seduced and manipulated Billy into killing her husband so that the two of them could be together. On August first, nineteen ninety, Pamela was arrested at the high school that she worked at in the parking lot. And this next part is just kind of hilarious. The
detective told Pamela upon seeing her in the parking lot. Quote, well, Pam, I have some good news and I have some bad news. The good news is that we've solved the murder of your husband. The bad news is you're under arrest.
And that is so I wonder if he practiced that, you know, the night before, Like, how do I present this tour?
Yeah?
Yeahoo, he's my cleverness. I know.
I think that's great. Hey, we solved it.
You're it tag?
Yeahar it. Pamela plaied not guilty, and her trial was the first ever fully televised murder trial in the US. Wow and I think that's how we all know it. Yes, it has to be. And you know the fact that she's a teacher at a high school fucking one of her students, So I mean, which that was quite salacious.
For sure, great word too.
Yes, it's part of my lexicon.
I just put it down on mine as well. I do like salacious.
The entire country was glued to their televisions as they watched Billy take the stand to tell his side of everything. And I do remember seeing the video like of him crying on the snadh.
I got.
Yeah. The prosecution had zero issues talking about how unhappy Pamela was in the marriage and how she was looking forward to Greg's life insurance payout of one hundred and forty thousand dollars, which is equivalent to roughly three hundred and thirty eight one hundred and twenty five dollars today.
WHOA.
Cecilia agreed to wear a wire after the murder took place, and the recordings of her conversations with Pamela were played during the trial. In the tapes, Pamela acknowledged her role in the murder, and she told Cecilia, quote, you'd be better off just lying to the police. We'd go to the slammer for the rest of our lives end quote. Pamela was also on tape saying that the murder was almost perfect. Billy just had to brag about it to his friends.
I just kid, she just zero responsibility and then trying to make us seem to Cecilia that we're going.
Yeah, we're going. Cecilia is like, bitch, I didn't do nothing.
Because what how fucking she's Another thing about my lexicon is I am trying not to swear so much, you know, using fuck as an adjective.
So why haven't you seen the studies that if you swear a lot, you're more intelligent.
I do. It needs to balance out with good words.
Yeah, I just can't rely on'm fuck fuckery about her being such a predator to these boys and the girl you know she's yeah, she's really groomy.
Yeah she knows or not.
Yeah, she really made them do what she wanted.
Yeah, And who doesn't think that a girl is so you know, a young student or a young teacher. It's so cool. It's very impressionable, and she had a big responsibility. She totally took advantage of it. I don't pleasure. Yeah, I'm pretty sure it wasn't worth it, pam.
But yeah, I know. I remember when I was in high school. There was a new teacher and he was young. He was the typing teacher, and we were all excited to take typing.
A huge surge. There was a waiting list for typing. Oh but back to our story.
Yeah, jury found Pamily guilty of being an accomplice to premeditated first degree murder on March twenty second, nineteen ninety one. She was also found guilty of witness tampering. She was sentenced to spend the rest of her life in prison without any possibility of parole, and she remains serving out the rest of her natural life at a maximum security
prison in New York. Since Billy was a minor and completely manipulated by Pamela, he was found guilty of second degree murder and his sentence was a pretty hefty one twenty eight years to life, but he was paroled and let out of prison in twenty fifteen. Pete was also paroled in twenty fifteen, while Jr. And Raymond Fowler were released in two thousand and five. Since the murder, this case has been made into a movie that you and I talked about called To Die For and it stars
Joaquin Phoenix and Nicole Kidman. Did you ever see it? It's been so long, but Joaquin, you know, he's one of the people I go to the movies for.
Yeah, even if I'm not interested in the movie.
Oh, oh it's Joaquin. I'm there.
Yeah, it's Joaquin, I'm there. Yeah, I remember seeing it. It was what was really good.
Yeah, she looked really good, just like her sex appeal.
And you know, you can just see from the clips you could get the gist of the problem that Joaquin would be facing, right.
Yeah. Absolutely. Billy was released on his forty first birthday, and during his parole hearing, he said, quote, I will always feel terrible about what happened twenty five years ago. Parole will not change that. I know that nothing I can say here today will be of comfort to the Smart family, but at the very least, I sincerely hope that this will be the last time they have to be publicly reminded of their grief, and I am truly sorry for the pain I have caused them.
End quote.
He met a woman while in prison and he married her and once he was finally released, He and his wife moved to Maine and butt a pretty large piece of land to live out the rest of their lives out of the spot late.
That's nice.
Yeah, And I don't know what happened to the rest of the bunch, but yeah, I mean, so.
She's still in prison and.
Sounds like the ride the getaway driver and another accomplice got out in two thousand and five and then the other.
Two twenty and fifteen. I mean, what a life lesson? Yeah, for these the nineties were a trip.
Right, I know, they absolutely were.
Oh, if you wanted it, you just took it, and you just made a lie. Oh, probably just somebody who came in the house of some drug person wanting ten bucks.
You didn't really think about the story much, did you after? Because that sounds like a child.
She put a lot of thought into how to do it, leaving the doors unlocked, make sure you ransacked the place, blah blah blah blah blah blah. Boy, oh boy. She did not prepare for the long game at all.
No, And that is so important. Don't start anything unless you can have a long game. That's where that's where you're going to fuck up.
And you know, she's like she's like distant about it, Like she's not like acting like she's distraught. Like, girl, you have to put on the act, like you have to act distraught and upset that somebody came and murdered your fucking twenty four year old husband, like.
You know exactly the disconnect.
You might as well wear a red cape with how little you're expressing.
You know.
But if I did it, she should I did it.
I'm lying, Well, that was a good That was so long ago, but it's still so fresh. I know that Nicole did such a great job of portraying the story with Jaquin.
Yeah, we were all over.
I did not realize that it was the first televised yeah either for everything. We know, the bigger ones like the OJA and Johnny depf, but we have to take a bow to the archaeotype case you know.
This. Yeah, yeah, this one is. I didn't realize it was the first one either, so I was like, wow, you know, and then I was thinking about it and like that's pretty crazy, and it's like I said, that's probably how we all know it. And at least if you were an adult in nineteen ninety or close to it, you know, you would have seen it in the.
News for sure.
It's such a sad story that I and I don't know what her long game was. I doubt it was to stay with Billy for the rest of it.
I don't think so. I think she just loved the thrill of the chase.
Yeah, that's when you're fifteen in a world you're twenty six in your love of your life is fifteen.
There was some delusional problems there.
I think she was only twenty two or twenty three actually.
Each Okay, even's I'm an adult and you're a child. Thing that happens when you're eighteen, right, you know, whether you're aware of it.
Yeah, So not that I'm trying.
To make it sound less gross, but you're yeah, I mean Billy, I hope he's having I feel so terrible naturally for the Smart family with Gregory, and then it's just so many factors, the youth of Billy.
And then my god, it's the teacher.
If you're a teacher, is inviting you to her home by specific lingerie for you, is blasting Van Halen and Sammy Hagar. He never listens to I can't drive fifty five again, because you know what I'm saying, like he.
Thinks she is a goddess.
Oh for sure, rock and roll.
And she was doing this while this song was playing. Hello.
Yeah, she's older, she's beautiful, she's experienced, and she's him. And I doubt that he had a lot of sexual experience at fifteen years old.
Oh my goodness.
Totally manipulated him through sex. And you know, he's just a kid. He And again, I'm not trying to excuse what he did.
No, not at all.
But I mean him too, I only manipulated into doing this. He knew what was wrong and that's why he ended up in prison. But I feel it's just so senseless. I feel for Greg's because he sounded like a great guy and what like she just didn't want to give him the dog or the furniture. I don't get I don't get it, like she just wanted the money. Really wasn't even that much money, I mean three hundred grand
Yeah right, it's not worth killing your husband for. I mean, I'm in I'm not killing my husband for three hundred thousand dollars.
I need a bigger number.
Yeah, Like I might think about it if it's like thirty million dollars.
But I mean that's right, we're just in the hundred thousands.
Come on, I'd pissed that away, so fat So anyway, the long game, Yeah, she wasn't mature enough either, No, and you know she just you know, when you're young and you get married, you married someone because they're hot. And now Greg cut his hair and wearing boring ass suits and she doesn't find him hot anymore, and you know what.
And that's like so shallow, like you didn't like anything about like you don't have any roots that you loved about them. I mean, we can all change our appearance, right, it's our core. That is the fun.
I mean he sounded fun and great.
Totally, oh my gosh, and you're not. You don't become a very successful sales guide and insurance by being a dick.
Yeah, I'm sure.
Yeah, you had any like terrible qualities about him, the simple divorce could take care of.
But it's just sad. So well, thank you Shannon, and thank you everyone for listening to this week's episode. If you haven't done so already, please hit subscribe or follow on whatever app you're listening to if you would like more episodes with Shannon and I and We also have an archive of all of the episodes with TULEA two
hundred something. Yes, you can join our Patreon it's p A t R e O n slash TNT Crimes, or you can join through the Apple podcast app and we release one additional episode a week, So if you sign up for first degree or through the Apple Podcast app, you will get an additional episode per week. You can go to our website Crimes and Consequences dot com. We have merch that we're probably going to be updating soon
at some point. It's in progress. Like I tell everybody, can get Shannon on the website and.
On the stem a time. We're getting there.
We're moving forward right exactly. So anyway, I think that's all the business. So until our next episode, Shannon, I.
Love you girl.
You take care of yourself till next time, which could be tomorrow or the day after.
It could be one of these days. I will see you again very soon, So I love you.
I love you too, you guys, take care YouTube bye
Ra think so