Crime Stories with Nancy Grace joining me right now is a longtime colleague and dare I say friend, Doctor Kendall Crowns. You know him well and he is launching an incredible podcast. He is joined by his all star panel behind him. He always has a full blown skeleton and a skull. You know that doesn't come along every day a guy that travels with a skeleton and a skull. Doctor Kendall Crowns is always the star of the show. Always. I
could listen to him for hours and I have. Doctor Kendall Crowns is a renowned medical examiner, typically joining us out of Tyrant County. That's Fort Worth. As I like to say, never a lack of business in the Morgue in Fort Worth. He is an esteemed lecturer at the Burnett School of Medicine at TCU, and he is launching Mayhem in the Morgue. Now. You may think that medical
examiners are dry as dust. Not true. When I listened to his first episode of Mayhem in the Morgue, it made me laugh, it made me sad, but most of all, it made me curious, very curious. Doctor Kendall Crown's thank you for being with us.
Of course, thank you, Nancy.
Tell me how you got in the business.
So how I got interested in forensic pathology and ultimately became a medical examiner is my dad was a criminologist, and so when I grew up, it wasn't we heard the stories like Doctor Seuss and things of that nature. We actually heard about helter skelter and crime scenes and things of that nature. One of the books I had as a that I absolutely loved was called A Catalog of Crime, and it just had stories after stories of convicted murderers and what they did and all those things,
and I always just found it fascinating. As a kid, I'd sit in his library at the house and just flip through the different books, looking at all the different pictures, and it just was part of my life. And when I was getting older and I thought I wanted to be a doctor, my dad said to me, Hey, you know, there's this thing called a forensic pathologist or a medical examiner, and I know the local one, and you want to go see an autopsy? And I thought that sounded great.
I went to the medical examiner's office and saw my first autopsy, and it just was incredible to me. It was a suicide, a single gunshot wounded the head, and I thought it was the most interesting thing I had ever seen in my life. And at the end of the autopsy, said to the medical examiner, how do I become you? And he told me, well, you know, you got to go to college, you got to finish medical school, and then he'd do residency and then eventually you're a
forensic pathologist. And that's what I did. From that moment on, I did everything I could to become a medical examiner. I bought books about it. When I was in college, I was a autopsy tech, and when I was in residency, I did autopsy tech work on the side to make a little extra money. And then I also worked at the medical Examiner's office on the weekend as well because my residency program would pay for it. So I've just
kind of always been around it. And it really started in ninth grade in nineteen eighty four.
Wow, talking about you growing up looking at crime scene photos and talking about cases with your dad. I will never forget when John David we were watching something, it was a murder mystery on BritBox, and he jumped up and said, where's the PC Probable calls, and in my mind I ticked a box brainwashing complete and I'll never forget. We were actually talking about Jody Arius and Lucy said, oh, yeah, she's a guilty girlfriend that changed her story three times.
I was so happy. I could not have been prouder of my sweet little girl that said. Can I ask you how did you get women? I mean, you certainly can't say I hang around the morgone weekends. That's not sexy unless you target another medical examiner. I mean, or do you just say I'm going to medical school That usually works and leave out the dead body part? How did you manage to somehow catch missus Kendall Crown.
My wife, Beth, is not in the medical field. She had worked as a volunteer emergency medical technician, but we met by happenstance at a comic book store where one of my do nothing friends was hanging out or was working, and I would go there after getting done with rotations in medical school, and then he and I would go play pool at a local pool hall, and she happened to come in there because she knew the owner and was dropping something off, and we met and we started talking,
and two months later I finally got up the nerve to ask her out, which is one of the most pathetic asking out moments of all time, which I.
Got to hear the whole thing.
Tell me, I learned when I used to vandalize things that when duct tape catches on fire, it smells like pine. And I told her that so I and she was like, oh, that's interesting. And I said, well, you know, I have a roll of duct tape in my car. I could show you.
And she was like, away, I got to meet this woman. Because when you say, hey, baby, I got duct tape in the car, everybody runs you say, nothing but tailhole on elbows. But your wife, Oddleie was attracted to that.
She could take me to fight. I'll just say that. So we went out to the car and I got out the roll of duct tape, rolled it up, a little piece of it and lit it with my car lighter, and sure enough it smelled like pine. And I said the classic nag.
Talking charmer, silver tong ken little Crown's okay, so that's how you managed to get your wife. Now you were mentioning, it's a story. I didn't know you were mentioning the first time you saw an autopsy. I believe you said it was a suicide by shooting. You know, isn't it interesting? You never forget your first.
That's correct, you really don't. It was through them through gun shoveling in the head. The guy was playing Russian ulette. He was drunk and shot himself in the head contact range wound. And one of the things I always remember is they took out his liver and it was bright yellow instead of the normal brown. And I asked the doctor, I go, why is it discolor Then he said, oh, that's from drinking. You know, it causes damage to your liver and all that.
Right? Yellow? Like what yellow are you talking about? Because I've got to know the answer to this, Like what yellow? Like yellow? Mustard yellow, like kind.
Of a bright yellow, like a French's mustard yellow.
I can't wait to tell my children if you drink when you go to college, your liver will turn yellow, ask doctor Kendall Crowns.
That's because it's a toxic.
I have another question for then. I'm going to get to your radio show, uh Dtor Kendall Crowns. When you go, I don't know if you even do out to dinner or you go to a party of some sort, do you find yourself totally bored out of your skull unless people are talking about murder or crime.
So usually when I go out to dinner, it's a bout. We talk about other things in my workplace, but parties.
Actually around other people.
I don't have a lot of friends, Nancy, But anyway, when i'm mad to behind you, there's the perfect friends. They don't talk.
But by the way, I've never asked you that, have you named them? No? I have not, So I'm going to come up with names. I'm not going to do it on the spot because I may think better of it later. So when you're around other people that are not in the business, are you or do they totally
bore you? Or am I just projecting? Because when I go somewhere and somebody tries to talk about politics, I'm like, I'll be right back, or if they were anything, because when it's in your blood, it's in your blood and everything else seems low watted.
Well, I agree with you on that, although when I'm around other people, I like to just talk to them and hear their stories and get information about them because I find people to be fascinating in that regards, because you never know when you're talking to someone what else they got going on at home, because who knows, they might have a you know, a sex dungeon in the basement that they're never going to tell you about. But one day you'll think.
You know, it's funny that your mind to go immediately to sex dungeon in the basement. You could have said anything, but you went with sex dungeon in the basement. I'm not ashamed that people that means something only to you, which brings to mind Rex hereer men, I've got so many cases I could ask you about, but I really want to talk about you, So just give me. I think i've heard it. Give me a tiny taste. Don't give away the end if it's the one I'm thinking about,
which was awesome. What is your first story on your first radio show, translation podcast Mayhem in the Morgue. What's the first one about? Don't give away the end?
The first one is when I am on the first day of my forensic pathology rotation in medical school. I arrived at the office and right away they get a phone call in that there's a possible homicide crime scene, and we go out there and I'm super excited, you know, it's first day. I get to see this really exciting thing. And we get out to the scene. It turns out to not be a homicide.
We just had to cut Doctor Crown's giving away the end. I can't believe I just said, don't give away the end, and you gave away the end. But I will say that near the end, something shoots out of the victims behind.
That's correct, that would be the true the end of that situation.
Stop, don't say another word now. Can I ask you, while I know your two friends behind you, I've always wondered what is on that pillow? It looks like the evil Eye, four of them multicolor. What is that?
My daughter is an ad crowcheer and she made that pillow for me.
Wait tell me about your daughter. Don't give me any names.
She has a degree in computer science and is now getting a degree in geology or a master's degree in geology and then trying to pursue a paleontology career. But she is. She really loves to crochet, and she really loves her bones and dinosaurs. And we just went out with her a couple of weeks ago to a dig site so she could look for dinosaur bones for her master's project.
Wow. You know, because when you and I talk, it's always about dissecting a dead body and figuring out the cod cause of death and tissue and DNA and body cavities. I rarely ask you about Beth, your wife or your daughter. Are there any other children I need to know about?
So? I have a total of five children, two girls, three boy. So my oldest is the largest one wife. That's correct?
And uh okay, so I don't need to ask what you do in your spare time.
Five children, that's correct.
Just give me the breakdown? How many boys and how many girls?
Three boys? Two girls?
Wow? Okay, I always wanted four, but when I got the two that I have, I knew I was lucky in anyone to quit. Obviously, some people don't know where babies come from, and amazing you're a doctor, doctor Kendall Crowns. Where Okay, you know where they come from, but do you know how they got there?
Oh? I know that too. I also know how to take them out and can't put it back in.
Though, so you really do? So how happy are you that you're a medical examiner and not let's just say, a plastic surgeon, or I don't know, let's just go a plastic surgeon.
Well, plastic surgery is a funny one because that is one of the rotations in medical school that was actually pretty good at and they told me that I should think about going into that, but I did not want to do the surgery lifestyle where you were constantly at work and on call and all the stress associated with that. I really loved being forensic pathology from the beginning of medical school, and my mind never changed throughout all the rotations, and I really actually enjoy what I do on a
daily basis. It's always different, it's always something exciting, and you get to do testify, you get to do autopsies. It's just it's a great job. I cannot complain. I'm very happy with my life.
Do you normally have people in the room with you when you perform an autopsy or you normally by yourself?
So usually an autopsy, when you're doing the autopsies, there's usually two to three other doctors working in the room with you, to autopsy technicians to a body. So the room is very loud and a lot of people moving around, a lot of talking noise, of the saws, the cutting and all that. So it's actually not very quiet. It's very very very noisy, very stimulating, and there's usually music playing there.
We'll say, you know, doctor Kendall Crowns, that's not the way it is on TV and movies. There's always a medical examiner and everything's pristining quiet, you know. It made me think back to days as a trial lawyer, where there was so much happening in the courtroom. People were coming in and out, spectators getting up and down talking behind me, the defense attorneys whining and gnashing their teeth and twitching their tails on the other side of the room.
But you zone completely out of all that and focus on what you're doing. It's like all of that just disappears. I wouldn't even be conscious of it. I remember, this is funny. The first time I'm court TV, where I later went to work, covered a case of mine that was when women still had to wear pantyhose, and I was so not focusing on anything but the case. They got me from behind hitching up my pantyhose as they inevitably would start going down now in the middle of
its trial. So you totally zone out and focus on nothing but what you're doing. On the other hand, I also loved being in the law library on weekends when it would be totally quiet and I would be completely alone with my legal thoughts and analysis. After you perform the autopsy, when do you do all of the written reports. You probably dictate during the autopsy.
Sometimes I dictate during the case, and sometimes I wait till after. It just depends on the complexity of the case. If it's a multiple gunshot wound with multiple wounds, the dictations self can take quite a while and it can be very in depth, so I usually do those when I can sit in my office and just read through my notes and make sure I get everything accurate. If it's as simple like just heart attack or drug overdose, those can be dictated quite quickly at the autopsy, right
as soon as the autopsy is done. So it kind of just depends on the case of when I do the dictations. But I do have some alone time in my office usually at the after the autopsies are done, to go through things and then process the paperwork.
Are you in your office right now?
I am in I have actually two offices connected by a hallway, and this is a kind of a conference room office, and my other office is through the hallway on the other side.
Because it looks to me that you're never alone with your two friends behind you. All I know is this or the voice never gets old talking to you. Yeah, them too, it never gets old talking to you. The more you talk, the more questions I have, and the more I want to listen. You're one of the few guests that don't get interrupted. Just look on Twitter. People hate it. I know that because you have so much to say, and I don't ever want to miss a word, and I don't want anyone else to miss a word.
You hear about the autopsies, you hear about the investigations, but you hear a whole another side of what really happens in the morgue and on crime scenes death scenes. If I am judging by the first one I've heard, I can't wait to hear the second one. Doctor Kendall Crown's launching mayhem in the Morgue, and I am looking forward to the next one. I love the first one, and I will leave it a mystery as to how
something shoots out of the dead person's rear end. I will let you tell that story at the right time, Doctor Kendall Crowns, thank you for joining me.
Hello, I'm doctor Kendall Crown's, host of your favorite new weekly crime online podcasts, Mayhem and The Morgue. I have been around forensics for over thirty five years and performed thousands of autopsies. I have been everything from an autopsy tech to finally, a medical examiner, and each week we'll be discussing stories from my lengthy career. The stories will
range from courtroom dramas, explosions, maulings, shootings, drug overdoses. The cases will never end, and the stories will range from the humorous to horrifying, covering a wide variety of topics, and it will never be a dull moment. Hopefully you will find the stories entertaining and maybe you'll learn something. So tune in and I can guarantee your nightmares will never be the same.