I already know it's the creative spaces show first off. Do you consider yourselves to be
creators? Oh, interesting. There wants to go first. So I think about that
too. I think I'm a creator. Yeah. I think I'm a creator because I think being a creator means like starting something from scratch and having an imagination to build something from your mind into something, either physical or something. That's too.
Yeah. You know, I think I don't, and not because I don't create things, but because I've explicitly aimed to be a generalist, I feel like if I started going, like, yes, I'm this falling out from that path.
Okay. I want to dig in on that because I feel like you guys. Both creating a podcast together and might also have a business that you're creating value in. And a big chunk of my goal with this show is just to remove any definition from the word creator. I know that one of you is sales and marketing, the other one's engineering. I'm wondering if you think that informs your
answers. Yeah, I'm a software engineer. I work over at Patrion right now. I guess I've been more on the finance side than like the front end side. So maybe that doesn't formally answer, but I feel like I'm more so working on the plumbing than like the thing that's happened.
Yeah. I guess maybe it does have some influence about sales and marketing. Sometimes it's about the story or the background, or maybe even the pitch behind whatever it is. And by being a creator and thinking about it that way, you think about things in a different mindset that when Nick would think about as an engineer. So
tell me a bit about what you guys are making together. What exactly do you.
So Nick and I created a podcast and the podcast is, I'm sure you're aware of it. And all of your audience is aware of the building public movement. And that was something that we were really eager to try and start on and try and figure it out and see if we could do ourselves. And so we were thinking, okay, we don't know very much about buying a business.
And the idea came from Sean Perry from my first million Nick and I. From all access pass, which was one of his first projects, then he started with Ben levy.
Yeah. And so you've got this podcast, Nick, maybe this one's for you. When did you decide that you wanted to start a podcast? How did that end up
happening? Yeah, that's a good question. I'm not even positive Howard. Daryl. And I both are like big listeners of the podcast and we more or less met because of a podcast. I think it just kind of organically grew out of that. I mean, Darryl, do you have an exact moment where we decided
that it, we were talking about building and public, we should talk about our experience and I know buying a business was intimidating for both of us. We figured if it's intimidating to like both of us. I'm sure other people are thinking the same way and maybe they want some insights. So I think at that point we were deciding how do we build in public? We both don't really like writing that's easiest option for us. Yeah.
I want to zoom out a little bit and talk about the cycle that you've got here, where you're building in public. You're have acquired a business. You have a podcast, you bring other guests on to the podcast, but I'm guessing you also talk a bit about building your own business there. And I'm wondering if you've got any sort of audience flywheel building between the business and the podcast.
So I think both of them are a little bit too early for us to really be able to say we bought a really small business almost as like testing ground Darryl. I think a big part of that was like a what's it like buying a business? Well, we do a smart and be like, do I want to work with this person? I can take a small bet and do a risk on that. And like reassess from there. Yeah,
that was pretty much the idea in the first place. How do we work together? How do we create something together? How will the partnership lasts the test of time? I think that was pretty much what we were looking at when we're doing. Got it. And so how's that going? I mean, most part, I think we have a pretty good combination between both of us. We've interviewed quite a few. And veterans in the business building like realm. And they've always said, Hey, this is actually the perfect combination.
Like Darryl, you do sales and marketing. Nick. You're an engineer, so they can go on and build something. And I can just go out there and start posting ever pitching, running ads, doing all that sort of thing. We kind of compliment each other. The ideal thing that you'd be looking for in a business, even
just beyond the skillset, I'm very much the is exciting. Let's go do this thing, like this shiny new toy. And Darryl's like, oh dude, can we get a little focused on some of this here? So I think even just interpersonally, we kind of balance out awesome.
And since this shows a little more focused on the creators, we won't dig in. Um, the, uh, business, but how's the
podcast going? I think the podcast is going great. It's growing out, but we have pretty niche audience. It's really us trying to figure out, I would say almost where those people live and how can we talk to them a bit more? We've gotten some feedback that, Hey, you guys have done a bunch of interviews in a row what's going on with the business. So it's definitely some real interest in the buying and building side of it more than just like an interview. I
think for us, we really wanted to figure out like, how does this whole podcasting thing work? Like how do we go out and find interview? Yes. I think it was a experience where we've gone through so many things together and figure it out when we didn't know anything at all. And I think it was fun to get to know and understand, Hey, I'm good at this. You're good at this. Where are we bad at?
And through that whole process, like you said, like we're creators and we figure out things as we go and something out of it.
How do you go about
building your audience now? So right now, a lot out of what we do is trying to do it organically by posting in different groups with like-minded people. So we know a lot of the base of our customers are a few different things. One, they're going to be like founds of either trends by the hustle, my first million and recently the hackers. We've got people who are engineers, who work from some of the biggest companies like Google, Amazon, and a few other places.
And then we have people who are like, oh yeah, Haven't even started a business yet. I want to think about starting a business. And then there's some other people who are like midway through and they just liked the build and public experience. So we kind of have a blend of a few different things and we try to compliment our build in public with guests that we bring on. And so it's mesh between all those different ideas.
So what exactly is the, uh, business, because that I'm guessing is your primary monetization plan for the partnership. So
our business is called cloth cath live. It's an online fitness and yoga company. We're just interested because both Nick and I believe in the health lifestyle, Nick is really into jujitsu and a few different things. I'm into working out. I've created a few of my own fitness. So we just thought there would be a natural fit for us to look into and check it out. Especially during this whole pandemic situation, there was our adoption of online fitness and working out from home.
So we thought, okay, this business doesn't cost tight on money. I would be a good start for us to find out how the process is and what it would be like to work with these teachers and all these things.
What's your north star metric for success. How do you know you're on the right path? And I guess since we're talking about it, both in your personal life and in business, if you could answer
independently, I guess the north star metric is, am I making progress right? In some way that's meaningful to me. So either that's money or it's with this company, I would say like, you know, major progress, because like I found a good partner in Daryl and his podcast super successful because we got to talk to people who I wouldn't be able to talk to. Otherwise, I tried really hard to be patient. Very easy to be impatient.
And it just seems like the people who are patient will eventually get a home run in some way.
So I met a little bit of a green Sarah. Like I think progress is a really important thing, not to overlook because all of these little steps that I've taken personally over time. Sure. Nick has too. Those are the. That you learn from you become better at and you take notice of, and they all compound over time. I think it was a book, like count the compound effect. Right? So that's one side of success in terms of like your own journey and understand yourself and becoming better.
And then I also look at attraction like how much traction is the business getting, and is it leading to profitable return over time? Or is it going to get there?
That actually leads me nicely into my next question for you. What's your current
goal as a creator? Yeah. I feel like we have so many things going on simultaneously that we haven't really gotten together and been like, okay, this is like the number one thing that we are working on towards here. For me, it's like building up the podcast and doing the interesting stuff there. If more people are listening or the people who are listening are higher profile or anything like that.
Yeah. I would say that's a big success in my mind, but beyond just that I'm building out like a bunch of little projects that were just validating and then going, okay, like this is one that seems good. Let's shift focus onto this. Right there. Also we have two or three things that are like in the pipeline in some way. And I'm Daryl being like, okay, dude, we need to focus a little bit. So it's
time to turn the tables. Darryl, what's your current goal as a creator?
I think my current goal is just to help build an audience. And as new mediums and platforms is a lot of things that I've looked into coming from a sales and marketing background and talking to some amazing guests we've had on our podcast. I think a lot of them say it's about building it on.
Yeah. And with Nick's point and Sean build something that he has a huge audience, you know, maybe one day that is something that we just want to like, have an audience that we can do and let them know like, Hey, we have his experience and I like being a teacher as well.
So I've looked into some different channels, like how does SEO work and how does YouTube work and tinkering with the idea of creating like a YouTube channel that will help people understand the journeys that I've been through and then point them in the direction of the podcast.
If you could send a tweet back to your start, what would it be? And when would it be you get to
choose the start, man, I think I can give you the cop out answer by Bitcoin. So the first thing that I think I really did good was like, learn how to learn in college. I basically just skipped all my classes and study how people learn and like kind of practice that. And I mean, I was economics major and now I'm a leader. It gave me a little bit more flexibility than I would've had. Otherwise. The one thing I really underappreciated was the value of sharing your thoughts.
I grew up during that three year phase, when everyone was telling you, you know, if you put any personal information online, you know, you're going to get hacked and people will come find you. It was when I got introduced to the internet. I think probably, yeah, I would say lean into community, building into connecting people with each other. There's a ton of value. Not yet. Having everyone know you, but having everyone know each other and making the network more interconnected.
So I would say probably halfway through college, social media is the most valuable tool. Make sure everyone's interconnected. Awesome.
That is I guaranteed novel advice
for the show.
Do you regret letting him go first on
this one? I think it was good that Nick went first because they gave me time to actually think about what it. Say, so if I could compress everything over time, when would I say it? I probably say at the start of my journey, when it was the most frustrating and not figuring out how to Gerry your thing, this is what I would tell everyone else to do. And what I would tell myself is learn everything, meet and network as much as you can. And most importantly, get started. It's okay to fail.
Each step is a move to the next direction, leads you to success.