Cowboys Break: Staff Reset

twenty twenty three, season eighteen, episode number one fourteen. Welcome to the latest edition of The Break Life and SWBC Mortgage Studios. At the start, we're presented by Middle Light, the only beer of the Dallas Cowboys, and we appreciate you guys being patient with us this week. We're doing our show on a Friday afternoon. That was supposed to be on Tuesday, but then it was supposed to be on Wednesday, but never really quite happened and we just

ended up on Friday. So thank you guys for being patient with us. Got Nick back in town, we got Amber up here through all the ice. I'm here. Brian did not make it so he won't be joining us today, but we will try to make it work this week and back next week we'll be back on our schedule. I guess not even back, but we will be starting our offseason schedule. Our normal time will be every Wednesday at eleven eleven or ten eleven thanks eleven ten every

Wednesday at ten am Central time. You guys will be able to hear us and I will give you the latest news and our opinions on it. So do Brian, because Brian has something going on with the like the fan at World five, because it's not like he couldn't make it, because Brian thrives on moments like that, like it's like icy and all that. He was like, Oh, I'm I'm coming, I'm gonna be here. I'll be the first one there. Yeah, the only one there. It's not

like he couldn't make it because of weather. He hadn't you know, He's in radio all day long. Yeah. It's interesting because I noticed on one on five Dot three the fan. You know they do the camera where you can see all the hosts talking and Brian's show I saw this week Brian was the only one in the studio on camera. Everybody else was at their home. But

that's Brian. Brian is not He's like, yes, the worst the conditions, Brian's like, I'm gonna figure out a way to be there because yeah, exactly, So that's just that's what he does. But yeah, I think he lost a bet on air, and as a result of losing the bet, he has to do every show all day to day. So I think he got on this morning and he'll be on until like nine o'clock tonight. So good luck Brian. Have fun with that. That's a lot of talking. Yeah, if anybody can do it, Brian can do it. Though,

So all right, let's let's jump in. There was a lot of news that's happened throughout this week, so it's a good time for us to do a show on a Friday because there's so much we can talk about. But I want to start, obviously with what I think is the biggest piece of news, which was Cowboys mutually agree with Kellen Moore to move on. And in the meantime after that, Kellen Moore is already a new offensive

coordinator with the Los Angeles Chargers. Stephen talked about it this week at the Senior Bowl, and you mentioned it. There's still a part of it, it doesn't he He was talking about that with regards to Mike McCarthy and how that all works from the head coach to the offensive coordinator. He says, there's still part of that. It doesn't totally job with what McCarthy wants out of the offense.

What did you guys take from that? Well, I mean, I think Stephen was just trying to point out that, you know, everybody, everybody still respects Kellen and all that, but at the end of the day, you know, there's there's just differences of opinion, and I it's one of those things that when you hear it, it's not that big a deal. When you put it out on you know, in a quote, it looks like it. I mean, it's no different than you and I worked together and we

have a difference of opinion on certain things. I mean, not to the point yet that you're letting me go. But but you know, but I'm not saying that they let him go. No, I'm just saying, but people have different No. No, I'm saying people have different opinions on stuff. And so it was kind of like, yeah, like he respects Kellen, but you know what didn't get said, And this is what the way I'll take it is. I think everyone thinks or knows that Mikey McCarthy's got to

keep winning here. You can't go backwards at all. He's got to keep winning, make it break season, if that's what you want to call it. Probably he's got to go to the NFC Championship game. So he probably feels that pressure and he's like, listen, this is the way it is. Like I've done it for three years with Kellen, but I think there's a different way to do it, and I'd like to do it this way. Yeah, and

I think Kevin probably saw it too. Yeah, when you initially said big surprise, I thought you were gonna say dan Quinn because that was a huge surprise. But as far as Kellen Morton, you know, I think he he has a lot of talent, and I think he did a really really good job while he was with the boys. To see his transition from being a backup quarterback to then transition to becoming the backup the quarterbacks coach and

then quickly becoming the OC, that's pretty impressive. And to see the amount of stats that he was able to put up despite everything, despite Dak being out, despite all the different challenges you're not having the right amount of talent, a wide receiver, he was able to do a lot of things for you. But I do agree was probably time, and we talked about it last week. Definitely time for a different voice. It wasn't just working. It just wasn't

working out. And I think he's gonna do good things over there with the Chargers, so I'm rooting for him, not when we face them, but just in general. I think it's time. I'm curious to see how it's gonna work out, though, with Mike McCarthy calling the place now, because now you ain't got nobody else to put the blame on, that's all you. And we were talking about it before the show, Derek a little bit this morning. To me, it's just like, why didn't you take over

a little sooner? You know when you see it because we go through every year and you know how much the team changes. We were almost in the verage of losing dan Quinn and him going somewhere else. You have to you're gonna lose players. It's just the roster continued like always changes and to me, last year, I mean we were pretty close. Despite of how the season went,

it got pretty close. So in my eyes I'm just like, okay, if you have trust, even though aside of you have different opinions and philosophy and all that, but you're the head coach. Like I would have liked him to maybe take over a lot sooner if he felt very strongly about some of the decisions are not the decisions that were made well, I think, first of all, let's put this in context. I don't think it's just talk when

they say this was a mutually agreed to decision. I don't think this is a situation where it's just cowboys are like, hey, Kellen, we really don't want you here next year, so mutually we agree. Like, I think this was a mutual decision, maybe as much Kellen as it was the Cowboys. I don't know which way it fall. Maybe it was sixty forty one way or the other. But the point is I think it was a mutual decision. But I personally, and you're talking to you, and I

talked about this before the show. I don't think last year would have been the right year for Mike to make that kind of move. You were coming off a twelve and five season, you were coming off a year

we had the top offense in the league. I think if he makes that move, then I think the question I would have had questions because my thought would have been the Cowboys invested in Kellen Moore as a young offensive coordinator with very little experience, really no experience doing the job at just the moment when this offense seems like it's starting to take off. That doesn't mean it doesn't have its growing pains and it's still not quite perfect.

It's starting the show signs as being the top offense in the league that he has, he's on the right track. That would have been a little weird for me to say, Okay, now that we've finally seen some return from this investment, let's just rip it up. That wouldn't have been the right time saying like mid season. I mean, it's not, but I don't think that's the thing I don't like. Yes,

I don't. I don't like do that mid season for sure, unless unless the wheels have fallen off, which at no point this year did I feel like the offenses wheels fell off. Unless the wheels have completely fallen off, I just don't know that that's moved to make. I think he had one game where he would say that it was kind of wobbly because see Cooper. When when Dad got hurt, then Cooper comes in and so it's like, well, what's going on with the offense. I think everyone just thought, well,

it's because Dad's not in it. And then the one game in Detroit they didn't really play well for a while. That comes back and it's like, okay, what's going on? And then it was the Bears game and then it just went crazy. So like it was almost like if they didn't play well against the Bears, I could see or something. You know, now, now we got a problem because Dad's been back two weeks and it's not getting fixed.

But it got fixed. They went to the buy. They had a pretty good offensive showing in Green Bay, then Minnesota, so it's coming. It was almost like when the injury kind of almost put its pause on everything, like okay, we can't evaluate anything because there's an injury. And then Dad came back and had pretty good So I don't know if it was the right time to do it, and I don't I don't think it's a this is

that big a deal. I just think it's like McCarthy's like, you know what, I'll call the plays, but we don't know who the offensive coordinator is yet. There's a lot of names. They've interviewed two guys, there's some, there's you know, Brian Schottenheimer's also a guy that could be in the mix here either way. I mean, if he's calling plays, it doesn't really matter bring it to that's not really

it's just the structure of the offense. But I get the sense, and I don't know if this is always the case, but it's like everything is gonna be a lot more connected, like everything, you know, like hit bones connected to the kneebone type stuff, where it's like running backs, coach, offensive line, receivers tighten. I mean, it's all going to be a little bit more of a cohesive group. That's

at least the plan. We'll get to that in a second, because I want to talk about some of the players, some of the coaches that they that they didn't renew and maybe what that means. We haven't had a show in a while. Honestly, there's so many different things that

have happened this week. Before we move on, though, I do want to ask you guys, are he at all concerned about Mike McCarthy calling plays and still being able to manage the responsibilities of a head coach, because we've seen over the years there have been a number of head coaches, really good head coaches who have a particular discipline offense or defense that as time goes on, they're originally I mean, they're eventually removed from the responsibility of

the offense or the defense so that they can really be focused on managing the game. There have been questions about Mike's decisions in games, fair or not throughout the last several seasons. So that being said, are you at all concerned about him now being calling the plays in addition to trying to manage the game? You know, not really, because I'm gonna look at it from more of a

positive spin. Maybe it's maybe it's actually easier to call a game when you're managing to manage the game when you're calling it, because it's one thing to say, all right, you know, I kind of know what we're gonna do when you get in field goal range. We're gonna try to kick this field goal, So let's call play here. But but and and you know, and Kellen's thinking, all right,

I'm trying to get a first down. I'm trying to do this and then, and you can't communicate everything in fifteen seconds, so you know, maybe it's almost easier what you're doing here. I know, I want to I want to get the ball. I want to kick a field goal here. I want to run the ball to the left side to get right in the middle of the field. You know, of course, I don't know. I don't know if that's a good spot for a field goal. I mean, I don't. I don't. That's kind of a bad example.

But it comes to they can't make any kicks right now. But but you know, I just maybe you can eat call a game even better when you're managing it too. Maybe I don't know. I wouldn't know that. Yeah, you wouldn't. I wouldn't. No, I wouldn't know how. You've never been on a sideline calling a game before. No, Now, in the game that I did, I wasn't managing the game, you know. Yeah, so five year olds are a little easier though, right. That was it was kind of a

flag football game back in college. It was the quarterback. Oh no, that wasn't that game. That wouldn't have been coming that flag football. No, when rama was playing. Now, I wasn't managing anything there. I was just blocking. So it was like it was like you were blocking like Zeke on the final play, or I just wondered why. Yeah, that's funny, is yeah, yeah, everyone's like Jon Curse is tweeting out like I got Tom Brady's last interception. You know,

it's like, you know, is Zeke had the ball? Zeke snapped the ball at center the last you know, that's a trivia question. What was the last position Zeke played for the gab Boys center? And he doesn't remember it because he got hit really hard? Are you teaming up the next segment as to what you think is going to happen with Zeke? Oh, if that happens, okay, I don't think he's coming back. I say that we'll get to that well. I mean, I'm sure we have to go to break pretty soon. But my answer is quick.

I do agree with Nike as far as like, I don't think he'll be a very difficult transcision, and I think he'll be fine because he's still gonna They're still gonna hire an LC to come in here and take over some of the responsibilities, and so he's still gonna have the help he needs around him. But I do agree it's a lot easier when you don't have to communicate with somebody else that quickly and you can just

make your own decision and you're the guy to call. Now, what I like the most quote unquote is we would know specifically who to point. I don't like finger pointing. Okay, I'm saying this, I'm not a fan of fingerpointing. But even last year we were wondering, okay, how much input, what's the percentage between the amount of voice and decision that is taken during the game between Kellen and Mike McCarthy.

We didn't know really the answer to that. And now we will know for sure who's making these calls, and you're going to specifically extend in front of Mike McCarthy after a game and ask him specifically those questions and he's gonna be able to hopefully give you some feedback right then and there rather than I mean, they still got a look at tape after the game, but it's just it gives you a clear answer on who's doing what. And we'll see he's done it in Green Bay. He

has the experience. We'll see if if the offense truly changes because on the defensive side of the ball, you got another head coach there on that side. So yeah, I think I think all the way around this worked out for everyone. This is one of the situations that worked for everybody, because I do think the Cowboys quite frankly, I don't think Kellen did a bad job, but I think sometimes I remember Bill Parcel's talking about how I

don't care who you are as a coach. At some point whatever your thing is gonna run thin, and it's going to be time for a new voice. And I just think this is a good time for a new voice. I also think Kellen landed in a perfect spot talk about when to throw the ball. He's got a quarterback that could sling it, and I expect their offense to

be that kind of offense next year. They don't have a traditional running game, they have a running back who is a great guy out in space that you can throw the ball too, So you think about it from that standpoint, I think it's gonna be a great fit for Kellen. So I think all the way around, everybody comes out better and let's see how it all turns out. I don't think because Kellen has success there it necessarily means he would have had success here in order, you know,

or vice versa. I think at the end of the day, I think this was just the right timing for this move to just do something a little different than see if you can get a little more out of the offense. Are we're gonna say our first break, we will come back. We got to talk about Dan Quinn and some of the other coaches who will not be back here next year, some of them kind of surprising. We'll talk about that

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of the Break Life from SWBC Mortgage Studios. At the Star, we're presented by Miller like the only Beer of the Dallas Cowboys, and this segment is brought to you by blockchain dot com. Let's talk about Dan Quinn, defensive coordinator for the Cowboys. He is returning. There was there was lots of speculation that he would be leaving as a head coach. He'd interviewed for a number of different head

coaching vacancies around the NFL. Then the news came out that he informed those teams that he did not plan to leave the Cowboys, planned to be here, wanted to finish the work that he'd been doing here. How surprised were you guys that he didn't end up taking a head coaching job and decided to come back here and remains the defensive coordinator. I didn't think it was gonna happen again. I thought, you know, they got lucky last time.

Probably wasn't gonna happen this time. And you gotta remember, dan Quinn came out and said that this offseason he prepared for this. He prepared for his interviews, He prepared for you know, what he would say in the event that he was playing in a playoff game but also interviewing at the same time. So it's not like he doesn't want to be a head coach. He does want to be a head coach. He was preparing for it.

He's waiting for the right situation to come along. But as it stands right now, this is still a good spot for him. Um with with the Cowboys. You know, you're you're you're coaching you know my I mean Michael Parsons and you've got you've got a great you know, you've just got a great set up here. I think he's making um pretty good money, you know, maybe even head coach money. So he's doing fine there and he's waiting on it on the right spot. Yeah, I could

not believe the news when I saw it. I'm like Jerry freaking Jones. He I mean, obviously a lot of it came down to Dan Quinn's decision, obviously um, but at the same time he has to be happy and with the right people and Jerry Jones to make it happen. Last year, and like Nick said, salary we gotta remember, is that still applying the whole were his contract or money that he was making previously from Atlanta. I don't. I don't know, honestly, And if so, it's usually an

offset thing, so it's what what it was made. You kind of pay the difference because I remember he was still making money out of from that and while he was still working here, So it's just like the salary. Once you add everything up, it was still pretty good. But my thought process when I saw that is that maybe, just maybe because once again Jerry Jones has come out and he has full support of Mike McCarthy and he still has I believe, two years left in his contract,

but maybe that's a scenario. This is a scenario where dan Quinn possibly realizes what could happen in the near future and this could be a place where he could become potentially a head coach later on, and he sees the opportunity. He also see the amount of support. I mean you look at Twitter and things like that, just the amount of support that his own players give him. He's a players is that what you call him? Players coach?

He's very, very tight. He's a great guy, not just a football knowledge and what he's done as a DC, but as a person, so humble and everything. You just love the guy. So everyone is happy. Everybody's happy to

have him here. I'm freaking excited, especially because I'm not sure kind of how they're gonna handle free agency, and you look at what dun quinn has been able to do during free agency with guys that are not like top player, a lot of money, big splashes, and he's still being able to take veteran guys and make a name out of them again kind of refreshed their career here. So I'm really really excited to have him back. Yeah.

I think this was a great move for Dallas obviously, and maybe it was a situation too where it all kind of worked out where you know, and I'm not getting inside Dan's head, but you have to think about all the things that are factors here. He might have looked at all the positions that were available as head coaches and none of them was a great situation as far as maybe the things that he looks at that he'd want to have in place to take a new job, and he might be thinking next year might have a

better opportunity. Um. And so either way, however it goes, whatever was involved in that decision, it worked out for the Cowboys. They get their defensive coordinator back, and hopefully their defense continues to improve because it is, in my opinion,

one of the better defenses in the league. Yeah, I mean, you've got, like like Amber said, I mean, the guys like jay Ron Curse, Donovan Wilson, players that he kind of had a good vision for that that it was like, all right, let's let's you know, let me let me put them in this scenario and and and let's make them have you know, great, great seasons. I mean, and then obviously we don't know what it looks like with

Micah Parsons here without them. We don't really want to know it, don't really have to know right now, so I you know. But but I also think that was a vision that was something like, hey, this guy rushes the passer really well, um, we need it. We needed some pass rush help here, so let's see about putting him on the edge, and now he's an edge rusher. I'll tell you one other way that I think this

helps the Cowboys quite a bit. You have a lot of players on this defense, and really on this team, they got a lot of guys that got to figure out contracts for for that are free agents. There some notable defensive players that let's assume for a second, dan

Quinn does go somewhere else. Does he then take a lot of some of those players that you may have wanted to resign because you can't franchise everybody that you may have wanted to resign, and then they want to go and play for him because that's when they got their best work. And I'm looking at people like Layton Vanderesh where I'm like, does Layton say, Hey, I really believe in this guy, So wherever he is, that's where I want to be. If he's in Dallas, maybe I

want to stay in Dallas. If he goes somewhere else, maybe I want to go there. That I think becomes a bigger thing for Dallas. They don't have one guy that already has relationships with some of these players, you're going to try to resign that might be somewhere else. You're right about that, and I'm curious to see how that plays a factor. But this is also you know, this is like the second contract. Players will say it. They've they've been advised forever. They know the second contract.

It's your contract, it's your contract, this is it. This is the window that you've got. So if you're Donovan Wilson, if you're Layton Vanderesh, and I know a second contract for him as a little different because he signed a one year deal. But if he has a chance to get a big deal, Leyton, Donovan Wilson, and there's there's other players I'm trying to think, you know, Anthony Brown is he's getting kind of a different boat too, because

this is be his third contract. But I just don't see as much as Donovan Wilson probably would love to come back and play with Dan Quinn, the money's got

to be pretty close. Yeah, But just to be clear, I guess my point was if he goes somewhere else, now he's the person in that building that has influence that can say we should give a big contract to Donovan Wilson and maybe that pulls him away from the Cowboys because maybe it's more money, maybe it's the same money, but that he believes in Dan Quinn, that's really more the key. And the Cowboys just can't sign everybody. There's

no way they can. They can sign everybody, and the way that they do try to sign a lot of people is you've got to you've got to give Dak every structure you know. See, and I know we're kind of getting off the beaten path on this, but like they haven't paid the piper yet on Dak. No, he counted like five and on the cap last year. The year before that, his base salary was like a million. He's averaging forty a year. So if he's only counting one or two, what do you think? What do you

think's coming down the pipe here? So it's gonna be tough, um, But the way to do it is probably to extend him out. And you extend him out, you can you can free up a lot, you can free up a lot of money. But then again, you know, and he's got to want to be, you know, be able to

do that, which I think he would. I don't know why he wouldn't, um, So that's another thing that's interesting to see kind of where he stands and what he's thinking is and his agent, because look all it took for them to come out with that deal, and he was the one who wanted a shorter deal rather than a longer one compared to the Cowboys. So I wonder where he stands right now because I'm sure possibly he would have thought he would be like at a different

level in his career at this point. Well, and something that Stephen said this week from Mobile, he said that when the season starts next year, there there's gonna be thirteen and maybe fourteen quarterbacks that are making forty million a year. So you know, we said this several times on here, that yeah, Dak's making forty million a year.

It was number two at the time, and now it's probably going to be a ride around thirteen or fourth league, which is when you've when even even the people that hate on Dak's game, if you said where does he rank among top quarterbacks in the league. He's probably in the top half. Some people want to say top ten, top fifteen is pretty fair. I'm gonna have You're gonna be heartreaspond. Somebody says he's under top fifteen. Yeah, yeah, I mean, and he's played some some games this year

that didn't look like a top fifteen quarterback. He's played a few games where he looked like top five. So you had it all out, and that's probably where he is, and that's where he's getting paid. But that's that's kind of the way that it goes. I mean, you have to make a decision. You know, you have to pay him more than than you then you want to pay these guys sometimes, but that is the market because you don't want to start over every time on a quarterback.

That's exactly So to stay on the same topic, Steven he made a calm and saying he would like to have Dak here. He's going to be your guy. He'd liked to have him for the next ten years. And I think when fans see that on Twitter, you know, there's an initial reaction of like those people that very much dislike Dak and don't think he's the type of quarterback that's gonna take you to a Super Bowl. What

exactly does an extension mean? Aside from the amount of money, how long would this like extension be looking like, yeah, it's you probably it's probably like a three three years or so added onto it. I mean, it gets kind of tricky because then there's there's there's voidable years. I mean, what do you have like a six year deal that was voided down? So so maybe you put those years back on the table. There's a lot of different ways to do it. But basically, what you're doing is you're

just pushing money. You're just pushing money to the outside. You're not taking a pay cut. You're just you're pushing money to the to the end. And you know, I think you got to be real clear on what Stephen said. Hopefully we would we would love to have Dak here for hopefully the next ten years. That that doesn't mean ten years of him throwing two interceptions in a playoff game or leading the league and interceptions, of course not. It's hopefully it means that Dak, you know, has some

great years, keeps going. It's worth it. Hey, Dak's our guy who's better. Well, nobody, let's keep it going, keep it going. They would love for that. When Brady was thirty, the Patriots were like, I would love for him to be here for the next ten years. Like okay, and he was for twelve years. So but that's about the only example of that. So hopefully means that Dak is playing well enough where that is the best decision on the table and does that well, that probably happen, Probably

not ten years. I mean, I don't see him be any player playing forty is that's not the average is not going to say that's going to happen. But I will say this, and I think it needs to be said. I think people forget what we saw this year from Dak from the standpoint of interceptions. That's an aberration that has not been Dak's career, that has not been something

he's been known for his career. So for me, I look at it, I say, Okay, I'm willing to give benefit of doubt that there were circumstances this year, whatever they might have been, that led to him having such high interception numbers that I'm not willing to make that who he is at this point in his career. I think it was just an aberration. It was a bad year from the standpoint of turnovers. I expect that to

be better next year. I also expect that Dallas is going to do some things to help him out, which, by the way, we've talked about that before. Every team, every quarterback needs help. If this is not a league where you got quarterbacks that are just so good they don't need help. Even the quarterback right now that's in the Super Bowl that people in arguably say is the best one in the league, Patrick Mahomes, was there a couple of years ago and they lost the Super Bowl

because this offensive line did him no favors. He was pressured more than anybody in the Super Bowl era of the NFL in a super Bowl game, and they lost, and they lost badly. So everybody, every quarterback needs some help. I think, particularly right now, what they need is they're gonna have to give him some more help on the outside. But I'm I just think it's an aberration right now, and I think don't think we should extrapolate that to saying that it's more than just this season. Let's see

where it goes next year. If it's more of a problem next year, now, maybe you have for something to talk about, but right now it's just not that. Yeah, we'll take our final break, we'll come back. We got to talk a little bit about some of these other coaches that won't be back, and maybe we'll get into a little talk on Ezekiel Elliott as well. Do that in the final segment, Dallas Cowboys dot Com Radio, The season is finally here. For months, we've been gearing up

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presenter by middle Light, the Only Beer of the Dallas Cowboys. Remember, next week we'll be back to our normal offseason time Wednesday's at ten am, and we'll have every week we'll have some new things to talk to you guys about. As this week happens, there will always be news around the Dallas Cowboys. So let's talk about some of these other coaches who had contracts that were expiring and the

Cowboys decided to allow them to expire. I'm gonna run off the names for you, and then I'm gonna ask you, guys, which of those coaches do you think it was most surprising that Dallas didn't resign. You had assistant head coach Rob Davis, quarterback po coach Doug nust Meyer, running back coach Skip Pete, offensive line coach Joe Philbin second, or the backup defensive line coach Leon Lett linebacker coach George Edwards, Which do you think was most surprising? Philbin, to me

was the most surprising. But it's a close tie with Skip Pete. But I would say Philbin because I thought the offensive line did a great job of adjusting all year long. They were a pretty cohesive group when there wasn't a lot of cohesiveness there. So I thought they did a really good job. Was surprised by that, and come to find out that Philbin was making a lot of money. I mean, this contract was really high, like almost three million dollars or something like that. For an

offensive well, that's pretty it's up there. But for coaches, I mean you, I mean, there's no salary cap, so you pay for good ones. I thought he was a good one. I was kind of surprised that they were going a different route there. Well, not to take credit away from the running backs, but for a lot of that to happen, you got to give credit initially to the old line. And I keep remembering all the times that the old line, as soon as there was an injury,

it would just nothing would work. And that was a huge thing and it was a huge problem for the Cowboys. So for me to transition from that to now you see so many different guys a different positions getting hurt, and now you're having to shuffle guys around, make changes on the spot, be prepared for what could happen. We saw it in what game was that when McGovern had to go in that center Tennessee. It was when Beatis

got hurt Tennessee. So yeah, yeah, Tennessee. And then you saw those shuffling, which is not necessarily easy to do. So to see that they have been capable of doing something like that and be successful at it, are good enough to just keep you going and get you through the game. I thought it was a very impressive job and something that I haven't seen another on line coach do here for the Dallas Cowboys. So that was very very surprising when I found out that they kind of didn't.

There was a lot of them though, I mean, I mean, I think Philbin was the biggest one, but Pete, you know that was that was a surprise that the running backs, I think all had better years than they had the year before, and that includes Zeke. I thought Zeke had a better year and the backups, like, I mean, those guys, it's all about developing young players and Philbin did it obviously with the all O line with Beotist and Steele and McGovern and tarn I mean Tyler Smith, let's not

you know, what he did was amazing last year. Um so that those are surprising. Mica Edwards, Mica Parsons loves George Edwards and to let him go that was that was kind of an odd move. I mean, your right hand man is Rob Davis and Mike McCarthy and then they let him go. I really think at the end of the day, it comes down to the fact, and Jerry said it on the radio last year. I don't think he loved the fact. There's twenty nine, twenty nine coaches on this team. Twenty nine coaches A lot of coaches.

Typically you have how many I mean, I would I don't know. I don't know what twenty proper position, maybe a couple like backup type guys. But yeah, it's a lot. I mean to have twenty nine, you know, it's just it's a it's a lot. And I think that that's where and I'm not gonna say that, I mean trimming the fat. It sounds bad because it sounds like they weren't doing anything but I just think it was just

trimming it, trimming it down. Do you guys take anything from the fact or this this could just be pure coincidence and it was about the individual situations with each one. But do you guys take anything from the fact that your offensive coordinator, your quarterback coach, your running back coach, your offensive line coach, like that's your offense basically, that

all those coaches will be different. Do you take a bigger is there a bigger picture story do you think here or do you think it was just simply with each one of them there was a different reason why they were no longer back. I think that's a good question, and I think the answer is both. I think there's probably a different, different thing for all of them, but it's probably it all's gonna funnel up to Mic here.

And I think Mike's like, listen, you know, if I'm going down here with the ship, I mean, this is it. He's got. He's got to go to the NFC Championship Game. I think if he doesn't do that, I don't think he's gonna get that contract extension that he's looking for. And so he feels that and it's like I'm gonna. Okay, some of these guys were hand picked for me. Something of them I did bring in. But we're gonna, we're gonna make some changes here, you know, And I don't

know what I don't. We look at Philbin, we look at Pete, we look at these guys that go, Man, these are good coaches, but behind closed doors, we don't know exactly how they've meshed with with the coach and how they fit in and and just what the overall philosophy is. There's a thought process about running backs coach that that you and I could could coach running backs. That's the kind of the thought generally, there's a generally yeah,

and look at look at how much they make. They're I think they're the lowest paid position across the board in the NFL. It's just and look at the franchise tag for running backs. I mean it's ten point one. That's the lowest one. And that's what I was saying

to say about Skip And nothing against Saim. I absolutely love the guy and love what he's done and as a person, but it's that mentality that Nick just mentioned, not just with let's say coaching, but even the player themselves, Like it's this thought that you can easily quickly replace a running back with somebody younger, somebody fresher, draft a guy, come in, plug at him and play. And it's one of quote unquote easiest positions where you can just keep

you know, their life spam in the NFL. It's not as long as the rest of the other positions. But quick question, and this might be dumb or not. I don't know. I've never really given thoughts to it, But where does the money come from as far as like playing, paying coaches salary? Jerry's pet? It's nothing, no, no type of it's it's no different. It's no different. Honestly, it's no different than what he pays any of us. Like it's complete between us and a little different ry. Not

for you obviously, but for us amber for me. No, no, But I think how much money the NFL is making every year? Um No, But it's it's about that's a former player of the Cowboys we're seeing on TV. But no, it's it's about It's about nothing more than whatever the owner and GM works out with those coaches. It's not the league does not necessarily say there's this cat that you can't go over and so then it just becomes a function of your business. In your business, how much

do you want to pay for these particular roles that instance. Okay, that makes it very interesting to me because one thing we do know is if Jerry wants something, he's gonna get it. If he wants to have if he loved this guy, he's gonna make it work. So it's really interesting to see because I feel like in our eyes, these guys did a really good job as coaches, but who knows what happens behind this door. We're not in

those meetings, we're not there. But the end result of what at least they've shown the public eye has been pretty good. So it is interesting to see what's happening just on the offense overall what you say and all these changes, I mean part of it, and obviously none of us knows, but it could be a situation where it literally it's just like, you know, you like what

you have. But at the end of the day, these twenty nine coaches haven't delivered a different result than say, twenty right, and so it's like, okay, we tried it the way of doing twenty nine coaches that ain't really showing us different results. Maybe we ought to change up our process. And I mean, we all know what the definition of insanity is, right, do the same thing over and over expecting different results. So I do think that

I do think that there is a possibility. Again, this is all speculation, but there's a possibility at some point that just from a business standpoint, you start saying, we've had a lot of extra bodies and we haven't really seen a difference in those extra bodies providing more in the outcome, and so maybe we should trim that a little bit, and maybe we should be a little more thoughtful about who that one person is instead of the two people you will have at that position, or the

three guys you have here. Can you do that with one or two that are that are maybe more qualified or better at handling as one or two? Right? Who knows? But I just think from from a business standpoint, that's how I would be thinking about it. If I running a group and I'm trying to think about where I'm going to spend my dollars, if I've been really, really fat and i haven't seen a difference, at some point you say is this worth it? Yeah? Well, and I

think there may not be a salary cap. There's not a salary cap for coaches. There's probably something in Jerry's mind of what the coaches should get and how much we're paying. And if he's paying a defensive coordinator stuff. You have a budget, as does every business, so is defensive coordinator is probably making a little bit more. So Yeah, like all right, he's gonna more about this budget. Yeah that's a head coach. Like we're good. And you know, I honestly i'd never the role that that that Rob

Davis played for this team. I had never even heard of until he got here. Um, the coaches that had been here previous to that, I'd never really heard of them having that kind of role. Now, maybe they had somebody on their staff that did those kinds of things, but I never really heard of someone who was dedicated to that. They really didn't have a position group. They were the assistant head coach. But it was more of it. The way it was described to me by someone was

he was like your culture coach. He was more about creating the right culture for your team, which in most instances you would suspect that the head coach creates the culture and he's the one that's engaging with guys on a personal level and making sure that they feel the right way about the culture of the team. It's just it was a different way of doing it. Maybe they decided at some point it just wasn't you know, a lot of extra value. In college, you always hear about

these coaches they know everything. Yeah, you know, like even though there may be an older guy, but they're like, you don't think I hear things like I know what's going on. Yeah, And it's because there are people that report to them that are on the end. They're not in the weight room, ye, I mean, like the head coach isn't, but these other coaches are. They're down at the meeting rooms. They kind of know what's going on.

They're talking to guys every day. Yeah, yeah, hey someone so I was dealing with this at home, or you're about to have a baby or whatever. You know, like there's just people that kind of know what's going on. And he was one of them. And there was a lot more things probably that he did. But you know, that was a tough one I think for McCarthy. But you know that that let me know that Jerry was

probably making some of these moves here too. And don't get me wrong, I a lot of these guys on this list, in my opinion, have been some of the when you just talk about good guys, some of the best coaches that I've seen come through this building in the years I've been here. I actually I think joy spending time with Skip Pete. He was He's a good man and always gave good perspective. Was willing to talk to us about things that, you know, and give us

perspective that we may not have had otherwise. So and I really appreciate guys like to miss that at training camp. Yeah absolutely. I mean, if you could just deal with the cigar smoke for a few hours, you just deal with you know, He's sitting there just telling stories and just talking about you know, he had a plan all year. He had a plan. He was like, Zeke's gonna get the ball less, he's gonna be better. Paulard is gonna get the ball only a little bit more, but he

is going to be better. And I'm gonna get this third guy, which he thought was Rico Daddle. It turned out to beat Davis. But you know, but he had a plan all along and it worked perfectly. It really did work perfectly when you think about a guy that didn't start that's in the Pro Bowl. Yeah, which is one of the reasons I asked that question about the bigger picture is because you look at him, you look at Philbin, you look at George Edwards, and you start

thinking man. In each of those cases, there are probably guys you could throw out there that played at a higher level than you thought was they were capable of this year, which you would give at least some difference to the coach. Yet they didn't have their contracts renewed, and so it's just I think there are lots of things that factor into those kinds of decisions, and for whatever reason, the Cowboys side to move on and the coaches are going to move on. So all right, we'll

be back next week. We'll get into that running back conversation next week, because they're not going anywhere between now and then. We'll talk about Zeke and Pollard, maybe even talk a little bit about dak that next week. Until then. For Nick Eatman, Amber Garcia, I'm Derek Eielton. This has been The Break live on Dallas Cowboys dot Com Radio. This has been a production of Dallas Cowboys dot com and the Dallas Cowboys Football Club out