Cowboys Break: Numbers Game

member gar See I, joined by Nickiman and David Hellman. Uh. Derek is not here right now, but he might join us later in the show. We'll see. We never know what Devis is gonna do. You just get to make up the rules if you run the department. I guess that's fine. Yeah, he's just kinda want to get called to meetings upstairs. Yeah, you know the people that call him into meetings. I guess you can't afford to turn them down. I think it's probably been where he said, hey,

I need you to come up for a meeting. He's like, I have a show at eleven thirty, and they're like okay, and and yeah, and then and then you're like and then he okay, I'll see all next week. Yeah right, I know, I don't know. Either you're committed to the show or you're not. Whatever you tell that, you tell that to someone named Jones, I dare you. All right, well, let's get into it today. We heard some news, some updates that are currently happening, as far as a signing

that's about to happen. I know the Cowboys as of right now have agreed to terms with a punter, um Jared what was his name, Brian, And we love to joke about how it like the timing is always bad in our industry, but that was perfect. Like we were just kind of sitting around waiting to do the show and it came down and got it written and taken care of and got it confirmed. Yeah yeah, like thirty

seconds later. Like yeah, that's the biggest thing. And I know fans out there that that see other stuff and people can do things really loosely and agreed to terms according to sources and stuff like that, and it's a little bit harder for us. So we get calls from Fifth Avenue in New York if we don't cross all ourts and dot allR right, right, So we've got to make sure it's good. So when we when we get that agreed to terms text message or call that we

were happy about that. But you know, speaking of the position, you know, I think that we're talking about a veteran guy here, and I thought Hunter nice wonder did a nice job, did a nice job, did a nice wonder job. Last year better than we've ever seen he really, I mean from in the last ten years. I mean, his his average was better than what we've seen out of Chris Jones. But you know, he's he didn't do enough

where you're like, that's your job. I literally was sort of tinkering with the depth chart and just sort of thinking about the draft last night, and I was like, yeah, like Hunter was good last year, But in any given year, how many punters are so good in the NFL that they you shouldn't try to have a competition, you know, like maybe maybe there's one like Leckler has been that

guy for a long time. Probably Johnny Hecker's in that category where you're just like, oh, we're fine, but a guy that played nine games for you, like absolutely not, like bring in some competition. This this will be great. And twelve hours later they did, so, Yeah, what I don't know about this because again I just got um, he just got agreed to you know, the terms here. But is he if he's a kickoff guy, he did

do kickoffs in Houston Lafe. See that changes things a little bit from the standpoint of what you want Zerline to be doing and how much you want his leg you know, because his team's gonna score, and they score points, they kick off a lot, you want to have that option of him doing that also, holder, you know, just depends.

It's just the whole package. And you said he was drafted there's a joke keeps drafted higher than It's not a joke, like, I mean, no offense to him that his lasting legacy is that he was he was taken ahead of Russell Wilson, the jack. The Jags drafted a punter over a guy that's, you know, argue, you know, one of the best two or three quarterbacks in the league. So they had portals. Yeah, yeah, no, they were good, they were Yeah. Russ was pick seventy five and obviously

seventy four. Other guys were taken in front of us too. But when it's a punter, like where was he taken? Brian Inger? He was pick seventy by the Jacksonville Jaguars. Third round. What school? Uh, California? Okay, I remember there was there was a lot of hype on him coming out. He was a very good player. But like you just in same you know Roberto Aguayo, the guy that the FS guy, one of the best college kickers of all time. Like I think he missed one in four years. But

you just don't draft special Texas punter Dixon. He was a fifth or sixth round pick, Which that's fine. It's kind of weird if there's a guy that you love that you went like, sixth round is where I start thinking that's a good idea. Maybe fifth if he's amazing. But third round for a punter Andy with Jacksonville and he went to Houston, so he went well, he went to Tampa before like he played all four years with

the Jags, but they didn't resign him. So four years of a decent punter over Russell Wilson, the hold on cal Berkeley drafted by Jacksonville, went to Tampa. Where we going? Euston Dallas, what do you think? I don't I don't know. He doesn't like kicking in the cold. That's well, that's fair, fair enough. Who does who does well? He made his way to Dallas. Now he's over here, He's gonna be over here, and a healthy competition there at the position.

So we'll see what just ends up happening. Interesting time, though, because this is a time where things usually tend to calm down with free agency and you start turning your attention around and focusing more on the draft. Do you guys think that the Cowboys will be signing anyone else or any at any other position here in the near future before the draft? I I think that you could.

I'm trying to think what they did last year. I know that you can't compare anything to last year, how crazy it was, but I feel like that, you know, there are guys out there that you sign. The Cowboys are expected to bring in even a tight end today, and you're going to take a physical and if he passes, they could sign him. Jeremy Sprinkle, he's been in the league for a few years, but that's not official move

or anything that that's pending a physical. And and also just to clarify, I would kind of hard some things too. Kean O'Neill agree to terms. They're waiting for him to get a physical, he's waiting to fly here. He's dealing with some medical issues. Nothing major, nothing, they're they're alarmed about. I think the biggest question fans want to know is what's he gonna wear with jersey? Because he war twenty two. That's a great segue. Do we just want to do?

We just want to get all this uniform madness out of the way. Which is gonna wear twenty two? No, he's not. And Jalen's wearing nine, and I saw Gallup was going to switch into number four. We'll see what Dak does. I think eight's available for any we're joking if yeah, I can't assume any Everybody listening to this is all over Twitter, so I don't want to confuse anybody. All right, what's going on with the does't divide this into two parts? Number one? Is this an actual thing?

We know that the league is waiting to approve. It's winning on approval, and it's something that's depending It is an actual thing. The Kansas City Chiefs have proposed a rule that would allow basically skill players to wear a much wider range of numbers. So, like you know, receivers can only wear ten to nineteen and eighty to eighty nine. Right now, this rule would allow them to wear one

to nineteen as well as eighty to eighty nine. Running Backs can wear single digit numbers linebackers as well, so basically everybody but offensive and defensive lineman, and I believe quarterbacks can wear anything from like one to fifty nine more or less. So you're seeing a lot of guys talking about it. Obviously, that's a thing in college football. Jalen Smith famously war nine for Notre Dame. Part of the reason he chose fifty four was because it adds up to nine. Nine is a big thing for him.

Not sure why, but it's his number. You know, you've seen guys around the league, you know Odell Beckham war three in college. This would allow him to switch to three if he wanted to, just to It's not a big deal, but people love talking uniforms. So man, how likely are the Cowboys though, to accept because I would imagine you have to the Cowboys have to accept a player's proposal to like, oh kind of change to this number.

They don't have to accept it. They're spend many of people that want to wear number twelve and number eighty eight and number twenty two and stuff like that and seventy four. No one's ever worned seventy four other than but that's what I'm saying, like, you basically need the cowboys approval, whether they say yeah no, the Cowboys how to accept or not accept, right, So there's before we

get there, though, there are there are some things. And again, if they're going to change the rule, they could change multiple rules, but in the past you had to put a request for like two years. Yeah, I don't know if they're going to still do that. I think that's what gets lost in all of this. And the rule hasn't even been approved. There's another there's another competition owners

meeting later. They already had one here in Dallas. There's another one later this spring, so they'll vote on that, you know, sometime in May. They'll vote and see if it even gets approved. But if it does, that's I think the intricacies of this kind of get lost because you know, if um, I don't know if if Cedric Wilson wants to change is ur is that a huge deal.

Probably not like we've you know, Jordan Lewis and Cheetah Woozier have done it in recent years and it's not a big deal, but you know, Jalen Smith and Michael Gallup and Amari Cooper are and Ezekiel Elliott Zeke got in on it this morning. He said, yeah, I'd love to wear fifteen again. That was his number at Ohio State.

These are guys that sell tens of millions of units of merchandise, and I just feel like there's a little bit more to it than that than there's two ways roll enough to work on a Wednesday and saying I'm fifteen now, yeah, because that's I mean, that's a big monetary decision when you're talking about guys that have their

jerseys in every sporting goods store in America. So I'll be seeing if it passes, which that's I keep saying, like it's not even a rule yet, but if it passes, yeah, and it and it happened before that too, Like you know, you're talking about current players. I remember, you know Roy Williams wore thirty one, five time pro bowler and then he switched to thirty eight, and he did it because he kind of needed a change. Marcus Spears same thing ninety six to ninety eight. You know, maybe that's what

Jalen Smith needs. But let's bring it back towards that. Yeah, that's why he need. Let's bring it back towards that. And this is an interesting one because it's it deals with two players that I think are the most polarizing players in their of their time. That depending on the fan base, some of them, you know, love the guy, hate the guy, whatever, And there's not a lot of people that hate Ramo. They just thought he you know, not anymore. They definitely did. They did, Yeah, they did.

So are we really about to have this conversation? Well, get ready, age seriously waiting it. This is the most ridiculous conversation right here. What you're about to say, let's take it away. Take it away because you got more, you got more passionate about it than I know. To me, it's not even like it doesn't go even on the same sentence. The two guys don't even go on the same sentence. It's just not comparable at all whatsoever. So I would like to hear if you guys have a

different opinion. I do. I do a little bit because I think the point I think you're you're missing here. I'm not comparing the players. It's not about Jalen Smith. At this point, it's about Romo. It's about the number. You can't. You can't protect all these numbers. You can't. There are there are five number or four numbers right now in the Ring of Honor that are multiple the

multiple players have it. So that means a Ring of Honor player left and another guy came in, and there's gonna be five when DeMarcus Ware gets in because Haley's in, So five numbers are already duplicated. So Romo can't. You can't protect him. So you can't protect the number. He was. He was a great player at this time, probably better than I think people gave him credit for. But at the end of the day, somebody's gonna wear nine again. Now yeah, but who Okay, seriously, but that's I get

your point. You can't protect the number forever. It's fine, you can't someone what's right. But so what's worse. What's worse getting getting a young quarterback that they draft in the second round let's say this year, to maybe be a replacement. It ain't gonna happen. But I'm just saying, a young budding quarterback at number nine, give him number nine, or give a linebacker number nine, because I guarantee you none of Romo's passing records are gonna be broken by

Jalen Smith. That's what I'm saying. Like, and I know this because they'll give twenty eight out, but they had to give it to a young safety. They're not gonna give forty eight to each to a full back. You said that last night when we talked about tell me Jamie Showers. I won't. I'll tell you Daryl Warley. Instead, they sent him out there to get abused wearing twenty eight all last year. Just saying, Darryl Warley chasing after

Christian Kirk for eighty yards against Arizona, Like, oh my god, quarterback. Okay, played a lot of safety. I'm just saying. And that's that's kind of where I come down on it is there was it feels so selective to me, and like you can't protect all these numbers. And again I said this, like Jalen Smith is currently wearing the number of like too far greater Cowboys than Tony Romo. Yeah, I hope

nobody gets mad about that, but they are. Chuck Howley won a Super Bowl Super Bowl MVP, like a five time a'lpro Randy White, I mean, come on, a manster. So yeah, and I think that that and that's true, but how I see it's like, Okay, how long ago was that? Though you know it's the thing, it's so much recent that is the crux of it is like Romo, for he just retired and he was like he was the bright spot of this franchise for a solid fifteen years.

And especially for younger fans, like if you're my age and you grew up a Cowboy fan, like Tony Romo's really the best thing that you've seen from this team so far in your life. And and I think that's what prompts this emotional response to it, which I get it's weird. I think the three of us have three different takes on this because it's there's there's so many way you can slice this thing, because it's not about one player versus another. Because and I said this, I

said this to you, M. Dave earlier. I think that Larry Allen is the greatest offensive lineman, greatest guard in the history of the NFL. And I don't think you can say that about any other player that's ever played for the Dallas Cowboys. Other than Digon Sanders that is the best at their position, hands down. Joe Looney rock seventy three for the last four or five years. McKinsey Bernardo had it too. Okay, Yeah, so that's it's it's

so selective to me, that's my thing. And then and for that matter, my like, I get it if it's the same position, don't give twenty two to Zeke. But like if Keyan O'Neil wanted to wear twenty two, me personally, that doesn't bother me. He's not playing running back. It's I mean, it's you only have so many numbers. You know, Jalen Smith is wearing these great linebackers numbers. You know

they've given twenty eight. You know, Felix Jones were twenty eight. Um, you know, Okay, a decade from now, if a receiver wanted to wear eighty two, it's not gonna bother Okay, Kyle, this is Jerry Jones, and I'm not doing a Jerry impression. I'm just saying this is this is as You've just been drafted by the Dallas Cowboys. Great. I can't wait, guys, I can't wait to get there. I can't wait to wear it number twelve, uh or eighty two? The rule would have to be passed first. Twelve can't we as

a tight end? Are we sure tight end can? Tight ends were tended nineteen? I thought, Wait, all right, so I'm sorry, we're doing research anyway here he wants to wear an eighty two or twelve or whatever. You're like about that. Nope, tight ends can only wear eighty to

eighty nine. And right, yeah, but if the rule passed, he could And no, that doesn't bite like I'm seculating a lot here because we can get into some Kyle Pits talk that it's so it's so selective, like everybody wants the hot shot receiver to wear eighty eight, and everybody want you know, Randy Gregory got ninety four, DeMarcus where got ninety four? After Haley It's it's a sweet spot. It's like, okay, it's like if you're if you're not gonna do it at all. Like here's a number, can't

touch it, No one can happen. Here's a number. You can touch it, but you can't be anything close to the position. Or here's a number. It could be the same position, but you better be a badass. Yep. Eighty eight, yep, ninety four and then and also in a way, fifty four was given to Jalen Smith for that reason. You know, everyone wants to you and laugh about what were their expectations. I mean, he was coming off an injury and all that, but I think that their expectation was he was gonna

be good. That same with Bobby Carpenter. You know, he was first round pick, he gets fifty four, he's gonna be a good That always worked out. We gave it to Bruce Hambrick. You know hambric were as a fifth round pick. Yeah, that that that was in two thousand. Yeah, they weren't doing that. They weren't thinking there is there has been a running back to where thirty three, but there probably won't be another one. Yeah. I mean, and that's fine, But I didn't I didn't mind at all

when Cheeto was wearing thirty three. Yeah, like he plays quarterback. Who cares if they gave it to a running back? I get it. Yeah, that's just me. Everyone's got different opinions on this, and it's it's it's fun, it's healthy. Um, it's a fun debate. Yeah, I just I don't like the whole like, I love Tony Romo, but I don't think that his number is one that nobody can have. All right, let's let's go ahead and stop the nonsense and before we go to break, Okay, have we got

other stuff to talk about? This is nonsense. Okay, let's stop the nonsense with between Romo and Jalen Smith conversation here. But right before we go to break, are there any expected rules to pass that could be a little controversial controversial? Or is there anything else that's the big one? I know, you know, the Ravens, the Baltimore Ravens proposed an overtime rule that actually sounds really really fun where the team that wins the coin toss gets to pick where the

ball is placed on the field. So you win the coin toss, you say we're gonna put it on the opposing ten yard line. But then the other team gets to pick who plays offense and who plays defense. So a lot of strategy going into that. That could be really interesting. Yeah, it could be really interesting, but again we won't know if it passes for a while. And so that's where I'm at with the uniform thing, where I'm like, can we save this conversation for when it's

even a reality, because it's not right now. So but we'll see. I don't I honestly don't know when those meetings are going to take place, but it should be sometime in May, as long as they don't. When it comes back to jerseys, and I said this as well, like college football, people wear all kinds of jerseys and

doesn't really bother me. The only thing that bothers me is when you see like four number ones or number twos and all that kind of stuff, and and you have to they have to put a jersey on on the sideline, you know, because you can't wear the same jersey as someone else because he's playing special teams and there's another eighteen and I'm wearing you know, I hate that kind of stuff. I don't think I don't think

it'll get to that. There's not that many players, but forty seven guys in uniform in the NFL on a game day, there's like eighty two guys in uniform in college football. So all right, yeah, anyway, all right, we're done. Okay, we're done with this segment. We're gonna go to break and when we come back, we'll switch the whole conversation into the draft and some of the things moreover, all of what's happened so far with free agency and the Cowboys. Honey,

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else Cowboys Cheerleaders dot com. Welcome back to the breaks down a little bit now that we got all the nonsense talk out of the way in the first segment. In this segment, we are going to talk about some actually important some more nonsense. Got some more nonsense, all right?

Cowboys free agency, we've seen what they've done so far, and before we get to the draft talk and some of these guys, the prospects that may be linked to the Cowboys currently, I want to talk to you guys about just some of the holes that they've filed so far through free agency and if some of those needs we know we've talked about safety, linebacker, are some of

have some of those needs changed draft? I mean not drastically, but a little bit of what you kind of go into the draft thinking I do think so, I think I think it's changed some and not on the front end, not when you're talking about Thursday night, even maybe Friday. But when you don't signed Jordan Lewis. Um, then you go into this draft and you don't just need to get a cornerback in the first round. You gotta get multiple cornerbacks and they might anyways, but you would be

pigeonholed to get two. You gotta get one in the fourth or fifth round. You gotta get another one, you know. Um, I think I think cornerback is one that they helped themselves. Um, they could go play a game with Diggs Brown. Why are you looking like this? They could? They could, they could, they could, But I mean, fun, but there, let me finish before you that who farted? Look I didn't say sorry Diggs Brown? Um, who am missing Lewis? Those three and then and then you then you're gonna draft one.

But if you didn't signed Jordan Lewis, I mean you might have to draft two in the first for three or four rounds. Yeah, So I think I think. I don't think that's good. Jordan Lewis. Signing him didn't didn't help you didn't change the factor. You're probably gonna get one in the first round or so, but it did help from the standpoint of your numbers. And I think there's some other positions like that. I mean, they covered

their asses, that's what they do. But I don't think they did anything that changes what they need to accomplish in the draft that Like, I don't think anything they did. They still need a cornerback and they need to draft him in the top one hundred, Like they need a guy who's good enough to potentially start right away. You know, they signed Tie and Secky, but does that make anybody feel better about the swing tackle spot? Like, not not me,

not significantly anyway. Um, you know, they added a bunch of depth on the defensive line, but those aren't guys that you know should you Like, if if a guy's there, it's like, well we have we got brenn Urban, We're good. We don't need this guy, you know, Like, no, that's not that's not a thing. Um. I know we've talked a lot about safety, and I know that that's not necessarily a first round type of position there. But Demante because he's guarantee. These are like minuscule compared to haha,

Clinton Dix's and how that work out. Yeah, that's my point. It's like, yes, that could work out really well. And I actually I wrote a column about this last week, which is, you know they're buying they're buying scratch off cards. You know, you go to the gas station and spend two fifty on or how much does a scratch off

card cost? I don't even know, or you know, I go to the I go to the gas station when the powerball is crazy, and I'm like, give me ten dollars worth of numbers, just you know, maybe, And I drive home and I'm like hell yeah, man, like this parents a house? Yeah, I'm like this could be the one, Like who's getting Like, okay, my brother can have some, I'll get my parents a house, like you know, uh quit Yeah, no, no, no, I absolutely wouldn't quit my job. My job would be even more fun if I was

actually rich. Um. But then you go home in like five seconds into the broadcast, you didn't win. And that's what the Cowboys experience has been. Like they're like, hey, you know this guy, this guy had seven picks two years ago and we're only paying him like one point two million, like we could strike it rich, and they could, they absolutely could, but they haven't yet. It has not cashed in the way they wanted to yet and they've been doing it for eight years, so maybe this is

the year. But seven interceptions in three years before that ten and last two years. What happened last year, which and I'm not trying to I'm not trying to bash Demante because he or any of the other guys that they've signed. You know, huh, Zeke tried to bash him. He didn't, well, no, Zeke didn't try. Zeke ran him over. Um.

What about the linebacker position? I mean, does that change they had draft needs as far as having Kian O'Neill, which would say the biggest signing that Keyan O'Neill is probably my favorite signing that they've made because I know what a good player he was, and he came back and had a nice season last year after two years of injuries. But it's a five million dollar deal and that's probably like the guarantees aren't five million, so again it's one year, like you're not these are these are

not guys that you're looking to build around. And there are guys that you're you're saying, Okay, this guy can start for us if we need him to, but we're trying to improve this in the draft. That's what they do.

And so again they've done They've done some things that I like, like, they've made some additions that I do like, but they haven't done anything where I'm like, oh, I was worried about that last month, but I'm not anymore like, yeah, if this, if they try to go into this season, honest, like, they need to draft a cornerback with one of their first two picks, because you think about what you got

from Digs he was picked fifty one. You think about what you got from Cheetoh he was picked sixty like, and so now you're thinking, if I want better than that, I probably need to draft a corner number ten. I'm picking a corner at ten, and I mean, we can we can move into the next talk. As it stands right now, there are very few scenarios where I would go away from that. I'm I'm picking a cornerback at ten.

And if some reason, if certain in and and I think I think J. C. Horne has now jumped himself into a legitimate number ten absolutely, And if he is. If it's eight nine for some reason it's eight nine and those two are off the board and you're sitting at ten, I mean that means there's an outstanding offensive lineman there, you'd like to think, because the quarterbacks are going right four four of them, maybe five. Yeah, I

think I was going to ask you guys that. I mean, we saw it happened last year with Ceedee Lamp kind of help he fell into the Cowboys lab. But um, is there anyone, any player on the offensive side of the ball. There we go. I don't like to talk, but it could happen. Is there anyone, any name Dave that could pop up that you're like, Okay, if this guy, even though it's not a position of need, necessarily go for it. But he's too good to love the guy? How a few don't love the guy? What are you doing?

His name is Kyle Pitts, And I'm sure I've been as excited about a draft prospect at some point in my career, but I'm struggling to think to remember it, and and I get like, it's terrible. Your eyes are like in your eyes flat got the longest wingspan of an offensive skill player in twenty five years. He runs a four four four at six five two fifty. U turn on the tape. You can in the SEC, which most people would agree is the deepest, most talented conference

in college football. He's just going up there and posterizing guys, jumping over two and three dbs to pull in touchdown patches. He averaged eighteen yards per catch as a tight end. Oh you like j C. Hornnick? Oh no, Jason, I mean him, No, that's not him. But he beat j C. Horn in this game. Uh. He beat Tyson Campbell and Eric Stokes from Georgia, who are two of the best cornerback. That's jac Horn number one highlight. He beat j on

a crossing round in this game. Um, he didn't beat up on Patrick's ur tan so much, but he did beat up on Alabama. The guy's just uncoverable. And I get can tell you Ed K. Hill who used to be who used to be running this show back in the back. It's not he's not running these highlights. Is he's a South Carolina guy. He's just getting abused. I mean, but everybody that played this guy got abused. Yeah, I'm glad we don't see any LSU or Arkansas. What we got here? Oh? Yeah, no, who is it? That's yeah,

that's saying him. He didn't play against LSU, which is probably a big part of the reason why Florida lost that game. We know that there are certain guys that you like or we like or whatever, but the Cowboys don't necessarily aren't necessarily aligned with us most of the time. But is this a guy that could attract Yes, well, let's go out with what's what's being reported right now? It's on the I mean, and why it's being reported

as it is interesting too. But I think was Chris Mortenson from ESPN, who if you pay attention to these things, he never really does. He never talks a lot about the Cowboys other than like, you know, he talks to Jerry. That's if he's reporting on the Cowboys. It's because he had a conversation and it sounds like and he said he told him that you know, they're enamored or he's enamored by Kyle Pitts. And Jerry is a businessman here,

he knows he knows how to play the game. Yes, he is probably enamored by and why would you not be, But he also has to think get these offensive guys, quarterbacks, linemen, tight ends, receivers off the board. Yeah, and there's no way that if he really thinks, oh, I'm gonna go get now. I think I think it's true. I think Jerry really does like him. But you don't just start talking to people. You just tell him how much you love Yeah, if you wanted to draft Kyle Pitts, you

probably wouldn't say that. You wouldn't say that if that was who you really wanted to wind up with, which that's the you know, and people people get so up in arms, which I think it's so funny. Fans are like, you know, all through the year, and I noticed that with mock drafts, to everybody's like, draft the best player, don't worry about the need. But then when the chips are down, it's like, what on earth are you talking about?

We need cornerbacks. And that's mock drafts cracked me up too, because every draft analyst always says like, just get the best player, and every mock draft, you know, the little blurb, it's like, well they need a cornerback, so that's who I drafted for him. It's like the logic doesn't line up, and that's I think the world of Blake Jarwin. I thought he was going to have a breakout year last year. I feel even more strongly about that having watched Dalton

Schultz do what he did. Dalton had a great season as well, but he's in a contract year. Jarwin's contract is structured so that, like, you can get away from it if you need to, Like so the you know, these are not building block players and this is a generational prospect. I'm just gonna say it. This is what if they draft any one on offense aside from the offensive line, I'm gonna be pissed. That's just the absolute wrong way to think about it. I'm sorry. I wasn't

pissed about see Lamb. Last year. It was like, okay, okay, but this year, No, this year, after the season we had last year, No, okay. You know they needed a defensive end in ninety eight and they drafted Greg Allis over Randy Moss. Like these are the types of conversations. That's cool, they need I know, I know you from a talent perspective, I know there was more to the Randy Moss thing. Yeah, but I'm just telling you, don't come crying to me in fifteen years when Kyle Pitts

is the best player in New York Giants history. That's all I'm saying. Okay, I don't think if he is a generational player, like you say, and like a lot of people say, he's not going to tend no, And that's really it's kind of like the Jersey thing. It's probably a moot point. I really don't think he'll be there. I really don't. And so but but if he is the guy you need to do. If you're a Cowboy fan, you need to be pull and for Davante Smith, Mac

Jones and Trey Lance, maybe Jamar Chase. You know you want those guys drafted because you want those quarterbacks, and then those guys that's gonna give the Cowboys. Now, this is what I think is interesting. If if Horn and Certain are gone, what happens. I'm almost more intrigued about what happens if Horn and Certain are both there, because I don't I don't mean, you know which one do you take? Take? I'm saying, if enough players the Cowboys love are sitting at ten, you know Jerry will be

on the phone. Yeah, you know they would love to trade down. You just you might not have seen that happen. And as if they trade down, I heard this the other day and I'm just throwing it out there. If the Cowboys trade down, do not be surprised if they picked twice in the first round because down, and then they got up with what they got. That would be fun. I would love that, which I was gonna say, you might want Trey Lance to fall to you because that's

what facilitates a trade, that's what gets it going. You're right about that. New England might want a quarterback at fifteen. I don't know if you. I don't know if it would be smart to trade with a division rival, But maybe Washington wants to come up Chicago and Washington a quarterback. I mean, it depends on the price. I would jack the price up. Oh yeah, you have to. I don't

even know if I would do it. Then. I just like, if they want like fields on the off chance that he becomes a star, do you really want to be the reason why your division rival found their quarterback. I don't think that's a good idea. Don't think so either. But Chicago's right behind him at twenty. Maybe Chicago, their GM's about to get fired. Maybe he does something crazy to get a quarterback. So if Andy Dalton they only need trade up, there's a million ways this thing could go.

And it's fascinating to think about. And if you try to keep up with all the mock drafts, they changed by the day, you know, like they you know, you you probably got a list of seven or eight eight guys that have kind of been linked to the Cowboys. And I know, I don't even know if Pitts was on that list, but I mean Jerry talked about it,

but I saw one the other day, Daniel Jeremiah. He's he's pretty plugged in Quity Pay quit Pay Like, yeah, Michigan pass rusher, very very athletic, like bendy fast, explosive like And we talked about this on the Draft show yesterday. You know, spare me the taco stuff because you know, they both played at Michigan. But like Quitty Pay is an absurdly more athletic player, but his college production maybe

scares you. Like I think he had four sacks last year, Like he didn't, you know, he wasn't this monstrous guy. You would be banking on his athleticism, You would be banking on him developing as he went along. Ten seems it's not the number for that. But if they trade back, right, that's I just you know, I look at it and I say, if Patrick's r tans there, I think he's your pick. Honestly, I think that's their dream scenario. J C. Horn. If if that's possible, then you're probably talking about an

offensive tackle or a trade. And if you can't do that, I wouldn't be surprised if they drafted Michael Parsons either. Let's go back to I love that actually, by the way, I know you love partners, I know, and I don't know where he fits on the board and where they'll he would have to fall and get him or whatever. But I think he's everything you want Jalen Smith to be.

That's actually I did an interview that's that's coming out today with Bobby Carpenter, which against spare me the snark, you know, the NFL player, a great college guy who is plugged into the big ten. He said, he was like, if you want a comparison for Michael Parsons, it's pre injury Jalen Smith, like the guy that people were hoping

he would be. Really that's interesting. So, um, you know, going back to J. C. Horne, we showed some highlights of him and you said he went up against Kyle Pitts and as oppressive as it was for Pitts to beat the cornerback and all that, which, I think he's a bulky wide receiver. Um, but I love the See that's what I love about jac Horne is I got him. I got pits. Now, maybe he didn't get him all the time, maybe he got beat I bet he won some too, But that's what I love about him, not

knocking Curtan. But obviously there's five star guys all over the line for for Alabama, there's not that many for South Carolina. As we saw his pits just to torm up the whole team. But he is He's more of a dog to me, and he is a guy we got some Jac Horne. Okay, I mean I think he takes the best guy every time. He doesn't have a lot of other guys, you know, like on defense around him.

He's tough. Is you know, if you love the fact that Certan's dad played fifteen years in the league, jac Horne's dad, Joe Horn, played ten to twelve years, pretty good. Saint Bride receiver. Um so I just I just love I really love his game, and I think I might pick him over him. Kyle Pitts said Horne was the guy like he hated going up against him the most. That was his toughest assignment this year. And I love

Horn because he strikes me. I feel like Horn would come in here as a rookie and at mini camp, yes, he would bat down a pass from Dak Prescott and tell Dak that he's trash, like he's that type of guy. He's like he's got some like Richard shirt. I mean, no, don't maybe not not be so good at training camp because we get the sieve of what happened. You are like, you're so like you're so super stick. You're like, well, wait, I don't want him to be good. That means he's

gonna let me down. Just suck through training camp and be great during the season. You're just you're so afraid to be hurt. And I love it. But we see it all the freaking time. It's like this, why you're shine during training camp and then they sucked during the season. They guys who shine during training camp shine during the season.

Two Like Okay, You're like Renky Robinson and not show up at all at training camp and then just don't play, just keep don Mike McCarthy mentality of keeping things secret and then show up. I've never seen I know. I mean, cornerbacks are important. I watched that Auburn Carolina game, and I like, I've never seen a cornerback have such a ridiculous impact on the outcome of a game, Like he just terrorized bo Nix all afternoon in this game, which

Bonnix isn't a very good quarterback. So no, there's that I'd like to I'd like to mix it up a little bit. I mean, I know that's the highlight package, you know. Sorry, Chris, I'm just saying I like to mix it up. Well, here's here's another thing about highlights too. And and I've learned this over the you know you go YouTube highlights or somebody huddle, you know in high school. Oh yeah, give me the one where he's just getting beat, you know, like give me where he gets paying take

to run over or something like. Watching tape is so much, especially if you're ever fortunate enough to watch like a cut up. Cutups are hilarious because like they'll put they'll group all of the good plays and you're watching and you're like, this guy's going to the Hall of Fame. Let's go. And then you get to the bad plays and you're like, oh, it's organized in a certain way. I get it now, so that's always fun. Well, let's

go ahead and take ours all the Auburn game. This is unbelievable, Like, you're right, he played the gamesolutely, he killed him dominated. I keep waiting for another highlight, but I keep seeing the same game but different highlight, Like, yeah, it was he SEC player of the week. So I don't know, fall in love with the player. So you don't get your heart broken when something happens in the draft and he does not end up here. Oh, I've learned a long time ago. You can't. You can't worry

about the draft. They're gonna you know, they're gonna pick it. That's why I don't really, I'm not into what Dave does and Broadest did and Kyle and those guys because I just can't. I just can't invest. I just can't invest in four hundred guys, but no one that only twenty are going to be here. Oh, and I get it that in three or four years they'll be free agency and you learn them and all that. But I just not, Oh see, I I love it. Maybe I'm

a hipster, but like you know, I knew. I knew Kareem Hunt was going to be a beast for the Chiefs before he ever played, and he like he had like one hundred and fifty yards in his first game. Like, it just helps you know the league so much better. You're like, oh, yeah, I remember Kenny Galladay. I like, yeah, he was great coming out of school. He's just so I it just helps know the league so much more. Found another game one oh lsu oh here comes to

score in a second. Yeah, anyway, I would be I would be tempted to draft j C. Horn over Patrick's Urtan. And I like Patrick's Urtan, but he is a hell of a player. He's physical. That's what I like about him. I mean, and I know certain is Certain would would be great. I just think you have to do you have to take a cornerback at ten? You just you have to. No, you should never know. I disagree with

that completely. That goes again. That's my point is, like I just I think so much of Kyle Pitts that if for some reason he was there, and then that's when that's why you do your homework, and that's why you say, Okay, we like Eric Stokes, we like Elijah Molden out of Washington. Going back to your point, you know they have enough capital that they could maybe trade up for a guy if he fell a little bit,

Greg Newsom out of Northwestern. You should never do anything. Well, it's just it's hard to have that kind of mentality this year after the kind of season they had last year. And I get it. It's why you gotta peel back and remove your emotion from it. Okay, Well if you told me, oh, we didn't spending all our money on the quarterback, and we had some a bunch of money to spend on the other free agent veteran guys that can actually come in here and be very impactful, but

that didn't really happen. So you're great, Okay, sorry, just love it. You made it. But you're lamed running to the podium to draft Kyle Pitts if I can, and I'll worry about everything else later. Okay. Well, let's take our final break, and when we come back, I do want to talk about some of them possibilities of trading down that you guys talked about and see if that could actually happen and how or what that would look

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a little bit to start working out or something? Damn all, Right, then maybe I added a little too much too, so thank you, thank you for that. But okay, last segment, and you guys kind of hinted at the whole possibility of training down. Nick, you mentioned trading down and then training training back up. But if the cow was where to trade down, how does how would that look like?

I mean, as far as I know, it's hard to predict what who's going to be there and all that, But just looking at it right now, would you guys like that that if the Cowboys were to trade back in the right circumstance for the right price, I would love it, like, depending on what is available to them. Yeah, And it is really hard to predict because everybody loves to say that and we always say like, you gotta have a trade partner, you got to have a player

worth trading up. For that's almost always a quarterback, not always, but almost always, so Trey Lance mac Young. If one of them were to follow you at ten, or if a Jamar Chase or a Kyle Pitts, just this guy that somebody is completely obsessed with, you could maybe make

that work. But you need that because we've seen what a trade looks like when you don't really have a partner, and that's the Travis Frederick trade, which it worked out because Travis was great, but they still kind of got fleeced on the deal, like Floyd was there for him.

I think it was seventeen they were, or eighteen eighteen, you're picking eighteen, and they bailed because they didn't want to draft Sharif Floyd, which turned out to be a good call, but they only got a third round pick for moving thirteen spots in the first round of the draft. Like that's just not that's not good. And it's probably not a coincidence that they shook up the way that they do the draft after that happened. Yeah, so you

don't want to do that. You know, I'm not bailing out of ten just because I'm terrified of picking somebody. But if somebody's gonna really sweeten the pot. I talked about this in the mailbag earlier this week, Like, if Chicago wanted to offer me their next year's one to jump ten spots, I would do that all day and then into twenty. You'd go down to twenty in this year's draft. Yeah, and then you get and I want

next year's one. Hopefully I could maybe even get a Day two pick out of it as well, like next year's one and this year's three to fall back ten spots and let them get their quarterback. I would do that in a heartbeat, especially if it's for a quarterback. Oh no, and that's you need something but that you were capable of driving price. I say that too, or having next year's number one, because if most teams are

not going to sit on their quarterback, they're gonna play him. Yeah, and so you want to trade with the team if you have their next year's number one, you want them to play a rookie quarterback and that he struggles and get a better pick out of it. So I would do that, you know, I'm like I said, I'm not doing it for the sake of it, but in the right circumstance, you know, like I said, New England at fifteen makes sense. I don't know if you would want

to trade with Washington Chicago. Those are probably in that scenario about trading next year for next year's one. You're not trading back into the first round. Probably not. The scenario that trades into the first round is like ten to like seventeen or something like that, and then you get their number two maybe something else out of it ten to seventeen, you probably get a two and maybe a four, and you package that pick some of that with picky and yeah, I mean we see that happen

all the time. Somewhere between twenty seven and pick thirty two, somebody in the second round. He loves to jump up and get whoever it is that they covet. Again, a lot of times it's a quarterback, like if a Lamar Jackson falls to the end of the first round or something like that. And I know a lot of fans know this, but it's worth pointing out just the difference in getting a first round pick with that fifth year, you have the ability to keep them for five seasons

instead of just four. You know, the difference between the thirty second pick and the thirty third pick is tremendous, And that's you know, it gets a little convoluted, but that you know, So the Cowboys have four picks in the top one hundred right now, and I tend you know, top one hundred draft picks maybe not necessarily starters, but if you're drafting in the top one hundred, you should be good enough to contribute as a rookie significantly. So

would they have four right now? Would you rather have four players in the top one hundred, four guys who can come in and contribute or use some of that capital to draft two guys in the first round. So now instead of four top one hundred, maybe you have two top thirty and those guys should be stars. And that's you know, that's always an interesting debate. That is a different scenario, which isn't necessarily trading picks for picks.

But it's the whole Michael Gallup conversation which people have been having during this offseason, you know, kind of hinting, is he a good guy that would be good for a trade, and we know his contract is about to end, He's probably gonna require and ask for more money than what the Cowboys could possibly paid him. And looking at the fact that you still have Amari Cooper and um Cidey Lamb, Cilley Lamb, sorry for Nancy Brain Cidey Lamb.

Where do you guys currently stand with that whole conversation? Is it still really a conversation or is that something that kind of like that's not really going to happens. That's well, there's a whole there's a segment. You know, there are is a segment of people that are so obsessed with best player available that they'll say, you know, Jamar Chase, Jalen Waddle or Davante Smith has a chance to be the best player available when you pick. Yeah,

those I mean, those guys are studs. And if you were really about that business, you could draft one of those guys and either just let it roll or try to do something with Michael Gallop after the fall. I wouldn't. I wouldn't do anything with Gallop unless that happened, Like, yeah, if you wind up with Kyle Pitts or a wide receiver, maybe you could make that happen. I always say it just like people are always trying to solve problems before

they arise. And I know we've talked about this before, but Amari Cooper's deal is structured to where they can get out of it this time next year without really any consequences. Like the vast majority of his guarantees are front loaded and they'll be done, so you could trade Amar next year for cheap. You could cut him if you wanted to. I don't know why you would. He's great.

I think he'll be great, but you could so. I mean, you could find a way to pay Michael if you would prefer to keep him around, or you know, if he leaves. Based on what he's done, I would think any deal that he would sign a free agency would net you a fourth or maybe even a third round pick, depending, so you could go that way. So I don't think it's necessary. Would you get for him if you traded

him right now? That's a great Q draft day, on draft day before you draft a receiver or after, because I think you know, if you draft Jalen Waddle and then you try to move Michael Gallop, I think people would be like, well, I'm not going to pay a premium for that. Like you, like, you got more receivers than you know what to do with. I think there have to be some kind of agreement going on here or something like that. I would like to think you

could get it. I want to do that. I like, statistically, I believe like Gallup is one of, if not the best receiver from a production standpoint, from his draft class, one of Yeah, and so I'd keep in him. I'd like to think you could get a third for him. But it's hard to predict that type of stuff. I mean, I mean, I would rather keep him unless you wind up with one of these guys on your team and then or or you know, it's Will. It's Will's job to you know, have his eye on you know, he's

the executive vice president of player Personnel. A big part of his job is knowing other teams rosters. And so maybe you could trade Michael for a similar defensive tackle, I know, like Dalvin Tomlinson just signed a new contract. But a guy like that, like a talented defensive tackle who needs a new contract, who's a obvious upgrade over what you have here. Look at guys in contract years, Yeah,

both on other teams and on this team. Gallops a contract year, Connor Williams is in a contract here, Um, Dalton Schultz. Those are the those are the guys that are easiest to trade because they don't have a lot of money. You know that with the cap hit wouldn't be that much at all for the for the team that would taking him or or letting them go. So and we I mean, it's easy for me to say, oh, that stuff never happens, but like you know, they did trade Ryan Switzer for Jihad Ward on Draft Day a

few years ago. They got Tavon and a draft trade, so it does happen. Does happen? But I lean towards thinking it's more unlikely than that. Is it unlikely for any other players like you mentioned Connor Williams. I mean there's also I mean Dalton Schultz. But but Dalton Schultz but be an interesting piece of trade bait for you know, any of those guys could be interesting. But is it something realistic for that the cowboy that you could see

the cow was actually doing with any of these guys realistic? Yes? Likely, No, Like that's kind of my answer. Across the board, it happens, it all those would be because those players, I mean, if you're saying that Gallup would probably give you a third, then you if you were to trade Dalton Schultz on Draft Day or Connor Williams. I mean we're talking about day three pick here, right, probably fifth or it maybe a player of a compar break and so at that point,

you only do those things. If something happened in the draft that right change, like get a guard in the second round. I'm only trying to move Gallop. Yeah, I'm only trying to move Gallop. If I draft Pits or Waddle, I would only be interested in moving a guy like Connor Williams. If I wound up with Rashaan Slater. It's like, these aren't things that I'm seeking to do. These are things that because I might, you know, my draft class might change how I feel great as the future is

this team. This team showed you in free agency that a lot of one year deals. I mean they're trying to They're trying to win now as well. I mean, you know, hoping that these guys sticking to baby keep them down the road, but I mean that they are trying to win right now and for this year as well. Yeah, and that going back to the first segment, I you know, they covered themselves as well as they are willing to do. But it just it doesn't and shouldn't change their philosophy

in the draft for basically any position. And I know we talk about a lot about all the needs that they currently have on defense, and mostly that would be hopefully addressed through the draft. But when from the first round, second round, those later draft picks are there still like good talent there defense, what would be like the like the best kind of position that the Cowboys could be looking at in later rounds. Let me just throw this

part in. And I don't know if I've said this before, I'm not interested in doing a lot of trade ups unless you've already traded down a lot. I think this team has ten draft picks, and I think they need ten players. At least. They need to throw ten things up on the wall and hope six or seven of them stick. You need that sixth round pick. He might be Rico Gathers that might not play for you. He might be Anthony Brown who you resigned, and as as

a quality player, you need those guys. This team needs so much help and so much depth that I'm I'm trying to I'm using those so to answer your question about position, you know, there's hall of famers at every position. In the sixth and seventh round, at some point in there, you know, at somebody, do you hit on one who knows? I mean, I think that's and I think it just depends. I mean, you can talk trash about him all you want, but they trade it up for Xavier Woods because they

felt strongly about him. And you know, for a guy he was drafted mid late sixth round and they got four years of starts out of him, Like that's a wine. That's a good pick. Even though last season was bad for him, and I don't think very many people were sad to see him go. That's a good draft pick. They traded up for Tyler Bottish last year as well, So it just depends who's sitting there. I always tell

people this is just my opinion. But like I said, the top one hundred is where I stop really thinking that this guy is going to contribute. And again, he could grow into a Hall of Famer. He could be an Anthony Brown who or or an Xavier Woods. But Bradley and I is the perfect example. He falls to the fifth. Everybody's Senior Bowl MVP, this great player and he still could be. But everybody like, oh my god, we got Bradley and I and he played six defensive snaps.

That's something. Sure you can say something. Okay, for the last year and a half, every time you say top one hundred, I'm not trying to be rude about it. I always think of Jazz Green. I mean it's just one example, but it's like, every time you say one hundred, I think of Jazz Green because he stuck in there at like ninety eight or whatever. I know, Michael Gallup was pick eighty one, I get it, and Dak was whatever. Dak was pick one thirty five. You work out with everyone,

you just throw it out every number. Like I'm just saying, that's pretty awesome. H I always say should if you draft, if you do your job the right way and draft the right player, a top one hundred pick should be able to contribute. It's not an exact time you say it. I can't get that out of my head. Like I just think maybe I'm always like being like contrary, like, oh that's fair, but I just people, you know, I

think the draft changes on Day three. That's when you're basically just cash in lottery tickets and hoping for the best bodies, yeah, and adding guys that can compete, maybe grab a roster spot, and you hope for the best. And that's why, literally, like I'm sitting here thinking, I'm like, okay, in the first in the first three rounds, they need to find a cornerback, they need to find uh some offensive line depth, they need probably need a linebacker who

could potentially start right away. But then by day three, I'm like, shoot, draft a quarterback. If the right guys there, if a running back that just absolutely shouldn't still be there in the fifth round is there, draft them, draft a defensive I don't care like and they have six picks on day three, do whatever the hell you want with them, honestly, because you're just hoping for the best at that point. Anyway, all right, well they are going to do whatever they want. They are they always do.

They always do, not just on day three. They are gonna do whatever they're doing. Who they is true? All right, Well that's it for today. We ran out of time and Derek never showed up. But that's okay. You guys did a great job. I think the YouTube had a pretty good conversation here. Today. We got we went into the weeds with the Jerseys, but we pulled it back. We got back on the road. No, it was great last night. It was a seriously Nick called me to

like breathe. It was like one of it was supposed to be like a ninety second work conversation, and we'd wound up ranting to each other about jersey numbers for like a half hour. It's funny because you got you guys say it's kind of stupid. It's not even done yet, but yet you're still nothing. Love it. I mean, tell them that story about LSU, that the patch, that's funny.

The most clicked on story that I ever wrote in college when I was a student journalist was just some bs that I threw together, like LSU decided that they were going to stitch the letters LSU onto the collar of the jersey, like the most stupid, minuscule change. It blew up. It got like so many clicks. People were arguing in the comments about it for like weeks. It was. And the other one other most clicked on story I ever wrote was just a throwaway blog post that Terrell

Pryor was going to visit. He was going to go on a visit to LSU. He was like the number one prospect in the country at the time, and just the thought that he would even visit campus, you know, but then you know the story that I've spent like four months reporting on, Oh, nobody right next, next week or whatever, And it's not I'm not saying this has happened. I'm just throwing out a free agent. We'd have two headlines in a row. Cowboys signed veteran linebacker kJ Wright.

Cowboys change pants to lighter shade of green. Oh. I mean like telling you that would be the only thing which I can't talk trash because I've been I say, I don't care, and I've had like five different arguments about the jersey numbers in the last twenty four hours. LSU ever changed their goal post back to a regular goal post and knockout, he wouldn't change anything about the game. I would be so mad, all right, guys, Well, thank

you so much for joining us today. For Nickiman, David Hellman, I remember you see on Cowboys Break Dallas Always dot Com Radio. This has been a production of Dallas Cowboys dot Com and the Dallas Cowboys Football o'clock