Cowboys Break: Make The Call

latest edition of The Break. We are alive from this s WBC Mortgage Studios at the Star, joined by Nick Eatman. We've got Amber Garcia. Dave is not with us today. He is out in Indianapolis covering the combine. He's going to join us here in a moment, catch us up on all the things that are happening out there, the people he's talking to, the information that he's getting. Uh. And just if you guys have any questions for him, you can kind of throw those at him too. I'll

be good. We got to start the show. What, oh, we don't have any glass? Yeah, in case you guys haven't noticed, we got like no glass. It's actually a good thing. I love this, but we gotta start the show. We wishould go very happy birthday to my dude. Thank you, Happy birthday. Okay, man, pretty old, you're not old. Yeah, it's all about to say story. Sure, it tells the story. So this seems old, but go ahead. Yeah. When I

was thirteen years old, just a while ago. Um, I was thirteen and I've just moved from Oklahoma to Dallas. So I was like, you know, a little small town, Okhom, very rural, and then all of a sudden get here and it's like a little different, little preppy. I wouldn't you sed saw that. It didn't have a lot of friend I hate it, you know, want to move in your thirteen seventh grade. So it was like my fifth

sixth day of school, March second comes around. I'm in the history class and the teacher was really nice, like I gotta gotta it's a very special birthday to day. I was like, oh, thank awesome, because do y'all know whose birthday it is? And I was about to raise my hand. They're like, it's Texas's birthday. It's Texas Independence Day and everybody was like oh. I was like okay.

So then they went through that, and then she goes, hold on, there is another birthday, another birthday, and I was like, Okay, finally she's like doctor Seus's birthday is today, and I was like, I hate this class, I hate this world. I want to go back home. But I hate Texas. I hate Texas. I hate forever. So anyways, so those two birthday Happy birthday to doctor SEUs, yeah, and happy birthday to Texas. And it funny how you kind of know, like, you know, celebrities, you know, things

like world Chamberlain scored one hundred points today. Really you probably saw it somewhere. Yeah, I put a hundred points in a game March second. Yeah. Yeah, you know you share birthday with like bon Jovi and things like that, do you. Yeah, that's what about you? What do you share through it? You know, like the celebrity I want to say, Denzel Washington, it's either the same day or like a day or two apart. But that's the only thing on what I know. I don't know. I don't

think I've looked it up. No, but happy birthday too. It's a it's always a good right here right here day back there. There's something I don't know what it is. Oh gosh, hey, what does Indianapolis feel so far away? It's like reporting from Baghdad? Like, what's up? Man, That's just that's just the cherry picker driving down the street. Sorry, I got it. Happy birthday, Nick, Thanks Bud, appreciate it.

Mind so isolated here, you know, like you guys in December, and so we run back and back to Man, we're all together. It's like here here, here, here, Dave eating this half eating cake that we gave to Broadest. So Dave, Man, what's going on out there in Indianapolis. Give us an update on what what you're seeing, what you're hearing, what's going on. You know, it's kind of ironic because, like, I mean, the combine has started and it's picking up.

But like I've been here since Monday, and the thing that people are here for, which is the drills, like that doesn't even start until the weekend because they want to maximize the TV viewership. So yeah, like people are talking and then all of the good combine whispers and everything. It's just funny to me that we're three days in and like nothing has actually happened. But yeah, I mean, that's the sideshow of the honnestly, the real reason you're here.

Nobody actually cares about the drills. It's all about you know, contract negotiations and all that type of stuff, and that's going on in earnest We talked to Stephen Jones Monday. I still don't know when we're gonna talk to Jerry Jones, but I actually I have another interview with Stephen set up in just a little bit. So all of the good, all of the good combine storylines of who might be getting a pay cut or who might they be targeting

for an extension, all that fun stuff. So Dave, Dave and I have talked about this, like I think, I think the meeting is this afternoon, and then after that, like they got to get off the bus because then the agents are coming in. Wait, So the meeting with Jerry on the bus, no, no no, no, the meeting with Steven day. They're gonna meet with Steven and then after that, reportedly the agents are coming in to meet afterwards. So Dave's gonna go to the bathroom real quick and stay there.

I stay there. Well, Jay ron Curses agent or Schultz's agent or Gregory's agent come in and meet on the bus. You got that phone charged up, Dave. Oh yeah, report all that. I got a solid I'm gonna hang out in the back and see what they'll let all right, Dave. So I'm gonna put you on the spot a little bit. And I understand as a reporter you can't always talk about everything that you hear. But what has been the

most interesting little tidbit you've heard this week? That that's safe for for air, safe for radio, that is, I mean, that's that's quite a contradiction, um man. So I feel like it's it's almost kind of beaten into the ground at this point. We've just we've talked so much amar and so much to Marcus Lawrence, I think, honestly, and I'll kind of I'll bail myself out because the funny thing is, like you hear it, you hear it a

little bit of both ways. Like you know, we got here Monday, and again we've been talking about this for a month where it's like, oh man, they got some decisions to make. This could be a really hectic month, and and Stephen was very noncommittal about Amari Cooper's shooture on Monday. So you start connecting the dots and it's like a certainty that Amari Cooper is not going to be on the team. And then I was out, you know,

doing the hobnobbing thing last night. You just never know who you're going to run into, and then you wind up having a conversation where it's like, you know, that's don't don't be too quick with that, Like, well, we'll see what happen. Yeah. Absolutely, But then the other side of it is like, oh, they you know, they're already they're already talking about using that money to bring back Schultz or a Gallup or whatever. Like it's it really is chaos, and the truth is somewhere in the middle.

But I guess the most interesting thing I've heard is I've heard it all Like everybody's got a story that they're trying to sell depending on who you're talking to. Yeah, wow, all right, So you guys did talk to Steven and you talked to Mike McCarthy. What were you were out takes from that? What were the I guess the things that stood out to you from those conversations, from those interviews that we've all heard, what was most interesting to you.

That's a man to be honest with. It's funny, like again like I was out late last night talking with Cowboys people, talking with NFL people. We did Steven, We've got another interview with Stephen that we've been prepping for. I completely like forgot. Not only did we get to talk to Mike yesterday, but he took us to lunch and again like most of the good stuff happened after they made us turn our records off. But always, yeah, we'll talk about that when you get back. Yeah, no, absolutely,

but it's um. It was interesting. I thought I might talked a lot yesterday about UM about the offense, and I mean he did. He made the comment at the podium that he was or no, I think he said it at lunch. He was like, we've got to find a way to improve the most productive offense in the league, which is a nice problem to have. That's an interesting perspective. But he talked about wanting, you know, the walk around

head coach. You're all about where you need to be, what you need to focus on, and he made it pretty clear he thought he needed to focus on on the offense. And at the same time, though I actually I asked him directly how he felt about the job

that Kellen Moore's done. He was very complimentary of Kellen, but talked about I felt very smart for all four of us, honestly, because he talked about talk to me about a lot of the stuff that we've talked about in regard to Kellen, whether it's situational stuff, red zone stuff, you know, growing pains that any young offensive play caller has. I thought it was interesting because I don't I don't think he shied away from some of the problems that

the offense has had. Talked a lot about endencies, um, you know, being being sure not to give away your tendencies to too many people, are not to telegraph them too much. Um. So yeah, I thought that was a really interesting and it sounds like he wants that to be a focal point for his third year. Is not to like take play calling away from Kellen or revamp anything, but just to kind of maybe help him a little bit with the expertise that he does have as a

play caller. Dave, I have a question for you going back to kind of switching the conversation to the combine. I know you you said that not a lot has happened yet, but usually, you know, you kind of tend to keep an eye on certain guys or wanting to look at certain guys. So as of right now, what would be like either a name or a position that And I know the Cowboys are kind of all over the board, so it's very hard to pick one. But at this moment, what would be a position that's kind

of getting hot for the Cowboys. Well, the interesting thing for me is, I mean, like I always say this, there's like there's several storylines. There's the storyline when the season ends, there's the storyline at the combine when you're starting to revamp your roster, and then like when free agency gets going and the league gear starts, it completely

changes again. And I bring that up because again, like what we were just talking about me right now, like there's there's like a small list of guys that I'm focused on, but I know it's completely going to change. Like we've talked a lot about Tyler Linderbaum is the center out of Iowa. Nikobe Dean is a linebacker out of Georgia. This team obviously needs help a linebacker next to Michael Parsons. But if all of this stuff pops off with Amari Cooper and or DeMarcus Lawrence, this is

a super deep edge rushing edge rushing class. Obviously there's two guys at the top of it that the Cowboys don't have a shot at. But like a guy like George Carlostis out of Purdue is a guy that becomes very very interesting. If DeMarcus Lawrence isn't on this team, how about I joked with Nick about this the other

day when we were talking about work stuff. I mean, if a Maria Cooper is not on this team, Traylan Burke out of Arkansas, like he skyrockets to the top of my list of guys that I would love for the Cowboys to draft. And that's the funny thing. Like two weeks from now, we could be hyper focused on wide receivers, of which there are a lot of good ones.

Burke's is one. Chris Lave out of Ohio State actually just spoke to the media about an hour ago, really talented player who I think is going to perform very well in the drills this week. So I just I always love the way that that shifts is, like, you know, we're super focused on guards and centers and linebackers right now, but two weeks from now, it could be a completely different story. So edge rusher and wide receiver become a lot interesting, a lot more interesting to me depending on

what happens with free agency. All right, Dave, I'm want to go back to the roster real quick. And so you say, like, I can foresee this conversation you had last night, like what everyone's saying, Amar, he's probably going to be cut, and then whoever another drink, whoever was sitting there like, oh, having some drinks, Like uh contrary, hold on, you know, like like that's what people do.

I felt like Mike was doing that yesterday when Tony Pollard needs more carries or Amari Cooper didn't get open. And I felt like he was kind of defending that, like, well, that's just the narrative for you. I thought so too. I absolutely thought that was the case. Like he was just kind of like hold on, you know, yeah, yeah, yeah he was. Yeah. He basically was like, you know, what are other guys doing? Like are we doing enough to get get him featured? Are other guys doing enough

to take the pressure off him? That's the way I took it. And here he was like, yeah, you have to have these types of football conversations before you can have a contract conversation because it all ties in. It's like, you know, if he's if he's sitting in your cap for twenty millions. Yeah, that's what everybody focuses on. But okay, let's look at you know, how our teams playing him? How are we How are the other guys on this

offense helping him? And he had a big thing about, you know, to win playoff games, to win games against really good teams deep in the postseason, like you need your your third, fourth, fifth perimeter player to step up. And yeah, I like, I was kind of side eyeing Mike while he was saying all this, and I was like, you don't sound like a guy that thinks Amari Cooper's

abum um. So I don't know. Yeah, Like it's it's one of those things that it's it's like I said, like everybody's selling a narrative, and I like, I still I lean toward thinking something's going on with Amari, But

who knows. Maybe they really haven't made up their minds. Yeah, yeah, And that's so honestly, it sounds like to me, across the boys, there's a lot of decisions have to be made, and I'm not sure that anybody in this building where I guess the guys that are down in Indie really know exactly what they're gonna do with all of them.

That's where the conversations are going to come in. What are they gonna hear when they talk to the different agents, and what are they gonna hear when they when they start thinking about who they can possibly get in the draft and who they think you'd be available to them that could possibly replace guys. There's a lot of stuff that has to be decided. I don't think they know the answers right now, no, which that's kind of I love that you said that, Derek. I think it's like

you read my story. That's I mean, that's what I wrote the other day. And Stephen kind of said that. He was like, you know, it's still pretty early and this is this is typically where you start talking to agents and start trying to lay the groundwork for what's going to happen. And that's all well and good, but you know, I blink. I feel like I blinked, and it was March. I mean the league years fifteen days

away or fourteen days away. Now it's March second. Now, Yeah, it's not even the first anymore, So you got two weeks to figure it out, or maybe maybe two and a half because Amari's salary doesn't become guaranteed until the fifth day of the league year. So I mean, you can stretch it out if you want to, but get you gotta it's time to start figuring this out. You don't. It seems like a lot of time. It's really not. Yeah,

all right, Dave, real quick, give us a schedule. What's coming up here in the next I guess day or so? When when can we can Well, those of us that will be watching it on TV, do you know when those when the players are actually going to be on the field and doing the drills. That's the funny thing, man, to be I'll be very blunt with you. I have no clue because like that stuff, that stuff feels so secondary.

First of all, like we're not allowed in we're not allowed in the building to watch it, and then they stretch it out to the weekend, which honestly is usually when reporters leave town. But I like, we have so much stuff coming. Like I said, I'll say it for the tenth time. We're meeting with Stephen in a little bit. We're gonna get a nice little exclusive with him talk

about some draft talk about some free agency stuff. I think we're gonna have that on the site, and I think we're also going to have it on the Draft Show today. Well, we're supposed to record another episode of The Draft Show with Dame Brugler later this afternoon. Good stuff. I heard a rumor that Will McClay is actually gonna come and sit down on our set tomorrow, which would

be amazing. He usually doesn't do that till after the draft, so for him to take the time to do that in the middle of the combine would be really great. And then there's the ingering Jerry Jones State of the Union is still to come too, So I mean, we're gonna have more content and I can even wrap my brain around here in the next like three or so days. So do me one favorite when you when you talk to Steven, I do have one question I'd love for

you to ask him. I'm just interested to know, do they how comparable do they think Blake Jarwin is to Dalton Schultz, Because I think there's a lot of talk about Dalton Schultz and what he provided for this offense. I'd be interested to know if they would even say it, how comparable they think those two players are. So ask him that. Hey, we're the only ones talking to him, so I can do that for you. Good, awesome, Let's

do that, all right, Dave, appreciate you. Man you. We'll have you back at the studio with us next week. You have a safe trip and enjoy Indianapolis, and we're gonna take a break when we come back. We got lots of questions to talk about here. We'll talk about some free agency stuff we'll do. We'll come right back. This is Dallas Cowboys dot Com Radio. At ATNT, everyone new and existing customers get our best deals on every smartphone.

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do more. Welcome Back. It is a second segment of The Break Life in s WBC Mortgage Studios at the Star. We were just joined by Dave Helmont. He told us all about what he's hearing out there in Indianapolis. I'm

sure Nick, you've had that experience. Is you know that part of the trip we talk about the trip we talk about it's the stuff that we get that may not necessarily be on camera, that might be just as good as the stuff that is on camera and those opportunities just to talk to different guys and get to know things that will help us down the roads. Certainly, it's fun and it's it's one of those head on the swivel type things because you never know where to

go and and that's the difference. And I say this all the time. And one of the writers who's been doing this for years, he told me my very first year covering the team. He said, there's a difference between covering the team and covering the beat. And I didn't understand that at the time, and I certainly understand it now. You see people that show up at restaurants. You're like, oh, I go to this restaurant every year. Why because Jerry and Steven and Jerry Junior and whoever they'll be there.

And then when they're there, then you talk to him and all that, and then you may sit there and who knows how the conversation goes. Yeah, this other place over here is a lot more fun. But this place is where you might have to talk to people. And other writers know it too, and you have to play defense. That's covering the beat, that is like, hey, I have

to do this. I have to walk eighteen holes with Tony Romo for this golf tournament that he's not going to win, but we're gonna walk and we're gonna talk to him and all that for that one minute where you might get some stuff, right. Yeah, that's covering the beat, yeah, you know, and so that that's kind of what Dave's doing. And you know, not not that Dave doesn't want to go to the bar, you know, but we're saying. But

it's part of it though. So I think that's probably the fun part of it for report is that's a part of what you get geeked up to do, right. I mean, there's a lot of people there's talking about the Combine movement and all that, and there's there will be people that will kind of be you know, disappointed a little bit if it moves to Dallas, because it Indian Indianaples does it well. But it is fun to like go on the road and do that stuff. It'll be a little different if you're in health you're here,

but like, of course be better for us. We have more resources as well. That's that's kind of like what we do. And we have to do training camp here in the past, like it's like it's harder because you know, when we're at training camp California. You're at training camp in California, like husband, wife can't say, hey, I need you to come home and help out with this. You

can't come home. But when you're here in Dallas, it's like, hey, when we go over there, it's like you're in a different space, but you feel like family in a way, like we know each other, we talk around each other, and you feel closer. Yeah, when training camp, for example, you're seeing training camp and is an example. We go come over here, then we have restrictions and there's more limitations, and it's just the disconnect is creative where now we're

just like everybody else in the media. Yeah, exactly, just feels like working late, you know, basically a training training camp here. You know. All right, let's jump in. I want to talk about Stephen Jones and then some of the comments that he made earlier this week and get

you guys' opinions. He was talking about Amari Cooper and I think just it was also kind of about DeMarcus, but I think the question was specific to Himri and his response was it's too early for me to address that I don't want to address any of that as far as the details of the contract, and where I found a stark contrast was he was asked about Zeke Elliott and his response was, I want Zeke on my team. Obviously, his contract, his money's guaranteed, He's going to be here,

there's no question. My question for you guys is, obviously we all understand the contracts are one thing, but does that also tell you something. Do you get some insight out of what they're thinking about with a Mari maybe with DeMarcus, just knowing that that that is not as concrete, that is not as as written in stone, and it does make it a situation where maybe those guys are are legitimately out of the door. No, I don't think so. I think that if Zeke's contract was similar to that

at then I think they might say it. I think they would be on the table to maybe release him. I think it starts with the with the fact that you can't move them. You know, It's like it's like you you go up and this is your house and this is a huge statue and it's it's not being moved, and you're like, do you like the statue? It's like, I don't know. You can say it's ugly or not, but guess what, you're not moving it, so it's just

gonna sit here. So we might we better like it because this is why it's going to be at least for right now. So yeah, of course you got to say that about Zeke and all that stuff. I think if Zeke's contract was at the point that those other two were, I think they might try to move on. I know they would move on from I really do. I mean his his Yes, he had a good season when he was healthy and all that, but that's part of it. That's the running back that doesn't They don't

stay healthy at this part in their career. So um, but I think they're gonna say all the right things because they know he's going to be here. But the other two, you can, you can move on from them because they have other options as well. And that's the thing. It's like, um, if they were sure about it, it's one of those things you are talking about two guys

or guys that are under contract currently. This is not a free agent guy that's about you know that you want to keep it kind of to yourself and not really say anything but if you feel one hundred percent sure or close to being sure to wanting someone to stay, I think you would go out and say, well, yeah, we're looking at all, you know, all the options and stuff, but we definitely want to keep or try to keep a guy like Amark Cooper, or not even say keeping,

but say yeah, a guy like Amary Cooper. There's a whole lot for us, and kind of just kind of back it up and give them more flowers, you know, and make you feel like, Okay, they definitely But something about it, it's like makes me want to think something's going on to where maybe they're not feeling as sure or as happy or as like you feel like they are gonna keep him. I don't know, I don't know how to feel right now, but it just doesn't feel like Amari Cooper would be here next year. Yeah, what

do you think is the timeline? Obviously, for Mark, you've got the five days into the next cale, I mean the next year for the NFL, they have to make a decision or they're going to be tied into his money. But for DeMarcus, what do they have a timeline? What do you think it's a timeline for that decision. You know, I think that I don't know about the time. I don't know if he's got a bonus on the in that at all, but I do think that there's a priority there that they have to decide on both positions.

And then the interesting thing is those two guys are under contract, but the next guy that's in the consideration is not under contract. So is Gregory a higher priority than d Law? Do you have to sign resign him? And if you do, we got to cut d Law Or do we want to sign Michael Gallop or Cedric

Wilson or both? And then if that's the case, that you cut you know, so because if you sit there, let's just say that they don't do anything with Amar and Gallop signs with another team, and what Cedric signs with another team, and they don't really like what they're seeing from other you know, other guy free agents. They're like, wait a second, do we really want to cut him on? You can't. So that's why I think that's why it's

set for the fifth day of the league here. That's why those things are setting like that to see kind of how things go and see what the market looks like. You know, because if four guys signed deals in free agency that are twenty million a year twenty two, twenty three. You know some guy and you're like, he's half as good as a Mari hold up here, you know what I mean? So I don't know. I don't know if

I answered the question, no, you did good. I was just gonna say it is interesting the way that Stephen Jones cannot put those two groups because we've been talking about these guys on here. But me, in my head, I guess I didn't necessarily put the two groups of like, okay, wide receiver. You got Amari Cooper on their contract, and then the two next guys, which would be free agent Michael Gallups Cedrick Wilson on the other side of the ball,

the Marcus Lawrence on their contract. Then you got Randy Gregory and then another guy that also a guy that has done fairly well and that you're still considering, is Daurn's Armstrong. And they're all in the defensive end position. So that's a tough decision because you got both sides equally as important on both sides of the ball, and

then what do you do? And right now I don't know, like, are you guys feeling like, for sure, for sure, they do need to make a decision, whether it's a guy like DeMarcus Lawrence or Amari Cooper, Like there has to be a decision made between those two guys of like actually getting rid of or maybe just restructuring their contract somehow. I honestly believe it has to do with what like like Nicol saying, like, what are you doing with those

other guys? Because if you're target, Let's say, for example, your target is Michael Gallup, You're like, we really want Michael Gallup back on this team? Then yes, Now, I think your decision on Amari has to come, and it needs to come swiftly because that's going to affect that decision.

If you feel the same way about DeMarcus Lawrence, it's the same thing, like do you think you absolutely need DeMarcus Lawrence and you're like, he's we really don't want to let him go, then I think you're probably making a decision that we're okay with the idea that we're gonna let him. Randy Walkers, you can't have both. I don't think in these instances you can have Gallop and Amr or you can have DeMarcus and Randy. So I

think all of those decisions kind of flow together. Some of them are free agent decisions, some of them are just decisions about guys that are under contract. Yeah, well, it's crazy, is how you would consider your second guy on both sides, on both positions, Like your second guy is gonna determine what you do with your first guy, with your starter, like your main starter. Yeah, which I think we can all agree, like Delo would be like their main starter over Randy at this point, right a

little bit ahead. I don't know that. See, that's the interesting quart. That's why I said maybe. And the reason why I say maybe is because I think, when everybody's healthy, I think DeMarcus is a better player than Randy. But when you factor in all the injury things that you've had to deal with with DeMarcus over the last few years, then I start to say, well, I think Randy might have the leg up because he hasn't played as much football,

his body's probably healthier. So so from that same but I think I don't I don't know that I would say that he's clear that DeMarcus is clearly the better of the two guys. It says like playing cards What I like about this is when you think about these two positions we're talking about Gregory and d Law, we're trying to figure out who's the king, who's the queen. Same with with with Gallup and and Amar and all that, because in their mind they got aces in both, they

got pass rushers. They have an ace in Michael Parsons. They got to figure out how to use them and then they feel like CDs the ace. So that's a good problem to have, is that it's a great analogy. Yeah, and the thing about receiver's more like Amari's the king. But you would rather have the jack and the queen, which is like sed Rick and all that kind of stuff. But you know, I'm like calling any other players like

a queen. But you know what I'm saying, I get your point, and I think it's a really good analogy because they do their chest. I wouldn't do a chest. But I don't know anything about that. I don't know. Well, the queen is the that's that's the leader, right. Yeah, I'm trying not to say words, but she is. Yeah, she can hand a little business. She's the man. Yeah probably no, No, she's the woman. You can hand a little business. Absolutely, yes, Yeah, she's protecting him. Yeah, exactly. Um, okay,

let's do this. Let's let's let's move that conversation a little bit. I want to talk about the franchise tag. Actually, Stephen was asked about that and this response was, we haven't ruled that out, says they're still thinking about what they might do and how they might use it. Talking about who the candidates are, obviously you've got guys like

Dalton Schultz and Randy Gregory. Are there other guys you think could be in play here that they could consider for the franchise to I think it's Schultz, it was it would be the one candidate there. So Randy you don't even think of as a franchise tag candidate. It's like seventeen million or something like that. I mean, as it ain't cheap, no, because you've got guys like I mean, you've got these defensive ends that are that are out there.

I mean, I don't even know if DeMarcus Lawrence is in the top five of that, but I mean it's twenty at twenty one million a year, so the average of that, I mean, it's it's up there. He probably isn't well and you also put in one of the stories you did maybe yesterday or the day before yesterday, you added um Brian Inger in that list, which was kind of like I was like, huh, yeah, yeah, it's interesting. If I could it is, but I could go edit that,

I probably take it out. Yeah. I talked to some people about that, that that number is a little higher than what they want to go there with Inger. Um, that one's going to be interesting too. The Cowboys have or have done some research on that. They've looked at that and looking at his career and that, you know, it sounds like he does better on contract years. He hasn't done it as well once they get the deal,

So they're trying to figure that out. And I do think and I know this that the punter position and the kicker position will kind of play off of each other. There's probably a total number that they want to spend within those two guys. Let's not forget Jake McQuaid. Yeah, but but um bore, the narrative has changed on John

Fossil a lot of bones. Um now you know he's had I mean last year was like after the fake punt, you know, if Yasco and all that stuff this year though special teams has done a really good job they blocking punts. The punter had an all worlds you know years haven't had to do crazy stuff to do it. Like they're playing good sound football. Yeah. So and the and the and the guys know that. I mean, Anger knows that. He knows that he benefits by being in

this system with John Fossil. So we'll see if that, you know, there's any kind of discount there, if this is where they wants to be. But um zero line. You know, he's under contract. The zerline is and another one of those d law amari that he may not be here just just further, you know, just contracted me. It's two and a half million a year. That's not a lot. It's seventeenth among kickers in the in the league.

I thought two point five million for a kicker would be a lot higher than probably where he is as far as his ability to kick right now. If you look at like his statistic middle the road, Yeah, it's the middle roll kind of guy. Yeah. Yeah, I mean he's been in middle of the road. Yeah, and that's he's one of those guys. He's a clutch kicker. I think he makes good kicks, but he also will miss it, you know, some head scratch. Yeah I did. I went around the league and looked this up at the top

twenty five kickers in the league. Um, the average extra point misses is like one point five every kicker. This is about average one point five. He missed six season just last year. Oh last year. Because there's a few kickers that did not miss an extra point. There's some miss one two average one. But he missed six and Nick Folk miss five. I mean, that's just it's amazing. I have to I have to think that's a mental thing.

If you can kick a fifty yard or a forty eight yard or with pretty good regularity and you miss six extra points when the average is one point five, I have to think that's play mental. But here's the best part, or here's the interesting part about that, And I'm not shrink at all. Yeah, he mixes it like mentally.

I don't even know if you could say it's mental, because if it was mental, then why can you miss in Tampa Bay miss an extra point, miss another thirty yard kick that didn't even hit the ship it was so far left. And then he comes back and hits two clutch kicks. But can't mental also be about focus? Sometimes the miss has a way of focusing you in. Sometimes the miss has the ability of allowing you to kind of figure out what to get wrong and correct right. So so that could also be metal isn't as bad

as you think. Right. That's my point, and I was actually making that point that if it's mental, that doesn't always mean that that's a guy you necessarily want to get rid of, because sometimes you can fix mental. Right. What I've heard is that sometimes when it comes to Kicker, in order to fix something like that, you need a change of environment. So it would lead to him not even being here and going somewhere else. But mental or not mental, I think most will agree that a change

at the Kicker position it's needed. So his time seems to be up for me from I think everybody listening to us agrees with you. I guess the point I'm making though, is when I talk mental, I think sometimes not being mentally tough is what requires a different venue. It doesn't sound like that's the issue. I don't think he's not mentally tough because he wouldn't be able to correct if he wasn't mean, he would go downhill every

time it went bad. I think the difference is he just may not for whatever reason, he may not be as focused, he may not be able to during the game. At the beginning of the game, may not be right and sync, but as the game goes on, he's mentally tough enough to be able to. Okay, I could let that go, let me figure out what I did wrong. Okay, I'll make this one adjustment and bam, now we're kicking him in right. And so that kind of mental I

do think you can fix those kinds of things. But I also I have to put some blame on the Cowboys because why do they try so hard to kind of protect their kickers, Like why again, remind me of

training camp from what I remember. I know it wasn't there and I wasn't taking care of a baby, but from what I remember, there was no competition and we go I feel like it's been several years where we go into training camp thinking there's, oh, there's gonna be a healthy competition at the kicker position, and it never really actually happens. So and then even like preseason games, did he play? Was he playing a preseason games? Did he played? Yes? At the back all during camp the

back end, nice Winder kicked all that. Yeah he was kicking in punting what yeah, and not kicking very well, and they didn't have a kicker, and then he kicked and preseason, the last preseason game they try to fifty something yard or any okay, well, either the point, it's like you go into the season, you start the season not really seeing a whole lot from your kicker, and even years before, you don't see somebody else kicking because it's easy to say, oh, yeah, we can bring in

a new kicker anytime, but then when does it actually happen? And then we get guys during the middle of the season trying now, and then that doesn't lead to anywhere. At that point, most kickers are taking most kickers that can do actually something. So I just put it on the Cowboys. But going back to the tag, I don't think this is a year for any tag. I wouldn't take anybody at all. There's nobody that seems appealing to me to put a tag on that I agree with that.

The only reason I kind of was intrigued by what you said with Anger is talking about his career and how he's done better when he has like one year and or us a contract year. To me, I look at that and say, that would be a prime candidate for somebody. You put on a franchise tag and say do it again. And if the number, if the amount of money that you pay him isn't crazy, then it makes sense. You get to make him do it again, make him show you what he did last because he

did he played really well last year. So if you can get one more year to say, hey, show me that again, and then maybe we'll talk about a long term deal. I think that's the example of where you'd want to use. I just don't think that that number for the franchise tag for a punter is as high. It's just too higher that they want to go. And that makes sense. Yeah, So I mean I think I think Schultz might be the best option if they want to do it. But I agree, I wouldn't do it

at eleven million a year. I don't know, because especially because you can't. I mean, if I'm gonna do that for Schultz, I mean I don't think he's gonna. I think this is what he is. I think he's a good, solid panelic. He can get a lot better. I think he's gonna get this is it. So if I'm gonna do that with Schultz at eleven a year, then I'll sign him to a four year, forty four million dollars deal and then work with the where they you don't have to pay eleven this year because I think he's

gonna be what he is. I think he's a good player. He'll never be like the star tight end. So I mean, if I'm gonna get him at eleven a year, then I'm gonna do it in a long term deal and spread it out and maybe don't eat so much of it right now. I can't pay eleven for him right now on this cap. I'd be interested to see what Steven says to that question. But I honestly believe he

and Blake jarr were are comparable players. I think had it not been for the injury with Jarwin, we'd be talking about Jarwin right now in the same way of being a guy that that's a safety valve for Dak. Dak drops the ball off to him. And by the way, Blake does have the ability I think to make some bigger plays like Blake is not. He is the kind of guy that can get downfield a little bit more

than than Schultz can. And I think Schultz, he is just a guy that has a knack for getting in the right spot and he'll catch the ball and that there's a place for that, and that matters. That's not eleven million dollars though, And I think those are comparable players. I think if he's gone, I think Blake will do

every bit of what Dalton Schultz did for you. Schultz has never been in a situation where that you didn't have Cede Lamb and I'm MARII Cooper taking these outside stuff like that, and then he could just work the middle and that's where Dak wants to throw it. But if you don't have that on the outside and you're not worried about the receiver as much, and you can maybe get a safety or something to guard Schultz, then

I don't know if he's gonna be as good. I think he's benefited from these great receivers and he may be taking one of them away. I agree wholeheartedly. All Right, we're gonna take our final break. We'll come back. We got some more questions with regards as the franchise tag. When we come right back. This is Dallas Cowboys dot Com Radio. Hi, I'm Clint Tillison with man. I'm Jay nova Chak and we're both with N and Turf, the

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Life from the s WBC Mortgage Studios. At the start, we're talking about the franchise tag. I have a scenario. Okay, good, I have a question. If you don't mind me ruining your go for it. It's the sea. During the Break we were talking about contracts and it's expectations and why kind of expectations come with the money that you pay the player. And we see it all the time. It happens all the time where someone gets paid and then people start killing them and criticizing them for not being

us good on the field. But is it maybe that we're at a point where we are the ones who need to change our own mindsets rather than keep expecting these players that get paid to perform at an even higher level. Or do we still keep complaining and say, no, this player actually needs to be playing at that level,

you know what I mean? The difference between them actually doing it versus us maybe kind of lowering our own self expectations of what we think of a player, No, I think you're the first way you put it is absolutely right. It ain't gonna happen like it's not gonna happen, like, yes it should. But that's the world, the world we live in. Like everybody is always going to the money becomes the big target, and that means if you're making

that money. And by the way, part of this is not fair to the player, but part of this is the amount of money these guys makes so much higher than your average everyday fan, and so the fan looks at it and it's like, man, you give me an eleven million dollars a year, I'll make that block. No, they can't, but they will say I'll make that block, like y'a'll making eleven million dollars. So I don't think

it's ever gonna change. That's my target. It's that mindset that people think that you would do it if you made eleven million dollars. The reason why you don't and you probably make eleven dollars an hour or is because you can't make that block and you've never made it since junior high. Like that's that's why and maybe too right. Um, So it's it's funny. I people think like the money is supposed to make things different and better and it's and it's not, but it's just the market value is

what it is. But you're onto something though, that there are people that think that your team needs to that you need to keep a stay hungry approach, which means you don't pay. You don't sit there and go all right, well, if you don't pay the law, we're gonna lose them. Then then let them go, you know, like at some point you have to do that. And that's why I

think the Cowboys are right right now. You're gonna lose Dalton Shoulders, You're gonna lose Randy Gregor if you don't pay them, and they're gonna have to make some tough decisions and say, all right go. But here's the flip side of that. Then people sit there and they look at a Byron Jones and he goes to Miami and plays really well. And they look at a Cheetobowoozier and he goes to the Bengals and he plays really well. And they look at a DeMarcus Square that goes to

Denver and wins his championship. And again I'm not saying that there are lots of caveats to that. All I'm saying is when fans are looking at it, they're like, man, we let him go. But man, he's so much better in that place than he was here. What's wrong with us? You know? But like you said in the Break, the Tyrone Crawfords of the world, the Jason Hatcher's of the world. If you would have said, hey, Anthony Hitchins, is he wants ten million a year, you gotta let him go.

You gotta cheat. They want to give Cheeto nine million a year. By I mean, but he kind of earned it. But yeah, But I mean, don't get me started by that comment he made before the Super Bowl. I mean, I thought that was it was low hanging through and that was that was what was the critical thing he said. He basically said that we don't even have an indoor facility. You don't have you don't need all the lights and

the bells and whistles to do well. He's basically taking a shot at what the Cowboys have and all that. But he said Beasley said the same thing when he went to the Buffalo, Right. But Beasley, he but Cheeto called himself a blue call. He goes I'm a blue collar guy. Yeah, no, you're not. He's not. He's not.

He did he didn't do that when when he had a hamstring injury, he milked it as long as he could because he knew he was going to be a free agent and he said as much, and he didn't want to when they were six and ten and losing games at the end of the year. He didn't want to be a part of that. So you don't come back now because your team, because of Joe Burrow, made it to the Super Bowl and call yourself a blue collar guy when the Cowboys were trying to trade him

because he did wasn't playing. So I have a problem with that. And then and then to talk about the indoor facility and all that stuff. But you know, that's that's the nage. Guys always, especially guys that leave here at leave here when they were underappreciate it like they all will to take the shot. The Cowboys are just glitz and glamour. And then media does it as well.

It's fine, it's fine. But I guess my point though, is I think there are you know, there is that that thinking of okay, let a guy go a little too soon rather than a little too late, But I think it also burned you when you see those players leave and go somewhere else, and the same thing happened with Hitchens. Hitchens might not have been a great player, but he went to Kansa city won a championship as

a starting linebacker. So when you see that, you're just kind of like, many, why aren't the guys able to have that same kind of impact here? They leave here and immediately have that type of success or impact somewhere else. You know, I always think of that, But look at and I don't know if you guys might know any names out of the top of your head, but are there guys where that story happens with us that they kind of are bad? Any notable guys? Mark Colombo is

a great example. I'm sure the Bears fans were like, how the heck is he playing like he's playing over there? When he played like that over here? Jayron Curse wherever he's been there probably like that wasn't the guy that was here? You know, I'm those guys. I mean, the same thing happens here. Now we haven't had the team success. Yeah, when you start talking about guys like DeMarcus and Hitchens and Cheeto, but certainly from just individual I think it

happens all around the league every single year. Yeah, I mean, but the point that I was making is is that the other teams are in better financial situations. So the Bengals needed to they needed to get a good cornerback, so they got They paid for Cheeto, and the Cowboys just couldn't afford in the nineteen million, and they couldn't afford the Dolphins the seventeen million for Byron Jones. I mean, but I don't I mean as Byron Jones light in the world on fire over there. This last year, he

wasn't as good as the first. The first year, I think he was a lot of people were questioning, like, did Dallas make the right decision? I think now it probably is a less of a conversation because Treyvon dig is playing in the way that he's playing, right, But if Trayvon wasn't playing that way, I think people would probably still be saying, was that the right decision? What I want to know, and I bet we can look this up. What players have the Cowboys drafted here that

have gone to another team and made Pro Bowls? Like Beasley has had a good year, and he's not the reason the build have done great. And neither was Hitchens and neither was Cheeto. I mean, they were great contributors. But who's gone and been the man? Did? Did Chee don't get to the Pro Bowl this year? No, no, no way, I mean I don't think he didn't. He was I'm sure yelled. No, he was up there. He was considered one of the better corners in the in

the AFC. But I didn't I don't think so. Okay, obviously didn't play because they were playing in the game and he got a pick in that game. Um and again, And I'm not I'm not trying to knock him. I like him as a person. I just didn't think I hated that comment because I thought it was it was like, it's funny how your narrative changed over over the time. But good for him, good for the Bengals and all

that they had the money to pay for it. But the only person I can think of it, and just because I remember running into him one time in the Pro Bowl, was was Martelli's Bennett, you know, Yeah, and he had Witten his way, and so that was gonna happen, you know, Um, I can't think of many others though that have gone. I mean DeMarcus Ware, but that was kind of a different time as well. They wanted a

different role from him than what the Cowboys need. Cowboys needed him to be the man there, they needed him to be a piece. Yeah, as a different kind of helped Von Miller be the man. And von Miller will tell you right now that having to Marcus there was one of the best things that ever happened to him in his career. So, but I mean that's a great point. But I guess what our conversation really was centered around is how fans think about it. Yeah, And I don't

think fans think about it necessarily like that. They just see the success that's surrounding them and they're like, man, they must be contriused. They were started, they must be contributing to that success. Why weren't they able to have that kind of success. You think Schultz will go somewhere and catch ninety passes and go to the Pro Bowl and all that, unless he's got two great receivers on the outside and a good quarterback. I just don't see it now. And if that happens, I do think it'll

be like, Wow, damn. But if you let Randy go after all this and he goes and gets fourteen sacks for somebody else that's very doable, then that I think I don't think Jerry could live with that. Yeah, especially after all the time three am phone calls and stuff and that the stuff that he's done and both of them have done. I don't think Jared can live with

himself for that. And I think I think that's why he's gonna stay, but because I think he can't get a fourteen sack year for the Vikings or you know, somewhere. But I do think you're facing that with two guys this year. I think both DeMarcus and DeMar could leave here and go somewhere and have phenomenal years next year. I think both of them are capable of. That's true.

And so no matter how it plays out, if they're not on this team, that something fans are going to be looking at and they're gonna be like, if they have those great seasons, they're gonna be like, man, why couldn't they do that? Because I think if if a Mari were let's say a Mari were replaced with Davante Adams in Green Bay with Aaron Rodgers, he would have,

in my opinion, Davanta Adams type numbers. Cowboys never used him like that, whether it's the quarterback, the offensive coordinator, whomever. They never used him in that way. But he's capable. He's absolutely capable of being that type of receiver. In my opinion, I was gonna say the difference here, or for example, with a guy like DeMarcus Lawrence, you have a decent enough amount of years to look at, like analyze and be like, Okay, what has he done for us?

How has he improved or declined? And regardless of his contract money. But you know we were talking about this even putting the money aside, Well you can't put the money aside. Okay, you have to look at it too. But he hasn't necessarily been the kind of guy that is one thousand percent contributing the way you want him to. And he is a leader, He's done other things. He helps his presence on the field helps other guys around him as well. Even Randy Gregory have the kind of

success that he's had. But when you look at and start talking about the injuries, are you now concerned? How concerned are you about his injury and last year was the main year that he missed that kind of amount of time. Yeah, the longest time that he's missed overall. But even then, how many years has it been that he's dealing with some kind of even what he's got, what's going to get the contract? What was it he

was dealing with the shoulders? So is he now becoming that kind of guy that, well, are you going to be able to depend on him? Is he kind of turning into, like I said it before, the tyrant smith

of the defense that you don't know how long? And And to me, that's a that's a really tough decision because you have you have to have a very good clarity of the kind of players you're gonna have and can count on on the field, and injuries are gonna happen regardless, and you don't know when that's going to happen. But injury prone is that a word that you want to be surrounding or tagged along the guy that's being paid that amount of money and that's supposed to be

contributing the way that you really need to start to contribute. Yeah, I mean the six or seven games, eight games where he was out I mean dan Quinn and the defense figured out how to how to get it done and get and win games and rush the password and all that. I don't think dan quinn success and his history of helping these pass rushers. I don't think you need more than one guy that's making more than ten to twelve million a year. I just I think you grab I

forgot about that point. You mentioned the success that they had without him. Now does that now change? Oh? I think that's a partless conversation that they're having about how much they need him and whether they can can do without him. I mean, everyone said that when Dak was getting carted off against the Giants and his tears and crying and everyone the whole stadium's crying and press, the proct people, you know, and they're like, what's that going

to do with those contract? Well, they went out and they sucked, They couldn't score any points, and they missed him his conduct that it did nothing to his contract other than maybe he proved his point that how valuable he is. It doesn't It doesn't help that when the law got hurt, that they figured out other ways to do it. And so you know, that's that's just kind of the way the way that it is. And so I didn't think you need one of the two. And who do you think is more special, Randy or d Law?

And I think I don't. No one's ever called d Law just like a freak, you know, like he and he's kind of freaking. He can be, he can be, But I think there's a little bit more potential. It's hard to say that over twenty nine year old Randy Gregory, but he's still pretty fresh because he hasn't played as many games. I think I think the differentiator for me

is I think DeMarcus is a better run defender. I think DeMarcus is as good a run defender as I see on the edge at the Cowboys maybe time I've been here outside of maybe DeMarcus like he is really really good against the run and so and I don't think and that's not a knock on Randy, it's just I don't think he's as good as DeMarcus in that area. And I think they're comparable pass rushers. I do think that that Randy speed off the edge is what makes

him special. Yeah, and the fact that he's younger that obviously helps. So you know what, I what I would do is I would focus on the defensive tackles because if you have the defensive tackles that can clog that up, then where are they gonna go wide? Who? Who do you want them to go wide against? D Law or Randy? Because you're not getting wide on Randy. We know that. We saw that training camp. Everyone tried to reverse. You're getting wide on d Law either, Like I haven't seen

that happen very often. I'm just saying I would get some I would beef this thing up in the middle. I mean, if I'm not getting a center, I'm getting a d tackle at number twenty four. And I don't care if he's two down player. I've heard that argument that he get a two down player, which two downs first and second? Love it if you can do anything to get me the third and nine where I've got a couple of freaks running around. You don't know where they're coming from. Perfect, do your job. I'll give me

the big, big old defensive tackle. Ye all right, we appreciate you, guys, John Us. We'll be back next week and we're gonna get into free agency talk. I have the whole list of free agents we're gonna go down the full list. We're gonna talk about who you expect to be back, who you want to have back. Who are the people that you're like, h, it's okay, they can go ahead and leave. We'll talk about that next week. Till then for Nick Even, Amber Garcia, Dave helm and

I am Derek Eagelton. This has been The Break live on Dallas Cowboys dot Com Radio. This has been a production of Dallas Cowboys dot Com and the Dallas Cowboys Football o'clock