Cowboys Break: Cowboys Draft Wish List

The Break, live from the s WBC Mortgage Studios. At the starts Draft week. We're all excited. Cowboys and the rest of the NFL will begin the draft tomorrow night. We have a lot of coverage for you guys. There'll be a live draft show that'll happen all tomorrow night throughout the draft from start to finish. Same thing Friday, same thing Saturday. Nick and his guys will be writing articles. Amber will be putting stuff together in Span for all of you Spanish speaking fans out there. So this will

be a fun week. How's everybody doing. Dave Hellman is included in pretty much all of that. Yes, he is h He's gonna be writing somebody, Yeah, I think I came in there. We're talking Spanish to each other, so maybe so when you learn Spanish. I don't know Spanish. I know a little bit of French and it helps me with Spanish. Tell me something in French? What was what I mean? What do you want me? Who do you say that? Like? Tell me something that's in French? Yeah? Say, uh, Cowboys,

I don't know. I'm betting that's not right. Like I'm betting you say something I said. I don't say. I don't know. Was he right? You know French? He said it halfway? He said half a sentence. Yeah, I got halfway there and then I cut it off. Okay, that's not it, right, yeah, mad, Mad? Yeah? Yeah, all right, So let's talk some Cowboys football. What I wanted to do today is I want to dissect the conversations yesterday

that happened in the annual pre draft press conference. Now, I do need to put a caveat on that you probably believe about three percent of what you hear during this week from any GM or owner across the NFL, because what they say you always have to put through the lens of They could be saying this for the purposes of other teams also hearing that and and that

affecting how they approached the draft. So with that being said, we're gonna talk about some of the things I think that came out yesterday and I want to get your opinions. I have a couple of questions that I have that came out of those those those statements, and then we'll get we'll hear for what you guys have to say, and then relate it back to the draft and how it could affect the Cowboys draft strategy tomorrow, Friday and Saturday.

Let's start first with the Deys and the wide receiver position. Steve Jerry said, we don't have a or they're okay with the idea that they don't have a pure X wide receiver to replace Diaz, and it sounds like they don't expect that that's going to be something that's coming in the draft. UM My question for you guys is can this team win without a true X receiver for this season? They believe they can, and that's really all that matters. I don't know about can they or can

they not? But they they think they can because they watch the Super Bowl and they don't feel like the two teams in the Super Bowl have a number one receiver? I don't know. If I don't know, debatable of course, but but do they use them as a number one? Yeah? Yeah, I mean Jeffrey makes a lot of money, but is he the true number one? Is he the guy? You can make the case? Maybe the same for Jacksonville who

got up there? And who did the Eagles be? I mean or the Vikings have two pretty really good receivers, I guess, but not guys that you think of as like the prototypical X. I mean, Stefan Diggs is not, yeah, and Adam Thielan is not. He's your typically MS rams did really well without a clear cut number one receiver, I mean you know so, I mean they didn't have

a receiver that was all world yeah. I mean, which it's an interesting point because I mean, there is there are guys you could get in this draft to fit that mold. One of them is on the cover of our magazine, Courtland Sutton. But I don't necessarily get the hype because they just parted ways with that guy because it didn't work for them. I mean, obviously price point has something to do with that, but that didn't work with the style of football that they think they want

to run. So it's weird to me that people think they want to run out and redraft the same player a month after they got rid of the guy that fits that mold. I mean they but they definitely could go back to that well in this draft. I just maybe you want to try something new. Well, let's ask that question. I think that they've seen what they can do with a great old line and the running game, so I would believe that's their main focus. They saw what they did in twenty sixteen with zek and the

old line, so why not. They don't really need that kind of receiver, you know, just someone that kind of helps out a little bit, but not the main focus. So let's play Devil's advocate here for a second. Let's say you run up against the team that has a really good run defense. What do you do then, Because we've seen in this offense, with this offensive line and this running back, there have been a few teams in the last two years that were able to solve the

riddle though stopping this running game. So what do you do when you run up against that If you don't have a true X receive, Well, you lose ten to seven to the Giants up there, which is what they did. I mean, now they did come back and beat him last year, but um, that's a good that's a good question. I mean, you have to be able to solve that. And they didn't do that so well that Dak's first year. About the second year that they had better answers for

teams like that. But you're right, I mean, I hear what you're saying about you're a running team, but you do need to scare some people off a little bit with your with your ability to go deep or at least to stretch the defense. And so I think that they need some um, they need some speed. I think it receiver as I've never heard that before. That's what I thought of this morning. I said, well, you know when when two people, you know, line up to race,

the guy that wins, you want that guy. Yeah, you want that guy, and you know, let him stress the field a little bit. You know what was interesting is as Jerry was talking and making this statement, particularly about the receivers m he did mention the fact that you know, you kind of want somebody that can come in and contribute a little bit and uh and kind of give

you a little speed. And I don't know how many people noticed that, but to me that stood out because if even more so than finding a guy that can be an X for you this year, it seems like, really to focus should be can you find somebody that does something different than this other ghooping of wide receivers and the one thing that they don't have in spades right now is speed. See I'm going a different way

with this. I don't really agree. And first of all, to play a wide receiver in the NFL, you gotta be pretty fast. I mean, just as a you do you, I mean you generally speak, you have to have better been a couple of percent of the human population. So I mean, you know four or five. Oh no, that's not super fast. I get it, But you gotta have it to play corner two. You do. No, But I'm not that interested in a receiver who's gonna quote unquote tape to take the top off of the defense, because

I think the world of Dak Prescott. But I think there's a little bit to be said about how off he was on those deep balls last year. I mean, when him and Dez looked at their worst, more often than not, it was trying to connect on balls more than twenty yards downfield. You just didn't see that, and so I think of it more. And plus I think, I mean, I think Terrence Williams is faster than he gets credit for, and Deonte Thompson is a speed guy.

I mean, they brought in a guy with similar characteristics to Bryce Butler who can do that what I'm looking at. And again you mentioned the Patriots, the Eagles, the Rams. These are all teams, Like, I don't know that they have Brandon Cooks is a pretty fast guy, but I don't know that they have all world speed among their

receivers either. I think big thing for them is finding different ways to get their guys open, Like I'm thinking about mesh points and having receivers running crossing routes and creating space and a guy who can run great route, who can create extra separation on a curl because of his footwork or an end and can get that extra step Like I don't care about having home run threats because I don't think that's suited to this quarterback's strengths.

I would rather just have receivers who can get open and make life easy for him. I do agree with a lot of that. My question would be, it seems like at least over the last couple of years, there were at least a few opportunities, a few times that we saw him connect well with Bryce Butler down field. Yeah, so I guess I wouldn't say that that's not a part of his game as much as maybe he and Dez, just as we all know like he and Dez would

just not on the same in his career. Obviously, he has shown an ability to hit the deep ball, and he and for the millions time I'll say it, he did it with Dez consistently in twenty sixteen. I don't know what happened last year. I mean, I'll never know, but I don't know that anybody will. He can do it, but I think I just think his skill set. I'd just rather have a guy or multiple guys who can consistently be open eight to fifteen yards down field and

give him easy throws. I don't really care that much about going, you know, running a nine and being open fifty yards down field. So how many wide receivers in this year's draft can give you that kind of production? Do you think this year? Based on where they are right now? Without developing them. They can give you that this year. I just described the top two receivers in this draft, and that it's only those two. No, No, I mean there's a bad year for receivers. I think, Oh, well,

you're being sarcastic. No, I don't think. I mean, I don't think there's a dynamic receiver. If there was, he'd be drafted higher. I don't think there's a dynamic receiver. But I think that there is a good it's a there's a bunch of good receivers. I don't think there's any great ones. And the simple fact is that you have a chance to get the best one in the class at number nineteen in Calvin Ridley, who is considered the best one. You're right in the sense that there's

not a lot of talent at the top. But I think after that, yeah, after that, there is a lot of There's as many as twelve guys who could come right in and do something for you right away, which to me, really it's a lot that's I'm not and I'm not gonna be surprised if they wait until the third round to draft a wide receiver. If the board falls that way, and you think they could help this year,

I guess is the again, that's that's the question. Help. Yes, not step in and be Dez Bryant from day one, But I think they've you know, I think they've taken steps too. They don't need that. Remember this was the third receiver on that team. That's I mean, it's easy to forget. Dez Bryant did not have this crazy impact in his rookie years and Roy Williams were the starters, and I remember I think it was this is me for are you talking about his rookie year. Yeah, I'm sorry,

I thought you're talking about last year. This is me, This is me from the outside. I didn't cover the Cowboys at the time, but I remember as a younger Saints fan in twenty twelve he abused Patrick Robinson and

had like almost a two hundred yard day. But if I remember correctly, the first half of his twenty twelve season was pretty bad and he caught fire towards you know, in the second half, like and then he was just he got it, I guess, and he was just reeling off one hundred yard game after a hundred yard game. Point being, it took Dez Bryant longer to get acclimated to the NFL than people. Remember, that's kind of my point.

They're working on it. Well, yeah, no, I mean that's that's but I mean he didn't have a thousand yards right out of the gate, is what I'm trying to say. So I think there's guys that can contribute right away. I don't think Calvin Ridley maybe, but I don't think there's a lot of guys who could step right in and have a really impactful season right away. But I don't think that's what this team needs. So doesn't bother me.

Let's talk about the linebacker position. Yesterday, Stevens said that his expectations are that Jalen's going to make a t a huge step this year, and he even mentioned that they're really looking for depth in this draft. It made me think, or it sounded to me like he was suggesting that Jalen Smith would be the starter this year along with Sean Lee. Are you guys comfortable with the idea that we haven't seen it yet because he still

has been He played a lot last year. I think towards the end of the year, I think he was much better than earlier in the season. But are you comfortable with the idea of the Cowboys going into this season thinking of Jalon Smith as their number two linebacker. I'm comfortable with that, but I don't know if that necessarily means not do anything by in the draft. I mean, yeah, I think you expect that, But you also have to

expect Sean Lee to be hurt. I mean that's what you have to you know, or at least expect him to not be their full sixteen games, and then after that. I mean, just like receiver, you've got to think about what the position looks like next year. So I really see them drafting a linebacker pretty high in this. I know they got Joe Thomas for depth purposes. They still have Damien Wilson, but I mean, you know, they haven't really replaced I mean, Hitchens had a role last year

and they haven't replaced that yet. So I think that this, you know, it's a position of need, and the most important role I think that Hitchens had was in the event Sean Lee goes down, he steps in. That's the part missing, right, Yeah, that's yeah, yeah, I mean you need three to play too, that's I mean, Shaan Lee has in the lengthy injury history he's gonna turn thirty two while we're a training camp Jalen, I'm rooting like hell for the kid. Yeah, we haven't a party, we

can see. I'm sure he's the one throwing it. Um, it's gonna be wild. Watching tape on his iPad counts as a party. Sure. I like that kind of pouted. I mean, you need, you need a guy. And what j Jalen was at his best last year when he was playing like fifty percent of the snaps are less like when they threw him into the deep end, he wasn't quite ready for it. And I hope, like hell, he takes that step forward that Stephen suggested he would.

That's great. Can't count on that. Hoping is a bad strategy. Um, they need a guy. They need a guy who can preferably play middle and weak side at a high level like they got it. They need him. That's why I keep I don't I would prefer not to draft a linebacker at nineteen, but I just can't talk myself out of out of it. I just think they need it

too much. The two positions they need to me, the most receiver in linebacker that you talked about are exactly the same in that that there's nobody there, no, no, no no, I take that back. It's not it's safety and linebacker. That's exactly the same. There's just two really good studs that aren't gonna make it to nineteen. Then after that,

it's just an incredible drop off safety and linebacker. And that's one of them where you would like to get one of those up there, but it's not gonna work for you, and then you have to somewhat reach it linebacker.

Maybe Evans's I don't think. I don't think the drop off it's safe linebackers is steep because I think Rashaun Evans and Layton Vanderesh, that's you get into this happens every year, like you get into this think tank where like you know, Layton Vanderesh and Rashaan Evans aren't as good as Roquan Smith, and that means they're bad players and that's just not true. Um, maybe it's a little bit of a reach, but I still like nobody's gonna bat an eye if either one of those guys is

drafted in the first round. So I don't think it's a crazy reach in that regard, but they are not as good as Roquan Smith. I just want you to do more than one year in college. It's fair, Vanderesh, just especially at Boise. I mean, you can't do a lot more of your freshman and sophomore year. And I mean Lake Bloomer, I guess, and he's big, big guy six four, right. I mean, I mean, I'm there. You can talk all day about their ups and downs and their warts and their bright spots, like I get it,

But let me ask you this question. I heard this the other day. I was listening to a program and I heard someone who was a draft expertus as there are plenty that seems to be out there now, and his critique of Anderesh was that he's a guy that needs to play more physical. Have you seen that? Is that's something that you hear because hearing that from a linebacker reminds me of what was said about Bobby Carpenter coming out was he wasn't he wasn't the most physical guy.

And and I'm like, if you're playing linebacker and you're not physical, that's it's kind of part of the giant name is bart But but again, I don't watch Vanderesh, so I wanted to hear from you I think study that goes back into the group think trap where you're like, like, you know, Brian Broadus goes on the Draft Show and says, I want him to be more consistently physical. I want him to fight through the trash and get off the blocks. The game where he looked the best was Oregon, where

nobody could get a second level block on him. But when they do, he doesn't fight off of it that well. People hear that and they say, well, he's not physical. He's like he can't tackle, blah blah blah blah blah, and it's a valid criticism, but it snowballs into like all of a sudden, a guy who's six four, two fifty isn't physical. I don't think I believe that. But again, to Nick's point, he's a one year starter. He's got a lot of developing to do in consistency to get whereas.

And then you turn it around on Rashaun Evans, the guy from Alabama, which is I don't feel great about him in coverage. I don't know how, you know, I don't know that I trust his instincts one hundred percent. But like when he gets to the ball carrier, no, there's no question about his physicality, like he brings the pain. So again, I think valid critiques that Snowball too lazy talking points. Okay, do you think that the Cowboys need

to use one of their top three picks. I'm gonna start with you, Amber, one of their top three picks on a linebacker this year. And then I want you all kind of day if you have some names of some guys that you think that might fall into that category. We mentioned vander Esh, but any other names that we think fall into that category, I'd love to hear them, Amber, I mean, you have to. I don't know how you

go about it without doing so. When when you guys were talking about Jalen Smith watching him, I'm rooting for him. I believe in him. He's a great player, a great guy. But at the same time, there were a lot of occasions where I would watch him play and it looked like he would rush things like his instinct He has the instincts, but they're not at the right place yet.

He has a lot of learning to you and I watch him and compare him to Sean Lee, very similar player in the way they play, but he's still way far away from being that guy. Now, can you hear me? Yeah, it just up now, Sean Lee. You guys talked about him great player, and you can't really rely on him and playing him. I don't really like hearing what Stephen Jones said about having Jalen Smith and kind of fully trusting him. You still need to bring the guy and

rotate him. And like Dave said, fifty percent of the times that he was on there, that's when he was at his best. I don't think he's quite there yet. And the most popular guy is the one you guys were just talking about, vandersh He's the one that people keep talking about and expect him to come in for the Cowboys. He's the most popular name. And again I have my different opinions. I would like to trade go up, try to get there when James. I don't think that's

gonna happen that. I think we're all in that it's unlikely, but you're not. But there's a there's a scenario that actually makes sense that they may be in position to trade up. But you know what bothers me is like, I mean some of the things I don't really hear much about that, about the need of safety, I'm not I mean, I know I'm worried about it, but I don't hear it around. You know what everyone's talking about. People talk about linebacker, wide receiver, what about safety? Like, hello, guys,

I mean this is a big need. I don't understand why people are not talking about that. Oh, maybe there's more. I think they're talking about it. I know I'm talking about it. I've been talking about it for months. I have to off the record. Okay, let's just since the health and it's like sitting right here, let's just talk about it, like, because I think that affects everything that you do. You're talking about trading up a trade up in and I get you to hold for just a minute,

hold on that thought. We're gonna go to a break. When we come back. Nick's going to give us this profound wisdom that he has on the safety position. Well that when we come right back. This is Dallas Cowboys dot com Radio. It can be hard to find the right resource for learning about important financial matters. You search how to build savings, you end up reading about the one weird ingredient from supermarkets that can make you taller.

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twenty eight. Plucks more fans than ever before. We'll get the chance to be inside the theater to see selections made love Register now at nfl dot com, slash band mobile packs and check in at NFL Draft Experience to be part of the action. Back to the Break, Welcome back. It is the second second month the Break Clive for the s WBC morters studios at the Star. We're talking draft. We're talking about pre draft press conference today that Jerry Jones,

Stephen Jones, and Jason Garrett held yesterday. Nick, you were about to talk to us a little bit about the safety position. There was some thought you had there that I don't think it's been expressed. Yeah, let's let's get to it. This is like ranked second into the I want a speed receiver. I've think have been beat right. Um, I do think that they need to make a trade and they need to try to get a veteran safety in here. And I mean, we all know who he is.

He's sitting out there in Seattle, and if they can, if they pull that off, you know, it would count about eight and a half million on the cap. That's pretty close to what probably got to resign him though, I mean to resign. I think that's part of his problem in Seattle is that but to make it work right now, Yeah, it works because of what you just did with Dez Bryant. So yet technically it works, but you're not going to make that trade if you don't

feel like you could sign him long term. Then again, he's not sprinting after a four quarter game to your head coach to say come get me and not looking to play a little bit long term. I think so, um, I think it's got to be. It's got to be in the plans though tomorrow. I mean, because if you want to know what you gotta do there is let's say you don't have a second round pick that might affected you want to trade it back a little bit.

That would be my dream scenario right there. Make the trade, lose your second round pick, move back in the first round if you possibly could, I know what's easier said than done from nineteen late or mid twenties, late twenties, and then take the receiver that you really want. You really want DJ Moore or Courtlandt Sutton and I think they sit better at twenty six, twenty seven, twenty something.

That would be ideal. I mean, if we're just talking dream scenarios, yeah, draft dreams, that would be that would

be pretty great. It just seems to me like they could, This could happen, and I'm actually expecting if it does happen, it would happen Friday, because I think those kind of things typically happen when when you're kind of faced with it, and I think in the break day if you made the point, and I'll let you make the point for yourself, but just kind of think of when it would be advantageous because Seattle would have all the information that they'd

want to know. Maybe that is Friday. I mean, I think I read a stat that the Seahawks haven't picked in their original slot in the first round since twenty eleven. Oh wow, they're movers and shakers. I don't know why they would agree to do that tomorrow until because again, the thing that the thing that even makes me think this is possible is that Seattle doesn't have a second or a third round pick, and we know how much they value drafting. We know they need to make their

roster younger, and they've gotten they lost a lot of players. Yeah, ton, but if they can trade back from eighteen tomorrow night and get a second or you know, get the picks they want that way, then all of a sudden, the leverage is gone, and so I don't know why they would agree to that tomorrow. I think it would have to be a Friday thing. You know. There was a moment this week, and hey, I mean he never had he never said the name, not no tampering, blah blah blah.

But Stephen Jones answered a question in the press conference yesterday about trading for a veteran who wants a contract extension, and how you make that stuff work was his response. He I mean, he's like, you know, you gotta that's the gamble. You gotta the gamble you gotta make. You gotta, you know, you gotta work with their people. You gotta

try to get something done. You gotta, you know, either do that or or try to play hardball and hope that they'll play under their current terms of their deal while you figure something out. It's happening, but see it better happened. I don't care when it happens. It better happened killing me. Listen, the Cowboys, there's no way they're feeling okay with what they have right nowt of that.

I don't agree with that. I definitely agree, but also not well, okay, I can't think it could be going into this draft dope thinking we don't feel comfortable, we got to do something in the draft. I don't know that it necessarily means I will I mean you could.

It has to be two parties that want to do the deal like this is we always get, you know, the fan emails that comes in and says, hey, go out and trade Terrence Williams for Earl Thomas, Like it has to be both sides here, here's here's here's the thing. And the difference is Nick loves to point this out. Earl Thomas put this in the store in the news cycle himself. Yes, he ran across the field and flagged

down Jason Garrett and say don't get me room. I mean ultimately, you know that doesn't like he was in there taking off his shoulder pads, like what's up, homie? I mean like you know that doesn't matter right at uht. Earl Thomas doesn't sound anything like that. He's got this like deep East Texas voice, like like it's it's very

startlingly deep. Um point being a million a million trades get talked about in the NFL like all the time, like I have heard after the fact about conversations that were had in this bill for trades where it fell apart. For some reason, it never got off the ground floor, you know, I mean, because so much goes into that. And this is obviously something that has been talked about. It's been kicked around here, It's been kicked around in Seattle.

But I would argue ninety eight percent of player trades fall apart. I would I guarantee that that happens. And so I look at it. I'm sorry, Nick, you're good. I look at it, and I think I think you're right. I don't think they feel one hundred percent comfortable, But I think the flip side of that is like, Okay, we do all this, we take on all this money for the thirty year old guy, or we hope, like Jalen Smith, we hope that Xavier Woods can take that

step and be our free safety. And five different times in the last month when Stephen Jones has been asked about this, he has said the name Xavier Woods. I thought it was really funny. Actually, Cavon Frasier quote tweeted a tweet from Stephen Jones about this last night that mentioned Xavier Woods and not him, and he was like shaking my head, like, what the hell, man, I'm a

bust doesn't even know exactly, no, exactly. So I think the flip the flip side of that is they say, all right, we can spend all these resources on this all pro guy, or we hope that our young guy that we thought the world of last year can take the next step and we draft somebody behind him. And they brought in two or three safeties who fit that day two, day three mold. And that's how you do

it on the young and cheap. And I know that doesn't excite people, and I'm not saying it's gonna work, but I won't be surprised if that is what they do, because that's way easier to do. And that's wow wow, I mean, this is I mean, I honestly, I honestly

believe that they need more help. But I agree with Dave that the mo has been that when they get on a particular position, they're willing to go young and say, we're going to ride it through with these young guys and see if we can draft a guy that we think and Stephen talked about it yesterday. There's the thing about the young guys is if you draft them early and you get them playing early, you have a better chance.

If they can play, you have a better chance of signing them to longer term deals then playing in that free agency. He Marty didn't do that. They didn't. They drafted early, and they're moving that. The ones that they didn't draft early, Cavon Fraser and Xavier Woods, they're hoping they can do something with. But I mean, no, and I wasn't early in the draft. I mean just drafting them as they're you're drafting them, bringing them in and

letting them play early, not necessarily drafting them, right. I think that the reason why I think this is going to happen. I agree, there's a lot of trades that ever get talked about, but this, there's got so many elements to this. Number one, there is a need. There's a need at safety. There's so much of a need that they moved Byron Jones already. I mean that they're moving him to get a better position. So now they've

created even a bigger need. When you get a new coach in here that you like and you want to build some things around him and give him some an idea, I mean, because I think Chris Rahshard is a guy they really like, maybe leaving long term as a coordinator. You want to give him some some you know, things to work with. From what I hear, he's pretty much on the table for this, so that he's you got a guy that's lobbying for him that you want this

system to work. You hired me. Here's a guy that we know and can make you know into a really good player. Then also Seattle needing those picks, I just you know they're sitting there. It works for them. The fact that he ran over the field and say that he wants to be here. There's just a lot of factors here that make this thing work. And the money now works. So there's just a lot of things that just keeps pointing to this. The smoke. There's fire. There's

a lot of smoke. Let's be some fire. There's and I won't be surprised. But like I said, there's twenty components are more to a player of trade that have to go right. All twenty of them have to go right. Only one has to go wrong for it to not happen. And so like san Diego saying, I'll give you the forty sixth pick in the draft and you're like Seattle or you know, New England's like, we need we need our we need our we need our night soldier, we need our right tackle of the future. We're coming up

to eighteen. We'll give you our two or whatever. Actually, I don't think New England, No, New England has an extra two. I don't think that changes as much as you might think. Like if Seattle trades back and gets another pick or two, I still I don't think that

affects that much. Yeah, they're getting more picks. That takes off one of those aspects, but they still don't want him in that price tag and they think they're gonna they could get something for him maybe, But I mean it's I mean, take two picks, take on one one year at eight point five, and then you get a compic when he leaves in free agents? Would you trade I'd trade a two and probably as much as maybe a five. What would you do? Maybe that much? Either

my two or my three do more than one pick? No, if if they were like two and a four or two and oh five, if that, I mean, if it's gonna get it done, I'd probably do it. But I'll just say this, like I'm sorry ahead him, No, I would about to change the object. Sorry you got us it was, I mean, but what but from what you're saying, Nick, I mean, I actually would be kind of shocked if

this happens. And I think it just comes back to this has not been what the what the Cowboys have done the last several years, Like they don't go out and free agency and or and and I guess even from a trade standpoint, they don't go out and get high priced guys. And I just so, so that doesn't mean it doesn't happen. It just means I would be kind of shocked if he did it. Is this a Jerry type move? Though Jerry does that these kind of things. Stephen really doesn't. But also, what could the seat be

any hotter for Jason Garrett? I mean, it is what it is. It could be going into a season though. If they go is this the hottest seat he's been on since he's been here? If they go ten and six, when the East lose the first round, is he the coach next year? I don't know. I don't know. They didn't win a playoff game, I don't know. I don't even see that. That tells me that is an extremely hot seat. If you're if you could go to the playoffs and not win a playoff game and you're gonna

get fired, that's a hot seat. So my point is is that getting a guy that can help me right now, it's the best second round pick you're ever gonna dress bow Bob worries me a little bit. There was a quote, I believe it was Jerry who said it. He kind of talked about when you get rookies in here and how they can be a quick impact and do you remember that listening to it? Something like that that you can trust some of these guys because they've seen it. Some rookie guys come in and an impact and make

an impact in the game. Now, that worries me when I hear something like that, because that's not always the case. You're taking a risk. And when you talk about the group of safeties, the guys that you have right now. Yeah, so I'm veteran guys, but you don't have anyone that scares teams. You don't have anyone that is like, oh my god, we're playing against this guy. So you put in a rookie and you're expecting him to make be a game changer and make a difference that's not very realistic.

So they need a veteran guy that comes in the game and other teams are worrying about him. A rookie is not gonna do that, probably not, unless, of course, you get somebody like Derwin James. Now, if you can move up and get a Derwin James and maybe you do create that kind of then we're talking about something there. Honestly, I would rather take Girl Thomas, really yeah, because I because I still get another player, And I bet Jason Garrett would rather do that because he gets two players

as opposed to one. You lose your second round pick by going up six spots or whatever to don't you lose a team. You're a second round pick. If you're gonna try to get Earl Thomas. He's saying, yeah, but you get a nineteenth overall pick as well. Yeah, you have to trade the second the first to move up to get James, who you think is going to be good as opposed to But you're not really giving up the first because you're going up, you're getting a first

right right, two players versus one. I get Earl Thomas. Trade for Derwin gets you one players with your nineteen one player with your nineteenth and fiftieth. Oh, you're saying because you're counting Earl Thomas as a guess well, I mean, is he gonna coach or is he gonna play? I don't know. I don't know. I'm not certain about that, but I guess that, and I ask you that question earlier this week. I do think there is an argument

that can be made. Do you want the guy that's approaching thirty or do you want a guy that you think could be just as good at the beginning of his career. Where the money is is is like there's a lot of stuff about a young guy approaching thirty with both of his last two seasons significantly affected by injury, Right, so there a lot of money. And if you really think Darwin James is a legit player, like you think he's gonna be really great, I know it's still a risk,

but I don't know that I fall. And I'm an old Thomas Thomas fan. I don't know if I fall in the category is saying, if I have my choice between the two, if they cost me the same amount, like if I got to give it my second for both, I kind of think I want the young guy. Yeah, I don't know, but I mean, how much voice does Jason Garrett having this? I mean he has the head coach. I think he has. I think he has a voice.

And to be honest with you, I think when it comes down to it, that's one areas where I actually do believe Jerry when he says that they make group decisions. I really believe Jason has a voice. I think Will has a voice, even has a voice, and I think Jerry has a voice. And I think at the end of the day, Jerry's the one has to make the final decision. But I don't think Jerry makes decisions on an island. I think he makes decisions based upon the consensus.

The cool thing about the draft is you can see that play out in the war room. Like it's not like, I mean they're all together. You can see them all having conversation. Yeah, yeah, I hate that we're talking about here what Yeah he didn't say heck, but yeah, yeah, that was funny. I mean, I'll I'm I'll be the buzzkill I always am. But I don't think either one of those two guys is on this team. On Saturday Afternoon,

Earl am Earl or Irwin. I think it's because you're you're bessimistic, and I tend to be a linebacker or receiver and the best valued guy they get somewhere else, or maybe they trade for one and that's just the two. Let's move on. Yeah, sorry, let's move on. I do one, they don't draft. I mean, if if they don't trade for Earl Thomas, I do think they'll be sitting there with the third fourth round picks and they'll be they'll

be looking to do that with somebody. I think that they do make a trade this year for a veteran player. It may not be Earl Thomas. It'll be somebody. It might be a linebacker that you don't get, you know, it'll be I just think that that's a route that we're going. Yeah. I think it's a route where we'll see them take this year. And I think they can probably think the Eagles for that. You got the picks to do it. You have the picks to do it, right. All right, let's take our final break, and when we

come back. I want to talk about the offensive line. There was some conversation yesterday on the offensive line and the players involved there, and then We're going to talk about how that could affect their draft strategy when we come back. This is Dallas Cowboys dot com Radio. Cowboys fans know that the second best of anything simply won't

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Welcome Back. It is the final segment of The Break Live from the s WBC More Studios at the Star. Nick take it away, Well, I have a question for Dave or really anybody when you're heading into a draft weekend, what's the one thing you really want? A lot of underwear? Picks want a lot of You do want a lot of underwear, I would think at least one for every person in the room. But also you want a lot

of picks, picks, draft picks, picks. Now, what you don't want when you're dealing with underwear is a lot of picks. That's one. I was good. I wish i'd played along with that better, right, That's okay. I didn't get where you're going. That's okay though. So the reason you can where here's one way you can avoid that, Tommy John. I mean as simple as that. Tommy John. You don't have no picks. You don't haven't picking anything back side whatever that may be the only time you didn't in football.

You don't want picks, well your quarterbacks there so anyways, Tommy John will prevent picks. Um Tommy John dot com slash Actually it's Cowboys Slash Tommy John. You get twenty percent off your your first order, your second order, your third order, Plus you can also personalize them and get some Dallas Cowboy logo on there. I still think that's cool personalized, Like, can I get my name on? You? Probably could, really definitely could because you're so boogie. Yeah

do that boogie? Yeah, that's not how to word that's ever been used with men that I've been to dinner with you. Are you serious? I didn't have anything to do with boogie. No, I've never had that. Now you could say my wife is boogie, but I'm not bougie. You're bad and boogie kind of You're not bogie. You are nobody likes to be called booge. Seriously, I'm there's nothing about me that's boogie. I'm most down to earth

person you'll ever meet. You are down to earth, but your taste is bougie, Like that's just a fems to order and at a restaurant. Yeah, I want myself the way I want it. I know, I know, and it's just gonna take forever. I mean, you know you want to go after Jay like you go first, because I got another fourteen minutes before she's gonna ask. I just like it the way I like my boss is bad and boogie. There is there a way that you can put this on the side. Yeah, okay, cool anyways, Timmy

John Yeah, no, Reggies, you digress all right. Let me let me throw out one other thing For those of you out there who are draft nuts and like to be able to follow the draft and be able to know what's being discussed and the players that are out there, you gotta get this magazine. Star Magazine. Um. It is the the official magazine the Dallas Cowboys, and there is a this edition they put together every year. The whole crew is a part of writing it. Brian Broadus has

a lot of stuff in here. If we broke down, I don't know how many players it were in broken down, maybe about three hundred players broken down, but this lists about five hundred. Yeah. It's It's an amazing, amazing program that you can use for the draft. I use it every year as I'm watching the draft to be able to jump to you know, player gets draft I don't know.

I jump in here, I find that guy. I can get a pretty clear understanding of what Brian and you guys thought of the player and and uh and so I think it's a really really great thing. If you want to check it out, check out Dallas Cowboys dot com Forward Slash Star again at Dallas Cowboys dot com Forward Slash Star and you can you can get your own copy and be ready for I'm not just saying this because we you know, I kind of helped contribute a little bit, but this is the first year that

I haven't purchased another magazine. I always will do that. I'll be at the store, I'll see some some other magazine and take one, But this first year I haven't even considered doing that because this is this one to me is it's just as good, if not better than

than the others. Plus, you know, you have some stuff that Dane Brugler does, and we we've looked at his draft guide, but I think between the two, I mean, we know, I just don't know if people are can watch as much tape as What's Brian starts back in December, yeah, and it keeps going. And the other thing about this there is an online version. So if you're thinking I can't get my copy before a draft starts, go to

Dallas Cowboys dot com Forward slash Star. You can see that there is an electronic version that you can then pull up on your device and be able to flip through and be able to get all the same information, just without the actual hard coop. I wish they were selling them at the stadium when you go out there. I wish they were Oh mat, they are, okay, oh hey, what enjoy the experience at the stadium, folks. It was that serious, just saying, just check out the experience at

the stadium. You never know what you'll happen across. All right, Um, let's get into u's getting back into this conversation around uh, the offensive line. Um, yesterday in the press conference, UM, I think it was I want to say it was Stephen that was talking about the offensive line. He said, they have tremendous, tremendous flexibility to look at both guards and tackles. You say, that was a pretty good question something you Yeah, it was a question that came from

our own David Hellman's true, really good question. I thought Stephen had a look on his face where was a little bit I don't know if it was that he didn't like you or a little perplexed by the question, but he answered it. So that's all I feel like Stephen and Jerry or the like, you're like, who's this guy? Why he know they know who you are? And they're like, he you know who you are? No, No, I mean

it in the sense of like this guy works for us. No. I don't think it's that they just like that's our guy. That's our guy with that question, but like not like your tone was admirable, admiring, you know that their tone is like like that's our guy, that's our guy. That question whether the statement is yeah, that's our guy. Yeah, anyway,

good question, Dave. Um And the thing that stood out to me about the about the answer was that it sounds like they're comfortable with Fleming, who they got in free agency, coming in and starting at either right tackle or being their swing tackle, and they're also comfortable with Lyo either being at right tackle or at left guard. Um. So, by question for you guys is what do you think

is the best scenario you're entering the draft. Do you think the Cowboys should be going in thinking, hey, let's get a guard so that we can keep Lyo where he is and we can have Fleming be our swing and you've then upgraded your offensive line from where you

were last year. Do you think they have to go in thinking, hey, we need to get a tack we can move Lyle inside because there are better tackles in the draft where we're gonna be picking, and we'll still have that person can even either battle with Fleming for the starting job or be the swing tackle. What do you think is the best case scenario for the Cowboys

on offit splay? I think what the best case scenario is if they get their hands on a guard who can compete for the starting job and leave Lyle Collins where he is, and then Cameron Fleming becomes maybe the best swing tackle in football right now. I mean, like, you've got three really good tackles, two of whom can start on either side. Hell Lyle might even be able

to start on either side. I don't know. But you've got three great tackles, and then you've got a really talented rookie who could push Marcus Martin for the starting job or maybe even just start. And then I mean, man, that sounds nice. Let me interrupt nasty this question. Is that more about the fact that you want to keep Lyle Collins where he is because I know I've heard you say before you really want to keep him out

at right tackle. Is this more about a decision of keeping him where he is, or is just because you think that overall that's the best scenario. I think it's are all the best scenario because your lack of tackle depth killed you last year. It absolutely I think it's as big almost killed to quarterback. It's this bit. It is so tied into everything because your line fell apart, your quarterback got murdered. I think he lost his confidence during that stretch of time where Tyrant Smith couldn't play.

I think more so than any I think that's why he looked worse than normal in November and December of last year. I think I just I think the world of the job that Lyle Collins did at right tackle last year, and I think it would be a shame to dismantle that tackle depth if you don't have to. But having said that, that's what I said, I think

they should do. What I think will happen is I think they're going to draft a tackle to either start or be the swing tackle and move Lyle to guard because I think the way this draft shakes out, that's more plausible because unless you draft a guard at nineteen, which they could do. They brought in one. I mean,

there's a couple guys there that makes sense. But unless you do that, then I don't know where you find a guard that's definitely gonna be good enough to do what you want, Whereas you can find a few tackles who fit that criteria. And I just I think it's easier to find a good tackle in this draft and move lyle than it is to find a good guard.

I would be focused on guard, and when you have a guy that has done a good job at a certain position, you would want to keep him there, especially if that guy comes out and says, that's where my focus is at, that's where my mentality is at his training right now to be a tackle, to stay at tackle. So you don't want to mess with the guys that is feeling confident and comfortable at a position that he has shown succeeds success. Yes, so yeah, I would. If I'm the Cowboys, I would go in with my focus

being guard. Now, worst case scenario, if you need to make a move, then you need to, and there's no way around it. Then yeah, you have that secure. Marie Blankett would well that you can move him. But if as of right now, I wouldn't be focused on that. So are you guys at all surprised hearing what Amber said?

Are you guys at all surprised if they didn't make more of an effort to possibly resign Jonathan Cooper because if you thought now again, I think that I'm basing this on the fact that I think in this room we all thought Jonathan Cooper played well last season, not great,

but played well. If you had Jonathan Cooper on this team right now now, you really have flexibility because right now you're looking at it, you feel like starting day, you've got your starting five, You've got a good swing tackle, you feel really good about where you are from the offensive offensive live standpoint, and if you happen to run across the guard in the draft that you really love, there's no reason why Jonathan Cooper couldn't be kind of you.

You kind of kind of keep him. Maybe you don't keep him, but he did. It's he signed this big deal with San Francisco. Right I don't feel any differently. I've never watched Marcus Martin play. It's not my job to Brian does that, But based on what they gave him and where he comes from, I think he's just as good, if not better than Cooper. But the fact that it's not set, I mean, they love to create competition and they love the best five idea. Do you

think Marcus Martin is a starter caliber guard? I think he could start on this line. Sure, yeah. I mean again I'm not watching his tape, but just based on how much they paid him to get here and his prior history, I mean, he could be the weak link on this line just as easily as Jonathan Cooper could be. But I think that's the difference is but the weak link means you're not in the Pro Bowl, right, No, that's what I'm saying. But that's okay, right, But there

ends in the whole line. I don't think they're in lies. Therein lies your argument though, Like, do you want to have a weak link at guard or move a potential would have been top ten pick over there and have an experienced veteran or a potential high draft pick battling out at right tackle. I mean, if you subscribe to that best five idea, then you could conceivably have badasses at every position other than just allowing for a weak

link that left guard. They've they've done a nice job of kind of just protecting themselves at this position for nothing to happen or a lot of things to happen. If they get wiped out with the guys they want and they're sitting at nineteen, no trade back scenarios. You have to make a pick here, and the best guy available is Mike McGlinchey, then you draft him, and then you take him at right use, play them at right tackle, and Lyle's probably going to be playing guard for you.

Or if the best one available is a guard, let's say it's a James James Daniels or maybe Will Hernandez. This thirty seven bench press for Will Hernandez pretty strong for me, because I mean that's what they need. They need a guy that can push the pile, and I think that he could come right in and help you that happens, and then obviously Lyle's playing right tackle, so and then Martin and Fleming are also just going to kind of factor in if nothing happens here. It's all

it's a good scenario, I think for O line. It's all nebulous and literally I mean that. I asked that question because I wanted him to say that and basically confirm that what they do with their offensive line is going to depend on what they come out of this draft with that's and he said they have the flexibility pretty much whatever they want to do exactly so or do nothing, I guess, I mean from where you talking about Martin, they did nothing. They probably still feel okay

about where they are. Well, I don't think they're gonna do but but it's just a man. I'm saying, do something that affect that that will have an impact this year if if what happens is you know, and there's there's some mid round guys. There's a kid from Washington State who's like a mid round guy that they brought in on a visit. If they draft him and let him and Marcus Martin fight it out for guard and

leave Lyle where he is, I'm fine with that. And yeah, like you could have a better left guard, but on a line full of pro bowlers, you should be able to survive that in my opinion. But you can't survive is what you deal with last year at your swing tech, which is why it seems like they've solved that problem

at least, well, well, what for the time being. The problem does become if you move lys All down the guard, now you've created that position, You created that situation where you now have to have somebody that could lay swing tackleft Tyrn goes down if you're or do you move a second guy from their position where they are now just to be the tackle you put on the left side. You could ask you could draft a tackle and make him play guard. They did it with Chazz. You could

do it again. You could draft that. I that's I just want every just don't mess with a good thing. I agree with. I actually agree with that. Don't mess with it. I'm hopeful that they find the right answer at guards a Lyle stays attack moving guys your best option as a swing tackle. I love that they signed

Fleming to be a swing tackle. They did. I mean, his contract says that he's not going to be making a lot of money unless he starts so many games, and then if that happens, then, which is fine, that's what it should be. Right. You moved Byron Jones because you're not sure what he can be better at Lyle Collins was pretty damn good at a more important position in my opinion. All right, let's uh real quickly. I did want to talk a little bit about the tight

end position. U. Something that Stevens said was he thinks some guys are being overlooked at this position. He mentioned Jarwin, he mentioned Swam, later he mentioned Rico, and then we find out last week I think it was that James Hannah has decided to retire such one less guy as far as your depth is concerned to tight end. Are the concerns that you guys have right now about the tight end position. And I want to take it from

two different standpoints. From the short term, which is this season, and also from the long term, knowing that Jason Witten's not getting any younger and there doesn't appear to be, at least from the standpoint of the amount of time that they've played, a clear replacement for him that's on the roster. Yeah, I think there it should be a position that they address in this draft, and maybe more of a pass catcher type, just because I think that

they need that that position. They need to get somebody that can kind of get open a little bit. Swam and Jarwin and even Hannah and those guys. I mean that they didn't really. I mean, Witten is still somewhat getting open. He's making some good plays, He's not getting open as much as as he did. They needs a little bit more athleticism at that position, um, in my opinion, and a guy that's played a lot of football in his career as well. I don't care about tight end

at all. I'm in the short term or the long term until eighty two decides that he's okay. Let me ask you this question, do you think and I know everybody, it seems like, at least from a standpoint the way the coach talks about it, Um, it seems as though there is this, uh, there's this thought that well, Witt and just won't come off the field. Do you think that this is a situation where I don't want it to give you won't but doesn't I mean either the way that its Ricky Waters for who for what? Well?

But that's my question, that's my question. Should they be looking to try to get if they if they really like Jarwin, if they really like Rico. At some point, are they gonna have to say, Jason, You're gonna have to start splitting up some of those reps because we need to get these younger guys on the field to see if they can play right. Well, you think they should do that, Maybe somebody should be drafted. They can take him off there and maybe somebody's drafted. But but

they've they've tried that before and that hasn't worked. They drafted a kid in the top fifty not that long ago, and they've done it three times since. Okay, but I'm i mean years. But okay, it's hard to compare Fasano and Martellis. I mean, Witton was in his prime back then, but Witton in the in the third in the final chapter of his career, if you I mean break it into five year stretches, toward the closer to the end than the beginning. They drafted a guy in the top

fifty and he couldn't really do anything with that. Witten played ninety seven. He's the reason I love the Earl Thomas trade even more. Who give because it gives us something to watch a training camp or no? No, because well that I'm not even that would matter. I wasn't talking about that would be a lot of fun. I was talking about Escobar. Oh you're gonna give a second round. Oh yeah, No, when I think about it being picked on Kevin Escobar, I'm like, yes, sounds pretty good. How

many Sean Lee is really? I was about to say, Shaun Lee is about the one I could think of, And well, I mean the guy you're paying seventeen million dollars to Marcus supposed good SECD round figure. It's there's every reason to believe that they can find a good second round player, but they've got plenty of history with bad ones too, And I for bet it's It's not my place to comment on whether Jason Witten should come off the field. Honestly, I mean he's he's gonna be

the longest tenured cowboy in history. He's going to the Hall of Fame. He can do whatever he wants until he decides he retires. As far as I'm concerned, he's still he's not as good as he used to be. He still does his job effectively enough that and no, he's not. You know, it would be fun to have like a David and Joku type of guy, or or an Evan Ingram who can do all that type of stuff.

I don't like these guys don't want that type of guy anyway, Like they've shown nothing to say that that that's how they want tight ends to play, Like it's easy to daydream about a tight end with Jimmy Graham like ability running down the scene. Like they don't want that guy. They want no offense to Jason went and they want like the boring style of tight end play. And not only that, yeah, but the other part to that too is that they they respect what he'll does

from a leadership standpoint. We've seen this happen throughout the NFL history of the NFL. A guy that is a really great leader, they will give that guy many more years of being on a team. It happened with Woodson. You look at a guy like ray Lewis. Ray Lewis wasn't playing his best football by the end, but he was such a great leader that they were like, Okay, we'll deal with some of the things where he's taking a step back because the leadership is so good, right.

And I think it's kind of the same thing with Witton that you have to factor in all of that when you talk about who he is as a player. The positives outweigh the negatives in my opinion. I mean, he got flagged four times last year, his yards perception or the lowest of his career. I still think the positives outweigh the negatives. I still think he can be a meaningful contributor to a good team. And I still think he's gonna play ninety five percent or more of

the snaps. He got flagged four times last year. That's what the that's what I read. I mean, we'll not read. But like I went back and looked at it. I mean, it doesn't seem like it's almost won a game. It does, but that's one a month. Yeah, Ford, I mean that's got flag. I mean, got a false start every single game and it was fine. He got flagged three times for holding and once for false start last year. That's it. Yeah, God,

I thought it was. He did all he did. He might have two of his three There might have been some declined ones in the maybe, but two of his three holds wiped out like fifty yards of rushing yard and um, I don't know, man, I just I'll worry about that when he decides to retire, because like they'll worry about the few, like why just why are you gonna draft this guy? You know, Mike Mike Kiseki from Penn State is like he's that's he's the Jimmy Graham

this year. Like you're just gonna have him wither away on the bench because he not getting on the field that I'd rather have a guy who can do more for me. And the one thing you'll say about tight end too, is it seems it seems like replacing a tight end is a lot different than a quarterback. You know, you have to get the quarterback in there early and give him chance to kind of be ready for when he takes the mantle. For tight end, it seems like if you draft the right one, you can bring him

in in year one. They can be a really good for you. See what New York did not to mention for what they want their tights to do. Hannah and Swam can develop just as well at him in their rule. I mean, sorry, um Jarwin, Yeah, I gotta re focus myself, but train yourself well. You develop as blockers and all that good stuff in practice and in the two and three tight end sets like they're not. I'll believe they're

gonna draft an Evan Ingram when I see it. Anyway, at least as long as this coaching staff is in place. All right, we appreciate you guys joining us. We are back next week and uh, actually we got so much coverage coming on this week, and make sure you check out Dallas Cowboys dot Com. Were Cowboys Global app back next week? Can I take next week off? No, we're actually our time will actually change. We're actually gonna be coming on on Tuesday next week. Oh that's right, because

on Wednesday through Friday we ain't gonna be here. We're going on vacation. You got vacation coming up, and so we'll tell you more about that next Tuesay though, But until then, for Nick Even, Dave helm and Ambergarcier, Derek Eaelton, this has been The Break live on Dallas Cowboys dot Com Radio. This has been a production of Dallas Cowboys dot Com and the Less Cowboys Football Club