27 Years Ago, pop singer Cher asked us this question: “Do you believe in life after love?” … and it promptly rocketed to the top of the charts, selling 11 million copies of the song. Today, in 2025, a better question—especially for copywriters—is “Do you believe in sales without belief?” It’s a question our returning champion today, Billy Broas, has thought about a lot, and mastered the answer to. And he’s written a book about it, which I highly recommend and we’ll talk about later in the show. ...
Feb 24, 2025
Two of the most confrontive words in a conversation are “Prove It!” Nobody really likes to be challenged about how true what they are saying. But when it comes to writing copy in the real world, you have to expect that prospects WON’T believe you. In fact, the more they like a claim you make, the more skeptical they will be. Why? Because of human nature. And also, because they’ve been disappointed before. You can almost imagine them in a cover band, screaming at you, “We won’t be fooled again!” ...
Feb 17, 2025
Confidence in copywriting isn’t just about choosing the right words—it’s about embodying conviction in every line you write. In this episode, we explore the hidden ways self-doubt seeps into your messaging, sabotaging conversions before your prospects even realize why. From subconscious hesitations to subtle linguistic hedging, you’ll discover how these confidence leaks silently erode trust and diminish persuasive impact. But awareness alone isn’t enough. We’ll walk through the exact mental shif...
Feb 10, 2025
Today we look at an old and very true saying: It’s not about the money you make, but about the money you KEEP. There’s an old joke about a guy who loses money on every sale, but, he says, “I make it up in volume.” We’re not talking about back ends or affiliate sales here. Things can go sideways in your business if you’re not making enough sales, or your profit margins are too small. Or upside down, like the guy in the joke. But you’ve got an even a bigger problem even if you’re making enough sal...
Feb 03, 2025
We’re past the point of wondering about or fearing AI when it comes to copywriting. At this point, the big question is: What do I need to know, do and have to make it work for me? I say that because copywriters at all levels of skill and in all niches are using AI in all kinds of ways. It’s no longer the new new thing. It’s a part of the business, and it continues to grow in importance and ability to do more and more complex things really well. But you have to grow with it. Many people think the...
Jan 27, 2025
We have a very special guest today. A legend among insiders, Caleb O’Dowd is a master marketer and copywriter. He has been launching and scaling businesses from zero to seven figures and eight figures, through the smart use of great copy and strategic sales funnels. In more industries than I can count. Including some of the most brutally competitive. I was thrilled when Caleb agreed to come on Copywriters Podcast for many reasons, especially the one that he has written a new book: Monetization: ...
Jan 20, 2025
At the highest levels of copywriting, big financial publishers ask copywriters to do a “re-lead” when they want to increase conversion on a proven offer. What’s that? A re-lead is basically a reframing of the intro to a sales letter, in the hopes that the reframing will spur greater sales. And it’s probably no coincidence that when my mentoring clients show me copy they’re having trouble with, the first thing I look at is the headline and lead. A revamping of those two things — the beginning of ...
Jan 13, 2025
You could say the purpose of a sales funnel is to create desire that leads up to a sale, but these days, if that’s what you say, you’ve left out an important part. A part that very well could make the difference between a sale and no sale. With trust in general at such an all-time low and the feeling of isolation so rampant, people want a little more. They want to feel like you, as a business or a businessperson, care. Both about them personally, and the things they care about. You don’t need to...
Jan 06, 2025
Our returning champion is Brenna McGowan, the master of the pre-launch. Today she’s going to tell us about a special pre-launch technique called Anticipation Marketing™. Perhaps the best advantage it gives you is it puts you front and center in your prospects’ minds, and at the same time gets them eagerly looking forward to getting the full details about what you’re going to launch. Maybe even more important is that it revolves around one word: Trust. As we’ve talked about here before, and as yo...
Dec 30, 2024
It’s the day before the day of the night before Christmas as we put this on the air, and a very unknown year looms ahead. One thing for sure, no matter what happens: The market will be more unforgiving in 2025 than it was in 2024. Why? It’s simple. Competition keeps growing. So does impatience among almost all consumers, and mistrust among many of them. What this means to you, as a copywriter, is now more than ever, you can’t afford to do a half-assed job on your copy. Sounds pretty bleak and te...
Dec 23, 2024
So, we’re right in the middle of the Christmas shopping season as we come to you this week, and I’m wondering: Have you figured out how to delight your customers and fatten up your bank account? If you haven’t you’re not alone. Many copywriters and businesses don’t know exactly what to do to join in the holiday buying and selling fun… so they don’t do anything. Which is a shame, because there’s a ton of people out there just looking for a good excuse to buy something. So this podcast is my gift ...
Dec 16, 2024
For the copywriting word of the year, I’d like to nominate the word “authenticity.” It’s a big deal right now. People talk about it a lot. I will give you an example on today’s show of how an accidental Facebook ad created more engagement than anything else I’ve ever seen. I went over the ad with my clients and we figured out that it was the way they used authenticity in the writing of it that touched so many people and inspired so much response. These days, slick marketing is on a steep decline...
Dec 09, 2024
Have you ever heard a song and thought, “Dang! How did they do that? I wish my copy was that catchy!” Well, Nathan and I have thought the same thing and in fact pondered the similarities between writing a song and writing copy. You see, we’re both songwriters. We stoutly assert that we are both amateurs at this. At one point, music was Nathan’s business. I never got that far. It’s always been just a hobby for me. But I have studied and tried intently. Just turned out that wasn’t my path. However...
Dec 02, 2024
Ever wonder why some copywriters consistently crush it while others struggle to get conversions? This episode dives deep into the Five Stages of Copywriter Awareness—a transformative framework that shows the path from instinctive, mediocre copy to breakthrough results. If you’ve ever felt like your copy was missing something, this episode will pinpoint exactly where you’re stuck and how to advance. Starting at Stage One, you’ll learn why writing based solely on your own perspective often falls f...
Nov 25, 2024
Once you’ve finished your copy, the anxiety begins. And it almost always boils down to the answer to this question: How good is this copy–really? When people ask me to critique their copy, they’re often amazed at how quickly I can get to the heart of things. Once I have an overall opinion, I’ll drill down to a lot of specifics. But I think it’s important today not to talk about those specifics, but instead to talk about that quick take. How do you know if it’s any good to begin with? I’m going t...
Nov 18, 2024
Today we’re going to do another episode of “Just because it’s a story, it’s not a hero’s journey story.” What I mean by that is, many people have been misleading copywriters and salespeople for a while now. Saying, if you’re going to tell a story, it’s got to be a hero’s journey story. As you may know, in my book The Persuasion Story Code, I show 25 types of stories that are decidedly NOT hero’s journeys. That actually come from successful sales letters and other direct response copy. That you c...
Nov 11, 2024
It’s become so common we don’t even think about sometimes, but subscription products have really taken over our world in a way no one could ever have predicted. And along with them, new demands and new opportunities for copywriting. If you look at the past, you’ll see a lot of promotions were based on a single sale, with the copywriter or the business HOPING that the customer might buy the upsell. These days, recurring revenue is just a matter-of-fact business model. The question is, how do you ...
Nov 04, 2024
If you would like your lead magnets to perform better and get you more qualified prospects and customers, wouldn’t it make sense to look at the most popular form of engagement in the world for some clues? I’m talking about video games. According to the sports and gaming platform Sportskeeda, last year gaming was a $396 billion industry. Movies, $284 billion and music, only $28 billion. Marketing logic tells us that video games are so popular because they give people something they want that mayb...
Oct 28, 2024
Four months ago, I was completely skeptical about AI and how it would ever fit into copywriting. I saw a post on LinkedIn by Brian Halpin, a copywriter working in Jason Parker’s agency. Brian talked about some unbelievable results, nearly one million in sales, that they had gotten with a VSL that was 80% written by AI. I’ve known Jason for more than 10 years, and Brian’s post piqued my interest. Jason agreed to come onto the podcast to talk about what he was doing. Nathan insisted we bring Jason...
Oct 21, 2024
The term “cult” has become such a loaded word lately. People who aren’t members of certain groups call the groups a cult, and the members of those groups resent and deny it. Yet, are all cults bad? Maybe some are, maybe some aren’t. But on today’s show, Nathan Fraser is going to talk about a special kind of cult that, in his view, is not only GOOD — but actually necessary to the survival of some of his clients. We’ve got to admit, these are not what you usually think of when you hear the word “c...
Oct 14, 2024
Ever wonder how to set yourself, your product, or your business apart? It’s a big puzzle these days. The best general advice I’ve heard is from recent podcast guest Scott Zetlan: “Different is better than better.” It almost sounds silly, but in the super-competitive marketplace, where products live in the real world, it’s not silly at all. It’s actually profound. Because here’s what it means: When you can show something DIFFERENT about what you’re offering that MAKES A HUGE DIFFERENCE to your pr...
Oct 07, 2024
Job one for a copywriter is getting and keeping attention. We always give that our best shot. But there are some situations where you need to do this more intensely, and you don’t want to come across like a screaming insane person yelling loudly just to get attention. So we need to come up with some unusual techniques, to increase the intensity without pushing our prospects away. That’s what today’s show is about. I’ve identified five unusual copy techniques that are especially helpful for cold ...
Sep 30, 2024
Today we’re going to talk about two words that can change your writing forever. Not just your copywriting, but especially your copywriting. One word is a first-grade word and the second word is a fourth-grade word, according to people who seem to know about those things. The words are “but” – with one ‘t’ – and “therefore.” Why are these words so important and who, besides us, says so? It’s because these words can take a boring string of sentences and make them interesting. They can add conflict...
Sep 23, 2024
You know FAQs – that list of frequently asked questions, and answers? Are they a copywriting chore you would just as soon avoid? Well, today I’d like to offer a different way to look at them. As a huge, and mainly underutilized, marketing opportunity. I want you to consider this possibility: An FAQ section doesn't just inform. It also persuades. But not in a cheesy, ham-fisted kind of way. See, it is possible to inform while persuading, and we’ll look at how today. Download....
Sep 16, 2024
OK, finally. You’ve got your copy written. At least your first draft. Now what? That’s what a subscriber to the podcast asked me on youtube a few weeks ago. The best I can do to answer that question is tell you how I look at copy, whether it’s my own, or a client’s. Today’s show is about a series of steps I go through to review copy with a mentoring client or in a one-off copy critique. Some of this may be familiar, but listen for the parts that aren’t. Adding those parts to your routine could e...
Sep 09, 2024
These days, things in copywriting are changing so fast it can make your head spin. Junior copywriters aren’t sure there’s a career path, because of AI. Experienced copywriters are finding clients have different and sometimes confusing demands that you never would have heard five years ago. Our special guest today, Scott Zetlan, has some answers for junior copywriters, experienced copywriters, and everyone in between. That’s because he’s seen and done so much in business, both old school and onli...
Sep 02, 2024
One of the hardest things for copywriters and business owners to get right is running ads to cold traffic on Facebook and Instagram, and making those ads profitable. If you’ve tried this for yourself, I think you know what I mean. So does today’s guest, who has discovered some important techniques that work and has also discovered the mistakes to avoid, and is going to share valuable info about both with you in detail. Our special guest today is Travis Moh, a media buyer who understands copywrit...
Aug 26, 2024
I would say our guest today Will Siebler takes a Zen approach to copywriting. On the home page of his website, he has a picture of a lonely but sturdy coffee cup on a table. On the coffee cup is the word “Begin.” But the shimmering peace is shattered by a few words overlayed on the picture: “I’m Will. I write words that make your clients say, ‘Shut up and take my money!’” It’s a quiet confidence you just don’t see that often in copywriters. Will has had his own marketing and copywriting business...
Aug 19, 2024
Listen to this: “A perfect summer day is when the sun is shining, the breeze is blowing, the birds are singing, and the lawn mower is broken.” That’s from author and sportswriter Jim Dent, and it perfectly captures how a lot of us feel in the summertime. Lazy and happy to be so. And that’s fine. But don’t mistake your state of mind for the state of business. While more retail sales happen in November and December than they do in July and August, business is still very active. People want things....
Aug 12, 2024
It’s a double-edged word that doesn’t get talked about enough. And that word is: confidence. It definitely has a bad connotation, as in “con artist” or “confidence man.” But on the flip side, and with a different meaning, it’s a very important, positive word. I would say in some very straight-laced business circles, it’s the only emotion you can talk about freely without raising eyebrows or causing questions about your strength and resolve. Most important of all, though, is that confidence can m...
Aug 05, 2024
