¶ Intro / Opening
Hey, I am Bruce Weinstein and this is the Podcast Cooking with Bruce and Mark.
And I'm Mark Scarborough, and together with Bruce, my husband, we have written 36 cookbooks. We're publishing our 37th this summer cold canning, and we're gonna be talking a little bit about that, about some various categories of preserved things that sometimes cause, uh, definition problems. Let's just say we've got a one minute cooking tip as per usual, and we'll tell you what's making us happy in food this week. So let's get started.
¶ Our one-minute cooking tip: use a salt brine to get the smell of cut onions and garlic out of cutting boards.
Our one minute cooking tip. And guess what? I'm not doing it this week. Mark is.
I am. 'cause it's mine. And here it is. Did you know you can get the smell of onions and garlic out of wooden and sometimes plastic cutting boards with a little salt water brine. This is an old Julia Child trick, and if you find that your cutting boards have a bit of an onion or garlic smell to them, even after washing them with soy water, if you make a brine. Of, oh, about, let's say a one part, salt to five or six parts, water, and then you use that to wash down the cutting board.
You can get the smell of onions and cut garlic out of
it. And why wouldn't we just put salt on the cutting boards and rub that in?
Well, because it can abbra it and you don't wanna nick up the wood on a wooden cutting board if you don't know. By and large wooden cutting boards have better microbial resistance than plastic ones do. That's because wood has a natural microbial deterrent in its chemical structure. So in general, wooden cutting boards are preferred.
Yeah. And also those plastic ones, when you make those knife cuts and knife grooves in them, moisture can get locked. Into those grooves and it never dries out. Whereas wood, it gets absorbed deeper into the wood and it does dry out, which will also kill microbes when it's dry.
Yeah, that's right. And you'll notice that neither of us is talking about glass cutting boards at all.
I don't even understand the point of glass cutting boards. What a great way to both ruin your knife. Yes. And it's the most awful sound and feeling in the world to cut on a glass cutting board.
Some of us like the sound of, of, of, uh, fingernails on chalkboard. But, for the rest of us, that's apparently a bad sound glass cutting
board. That's like an oxymoron.
It does ruin your knives. You really, if you have a glass cutting board, should think about switching to wood, although they are expensive. Okay, that's our one minute cooking tip about salt brine and cutting boards with the smell of gut onions and garlic if you would like. To know more about this podcast, we have a Facebook group cooking with Bruce and Mark posting videos. There you can see us making various salsas and, uh, nachos and talking about the cookbooks, all that kind of stuff.
And there's always a place where you can tell us what's making you happy in food this week, each week after the podcast. So check out that Facebook group in
¶ The differences among preserves, marmalades, njams, jellies, savory jams, conserves, and chutneys.
otherwise, let's move on to the curious difference between some things that get put. In canning jars and the ways these things are often confused, one with another. So let's get started
most of the time you open a jar of jam or jelly, but there's so much more on the shelves in the store and on the shelves of people who put this stuff up like marmalades and preserves and all sorts of things. Conserves, chutneys, so. What are the differences between these things?
I just wanna say that I think a lot of people use the terms jams and jellies to mean a lot of these things. And in fact, those are actually very specific items, jams and jellies. So we wanna talk about that. And let's start right at the top with the biggest category. Well, I guess no, the biggest fruit or vegetable category, which is preserves and marmalades.
Yeah, and I think what makes them the biggest fruit is that these are the things made with the biggest. Pieces of fruit, right? When you have a marmalade, which is usually a citrus based, preserve, Usually orange I think was the traditional, a bitter orange. Although you can get sweet orange marmalade, I think it's kind of disgusting, but bitter orange marmalade is the perfect marmalade. It's either has. Big chunks of orange where it has just pieces of orange
rind. One type of reason I found, I think we were at Dean in DeLuca in the city in New York City. We were somewhere we found an orange marmalade that was literally mandolin or really thin slices of orange. A small orange just stacked up in a jar with, yeah, with all of the jellified orange juice around the, but it was really just a jar of stacks of thin slices of orange. Oh, it was so
good because they'd been. Poached and cooked in this sugar syrup and they were like spoon tenders. You could dig through them, right? And then they were put in this jar so carefully and beautifully with that syrup poured over them. I, I aspire to be able to do that, but I can guarantee you I don't do it very often 'cause first of all, you have to get oranges that are exactly the size of your jars. Yeah. That's probably why they were charging like $35 a jar for that particular orange marble leg.
How much it
was. But it was expensive.
Yeah. And preserves. Are non citrus based whole fruit preserves. Sweet. They're they're sweet. They're very sweet. So like blackberry preserves will have whole chunks of blackberry in it, right? And strawberry preserves might have entire strawberries in that jar inside that syrupy jelly-like mixture.
And this is why when you go to the store, if you look for things to put on toast or peanut butter and jelly sandwiches or whatever, preserves are often the most expensive because of course the manufacturer must preserve in some sense the whole fruit. So the strawberry preserves have strawberries in them. Oh, when I was a kid, there was this uh, uh, strawberry preserve manufacturer. I think it was in Texas, in Oklahoma.
I grew up in Texas and I think it was around there and it was called Best of the Crop. I'm not making this up, and it would come. Out the strawberry preserves once a year and it was very limited production, and my mother would wait until best of the crop. Strawberry preserves appeared on the shelves because it was whole strawberries in a ified syrup, and she would buy them and they would this huge splurge. Now Bruce makes a similar thing and in fact.
In our upcoming book called Canning, there is something with this French preserves in which you, uh, preserve the whole strawberries inside the preserves. I get this
technique, so I take the strawberries and I layer them in a big bowl with sugar overnight, so now the strawberries are condensed down, but they're still whole, they've given off so much of their liquid. And you bring that liquid to a boil and you cook it. Then you put the whole strawberries in for a few minutes. Pull them out. 'cause now they've released even more. Then let the syrup cook down again. You put the whole berries in again.
It's just this whole process where you end up with these beautiful jewels of candied strawberry inside. Side this syrup, it's very much like that sliced orange marmalade. Only it's strawberries. Mm-hmm. And the inspiration for that mm-hmm. Came from something made by a British company tip tree. And tip tree makes a strawberry preserve that they have made forever called.\ Little Scarlet and Little Scarlet are these tiny, almost wild strawberries,
right? They're almost French deis
and they preserve them whole, just like this French technique. And it's even back in the eighties. So we're talking 40 some odd years ago. It was $10 a jar, and my grandmother was, that was her big splurge. She would buy tip trees a little scarlet, and that was her thing, but it was also my grandmother's. So she would eat like one strawberry out of it a week.
Yeah. No, no, no. But we went to, uh, Bruce's cousins in Washington to sea a few weeks ago and visited them for the weekend, and we brought them homemade preserves as a house gift, and we had breakfast with them. The next morning after we'd seen them, of course, we got up and had breakfast and they put out our preserves, and I think they were dumbfounded that Bruce and I essentially ate half a bottle of one of them.
I don't understand why people don't know how much preserves you're supposed to put. I don't care whether it's jam, jelly or preserve. Shell used should be shellac. They, they put like the thinnest, thinnest coating on there. Right? We have very close friends, uh, live near us who I give my jams to all the time, and they'll have a jar of it that lasts them like three months. And I'm like. How did that last you? Three months. Okay. Since you said that it lasts me, me, three minutes. All
right. Since you said that, we're gonna move on to the next category you said I give my jams to. So we're gonna move on to jams because this is probably the most, uh, popular or the largest category of these, um, jams as opposed to preservers. In marmalades jams are made from fruit. Pulp. Mm-hmm. So it's fruit that has been mushed up in some way, or cooked up in some way so that it has broken down, but it is still pulpy.
And you know, the best way to do that on your own is put gloves on and get your hands in that bowl of berries. Yes. It's,
it's a, we talk about this endlessly in cold canning is put on kitchen and gloves and go at it with your hands.
Your hands are the best tools you have in the kitchen. You should be using them for tossing salads, for mixing dressings into, coleslaw. So long
as you put on kitchen gloves or scrupulously, clean your hands.
I have even put on gloves to make. Chicken salad, tuna salad. It's like get your hands in your food. It is fun. It feels good, and you'll have a better distribution. And in terms of jams, you'll have a beautifully even mashup and you can control it so well. So you can have pieces of fruit, but not total mush. So if
you're making this at home, this is basically how it goes. If you're making blackberry preserves, you're gonna. Put the blackberries into the sugar syrup fairly late in the process so that they stay whole. If you're making blackberry jam, you're generally gonna put them in very early in the process, so they cook in the sugar syrup, and you're also gonna take, I don't know, a wooden spoon or a potato mash or something and mash them up during the cooking so that they're.
Pulpy, but inside of all of that sugar syrup,
potato masher is the next best tool you have after your hands. Plus, I wouldn't suggest putting your hands into a pot of boiling jam No, no. To continue to mash up that fruit. No. Because that's not a smart idea.
No. And this is all in contrast to jellies. So if preserves and Marleys are whole fruit and jams are made from fruit pulp, then jellies. Are made from fruit juice. Mm-hmm. This is the big difference. There's no pulp in it. Just think about grape jelly. It's smooth or strawberry jelly or I don't know what else is there? A blackberry jelly. It's smooth
and translucent. Yes. When you shine a light through it, you should be able to light up that jar. It should look right. Beautiful. It should glow. Some of them are clearer than others, like. Apple jelly you can actually see through. Right, of course. And I do a strawberry jelly that you could see through, but darker things like Mark said, concord, grape jelly in particular, you can't see through 'cause it's dark purple. But uh, green grape jelly you can see through Oh,
which we have a recipe for in the book. Gold canning for green grape jelly. But I should say that too, uh, while we're talking about this, that when getting light through even Concord grape jelly, we were able to get some light through it in the photo shoot for the book. But you can't get. Any light through Concord grape jam No. Or any light through strawberry preserves. Well, part
of why we got light through it is the extraordinary talent of Eric Medsker, a photographer based in Brooklyn, whose number one talent in life is light. Eric can create light that looks magical no matter what he's doing. He can, he photographed all the jams and jellies and chutneys that are in this book and they glow and they glisten and they look
gorgeous. Mostly shoots, cocktails. You can look him up on Instagram, Medsker, M-E-D-S-K-E-R, Eric Medsker, and you can see his cocktail shoots and, uh, his crazy shoots for our death and co and other big, uh, hip bars and all this stuff. And he gets amazing light inside of cocktails, so, okay. Just a review preserves our whole fruit jams or fruit pulp jellies, our fruit juice, which then leads us to an oxymoron category, which is savory jam.
Um, this is a whole different category in itself, and this is also a bit of a misnomer because given our definitions of what a preserve is and what jams are, and what jellies are. This should actually be called a savory preserve. It
should be, but
no one calls it that. Everyone calls it savory jam. And this is part of the difficulty and the definitions here,
and the word savory is confusing too. It would make you think there's no sugar, but there's a lot of sugar, of course, because you're making a jam. So it is a strange category, a savory jam. So let's imagine I have a sweet but not too sweet jam and the. Basic ingredient instead of raspberries or strawberries is onions. Mm-hmm. Or it's bacon. Mm-hmm. Or it's kimchi. Mm-hmm. Yes. I created a kimchi jam for this new book.
So a savory jam is, not a chutney because there's no spices and vinegars in it. We'll get to chutneys in a minute. It is strictly a savory jam. You
might know this. There was a very famous product that came out, oh my gosh. What? 20? 30 years ago, which is the Stonewall Kitchen's Savory Bacon Jam. Mm-hmm. Bacon, onion Jam or Bacon Jam. It was
their bacon, onion jam. It was one of their first products ever. It won them an award at the Fancy Food Show. Yep. About 25 years ago. It set
their career off it set those guys' career off in
Stone Kitchens. What? Put it's what? Put them on the map and from there they went on to do lots of other things. But yes, there. Bacon. Onion Jam was the first nationally distributed product that was like that. Yeah. Right. And it was earth shattering. You could put it on a burger. You can have it with roast chicken. You could mix it into chicken salad. I probably wouldn't put it on an English muffin to have with a latte in the
morning. No, no, no. That's the whole point is savory jams don't go on toast.
Well, what if you're having it with eggs? Butter. And then you have bacon
and No, I still think that's gross for me. That's gross. You could try it. But to me these are things for roasts, they're things to put on burgers, on hot dogs. They're, the savory jam is much closer to a, a true condiment. Mm. Even though it's sweet. It has sugar in it, but
ketchup is like by the number one condiment in the world and that is sweet. There's a lot of sugar in it. It so it makes sense. I mean, I could see, um, a bacon, onion jam, even on a hot dog. Of course, I could see it on a pastrami sandwich of course, because there's something about that sweet. Then with the smokey and, oh, I
don't think you're gonna get bacon onion jam in your kosher deli on a pastrami sandwich, but okay, go on dude. You can. Pastrami is
not. Only a kosher meat.
Oh, okay. Um, uh, your own relatives are gonna rise up and slap you right now, though.
My relatives whose idea of kosher was a separate pan for the bacon. Yes. They're gonna rise up and slap me for putting bacon jam on the pastrami sandwich.
Okay, so a savory gem is a bit, as we say, of an oxymoron. It's not really a gem, it's a preserve because the onions are pretty whole, the shallots are pretty whole, they're cut up mm-hmm of course into small bits, but they're, they don't dissolve into a mush in it. You
know what they are.
The bacon is, you know, in tiny little bits, but it's still in there.
And that's the funny thing, bacon. You think of bacon in the refrigerator as getting congealed, and the fact gets gross and it. Doesn't in this partly is you cook the bacon so long that there is no fat left, right? You render out every bit of fat from that meat, so it is only charred little chunks of bacon meat. And
Bruce mentioned kimchi cham, which is was spectacular. It was a revelation to me to have this, uh, sort of sweet product made with whole kimchi. So it's really spicy. But we should also say that there are carrot jams, there are bell pepper jams. These are. All part of this savory jam category. It doesn't have to include bacon. Mm-hmm.
In fact, you can just have shallot jam, which is part of this, uh, weird category of savory jams, which really, again, should be savory preserves, but nobody says that. So people say savory jams. Okay, so now we're gonna move on to the fifth in our list. So we've come through preserves and Marlon lights, and then we had jams, and then we had jellies, and then we had savory jams. And now we're moving on to a very esoteric. Uh, category, which is conserves
and conserves are interesting because the word conserve basically can almost encompass this entire category of what we're talking about, man. But in olden, in olden times, and if you look in old cookbooks and old things, a conserve was just a preserved. Thing.
Yes. But in UK parlance and in US parlance, a conserve has been restricted in its definition. So
what is that definition? Well,
one thing is a conserve is generally, not always, but generally is a very general rule. It's less sweet than anything we've currently been talking about. Less sweet than preserved jams, jellies, or savory jams in any way.
Less sweet is good.
Yep. And it's also often made with other. Aromatics. Sometimes there are tomatoes in the mix and usually there are nuts and toes. So think about, let's say a conserve with tomatoes, chilies, ginger, and almonds. Mm-hmm. And it's. Sweet. Without a doubt, it's still in this sweetish category, but it's moving away from anything you would put on toast. So it's
almost like a semi-sweet tomato jam with nuts and onions in it. Yes, that's right. Which is really an interesting condiment and it's a great thing to serve with roasted vegetables. Yes, it's a great thing to put on a roast beef sandwich.
Yes.
While I might. Put a savory jam on a burger, I would for sure put a conserve on a burger. Right. Because it's less sweet.
Right. In recipe testing, we made a tomato ancho conserve. Mm-hmm. And it's got ancho chilies, and tomatoes. And onions, and I think it has a bunch of, uh, southwestern spices in it. Maybe even I, I put pine nuts in that one. I maybe, and maybe even. Smoked paprika goes in it. Mm. So that it gets this very savory taste, although it is sweet and so it's perfect. A conserve for all kinds of meat applications, as they say in the food business. And ESP Bruce has roasted vegetables.
Now, I will say that in our book, we do have a blackberry conserve, and it's made with ginger and blackberries and all kinds of aromatics and
walnuts
and walnuts, and I do like it on toast, but I have to confess to you that I. Ask for that, uh, this Passover on the chopped liver. So there go, and we are recording
this the week before Passover. So the livers have been ordered and the blackberries are on the shopping list.
And I think you're going to hear this long after Passover, but okay. It's probably
going to be what's making you happy in food. Next week when we record the next batch of these was that blackberry conserve and my chopped chicken livers. Right?
So you, I I do like that blackberry conserv because it's. Blackberries on toast. It's less sweet than a traditional, uh, preserve or jam, but it's also really great on chopped liver. It would be great on pate, it would be great with cheese. Conserves are by and large good with cheese, especially soft runny cheeses. Even Brie, they're really great as a topper to those things. You probably know some of these, uh, conserves from like what's often called ginger jam. Just think if you kind of.
Bumped up the spice range of ginger jam and maybe even added some nuts to it. Well, yeah, I, you would get it very close to a conserve. I
think nuts are really a key. And also when I cook a conserve, I tend to cook them until they're a little firmer than jams and savory jams, which are a little more spreadable. Conserves are a little more dollop. I would think they're, I would think of a conserve almost as the texture of a, uh, a chunky cranberry sauce.
Okay. So. Again, go back. Preserves are the whole fruit jams are the fruit pulp jellies are the fruit juice. Savory jams is an oxymoron. The conserves are less sweet and include a lot of other aromatics and most often nuts. And now we come to the last category, which is the most difficult of these sweet. Uh, can preserved sweet canned things, which is a chutney, and there's a reason why this is difficult.
Well, it is probably my most favorite category of all of these. Okay. And part of it is as a chef making a chutney is much more flexible and forgiving than making any of the above category. And part of that is most chutneys are not going to use pectin. So I don't have to worry about my ratios as clearly, right. I'm not gonna have to say, well, how much sugar versus how much pectin to how much fruit? It's much more forgiving.
There's always a vinegar content, so there's a liquid added, the kind of sugar. I think that's key. Let's just stop
right there. I think chutney the key is that it has a vinegar. Mm-hmm. Or sour component. It does of some sort in most, but not all chutneys.
Right. And the kind of chutney that you would get in a standard American East Indian restaurant, like a mango chutney, mango chutney. It's easy to make because you dump everything in the pot at once. The sugar, the vinegar, the fruit, the ginger, the garlic, all the. Asian spices that go in there and you just cook it, and you cook it and cook it and cook it until it boils down and thickens and becomes the texture that you want it to become.
And that gives you the flexibility and the freedom to add other things. Do you want to add raisins? Do you want to add chopped apples? Do you wanna add celery? It is so flexible. That's why I like making them.
Now, here's why this is problematic, what we now think of as chutneys, which are vinegary sweet, savory condiment jam. Like preserve, like substances,
like mango chutney, like major gras chutney.
Yeah. And like major grays, chutney are actually a product of the Raj of the English. Overrun of India. And here's the deal. When the English overran India, remember from your history books in the East Indian Trading Company and all that bit, and the Raj, the English control of India, many traditional Indian foods were then CD through English cooking styles. And what happened here is that, um, traditional chutneys, and we'll get to those in a minute, traditional chutneys got sied through.
English jam making techniques and got crossed up into what most of us now think of as a chutney. In fact, that sort of jam like chutney is in fact the common chutney in India at this point. So it's a kind of backward, reverse, cross-cultural problem that goes on here. The original chutney is just to say. Were much drier. Yeah, and much fresher. They were not necessarily cooked?
Not always, no. No. They often were just things like cilantro and spices pureed up or chopped up with chilies in a mortar and pestle. Correct. And then what? Usually happens is, and they call it the tempering, but the spices that are used are fried and oil, and that spicy fried oil is imported on top. And that is the tempering moment of those cut
coconut in there too, right? There
can be, there's often there are. There are. Often, sometimes just coconut chutneys, which use fresh grated coconut and maybe chopped up cashews. And then these tempered spices. And that was what constituted a chutney. So it's like their colonizers came in, created something different out of what they were calling a chutney. Right? And then the indigenous people liked it. Yes, exactly. And it stuck and it went worldwide.
Exactly. I I, I mean, I think that this is the same problem with, uh, n not to step on a landmine here, but this is the same problem with Navajo fry bread. It's not necessarily intrinsic to the culture, but over centuries it has become intrinsic to the culture because it's actually taking this dough that probably was baked and then frying it now in oil, and now of course we think of it.
As part of indigenous culture, and even indigenous people think of it as part of their culture, but it's a weird cultural mix that has happened. And I should tell you just before we, uh, move on, on chutney, I should just say that what we're telling you is a bit controversial in food historian parlance. Not all food historians agree that what happened is that these fresh and relatively dry, or as Bruce suggests.
Fried oily chutneys got passed through English techniques to create what we now think of as major grays or mango chutney, et cetera. Um, in fact, some people will say, no, that's not true. And actually other things happen to create these. But the bulk of food historians hold to this story about how what we now called chutney came about. So chutney, people think of it as mango, but it's not right.
Chutney is anything you can make a plump chutney is anything. It could be made from grass clippings. Well, it would be interesting to try a grass chutney. Oh, gross. Look, mango chutney. The base fruit is mango. Then you add garlic and ginger and celery and carrots and chopped apples. But you could make a similar chutney where your base fruit is plums. Oh yeah. About that. That's what we have in the house
right now is plumb. Chutney.
I make a plumb chutney every year from Santa Rosa plums that my sister sends me from her backyard trees in California. Yep. And I chop up the plums and I add vinegar and sugar and brown sugar and celery and garlic and onions and ginger, and I add mustard seeds and cloves and it cooks down into this sweet and sour and spicy and complex condiment that I put in everything, and my favorite way to use it is chicken salad. I buy a rotisserie chicken at the supermarket. I take all the meat and off.
I throw the bones and skin away. I get my hands in there and I smush up that meat and I add in mayonnaise and more chopped celery. And a big dollop of this plumb, chutney and a L curri powder. And nuts. I had lots of chopped walnuts too.
Yeah. Well, I think that it is really interesting to think about chutneys as beyond man coke, because most of us think of major grays, and I will confess that I'm not a fan of major gray's chutney, so I didn't know much about chutney until I met. Bruce and Bruce was a kind of chutney connoisseur already when I met him 28 years ago.
So I learned a lot more, and I learned that there was a world beyond, beyond major gras that includes all kinds of crazy things like peach chutneys and apple chutney and tomato chutneys, all kinds of various fruit based chutney that move off into savory and even extraordinarily spicy renditions. Mm-hmm. To create chutney. So there's our rundown. Preserves of marmalades jams, jellies, savory jams, conserves and chutneys. Those are various sweet things that you can preserve and put in jars.
Our book called Canning, which is out this summer, has many recipes for these, but it's not all the book. In fact, these only make up about a third. Of this giant tome, cold, canning more on what's ahead for that later. But we wanted to just nail down the difference between these. Before we move to the last segment of this podcast, lemme say that it would be great if you could rate or like this podcast and even greater if you could write a review. Remember, this is an ad free podcast.
Think about that. How many podcasts do you listen to that have no ads? This is an ad free podcast. We wanna keep it that way, and one of the ways you can help us is by either rating it, can I ask for five stars? Or. Even better dropping a review, which keeps it fresh in the algorithms. Thanks for doing that.
¶ What's making us happy in food this week? Smoked salmon salad and and the kale salad at Mecha Noodle Bar.
Okay, onto what's making us happy in food this week.
Hot smoked salmon salad, or as my family used to call it, baked salmon salad, baked salmon salad. So our local supermarket here in New England has started carrying this smoked salmon called honey smoked salmon, that's like the brand name, and it was on sale. So I bought a couple packages in Each package is an. Eight ounce piece of hot smoked salmon. And it is so smoky that when I opened the package, it smelled like jerky. I mean, that's how smoky it is.
Mm. And I decided yesterday that a piece was sitting in the refrigerator too long, ea. So I opened the package. I. Took the skin off, I threw it in the food processor with more mayonnaise than you can imagine. And I word it up. I put in about a tablespoon of sweet pickle relish and it was homemade hot smoked salmon salad, and Mark devoured the entire container, leaving me only a spoonful to taste. But it is what made me happy. This
week I came home from teaching Flannery O'Connor for two hours. I ended up eating smoked Ella, which was kind of great. Kind of a nice antidote to FLA O'Connor. Um,
I bet she never had smoked salmon salad. I bet she
didn't either. Uh, so, so it goes, uh, I guess what's making me happy in food this week is something from a chain of restaurants that has actually blown across the country and they're growing exponentially, and that's MEChA Noodle Bars. So shout out to MEChA, M-E-C-H-A, MEChA at Noodle Bar. They may be in a city where you live, and I have to say their kale salad is, mm-hmm. Just spectacular. It's, it's made with a miso vinegarette. It has golden uh, raisins in it.
It Bruce and I go to MEChA Noodle Bar just to order the Kale Caesars so well. I've never had
a salad like that. There go. 'cause it is half fresh kale and half deep fried kale. Yeah. So you have these super, super, super crunchy bits and these super fresh but still crunchy bits and the beautiful dressing. They always
top it with the avocados. They stop. Mm-hmm. It's
worth the drive for us. To go where they are, which is about an hour and 20 minutes away.
So we love MEChA Noodle Bars. Kale, salad. Okay, that's the podcast for this week. Thanks for joining us, and thanks for being a part of this journey. We appreciate your time in this vast podcast landscape. Thanks for being with us. A long to talk about food and cooking
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