Podcasthon: IWDG and IWT

This is podcasthon episode of the Conservation and Science Podcast. What is podcasthon you ask? It's a global initiative where podcasters across the world dedicate one episode of their podcast to the charity of their choice. And all those episodes are being published in one week to create a wave of awareness of various causes. And I decided to do one better. And I am featuring not one, but two Irish environmental charities.

And they are Irish Whale and Dolphins Group and the Irish Wildlife Trust. Alphabetical order. So I hope you will enjoy this episode. Links to both charities as well as to their podcast on the website are in the description of this show. So go in there and donate. Or maybe become a member of one or both of those charities. And don't forget to check other podcast home episodes that are being published this week.

White IWD, Irish Whale and Dolphin Group. Patrick Hooley, welcome back to the show. You are our guest in episode 87 and it's a pleasure now to welcome you back to the show for this podcast horn episode. It's it's a pleasure. I got an email yesterday from our CEO, Simon Barrow, and that, who who wasn't at the a miss Ames conference in Galway where I met you last. And Simon said, you've done stuff with this guy before. You kind of liked, written show. Excellent. I know it's a pleasure.

And there was pleasure to meet you at the conference and have you here again. Listen, this episode, it's a special episode where I'm showcasing Irish environmental charities and the Irish wares. And dolphin Group is one of the biggest and one of my favorite Irish environmental charities. Please tell us everything that we need to know about the Irish wearing dolphin group. Well, firstly, I'd have to clarify.

We're certainly not one of the biggest. I would say we're nothing like one of the business. We might be one of the busiest, but but certainly we, we, we kind of always I think, punch a little bit beyond our weight category. And people often assume that the Irish Way and the dolphin group is a very large NGO, with a staff of dozens and, you know, we're just bloody busy, where you could argue and on fact, I do increasingly argue that we're too busy.

And that to the point where almost the phone can be going out of it, you know, these these, these these are not high powered, well-paid jobs, Rory. And I'm that, sometimes I think the most important word is there is no, but for me, when I, when I was asked if I, I'd have a chat with you, I just, I couldn't help myself, but, via the Irish whaler dolphin group, I just to go back to the start.

I mean, where, established in 1990. Kind of the king, the linchpin or the king, then the the whole thing was really Simon Barrow.

And believe it or not, you know, 35 years later, Simon is is still very much, sort of, a central character in the Irish Whale and Dolphin group, sort of where he gets his energy from, but, you know, listen, we have grown considerably from then, I mean, or up to about, you know, 7 or 8 years ago, we didn't have, you know, we we probably didn't have a single paid officer in the group that's kind of changed. Now, you know, we do have roles, that, you know, we, we, we advertise on that.

So with that, I'm talking about marine policy officers, science officers and the group. You know, our remit is is getting wider and this getting bigger. We're more involved now in areas that we historically kind of didn't really get involved in. I'm thinking in particular of, the whole issue of live strandings, is one of my, my role in the group has always been sightings. So I, I deal with things that are alive and free, swimming in the ocean.

And then, you know, that's a subset or a subset of, of all of those living animals is a percentage of the population that are dead and dying. So we have a stranding officer, Stephanie Levac. And Stephanie handles dead and dying things on beaches, or should I say dead things on beaches, because now we're going into more the welfare side of things where we're looking at, whales of dolphins and porpoises that are still alive when they strike.

And so it's a it's not so much a, a conservation or population level thing that's more a welfare issue for the individual animal. And it's something that, you know, over the years we've we've kind of skirted around a little bit, but it wasn't a core area for the group because we were as a conservation group, once you use the word conservation, you're thinking, you know, health of populations and you're not necessarily looking at the health of individual animals.

But there's a bit of a gray line there. You know, if you've got, if you've got a rare species of whale or dolphin and you've got even one of them is alive on the beach, or what? What happens if you've got 20 or 30 of them alive on a beach? Well, then that is potentially a conservation issue. So it is important that that, you know, it's just one example of new areas that the Irish whale and dolphin group is getting involved in.

So I you should say that we were there were where it was, we were two sides of a coin, the sightings. And then you flip the coin and you get strandings. And now we're becoming more like a three legged bar stool. So you've got the sightings, the live strandings and the dead strandings. And that's that in their core. Is, is, is is what the Irish whale and off a group does.

What are they community engagement initiatives like I'm sure you're doing like a lot of like an outreach and engagement with community. So I'd like to hear about that. And you know, how people who would like to get involved, how what they can do. What what are they? The easy answer to that question to me is, you know, how can people get involved? They can always join, you know? Yeah, become a member.

Now. You don't have to join to be, you know, you can just subscribe to our ezine and you get a monthly saying, in fact, that the next thing I need to do after talking to you is do a write my piece of the monthly easing. So there are lots of levels. I mean, you cannot be involved at all. You can just be a subscriber to our or you can put your hands in your pocket and you can give us 20 or €30, whatever it is. And become a member.

I, I just got my, my member's magazine, in post in the post this morning. So I'm actually also a paid member. Just because you're an officer of the group, I still have to pay my €35 membership. So that's the sort of thing we do for members. You know, we we, we send out or we try to send out to, full color, flush magazines to our members.

You know, we also offer, I've just put live this morning on Eventbrite to, workshops that we have this summer and see and left and these are sizing workshops where we introduce people to the concept of whale watching, where we talked about biology and ecology of whales and dolphins, how to watch them. We bring them up to the headlands and we do some launches. We take them out in boats and they get to listen to my my dulcet tones for 2 or 3 days.

But we also have, stranding workshops like live Stranding workshops. So my colleague Gemma, she wants the what she needs.

So wave a little bit later in the year, because of weather and swell and tides, but she will be delivering live stranding workshops with inflatable rescue pontoons and inflatable whales, demonstrating to people the the the craft of how to, safely, put in that, an animal back into the water so that everybody isn't pulling, pulling it by the tail and dislocating their vertebrae. In March we have Whale Tales, which is an event that we host every year or two.

But this year it's in the Carlingford Loch, up in County Down. So this this is a year we've decided that it's been quite a while since we've done anything in Northern Ireland, because we are an old Ireland NGO. So this will be, an opportunity for people to if you're in the Dublin area, it's only an hour north of you. If you're in the Belfast area, it's only 45, 50 minutes south of you. So only people who join us at Whale Tails, which is, in.

Let me just get the dates. It's, March the 7th to the line. So it's a weekend event, and we have our keynote speaker, Andrew Stevenson, describing it all the way from Bermuda, to give a talk. Now, we he did have business in London anyway. So he's taking you on a trip just in case you're worried about our air miles an hour, our contribution to climate change. But, yeah. So that's going to be a really good event.

So we're hoping, you know, if people in particular in the north of Ireland or the northeast would like to, you know, learn more about the group and become involved so they can sign up for a whale trail. So there's an opportunity for people who are like minded to get together and, shoot the breeze over a very casual. We like to keep these things quite informal. On the top of your invited tune. So if you want to come up, come and join us.

Thank you so much. I definitely take you up on that porridge. What changes do you see over the years, like the, the, the group is, you know, many, many years in, you working for many years, like, what are the biggest changes you're, you can see are they related to climate change? Are they related to, attitudes towards, whales and dolphins in terms of, you know, area that you're working on? Well, there's no doubt that the, the level of awareness has been, you know, has been enormous.

I mean, like, you know, we we still here today, people, you know, no matter how many times does a whale story or no matter how many times you know, or the news or social media, have a whale story, you know, you still hear it all the time. Just like I saw that piece of, news last night. I had no idea there were whales in Ireland. And you're going, wow, 35 years later, you know, sort of, you know, it is amazing. But we do hear that less and less.

So I do think the message is getting home that Ireland, you know, we are very fortunate. Irish inshore coastal waters are certainly one of the best places in the northeast Atlantic to observe whales. You know, just even sitting out on the headland. I was talking to a girl yesterday, I bumped into in Killarney and she was going back to Waterford. And en route she stopped off at Bailey Cotton and she was watching fin whales and humpback whales blowing off paddy cotton.

So, I mean, this is actually a great time of year, especially along the south coast, to see whales. Which surprises people. But, you know, there has been a big increase in awareness, obviously, in the dark years. Like if you were asking me now, I would say about big whales like fin and humpback whales, you know, 20 years ago I'd be telling you very different things. So what I'd be telling you now in terms of what times of the year do we see them, how long are they staying?

Where are they occurring? All of that has utterly changed. And I think, you know, I can't say exactly how much of that is related to climate change. You know, everything getting warmer in the ocean. I can't say how much of that is due to the fact that we're we're hammering. We continue. And the Irish government continues to allow big, wealthy fishermen with big, powerful boats. These are the biggest fishermen in Ireland.

Hammer stocks of forage fish that are so critical for the entire ecosystem of our coastal waters. So? So we're doing a really good job down here in West Cork, completely destroying that stock. And, you know, we're seeing a response from the whales to the whales. You know, about ten, 15 years ago, they started moving from West Cork. They started moving to Carey.

And now the very same whales, I mean, know by the photo identification work we're doing, those very same whales are now moving up to places like the male coast and the Donegal coast. Ultimately, if they keep tracking north, they'll just leave Ireland altogether and we'll go back to the way we were in the 1960s and 1970s and 1980s, when nobody ever saw whales in Ireland. So you know what? It's the goose that lays the golden egg.

And if we decide, just for short term greed, that we don't really give a damn about marine, the marine environment, well, then we just need to keep doing exactly what we're doing now. The government authorities, just needs to continue doing exactly what they're doing now, which to me, looks like very, very little. You know, they're great at putting out big consultations.

The great are getting thousands and thousands of people to write into those public consultations, where 99% of people replying to them are saying the exact, exact same thing. This madness has got to stop. And yes, once again, the fishing industry was the big lobby lobbyists for the fishing industry. They've got very, very deep pockets and they can pay for senior counsel to find the tiniest little, you know, weakness in us. And they'll exploit that weakness. And then it goes to, a higher court.

And it's thrown out because of some absolute nonsense. And yet 99% of people, you know, agree that, you know, this ban on big pot boats feeding in our bays and our estuaries, needs to come in. I actually doubt if it comes in in the morning in West Cork. It's quite possible it's already too late for us. Because there are some people who would say that those populations are fish a little bit like our herring, like our surprise that they're endemic to an area.

And once they're gone, they're gone because, you know, it's not like they could just repopulate if they're endemic to an area. They can't. And if we take the likes of, the herring here in the 1960s and 1970s that were hammered to the point where, you know, the last shoal was fished out in 30 years, they've never returned. And they're still, you know, a ban on fishing for herring and what used to be an industry that employed hundreds of fishing boats. So, you know what?

You go for short term greed, and then, you stop thinking about the next generation that are coming true. And, you know, we would love to see a thriving fishing industry, but a couple of boats, a couple of big boats that are doing this, they're they're just going to keep hammering us and then keep doing it probably until the very last splash and the very last herring is gone. And that is where the very last whale will be gone. And the very last seabird and the very last seal.

And, you know, and all of the fish species that we eat. So really, it's, it's we really do need to look really seriously. Not just us, but at the whole concept of forage fish, because these are at the very bottom of the food chain. And if you've got if things have got so bad now that the big Irish pelagic pair of trawlers are fishing, what's up? The very bottom of the food chain. Well, then you have to ask the question. You know, what? Will they be fishing in ten years? Gone.

What will we be fishing for? Plankton. Because that's that's actually the way we're going. We'll be like the Chinese down in Antarctica. We'll be fishing for cradle and fishing for plankton. And then what we will no idea what they'll be fishing for after that, because there ain't nothing left. There's no nets small enough, to catch anything smaller. And krill are plankton. But, you know, that's where we're going, you know?

So really, I think, the new government ministers that we saw rolling up, and I'm thinking of the in particular the, the Minister for the environment and the new junior minister for the environment. And he's a good friend of ours, Chris O'Sullivan, West Courtney's, and he's really keen on this whole issue. So I, I'm hoping that this new cohort of politicians coming in, will take heed to the likes of these issues, Tommy, that you do such a good job of showcasing. Thank you so much.

And like we said many times on the podcast, the the issue of big boats, which are not only like an environmental issue, but like you said, the local fishing communities are also, heavily impacted by that. But just to wrap this up, how would success look like for Irish whaler dolphin Group in 2025, 2026? And going forward? I listen, there's a really easy answer to that one is to finally bring in this ban on big pelagic patrollers.

And you know, what I would say is that, which 99% of coastal Ireland, what if that ban was to come in, you know what there'd be there'd be almost no need for feces and no need for marine protected areas, because that Brown was what would encapsulate everything that is wrong with Irish coastal waters at the moment. But obviously you've got our offshore water, so we want to see these MPAs and the government really running out of time here.

They were supposed to declare, you know, 30% of Irish, territorial waters as marine protected areas, and we haven't even seen the primary legislation that will enable that to happen. So I'm thinking, my God, when when I heard about this three years ago, I thought, My God, you know, the wheels of government in Ireland move really slowly.

And it is absolutely inconceivable at this stage that three years after the whole or two years after the old Ferris's concept, kicked off of which the Irish Rail on Dolphin Group is only one of about seven or 6 or 7 partners. But, you know, we really do need to see that legislation introduced.

So that the likes of the National Parks and Wildlife Service can, can start dedicating, you know, resources to managing and monitoring these, and making sure that they're not just paper parks, but to make sure that they are protected areas that that have a certain amount of clout, you know, so marine protected areas, getting these big, people often think that this damage, the fishing damage has been done by big nasty overseas trawlers. It's not we're doing all this ourselves.

These are Irish owned boats. So if you're listening out there, guys, and there's only a handful of you, but you do have very big, powerful boats. We do need to bring in that legislation. That that to me, is what success would look like in the next year or two. Ladies and gentlemen, Irish workers in dolphin Group. Thank you very much, Patrick. Thanks, Tommy.

All right, folks, and, another Irish charity and the one that is very close to my heart, Irish Wildlife Trust. Kieran, welcome to the show. Thanks. Very happy to be here. Excellent. Isn't. Tell us everything that we need to know about the Irish Wildlife Trust. What is the history of what you do at the moment? And the, you know, like, everything that people need to know about Asia left? Sure. Yeah. Well, we do have a bit of history.

We're one of the, probably one of the longest established, nature charities in Ireland. So I'll start with that. That, Yeah, we're non-government organization and charity. We're all about protecting nature, protecting and restoring nature in Ireland. But, yeah, we've been around a while. We were founded in 1979. So we've been active for over 40 years. And even though, yeah, we're not the biggest charity going, but we've, we've certainly been around for a while.

I'm working hard for nature that time. So yeah, we got started back in 79 and, a few sort of early things where we would have got David Attenborough over to sort of do a talk in Ireland. And then we were all about back then we were very focused on, you know, engaging people with sort of the more scientific side of nature and like promoting sort of recording nature and sort of natural history, science side.

But then we do get more into what we're probably more known for now, which is the, you know, being a voice for nature and, and lobbying and running campaigns. Like in 1981, we would have run a campaign to try and get arm to join the International Whaling Commission, because we weren't actually we were, for whatever reason, the the then leader, it was not, charity. I was not really, signing yet.

So we just we ran a campaign where we sort of put a bit of pressure on to, to join the International Whaling Commission and, sort of, I think our four founding sort of members like, brought a big float of a whale down O'Connell Street and, and brought a lot of attention to it and did a great job. And so we did, you know, Ireland did sign up to the, to ban whaling in our waters and signed up permission. So that's quite like an early story of, first taste of campaigning.

And we've kept going from there, just with the mixture of, of campaigning for nature, but also raising awareness about about Irish species and habitats. So nowadays, like our vision is in Ireland, where wild nature thrives and society enjoys the benefits of coexisting with like, diverse, functioning ecosystems. So that's that's it in a nutshell. That's what we're looking to get towards.

And we do that through a few different ways, like mostly through education around nature, sort of connecting people with nature, getting people out into nature, learning about us. And then through the advocacy side, which will be the same sort of things I mentioned, like lobbying politicians, running campaigns that are submitting to public consultations. We're sort of trying to drive the agenda to restore and protect nature that way.

And then our sort of we have a few sites, nature reserves, which is probably something we're going to build more over the next few years of actually doing a bit of that kind of rewilding work ourselves in the hope that it will, you know, inspire other, other organizations, other people. So that's us at the moment. Shift overall, like how would you describe nature in Ireland? Like in what shape is, is the nature in Ireland and what are the biggest challenges?

What are the biggest, you know, challenges that you try to address or maybe that the nature is facing in Ireland? Well, I suppose nature in Ireland, is not in great nick. It would be, I suppose, the quickest way to say it. But it's not too late, you know, there is still plenty of beautiful species and habitats out there in Ireland, but it's been depleted a lot.

And so this is something that maybe the a lot of people are aware of, because Ireland's got a reputation for being green, you know, and, it is it is very beautiful and does have some lovely wild spaces. But, essentially nature in Ireland is in a, in a state of being really quite depleted, over the years probably, you know, going back quite a long way to when we were initially started farming here thousands of years ago, and then other stuff like the extractive, practices of the British Empire.

And then right up to today, when we the way we farm, the way we do our forestry, the way we do our fishing is still actually putting a huge amount of pressure on, on nature in Ireland. So unfortunately, the nation of Ireland is not in Great Neck and under a lot of pressure. But, it's still there. You know, it's not too late to try and restore it and protect it. You asked about the main pressures. Like there's lots of pressures.

I suppose, at sea and we do campaign, and work with some marine issues. I see the. So overfishing, so very, very like, industrial levels of fishing will be a big one, that you could point out pretty, pretty quickly.

But there are lots of other pressures as well in the ocean, you know, so like the development of, you know, infrastructure for transport, ports and things and, and also then coming down the line potentially, wind power as well will be all these things to be putting different pressures on the ocean.

And then on land, I suppose one of the bigger the big two that you look at quite quickly would be the way we do forestry and the way we do agriculture with both, you know, not particularly nature friendly. Overall there are there are great examples of nature friendly farming in Ireland. Some examples, not many of nature friendly forestry.

So yeah, there'd be some pressures on, land. Yeah. So a lot to, a lot going on and, but the solutions to all of this, you know, there's, there's ways of making farming more nature friendly. There's ways of making forestry more nature friendly. And there's ways of making them managing our sea, better. So we at the Irish Wildlife Trust, we feel our role is, is to just bring awareness to these solutions and then, you know, sort of shout for them really.

And obviously anyone who's listening to this and these the state of nature and future of nature in Ireland is dear to their heart. They can join Irish Wildlife Trust. Please tell us, you know, what are the best way how to join the Irish Wildlife Trust and then what you folks offer for, members. I know that you're issuing a magazine and there are many webinars and other things.

So if you could just get, you know, laid out to our listeners and viewers what they can expect if they join, like, how are they going to contribute to Irish nature? Yeah. So I kind of we went in heavy there on the old, the threats to nature, the pressures. But it's good to certainly, to speak of, speak to that straight away because that's, that's very, very important. Our membership would, you know, it involves some more fun stuff. So yeah, anyone can join.

We're pretty much like a standard charity in the sense that you can pop on to our website, IWK. And become a member. And it's, you know, there's various rates as concession, family and, and standards. We also have a junior membership for it for kids. So, and all members will get our magazine, which we produce quarterly.

So for the, for the kids, we have a nice of junior supplement, which is colorful for those kind of simple little supplement that the junior members get quarterly, which teaches kids about nature, different habitats to species. And then for everybody else, you'll get the main magazine, which is, yeah, it's a full color, a beautiful magazine where we talk about what's going on with nature in Ireland.

We, we it pretty much covers those two themes that I might have mentioned at the start, which is firstly connecting people to nature. So information about nature, sort of looking at different species or different places where nature can be found and different habitats, plus that side of like promoting people to take action. So we want to sort of inspire hope through action.

So the magazine also features, you know, some different projects that are happening not just by us, but by other groups as well. So you can find out about things happening in Ireland to protect nature. So yeah. So when you become a member, it's easy enough on the, on the old, website, become a member and you'll get that beautiful quarterly magazine.

And then you'll be invited to our events now, thanks to the work of our local volunteer branches, we have events, certainly not in every county, but a nice spread, of events around Ireland. So places like Dublin, Waterford, Kerry, Limerick, are modern, you know, they're all fairly active at the moment in terms of our local volunteers who run events.

And the events are, are generally fun and kind of getting people out into nature, learning about nature, learning maybe sometimes about particular citizen science things or like how to identify dragonflies or or wildflowers or sometimes it's sort of just a nice walk in the woods or a bat walk. So the events are there as well for members to come to and throughout the year. So they'd be the two main things is magazine and events.

And then the knowledge that you're, you know, supporting our, our work down because you work on the engagement work. Tell us a little bit more about those local chapters of Irish Wildlife Trust. Sure. Yeah, we've had branches for quite a while, and they are well, first of all, they're voluntary run, which is fantastic. People are giving quite large amounts of their time to run these locally, these local branches.

It's not like the British Wildlife Trust swear they're independent, somewhat independent kind of agencies of their own or, you know, their own organizations in a federation. They are there is Irish Wildlife Trust is a national organization, and the branches are members of the trust. And they're they're sort of running activities in, in their own area. And doing a great job of it.

And, you know, they have a good bit of autonomy to decide what, what's their projects to work on and obviously decide what they want to do in terms of events and things. So, yeah, completely voluntary run. And the organization, it's central organization. So, you know, we'd support them with communications, you know, and obviously the things you need to run an event insurance and all that. So it works quite well. Which is good.

So for example, our we have a branch in Limerick that does they're, they're doing a lot of dragonflies and damselflies at the moment because there's really some passionate people there who know those creatures and they're, you know, they've formed a small group that they're surveying and monitoring dragonflies, damselflies and other insects. And they do run those big open events a couple of times a year for people to come to, you know, with the, with the family and, and just learn about nature.

Our Dublin branch run an event every single month, and they're always free and family friendly. So sometimes they'll go to to the coast to look at birds or the time to sail, go on a river walk. During the summer, we always do an event with them where we teach people about bumblebees and pollinators. So yeah, so the local branches are just great people who volunteer their time to run events and, local projects as well. Yeah. And I presume that

that those local boroughs, even if anyone wants to join as a volunteer to the local branch, they they also able to do so. Yes. So when you join as a member, we we ask you where if you're interested in any of the local branches and this is like a tick box thing, but then also their email addresses are on our website as well. So you don't have to, join first. You can actually just contact them through the emails on the website. Oh, excellent. Excellent.

And not long ago I was talking on the podcast about the importance of citizen science. So I guess people who are just just itching to do something and come by their passions into some, citizen science, they can they can join the Irish Wildlife Trust at one of the local branches. And I'm sure there's going to be plenty of work for them. And and they're going to be welcome. Yeah. Citizen science is brilliant. Yeah. Yeah. The organization as a whole, like, likes to promote citizen science.

We, we, we would always promote people, you know, engaging with existing citizen science surveys run by the likes of the National Biodiversity Data Center, for example. And so it's brilliant because it gets citizen science is kind of the two things together. You're connected with nature. You know, you have to spend time to do the citizen science outside like looking in that the bees or like looking at the, the plants.

So you're spending time connecting with nature, but you're producing the information data that can help the conservation effort as well. So for me, I've always that's how that's how I got started with the wildlife Trust was running citizen science projects. We did, we did a nude survey and a lizard survey, which they're not active right now anymore. But, that was how I got started. And so we're a big fan of, of that.

So while we're not running like a big nationwide survey of any particular species right now, we're always sort of, you know, trying to help people do citizen science, maybe teaching them some skills and just sort of promoting getting involved with the Biodiversity Data Center. So yeah, it's you're right. It's citizen science is a great one. Yeah, absolutely. And this is a great way for people to engage with the listen here.

Are you running any any projects at the moment the the big initiatives that are underway. We are launching our 2030 strategy, which is, you know, pretty much just reaffirming that we're committing to keeping doing what we said we've always done, which is building those kind of communities of people engage with nature.

So our our subscribed members, but also like our newsletter followers and generally people who who follow us, so we're continuing the building, the communities, we're continuing advocacy for nature. And we're going to put a bit more resources into that rewilding side of things. So projects at the moment, like with the advocacy, we spend a lot of time

the last few years trying to get the nature restoration law over the line, which it's now is. So what we'll be doing there now is trying to engage with the government, because they're now creating the nature restoration plan.

And for the for folks who maybe haven't been following this, it's it's a new piece of European law that basically requires member states to to try and reach certain targets to restore really important habitats in their country where things like, you know, natural woodlands, native woodlands, pollinators as well get their own kind of targets, and marine habitats. So it's a pretty and we think it's a pretty, good idea, this law.

And now because it just passed with a lot of kind of efforts and support from environmental NGOs, all the governments now need to produce a nature restoration plan. So that's going to happen in the next two years. So we're very much mobilized and trying to make sure that that's a good plan. You know, that that it's ambitious, it's realistic and has a lot of public engagement in it as well. So with the advocacy, that's something we're really, on at the moment.

So if you're on our mailing lists or whatever, you're probably be getting updates and maybe we'll let you know any opportunities to engage with that process. Other things we're really like shouting for is marine protected areas. We've been private members of a campaign called Fair Seas for the last, three and a half, maybe four years. And Paris's is really just like it's a coalition of other environmental of environmental NGOs. So Irish water trusts, Irish.

We're on dolphin group, bird watch Island, stream scapes though loads of different groups and, it's supported by the Irish Rainbow Network, and Swan Island. So we're all just kind of shouting together for marine protected areas. We're not, we're not going to stop that anytime soon. So. Yeah, that that's another one that we're really working on at the moment, is trying to get the government to take action to produce, like to designate more marine protected areas.

And one way we're we're calling on that is new legislation to be to be published and, and brought into force that allows for designating more marine protected areas, but in a really good way, with a lot like, a lot more public consultation than what had happened before. Like a really good sort of ecologically coherent network of MPAs is what we're looking for. So that's exciting because we know how marine protected areas work and they can help marine ecosystems, fish communities, etc.

like bounce back when they're done. Right. So Ireland is an island nation. You know, we've got this beautiful sea surrounding us, the Atlantic Ocean and everything. So yeah, we're happy to be PM working on that right now. So that's probably some of the campaigns you'll see, us shown about over the next few months and years. Very well. Yeah. And then the, the new project of, of trying to do a bit more rewilding. So we own a few small nature reserves.

And we'd like to, to acquire maybe 1 or 2 pieces of land where we can do some rewilding and, you know, showcase it like that, that, the public know about what's happening there and, and just sort of get behind that rewilding efforts. Because that goes back to our vision, which is like in Ireland, where wild nature thrives and there's so many benefits to people when that happens. All the seed benefits to, to nature itself. So, that's exciting.

We're not we wouldn't call ourselves a really a, a leading rewilding organization right now. We're not doing huge amounts of it in practice, but we've always been advocates for it. And now we want to start doing a bit more ourselves. So there's a few things. Yeah. Key things come up. Excellent. This is this is fantastic because the nature restoration law we we covered nature restoration law from various angles on this podcast many times. And I'm sure the listeners are well aware of that.

Marine protected areas also were covered in length. And rewilding, it's like one of the staple topics. So I'm sure that they do that. Yeah, I'm sure the audience is very familiar with all of that. And that is just, should should make them want to join the Irish Wildlife Trust if they didn't already. Kieran, before we wrap this up, if you can wave the magic wand for nature in Ireland, well, that would be. Well, no pressure. I'm going to try and think.

I think big, rather than focusing on any one ecosystem or pressure. Really, what it comes down to is that unfortunately, there's a real lack of awareness as crept into humanity, about, the interconnectedness of everything and the fact that human beings are a part of nature and we seem to have tricked ourselves. We've done this great trick on ourselves where we think that we're separate from it, and we can go on with our own activities,

our own economy. And it's got nothing to do with nature that's, you know, we're slowly killing off. So if you could maybe wave the magic wand and make Irish people, everyone in the world really just kind of, appreciate the interconnectedness of humans with the rest of the natural world. I think that would probably just solve everything for me. Yeah, I think you're right. I think you're right. I never I never heard that answer, but I think you're right more than any other answer, folks.

The link to the Irish Wildlife Trust website is in a description of the show and going there. Subscribe to the newsletter. Subscribe to the newsletter. It is, it is the best way to keep in touch. And, Kiernan, thank you so much. Thanks for me. Thanks a million. It's nice to chat with you.