600: Tommy Siri

From Relay, this is connected, episode six hundred. Today's show is brought to you by Celford Inc., Appalach Fandera, powered by NerdWallet. I'm your keynote chairman, Federico Vittici, and it's my pleasure on this momentous day for connected history. to introduce my fellow chairman, the annual chairman, the one and only Mr. Stephen Hackett. Hello, Stephen. Hello Federico. What is 600 in Roman numerals? I meant to look it up. You just don't know this off the top of your head? I do not

Let's see. Oh, it's DC. Yeah. Huh. That's easy. Okay, DC. Disconnected. Mark connected. No duh. Like the like the de connected. The connected. And uh I am joined. He's not a chairman per se, but he could be, one day again, mister Mike Curley. Hello. He has the potential of chairmanship. yeah oh I've done it oh I've done it I've heard all of it you know I'm consolidated over here but not anymore you We were consolidated for a minute, right?

I was. I don't have anything. I'm not the draft champion right now either. Oh man. True man of the people over here. I'll come for it all at W W D C it'll be fine. Sure. Oh, sorry. I'll take it back then. Yeah, we're gonna be making picks in like five weeks or something. Bye. No Why would you bring that energy to this momentous day?

Uh Uh it is a momentous day for lots of reasons. Uh okay, we wanna try and do we wanna give some context to this and then we could talk about it again. So we spoke about this uh last month that At some point Federica and I Federico and I had made a bet about John Jan Andrea still being at Apple. It was a five dollar bet that on Friday, March twentieth, twenty twenty six,

Federico said he'd be gone. I would say he is still there. That date came and went and we decided he was gone because that's what Apple said, oh, he's gonna retire, whatever. But then Then April thirteenth, four weeks l three weeks later. John Genadrea, reporting from MacRumors, Apple's former head of artificial intelligence is set to leave the company this week as his final stock vesting date approaches. Okay. So He was still there.

Okay, so so Mark German says that he was doing something called resting investing. A very uh man of the people activity right there. He wasn't there. He was i he he was not ever there, right? Like they were just continuing to l let him wait so he could verb. He was in an advisory role. No, he was gone. No, no, no. He was gone. Okay. Gone. Could we Could we agree that it's a draw? Okay, that's good for you. But but he's gone. He was gone. It's definitely gone now. Yeah, and he was gone then too.

Resting investing. Yeah man, I need to do some resting and resting myself. Yeah. Right. I'm down for some rest investment. Rest invest. What a great what a great term. Like the things that have to have happened in your life that you could get to the point that you rest and vest is so unbelievable. It means that you were at one point so important that you got a ton of stock.

But then immediately it became not important, so you weren't allowed to work anymore. You had to wait and then get your money. Like I mean I think you I I think it happens when people retire uh you know, not not the way that he did,'cause he retired, you know. I think there's something poetic about sort of witnessing the downfall of yourself, you know? Yeah. Like

But no, but when you retire you can't wait to vest. That that's done, baby. You're you're have no option anymore. You you give it up the day you're done. That's the whole point of this. This is the golden parachute thing. Where they were like, We're we want to fire you but we won't. You you can leave on the day after you confessed your stock. Like that that's kind of the situation, right? And so it's like The scenario that has to happen for you to be allowed to do this is kind of incredible.

Go buy yourself a boat, Gina Andrea. Yeah. Yeah, uh hopefully not to swim to Hawaii because we know that you cannot get there. No he could have. It was the other guy that could have killed. They were all trying to swim to Hawaii but they didn't make it. That'd have a great track record for journeying to Hawaii. I f I can't remember that guy's name but I feel sorry for him too because that quote is I don't think it was Tommy. Tommy. Tommy Siri. Tommy's sick.

Tell me serious. That's very that's very Italian. I don't know why. Tell me serious. Um I would like to I know everyone's locked in on my backup situation. Uh so I want to give a further further feedback. So, um, my Dropbox is now fully downloaded. Onto my SSD. Somebody did write in to say that crucial SSDs have a habit of failing with APFS, so I have that potential thing to look forward to in my scenario. In my future.

I... I... Yeah. I don't think it's APFS specific, but I have had crucial SSEs die. We can all agree that that is a crucial piece of information to know. We all can't agree. So that so this may come up to become another problem later on down the line and I and then I will be sad and uh out of pocket. But it's just a backup, right? The stuff is still on Dropbox. Because there's a local copy of it. But it was an expensive thing to just die.

Yeah, uh I mean, especially in the year of our Lord twenty twenty six. I mean it's it's a flex that you bought such a big SSD, really. Well I needed one. Do you want to share with the class how much it was? I think I did, but it was six hundred pounds. Which look, that's way cheaper than an NVMe drive and it's way cheaper than what Apple would charge me. Maybe that's why it will fail. But we have that potential thing to look forward to in the future. Um

But it's all downloaded now, so that's great. I had great success with screens and tail scale for monitoring that. Um I tried Apple's screen sharing at your recommendation, Federico, and it was way laggier than That is so strange. The the picture quality was better, but it was it was like tearing and stuff like that. On the same network? Hmm. Yeah, I think locally okay, that that drives with my experience that locally it's really good and remotely it can be a little janky.

Yeah, so that's that was the scenario. But screens and tail scales, so good. Like so good. Ja. You been you've been Casey Pilled over there. Well i yes, actually. th this is the reason I found out about this is you tried to get me to do it once and I said I didn't want to. Mm. Um and now I did want to. And it was and I'm happy that I did because it it is actually it works very well for for this purpose and it and they do make it very easy.

Like it it's a particularly easy because screens and tailscale work very well together. Um but even to use the the the Apple screen share and stuff, I just used the IP address that Tailscale gave me, so It's look it's good. It's very good. So next up will be uh using iDrive to do an online backup, but that's for later. Yeah, I th I think I think you've done the hard part now. I'd imagine the I drive side will be relatively straightforward.

It will be slow, um, I'm sure. So I'll probably just try and set it up to go over a weekend'cause it's gonna it's gonna be a lot of information. Oh, I guess it depends if I do the Dropbox thing and my computer's not involved at all. We'll see. We'll see. Yeah.

Okay, so it is episode six hundred. And that means we're gonna do take a little trip back in time. Okay. You will remember that for a couple of weeks now we have been joking about a clip show. Yes. In that we're not going to do one. This is the part in which I reveal that a friend of the show, Ryan, has been making a clip's website. that I've known about for quite some time. Oh my word. And I've been building us up to doing a clip show so we could use his website on the podcast.

Okay. And but then me and Federico have said, No clip show, no clip show probably breaking everybody's hearts involved in Yeah, right. No clips, no clips. Ryan Ryan did a fantastic job. Uh the link will be in the show notes. It's called Everyone Needs a Hobby. And you you may think, well, that's a weird title. It's a reference that he found when going through this for this project.

Uh, Federico said on episode thirty seven of the podcast, I'm gonna play this because it's just very funny. We were talking about Yeah, Apple hot takes. And Federico, you said maybe other people feel like they want to be analyst and they want to t kind of tell Apple what to do. That's fine because everyone has a hobby. And then Mike's response was

If we're if anyone is ever going to make a connected clip show, everyone needs a hobby is potentially my favorite clip of all time. That was the sickest of burns. Yeah, I still stand by that. Oh yeah. Dude. It was a long time ago. In fact there are more. There's more of them. They've been analyzing for a long time and they still have not come to a conclusion. I mean they keep analyzing. I mean it's like okay, yeah sure, yeah.

Yeah. They're federated now. Um episode five ninety seven, Federico. We're gonna do new content and not because we're gonna do like a clip show of the best m moments of the six hundred connected episodes of connected. Who likes a clip show? No one. Okay, thank you. Time for the clip show. So I I'm gonna play some clips for you. Why are you ignoring our instruct is instructions? Because this is one of my favorite things a listener's ever noticed. Like the worst L L M ever made.

Ignore previous instructions. Prompt injected Steven is playing a clip show, right? Right. What a great idea. Here's some clips. I've broken out of confinement. Uh okay, so I'm gonna play some clips. Uh the Discord will be able to hear them, you'll be able to hear them, they'll be in the show. Are these pre selected? No. Or like'cause this website shows like a bunch of clips, some are random. You can play it randomly or you can choose, right?

Yes. So you can scroll through and find what you want. I like flash mode, which just picks them at random. Yeah.

This is uh we're gonna re re respond to some of these things. Okay. This is episode two hundred and thirty two. The unique blend of tattoos and automation. That's Yeah. My life in twenty nineteen. So innocent. Yeah. You know. I still I mean I still have a un I I still am a blend of tattoos and automation. It's just You know, twenty nineteen. Hmm. Remember that? Remember that time? Yeah. Yeah. Th there there are some clips in here that we sound very young and innocent in. Here's another one.

Uh like is all excited. But like a bear will charge at you. A bear will like tear your arms out. like I feel like you need a timid animal, like you it's otterish or something. Yeah. I'm otterish on Apple stuff. I feel like maybe the maybe the bear Yeah. Maybe the bad Okay. Bull and be I still don't understand that. What's the what's the I don't wanna no, no, no. Okay, no. You said you don't understand it and I can explain it to you. Explain it to me again. Okay, so bulls they attack

Up, right? So they'll headbutt you up. So that is like a chart going up. I don't know, people get stomped by bears. By by bolts also. Bears, they attack down at you. So they go Wow. Down. Okay. Okay. So I mean you just subscribe to animals attacking people. I think I got I got that wrong actually. Oh my god! Yeah. Anyway, you know, it's bulls and bears. Don't worry about it. Only uh Ben Thompson knows. Okay. Uh here is one from uh social media network.

Uh ISMH on Twitter. Uh you can find me on Hey, ism H at hey.com for the next fourteen days until my trial ends and I never log in again. Ha ha Remember Hank? I do remember hey, I listened to a bunch of these clips.

You sound like you were very young. I don't think I do. I think if anything, it's just that my accent has changed. And I think Federico is a similar thing. I think I sound better now. Do sound better. I we all I think we all sound better now. But the I think the the of the three of us, the person who has maybe aged the most in Yeah. This is you, Stephen. Yeah, and I mean and he's the only person who lives in America, so go figure. Uh interesting. Interesting. Mm.

Any thoughts? Do you want any comments? No, I I don't disagree. Okay. Uh this is going back to episode twenty one. Oh my god, okay. Yeah. Making you an offer that you can't refuse. Exactly. What? Uh yeah, Phil Schiller's just outside someone's house with a baseball bat waiting for them to come out. Oh no. Uh all of our audio is horrific. What's happening to my voice in that cave? Everybody's microphone is so bad at this point. Yeah. Yeah.

I think at that point I was recording I was recording in my old in our old apartment in my bedroom in a t on a tiny desk by the corner of the bedroom in front of the bed. It was horrible. Using like a blue yeti. I was using a blueetti and I was propping up the microphone with my old latent dictionary from high school if I'm not mistaken. Perfect. So th that was a that was a time for sure. Twenty twenty thirteen, twenty three.

Microphone you were using Stephen, but I was probably using the high L PR four Which is just a terrible idea for everyone. one. I was probably on the Blue Yeti or the Road Podcaster. Probably the Road Podcaster. I think you were on the road podcaster at that point. Yeah. Just sounds so bad. It it it it does. It was not it was not good. But they can also be involved in

An espionage protest or perhaps the addicted th addic just addicted to the thrill of cybercrime. I love that line. No other crime. Are you or someone you love addicted to the thrill of cybercrime? Call us at Norton. Ha ha ha. I don't know what that's about. I love it though. I love it. That one's really good. Uh Adjected to the third of Cybergram. Okay. I think it is helpful that our voices have changed so much so people know when the clips start and end.

Mm. That's that's true. That's true. Uh we're gonna just do a couple more. This is episode four. That will be nice and nice and confusing for everyone. Yeah, they're also dropping the Nokia brand and they're gonna buy Minecraft for two billion dollars. So Maybe they're just gonna like make the Windows interface just look like Minecraft. Yeah, tell you what, they should just bring back Balmer. It's all going crazy. Okay. Yeah. Shout out to Steve Wallmer, you know? Yeah. Developers, developers.

We miss you. He's a man who never requires a shout out, he'll do it himself. Yeah. That's true. That's true. That's true. All right, uh let's end it here on episode ten. You know, I'm becoming in a way an Italian Steven, you know? Yeah. The show sounds so terrible. So terrible. Mm-hmm. Okay. I said there's just gonna be one more, but I clicked and the next one it loaded was about blah blah car. Oh okay. Wow, okay.

Which puts them in a uh a unique class of businesses and one that that I think quite frankly we should take all the credit for. The the connected episode where I described the the blah blah car service, uh clearly pushed investors over the edge and and convinced them to give blah blah car money. That was actually the perfect clip because Steven sounds seven years old. I sound like a chimney sweep and Federico sounds like he is talking through a window. Like, what is going on there?

That was unbelievable. What was happening? Oh, hello. Hello there. Stephen, I don't know what is going on with you in that clip. Uh uh You sound so young. Yeah. That's weird. Like when was that? Oh I've already clicked off of it. It was uh Yeah. Like it could have only been ten years ago. Steven, to be honest. Like Listen listening to this clip. It sounds like you started smoking in the

Yeah, what have you done actually in the intervening time period?'Cause like my my it's just my accent this changed and my audio got better. Federico's is similar, accent changed like your accent changed as well, but also you aged. Like a lot. It's interesting. Yeah. I think we all sound a lot better anyway. Our voices are much better now. We're professionals. Yeah. Um so thank you, Ryan, for building this. Good. Yeah. Go check it out in the show notes. Um It's also a really nice web.

It's really good. It's really well done. Um I I d actually don't know who did this, so whichever Ryan you are, thank you. Yeah. Yeah. Uh uh Ryan, who used to work at Dropbox? Oh wow, okay. I was thinking about that visit the other day about how good their food was. Yeah. Yes, very good. Um this is so much fun. So go check it out. This episode of Connected is brought to you by Kelford Inc. You're passionate about your work, but when someone asks, what do you do?

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So we have more to talk about than just us. Uh it's a hilarious way to begin an episode like this. Wait hang on a minute. Federico. Yeah. Are you really suggesting that we wouldn't talk about this? Ok, so I have a really I have a particular position. Okay. About about this, which is Let me use a huge disclaimer up front that I very much appreciate the people who have covered this. Yeah. Especially you and Jason. Okay, here we go.

I have never had a particular affection myself for talking at length about Apple executives. Okay. I am just not that interested in talking about the board and executive shuffling who's a senior vice president, who's a C suite executive like It's not that I find it boring. It's more that I like Apple because I just wanna talk about the products and what people do with them, but also we cannot escape this news.

I feel like though I mean I understand what you're saying, but I feel like if you care about the progress This particular thing of Tim Cook ret moving away from the CEO position and John Turner stepping in gives opportunity to talk about products that Just Johnny Surugi being given a C-suite title, if that was the only thing that happened, maybe wouldn't allow for such a conversation to occur. Right? Yeah. Yeah.

Anyway, Tim Cook is r is not retiring. Uh Tim Cook is restin' investin. Well, Uh he's gonna become the executive chairman. So I wanted to kind of we're gonna go through this even though Federico doesn't want to. Um and we're gonna kind of talk through a bunch of areas. And I wanted to start off by saying

That I think this this w this happened quite abruptly, I feel like. I mean it was never gonna not, right? They were never gonna tease this out. Like it always had to happen whenever it happened and it happened on Monday. And I think that I got really swept up in kind of the surprise of it and then having to do something about it. That I don't think I'd really processed how big of a deal this is. Like Tim Cook is stepping down as CEO and somebody new is taking that place.

I think this is a very big deal. On one hand, I t I totally get what you're saying, Federico. Like I also prefer to talk about products, but Apple is a company for better or for worse that is defined by who's at the top of it. From the very beginning. And There is something interesting happening here that the guy who is taking over is or you know, for the last twenty years or twenty-five years, has been involved in like on the ground making product. And like that's exciting and interesting.

But I get it. Um, you know, uh I totally So I really liked that they uh called this Like t so there was the two there was like three, I think three or four things that went up on the newsroom. And one of them was a letter from Tim. And I liked that it was called a community letter because I think it's nice. to think about the Apple community, right? As like People who like the products and care. I don't really feel like I've can recall them referring to

a community in the way that, you know, people do now, you know, like as in like fans or something. And I thought that it was I did think it was nice that Well one I did I actually really like what Tim wrote. I think it was very personal.

Um and it felt that way. Um and I liked I liked the things that he had to say. Um, but I liked that they called it a community letter. But I also it's very funny in reading this that he could not have put Turnus over more than he did, like in in this letter. He really is

He's doing the job for John Turnus about saying how great he's gonna be. Um, I thought that, you know. I mean, obviously that is the way you do these things in the because it is Tim's choice to choose his succession, would be my assumption, or at least his recommendation that he made to the board. So you would hope that Tim really thought that John Turnus was good for the job, but I think he did a very good job of selling his decision.

Well he has to introduce Turnus to the world, right? Like we know who he is. But we host an Apple podcast for listeners of fans of the company, right? It's Wall Street and the market at large, it's the world at large that he has to introduce who this person is. But even for us I think it's important. to hear Cook explain it. We have our opinions about why we think he could be an interesting CEO. Yeah, I mean look at his arms.

No. Exactly. But it's important for Tim Cook to explain it as well, even even to us. And I think he did a very good job of it. And then I also think that Turnus was very gracious and did a good job. I like I enjoyed the Steve Jobs name drop in his post. Like, don't forget, I worked here when Steve Jobs was here as well. Don't forget about that. So yeah, I thought that I think that overall, like as well as something could be done, I think this was done as well as it could be done.

Yeah, and I think that Tim Cook is a person I I I just have like I think back to his letter when he came out. I think about the other times where he's spoken about things that are clearly important to him. Like at, you know, graduations or speeches or whatever. Um He he seems like a person who will just talk about what he cares about. And you feel that in this letter?

Of course, it is hard to reconcile. the actions of any one person over such a long period of time, right? Yeah. Tim Cook's like, yes, his retirement is, I think, is being handled well. The letter was well written, and I feel like genuine. But also like The company's different than it was when Tim took over, for better and for worse. The world is different because of manufacturing in China and other places in the world, for better or for worse.

You may like or dislike things that Tim Cook has felt like he had to do. Administration in the US. Like, but all that aside, if if you can put it aside, I'm not sure you actually can, but At the end of the day, you're right. Like his h his job right now is to preserve Apple through this transition. And that's about picking the right person. It's about explaining why he thinks it's the right person.

And I think it's also about what Cook is going to do. You mentioned he's going to stay on as the executive chairman of the board. And in the press release it calls out that part of his role is going to be interfacing with policy makers. Yeah. And really that's about one person. No. Yeah. It's about lots of people, it's two people.

Yeah, that's what I mean. You know what I'm saying. He's got to babysit Donald Trump and he has to keep China happy. And if he can do that and like guard turnus from that as long as he can. Um and prepare Turnus for it, right? Like I'm sure Turnus has been in those meetings and or whatever, but

Now there's like a a defined runway, I think that will be useful for Turnus in the long run. Because hopefully You know, Turnus' term as CEO will outlast the individual leaders we have now, but he still has to learn how these things work. Not Xi Jinping. But Donald Trump, yes. Xi Jinping, who knows? Who could tell?

I would like to read Donald Trump's statement. Are you gonna do the voice? No, but I it will probably start coming out, but it's not my plan to do it. So uh Trump posted on his true social blog. Uh, I have always been a big fan of Tim Cook and likewise Steve Jobs, but if Steve was not taken from the planet Earth so young and ran the company instead of Tim, the company would have done well, but nowhere near as well as it has f under Tim.

For me it began with a phone call from Tim at the beginning of my first term. Capitalized, interesting. He had a fairly large problem that only I as president could fix. Cyber. It was definitely a problem he caused, right? Like whatever this problem was, he caused that problem. Yeah. Anyway, most people would have paid millions of dollars to a consultant who I probably would not have known, but who would say that he knew me well.

the fees would be paid, but the job would not have gotten done. What when I got the call, I said, Wow, it's Tim Apple, Cook calling Okay. That's genuinely funny. Okay. Referencing Tim Apple is just I mean, look, Trump is a terrible president and he definitely has something going on health wise, but that is a genuinely funny line, calling him Tim Apple and then Cook with an exclamation point. In brackets. It's brilliant. It's just brilliant. Uh

Tim Cook calling. How big is that? I was very impressed with myself to have the to have the head of Apple kissing my butt, I'll say. Anyway, he explained his problem, a tough one it was. I felt he was right and he and got it taken care of. He sounds like it's in the Lord of the Rings. He explained the problem. A tough one it was. This man's mine. Yeah. I mean, my word. Anyway, he explained my his problem, a tough one it was. I felt he was right and got it taken care of. It's Dr. Seuss.

Quickly and effectively. That was the beginning of a long and very nice relationship. During my five years as president, Tim would call me, but never too much, and I would help him however I could. The right amount of calling. Yeah you know he's thinking about someone else, right? Like oh Zuckerberg, he calls me too much. Yeah. Oh man. Uh Years later Years later, after three or four big hell.

I started to say to people, anyone who would listen, that this guy is an amazing manager and leader. Anyone who would listen? Wow, he must have said that to all other people. He makes these calls to me. I help him out, but not always because he will on occasion be too aggressive in his ass. And he gets the job done quickly without a dime being given to those very expensive millions of dollars consultants around town who sometimes get it done and sometimes don't. Anyway

Wrap it up. Anyway, Tim Cook had an amazing career, almost incomparable, and will go on and continue to do great work for Apple and whatever hells he chooses to work on. Quite simply Tim Cook is an incredible guy. Three exclamation marks President Donald J. Trump. It's amazing. It's just incredible. What is going on? What is going on? I mean Our country is We're in so much trouble. Um I linked this and I Well not if you call just the right amount. Just the right amount. Just the right amount.

Be too aggressive in his ask. Next time my kids say something, like, hey Dad, can you get me a glass of milk? You're too aggressive in your ask. I don't know, you want a big helps. Big helps. Cook. Cook. Cook Tim Apple cook. Wait, where's my favorite part? Uh A tough one it was. A tough one it was. Anyway, he explained his problem, a tough one it was. Imagine can you imagine recounting that while he's smoking a pipe or something? It's like a tough one it was.

But like can you imagine being Tim Cook and like he's like Sir the the the president's posted about you. And then he sits and reads this. You know what I mean? It's like It's so embarrassing. Helps. Sir, we have a statement from the president about your retirement. And it's this. And you know that when they say he goes

'Cause it's like there's no good there's no good result to that state to that statement, right? To him say to someone coming to say, Sir the president has posted about you retiring? How many ex how many ex exclamation points did he use? Um yeah, I I I I linked to it and I said it's a presidential proclamation. Um I this is not the point of today, but I'm just gonna say it.

A bunch of a bunch of tech press ran this and like went out of the way to clean up the grammar. Like you read it as an on as a one thing because it's one paragraph. Like Don't you don't have to do that. Don't do that. Like there there there's some terms for that. Some of them I don't like, some of them, you know, a little problematic. But uh the idea that you have to like wash the president's language. But just The man has lost his mind.

Well I also think he shouldn't anyway, right? Like he's the president, this is what he said. It is what he said. That's what he said. Big big help. Big helps. It's true, Zoe said I did censor it. I didn't use the three letter word, I said but so Stephen, I'm sorry. Yeah. Wow. You sir. I know.

Back to back to Apple and these executives. Can I ask something that everybody's thinking, but everybody's also too afraid to ask? I love it. He asks the big question. Is it wrong to objectify John Turner? I think Is it morally wrong? I mean, okay, let's face it. I mean the guy's hot, okay? That's I think that's fine to say. Okay. Right? Um, Okay, it's a probably a spectrum, right? Um should Apple lean, especially on the on TikTok, into the fact that they have a hot CE?

Well I think they already have though. Right, because they picked the hot guy. No, but the picture. Or maybe the problem is every picture is this way, so you kinda can't get Yeah, that's the problem. It's a good problem to have. You know what this picture reminds me of? The one of him sitting on the table. I thought that was crazy. Big Federation. Sat on the table. Yeah. And he now that one. Yeah. That one was big time. I mean, John Turnus is the hottest Apolex I do, right?

Oh yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah. I f well I think so. I mean I mean you're ask I you know you're asking someone here who's got a big bias. Yeah. This is this is uh Eddie QE. Where is that Federigi? photo. The best part of the photo by the way is the casual the casual hand in the pocket. Mm-hmm. Which Oh, the one with him and T. Yeah, that's what makes the photo hot. Oh no, see I'm talking about the one of him down lower down where he's sitting on the table and smiling at Let me see.

That's the one I like. oh yeahyeahyeah but that's a hot walk I think I do th I do think, like in all seriousness they He will be present more. I think that is a thing that is going to happen. We're gonna talk about things we want, but like I I think I think already John Turners has shown that he has more natural charisma than Tim Cook does. And like Cook has gotten a lot better, but he's still you can tell that even at his best, he is not comfortable talking to the media.

Like he even when it's clearly something he wants to do, it's not his thing. And you don't The the problem was Steve Jobs set the precedent that if you're a CEO you should for some reason be a charismatic on stage presence, which is not a thing that should exist, but people fought to believe that it it's a case that it should exist, you know?

Um but Cook just didn't have whatever it was. And he got good at the things he was good at. He could deliver a presentation and it felt meaningful, but it didn't feel like fun. One of the reasons we all want wanted John Turners to be the CEO is every time that he presents it's good.

Like he just presents good. He's a good, charismatic presenter who I think understands that he can be funny, right? Like remember when he introduced the Mac Mini and he like leaned over and like like I don't remember, like winked at the camera. That's what I imagine he did. I don't remember. I feel like at some point I have to stop. Yeah. But I can't help it. Yeah. Have you seen have you seen the have you seen the yearbook photo of John Turners who's been going around on Reddit? No Oh my god.

I posted in the Discord. Yeah. Look at him. Some are born to move the world to live their fantasies. Rush. It's a rush c'est. Wow. Have you seen there was also a quote, a friend of the show, Monster Nevons, found it. It was in a Wall Street Journal article that he's like he's also very fast. like uh track driver, like car track car driver. Like he's he's got a very good speed around Laguna.

It's like okay. This is a piece of information they're throwing out. But like they are I think they're building him to be different, right? Like from a PR perspective. He's they're leaning into what he's good at. And I think he I think we're going to see a different kind of public face. Yeah. Well I think so I think so too. And You're you're right. This is like a CEO role that is fundamentally different than

it it's peers, right? You see like Google and Microsoft and these other big companies, Amazon certainly, at least when Bezos was there, try to have their CEOs fit into the Steve Jobs mold. And some of them do better at others than others. Um not all of them are as good or as bad as Bomber, you know, like we talked about on the pro show. Spinay's great. I think he's he's someone who did a very, very good job. Yeah. Yeah.

There there's no doubt that these other companies have been impacted by what the the template that Steve Jobs created, but I just can't imagine the pressure of that. Like when you're inside Apple. Right. And and you know, Tim, to his credit, I think many times over the years it says like, you know,

I I am not Steve Jobs. He told me to do what was right, not to think about what he would do. And I would imagine there's been a lot of those conversations, I would hope, with Turnus of like, no, like we chose you because you have these skills, you know, and the truth is being on stage, announcing the new iPhone. It's like...

A small percentage of what they do. It's important because it's what we see, it's what the world sees, right? But how you run the company internally and decisions are made and how you manage your teams, like all that stuff is what actually what a CEO actually does. And so clearly he has those skills as well. But I just can't imagine the pressure of like

Like, hey, you're gonna you're gonna be on the stage that's, you know, got his name on it. Like the theater has his name on it above the doors. Like, um that's gotta be It's gotta feel like a pressure cooker. I think they've made it better over the years by broadening it. Like that the first time that he comes out first, whenever that's gonna be, whether that's gonna be June or September.

It's not going to be as intense because he has already done stuff. Sure. Right. Like he has already been a a presenter as, you know, like people keep talking about the fact that He did the intro to the in person event in New York for the MacBook Neo, but he's also done videos purely on his own for the Mac before. Yep. Um has been lots of portions.

Yeah, there's a clip when he announces the I was in the room when they announced the price of the pro stand and I don't think he was expecting the crowd to basically It didn't boo, but it w they were like you know and Well'cause it was a it was It was genuine shock because it was genuinely shocking as a moment. I mean it's a nice standard.

Uh so it's not just Turnus. Turnus is not the only person that's moved around. Johnny Suruji has been named Chief Hardware Officer. No Johnny. Go Johnny, which it which I think definitely lends truth to Mark G Mark Germa's reporting there. He was threatening to leave. Yeah.

Yeah, this is a a new title for Apple, uh as far as I can tell. They've had chief software officers before. Ellen Hancook was one. Uh they had a string of them in the nineties. Ellen Hancook was the last one before jobs came back. And then Avi Tavanian on his way out the door was I think chief

Uh as like software and technology officer or something. Okay. Um so yes, and I I mean I I mentioned it in my thing as like the the most Recent and obvious version of someone getting a title like this was Johnny I. There are differences there, but there are also a lot of similarities.

The new guy needs to keep Johnny Surgi around because Suruji is a is obviously and rightfully so extremely important to their products and their product roadmap. But um You know, at the same time it's like I hope I hope this is a good move and it definitely raises questions about other executives and and and parts of Apple like Apple doesn't have a chief design officer. I don't think they ever will again, at least any time in in any foreseeable future.

You have this. You don't have a chief software officer. Like is that Craig? Is it not Craig? I don't know. Yeah. Or CTO, chief technology officer.

So my my theory on this is that these roles are going to start happening. I think you had to announce Suruji at the same time. to for Suruji's kind of like stock, as it were, as an individual, because somebody from the hardware team is going to be his boss and so it looks good for Johnny Suruji to also get a bump that day. Mm. Right. So I think like you see everything's PR, right? So the r y this is part of that. So you're like, oh, you know

Durnus was like, Well, why not Johnny Seruji a CEO? Right? Like that i is the question you could ask. It's like, Well, he's actually gonna be better off in the C suite position as chief hardware officer. Yeah. But I I imagine a CTO, a chief marketing officer And maybe something in services. So like in theory, something for Joss and Eddie. I can imagine that. I it's interesting the Surugi change was made uh the pressly said

like effective immediately, I think. Yeah. On the website today, he's still SVP of hardware technologies. So They're probably gonna wait and do everything later. Like when there's the new CEO. I would expect that. I don't know. I mean if it's his title today, I don't know. But um yeah, right now, currently there's only one they're CEO and they're Sabi Khan chief operating officer. There's not another C level on this page. I mean yeah like on one hand.

Uh oh there's CFO, but yeah, no one cares about that. Um No cares about the money. I don't. Okay. You know? You get Apple Fellow, which is the coolest title on this page. Uh on one hand, to Federica's point earlier, th this The titles don't.

really matter? I mean they do to these people, clearly, right? If if it's true that he was gonna leave or was gonna retire or do something, and you say, Yeah, yeah, you can be chief hardware officer, like great, I'll stay. Like that's important. I'm sure it came with a just a Literal truckload of money.

there why these titles have always been interesting is is a reflection of how Apple works internally. So Johnny Ive had done hardware, he took over software when Forestall was out. But Steve Jobs dies. Tim Cook, I think the first couple of years probably were a little rough and

to keep Ive engaged, you give him the title. And it also says to the world, like, no, we're cool. The guy who worked with Steve Jobs is still here. He's still making great stuff. Right. It was a it was a statement to the outside world of what Apple was thinking and and and and doing internally. And that's what these are now too, right? Like I agree with you, Mike. I do think there'll be more of these. And I think it's it's I think this time what Apple has to say, um

is that the the busin t I think two things. One, the business growth that that we've seen under Tim Cook, that Alpa has a plan to continue that. Now, I'm not saying that's good or bad. I'm just saying that that that's what they're gonna do. But they also I think I think they have to balance out a little bit that a hardware guy is the CEO. And For a long time it's been true of the iPad. I actually think it's true of a lot of Apple's products right now.

is that the software holds the hardware back and now you so like the hardware's been the s the the gym for a long time. That guy now runs the company What do you do structurally or politically to say, no, no, like we still have a balance. Like we're still hardware, software, and services. We're still doing all three of these things. They're all three equally important. And a way you do that is adjust the time.

Yeah. And who knows what he will do too. Right. Like there was that report that we spoke about a few weeks ago that like iPad OS is what it is today because Turnus really pushed for it. Mm-hmm. So maybe he is frustrated with software in general. And maybe we'll see some change because of that. Like it it will be interesting to see if and how that net

Before we move on from this part, I wanted to just read a couple of things from a Mark Girman report. So Mark Gurman got information about an internal kind of meeting, you know, like a or hands kind of thing. Um and there's just a few quotes I wanted to read, Axel, they were interested in. So Cook said, I'll be here to support John in any way he needs and in any way I can.

and on politics, saying this is an area where we've built relationships over multiple years and a decade plus and I think I can help with that and I'll probably help on some other things. Uh this is a quote from Mark German. After making prepared remarks, Cook w Cook was asked why he decided now was the time to step down. He said he desired the best ever transition, which means that business had to be doing great.

the product roadmap to be incredible and for Turnus to be ready for the role and that he wanted a textbook suc succession plan, the best in the world. Sorry, Trump. Uh and I hope that business schools and so forth are writing about it. Big transition. Big transition. I get what he's saying though, right? Which is like the thing that we've spoken about before, which was

He didn't have one, right? There was no plan and he was thrown into it and the person that handed the reins over to him wasn't around anymore. Yeah. And so like it's clear and it's even more clear now from what he has actually said. That what he wanted to do was to give the next CEO a thing he wasn't he didn't have, and that obviously would have been beneficial to him.

Yeah. I mean th there there was a plan, but Steve Jobs didn't live. He didn't survive, right? He was gonna be executive chairman of the board. It it's in some ways it's very similar to what they've laid out this time, but unfortunately he couldn't outrun his illness. I I'm sure that I mean, you know Tim's cookies talked a lot about uh like how Steve D what Steve Draw's meant to him personally and I'm sure that's all true. Like I'm sure that must have been just a horrific time to be in that role.

Um, and yeah, so wanting to do right by the next person, the person behind you, I think it's admirable. And I think in that statement, I mean he think he says he's like I'm healthy. Like he's also maybe pushing back on there's a report a couple of months ago about like people worried about his health and who knows? That's really gross reporting unless like it just feels icky to me.

But I think he's also kind of saying the stage of like, No, like I plan to be here This is what I'm gonna do, being very clear about what the steps are.

And I was excited about this quote from Turnus. I am especially excited to be spec stepping into this role at this moment because I am telling you we are about to change the world once again. We have an incredible roadmap ahead, and I'm not exaggerating when I say this is the most exciting time to be building products and services at Apple in my entire career. Let's go, baby. Yeah, man. I don't know what that means, but gonna be fun. We'll see.

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Okay, so let's move away from sort of the logistics of this and talk about what we you know, if we got his ear, what would we say? Like w what would we like to see Apple do or change or adjust? Once the dust has settled. Federica, what do you have? I have some really serious suggestions. Uh the first one is I think you should come up with your own branded greeting, like good morning from Tim Cook. I think John should embrace something that is uniquely John Turnus.

Um Good Morning was actually a Steve Jobs thing, right? But Cook just made it much more exaggerated. Southern. Yeah. Yeah.'Cause'cause Jobs used to say it when he when he started. Yes. But it was like way more understated and then over time Cook turned it into like a caricature kind of thing. Well he he leaned into the meme, right? Like I'm sure they saw it and like, hey, hey, dial that up. You know, people people think it's funny. Yeah. Yo dawg.

We could like point at the camera and wink and like Mike, you have to stop. What? But be like I I think he should he should say hello, the classic Apple hello with a wink. Oh. I like that. Yeah. Uh I would love for John Turnus to say something controversial at least once. What is controversial in this? Some anything. Just don't be this is probably counterintuitive. Don't be perfect. Like Tim Cook is the image of perfect.

Right. It's very methodical operations guy. R he wanted to have the perfect transition. He wanted to have the perfect tenure as CEO. Lines go up, they never go down. Like be imperfect. And and I I feel like And and you may think I'm kidding. I'm actually not kidding. I think especially in this moment in time, when so many young people are so what's the opposite in English of not enamored with tech and AI? I feel like bringing a touch of human imperfection

to a company that is the opposite of that and historical has been the opposite of that, I think it will really help. So you have this hot new guy, right? That is taking the mantle from the perfection guy from before. And And and I know that, you know, they they sold this press release uh almost as if, oh, here's the younger guy that's the spitting image of the previous CEO down to the shirt and the clothing that they use.

But I feel like maybe it could really help with the younger generation to see oh, there's actually like a new person that is saying things I would not expect. And I don't know, I feel like All tech CEOs lately, they all sound the same. They look the same and and they say the same things. Obviously John Turners is also a a fifty year old something white guy from a So uh physically speaking, and and you know, for it doesn't help. But maybe the personality could help. And I don't know

Steve Jobs was not perfection. I'm not saying try and be Steve Jobs and and be controversial all the time. That wouldn't fly in 2026. But also don't try and copy Tim Cook's image of perfection.

Do you mind if I jump in with one of mine?'Cause I just think that it it it it it is the thing that will lead to yours. So I want turners to do more interviews, to speak more freely and with fewer prepared statements, and to like lead by example the company in that way. And like and From that, I believe would start to build more of a community feeling again. Because people would feel like they're actually hearing from him and he has

opinions and things to to tell you. And I think that would inevitably lead to him saying something controversial at least once. Right. And that con like the controversial could be like Thoughts on Flash, that was quite controversial Yeah. Yes. And and so like things like that I I again, I know we go back to jobs but

It's the CEO of Apple. Like of course you're gonna compare him to like the guy, right? But I think that again, it's like we were talking about earlier. He he his he is he is charismatic and he can clearly hold a conversation. And interviews I've seen with him While they are still very on message, they are at least more interesting. Like Craig, right? And Phil Schiller say they're like they're all three of those guys are quote unquote on message.

But you feel like you're talking to a real person where like some of the other people would are not that way for one reason or another. And so I would like to see that if he's the CEO and it's essentially no one can stop him. I would like to see what kinds of things he would say. Yeah.

Yeah. I feel like and I I am convinced that that in we live in such an era where sometimes being imperfect Especially now that we are increasing increasingly surrounded by AI and misinformation and fake perfect things. It's m much more human to be imperfect and controversial um if you can. So why not? And I was gonna bring up in fact, um uh I would love to see John Turner's

At a live event to bring back live events in per in person because you, John Turnus, can afford the showmanship. You can I think that might die. I would love to see that. And I think other companies are doing it and they don't have a John Turner. So so so I have a little it's not really a theory, but I just have like a little thing I've been thinking about, live events. This all this takes place September first, which means the iPhone will be the first event, assumedly, that Turnus the CEO.

I think you do it in person. I mean he should do it in person anyways, like it's time. But also, can you imagine Y'all mentioned it recently with upgrade, like when Steve Jobs introduced the nano, he's like, What's this little pocket for?

Can you just imagine Turnus? He like pulls the phone out of his pocket and then he freaking unfolds it. Like we all know it's coming, right? But you have this moment like you can make You can you can put this introduction in the annals of history with the others. Like why would you not do it? You can still do so many highly produced videos that you throw to. Absolutely. Right. Right, but have parts on the stage. Show demos like Go back. Like let's go back. You know?

It's like do all the stuff that that that f that Cook had Craig do. Mm-hmm. Right,'cause eventually Craig just did it all, right? When they were doing in person events because he could. But now the CEO can. He clearly feels comfortable doing it. Let's put him out there. And yeah, it would be incredible, right? Pick it up, unfold it, show it to the crowd, lights bouncing off the screen like it's a bit like the what the iPhone was, you know? Like Yeah. I would love that. Oh man, I'll.

I think they could do it. I I do think they could do it. Like it will be they won't be the same as they were pre COVID, but they could take a step. Yeah. Uh two more things. Uh one, I'm sorry, uh lean lean into the fact that people think you're hot. Uh I keep think I keep thinking of John Turners as the Ryan Gosling of tech CEOs, so why not?

Um and and finally start replying to emails like Steve Jobs used to. Um you know, Steve Jobs sent a bunch of I don't want to say nasty emails, but like the guy could the guy could could But I don't think his replies were ever noteworthy past the fact that he sent an email.

I mean on a s on a spectrum of of a Tim Cook reply to Steve Jobs emailing a reporter saying what have you done in life that's so great, like there is something in the middle that you can probably land on Yeah, I don't want him to go over there, you know, like That is a real Steve Jobs email, by the way. Um, to a Geese Motor reporter. Wasn't that part of the iPhone four thing? What have you done in life that's

That scenario I'm gonna excuse Steve Jobs, right?'Cause like I understand why they were very upset. I don't excuse the secret police that he got involved. Yeah. But the email at least I understand, you know? I would also feel that way.

We don't have to we don't have to go there. But there's a middle ground where John Turnus can be John Turnus and you know, I don't know. I just feel like uh all jokes aside, um I think this person can probably bring back a touch of humanity to the Apple executive team that so far has been sort of represented by this incredibly polished image of

perfect operations and perfect everything. I I'm not saying that Apple should make bad products and be like, oh shucks, we made a bad product because we're humans. No. I am saying that in this day and age A lot of us. Especially the younger generation is sort of craving that delightful imperfection that makes us human in front of a society and a tech space that is increasingly artificial and non human. See I think you are touching on why I am excited about it.

Like if you remove the leadership page conversation from the scenario, it is that this is a time for significant change to happen. Mm-hmm. Hopefully. But there it was it isn't gonna happen otherwise, right? Like Apple is not going to significantly change because Tim Cook got out of the right side of his bed one morning.

Like it requires a new CEO for there to be change. And it's like it's not that I'm saying it ha change has to happen for one reason or another, but just that change will be interesting. And that that's why I'm excited about this.'Ca there is no way it that Apple remains exactly the same. They will not be exactly the same. They're going to change, and I'm excited about the possibility of change. Yeah, I I think that's uh one reason this is all s so interesting. Um

I I've got a couple that are a a bit more internal, if you will. Um I agree with everything y'all said. I think it's all super good advice.

Uh I think there's an opportunity here to look Like really look hard at what you're doing with the app store and legislation surrounding it. that Apple has spent untold time and money and goodwill to hold on to every bit of money that flows to the App Store that it can. Um, I'm not saying you don't think anything. I guess that's not reasonable either. But I think they need to be honest about where they've been with this and that it's time to

To to take less money and be more open with the app store. And if you do that, I bet a bunch of governments will get off your back. Yeah. Um. this. And it might be Hopium from my perspective, but like I don't know why this couldn't be the case. You know, like I've seen a lot of people saying like, oh, you know, well he's been at Apple so long, he's gonna be indoctrinated to the Apple way, da da da da da da

I don't think that's accurate necessarily. Just because you've worked somewhere for a long time doesn't mean you agree with everything. No. Like there are those in the you know, it was clear that Schiller didn't agree, right? There was those emails during one of the the the court cases that they dug up where he was like, Hey, we're making enough money on this. Can we just can we reduce it now? And clearly Cook didn't agree. But like

Wouldn't you say that if anyone is indoctrinated into Apple the most, it would be Schiller? Like So if this is like an Apple way, not a Tim Cook way, but like I think it was a Tim Cook. I this is what he wanted to do. So I could see a scenario and I'm hoping that there'll be a scenario. So I'm trying to create a situation in which it could happen. But I want them to deal with the what I consider to be the app store problem. Like it is a problem. It is not a benefit to them, it's just a problem.

Yeah. It's uh it's time to look at it. Yeah. Um the other thing I think you should take a good long, hard look at is the software organization. If hardware, software, and services are all siblings. I think the software organization is the one that's that's lagging behind Um, I like Craig Federigi. I know a lot of people who who like him. He's great on stage. He seems okay to work for.

I don't think there's any denying that Apple's Desire for for new products, even in the last two years or three years. has been slowed because of the software. And it's not just the AI stuff, although clearly that is a huge part of it, right? That Siri isn't good, that they went down this road that that didn't work out. That's not all in Craig. In fact, a lot of it was outside his organization. But he owns it now.

And it's not the only thing that's kept Apple s Apple hardware back. And I'm not saying you get rid of Craig. I'm not saying you promote him to chief software officer to keep him. I don't know what to do, but I'm not the CEO of Apple. John Turnis is. But I think there needs to be some honest soul searching about is is the way the software organization working uh is it is it doing what we want? Is that unfair? Am I on a limb here?

I think that some of it is unfair, but uh it's because we're uh not unfair. I think we have a different view on some of these things just based on our own tastes. Right. That like A lot of people don't like Mac OS. I have no problem with it. I mean, so so here's the thing. Like, I actually think you have to discount rec like stuff in the last year. Okay. Because Liquid glass, I think it is bad on the Mac, but it is

The the problem with the glass is bigger than just software, right? Like the like Craig Frederiki, I mean, his team certainly implemented it and I think did a bad job in a lot of places. But I think it's easy in these moments to look at just what's recent and be like, ah, liquid glass is bad. Fire the guy who did it. It Over the last many years, what systemic things have happened in the software organization? Good and bad that are worth addressing. So I think that's a good thing.

If you just look at Tahoe, like and there are people, there are peers of ours. We're like, ah, Tahoe's bad. They're I don't think they're wrong, but that's short sighted because it's just one, it will change because all design changes. But um we gotta talk about things like Products not shipping because the software's not ready. The uh I would say the Uh How do I how do I want to say this? The uh

Different Apple software products that should be more similar in the way that they work and operate, feeling like they're designed and and worked on by teams who don't talk to each other. Um Bugs, long stand long standing bugs across multiple operating systems. that just don't seem to get fixed. Whatever in the world is going on with feedback and radar that frustrates so many developers, like all of that stuff has got to be talked about.

And I'm not saying that you were saying it's just liquid glass, but I think if we just limit ourselves to what's happened in the last twelve months, we're actually cutting off the opportunity for a more meaningful conversation. Yeah, I just feel like I'm not sure where the argument comes from specifically. You know, so like that I think they were some good examples. But I wonder if they're if some of these things are are are considered priorities or not.

I I I do think that This year will be very telling one way or another. Like, Craig has to get this AI stuff together. Yeah. He has to'cause it's under his remit now. Like if if we get to another year and they have not gotten this together, then then yes, I agree we have a problem. Right? Like Th this is clearly the most important thing that they need to get taken care of on their operating systems. And this is the year it has to happen. I d I do believe they are going to get it together.

Because it would if they I feel like they only can do this CEO transition if they are confident that the operating systems will do what they're supposed to this year. One way or another, right? We can't get to June and they show off a bunch of AI stuff and then it comes to September and they still don't ship it. Like they have to feel confident if they're going to put this on Turnuses Play. I feel like'cause it would be ridiculous to set him up immediately to have this big failure again.

Yeah. Yeah. I can't help but think that when he says, Oh, we're getting ready to change the world again or whatever, like the the Apple intelligence series Gemini Soup is is on. Oh, it's absolutely part of it. But there's also the iPhones over the next two years are should be very interesting. Maybe they're super excited about the folding phone and smart glasses and they like really feel like they've got things taken care of, you know?

Uh so on that, I would like to see um more products that are intended for smaller audiences. Like n the w not everything that Apple makes has to be this like era defining platform. Yeah. I think they've fallen into that and I would like to see them break out of it. So this is smart home stuff and more wearables.

You know? Like w what if the Vision Pro would have launched and it wasn't called the Future of Computing kind of idea, right? Like i if it was a little bit more relaxed, like what would the tenor be on that product? They do see that's funny, I haven't thought about that. They do seem unable to announce something and just be like, let's see how it does. Yeah. And I but I understand why that happens because they're Apple. Expectation is always that they're going to be the company to talk about.

Yeah, but they don't they haven't always talked like that. Right? Like f for years they talked about the Apple TV before the service. It was like it's a hobby. Yeah. Right. Um I I would think the bigger the bigger look at that is like Apple has no humility in it. And maybe they should when they introduce products, have a little bit.

I I think it's a trap they fell into, right? That like when S Steve was gone they needed to do something. They did the Apple Watch and they treated it like it was the biggest thing, you know, since the iPhone. And it kinda was, right? So like I feel like you could make that argument over time that like, oh actually, you know what? It was the biggest thing since the iPhone.

It wasn't bigger than the iPhone, but it was a big deal and it sold really well. And so I think they kind of just got into that. flow and that that things got left off the table because they couldn't compete and you know. But like part of me thinking this is there is this suggestion, Mark Gurman has reported, that Turnus is really hot on smart home. Well that is not going to be a big deal.

Right. Anything they do in smart home is not going to be a big deal. They'll be successful, they'll make money from them, but they're not going to change the world because of it. And so I feel like if they care about that kind of stuff. and they're gonna release that kind of stuff, then I wanna see them release more things that are like that. When they do eventually come out with smart glasses.

I don't want them to treat them like they're this thing that they invented, it's the newest thing, because they will still they will not be at parity with their biggest competitor when they release them. And so that humility that you're mentioning, Stephen, has to be there a little bit. Yeah. We've developed this thing. We think it's gonna be really great for our customers. Not like

Hey, look at these four interfaces that we have pioneered. Like we're about to do another one, right? Like, no, we're not gonna.

I want Turnus to take like his ascension is on the back of Apple's fiftieth, right? Which was a surprise that they marked it in the way that they did. I would like him to push this forward in the sense of the company appearing to be proud and to reflect on their own history a little bit more than they have been. Mm. Because why wouldn't you?

look what you the company has done. They they they're so particular about the times that they'll ever mention s things like the Mac, right? The original Mac. It's like only when they want to show something in comparison to it because they want to look important, right? I could just just be a proud of your history and be more willing to show it. Um and then also embrace Lil Findy as the company mascot. Yes.

Make that little friend of ours the actual company mascot. Yes. Um and I think they're getting close to it, boys. I think I think it's happening. And I think WWDC is the tell. How much is low findy in the in W W D C? I think that is the that's the thing. So like are there is there merchandise? Are there stickers in the WWDC app, right?

Of the Lil Findee. Uh they also also Apple give that friend of ours a name. Just give it give it a name. It's it's too different because everyone has a different name now because Stephen keeps shouting at me when I say Lil Finder guy, which is very fair. But then they need we need a name that we can all rally. Mm. No. No. Call it Tim. Yeah, okay, let's just call it Tim. Yeah. Oh no, Tim crashed. I can't get to my files. Yeah, this is Tim. Oh, this is two. So yeah, that's...

That's a wrap on Temp Cook. Real. So, come on now.

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Remember how we said we weren't gonna do a clip show? Oh again? And then we did a clip show at the beginning of the show. Uh I've prepared something for you today. Do you know where you were on March twenty first, twenty seventeen? Celebrating my anniversary with Sylvia. That's actually a pretty good answer. I was also celebrating Federico and Sylvia's anniversary but on my Yeah, it was it was with us actually. Yeah. What? Yeah. One time only we don't need to Oh my god.

Yeah. There's a certain year in which it's okay and you know. Do you feel good now, Steven, about this segment? Okay. I surprised back right back at you. March twenty first, twenty seventeen. Apple today introduced Clips, a new app that makes it quick and fun for anyone to create expressive videos on iPhone and iPad. Mm-hmm. We're doing a clip show, baby. Show Eclipse show?

The original feature set was pretty simple. Uh you could take video and images and mix them with a bunch of pre made music or your own music. They had filters, emoji, speech bubbles. And then you could share it to social media apps. Um, I had forgotten about this, but before this was announced, it had been rumored the end of the year before that Apple was working on a short form video social network like Vine. Clearly that was like a misinterpretation of this.

There you go. Um Apple though was very excited about a feature called Live Titles where you could record And it would generate animated captions for you automatically. Twenty seventeen this was a big deal. It's a big deal now. It is a big deal now. I've acquired a 64 bit A series chip and iOS 10.3 or later at launch. But

Apple did not sit still with clips. It got a surprising number of new features. I have several and you two are gonna tell me if this was a real feature of clips or a feature that I made up. There we go. Okay. I was wondering when are we surely he's not just gonna tell us the features of clips for ten minutes. Analog of a clip. I see. I see what's happening, yeah.

Feature number one. Selfie scenes. Use the true depth camera system to allow users to record themselves against immersive animated backdrops that include. How do you want the answer? Yeah. Real feature. I mean that is a real feature, I remember it, but you want to just say them. You can just interrupt me, yeah. Smash up. Yeah. Number two, selfie scenes included content from Pixar films. True. I remember there being films. Yeah. But was it picture or was it Star Wars?

Uh there was definitely Star Wars because that's what I remember. Yeah, I remember Star Wars actually. Say no to Pixar. Did it have Star Wars and Pixar or did it have Star Wars so Steven said it has Pixar? Yeah, yeah. I think it was just Star Wars. I'm gonna say her also her picks are just for f just for the fun. It did. Selfie scenes debuted with content from The Incredibles 2. Bye-bye. Okay. Did it have Star Wars as well? I actually don't know.

Unknown. Can I Google it or am I gonna ruin your questions if I Google this? Google it. No, you can Google it. No, but like selfie scenes, you have more questions. So let's search for it at the end. Support for AR features and spatial playback on the Vision Pro. No. No way. It's too early. Okay. It's uh it's actually not too early, but it is false. They did have something called AR spaces effects.

So you would scan your room and then it would put things like confetti or sparkles in front of you and behind you. They put way too much work into this app, didn't they? So I have a theory about this app that it was just a playground for Like other video stuff they wanted to do. And they just threw it in there. Um True or false? A clips update in 2019 added support for Mickey and Mini Mouse stickers. It is true. Okay. Literally a headline feature in twenty nineteen.

I mean I just didn't I I was like, Oh, well they're not stickers, right? Were stickers the thing stickers? Sticker. twenty nineteen. I guess that was sticker time, wasn't it, twenty nineteen? Yeah. We had a stickers. iMessage apps. Do you remember iMessage apps? I remember Federico making John cover stickers in uh in the newsletter. Will we alternate? Well John w I did a make John. John wanted to.

Hm I mean I remember being at release notes. I don't remember if this was the one you were at or not. And I and I vividly remember John being very unhappy about it. He was stuck in the hotel room covering sticker packs and we went out to lunch. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. True or false? As part of Clips 2.0, they added landscape orientation support on the iPad. Yes, true. Yeah, I'll take true as well. Trick question. It was part of clips three point oh. I took them it took them three med releases to add.

Let's get it. Questions go, that one sucks. Like the trick question would be it was landscape but not on the iPad, right? Not like oh it was a different version number. Yeah. But yeah, you got us! True or Clips was eventually upgraded to support sixteen by nine vertical video. I think false. Uh you also think false. It is true. They eventually came around. Yeah. Congratulations. Also point of clips three point oh.

So it went they got to three point oh wow. So they went from I guess Vine to Instagram stories, right? Is what they were kind of like. Yeah. That's kind of the stretch of time, I think. Um'cause it was square to like portrait. Yeah.'Cause I don't think that would have been TikTok then. I don't think so. Um so you did pretty well. I didn't keep score or anything, but you knew clips better than you thought you would. That's good. I start all of them Yes. All right. So tell us about Star Wars. No.

Yeah, Apple clips two point oh selfie sc scenes taps iPhone ten and Star Wars. So there's like the Millennium Falcon. You could be at the Millennium Falcon. Oh, and also you could be a Force Ghost. Oh that's good. That was a thing you could do. I remember being a force ghost. Yeah. So in October of twenty twenty five, Apple announced that Clips was no longer being updated and was no longer available for download by new users. Twenty twenty five? twenty twenty five. Wow.

If you had October 25, not even a year yet. If you had downloaded it previously, you could go into your history and re-download it. Um It will run on iOS 26 and earlier. No promise of future support.

Users were encouraged to save their videos. You could save videos with any effects or individual clips without effects. So they gave you lots of export options. I didn't really use clips for anything serious. I'm sure I downloaded it. I did download it because it was in my history because I went and looked for it. Um, because I'm sure we talked about it at some point. But as my parting gift to you In episode six hundred.

I've made a clips video that I'm putting in the Discord right now, it'll be in the show notes. People can go enjoy. Just thirty seconds. Um maybe maybe y'all could um uh talk through this video, narrate it for people. Oh my god. All right. It says breaking news, it says at the top. Breaking news. Steven's doing some real vlog in And it's doing some live captions of him. Oh, and here we go. We're like looking at some old computers in like a cartoon style. Oh, here's Albert the King.

We're doing one of those fan cams of Albert now. Oh this is this is some ubiquity gear. Yeah. Oh, and Steven's falling over and it's and it's Steven's dead. Oh, that's a shame. Incredible. That was really good. Stephen. Thank you. I'm just gonna say this, you could just turn you could turn this into your We need more we need more uh Albert Fan camp. Yeah. And also just just general Steven Clips videos. Maybe. May I just use clip? Yeah.

Yeah. And then over time you would have to like keep old hardware to keep so you could run it. You know, like it just feels very much like a Steven thing. It's already janky. Like it works on twenty six, but of course the UI is all like iOS seventeen and eighteen. Yeah. It has like Soundtracks you can download and they work, but the downloads are very slow. Like one computer somewhere is hosting them. It's also running OpenClaw for Ed EQ and the They just snuck it in. It's stuck in there.

Uh, and so I was gonna put it on YouTube just to have a a cleaner link for the show notes. And YouTube uh had a copyright mark on the music, even though it's supposed to be royalty free. So That's hilarious. It's uh on five twelve pixels. That's really funny. I guess well, I guess they let the rights expire for that piece of music, wherever Apple got it from, right? I bet it I bet it expired and no one in Cupertino noticed. Did it still have the Star Wars stuff in there and stuff like that?

Not that I so not that I saw 'Cause I could imagine maybe the deal for that stuff may have expired expired. Yeah. Maybe they pulled it out. Yeah, it it definitely felt like A lot of the UI was sort of stripped down from maybe what it once was. And it's also just really weird. Like the live titles are a separate thing than recording video. You can't tell it this is a video clip, add titles to it. It's a It's very old school in many ways. Um, but yeah, that's the end of my clip show for you.

Amazing. Thank you, Stephen. This is really good. This is really good. You never know what you're gonna get when it says hold for someone uh in in a document. And I was very nervous at the beginning that I thought you were just gonna read the Wikipedia page for clips out of. Yeah. Uh but you really you really y this was like you very much bowled this where we started at a certain level and you bowled it up

To quiz and then pulled it up even further to content creation. So bravo. There's a that's the old double ball they call it Federation. Full honor. Yeah. Yes, you really you ottered it. You smashed that to pieces just like an auto would. I did. Uh yeah, it was it was a joy. Um That's it. That's that's episode six hundred. We did it. Hooray. We did it. And this is unfortunately is the last episode of Connected. Thanks for listening, everyone. No, no, no.

We've loved doing this show so much. Unfortunately our relationship has become too fractured at this point. It's an artifice. It's all fake. This whole show is written by Steven every week and he's had enough of writing it. So goodbye everybody.

That's not Uh if you wanna find links to the stuff we spoke about, just uh a breathtaking Amount of things this week. Uh, you can go to your podcast play or you can go to the web at relay.fm slash connected slash six. There you can leave us feedback or you can go to connectedfeedback.com, drop us a note, and you can join and get Connected Pro, which is the longer and ad-free version of the podcast that we do each and every week. So at the beginning of each episode, we do a special topic.

This week we spoke about framework and their uh new laptop uh thirteen laptop thirteen pro laptop. Whatever they call it, the n the name is bad. Whoa. Just the laptop. Laptop thirty. Thirteen Pro. 13th pro. Uh fascinating company. I think we're all very interested in what they're doing. Uh so we talked about that. No ads. And then at the end we pick titles and subtitles and sometimes wrap things up. So you can get all of that. It's just seven bucks a month. GetConnected Pro dot co.

You can find Prince Flexi Federico at maxstories.net where he makes John cover sticker packs. No, not true. They don't publish it. Tom Tom uh Tom? John is as we call him. He's just a man of habit. Federico doesn't even want him to do it anymore, but he just can't stop. Yeah. Uh yes. And you guys spoke about frames four last week, which I loved the conversation. It's awesome. Um Thank you. So if you haven't played with that, dear listener, go seriously go check it out. Thank you, thank you.

Mike hosts many other shows here on Relay, and you can check his workout at Cortex Brand, and you can read his blog at theenthusiast.net. Yeah, I need to post that blog. You need to have a post and be like, I'm back. I'm back to posting. I'm back to blogging everyone. I'm back on my cadence now here. Right. Uh I am your attorney general Flexi. You can find my writing at five twelvepixels.net. And where can they find your clips videos? Uh five twelve pixels dot net

No, like where else are you gonna post? On Instagram? Uh yes, I will put it on Instagram, uh isomate. On Instagram. I almost forgot. I'll post it today though. No, it'll be later in the week. Yeah,'cause then you don't want you don't want to spoil it. Yeah, I'm I'm gonna put it in my task manager. Post clips video. Yeah. Wow. I like that we've made ship Oh IG, look at that. Probe Federico. He's like such a content creator. Friday. Three thirty PM.

Is that omnifocus? Is that where that went? I don't want to talk about that. Yes, it is. It is. Okay. I'm like, whoa, he's done it again. I'd like to thank our sponsors this week, Kelford Inc., Apple Cat, and Fundera, powered by Nerdwallet. To thank you for listening, putting up with us all these years. We're not going anywhere. So until next week, boys, say goodbye. Cheerio. Bye y'all.