Hi, my name is Uzo Aduba. Ich bin da schon berufig. Benner-Sews, Walken-Lews, Klein-The-Fans, Books and Pens. I can tell that we are going to be friends. I can tell that we are going to be friends. Hey there and welcome to Conan O'Brien Needs A Friend. A podcast where I'm joined as always by my bosom buddies, Sonom Obsessin. Mac Corley. Nice to see you both. It's nice to see you too. Yeah. Meist du dich eine quick question? Ich bin super. Ich bin super. Ich bin super.
Wenn du travel, du denkst, du bist nicht mehr sicher. Nein. Du bist nicht wirklich zu tun, oder? Was denkst du? Was denkst du? Was machst du? Du bist ein Maskenstoff oder bist du ein Pfeil? Du bist ein Pfeil? Du bist ein Pfeil? Nein. Du bist ein Pfeil? Nein, ich bin nicht. Ich glaube, wenn ich die Leute hier sehen, ich denke, ich würde es nicht machen. Aber ich bin nicht zu tun. Und dann bin ich ein Stück weiter. Ich bin mein Mouth und mein Ton auf der See.
Nein. Ja. Wenn ich die See, dann ist es gut. Ich weiß nicht, es ist cool. Was? Und ich ziehe die Armrest. Es ist ein bisschen minty, aber es ist ein bisschen... Was ist das? Ist das ein Pork? Was ist das? Was ist das? Ist es ein Pork? Nein, es ist nicht ein Pork. Ich will nicht sagen, du bist ein Pferd. Ich denke, die Leute sind dick. Ich ziehe die Armrest und die Schlöße. YY grants sich ein Pferd. Nein, das heißt, die Schlöße trainieren, SpirREYst du an sie? Nein, das ist ein Sp surely. Aye ne.
Nein! Ich hab so viel gewac然 liegt. Ich habe keine Be Solidaruse focal, mir die mering že дich da und ich ex- Spuiый lay in die Stadt. Oder wäre ein Mann? Ja. Neh! mum trouver Orten. Hello, yeah, but the show. Three of us. You can just look at us. We are shocked. The president has put a lot on the show today. You know? Thvaa, I think, I don't think we can do it.
Es ging schluckig an einander auf wie der Kouch nach Standard habe Und das macht einトijod, dass ihr die Farbe vor collections peripheral ahora businessman Also was tun sie so ein Илиacz im Kopf der Schicksals? SRS ums Nak own zu absent lassen Ich weiß es nicht, ein schweres Freund Sie ist sein Erster So, when they set the camera up, they didn't know what they would find. So, they had no idea. But, like, things like chairs would have, were, like, weirdly placed, things were weird.
And they were like, this guy's, just guys a little off. Maybe the imprint of his face was in the couch cushion. Do you know what I mean? Every cushion was like the shroud of turn. Yeah, that's gonna say it's like a Roman death mask. Yeah. They just, they just saw this face, this death mask, perfectly imprinted on their couch. Seat sniffing, I never even think about that. Yeah. But now that you hear about it, what was I doing?
Why am I licking the armrest on the aisle seats when I could be sniffing the seats? No, none of that appeals to me. Now, the reason I did ask, Rape Stance, the reason I did ask is that one of our guests recently, Rashida Jones, right, I was chatting with her and she was talking to me about, we were talking about travel and I said, you know, I travel a lot for these max travel shows and I'm always catching a bug. Yeah. I just, I get run down, the hours we shoot are really long.
I'm on all these planes. I shake a lot of hands and she gave me a list of things that I should bring with me when I travel. And it's the most copper, it's a very long list of all kinds of stuff, including like a copper, a piece of copper that you put in your nose that I think kills bacteria. Oh. I don't know. And the reason I bring it up is that my wife is really into this too. Liza is really into.
Yeah. She reads up about home remedies and ways that you can, you know, keep bacteria, they are booster immune systems. She's always drinking very special herbal teas at night. Uh, I don't do that. But does, like, when you go to a hotel, because I've heard the remote control is the dirtiest part of the hotel, do you, does she like wipe that down before you guys sit? I use the remote control to stir my cocoa. I'm like, I'm going to stir this up. I guess I'll use the old remote.
They'll say there's a spoon right there. I like the remote better. Are you a remote sniffer? I don't know. I don't think there's enough immunity stuff in the world to stop you from getting sick. Because you've traveled with me all over. I always get a cold or something. Nothing bad, nothing that bad. I just get, uh, but it's not because if you're immune system, because I actually think you have a pretty good immune system. It's because you're talking to everybody.
You're like close and everyone's like breathing on each other. And then you just shoot for hours. And then you like are, you know, you push it so much. And you help me a path that cure for that kind of thing. You're just too much in contact. What's called, if I had self-esteem, uh, I think what Rashida should have done is said, oh, they also make self-esteem in a pill. You could have that. Yeah. But, um, no, I appreciated a lot of her stuff looked really good. I just think you're right.
I'm, I will talk to everybody. I'll get like two hours of sleep. Yeah. The whole time. I'm not licking the, uh, the aisle armrest. But I'm, I'm talking to people very close. I'm just thinking when the like apocalyptic plague finally comes, you're going to bring it to the States. I think it's going to be you. Oh, your patient zero. Yeah. The patient zero. Patrick Dempsey and Contagion or whatever that one. Wait, what a weird reference. I know. No one really knows. Outbreak.
Outbreak. Yeah. What a weird reference. Yes, so now. So now would you just? What I just corrected you. Wasn't that wasn't it outbreak? You're right. But how weird is it? Who else isn't that? So he's patient zero. Yeah. And then Dustin Hoffman was in it. Renee Russo, that movie, like traumatized me a little bit. Yeah. Yeah. Morgan Freeman. Donald Sutherland. Yeah, a movie that prophesies us a worldwide outbreak. Good thing. That never happened. Happened. Happened. Happened. Happened. Happened.
Happened. Happened. Waaaaam. It's the beginning of a rock song. Oh. Oh. Oh. Well, I think what we learned is that nothing I do will help me when I travel. Right? Yes. Nothing will help you. Sonar runs in a circle of seat sniffers. Yeah, that. I want to know. I love people. That's when I want to hear more about. I've never done that. I've never set up, you know, a camera in a room because I suspected something. I should start doing that. Yeah. God forbid someone does it to me.
Here are some four cameras in this room right now. Yeah. Wait, there are cameras in here? Yes. Oh no, I come in here at night a lot. I mean, I mean, just the idea that like he's like, everyone's gone. It's time to sniff some seat. And did you guys just step out of the room for a while? I wasn't there. This is like something I heard. But yeah, yeah, yeah. They like strategically left him alone in the room. And what are they doing? They're just waiting while he's sniffed seats.
I think they're just like giving it a minute and then they went back and like, you know, he was like, uh, everything's cool. I wasn't doing any. Oh, you didn't quickly get back in position. And then they went in and took him here later when they did they sneak sniffing? Yeah. No, no, sneak sniffing here. That's how nervous he is. No, sneak sniffing here. Say it makes me seem a little guilty. No, no, no, no, sneak sniffing here. You never know. Someone can be sniffing these seats.
Oh, no. You don't know. Good luck to them. Yeah. Yeah. No, not good luck to them. I'm not going to go to them. We sure are. We're always in the same seat. I move between these seats. You, but yeah, you move between seats. But this seat right here, Mark's pure Conan. That territory is marked. Oh, come on. Come on. I would go. You know what? Honestly, if I was in a sniff, I'd sniff whichever one. Ted Danson always sits in. Yeah. Yeah. Is it Conan? Oh, yeah. But you know what?
I don't want to sit in. Whatever. Whatever. Cool, beautiful, amazing aura scent that he has. I've ruined it with my old potato scent. Is it weird? I just said that. No, not at all. No, not at all. I mean, if it was Genders were a verse, you'd be a creep. That's true. But you'll get away with murder. All right. My guest today is an Emmy award-winning actress. Who starred as crazy eyes on the hit Netflix series Orange as the New Black.
She now has a new memoir titled The Road Is Good, How a Mother's Strength Became a Daughters Purpose. I'm thrilled she's here today. Who's so aduba, welcome. And I just tell like a really quick story. Sure. Okay. The reason why I'm interested is being friend us, because the first time I did your show, it was the first time someone made me feel completely comfortable. I'd always been so nervous. Wow. Yeah. I'd always been so nervous on like television and like, I don't know, just nervous.
It was so new to me, generally. And I just felt like relaxed. I felt like we were really listening and generally interested in what was going on. And I just felt like myself. So I'm interested in being kind of around. That's what I'm used to. I liked it. No, I mean, I'm glad you had that experience. And that was always what I was aiming for was to just tell people, it's just me. This isn't a big deal. We're hanging out. And then there happens to be some lights and cameras here.
But I'm glad you felt comfortable. And you told me just now in the green room that there was a strange series of events because it was your first time doing my show on late night. And you had to leave and go directly from there to the White House. Is that right? Yes, correct. So it was like this crazy, you know, like mix of events coming into place. And one of them was I had the exciting experience of getting to be on a Conan show.
And then the next day, I've been invited to the White House for the African Summit dinner. There'd been a summit all week there in DC at the White House by President Obama and First Lady Michelle Obama, which was like massive, like mind blowing. And both was like, and I was such a fan of your show too. I was like, oh my God, this is so wild. We're going to be on the Conan right. You know what really is? No, it really is two events of equal in one.
No, seriously, it's like late night appearance with Conan and you know, is here and then right there on the same level. It's like you have to pay the African conference, which by the way, I was not invited to again. Unbelievable. Unbelievable. Yes. Anyway, it was uncomfortable. Everyone there was like, why isn't Conan here? This isn't right.
You know, it's so crazy, which is I'm just curious what your feeling was going in and meeting the Obama's at the White House because it's they are very good at making people feel comfortable. Do you know what I mean? And especially First Lady Obama was, and since then, and the interactions that we've had, she calls it as she sees it. She's just very easy to talk to. A thousand percent.
Like, I don't know how somebody can simultaneously match the level of the office and the esteem and the elegance and the sophistication and importance of an office while simultaneously making you feel like you're just coming into their, you know, den or something. You know, and just coming to pay a quick little visit. You came from around the corner, which I absolutely did not. But it was amazing.
And honestly, I think I can count it, you know, now, you know, I've had a baby and since gotten married. So those are incredible days. But I guess tied with that was like the best day of my life because I brought my mom with me. And that was like the first question. I was like, can I bring my mom in there? Yes, you can bring it guys like that's happening. And my mom, who was just, that was her president. She can always be like, my president, my president Obama.
That's how she would always say, you know, and she loves them. And I did too. And that was the first president that I'd ever like stumped for and came this way and gave like the $10 they had, you know, like struggling actor, you know, whatever. And I just remember walking up to meet them. And I'm going to do a terrible president Obama. But he's like, hello. And I was like, hi, how are you? He's like, my name is Ooz. He's like, I know who you are. And I was like, what?
And then he's like, who's this? You, you owe the federal government $30,000 in back Texas. That's why you're here today. That's why he's focused on. And then he was like, who's this? It was my mom. And it was just wild because I was like, my mom shaking his hand. And honestly, you guys, I was like, my family's from Nigeria. Both my parents immigrated. You know, tough stories. Some assemble humble humble beginnings. And I was just like, looking at my mom.
Like this woman from Obusi in a number estate in the country of Nigeria is now in the White House in a single generation of living in this country. And I was like, this is the top. I don't think it gets better in the month. Well, that's what, that's the American story. And it's, it's best.
You know, there's, there are many American stories, but at its best, it's someone can come from Nigeria and in their lifetime have children and then go with one of those children's invited as an honored guest of the president because of what they've made happen on their own with the help of their family, whatever. But, but in the arts, whatever, that's, that's the idea. That's funny because we are talking today about your book, which is about to come out. And it's called The Road Is Good.
And The Road Is Good is the translation of what your name means in Nigerian. Is that right? Yes. So my tribe in Nibo, my tribe, it means The Road Is Good. And, and what it really even more like nuanced means, it means the journey was hard, but it was worth it. Yeah. That's cool. And it's like, you would say that, Uzzamaka, like say you were coming to visit my house and, you know, you're running late and then you're stopped in traffic.
And then there's rain all over the road and, you know, there's a pile up and, you know, what was snow suddenly here in Los Angeles. All of it. And then you get there, like tired and wet and drained and like, I opened the door and I'm like, hey, Makka, what was the journey? And you'd say, Uzzamaka, you know, it was hard, but it was worth it because I'm here now. And that's what beautiful that your name means that. You know, Conan is gay like for the face is wide. And most of those are very true.
Both contain a beautiful truth. I've got a fat Irish face. But we both come from, it's, you're from Medfield, Massachusetts. Yeah. And I was telling you, I was in Massachusetts yesterday. I came back last night. I had a gig, a performance that I did in Rhode Island and then I went up north to see my parents and my brothers and my sister and they're in Massachusetts. So I was just there and I'm thinking we probably have similarities in the way that we grew up in Massachusetts.
And I'm also imagining big differences. And you talk about this in your book, you're growing up in Medfield, Mass. Yes. And are you the only black student in your area or did you feel, did you feel like you were an alien that had dropped onto another planet or did you feel comfortable? At times, an alien and then a times comfortable. I mean, first of all, a yes. Outside of my siblings, yes, I was like the only one, you know. There were two others in my entire school, you know.
So there's a level of it that was comfortable because that's all I knew having grown up there. And I was used to it, but then there's moments that happen as you mature and you grow and you start to notice like the absence of you that you're wondering why, why am I the only person here? Like where is everybody else? You know, like how come I only see them on the weekends when I go to these e-boat meetings with my family?
Or just even like in smaller things, you know, I would watch every member, there was one year, Disney, you know, the Wonder World World of Disney, like me on Sundays would do their movies and they had done an adaptation of polyanna. An all black adaptation called poly and was with Felicia Roshad. It's amazing, by the way, if you've never seen it, I love it. I have an undebrede to this day. It's called poly with Felicia Roshad, Keesha and I poly up.
Brian Adams, who was like my first like crush and I remember getting excited because my friends at school, we'd always watch all the like movies whenever. And then I came one day ready to talk about poly and nobody had seen it. And I was like, how did you miss this genius work that just came up, you know, but that just wasn't on the radar.
So those were the moments where you started to notice the gaps, I noticed the gaps, you know, we're like talking about hair or braids or moments where people, you know, I have like my hair out and then have braids the next day. And they'd be like, how did your hair grow so fast? And I was like, I don't know how, you know, I just realized that there was a different understanding of culture. Sure. I would think.
Because you talk in the book, which congratulations, by the way, it's an amazing story. And it's a beautiful story because you're really writing this. It's your story, but it's also a tribute to your mom, who passed in 2020. Yeah. You know, one of the first things that I clocked when I was reading the book is your mom, she died too early. But she got to see all your success. That's right. And for me, that's the big blessing. She got to see your crazy success because it was a long road for you.
But I was watching, noticing in the early part of the book, you're talking about how you really didn't, you're uncomfortable with your name because people had a hard time pronouncing it. So you told your mom you were thinking of changing it to Zoe. Yeah. And your mom had this genius response. And I was like, because they can't say, and without skipping a beat, my mother was like, you can learn to say, And she just went back to cooking and it was like the end of it.
Yeah. You know, Mike, Mike dropped a total of my drop. And she had been through it before I have an older sibling, my older sister, she, her name is Omi, she wanted to be called Tony, you know. Well, that's just confusing. The same. Hey, Tony! And she'd already said the same thing to her, you know, and what she was really just like establishing right there at the door was who you are is okay is enough and everybody better get used to it. God bless. You were good student, great athlete.
You were interested, you were, I mean, you very serious figure skater. Yes. For years and years. Yes. And you were interested in going to the Olympics and you had a lot of ability and then your parents come to you and say, we can't afford this anymore. Yeah. You know, one of five kids and, you know, we had a pretty humble upbringing and we're ready there were two of my siblings were in college.
And it was just, it's a figure skating is a very, very expensive sport for people who don't know, you know, there's skates and ice time and coaches fees, choreography, costumes, travel. And then my parents were doing the best they could, you know, to keep up, but as the hours were growing in just in that year when I had stopped, my coach at the time had said, you know, she actually needs to skate more, put in more hours.
And, you know, we can see where this goes and at that point my parents were already, you know, pretty stretched then. And they were like, my mom is having down at a competition and she was like, this is going to be the last one. This will be the last one. She's like, we can't afford it anymore. This is like a college education, you know, we don't have it.
And it was tough at the time, you know, as a kid, you don't have that same understanding and I didn't have the level of understanding or maybe even appreciation. Some level of what had already been exposed and sacrificed for me. But when I look back on it now and think about it, I'm like, wow, you know, there was skating, there was violin, there was cello, there was ballet, there was hockey, there were so many things that my parents saw when they came to this America as my mom would always say.
That was opportunities and exposures and experiences that just did not exist, holi did not exist for them as kids. That it was like, wow, they did everything they could, they stretched it to the line to try and make it happen for their kids and just give them a taste, even if they had to, they couldn't serve you the whole meal. You know, they wanted to give you just a taste of what this, the possibility of America.
Also, I have this theory that good work is never wasted. So if you at a young age for many years work very hard on figure skating and the training and the dedication and repetitive honing of a certain skill over and over and over again, is an amazing thing to learn. And that's going to be with you clearly, you take that because that doesn't work out, but then you get interested in theater and you apply that to acting. And so all hard work is preparation for something else.
It doesn't, people get too literal and think, oh, that was all wasted because you're not a professional, you're not an Olympic figure skating champion. No, that all went into something else. 100,000 percent, like having played done track and field as well and figure skated like for so long, which are individual sports for the most part, you know, like self motivating is something that I've learned since I'm five, you know what I mean?
Good head talk being able to like talk my head into doing something that I want to achieve because you have to do that for the three and a half or four minutes on the ice, you know, you have to develop a good head talk, you have to develop a good head talk when you're in the blocks running track to get your mind in the place that needs to be to achieve. And listen, guess what, if that's not true for me, I have a daughter now, I can shove these dreams under her.
I can't be a total tiger mom. You know, it's crazy. It's, and it's this part of the book that is, is hard to believe, but you're doing theater and you're auditioning auditioning auditioning auditioning, trying to get these different roles and you're getting by, but a huge part of auditioning is disappointment, disappointment. So you auditioned for Orange is the new black, haven't heard back yet and you decide, I think I'm out, I think I'm done. So you decided more or less to quit. Yes.
Then you get the phone call. Is that correct? That is 100% correct. And it was also, by the way, the first time I'd ever quit. I have never quit anything before. And I was, and I never quit this more specifically acting. I had, you know, doubted, I have questioned, I have been exhausted, but I've never in my mind been like, I'm done. And it was a Friday. And I was just wasted, you know, I had been auditioning for film and television the whole summer.
Oh, exclusively, I saw my bank account, like disappearing gone pretty much. And just kept hearing no after no after no. And I had made it up in my mind. I was on Monday going to call my agent and call my manager and tell them that I was going to go to law school. The ultimate humiliation. And keep. But I know, yeah, I was like, imagine there are lawyers listening right now. I hung you in another day.
But I did. I was like legit. That was what I was going to do. I call my sister, Chi Chi. I ordered some wine. I ordered some sushi. And we were going to be like an out party. And then 5.45 pm on the nose. And my phone rang. And it was my team saying, hi, how are you? I was like, I'm good. How are you? And they're like, remember that audition? You went on for that show oranges a new black. And I was like, yeah, I remember the part you went out for.
And I was like, yeah, I remember. Well, you didn't get it. I was like, I'm leaving it the right time now that agents are calling you to tell you when you don't get jobs. This is a new part of our service. But you failed. And we want to talk about it for like 40 minutes. And I was like, okay, they were like, but they'd like to offer you another role. And I was like, wow. And it was I'd never done anything on TV as wild. And I was just like, this is crazy.
And I definitely did not know at all for real, for real, for real, for real, for real, that that was going to change my life in anyway. And knew that it kept me in, you know, like, but I had no idea that it was going to do anything. And I talked about this in the book. So you, you get the role of crazy eyes. And the time between you getting that role, I think it's within within a year, maybe less between getting that role and sitting at the Emmys nominated.
When you hear your name, yes, as the winner, yes, that's that's fantastic. And who gives you the Emmy Morgan Freeman. Morgan Freeman. It was wild. I was like walking up there. And I was like, for some reason, listing like his resume. And I was like, glory. Bruce Almighty. Driving the stick. Yeah. Shosh. And a favorite. Like going. Yeah. This guy's amazing. Yeah. And he was just handing it to you. He started talking about the life cycle of the penguin. No more again. No.
Yeah. But I mean, it's such a funny thing about this business, but talk about famine and then feast. It's just there are long periods or stretches of disappointment and misery. And then I'm always reminded of there's this movie that was made, I believe in the in the 1950s. And it's one of the later Humphrey Bogart movies, Humphrey Bogart, Catherine Hepburn.
It's a great movie called the African Queen. And it's about the they're basically it takes place in the beginning of World War One. And they're trying to make their way down this river because this they have this idea that to accomplish this mission together. And they're in this tiny little boat. And it's impossible.
And they're going and they're going and they're going and then finally and John Houston directed this movie. And they there's the scene that just resonates with me so many times where the river has gotten really low. And so Humphrey Bogart is pulling them through the river and he's covered in leeches.
And then finally the weeds just get too thick and they feel like we'll never get to the main river we're going to die here. And they resign that it's over and they get back in the boat. And he takes the leeches off of him peels him off and then they just cover under a blanket and they've lost. And the camera pans up.
And you can see that they're about 20 feet from the river that always hits me that's happened to me so many times in my life where I didn't know how close I was and what happens is overnight at rains and their boat just floats onto the river. But I think about that just that image a lot which is you got close to saying well this isn't going to happen. And if you could pan up it's like no no you are seconds. Yeah seconds from being there. Yeah you just didn't know.
I need that message B. Thank you. Yes like I didn't I really didn't like I felt like all the time that I had put into this thing that I loved and I love it you know like I really love it I love it still you know and to not feel like I could do it.
Like would get was getting to do it you know what I mean was really tough to wrestle with and make pace with and I didn't want my I said this since the beginning I'm like the minute and I do mean the exact minute that I no longer enjoy this I will go find something else to do.
And I was just feeling like this. Seer in this this this this worry really that I was not going I couldn't love this this idea of just trying to make something happen that maybe God the universe or an energy whatever we're calling it was telling me very clearly like no this is not for me and then you know when that happened it made me think of that quote from the God for me.
It's like just when I thought I was out they pulled me back in you know and I tried to get out and it was like no you're supposed to be doing this it came like right in the minute that I needed to happen like I said and it was not something that I had any expectation of other than the two to three episodes that I was asked to come on to do and that felt like enough when I got them to like when I did two episodes I was like that was enough and they're like we're going to see back I was like oh my gosh I'm going to get to do that 30.
It was awesome you know what I mean like and I was cool with that you know it was like it was totally enough and then it became more than enough and I was like wow right just one way then what really happens in the show is cycle is then nothing becomes enough. What you call this first class I can't lie down completely. It is there is a sick thing I've witnessed God blessed it's never happened to me more tea please.
And then later you get you get to you play Shirley Chisholm just this great historic character and you get an Emmy for that as well and it's just and like I say it's when it starts to rain it really pours I mean to me because so much of this book is about your mom and getting strength from your mom and perspective from your mom and reading your mom's journals and going back and reading after she passed her journals and there's a part where you're reading her journal and she's
writing in her journal you didn't know this at the time but man I'm really worried about who's so I don't know that she's going to make it and she would you know leave food and put food in your refrigerator like she after I moved you know I'm reading these true story like reading these journals and it's like she's in there just like constantly you know like this path that I've chosen she's like praying for things that's prayed every night like she's like I pray every night and ending her journal to that ooze also I'm going to do that.
I'm worried about it. She never calls me if she needs money she called today and I gave her what I had you know and it's like she stressed out she would come up the first time she came when I moved to New York and I didn't have anything that was waiting tables and anything in my fridge and she was like what way is your food and I was like you know I just eat at work it's fine you know like they give a premail you don't know if any of you guys waited tables you know like
they give you a premail there I was like they give me a premail there and so I eat that and you know in the morning I just have like a little oatmeal or like some couple hard boiled eggs that's fine and right before she's leaving she took me to the stop and shop it so I was in Queens she took me to the stop and shop over there in sunny side a store on the Astoria line which is a big grocery store and she was like get whatever you want and I was like no I'm signing she's like whatever you want
and she like would come and either bring food from home or like help me stock up my fridge because she was like I can't do much but I can do this you know and would just like you know contributed that way and I'm forever grateful my mom was an amazing lady I just need to go on record as having said that she was not a good mother she was an excellent mother well I mean that's such a big part of this book talking about that said your mom was very
very not a tall woman she's like five feet tall yeah but she seemed really tall to you huge she was a giant to me my whole life in my child memory and probably because I'm like two feet looking up at her you know what I mean like and I don't think it was until well well well adulthood that I realized it was like your like not only are you not tall you're actually short like you know like you're small but she was wearing incredibly like high platform she got these Elton John shoes
that's right Elton John estate sale that's right she wore them to intimidate took them off when we were all you know like she yeah she was that and like but she was like spunky and like had such a big personality and like you know I was trying to be I'm the big big personality to her by house and like you know would talk and be like now we need to do it this way by moms like number one comment to me all the time was there's only one captain on this ship and you're looking at that
but it's interesting is you talk about so much people always think they need to change or mold themselves to make it when sometimes for example you you know like the way that you said I wanted I was interested in you were interested in changing your name and you were younger you were interested or you had people tell you early on in acting you've got this gap in your teeth you should probably do something about that and there are a lot of people who go through these cosmetic changes
to try and fit into something that someone else thinks they should fit into but now that whole idea just seems crazy it does and I can't imagine if I had done that you know frankly for me you know there were so many pictures of me when I look at myself as a small kid I just did not smile because I was so conscious of my gap I do this like you know close mouth smile my mom would be like smile smile smile and then my senior year I had a photographer for my senior yearbook portrait
you know you get your senior pictures it's like the fancy one like yeah right so we had like the outside guy coming like do the like your book picture and you know like every time we'd be talking I'd be smiling and then as soon as he picked up the camera to shoot I'd close my mouth and not smiling
he's like why do you keep doing that you know what's that about and I was like I don't like my smile and he was like really I think you have a beautiful smile and I didn't smile in that picture but I did immediately the rest of that school year start smiling
and even now when I walk on carpets and I'm supposed to give you know like face or whatever I find myself wanting to smile on it's because I want to make up for these lost smiles you know and I feel like it's such an identifier for who I am and you know like if I change that you know like that's so much of my ancestry in this space between my teeth it's who I am it's the smile my aunt has it's the smile my great aunt had you know it's it's a smile so many of my cousins have
we call it my mother's maiden name I'm your cool gap you know and I would have taken a piece of myself away and now I just wear it proudly and when asked to take it out in the beginning of my career I had a choice and there was an early part of my life when I wanted to really fit in and thought taking away the parts of me that made me unique would make me better and at this stage of my life when I was approached with this idea of closing my gap
I really understood that the parts of myself that made me unique are actually what make me better yeah yeah it's just it takes a little bit of living to figure that out for sure when you're I had this experience where Mike Wallace the great you know like journalist and host of 60 kind of the one of the lead hosts of 60 minutes he was on our show once and this has been much commented on I'm not just white I'm translucent
I go beyond white I'm a whole other thing and a side effect of one of that is that I have this vein underneath my eye that you can kind of see and I remember I was doing a you know talking to the great Mike Wallace and we're having this interview
and then I say okay well you know we'll take a break we have more with Mike Wallace right after this band and Mike Wallace just takes his finger and he reaches over and he puts it on the vein underneath my eye and he said what are you going to do about that and the thing is he wasn't being mean he was well no I have a lot of respect from Mike Wallace and he was very nice to me what he was kind of doing was just saying like as a guy who'd been in broadcasting since the 1940s or 50s
he was kind of just saying oh yeah that's something you're gonna you know you're because I was early in my career who was probably saying like oh yeah so what so what do we do about that is or a kind of makeup you can put on or something or can you get get rid of it and I thought well it is I think it's supplying blood to my brain so I could just see going to a surgeon and having it removed and I'm just like welcome
over the whole section of the speaking part of my occipital lobe is gone but man his eyes look good but yeah I just remember thinking there are all these things about me I was you know I had a weird name growing up and looked a little different and wasn't sure where I fit in I'm like an Irish Catholic kid but I don't really like sports and I like to read and I have a weird brain and I remember just thinking like I don't know where I feel
another whole thing but then later on those things become oh thank god I mean I'd still like to fix the vein but what are you gonna do about that I'm having it removed tomorrow but I know it's interesting that there are many different forms that can take for lots of different people who are listening that if you can ride it out those things and I think unfortunately you know social media and also the rise of all these different cosmetic surgeries or injections people can get has
I see so many people that have clearly like injected their lips injected their faces done things and they just look like everybody else now and I think that's too bad you know I love character yeah I really do like
I love those little touches whether it's in the face and the hair and the mouth whatever that just makes you look stand in a different way and I actually think those things make you more interesting oh yeah in a beautiful way you know personally that's my my thoughts on it but well I disagree I think you're out of your mind you in the book you mentioned that as you you know as the years go by you think more and more about maybe mood would you visit or would you maybe move back to Nigeria
yeah I say move back to I mean you're not you're you're born here but you think about maybe going back to that country for a while I do think about that like repatriate there yeah I do think I do I do I really do I do and and it was something I used to sort of say like back here behind the back of my head you know abstractly that I wanted to do for you know like with my kids you know when I have them and now that my
daughter is here I do think about that because I think about the line of connection for me to the country was direct from my parents and who live there the whole lives and then immigrated to US and then when I think about her for just a section of time I would like to because it's like she's now once more removed you know and I want her to be steeped I just it's more about like I don't want to I don't want to lose the
culture for her but then I also don't want to lose it for me yeah like and I think especially now that both my parents are gone it's a way like almost like a socket of like plugging in for a little bit and getting a charge that maybe will be enough to last me the rest of my life but I also do know in having something that I'm learning right now in real time especially with motherhood is that they're with me still like my
mom I was so nervous you know when I was pregnant there were times where I was wondering you know how am I going to do this like I'm not going to know what to do my mom's not here like who's going to show me how to do this and the reality is that I've come to learn is that she soaked me in who she is and put so deeply into each of us my siblings and I so much of her belief system her values foundation how to mother that a lot of it does
come out even if she's not here so yes I want to go back so like super long answer but it's like yes I want to go back but if I don't I also do simultaneously know that that I'm I'm like soaked in it still you know yeah I had experience not too long ago where I was shooting this travel show for Max and we went back to Ireland and my brother through the help of my brother Justin and we also use this really good genealogist in Ireland
and between the two of them they figured out exactly where my town was that my great grandfather came from and I was thinking you know I'm not going to feel you know much we're going to go and we're going to see a field where you know and my people you know I had no money and they were tenant farmers and they they worked on this tenant farm in Galbally and so I was just not expecting to feel anything and I've been to Ireland a bunch of times
but I thought okay I'm just going to see a piece of land that I don't really have any connection to and I he took me there and we have it on camera but I I was blown away by how powerful it was to stand and think oh they were here and then in one day this this Thomas O'Brien I think just looked out and said we got to get out of here and I like an idiot I was looking at the gorgeous mountains and everything saying why did they leave and this woman said you can't eat the view they didn't have
food they had to go and they and so he just struck out and so that's the reason and now I'm back and I've got a camera crew drones producer standing around I flew here on a you know it's insane that I'm coming back in this way yes and I was surprised because I'm I was the sentimentality
of it and the power of it was a bit of a shock to me I didn't think that was going to happen and it does so say and I believe that and like do you think you're going to feel that way when you come with me to Ireland and look at that piece of dirt okay it's going to be very powerful for you
almost like the African summer I love a special where I take you so to my town in Ireland and try and like lot of probing like how do you feel is it hitting you I know I mean it's it's a feel but no this isn't this is a Nigeria yeah but isn't it kind of the same no not
enough when she just you can't be proud that you came back to Galbally Ireland oh who is this idiot no yeah well I'm first of all blown away that you wrote this beautiful book and shared because it's a gift to people there are a lot of people out there
who don't understand they they look at what you've accomplished and they think well you know she caught her caught her break or they don't see the whole arc and I think it's really a big part of this podcast is I I want people to understand how much
all of us have in common and that you just there's a lot of insecurity a lot of frustration there's a lot of ups there's a lot of downs and and your book Chronicles so much of that and it's I think it's going to be a tonic for a lot of people out there
so good for you thank you very much thank you very much for that thank you for having me today too well I just thought I'd probably get a free book that's how you did well as a lot of people I only book people if they're going to bring me free you took your watch
off I could take that watch she gave us books what's that she gave Sony and I free books yeah I saw her book yeah yeah plus beautiful jewelry and watches so much jewelry free trips to places we're going to Nigeria with you exactly yes you're going from here to
the old bone and actually three words are going to Ireland without we're going to go believe you're going to Hawaii to visit the old bomb the bomb is just but cone is not coming right now he's not okay fine well who's oh thank you so much for being here the book is the road
is good and it's fantastic and it's out in just a few days and do yourself a favor and grab it because it's a terrific story and it's it made me feel really good reading it so and thanks for being here thank you this was awesome it's only awesome when an awesome person calls that's true it is true thank you I can I can't take non-awesome and get it to awesome I just I can't I do not have that power okay it's time to do a segment here on the podcast and you know what a segment is usually
we have an idea of what it's going to be it's like oh let's review the reviewers or you know yes one of your little tricker who is one of your some category if you will but today we really don't have an idea there was nothing loaded up and so so now the idea let's just do some verbal jazz let's just start riffing talking and the three of us because we're such great verbal tacticians musicians will find it just in the groove so this is verbal jazz with Conan, Sona
and Matt and we're just going to start talking about things and we're going to find it and we're going to find it and we're going to find a great rhythm and people are going to say hey I love that these guys can take empty air and turn it into a tonal jazz as you can tell I don't love jazz but we're just talking here we're just talking about what's going on in our lives Sona how are you?
Yeah I'm cool man you were in the same little quarterway shirt you wear all the time let's denim with whatever close to quarter I don't know what you're talking about I just said it's verbal jazz it's chilly in this studio very cold it's very hot outside but I think they overdid it on the air
I disagree I have to say I'm still burning from having been out there an hour ago it's so nice and cool in here well it's got really hot where you live I have to say you're a little cooler for you but you know that's a frying pan you're not kidding
no I'm not kidding no this isn't a joke no this is just verbal jazz we're just doing it dude really hot out there if you crack an egg on the sidewalk right now it would scream oh that's it I see what you did that's an egg yeah it was verbal jazz yeah I'll come you didn't get it I don't know what you're doing this cleaned yes my ex didn't get it I did what I did what's this the bass here I'll do a transition from信feld haha I was thinking you don't.
Erwin flu is horrible who are these people Ich denke, die Menne, die ich identifiert, misgendered your shirt, und said, Which is male. I said corner boy. Or denim. Instead of denim. And they're just, I don't know my cheap materials that well. Wow. And so, you know, I know all of my self-threadbare T-shirt. Oh please. Oh, where are your concerts? This isn't a T-shirt. I just painted my bare chest. Buh. Jazz. Verbalt jazz. Not as good as having something worked out a head of time.
Were you doing a boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom. Yeah. Depends, man, not if you're chocolate pastores. Yeah, that's right. Oscar pastores. Jack of course. Oscar pastores. Well, the former, the blade runner. Yeah. I went to prison for a murder. Jack. Verbalt jazz. Hey, you don't know what? We're on the weather one minute. Then it's Oscar pastores. You never know, man. Don't think about that guy. Let's get back to Patrick Demsie.
Yeah. That was, was it that in the intro? Yeah, that was in a different intro. I know, but same episode. You're in the way in the middle of the show. Oh, I just called back a riff from the beginning of the show. You know, I just realized he's really the only professional. He was working in podcasts for a long time before us. He's the guy that puts all these things together. You're constantly fucking up. Yeah. Calling back references that are from an episode that we take. Are you saying, Dave?
Are you saying the different mind? Fucked up somehow. So what about that? Also, he's not the only professional. You were in broadcasting for 30 years. Have you seen what I did? Does anyone think I was a professional? No, not once. Does anyone say, hey, you're not professional from the television. That's never happened. Everyone, I just, I look like someone. Yeah, exactly. I kind of am. Yeah. I refuse. I refuse to be a professional. Jazz, verbal jazz.
I think, you know, I'm, look, like jazz itself, I don't know if this is good or bad what we're doing. I know that I've been charged a cover fee to be in here. I'm having a drink. I don't understand it, but I see a lot of people around me snapping their fingers. So maybe it's good. Blake, how do you feel this is going so far? Well, you know what? I think Miles Davis once said, there's no wrong notes. It's, you know, like there's no wrong notes in jazz. It's more what comes after it.
It's kind of mixed, man. Yeah, I guess it's got, I mean, yeah, wow. Do I have my honest opinion? Yeah, no. This is unusable. It's terrible. It is terrible. It's terrible. You do, you do have the riff going of, you say, then it's jazz. So it's kind of on life support. I don't think we've really hit the point of which it's a real segment yet. Are you serious? This feels all like prologue. I agree. Don't you think it's the thing about jazz? There's not a hook. There's not a melody per se.
There's nothing that would make you want to listen to it. Yeah. No, there's there's hooks in jazz. Eduardo is upset because he has to go away with jazz. And you're shitting on jazz. Yeah, I cannot take this slander anymore. I can't even. Wait a minute. I'm talking about the basketball team. Oh, Utah Jazz. Okay. Yeah, that's not a fan. All right. That's what I've been meaning the whole time as a music form. Jazz. Fantastic. My favorite. You can't name a jazz song or a performer I don't love.
Utah Jazz. Don't get me started. Okay. They're a tonal, a rhythmic and hard to listen to. Okay, fair. Jazz. Jazz. We'll be right back. Unusable. Our Supervising producer is Aaron Blair and our associate talent producer is Jennifer Samples. Engineering and mixing by Eduardo Perez and Brendan Burns. Additional production support by Mars Melnick. Talent booking by Paula Davis, Gina Batista and Britt Con. You can rate and review this show on Apple Podcasts.
And you might find your review read on a future episode. Got a question for Conan? 2847 and leave a message. It too could be featured on a future episode. You can also get three free months of serious XM when you sign up at seriousxm.com slash Conan. And if you haven't already, please subscribe to Conan O'Brien, you need a friend wherever fine podcasts are down the moon.