Hi, my name is Lizzie Kaplan and I feel... Meh, I've had better. About being Conan O'Brien's friend. Yes! We are gonna be friends. Hey there, Conan O'Brien here. Welcome to Conan O'Brien Needs a Friend. Put a little pause there, Adam West style, to add a little drama. Yeah, it was very... Welcome to Conan O'Brien Needs a Friend. Joined by Sonam Obsession. Hello. And of course, Matt Gorley. Hello. And guess what? This is a different little take on things. I've got some gum in my mouth right now.
Oh, I hate that sound. I know, people don't like that. All right, I'm gonna take it out. But anyway, I just thought it kind of made me look like a guy that doesn't, I don't know, I don't care that much. about my work i just do it i'm just kind of an artist you know you just you forgot it in there yeah i forgot it was in there and chewing gum implies all of that to you that you don't care about your work you're an artist just because you eat chewing gum
Um, I don't know. I didn't put much thought into it. And then you asked for an explanation and the whole thing fell apart. like wet cardboard. The gum is out of my mouth. For those of you, what is it called when you hate the chomping scent? Misophonia. Misophonia. I think I have. Yeah, I've got misohonia. Oh, man. Sorry. Oh, God.
I need to go. I just wanted him to walk right into it. I want to not be here anymore. No, I've been around people that have it. And you can't do anything. You can't have soup. You can't have peanut brittle around people that have misophonia. Yeah.
What's the matter? What are you looking at me for? I'm just saying it's terrible. You're not a victim. Let's put it that way. I think I'm a victim in some ways. How so? Constant expectations of greatness. Oh, I don't think anybody expects that from you. Yeah. Wherever I go, I'm burdened by middling expectations. No, it's terrible for people that have that. And it's tough to be around. What do you mean? Like it's tough for you to be around someone who has that? Yes. My daughter was constantly...
saying I hate the way that it sounds when you consume the food that keeps you alive. I mean, in her defense, but in her defense, you eat like an animal. I mean that in a nice way, but you... The way you eat. Describe it. You've got the floor. First of all, you're angry whenever you're eating. I don't know why. I don't know if you enjoy the food. And then you inhale it as if all of your siblings are just looming over you. They were. But nobody is.
I know, but it's the phantom leg syndrome. I'll tell you why I'm angry when I eat. Because I know that the food is sustaining my life, which is causing me pain. But why can't it make you happy? You're mad at the food because it's keeping me alive. I'm mad at the food because it's keeping me alive so that all this continues. Oh, my God. Pretty dark, huh? Yeah. No, I will admit that I eat quickly.
Mm hmm. And I do. I'm getting better. I'm trying to chew the food and be thoughtful. He said lying. OK, I figured because I saw you eat not that long ago and it's the same. Really? Yeah. I didn't get any better. It's OK.
It's okay to just be you. Well, Danny, your brother, does he eat quickly or no? He eats with the calm assurance that he was the oldest. He only had one sister and no one was going to take his food. Yeah, actually, he does. Your father was in the corner brushing his mustache. He wasn't going to take it. Okay, come on. Why does it all go back to Gil and his mustache? That's a good looking mustache. There's no way that it just looks that way. He's combing it constantly.
combing his mustache constantly. Frisk him. I bet he has a tiny little comb. I'm not going to frisk my dad. Well, I'm going to have the police frisk Gil at the airport the next time he goes through. And I bet whenever he walks through the machine, he goes... Okay, so it's a metal comb? I know, what kind of comb is it? Yeah, it's metal, and they take it out, and it's this tiny little mustache comb.
And then he has to explain to them that's why his mustache looks so good. This riff's a waste of everyone's time. Gil, my apologies. I love you. You're a good man. You're apologizing. That's good. I said it quickly. Let's not draw attention to it. Look, I'm on Nev's side. Yes, I think that, and she's made me very conscious of the way I. I eat. And so she helped me that way. There's a difference between inhaling food and are you doing the kind of open mouth...
That's the thing that I have a misophonia for. I can't stand when people- An open mouth chewer? I don't think I'm an open mouth chewer. Someone very close in my life is an open mouth chewer. You talking about Jeff Ross? Jeff Ross is a chomp, chomp, smack, smack man. And I think we can all agree on that.
Chomp, chomp, smack, smack. Yeah. Okay, yeah. He'll be talking to me and be like, yeah, so anyway, and I'm like, what are you eating? And sometimes it's something that doesn't even need chewing, like a melting, what do you have there, Jeff? A melted popsicle. What are you chewing for? It's two days old. It was in the back of my car in the sun. So it's liquid. That's right. Anyway, I think we're going to go out to the East Coast.
We'll be there for the SNL thing. There's nothing in your mouth right now. Yeah, he's an open mouth chewer. Yeah. But he'll hear this. Does he listen to the podcast? I don't think he does. Yeah, here and there. But this is my way of talking to him now is through the podcast. Podcastively aggressively. You know what? This is a great, I'm very passive aggressive and this is a great way to talk to people who I know and love in my life and tell them how I really feel. That's not bad. I'm going to.
Talk to the person who does the lip smacking. Who is it? I can't say. Why? Who? Oh, wait, we're on camera. Who? Say. Oh. Why are you doing all this miming on camera? Anyone can look up. This is going to backfire. You edit it. You can easily edit out the video. Wait, you haven't told her? You haven't told her? No, I've told her, but it's gotten to the point where I can't say it anymore. Well, then this is the perfect way.
Does she listen to the podcast? Wait, I'm not even saying this is a she. No, I mean, you could have married anyone. It's legal. Sorry, Matt. I love this person more than life itself. Yep. No. And this is but a... And I have faults, too. And so I'm probably greater faults. I'm sure I have greater faults. Yeah, it's it's been discussed and it's been noted and it's been put into the record and there's nothing more I can do about it. Oh, my God. How about the two?
of you, you and this person that Matt's talking about eat, you have a time minimum. To eat a meal. And this person. What are we talking about? I don't know. I lost it as I may. Eduardo speaks. I lost it. Eduardo talks good. I lost it as I said. So you think you can put like a decibel meter on that person to make sure they don't.
a certain volume maybe. There you go. We'll fix you. But that's the problem. It's not the level of volume. It's almost worse that it's slightly quiet. Yes. Because then you start, like, I start straining to hear it. It's... It's much my fault. It's a dynamic. Yeah. And I think it's fair to say that in all relationships, especially the one you're talking about, which is a marriage. No, this is my clergyman. Okay. Yes, that's right.
Pastor Samuelson. You eat a lot of meals with them? Yeah. They always get together for beans. Yes, I take my dinners with my clergymen out in the cloister. You have oysters in the cloister. Me so horny. Listen, you've got to admit, that was the natural. It was a home run. The lights exploded. Eduardo watched me trot in slow motion around the field with Robert Redford's body. Can we please just actually give you a sandwich and say you can't...
finish this in less than 10 minutes. That would be hard. That would be difficult. I have the same issue. I eat quickly, as do most people that grew up in a prison or penitentiary. Okay. You know what? I put my arms around my food to protect it.
From my brother, Neil. Yeah. Who used one of those supermarket grabbers to reach over and get my food. He was ingenious. I didn't have this oppressive sibling thing. I think for me, it was just, let's get this over with so I can do fun things and live life. Food wasn't that exciting. Watch Star Wars again. Okay. Live life. You happen to be right. Yeah. Yes, you're correct. So I can organize my figurines. But take it easy. Boba Fett goes in front. Yeah, I don't see a problem with it.
Mandalorian goes second. You're making my point for me. R2D2 third. Well said. Sabart Rop Beep goes fourth. That one's not real. It could be. There's a new installment. So you guys understand. He keeps cranking them out because they can't stop. They don't have other content. I got a lot of editing to do on this one. Czar Darth Bixnax goes fifth. He's from the planet Orcsnax, Max!
Okay. Now you're getting personal. All right. Well, anyway, uh, yes. Live life to its, you are Zorba the Greek man. Just living life to its fullest. Mmm, this small thimble full of iced tea, decaffeinated, and then off to organize my figurines! Oh, you're one to talk, asshole! Darth Billmore! Ooh, yes, Pixie! Theodore Roosevelt, 14 volumes gotta be...
Read by news. It's called knowledge of history. The nerd off. Oh, please. I think when I read history, I'm educating myself about the history of our nation. Maybe. with an eye towards how we should move forward. What you're doing is living in a fantasy world of Gax Bixnor, Chaz Bilney, Rax Haxldax, Zorath Bithri, and Arndang Dismore. That's one character. Oh my God. All right, my guest today. Oh God. There's no transitions in this universe. They were done away by the empire.
Destroy all transitions. Excuse me. Excuse me. That was a guy. Who's that? Darth Vader? No, someone with emphysema. Okay. That makes sense. My guest today, how do we know Darth Vader didn't have emphysema? And there was no device assisting him. My guest today is a... I have some... No, no, no. I have some thinking I have to do. I have to go home and reconsider some things. You need to go look at them.
mirror for a long time, buddy boy. I can't believe you're telling me this and I'm taking it from you. I take it from you. No, not, no, no, not guessed yet. I got it. I got it. You, of all people. And you yourself are always admitting you're just projecting. Yeah. Why don't you go screw you dick wish? Dick wish. This is what you held up our guest for. I hope you're proud of yourself.
You sure showed me. I don't know how I'm going to recover from that lethal blow. My guest today. All right, I'll allow it. You know what? This is, I love this person. What's happening, son? Are you okay? I'm dying. I'm dying. I'm actually dying. My guest today. Of course, she's a very talented actress. You know her from such films, TV shows as Mean Girls, Party Down. I just she's one of my favorite people. You know that. Yeah. You can see her in the Netflix series Zero Days. She's so.
crazily talented. I also happen to know that she's an amazing person in every way. You would want someone to be an amazing person. I'm excited. I'm thrilled she's here today. Lizzie Kaplan, welcome. Well, as you're well aware, I've got a bad case with Lizzie Kaplan. She's one of my favorite people. Of all time, your work and also just you as a person, I'm just going to start off saying it. We've hung out a little bit on the side.
And I just always leave thinking, Jesus Christ, that Lizzie Kaplan. Is there anyone cooler than this woman? I have not met her. Damn. Damn, seriously. Seriously, I absolutely adore you. Thanks, Conan. And I know you're going through some stuff right now. And I know your father just passed, which is bizarre because I just went through this with my- parents uh at the in december um both of them went at the same time like it was a suicide pact which it was not
But it just sounded suspicious in the press. Like my dad went and then my mom went two days later and it just sounds like, okay, this is a murder, you know? But it wasn't. Pillow. Yeah, exactly. Her mom. Yeah, exactly. But no, so we were chatting a little bit out in the hall and I said. We don't need to talk about this, but it might be good to talk about because I just went through it. It's so fresh in my mind, the different weird feelings that you feel.
If it helps you at all, we can talk about it and then I'll charge you $350. Cool. Great. Because that's the going right. It's actually a bargain at this point. Yeah, so I like popped my Prozac right before. I did recognize that pill. Yeah. Big fan, by the way. Oh, man. Hey, keep that Prozac coming. You guys are doing amazing work. We have a bowl of it here. Yeah, right? The Coca-Cola was the original. Interestingly, I don't know if you remember this, but I met your dad.
And I had a very long chat with your father. It was at a party, I believe here in Los Angeles. And you came in afterwards and said, what were you doing? And I said, oh, me and your dad were just talking. and we talked for a really long time, and you looked aghast. Like, oh my God, what did he do? What did my father say? But I remember him very fondly. That's really nice. Thanks, Conan. Yeah, he was...
A very funny man, very strange man. It's wild. It's wild, the whole thing. And I actually kind of wish I brought him around to more parties and more things because people had... good experiences with him but yeah it's weird my mom died when I was 13 so I feel as you do but it's very fresh for you like you feel like an orphan even though you're old and
Not you. You're very young. Speaking for myself. I know what you're saying because Sona came when my parents passed. Sona and a couple of the other people, not you, Eduardo, came out. Because he had better things to do. No, right. There was a big game that night. No, it was in Boston and I didn't expect anyone to come. And so some of the people who I work with.
Flew to Boston to be there, which meant, which was very nice. It was so funny because I wanted, I just wanted to make Sona laugh. And so Sona came up to me at some point and remember I was just going like. I'm an orphan. Yeah. But playing it up for sympathy when I'm a 61-year-old white guy.
A lot of little orphan Annie gifts in the text messages. But it was just absurd. I kept saying like, I don't know where I'm going to sleep tonight. Yeah, you're going to sleep at the Four Seasons Hotel, you fucker. You know, I just... I did feel the same kind of thing, which was just, oh, I guess I'm an orphan, but I don't get to walk around with a big 1920s cap. Well...
You're welcome. See, this is why I love Lizzie. She's giving me permission. Don't limit yourself. Not now. You two of you should hop a boxcar. We should. As orphans. We should walk along together. Two scruffy orphans. Two scruffy orphans in the poor season. It's like, wait a minute. That looks... like lizzie kaplan and conan o'brien and there's an suv following them like 15 feet behind in case they need anything so anyway but yes i do i mean i i don't i couldn't even begin to wrap my
header on your version of it, which is like the one-two punch. But I do think there's something which you will never know, but there's something really... kind about it happening that way that you didn't have to have like the five years of looking after your mom without your dad and yeah that would have been brutal that's just a good chapter that nobody really needs but yeah i i just kept thinking like my so my mom died it was awful uh and also you were 13 i was 13 which is crazy uh
Everyone thinks, oh, it would be the worst if you were two or three. And I've read some about this. And it's no, if you're it's apparently the worst time is if you're a teenager. That's when it can impact you the most. Can confirm it was. horrible uh and then like every funeral after that never felt as bad you know like a grandparent would die or it just never it never hit as hard obviously and then my dad
I just assume he was 80. He was not well. It wasn't that surprising, even though it kind of was in the moment. But...
I was so, so, so fucked up over it, obviously. But I realized like it doesn't even matter if you're 13. It's your... parent your parents loom so large whatever your relationship is and we had a good relationship but even if you're not speaking to your parent if they died like that's gonna you're like it's coming for you conan yes it's gonna it's gonna get you bad probably after the oscars
I don't feel things. I think we have to get through the Soul Train Awards. And then we had Werner, the great Werner Herzog was here. He's helping us out with something in a really lovely way. But he was here and he's always been.
very nice to me and he said he had heard the news and he said Conan you only have and he said in that Werner Herzog voice one mother and one father I don't know why that's coming out Irish what the fuck happened how did he do it someone help me out here I gotta access him For and one father. That's pretty good. That's it. There you go. Thank you. I don't know why I went to the leprechaun. One mother and one father. Don't fuck it up. But you still got lucky charms.
It's always like you have one mother, one father. And I just was, I was... It's like, this is not helping. It's supposed to be coming from him. Coming from him. And he said, and there is no afterlife. They've descended into a void of meaningless madness and chaos.
Thanks, Ferner. Can I say something very quickly? He was here and obviously we all love him. And Maddie always sets out a basket of snacks and stuff. And so he was standing talking to you and some other people. And before he left, he's like, I know. It's time for me to leave. But first...
A little treat. And he went over and grabbed like a little thing and took it with him. It was amazing. He narrates his regular life like that? A little treat. And then I will descend again into chaos and madness. Anyway, yeah, it is. You're still going through it. And then what's strange is the expectation other people have for.
you, which is you just, you feel what you feel. And I'm, I don't know if it's an Irish quality or what, but I just sort of get through things. And so I've had people that have said, you just must be devastated. And I think, I don't know. I don't know what I'm feeling. And then I noticed that I had put my watch on upside down and backwards. You're trying to reverse time. Yeah, exactly. I don't know what I was doing, but my belt was on wrong. I was telling everyone.
Oh, no, no, these things, well, they lived a long life and I think they enjoyed themselves and all was well. And they went peacefully and quietly and people would say, you just put your pants on over your head and poured gravy into the bathtub. What are you doing? Yeah. Yeah, I don't know. I don't I guess it's like it's impossible for me not to just be making constant comparisons to when my mom passed away. And I had no skills, no tools, no. I mean, I had support, but.
like 13 year old friends support, which is not amazing for that situation, like as hard as they all tried. I just it was. there were so many years of it just being so, so, so hard. And now I realize like, oh, I do actually have support and a therapist. Prozac. And, you know, like a great like I will be OK. I ended up being OK the last time against the odds because that was crazy. I just like I definitely am processing it in a much healthier way. I'm letting myself be.
sad but that's not that was not easy for me to do as a kid as a kid it was just like exactly what you're saying like keeping it moving yeah armor armor armor and now it's better it's better for it to happen now and in this way but like it's fucking crazy it's just crazy i'm so i guess i'm just so sad about it which feels healthy i'll take that over angry and confused right yeah right
That's a gift to be able to feel sad. Yeah. Let me tell you. Yeah. You should try it. Please. There's no time. Now. Mattress firm. Oh, no. Don't be the villain in your, oh, sorry, we'll do that later. Oh, my God. Do you, I even remember the tagline from that stupid, not stupid, terrific mattress. Lizzie, you've described yourself as, and I can see it, that you were a tough kid. Was that before your mom passed? Is that your nature or is it?
because your mom passed at such an early age that you were a tough kid? And how were you a tough kid? It may have been in there somewhere, but no, it was after my mom thing. I look at 13-year-old kids now. And they look like tiny babies. I just remember, like my dad sent me to a therapist once. It was a group therapist. And it was a bunch of other kids who had lost a parent. And you had to...
to like hold a talking stick to talk about. And I went to it once and I was like, this is bullshit. I hate it. I'm fine. And I guess convince them, my dad and my aunts or whatever, like, I don't need to do this. I'm OK. And they believed me. And then they like never. Sent me back to anything like that or worried about me. Right. Again, I don't know how anybody was like convinced by a 13 year old saying that.
she's fine when this happens, but I think nobody else was fine in my family. So everybody was just kind of picking up the pieces. So you were not... a great target for say bullies like you would have chewed them up and spit them out or were you the bully i mean i was I don't think I was the bully. Is that what bullies say? Well, we actually have some friends here. Come on in, guys. Stephanie from Second. No, I...
Wasn't a bully. I've had the same friends since then, since before then. And they're still my closest friends now. I always think that's a great sign. And my dad was like that too. And my mom. That was a big... thing in our family without it being like a lesson that was explicitly taught. Like you just keep your friends. But yeah, nobody like fucked with me. I guess I was tough. I was angry, but I thought I was.
That was a toughness thing. Right. And I tried to be funny. And it was just like this. Oh, I remember when I was 13, like the height of humor was. The retort, your mom. So I just remember, like, say something. Somebody would say, your mom. And just like immediately the look on their face, like, oh, God, I said, oh, God. And so I would just go to like trying to make everybody else feel less uncomfortable. And I lived in that way of being for a really long time.
And now I don't care if people are uncomfortable, which feels like a win. But I didn't have that as a kid at all. Yeah. That's a great superpower to care less about what other people think. Yeah. It's like, that's just like age. Honestly, I think age helps. And I know you and I are similar in this way. I have a social media presence, but I am not on social media, meaning, you know, through Team Coco and all of our.
different subsidiary enterprises. We will post things and if something's going to go out under my name, I will craft it or approve it. But the last thing I would ever do in the world is... type my name into the web and see what people are thinking or just live in that world because I think it is pure madness, I think. And as our friend Werner would say, chaos. Chaos and darkness. And darkness. Yeah. It's so damn.
It's horrible. And I'm sure that it's been an impediment to professional things for me, but I don't care. Why? Why would you say that? Because you think you're supposed to be every day saying, this is the... The chia seed pudding that Lizzie had today. I can't do it. You're going to do it. We brought out some chia seed pudding. We're going to Instagram it right now. I don't know how to do it. I feel like a dinosaur for not doing it.
I was like right on the cusp. Now, anybody younger than me, I think like it's mandatory. They tried to tell me it was mandatory to to be on this stuff. And I just fought it and really was like. this whole social media thing is really going to blow over. This internet, I don't think it's going to stick around. And now I do sometimes think like, oh, I probably should be playing that game a little bit more, but I just can't.
Do it. I hate it. It's embarrassing. The amount of times you have to like divorce your feelings about. Your friend who you know and love in person and then their social media persona, then some people are like, I just can't. I can't reconcile those two things anymore. And it's like an illness. It's weird. The narcissism.
It's made everything fucking worse. Like, let's be real. It's made everything worse. I'm hoping because our kids are the same age, I think. Yeah. Like around three and a half. Yes. Yeah. I think I'm praying that it like isn't as. omnipresent for that. But I don't know. I don't. I really don't know. I see it. I'm staying with some friends now. I've known their daughter her whole life. She's amazing. She's 13.
She was a private school in Los Angeles. And it's like it is a fight to not give this girl a phone and access. That's a big question is when they get the phone. It was a big question for us. Yeah, because your kids are the age like this is the beta testing generation. Yeah.
stuff and now we see like oh it's bad but as a parent like i get why it's difficult i get why you don't want to be the one being like hey you're you're gonna be the one kid who doesn't have this and that's gonna make you weird and an outsider and but it's so bad it's so bad there's uh
And then there are questions the other way, which is it can be a safety thing at a certain age that if they have a phone, they can call you. And so it was a big debate. We wrestled with it a lot about what age. We had the phones implanted in utero. Oh, boy. My daughter was born. She came out with 700 likes. Wow. That's really good though. Strong presence. No, I remember us getting in.
We did pretty well. Liza would know the exact age because I was probably looking in a mirror and thinking about my career. when this decision was finally made. Your social media, the mirror. My social media is the mirror. Look at that jawline. If only those eyes were a little bigger and they popped on screen. Conan, I need help with the children. Quiet! That eye thing. You're your biggest troll. You suck. It doesn't add up to me that you would feel you needed to do anything like that.
increase my social media presence or I have to do this or do that because you're so talented. And well, no, I'm saying, I'm serious. You're so, you have, no, I'm serious. You have such, I don't see how, do you guys see what I'm saying? I don't see how anything you're doing is enhanced by, and this is how I make a Cobb salad. I don't think. I fundamentally agree with that. And I guess that's kind of like the main takeaway is...
People aren't paying attention to you that much. So, anybody. People are paying attention to you all the time, Connor. No, no. I am. You know, I looked into it. I am the exception to that rule. Yeah, yeah, yeah. You are. When people say no one's thinking about you. Except you. That's because they're thinking of Connor. No, no. Yeah, they're not. And so like they think, you know, I look at some of my friends who are myself and I think like, oh, I should be. I wish I.
did this job or did like two more jobs during this period of time. And the reality is like people assume you're working. They assume you're. busy. Nobody needs to know about like those fallow periods. And the reason why people are even thinking about it is because you feel the need to just like chime in with your opinions every single day or like what set you're on every day. I just don't. Yeah. It's a real.
disconnect for me like what why do we all have to like log our fucking opinions about everything all the time like it's our job and you see you know like on message boards or whatever sometimes i'll look at the at the daily mail God, the Daily Mail is so bleak.
The comments like it doesn't even matter. You know exactly what people are going to say. Like they're going to judge this person on her appearance or her decision or something she did 10 years ago. And it's it's like these people think that it's now part of it's their job now to sit down and like.
do their part of this equation, which is like log in their opinion about what a piece of shit this person is. And I just think, like, who are these people? I know we always think, OK, they're in their mother's basements or whatever, but they're probably not. They're probably like.
living out in the world. And yet they take time out of every day to like sit down and let you know how they feel about Britney Spears is dancing. Like who? What? Why are you weighing in on this? And I mean, I actually I realize I'm sort of like. talking in circles right now. I feel like I have fairly insightful things to say about this. Not today. But I do. I do think like, how can you not connect these dots that.
Like the lack of community, like people's quality of life just being shittier. Everybody's isolated. People are fully OK living in this kind of like alternate reality where it's your opinions and the more fiery your opinions are. opinions are, the more people pay attention. But like, it's just create. Look at where we are. The world is like, look at where we are. It's Trump. What the fuck? Like, does Trump exist without any of this stuff? Like, I don't I don't.
think so. And beyond that, we're just people are sad. Kids are sad. Everybody feels isolated. And there's no I think we're in a weird position, too, because, yes, it is fully incorporated into our lives. We're we're young enough that like. We had phones from a young enough age that it's like woven into the fabric of our beings, but we had childhoods that weren't. And now they don't have that. I don't know what that looks like in the future.
Other than more like really lazy Gen Z people who don't know what a good, a hard day's work looks like, which I find myself saying all the time. You just sprouted a bonnet. I know. I am like so Tom. The husband really makes fun of me a lot because I am like a dinosaur about this. And look, I get left behind in this scenario. Like, I don't think the Internet's going to stop because it's making us sad. Well, I always go back to you just have to.
you know, I don't know if I'm quoting Jersey Shore here, but you do you. I'm sorry. No, that's Werner Herzog as well. This is different. You do you in the chaos of the eternal void. Jim Tan Laundrie. Yeah, it's just like... GTL. The Werner Herzog voice. He was in one season. He was in one season of Jersey Shore where he told them all that they were in a void. But Lizzie, I always go back to who are my people? It's like my wife, my kids, for you, you know, Tom, it's Alfie, and...
Who are my friends? And then what is my work that I do? I just always keep pulling myself back to that and saying, and then try to have empathy. which is working a muscle. You can't just say, I have empathy. You just have to keep going at it. But that's hard to do. Like for your job, that's really hard to do. I mean, talk show hosts are usually very mean and you're very nice.
See, that's how I... He's the nicest person I've ever met. Neither of you has the talking stick. We have microphones. Yeah, you put microphones in front of our faces. We've got to do this talking stick thing here. I intuitively fight against. the bleakness, which gets harder and harder and harder with all the issues that come up. But if I didn't have kids, I would retreat into, well, my life went pretty well.
You know, I exist. The earth does seem to be getting warmer, but I'll be gone before that's too much of a problem. I mean, I would have the capacity maybe to think that way. I would hope that I wouldn't, but I would have the capacity to. But when you have kids, as you know, you're.
invested in oh okay the future we need to figure out how to fix this i know oh i know they're like the greatest balm of all time and also but also right now going through what you're going through with the loss of your dad i found And I know that Sona's been through so much lately, lost her home. But I remember talking to you right after you lost your house in the fire and you were saying like, I've got these. Mikey and Charlie, and they need me present.
they were kind of saving your ass because you can't say to them, mom is going to just be depressed and weirded out for two years. I'll see you then. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I'm not going to be like, I'm in a bed just crying all day. So, you know, and then you, they, they're. ready to continue on and so you're ready to continue on absolutely like the best medicine it really is and it like
Gets you out of it. Totally. They're like little Prozac. Yeah. Sweet, sweet Prozac. But yeah, it's amazing. Even if you're in a bad mood, like a normal bad mood. And you go in and see your kids like unless you want to have them, you know. when they're talking to their therapist or writing their memoir later. Yeah. Mother was sad all the time. She took she took it all out on me. She would kick the dishwasher and then ignore me for two days. Like, we're not going to do that. No, like not those.
People. My best friend lives in Alcadena. I'm so sorry you lost. That's like unbelievable. And watching her, she has a six-year-old and their house did not burn down. But they're totally displaced and they have to live in the back house of a friend from schools. And like it's actually turning out to be kind of a great situation for now. But what. If she didn't have this little girl to, like, get to school and not be a husk of a human, like, I don't know. Yeah. I realize now because I...
I mean, I had my kid kind of late, like how much time you just spend like wallowing your own shit and then you don't get to do that anymore. And it like rips you out of it. It's a it's a wonderful thing. Is this the funniest? episode of this podcast. Am I wrong that I love this episode? Yeah, me too. I mean, Eduardo is the line, you're the line judge on these things, but this is right up my alley. Yeah, no, because like this is, you know, excuse us for having a-
a conversation. Shuckles over here. I know. The life of the party these days. No, no, but what I'm... This is, I don't know, it's making me feel a lot better. Yeah, it is kind of therapeutic. It's really therapeutic. I think everything feels very heavy right now. For sure. Even if you're not going through something, things just feel really heavy. It's okay to talk about.
Agreed. I think you have to. And it is like absorbing the, because I'm from LA. I just moved. We sold our house in December and gave the keys to the new owners on January 24th. So like right after the fires. And we were supposed to come back and pack up the house that we've lived in for 11 years and say goodbye to the house and have all these people over. Where are you moving to? New York.
Baby. All right. Yeah. Yeah. That just happened. And like take Alfie to Disneyland and do all the shit. And we couldn't come back because of the fires. And being in New York and watching it, I have. This is my hometown, but I've like talked so much shit about L.A. and what it means, and how it's changed, and how it's gotten worse. I'm sensing a theme in my overall personality. Do you have more Prozac? I got to up it to 20 milligrams. Also, Prozac is new.
We'll recommend, really. We can do an ad for them. I mean, I'm obviously loud and proud about it. Maybe I'll regret this part of it. No, no. But yeah, so watching it from afar.
was really strange. And seeing like my hometown go through this, I felt like this groundswell of love for LA, which hasn't gone away. I think this city is amazing. I think Altadena specifically is amazing. Like what their... doing and that was like the LA I didn't grow up in Altadena but I grew up like in the Miracle Mile and it was much more that vibe than let's say the Palisades vibe which is its own unimaginable like I don't even know tragedy but
There's something about like the Angelenos who are from here, who aren't in the business, who just like have regular jobs, regular families. And like you're just doing it in L.A. Like that was my upbringing. And I have so much love for this city. And it was really. horrible to be away because all of us like in New York who are from LA kind of huddled together because you'd go into, you know, when it was like actively happening or just kind of.
starting. I like went to get my haircut. Like, how you doing? Well, not great. Like L.A.'s on fire. It's like, oh, yeah. You know, when you're not from L.A., you don't live there. It's just like.
LA has fires. It's just like another thing that's happening somewhere else. And when it's your home, it's crazy. And so my dad obviously passing away was brutal. And then I've stuck around for these couple of weeks and feeling the... sadness of LA has been really intense but also everyone in New York's like it reminds us of 9-11 like people are really coming together and building each other up like the community that was the main kind of complaint I had about LA like there's no community
And there so is. And I feel like an asshole for saying that. I lived in New York during 9-11. And one of my clearest memories is going out to dinner and the... The waitress would come over, the wait person would come over and say, you know, would you guys like to start off with some drinks or, you know, and we'd say, well, how are you?
And then the person would end up sitting down at the table and we would all chat. And I remember thinking, this is this weird Eden that we're all living in where all the old- societal norms have gone out the window and people are really talking to each other. And if the bartender, you ask the bartender, you ask whoever's, you ask the person in the store, how are you? Where do you live? How are you doing?
and that happened in new york city and then i remembered it going away like it's like that's humanity just has this way of if you hit a human being over the head with a big stick he behaves himself for like six hours and then goes back to being whatever he was before and I know that this too shall pass but it is you do it's lovely while it's happening and I'm noticing I just keep having these great conversations with
I think I mentioned this, but there was, had to go to Sundance for something and I, there was a woman who was driving me to the event in Utah. uh from salt lake to to sundance and started chatting with her and it turned out she lived in la and i said well how's your place she said well my place burned to the ground and she's driving me and we just had this
intense conversation. And I thought, well, this is kind of what it's supposed to be all the time. Exactly. Which is, how are you? What's going on in your life? Not to drive me, driver. Yeah. Where are the Tic Tacs? Which is what I reverted to by the end of the drive. Oh, you got back there. Enough of your whining. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Oh, your house, where am I ticked at? Yeah, he's a spearmint.
I wanted the fruity kind. Sorry they burnt in the fire, sir. That's no excuse! A burnt Tic Tac's the best one! Yeah, so it's just... perspective and empathy and all that kind of stuff isn't something you attain. It is a practice and it goes away. And we all find ourselves drifting away from it. And then something happens and we get pulled back into it. Yeah, I wonder. I mean, I.
Have you felt, because I'm nervous about that, just like how everybody was like showing up and flooding the GoFundMes or whatever. And like you're saying, like everything, people move on to the next thing eventually. This is going to be a long... Yeah. Do you feel...
that it's still as intense? No, no, no, I don't. I mean, I even asked if I would still get a discount somewhere and they're like, oh, we stopped doing that a week ago. That was really the sign because when it first happened, you would walk into a store.
and tell people that you had lost your home and they would give you this discount. It was like a 20% discount. How long did that last? Was that three weeks? That was like a few weeks. And then I went into a store. I'm not going to say which one, but I was like, hey, I lost my home in the... fire do you guys have a discount and they're like
Oh, we stopped doing that a week ago. If anything, there's a surcharge. Yeah, I know. The sad thing is when it was a 99 cent store. I know. I want this scrunchie. Do you have a discount, ma'am? I know. It's $50. sense i i think that there's still people i mean there's still the empathy there it's still there there's still some feeling of it but it is waning a lot it is very quick how quickly people kind of just move on to be fair i would often go to
a McDonald's and tell them or a cheesecake factory and tell them I had lost my home in a fire, even when I hadn't. But you did it. You're taking my discount. I know. And they would be like, that sounds terrible. And I say, so this McFlurry. What are we talking about here? Can I get 80 cents on the dollar? And sometimes I put a little ash on my cheek.
I'm just telling you the real me. I kept always keep a little ash in your pocket. You can get a discount. It's not like I had ash ever on my face. Well, you fucked up. You'd be having a You'd be having a discount McFlurry right now. She had a little ash in your pocket. Why didn't you work up your orphan angle? I tried that. There seems to be this consensus that I'm too old, which I don't get because I think I'm very well preserved.
for a man my age. Ah, gee, I lost my parents. Do you have any soup? Sir, I saw you drive up in a Porsche. Yeah, but I'm not rich. I'm cash poor. Cash asset rich. I have a lot too. I have a lot of land in Montana and vast holdings, but I can't access it. Can I have some soup? All my money's tied up in holdings. It takes 24 hours to get the bank in Sweden. All right. What's your name? Billy.
You're changing your name? Billy does work better. It's a better name for me. What's the name you were thinking of naming your son but didn't? Mickey. That's a good one. Mickey. Yeah. Mickey the orphan. Mickey the 61-year-old orphan. It counts. It's done quite well. It counts. It's so fucking dark. It really is. I'm sorry, but my parents would laugh at it.
I can say that now because they're not here. They would laugh at that. Like them in the afterlife. No, we wouldn't. You asshole. We never liked you. I am going to get back on track here. Yeah, take it back. And I'm going to get back on track to one of the things that makes me very happy for you. Okay. Is that I think it is a wonderful era for people who have what it takes.
have ability and have a work ethic. And you have all those things and you're getting to do consistently this really cool work. You have this project now, Zero Day. And I was looking at the cast. This is on Netflix. And I'm like, you know. I've had so many people sit in the chair that you're in and people talk a lot about body dysmorphia and how
People can think they look a certain way and they don't and they hate on themselves. And I consistently believe that there's something called career dysmorphia that hasn't been diagnosed yet. And I'd like to invent that and submit that to the New England Journal of Medicine. I've had Al Pacino, Al Pacino sat in that chair and talked so much about the huge chunks of his career that didn't work out.
and how they didn't want him for The Godfather and how he couldn't get a job in movies in the late 80s and thought he was through and how he thinks all the bad reviews people told him about. And I kept wanting to cut him off and saying, you're Al Pacino. You're the face of film for at least the 70s. You do iconic work in every decade.
And you have it too. It's just so funny to me that you would talk about, oh, you know, the fallow periods and maybe I could do more if I got the word out on my chia seed recipe. And you're in Zero Day on Netflix. Your co-stars are Robert De Niro. Angela Bassett, Connie Britton, Jesse Plemons and Matthew Modine. Yes. Dan Stevens. It's what it's Gabby Hoffman. It's the craziest cast. And it's the best work I see now is limited series.
is our cinema. And I like limited series too. I like watching them and doing them. It just feels like a very long movie. I haven't seen Zero Day. My dad died. I don't know if we mentioned that. So I haven't watched the screeners, which is bad because I do want to watch it. That's interesting. I'm trying to picture you watch yourself. I hate it. Yeah, I would imagine you would. I don't always hate it, but I do want to watch.
this one because it's fairly dense and complex and i want to be able to like talk about it it's topical a little like eerily topical it's I hope people are in the mood to watch something that looks a lot like what's happening in reality, but it's kind of this like horror show version of it. Very smart people made this show. Very smart people were in this show. And I don't know. It's ensemble.
that I think I could watch it without hating the experience too much. But I think it's good. I mean, I had a great time doing it. It was surreal. Oftentimes, like the don't meet your heroes thing rings very, very true. It didn't on this. That's nice. De Niro's like. just a nice man. It was like a kind, generous man. I always think, so Leslie Linkaglatter, who directed all the episodes, and she did Homeland, and she's the president of the DGA. She's like a badass, incredible woman.
She's done a bunch of movies like she's she's wonderful. And she directed every episode. And her vibe on set is she did one episode of Masters of Sex in the first season. And I wanted her to. like, BR all the time director, but she was doing Homeland, so she didn't. She maintains this on-set energy that I don't even, like, it's six months. It's six months to shoot this.
Robert De Niro has never done a television show. I believe he didn't know what he was getting into in terms of like the time, like how much time it takes and like the hours. And he was in everything. But the first day of shooting on that.
The crew is always in a good mood for everything on the first day. The last day, six months later, everybody was in as good of a mood. The vibes were so good. It was just like a job that felt... important, but at the same time, right size in terms of like in your real life, like you'd go to work and you'd go home and these people didn't need to be like your best friends and you didn't need, it was just like.
It felt very grown up, like adult, but also really fun. Right. I don't know. It was great. It was a great experience. And we honestly. like during the strike, which was the last fun thing, just taking it back to like the doldrums again. We were supposed to start this June of last year, maybe. I don't know what year it is. Yeah, we were supposed to do like...
June to December. And that was the strike. And we ended up doing January to the next June. So it was a full year and everybody stayed on board. Everybody was just as excited. Which is rare because usually that's when people say, you know, I got this play I'm going to go do in the West End. And even just having that moment of like, well, everybody else or so many other...
people were really stressed out about what they were going to do and work and all of this, like knowing that Netflix is probably not going to shelve the Robert De Niro series. Like it just felt like we had a safety net at a time when there wasn't a lot of safety nets. Again, like if it's just the experience, which for me is truly the only part I like of this whole job, like it was a great experience. And I think it's really good. And I think you should definitely watch it.
America. Which camera are you looking to? America. The American camera. Okay, there we go. Hey, America. Okay, that's China. Yeah. Let's just make it the number one show on Netflix until the next thing comes out on Netflix. Netflix, America. The last observation that I will make is, and I'm certain I'm right about this, as dire as things are right now, and this is my need to be optimistic, but I also think this is accurate.
Let's say you could go back in time to what you would consider like the classic period of making entertainment. And it's like the 1930s, the 1940s. They would have watched you in Mean Girls and they would have said, she's great. She's really funny. That's what she does. And that's what you would have done for the next 50 years of your career. And because we live in this different era, there's nothing you can't do in this era. Whereas they would have definitely put you in a slot. Yeah.
And you would have been punished for being really good at one thing and they never would have seen the other thing. Yeah. So even if that means there's iPhones and other problems. What do you love? elon musk and jeff bezos They have been on their yachts many times. I bet you have. You're a big yacht guy. Big yacht guy. Yeah, big yacht energy. I know my yachts. You got big yacht energy. I am mega yacht energy. That's the only big energy I have.
I have big yacht energy. No, I love a big yacht. I like being invited. I like being at the beck and call of a billionaire. Oh, yeah. Yeah. And then when they say, like, dance for us, I do a little something. That makes more sense. And then I get a Krugerrand. Gold coin, in case anyone doesn't know what that is. I also think that even like not in the 30s, like in recent times, they would typecast you and pigeonhole you. And now it's like only it's very new to not.
have that happen like in the past 20 years maybe right people think oh you can do more than one thing right but a lot of people do find themselves like stuck in a lane and it sucks I'm stuck doing one thing because that's what I can do. That's not true, Conan. That's not true. I heard. But I'm saying happily. I'm happily stuck in my lane. You're not stuck in a lane, though, because I just read that you were incredible in your.
Sundance movie. Okay. As a male gigolo. This orphan thing is working for you. That's how I got the part. I'm an orphan. Yeah, I'm an orphan. Why am I getting smaller and squeakier as an orphan? But Lizzie, this.
was a lovely conversation. This is so surreal. I feel like we're just starting it. No, but this was... There should have been more jokes. You have dysmorphia. There should have been laughter. Well, we're going to put laughter over all the parts. Oh, that's right. When you talk about losing... When you talk about losing your dad and I talk about losing my parents, we're just gonna pipe in laughter from the 1940s. That would be amazing. I love Lucy laughs.
Nothing has changed. It's only you've only today confirmed my feelings about you, Lizzie, which is you're one of my all time favorite people. You are incredibly hyper, insanely talented and you're a real person. And every time I see you, you're Lizzie Kaplan and you're very wise and just a delight to be with you. Thank you very much.
I'm going to say it. Zero Day Netflix, if you're not watching it, you stupid. Yeah, you're stupid. Yeah. Don't be stupid. Watch Zero Day. Come on. Why isn't that going to be the tagline? No, that is the tagline. I mean, De Niro's been saying that on everything. Thank you.
Recently on the podcast, we talked about how you could mail into a comic book advertisement and get the Polaris nuclear submarine. Yes. The only thing I'll add to that, this was many years ago. I don't think it's still true, but...
uh when i was a kid probably around 1970 71 on the back of a magazine there were these things that you could on the back of a comic book there were things you could send away with one of them famously was like x-ray specs and it showed a guy i mean it's so not pc today but a guy looking at a woman in a dress. And the idea was that you put these on and you can see through her dress. Oh, good. Yeah. How many of those did you buy? 700. And they do work. Yeah.
One of the things that really intrigued me was give us, I don't know what it was. Seven dollars. Seven dollars. And we'll send you a working mini Polaris sub that fires missiles. You can get inside. It has a periscope. Now, I never did it, but. All these years later, it floats into my mind every now and then.
what the hell was that thing? What did you, because legally, if you send them $7, they have to send you something. And so we brought it up and you remembered it too. Yeah, I did. And I remember the hovercraft too. And they're distinctly two different things. Okay. So the. A submarine does send you a submarine. What? But apparently it's been very hard for people to track down. And I found the third point of Singularity blog. It looks like they went on a kind of hunt themselves. Yep.
ultimately found it it's the other tab eduardo if you don't mind and this is what you end up getting and it's like a cardboard Oh, my God. Wait a minute. I swear to God, that kid looks like me. Yeah, it does. I mean, that's what I looked like back in the day. He's got the same bull haircut, the same look of just defeat.
No, no, no. But that, wait a minute. That, I have to say, looks more impressive than I thought. Really? Because I see just cardboard that's kind of pinned together and certainly not going to do well in the water. Oh. But isn't that nice? He's using his imagination. Isn't that the whole point? Does it fire a missile? Okay. It's all right. Okay, so I don't know. This is helping me. This is actually...
This is therapeutic. This is giving me some closure because that's something. Yeah. You get inside and it does close and it's got, I mean, seven bucks. I guess this is seven bucks back then. So now this would be the equivalent of like $35. That's true. So, or $50. I don't know. Times have changed.
It's so funny. He looks so far from water. I know. It's like definitely Wisconsin. He's in the Midwest. There isn't a body of water for 800 miles. And he's like, see you later. For the listener, this looks like. a cardboard submarine seated in the middle of a big lawn. Yeah. And there's a fence way in the backyard and then power lines. All you can see is is just lawn and no ocean. It's fun.
So how fun is that? It would be fun. If you're a little kid, you know, you're not going to go to the ocean and go in a submarine. That's I used to make. things out of boxes. I used to, too. I used to if a big box came in, it was just a done deal that either Luke or I would get to build something with it. So I don't know. I'm I'm. I am not disappointed by that. Me neither. That actually looks like.
Looks better than I thought it was going to look. Yeah, me too. I'm impressed. I salute this company, and I think this should have been used by the military. The thing that I more remember was this hovercraft. Okay. When I said last time that I thought it was a kit, that's...
what the hovercraft is. You were supposed to take your motor out of your vacuum and build this hovercraft. So let's go to the other tab here. This must have thrilled your parents when they went to use the vacuum. Does this look familiar to you? Yes. It lifts 200 pounds. Yes.
This looks familiar. And then scroll down and you can see on this blog. Wait, go back up to see what this blog is named. Dwyer and Michaels. Okay. All right. This guy actually built the vacuum. Okay. And here's the order. Astronauts iron on with... With order. Okay, you can float on air free, lifts 200 pounds. So basically, yeah, a hovercraft you could build. I remember this. Yeah, now scroll down and you can see that the guy built it. Okay, there's a bunch of other ads. Oh boy. That's it.
He's building it? Yeah. Okay, well, there you go. And then, yeah, play that video. What? Oh, I know this website. It's called Bad Use of Your Time.
Well, I'm supposed to do dialysis today, but I figured I'll build this hovercraft from the 60s. I mean, that's kind of cool. We can't get enough air from a vacuum. Oh, I got him. He wasn't looking. But no. kid that's you know no eight-year-old kid is going to be able to build that i guess it's a nice project with your you know scout troop leader or your dad
Big problem here is you have to take the motor out of your parents' vacuum cleaner. And that was not going to fly in my house. No kid from the 50s that took the motor out of their vacuum cleaner would get away unscathed. Also, how do you do that? How do you just take a motor out of a vacuum? Why do they think an eight-year-old would even know how to do that?
Okay. I'm asking the real questions, but you guys are being nostalgic. Don't throw me into this bus. Yeah, just because we don't answer every one of your questions. Well, you stare at me confused. I just don't know why I hired you. That's a look that goes back to... Don't think about it. 2008 question. We don't think about that. We just...
Live in the moment. Live in the moment. Well, you know what? I have to say there is closure here. Good. I now know what rosebud means. That helped me. That helped me. How? Why? I don't know, because it was a mystery that never got solved. It was an itch that never got scratched.
It was a riddle that never had an answer, and now you have shown me what it was. Do you remember, too, like the x-ray gogs? There was also a thing where you could go from being a scrawny little kid to a big kind of like... Buff guy, and there's a little picture of tough guy kicking sand on the little guy on the beach. Yeah, those are called steroids. That's called juicing. I don't know what they were promising. They were just probably sending you a booklet that says...
take two soup cans from mom's kitchen and start using them to make a bicep. But I, now we know what that is, which is medical grade chemicals that will transform your body. And I don't know. Because I'm on them. How long have you been on them? Sadly, I've been on them for my entire life. Oh, no. What would you have looked like? I'd have had no skeletal structure.
Well, that was fun. Thank you for doing that. That helped me. And I hope it helped everyone else who listens from my generation who remembers that. Sona, you seem confused. I am completely confused. But I also I mean, I think that every generation. has toys and stuff that kind of dupe you. Yeah, exactly. What was yours? McDonald's Monopoly. Oh, that's different because that was rigged. But I was thinking of the spy tech gear. Do you guys remember the spy tech stuff?
It was like a bunch of gear that they sold to kids that was supposed to help you be a better spy. There was a mirror periscope. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Like a microphone or like a... Not a microphone, but something you held up so you could hear things from further away. And it didn't work? I don't. I think we bought a bunch of it. I don't think any of it worked. Were you doing actual spying for the government? Yeah, on our neighbors. Oh. We would go around our neighbors, hide behind bushes.
try to spy on them. Do you ever hear anything juicy? Yeah. No, because they didn't work. Hey, they're Armenian too. We all live in this neighborhood. What about you? What did you mention? I mentioned McDonald's Monopoly, although to Sona's point, it's been... explained now through documentaries that it was all a scam but but as a kid you know you were sold on the promise of like oh if i just buy a bunch of fries and we keep eating at mcdonald's and we
get these little game pieces we can win a mansion or you know some really cool prizes and right you're just constantly after the chase well the real win there is the health that you got from our generation reminds me of the columbia house record Yes, I was thinking that too. Like a penny for like CDs. 19 CDs for one penny. You know, I have to say, all of these things are true disappointments.
The sub is looking pretty good. I mean, I'm just saying I'm happy because the one I dreamed about the most actually appears to be somewhat valid. Would I take it deep into the North Atlantic and attack a Russian sub? Probably not. But that kid seemed pretty happy. That kid could have been you. Yeah, that kid could have been me. Yeah.
And then maybe in some other fold in time, that kid is me. Well, this has been a strange end to any conversation. I'm gonna sign off now, but Dreams Deferred will continue. It's the new segment. Peace out, Tupac. Live your dreams, or your dreams live you. I have no ending for this, so I'll just keep talking. No, please. Until I hit something. Just say bye. And we end, or do we? A beginning becomes a reality as we finalize. We'll see you next week. He's turning my sound off.
Conan O'Brien Needs a Friend, with Conan O'Brien, Sonam Avsessian, and Matt Gourley. Produced by me, Matt Gourley. Executive produced by Adam Sachs, Jeff Ross, and Nick Liao. Theme song by The White Stripes. Incidental music. by Jimmy Vivino. Take it away, Jimmy.
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