12.04: Bahamas Hangover - Hour 1 w/ Jay Williams

hour radio show. But obviously the result from last night's game not not great, and we'll certainly talk a lot about that. And if you guys want to be a part of the show today, we will let you do that, you can give us a call FIVEBO two five seven one seventy nine hundred, and you can text it in on the Ellen and Federal Credit Union text line at

five O two six five three zero seven ninety. I've got a plan today as far as how I'm going to balance things out, because I don't want to just spend three hours talking about how rough it was to see that gameplay out the way that it did last night. And I totally understand if you're a fan of Louisville basketball and you kind of have really started to doubt if this team is good enough to, you know, compete for a spot in the NCAA tournament. I will tell

you that last night was was a tough. Look. I still think that this thing can be can be salvage to a point where you know, you might find yourself a potential tournament team, but I also can't ignore what

what happened last night. I also think there's some factors that we'll certainly discuss that that I would hope in a week, maybe hopefully by Sunday, you know, it's not as big of an issue, but obviously it kind of seemed like everything just kind of came to a head last night with Louisville dealing with a lot of injuries.

I think these guys just kind of visibly you could tell that they they know, they know what it's they know what they're missing when they don't have Caseon Bryor out there, a leader for this team, one of their best players. Clearly, Koran Johnson hasn't played in a long time, but now they know he's done for the year, and that's not really an excuse. Pat Kelsey really emphasized that

last night and his postgame press conference. As far as you know that next man up, you can't use that as an excuse, and you can't approach it that way. You can't be a victim. And I don't think these guys did that last night. And I think the guy leading this program is somebody that will make it clear that, yeah, they know what's going on, but there's there's gonna be no feeling sorry for yourself. There's gonna be no victims. You're just gonna have to keep fighting and try to

figure it out. Now, will that result in them being able to become a good team despite how shorthanded they are. Only time will tell, But I don't have much doubt that the guy that's in charge is going to do everything he can to try to figure it out instead of, you know, feeling sorry for themselves. Now, speaking of that, the last guy here that was coaching, he felt like a victim the second he walked on campus, the second

he got here. He never really felt like there was any scenario where louisvill would be good and it was all everybody else was falled and we should just be thankful that he's here. And that man is Kenny Payne. So I bring that up a couple of minutes into the show because at three poin thirty we're gonna be

joined by Jay Williams of ESPN. And I don't remember if I ever talked about this on the show or not, because obviously if you follow me on social media, then then you probably saw the back and forth between myself and Jay Williams, and I think I might have brought it up like when we did that brief show after the Indiana game, meaning like we were on the air as soon as the game or from three o'clock to I guess about five, And I don't Austin, you may remember,

you may not if you don't know, biggie. Did I talk about it on the show as far as like Jay Williams saying he wanted to come on at some point.

inherit an awful situation didn't play fait. And I'll go back and pull up the tweet word for word just so we have some proper context. But you know, Jay Williams was one of the guys initially that I think was a part of the and I don't want to see him specifically, and I'll ask him directly because he's going to join us on the show A three thirty, but I just want to set it up as to

how we got here. So he was one of many ESPN or really just national college basketball guys that occasionally would gaslight Louisville fans as if we need to chill out and not be mean to Kenny Payne because it's none of it's his fault and people don't realize what he's dealing with and what he inherited in the mess and it's broke and all that stuff. That's just triggering PTSD for me as we speak, because it's all nonsense.

And really it was disrespectful to Chris Mack who did walk away, but he's the one who actually went through the worst of like scandal stuff. I mean, he actually didn't have nil and the portal because that hadn't existed yet.

And he didn't leave a bad culture of players. Those guys who were on the team when Kenny got here that stayed were good young men that did not have a bad like he didn't inherit a bunch of bad dudes, and some people bought that after year one, oh, he's going to go get new players because he took over a locker room that has a bunch of bad apples.

And that was never the case at all. And it played out the next year where they were slightly better with slightly better talent, but still the problem was the guy leading, who was not a leader by the way. So I didn't I mean, I didn't call him a name. I just said, it's crazy that Jay Williams is. Did you really just say props to Pat Kelsey for what he inherited whenever he you know, like Pat Kelsey actually

did inherit a mess, but he didn't play victim. Again, he's got If Louivill didn't have injuries, I think we'd be in a little bit of a different situation, especially with our mindset right now when it comes to love of basketball. So he responded by just saying, you know, why don't you tag me Nick or something like that. Very playful. He wasn't like we were screaming at each other, but you know, he said, why don't you have me on your show? So I said, come on any time.

I just assumed it would be done then. Well, then on Thanksgiving morning he DMed me and said Happy Thanksgiving and said when are we doing this? And we actually throughout Monday initially to start the show with it, and he had some stuff going on, and we then bumped it back to today at at three thirty. So he's actually on the call tonight in one of the acc SEC Challenge games, but he's going to join us at three thirty, and I mean, I'm going to ask him

about you know. You know, I'll save it because I I know there was at least one instance where he was sort of telling Louisville fans to kind of calm down and give Kenny Payne some time. And I don't remember if he was one. And it's probably not fair. In fact, it isn't fair, but it's just how it's

just how it is. You know, when you've got ESPN's crew of college basketball guys, rather it be somebody that is an analyst, somebody that's a played by play guy or just somebody who covers the sport like Seth Greenberg. I mean, he he's he's he was the worst as far as my in my opinion, when it comes to just refusing to acknowledge that like he was dead wrong

about Kenny Payne. Like he's the one who said that Louisville should have like should have high fared him mid season whenever Mack left, and look, a lot of people said Kenny Payne should be hired, Like it's okay to be wrong, but like he just acted like he didn't guess like Louisville fans for being unreasonable because they should

just understand that they should be thankful Kenny's here. So I know, Jay didn't say those were the worst people are the worst of the national folks that tried to tell Louisville fans that we need to be nice to Kenny Payne because we should be thanking him essentially because he came here to take over this mess of a situation. Seth Greenberg is up there. Corey Alexander is actually the worst. I don't know how that guy can look himself in the mirror with some of the nonsense that he said.

As far as blaming Louisville fans for the lack of getting recruits when Kenny wasn't even active recruiting anybody. And the I mean it was the last game of the season, when they were losing in the NCAA or they were losing in the ACEC tournament. Everybody knew it was gonna be over. And he's like doing this. It's gonna be a real shame of this, acting like Kenny was a good coach when in fact he quite literally not exaggeration, is the worst college basketball high of ball time, like

he just is. So you know, I don't want to revisit that previous era, but we'll get Jay's thoughts on it, cause I'm just gonna essentially ask him, like when it comes to the information you guys were getting, because I

believe trust me, I know how this works. I know that the guys who cover the games, the guys who are able to get access because they work for ESPN and they're going to be part of the broadcast in some form or fashion, they're going to get access to the player, to coaches, and I know those coaches were probably feeding them nonsense and if they ran with it,

that's really just you know that's there. I mean, they're they're sharing what they heard directly from somebody, but clearly if if it was all being stated that they're trying. But man, you just don't know what we've we've what we've dealt with, you don't know what we inherited. Then you know that that was just a lie. So this isn't going to be like a yelling, screaming thing. I'm I'm very happy that he decided that he would come on the show, and I look forward to talking to him.

You know, I want to get his thoughts also on Kentucky, because Kentucky obviously beat Duke, and he really made Yucky fans angry after he did a video shortly after the game and basically telling Kentucky fans to chill out. They need to understand that despite the loss, Cooper Flag is still going to be somebody that is going to be all over ESPN because he's a big time star and he's going to bring more eyeballs to college basketball. So

looking forward to talking to him. He's expected to call in at three point thirty today and you know, we'll see what happens. So just wanted to give you a heads up that is coming at three thirty, and also, you know, just explain the situation because it is kind of random that this that this is, this is all come. He's not somebody's ever been on the show before. I would never go about, you know, trying to to to ask him if he wants to come on, just because

I wouldn't think that he would. He would, he would do it, but who knows, maybe it turns into something to where we end up, you know, we end up making him a you know, not a regular, but somebody who comes on from time to time to talk some college oops.

to play. They're very analytically driven and the same way that teams are gonna successfully so far. I mean, the teams that have tried to slow Louisville down have done a good job of doing it. Last night, I mean Chris Beard, I think he joined Rick Barnes as far as the two coaches that really put on a really good performance, as far as showing how you take Louisville out of what they want to do and you really dare them to shoot threes because you know that the

numbers tell you that they're not good shooters. So you know that happened a little bit to Kentucky last night, right the game was slowed down, there weren't as many many possessions as as Kentucky wanted. And Clemson, you know, they were tough physically and they beat up on them

and they were able to pull out a win. We also got to talk about the college football playoff rankings because why do they even I mean, I hate to give you the same recycled take that I've had on this for the last month or so, but don't put somebody in front of a camera after you make these decisions whenever you know you can't you can't give any data or facts that back up where you have certain

teams ranked. And I really think that a formula, maybe not the BCS formula of old, but maybe something like that would in fact be a better scenario than this committee, because there's just there's there's plenty of teams ranked at a certain spot that have no there's no shot that mean it's over. I mean, the majority of college football teams aren't playing in their championship games, so like they can't move, they're done. But like there's examples of like

how would how do you justify this? So even though there's teams ranked egregiously that aren't in contingent for the playoff, it just gives people another example of like what are you all doing? Like what's going on here? So Ward Manual, the Michigan Athletic Director, who is essentially the spokesman for the committee, who comes on live television right after they give us the rankings. You know, I mean give him credit.

He's out there doing and he's trying his best to to you know, not make it look as bad as it looks. But there's just certain things that just you can't make any sense of. So we'll get into that and again, we'll taken you up until till six o'clock, all right, So just my thoughts on last on last night, this is something that we still don't like to say,

but it needs to be said. You lost to a better team Ole Miss. I know they were underdogs, and I don't you know, I get why Louisville was favored slightly at home because they were coming off of a good performance in the Bahamas. Ole Miss doesn't have a win that really, I mean, Louisville has a better win. In fact, Louville may have two better wins on the resume than what Miss that Ole Miss had and they

lost a close game to Purdue what they lost. So like Louisville being favored and crazy, but like ole Miss was better and ole Miss was probably a better team. Even if Louisville had prior doesn't mean louivill wouldn't have won. But like, Ole Miss is a good team, and I don't know if they're going to end up making a deep run in the tournament. We know the coach that they have as a really really good coach and he

showed that last night. So again, you don't want to be here as far as just you knowing that Old Miss is better than you, but they are they are now knowing that a team that's better than you beat you is tough enough, but it's even more tough to know that, you know, they beat you eighty six to sixty three. And it kind of felt like at times it might it might get even worse than that, And in fact, I think it did get a little bit

worse than that at times. So look, there's a lot of layers to just the the strategy, the style of play for Louisville that I'm going to try my best to balance it and not turn into just a big dork talking talking ball. I mean, I am a ball knower, at least I tell myself that I am. Yeah, you are, but I know that like that, that's not where That's not what this is for. That's not what this show is.

We're trying to have fun, try to be entertaining. But you know, there are some things that I think would make sense to people, even if you are somebody that you know doesn't follow basketball that closely, or maybe you know more about basketball than I do. I don't know, but I'm just saying this team being a shooting team, a lot of people are basing that off of the percentage that these guys shot at their previous school. Because right now, I mean, let me pull it up Lois,

by the way, last night they shot from three? Was it thirteen percent something like that? Last night Louisa shot seventeen percent from three? They made let's see five of thirty from three. I mean, that's just that's that's not gonna do it. Can't buy a bucket, and we all know that. So when it comes to this team, there's guys that can make shots. Like if you shot a certain amount of attempts and your percentage was in the

thirty mid thirties to forty, you're a shooter. But it's that doesn't it's not just all based off your percentage. Like for example, Noah Waterman, who, by the way, did play in a fast system last year at BYU, And maybe he's not the best example. Let me give you a different example here, because and you know, he's somebody that is not making shots at the same rate he did last year, and some of his misses are just him missing open looks and he'll eventually get those to fall.

But like him, you know making it, you know, cutting from the from from the block up to the to the wing and just catching it and firing it like that's that's not a I don't think like the percentage is that you saw from his time at BYU and wherever else Noah played, that wasn't what he was doing.

So like Terrence Edwards Junior, he's a guy that last year shot the ball pretty well from three, and we at times have seen him make some threes here, but he's playing in a completely different system that he did at James Madison. So like, I just think the numbers as far as what they did previously, it's irrelevant. And look, they're a better shooting team than what they showed last night. I think they're a better shooting team than what their

percentage shows right now. But they haven't you know, that's that's just a guess for me. I don't really have anything to back that up on. And some people would say, well, look at their numbers from last year. I'm not doing that. I just know that you can't mean they're missing because it you start to press, it becomes a mental thing whenever you know you're missing open shots. And here's a big factor. At the other schools, these guys were at

the Open. Three was just one of many components as far as what you do in your system at Louisville with Pat Kelsey. And this is not a criticism of his style and his system because I think it can work. I just think you've got some guys that maybe aren't as good a shooters as you thought they were. And also you're clearly injured. You got guys that aren't playing

that you need. They could have helped you. Not only because those guys, I mean, Cason's not a three point shooter despite percentages, but Corin is neither is Treori, to be honest with you, But whenever you've got those guys to play, everybody else is more fresh. Therefore they're probably

going to have a better likelihood of making shots. These guys are winded, they're playing more minutes now than they typically did, so, you know, disclaimer, it's not like I'm telling you that Pat Kelsey's system is just, you know, terrible, it'll never work. But I think Terrence Edwards Junior is somebody that last year shot the ball from three, let's see, thirty five percent roughly. That's that's not elite, but that's

not bad. And some would say that's pretty good, and I would I would agree with you, but I would be willing to bet that the three point shots that he got at JMU aren't a lot of the shots that he's taken now because it's just a different system. Like you're being asked to really do a different job. So like you're bringing your weapon to a fight, but you're having to use it differently and it may not be as effective. I think that is the best analogy

I can give you. I mean, if you're if you're running, because again, Louisville's system under Pat Kelsey, I mean, you got to make shots and score the basketball, no matter what you're doing, no matter what your style, what's your philosophy is. We all know that. But it's really like, if Louisville's not making shots and they're shooting that many of them, I don't know how you're going to beat

many teams. You can do it if you force a bunch, if you force a bunch of turnovers and you score points off those turnovers and you get to the free throw line. But good teams are not gonna let you do that. Good teams are gonna sit back on defense, and dare you to beat them, and what is Louisville doing.

They're chucking it up the first guy that gets a decent look, And it's all selective as far as like or it's all relative as far as what's a good look and what's not right like, So that's really just an opinion thing. Sometimes I see a guy take a shot and I'm like, yeah, he had some daylight and he fired it up there. But I wouldn't call that a good shot, but maybe Pat Kelsey does. So there's a lot of factors as to why this thing win as bad as it did last night, and we'll get into,

you know, some of those things throughout the show today. However, Look, you can't expect to beat really anybody if you're shooting thirty three pointers and making and making five of them. So you know, whenever, if you're if you are somebody like, see who else I can pull up here? Just actually, let me give you a good example, Rain Smith. Rain Smith is your best shooter. He didn't have a good night last night. I actually think he was just off.

In fact, I don't mean, what what did he shootlast time? Let me pull it up here. So Rain Smith last night from three point range, he was two of eight, so that's an off night for him. But on the season, even after going two for eight last night, he's still shooting thirty eight percent from three. That's a really good three point shooter. In fact, I'm sorry, he's shooting thirty nine percent from three, so he can go two freight

last night. His percentage are still really good. You know what system rain Smith played in last year, Pat Kelsey's system at Charleston. He's played in that. This is his fifth year doing that right now. So he is playing this style, this frantic pace, similar minutes, and he's comfortable because that's what he does. The percentage is that these

other guys at the others, it's just it's irrelevant. They're able to knock down a shot if they're you know, if they're just in rhythm and it's within the flow of the game and the opponent's daring him to shoot it. But whenever it is, there's such an emphasis on, hey, we are doing everything out here to get good looks from three. I don't know if these guys are as

are as good of a fit to do that. I don't think it's a coincidence that rain Smith is the one that it's the most comfortable to where he can keep firing it up and he's fine. The other guys, like I think they know, like, hey, I can make shots. But man, if if that's what I'm really out here to do, probably not gonna work out as well because that's you know, look, sometimes guys are gonna get hot, Like Noah Waterman can get hot. We saw Terrence Edwards

Junior get hot. But I think what happens now is that teams that are of a higher caliber like Ole Miss and the teams and the Bahamas and whatnot, they're you know, they're quicker, they're they're clearly more talented than the teams you play like Bellerman and Winthrop and whatnot. So it just takes him too long to get ready to shoot, like and at that point, like it's it's it's not in rhythm. So again, I don't have a problem with what Pat Kelsey wants to do as far

as style of play. I just I think now we need to wait and see. And I kind of got a little bit of an indication last night with something he said in his postgame press conference that you know, he is going to have to reassess what he has to work with moving forward and figure out what makes the most sense, because it it really you know, good teams or any team. Teams that aren't good are gonna try to make sure you don't get this game sped up.

And at that point, you know, maybe Chuck, you'll be able to take guys off the dribble and you'll get some things going and you're gonna shoot it better than you did last night. But you also have to have something else, something secondary, that you can get into that can generate, you know, something with a higher probability of working than just everybody firing it up. All right, quick break, Jay Williams ESPN College Basketball Hall of famer're going to

join us, coming up here on the other side. We'll keep this thing rolling along. Coffee and Company fuel by Thornton's right here on Sports Talk seven.

You'll save money at the gas pump. And with you know money, you're gonna have to spend on Christmas presents all that kind of stuff in the holidays can get expensive. So why not try to save money at every at every chance you get and saving money on gas can go a long way. So again, Refreshment Awards dot Com. Down on the app on your Android or your iPhone and you will be You'll be good to go. Man, it felt like last night the Lower Bowl. I mean

it looked pretty good on TV. I mean I could see some seats that weren't that weren't occupied, but I felt like the crowd was just waiting for something to really go crazy about, and man, it never happened. Credit to Old miss for playing a big role in that. But also, I mean, louisll just couldn't get shots to fall. And I do think some you know, shooting thirties three's a game when you've played this many games and your

percentage is what it is. I mean, I don't think they should be shooting as many, but there's no scenario where Louisville ends up being a remotely decent team where the three point shot is not a factor in that. So I think it's finding a balance as to what

makes the most sense. And Pat Kelsey will let you guys, hear some sound from his press conference last night, and actually this might have been something that he This might have been a quote I saw in his radio interview, which, of course, if that's the case, then we can't play that.

But he said something along the lines of they're going to have to figure out like where they are and moving forward because they now know they don't have case and they know they don't have Korin and that changes things. There's no doubt about it. And I think they missed prior more than I anticipated. And it wasn't necessarily because of production. It's just because of length and rent, protection and energy. I mean, he's a high energy guy. You know,

there's a reason that you know he's the guy. And I shouldn't say this because I don't know what people individually think of him. I know you've heard others mention, yeah, that's the guy that if he's on your team, you really love him. But man, you get it, and you would probably hate him too. If he's on the other team, that's just kind of, you know, kind of how it works.

So they missed him in a major way. But if I was Pat Kelsey, and again, he knows a lot more about basketball than I ever will, and it's his job. He's going to do what he wants to do, and I would do the same thing. Right, don't put don't put your fate, don't put your you know your job, you know, don't don't try something just because you want

to appease somebody else. So I think you just got to figure out what you have offensively, right, look at each individual player and figure out what can they do that would potentially put the opposing team on their heels. What do they have in their bag, what do they have you know that could cause some problems. Not only just you know, to score, because I think all these guys have the ability to knock down some shots here

and there. There's skilled players, But what can you cook up with the personnel you have that is healthy and available, that that could generate decent looks to where you can you can score more points than what you did last night. You can get better looks, you know. I think Terrence Edwards Junior. There's something there, meaning he was the Sun Belt Player of the Year for good reason. He beat Michigan State by putting James Madison on his back last

year at Michigan State. I just don't think he's a great fit as far as the style, and that's nobody's fault. Like ka Kelsey went out and built a brand new roster, and you know he prioritized shooting, and you know, I still have no problem with what he did as far as how he put the roster together. It's just one you're dealing with injuries and that impacts you in a

major way. Not only because you've lost one guy that we know can shoot it and that's Coren Johnson, but now you're playing guys more minutes to where you can't rely on your depth. And if you're not able to rely on your depth, you've got guys that are playing more minutes than you anticipated and that's going to lead over to them not being as effective, not having the

legs to knock down three point shots. So I don't think you need to reinvent yourself totally, but I think trying to do what you intend to do all year, meaning like with a team that you had that was healthy, that didn't have these these awful bad luck with injuries. You know, that just doesn't make any sense at this point. But again I'm not saying just completely start over, but retool it right, find some variation from the philosophy and

the system and see what works. And look, it may be some trial and error and that that that's understandable, but it's also not ideal. You don't want to be trying out some things against Duke when they come to

town on Sunday. But you know, here we are, all right, So we are expecting a call from Jay Williams at let's see at I sent him the number to call in yesterday last night at nine thirty when we were going back and forth, and he liked, you know what I mean when you like a message like you you know, the little thumbs he gave me the thumbs up on I said, perfect, the call in number is this because I gave him the hotline, not our ore call in line,

and he earlier today actually was this morning. I was I noticed I got a notification when I was walking my daughter into uh to her grandma's house where she's at today, and he liked it, which I thought was like a confirmation. But he is yet to call. Maybe he thinks we're Central time. I don't know. But what should we do here? Should I like DM him and say,

hey you good? Like we're a lot producing here on the air, like I don't, I don't really know, you know, And to be fair, I don't think for a second that that like he's dodging us. I mean, he hasn't called, so I guess technically he is, but like he's not like, oh, I'm not gonna call because they're gonna like they're gonna roast me or something like he's not worried at all. In fact, he's really good at a at a back and forth and I look forward to having the conversation.

But now, you know, now I don't know if it's gonna happen or not. So I'm just gonna write here, are you still? Are you good? All right? What else should I'll say?

or whatnot. So I'm saying, are you good? If the hot line number isn't working, you can call five h two five seven to one seventy nine hundred. That's professional, right like that. That's like, that's not like, hey, you know you're late. Where are you? It's just like, are you still good? Yeah? If the hot line numbers are working, you can call this number. And then I'm also gonna say if something came up and you want to come on later in the show, oh that.

can we reach you at. I just gave him our hotline number because I wouldn't think that he would want to give me his number. But I don't know, so I said, yeah, if you want to come on later in the show, that works to just let me know. And here's the thing I mentioned a moment ago, like he's not worried at all, like about like him not calling, maybe because he just big time to be in forgot

about me, which will be totally understandable. But this I forgot that he tweeted this out last night, which again, you know, it's not a situation where like he doesn't want to come on because he's worried we're going to be mean to him or something, which we wouldn't be. I mean again, I mean just kind of a conversation with him, and I actually think he could end up mean.

I think Jay Williams is really really good at basketball analysis, and I think there's a reason he's been at ESPN as long as he has doing a variety of different things. So I was just looking forward to to not only you know, having in mind to talk about U of L and the program and his thoughts on Pat Kelsey and what kind of nonsense was being spread from the previous staff about what was going on. But doesn't look like we're we're gonna have that happen, at least not

right now here it is. I'm trying to find the tweety sent Yeah, he said, because I tweeted yesterday once we got it confirmed, because I did. I didn't bring this up after last Wednesday because I didn't want to promote. I didn't I didn't want this to happen. I didn't want to say, hey, we're doing this, He's coming on the show, and then like this happened. So unfortunately, that's

that's what's happened right now. So yesterday and I wanted to probably give it a little bit more notice than we did, but I just I didn't want to put it out there that he's coming on until I felt for sure comfortable that it was going to happen. Right and you know, here we are and I promoted it and he's not here, so he said yesterday, see you tomorrow, because I put out Jay Will's said to join me on the show tomorrow afternoon. I put that out there

yesterday after the show. We didn't have a time locked down yet. We then later agreed to three thirty, but he said he responded see you tomorrow. Plus I love the comments, tell them to call in if they got it in them. So like he's not, he's not worried about and we don't do that anyway. I wouldn't be like, hey, we got Jay Williams on the line, why don't you call in at five h two Bob seven one seventy nine hundred and tell him how you think he sucks.

Like we wouldn't mean that's not what this is. And that wasn't what I was going to do. And I did have a back and forth with him initially last week on Thanksgiving and just said, look looking forward to having you on. Both fan basis around here are very energized when it comes to the new coaches that are you know, that are running the show. So I mean, again, I'm not saying he did it because he's he's worried about us being mean or that he's scared, but he

did no show. I mean, that's technically what has happened here, and uh, maybe we'll find out why. Maybe he'll come on later, or maybe he just wanted to, you know, have me promote his appearance and then him big time me and make me look foolish. But I tried my best to protect myself from this happening. And you know, here we are.

tell him before you answer it? You listen to me, you good tell me, tell him before you answer it, ask him if he can hold through this break because we got to take a break, and or see if he can call back in five minutes.

And now I just awkwardly wait to hear what he's telling Austin, because if I bring him on now, then it would be an extremely short conversation, and uh, I don't want to do that. I want to try to get the most out of this as best we can. So we shall see. What's what's the word?

A lot of people would probably say the same thing. And there are many of folks that that cover college basketball, a lot of them, of course, within your family of ESPN folks that at times, I in my opinion, my opinion only I don't not the only one, but it's my opinion they would gaslight Louisville fans initially that they didn't have a right to be critical and be upset and really just think this is going to go really bad,

meaning the Kenny Payne era. And I know the second year of that Kenny Payinn experience, your tone was a little bit different than it was the first time around, and you were nowhere near I mean, I mean, I'll just tell you who it is. I think Corey Alexander and Seth Greenberg, and I'm sure they know Kenny personally, and you know that's a fact that that matters, that that makes an impact as far as how you address certain things. But I'm of the belief and I'll ask

you this directly. Whenever Kenny Payne first got to Louisville and things were not going great, he didn't inherit a great situation. But were you all when you talk to the staff, when you talk to people, when you come here to do a game and you get access and you're embedded within the program for that day or two that you're here, was it expressed that like there's really nothing that can be done. This is just the situation

because of a mess that was inherited. Because I think that was initially what a lot of people thought, and then you know it didn't really play out that way.

I was being reintroduced back to college basketball. Right was doing a radio show where we still talked about college basketball a little bit, but our primary thing we talked about was college football and NFL and NBA, and I

was doing NBA countdown. So coming back into college ball last year, I obviously had paid attention to things that were going on between Kentucky, Louisville, Duke, all these great schools that I've known for so long, right, and I had text about the struggles, but that was really my first time calling a game and in hearing a lot of the reasoning behind why things weren't going well. So, but I also seen other schools in which didn't give off those similar excuses for lack of better terms that

it turned around programs really really quickly. So at the beginning of the year, I called the game and I was like, you know what, just let me try to feel this out a little bit more, and like, let's see what he does this year. Because I don't know Nick, I know you don't know me. I am not afraid to save my damn mind on TV.

didn't hear my voice anywhere around that stuff. That was my first time seeing it in real time, and I called it out for what it really was. So you know, my thing is just knowing who Pat Kelsey is and then frankly like going down there. And also just like Nola Smith was on that staff, I know Nola Smith

since his time at Duke. Like, I'm not saying things are done right or wrong, but I was given a lot of insight when I found out about things, and then I saw things pan out, I was like, I don't I don't think this is the right way to go. So I'm not lambassing anybody. Nick. I just went when I saw it, and then I watched it happen in real time. I said, Nah, unacceptable. I can't. I can't back that. So that's just contextually how that whole situation.

was pretty direct about how this just needs to change. So you know it, it was so bad that it still doesn't even seem real as far as how bad

louisvill basketball was at that time. So I'm somebody who is very fortunate to have a position where I get to cover the team, but I'm a fan myself, so again, I was a little triggered when it comes to that, because I felt like the whole time that Louisville fans were aware that, man, this wasn't expected to be great from the jump, but man, this is malpractice as far

as how things are being led. And I totally believe everything as far as what you were being told by people that you know, whether it be Nolan or others. And I think there's probably some partial truth to all that. But you know you were right. You've always been very direct and not afraid to share your opinion as far as what you really think. But when it comes to how it mean, how did it go that bad in

your mind? What do you think really was the ultimate root of it being just maybe one of the worst hires ever?

me that? Right? And then like you have to use other sources to be like, all right, well I was told this, did this really happen this way or is it being presented to me? So then I go on air and I say things right. So it's like you have to do a lot of due diligence through other sources and you have to watch it a lot to know whether you're kind of being bs or not to

be real right. So you know, I think a lot of times at Louisville, my thing is like, look, this nil game has changed a lot, right, But like I would often say, you got to get the top players, like you got to get people. You just have to have a system that you have to sell. And I thought, not like watching it, I wasn't sure that Louisville was being marketed and framed the right way by the coaching staff.

Like to me, like when I think about Louisville basketball, man, I think about some of the legendary coaches that have coached there. I think about that rivalry with Kentucky basketball, Like I think about top tier players that have played on that team. That represents something bigger, and I just

never feel like Louisville had that presence. It always feel like Louisville was smaller with that staff, And to me now it feels like even though back to back losses, but like it just feels different, Like and I said that on air. Yeah, it's like the bibe around it even watching it, like it's like there's an error about it.

There's a there's a cockiness, there's a swagger to it, there's a there's like I'm not afraid to challenge you back, whereas those teams that I watched seemed timid and they seemed unsure, and that's not what Louisville basketball was.

It didn't work out that way. And and now you've got a guy who is who's who's going to either make it work here, he's going to die trying because he realizes this is a special program for a lot of the reasons that you just mentioned, And you know that that's refreshing Louisville. Don't how goo they're going to be this year. They're dealing with a lot of injuries and you just don't know how things are going to go.

But this guy is clearly, you know, making and you shouldn't need this as a fan base, but for him to continuously talk about how appreciative he is to be the coach at Louisville and how you know he's he's he's highly he's basically gassing us up. And we didn't used to need that, but we kind of do now, I guess because of what's happened in recent years. So you you talked highly of Pat Kelsey. What is your

before he was the coach at Louisville. How familiar were you with him and just kind of your thoughts on his his style as a coach.

Like if somebody tell me I need to kill myself, if somebody tell me that I'm stupid, it's somebody time I need to lose my job. Like you've got to be able to like kind of block all that craziness

out Easier said than done. And also you got to know where bodies are buried, man, Like this ain't this isn't elementary school like and that that takes reps so for anybody, Like when you're trying to do that at a place where like your name was synonymous with being a champion and representing your school at a high level with not really knowing how to do that, Like Pat knows how to do that, like Pat's built programs from the beginning, like I watched it right, Like I watched

it his entire time, Like when College of Charlestoner is ranked top twenty five nationally, Like I've seen him build programs over time, and how he's been able to do that. He's done that by being around the block and being experienced as a head coach and forming the right staff and making sure the right staff knows how to raise some capital, knows how to get the right people on the door. It's just a different it's a different thing when you're in that seat.

address the Kentucky fans. We we are in Louisville, Kentucky, a big market for college basketball.

What what led to Kentucky fans getting so upset? Because I, I mean, I kind of caught up late, but I still didn't really understand what they were so mad about.

championship back in two thousand and one. Right, and that goes over to fifteen team that won a CHIP. Now, just because you have more talent doesn't mean that the talent is used the right way all the time.

different arguments with that, right. So, but that comment, within itself, I think it's accurate for the talent level of this Duke team in the player that they have doesn't mean they're going to mold into a better team than Kentucky inevitably, or maybe they could, who knows. It's a long season. So I think a lot of people started kind of like coming back at me with like, oh, how is

that most talented? How's that most depth team workout? Because look, at the end of the day, man, like, I'm always gonna be objective with my with my job and my team. Like I'm a fan of a lot of different schools, right, so but I would say I'm also I played basketball, dude. But I'll tell you when I think Duke sucks, I'll tell you when I think they're good. Like, I don't try to sugarcoat anything just because I played basketball there, Like,

I'm real. There have been times where I haven't been allowed to go back to Cameron d Or Stadium because Gray Sollend was tripping people all the damn time. I'm like, stop tripping people. Broke Oh yeah that was That was another intense moment, right, But I get it. But I'm always gonna do my job, and I'm almost gonna tell you honestly how I felt. So I think fans are triggered by that comment. And also when that comment gets clipped and that goes on social media, like people don't

have context around what it means. People act a certain way. That's one thing, right, So everybody started getting my mentions because of that. Secondly, the game is over and I'm on sports Center right after the game, nick like literally seconds after the game. Okay, So I go on Sports Center and I'm getting ready to make my comment about Kentucky. Now all my network, which I don't control, on a huge jumble screen behind me is a massive damn picture

of Cooper Flag. So you can imagine in my mind just like your mom, like, ah shit, here we go. Like I know what's gonna happen. I know the first question they're gonna ask me about is Cooper Flag because I've already seen it. I've seen it last year when he was playing high school basketball. How we started to sell him like and I'm sorry for going on on,

but I just want to be real about it. Okay, who was the last like incredible like player that we had to do us side of ZIGN also is like marketable, Like it's like Cooper Flag is somebody I know people are naturally going to compare to Christian Latner JJ Reddick, Like you get where I'm going here with this without saying you know what I mean, like like, oh, he's gonna be the white superstar and i'd've been living that world.

I just had people come up to me and say that, and I'm like, I would not even frame it that way, but okay, I see how people are doing that. What happened last year with Caitlyn Clark versus Angel Reese, like it turned into a little bit at where it's like Magic Johnson Larry Bird, like, like media can make people hate people or make people love people, but they're gonna market somebody that they think has an appeal that moves

the needle. So like, come in and last year I knew that, and then USA basketball, the way he played, I knew it was gonna be that situation. So right off the top of the show, I get asked by our sports center host, So Jay, like, what does this say about Cooper Flag. I cut her off and I say, I'm not here to talk about Cooper Flag. I'm giving credit to Kentucky basketball. Kentucky basketball, right, and I go into all the reasons why I think Mark Pope has

done one hell of a job at UK bringing in dogs. Now, granted, lost to Clemson in our night, but still like I I like the way this Kentucky team is constructed, right, So I give them credit for like two three minutes. And then obviously you have to go talk about Cooper Flag and about what you learned in the situation. I saw him, you know, having the ball multiple times, not in a position I felt like was to succeed for him,

and how that played out. Well, come off, and I'm going back to raps and I have all these Kentucky fans coming at me like, oh, you're going after you know, you talk. Of course you're talking about Cooper Flag. Blah bah blahah, Like cause most of the people, you know, if you're at a bar or you're you know, it's white noise in your back in your house. You're not really listening to what I'm saying. You're just seeing the visual and you're hearing me talk, right, So you see

Cooper Flag behind me. So like all these people started coming at me. I'm like, hold on a second. Like I gave Kentucky all the love in the world, so I like to engage people. And I also think sometimes it's like, yo, if Kentucky had a player like Cooper, we'd be all over it. Now we can still gonna promote Kentucky basketball, but like the same way tonight Duke is gonna play Auburn, Like you're gonna get a high dosage volume doses are Cooper Flag, whether you like or not.

So I just went on my social media and say, hey, look, I gave Kentucky love, but like here's marketing, here's how it's gonna happen. You may like it, I'm sorry, but like this is the reality. So like you could shut it up, shut people up like win, go win at championship please, But like this is how media works unfortunately, and it's gonna be too exhaustion for people. Kentucky fans are gonna hate it because they're gonna find a way to talk about Cooper Flag regardless of whether Duke wins

or loses a game, because it moves the needle. I don't know why I'm not involved in data and analytics, but it's just what it is. I saw the same thing with Zion and I dealt with the hate. So I guess that just ruffled a lot of feathers in a long winded context way.

is that fans here what they want to hear. You could have you could have done thirty five minutes just talking about Mark Pope and his offensive structure and how how great he is. But maybe one comment about Cooper flag and that's what would have probably triggered some people. So I know how it works. But Jay, real quick, I want to do a little bit of a rapid fire with you here because I know you've been very gracious with your time. You got a game to call

the night. But I'm going to give you a few questions here. You just give me the first answer that comes to your mind. You're ready, all right. Best player you played against in college that didn't end up becoming like a big time name, didn't have a long NBA career, But somebody that you went up against, that you competed with, is you had a lot of respect for that. Maybe a lot of people don't remember or don't you know, don't don't know a lot.

I've been in denial. But lately, as I got older, I kind of feel like, you know, maybe that is somebody that I do kind of kind of look like, oh my.

it back. But yeah, I'll see those clips that people share of Steve Blake, like fighting people in practice or just like the highlight mixes from him in the NBA with the Lakers and Kobe, And I'm like, you know what, I kind of get why why people say that?

Like obviously there are a ton of great players that played at Louisville, But for me, I always go back to d Mitch because I watched him when he was like a slasher in when his confidence was down, and to see what he's turned into now, like in the type of player he is, like being like one of the best players in the league. It also made me appreciate Rick even more because like, you know, last thing, I'll say, Nick, and I gotta get out of here,

and I guess it. The go break is like look, man, like the way like media confram people as like cheaters and all the it's kind of like bullshit. I'm not even sure if I'm a lot of the cursing your show, but I'm doing it.

about Rick Patino. So like I'm not coming on your show backing anybody. I'm just telling you what I've heard from players over the years. So for me, like watching Rick build in my relationship with him, and then also like Rick and I have been through it too, right with things I've said on TV, and we've had to work through those things. But like watching with Donovan, to me that that one always stands out because I don't I thought Donovan had talent. I didn't know he had that type of talent.