622: A Machined-Button Girlie

It's time for episode 622 of the Clockwise Podcast from Relay, recorded Wednesday, September 10th, 2025. Clockwise, four people, four tech topics, 30 minutes. Welcome back to Clockwise, the tech podcast that's never fashionably late, but always fashionable. I am one of your hosts. My name is Micah Sargent, and I am joined across the internet by my dear friend, my good pal. You know him, you love him. It's Dan, the man, Morin. Hello, Dan.

Hi, Mike. I appreciate the benefit of the doubt that I'm fashionable since this is an audio-only podcast and I look down to see myself wearing a t-shirt, jeans, and just a pair of slippers. So, yep, I'm living my best fashion life right here. I'm also wearing slippers. We're doing it right. Right. It's comfy. We do comfy podcasts here. Comfy casts. Comfy cast. Let's see who else is with us today on this comfy cast. To my left, editor-in-chief of the unofficial Atlassian Ecosystem Roundup.

It's the mellifluous tones of Brian Guffey. Hello, Brian. Hello. Hello. How is everybody today? Peachy Keen. Very well. And to my left this week, it's senior reporter for PCMag, Emily Forlini. Welcome back, Emily. Hello, I'm in the market for slippers taking suggestions. I remember which ones these are, but I love them. They're like, they're like, not fleece, but like.

Comfy lined like leather slippers. I don't even remember where you don't remember. That means you've been clomping around and those guys are real squished down. Oh, yeah, but it's still really nice. They're still really comfortable. I'm still okay with it. It should be. All right. We should get underway. Yeah, we should get underway. We have four topics, 30 minutes. Mine for you is this.

So Apple, of course, had its event where it announced new phones and some other new hardware. I'd just like to know in general. What do we think of Apple's color offerings this year? Do any of the colors speak to you? Any colors that you wish Apple was offering this year? Brian, we'll start with you. Okay, I have to be honest. I'm a blue girl.

And the mist blue looks kind of fabulous to me. Again, we'll see. It might look like somebody thought about the color blue and then like fell over into a pool of water and then dunked the phone into it. I mean, honestly, I love them all, but I really love them as blue. I can't go wrong with the blue.

Yeah, I mean, that's pretty good. I like that Sage one, honestly. I didn't think I would, but then I saw some photos of it from the hands-on area, and I thought that was pretty solid. Green is my favorite color, as I know it is also Micah's. That's a little lighter and I think browner than some of the greens that I prefer. But I think it's...

It's still very nice. In the pro lineup, though, I will probably be buying one of those orange phones. I'm not necessarily a huge orange person, but I like that it's eye-catching. I like that it's different. And I do like orange as a color. And I like that it's...

It's not muted like so many of the pro phones have been in the past. I appreciate that. I'd like to see more of that in the pro lineup. But in terms of what colors I think they're missing, I would like an emerald green. That's the green. And I'm all about that. So Emily, what about you? So I agree with all the caller takes so far. But for me, iPhone caller has been irrelevant for maybe 10 years because I've just been using cases.

I always have a case, so I'm totally out of touch with the color of my phone. It's more about the color of the case. So I'm actually surprised that people are still buying based on color because it's just something I haven't been a part of for so long. I love that answer because the truth is I shouldn't care as much about the color because I also rock a case. But yeah, that's right, Dan, you, you are one of the few who, who goes caseless. I just.

I guess the colors still do matter to me. To answer my own question, I'm not a big orange person either. I don't usually like orange as a color. It's too close to red, which I do not like at all. As Dan pointed out, green is also my favorite color. However, I thought the orange was quite striking this year.

That said, I'm planning on going with the deep blue and pairing it with the green case. And I think that's going to look quite nice. I always like a blue and a green together. So I. Regardless of Apple's overall choices color-wise or whether color matters, given that we rock some cases, I like that Apple is... perhaps looking at options for bringing some striking colors to its pro lineup. So yeah, those are my thoughts. Thank you all for yours. Let's go to our next topic, which comes from Brian.

All right, friends. Fine woven to tech woven. Will you try out the new woven cases from Apple? Or is the woven case name tainted forever to you? This is a good question. I already established that I don't buy cases. And part of that is because I'm on the iPhone upgrade program. So every year I get a new phone and every year that means I need to get a new case. And I started feeling guilty about buying plastic cases that I would just have.

have to throw out because they would never fit next year's phone you could put them on ebay i guess that just seems like a lot of work so instead that's why i just went caseless i will say i i kind of like i would like to

see what they feel like i kind of like the texture they showed off here it seems a little less like let's try to ape um you know leather and instead let's try to do sort of something that's a little bit different um so i appreciate that aspect to it i'm not sure if it's still if like

it's still like a premium case i think the edges are like silicone so it may feel a little bit more like a nicer silicone case with some texture than a real premium case and i do like they've done some colors on there um as somebody in our live chat point out there's a nice green case um and then i actually think that looks really good paired with the orange phone to be honest i think that's kind of a fun somebody pointed out looks like master chief and like michelangelo and i

from Ninja Turtles, and now I can't unsee that, but it's not a bad combo. Orange and green go well together. That's how I'm feeling at that. Emily? So yeah, I just established myself as a case person, but these cases I have not tried. And I guess I'm just speaking from the if it ain't broke, don't fix it, which is kind of the anti the Apple event, always trying to do something new, something new. But.

My phone case is just, I think the brand is Smartish. I'm looking at my phone. I've had the same brand for like five plus years. It has a credit card slot. I have never once lost a credit card, not even close, and it has eliminated my use of a purse and it's just working really well for me. So I've, yeah, I guess I haven't thought about Apple.

colors or apple cases because like this is the one tech thing that's just really working for me over years and that's rare so i'm pretty much sticking to it So I did get the green tech woven case. Yes, I think it's beautiful. And as I mentioned, I think it's going to look really good with the blue. Everybody's doing the green and the orange.

but I think the green and the blue are going to look good together. Look, this could be a moment where I go, what have I done? Perhaps the coating they've put on it didn't actually protect it. I am willing to try it. And the reason why it's not just the color, because I do think, again, that green and blue are going to look great together. More importantly.

It's that they specifically mentioned that they re-engineered the buttons to feel even better. And if there's one thing I've always liked about Apple's premium cases, so not the silicone cases, it is those machine buttons on the side and how they. feel pressing up against it. I'm currently on my iPhone 16 rocking an OtterBox case that is, it's a very thin one. It's not like a standard OtterBox, but it's cactus leather. And it has... these beautiful machined buttons on the side.

And I just love the machined buttons. So, yeah, I guess I am a machined button girly. And therefore, I was very excited to hear that Apple paid even more attention to it with this round. And I'm looking forward to seeing how that. plays out in the next one. Brian, round us out of here. Did you end up going tech woven? Well, friends, here's the thing. I am currently not allowed to get a phone every year anymore. By law or?

By partner law. Oh, yeah, that's the strongest law of all. Yeah, exactly. So he I mean, he will get a case this phone this year, probably because it's been three or four years for him. And I didn't, honestly, I didn't care at all. And then I heard about the in-memory safety thing. And then I'm like, I'm a man, I need more safety. But so, I mean, I will probably, so probably no case for me because no phone for me this year.

But, I mean, on the topic of it, I would try it out. I would touch it. There you go.

I would see how it felt. All right. We have reached halftime here on Clockwise. And that means it's time to tell you about our sponsor. This episode of Clockwise brought to you by Factor. Summer, it often means heaven.

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All right. So one thing not mentioned very much in Apple's keynote was AI. But the company did talk about some of the hardware improvements it made, including its GPU cores, which have been redesigned with accelerators and are optimized for AI. the question for me are you doing a lot of ai related work on your phone are you doing a lot of using a lot of ai

I don't know why I should care. Hello, fellow kids. Emily, what do you think? So I am using the ChatGPT app and Gemini app. So I've been using... Other forms of AI, but Apple's AI, like, you know, Apple intelligence baked into the OS and their whole thing that they launched with the iPhone 16 has not really resonated with me. You know, I don't really use the writing tools. I don't like the summaries on the texts and emails. I find them kind of confusing.

I did erase an object in the back of a photo for the first time this week. Ooh, congratulations. Ooh, a little party trick. Oh, what's photography these days? Who knows? So yeah, I think Apple just hasn't cracked its own code there, but we'll see. I could not agree more. I don't. I have all of it, as much of it turned off as I can because I just don't use it. And in particular, on my phone.

I, again, I could see making use of some of these AI features on macOS when it needs to come up, but I'm not doing AI work on my phone. That said... I do occasionally generate an emoji. I think that's a fun time. People love it. It's a good little moment where you're having a conversation and there's some specific thing where you need two emoji combined. And so you quickly type it in and you get this.

often horrifying emoji that it spits out. I will use that. Outside of that, though, no, not a big AI on the phone kind of person, but we shall see. if that changes after Apple's promise of a more aware Siri hits phones. I mean, bring me Magic Q and the other features that we saw from Google earlier this month. That stuff was cool.

Anyway, Brian, take this away from me. So I'm a big AI kid, so I use a lot of Claude on my phone. I have this thing where I don't like to use my computer unless I have to use my computer, mainly because like computer mean work. And so I end up doing a lot of chatting with Claude on my phone before I go to implement something on my computer.

So I just, yeah, I spend a lot of time doing a lot of chatting with Claude and ChatGBT on my phone, depending on what I'm doing with each of the things. So it's mostly chatbots and not anything else, really. Yeah, I mean, and these are interesting answers. I mean, I think as both you and Emily point out, like the chatbot stuff.

Yeah, that may be AI, but it's not taking advantage of any of this, right? That's not going to, that's all done on their servers. So it's not as though, you know, using those is going to be impacted by how good Apple's chips are for AI. It's not going to make your chat GPT session faster. And that's why I'm kind of perplexed by that decision then, right? Because they do seem to really be optimizing for stuff that's being done on the phone. And there's just not as much in that.

One of the things that may make a difference there is that, of course, iOS 26 has opened up Apple's foundation models for access to third-party developers. So there may be more developers using the on-device AI stuff. may in turn benefit more from these enhancements. I think it will be interesting to see because I thought your point, Brian, was really good about what you view as using for work, like your computer versus your phone, etc. And I wonder how many people are doing...

you know, AI, quote unquote, work, like with direct access to models and stuff on their phones. I just don't, I don't know. I mean, I understand from a branding and a marketing perspective why Apple wants to talk about its devices being great for AI. But for me, it feels like it hits maybe a little more home on a desktop or laptop than it does on a phone. But I...

I fully admit that maybe I'm just outside of the AI craze, and I just haven't quite plugged in there. So thank you all for your thoughts on that. Let's move to our final topic, which comes from Emily.

Okay, my topic is, is there any innovation left for iPhones? It's a very mature category. I think that's probably the reason why the last three topics I've said, yeah, not that interested or I've been doing the same thing for years. The AI stuff hasn't really caught my eyes. I want to know what you guys think. And also, are Apple Watches and AirPods kind of like the new grounds for innovation? I think it's fair that one would consider...

the Apple Watch and AirPods, perhaps the place where we'll see some more innovation. Arguably, Apple Watch year over year, still not changing much. I've seen some complaints about that, but... Part of the reason why I'm glad there haven't been too many changes is it means that even the watch band I bought. when I bought the Series Zero version of the Apple Watch all those many years ago, works with my current watch. And so there's only so much you can do without changing.

everything and then making it so that all of the bands one has bought are obsolete. AirPods, though, getting new, interesting features all the time. They've completely reshaped them. The AirPods Pro. in its new version and have added more tip options. I mean, there's a lot of stuff. Yes, a lot of innovation left to do. As for iPhones. The one innovation that people are talking about might be left is the foldable option. And that could be something we see soon. I don't.

understand foldables in the current way that they work. It's not for me. And so that's an innovation that I don't care about. And I've always said when this question comes up, that the next innovation for me is completely... separating from this slab of glass idea to an augmented

experience that I have where I'm putting on a pair of glasses, not a huge stinking pair of goggles strapped to my face, but a pair of glasses that provides me the experience that I was able to have on my phone. So I think we're still a long way away from that innovation. And until then, it's just going to continue to be this incremental upgrade to processor, camera and finish. Brian, what are your thoughts?

I would say that all of the things that we're loving about the AirPods could probably not be done without the iPhone. So we're getting that live translation. I'm pretty sure that that relies on the iPhone to work. I think it's often that we forget that so much of the brains of what's happening is in the iPhone. And there's where a lot of that innovation is consistently happening is it's powering these additional connected devices.

uh that give us uh some of these this functionality it's a little different in the watch uh that's definitely true the other thing that i would say is uh camera camera camera camera camera there is still so much room to do incredible innovations when it comes to the camera that we don't have an answer for because of physics yet. So that's, I think, a really interesting place.

And then the other thing I'd say is I can imagine an iPhone projector where your iPhone can actually project on a wall and you can watch a movie or something. And I can even imagine, I mean, I think there's still a lot of space to do cool things with batteries as well. So I think there is still a lot of innovation in iPhone. What I don't think that means necessarily is form factor or, I mean, we could also go completely courtless. That's the other thing.

So, like, I just don't think we're going to get different than this slab, except maybe the foldable that Micah points out. And I think that's partially because, like, what's better than, like, a screen in your hand in a lot of cases? That is the ideal form factor. But I think everything else around there, there's still a lot of opportunity. I just think we've reached that point where it's much harder to make those leaps and bounds.

Yeah, I think I largely agree with that. I mean, it's diminishing returns as we are quickly approaching the 20th anniversary of the iPhone. 20 years is a long time. And there's just... you know, the juice and the squeeze don't quite line up anymore after 20 years, right? Like, you know, there's just less in the tank for them to do, and stuff gets harder, right? They've made the problem harder for themselves in some ways, too, by making the phones smaller.

uh you know and lighter etc not in every case but obviously like they're trying to optimize for certain types of things i i'm very impressed with some of the stuff that's under the hood um in particular the iphone air while it's not the phone for me the idea that they've made

to centralize most of the components in the camera plateau there is wild. That's wild. And certainly, you know, to Micah's point about foldables, I think that sort of presages the idea of a foldable coming next year where they can devote a lot more... to battery and perhaps even try to find ways to make it even thinner in some places if you can sort of spread that out.

I am intrigued by the foldable. I do think that's one of the potentials for big changes. I don't think it will necessarily become the default because I think lots of people are very happy with their phones as they are now, and it will certainly be a lot more expensive. But it does add literally another dimension to the device. which is very, very powerful. As far as Apple Watches and AirPods go,

I think Brian's point right as well that the AirPods depend a lot on the processing power in the phone. There's just stuff you're not going to be able to do in the chips that are available in there because you don't have general purpose chips in there. You have things that are tuned for a very specific purpose.

The Apple Watch I find very interesting as a possibility because it does feel like there are places where it can be kind of standalone, but there's clearly places where it's just not good enough at certain immutable things like... text entry to be your only device. You can get away with it, but it's not as nice as using the phone. That said, the health stuff is a big part of that, and there are things they can be doing there.

But they are also kind of running into problems there as well. And some of that, again, is just immutable based on where this device is, right? This hypertension detection they're doing, they cannot take your blood pressure because they don't have a way to do that.

without your watch inflating every once in a while. And that's going to be real distracting. It's just not the best place to get blood pressure. So instead, they're having to try and figure out other ideas. And those are very clever solutions that may provide a lot of the functionality they want. terms of being able to warn people about risk cases. But it's also going to be limiting when it comes to things like they'd like to do glucose tracking, right? Non-invasively.

that's going to be hard. It's not that they can't solve it. It's just going to be really tough given that it's just a thing that sits on your wrist. So I wonder in a certain degree whether some of the expansion opportunities come from more...

proliferation of devices. Hey, we've got heartbeat sensors in your ears now. Why not a ring or why not something, you know, a wearable that can go somewhere else and detect information? Why not glasses? Like, I think there's rooms to expand, but it is certainly true that the iPhone in particular has become a very mature product after almost two decades. So it's just going to be harder to find new big innovations to do there. Emily, why don't you wrap us up?

Yeah, I agree with pretty much everything said. I think iPhones and just that form factor kind of becoming like laptops, just a staple that powers other things. That's a good point, Brian. I think for me. I have more wow moments when I'm reading about new features on the Apple Watches and the AirPods. Then I'm like, oh, that could change things. So sleep apnea detection, AFib detection.

Like you mentioned, the hypertension detection and then the AirPods as hearing aids, like these are all now cleared by the FDA and can change people's lives. You know, they're not a replacement for a doctor, but they're really interesting to me. And I know examples of.

people they could help. And then like with the AI, you know, I don't think a lot of the on the phone is compelling, but live translation, the AirPods, I'm like, that could change the world that could knock down language barriers. So for me. I think the watch and the AirPods are where low key the most innovation is really happening.

All right, folks, with that, we are just about to the end of the show. We do have enough time for a bonus topic. Before we get there, though, I want to remind you about our wonderful swag at clockwise.social. When you head to clockwise.social, you can see the cool stuff we have. available for you. We've got a shirt, we've got a hat, we've got a tote bag, we've got a mug, we've got stickers, we've got all sorts of

fun, clockwise swag. You can, you know, show your support for the show by wearing those items or carrying those items. And in doing so, you help support the work we do here. And we appreciate. that as well. So head to clockwise.social to learn more about our lovely swag. My bonus topic, if you...

could replace an actor in a television show or a film. So you are taking the spot of this individual. Who would you replace? Brian? I think we're going to have to go with Lawrence Fishburne as Morpheus. Yeah! that's so good that is so good i would not end up like morpheus i would be much cooler yes i would not die yes yeah well obviously

I didn't realize this. I thought I was replacing them with somebody else in my thought immediately to replacing actors with Muppets. Of course. Yeah, I really like that Department Q show on Netflix, but what if it were Sam the Eagle? You could be a Muppet. I will be the Swedish chef. Yeah, I mean, sure. Why not? I mean, I'm sure there's more glamorous things I could pick, but let's go with that. I'll be the Swedish chef.

For me, I also interpreted it the same way as Dan, so I'm just going to swap in myself. For my original answer. And so I was going to swap out Brad Pitt in the F1 movie, which is an Apple TV movie. So it's on theme. I think it's ridiculous that old men are working too long in Hollywood and playing.

you know main heartthrob characters like brad pitt come on like leonardo dicaprio you've been working you look like an old man in killers of the flower moon you look i think it's killers of the flower moon That very long movie. I think he played a young man straight out of World War I. And he is like a wrinkled old prune. I think we need to get these guys out. Pop off.

I am totally passionate about this. We need to get these guys the hell out of here, swap in some young people, make a new crop of, you know, heartthrob men, or just put me in the F1 movie and we're good. Boom. I would replace Chuck Bartowski in the show Chuck.

because i just think oh that'd be so great of being able to download stuff i can kind of picture that by the way thank you and be able to download stuff to your brain is just such a cool thing and i used to i would watch that show and every once in a while i'd have a dream where I had that power. And so I would become, you know.

different people with different skills. And I just think it's such a cool thing. So thank you all for your answers on that. Hey, to all of you listening out there, if you would like to get ad free episodes with an extra unwound episode every week where Dan and I talk about a topic, you can become a member.

Go to relay.fm slash clockwise. Sign up. It's just $7 a month, $70 a year, and you will help support the show in doing so. With that, it is time to thank our awesome guests for being here. Brian Guffey, thank you so much for taking the time to join us today. Oh, absolutely. I do have one thing that I need to just share with people very, very briefly. There's 1,295 days until the end of Atlassian Data Center. And Emily Forlini, thank you so much for being here this week.

Thank you. I would also like to add Tom Cruise to my rant. I don't want to do Tom Cruise's Mission Impossible stunts, but I would love to be in those movies. All right. So I got you guys on Tom Cruise and then I'll just. plug um i have my own little little mini podcast called the super intelligent podcast where we talk about you know just recent tech trends so check that out and we do not rant about tom cruise on that one so you'll have to come to clockwise shame for my true thoughts

All right. We'll be back next week where we may or may not talk about more actors that we've replaced in movies with ourselves. But until then, we remind everyone listening out there, watch what you say. And keep watching the clock. Bye, everybody.