Law Murray Joins for a Two Hour Clippers Talk Special - podcast episode cover

Law Murray Joins for a Two Hour Clippers Talk Special

Sep 06, 20241 hr 55 min
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Episode description

Clippers Talk with Adam Auslund as Law Murray from the Athletic joins to talk about EVERYTHING Clippers from Zu getting paid, to PG leaving, to Kawhi and James and Bones and Kai Jones.

Transcript

Speaker 1

Lolco've been to Clippers Talk a live edition, just the third we have done so far. I'm out of Moslin. If you missed yesterday's show, we had Paul's cheron that was not live. That was an intimate podcast with a comedium that is a Clippers fan that y'all should learn more about because he is one of the best of the best speaking of today in this live everyone is fortunate to have La Murray on, uh, including myself, because we haven't connected in some time now during the off season.

I think he came on with us once on Clips and Dip. But now I got this YouTube channel going at Clippers Talk is where you could find it at La Murray. The NU is where you find him on x. He covers the Clippers for the athletic He is well. He is an unbiased, objective, impartial member of the media. He does a service to Clippers fans because of his great coverage. You are more plugs did and more informed with this team clipornation. I know everybody loves La Murray a lot of my friend, good catch.

Speaker 2

Up, appreciate the kind words, thank you, and uh yeah, I've been seeing your your little pot thing. I thought that John went straight out of Super Mario World too, with the cutouts and whatnot, so.

Speaker 1

We're not as hard as Super Mario World.

Speaker 2

To come on, y'all. Y'all's closed. Is that a lo O Eric production?

Speaker 1

It is hashtag w t F l O l Eric.

Speaker 2

You gotta shout out my guy, my guy Eric. I recently had a change the avatar because it's a new year, but shout out to him. Shout out to him. Man, he gifted me for a year, so I gotta shout him out. I know his see I know his work when I see it. But I was like, if it's not that, it's something out of this is definitely something out of Yoshi's Island for sure.

Speaker 1

With a little baby, asked Mario that starts crying all the time.

Speaker 2

Yeah, no, I hate that game for real.

Speaker 1

Lobry is with us here. It's a Clippers Talk Live. I'm out of Mosland. Why alive because we both want to watch the game tonight too, So we gotta get this out of the way now. I don't want to have to worry about uploading it later on. It's on the YouTube side at Clippers Talk is where you find it.

Speaker 2

Love that game tonight is going to be a celebration for some.

Speaker 1

So celebration for some Chiefs and Ravens. We'll see what King Henry can do, all right. Not talking about King James here on Clippers Talk. But there are a lot of subjects I want to get into. Because you've been doing a series. Let people know where they can find it. Talking about the fourteen teams that didn't make the playoffs last season.

Speaker 2

Yeah, well not just those teams, but the teams that sixteen teams that made the playoffs as well. So I called it the Epitome Game Series. It's something that I did last summer as well. But last summer was the first time I was like, you know what, I'm watching all these games in the offseason. Let me do some video breakdowns. Mainly because I learned how to use iMovie efficiently, so I was like, you know what, let me use it. You know, shout out to the New York Times for

that one. And so last year I gave myself thirty days to do it, and that was that was reasonable. My life was a little bit more hectic going into August twenty twenty four, so I didn't get around to You might have heard about that building opening up in Englewood, So you know, I was a little busy the first half of August, but it was August seventeenth, I was like, all right, if I start today on this project and do two today, then I can get this done before

September first. And so doing doing these video breakdowns, I watched entire an entire game for every team, and I would basically break down what I thought was like the gain that showed their biggest extreme as far as their strength or their weakness if they were a team that missed the playoffs, and and you know I had I had a good time doing it, Like you can't tell me I don't watch your damn team. So I've watched every single team at least once, and a lot of

those games were not fun to watch. I watched the Blazers get smacked by sixty points. So like it was a project I wanted to do, especially after doing it last year, I was like, yeah, let me, let me, let me do it again, because not only does it refresh me at the deadest time of the year as far as games go, Like we're in the midpoint of it's been a while since the playoffs, but it'll be a little while before the season starts going, So August is that time where it's like, let me remind myself

what basketball looks like in the regular season. And so not only do you have that refresher, but also naturally you're going to look at that and preview this upcoming season. So you know, it's a It was a service to me because newsflash, a lot of the work I do for anyone else that's got to start with me. Do I want to do this? Is am I engaged with it? Do I have a sense of purpose here? And then obviously if I do this, I want people to see it.

So shout out to anybody who is like, yeah, I want to watch one hundred minutes of what Law's got to say about thirty NBA teams. It goes by quick if you break it down like that.

Speaker 1

And where can people find it? One more time?

Speaker 2

Law, Yeah, it's on my YouTube, It's on my Instagram. I'm putting them up daily on my Instagram. Now they're on my little used TikTok. So if you can find my social you can probably find where these are at. And if you can't, then I ain't that hard to find.

Speaker 1

I saw it on Instagram earlier today, and it reminded me of something that we'll be keeping track of all season long, and maybe we can start with this. But teams that you believe that are going to be close on the standings in the Western Conference to the Clippers who those teams are based upon, you know, the outlook of this season. A lot of people have said law that they believe sixth is aspirational. Basically for the Clippers, staying out of the playing is the goal right now.

But if you're saying they're going to be around that area, that means six through ten somewhere in there. There's a lot of teams in the mix. We know how close the standings were last season. Do you believe I know we say this every year with the Western Conference, but to me, this might be peak Western Conference Gauntlet because of the young teams that are on the rise. Wemby with the Spurs now as CP three, the Houston Rockets could be right there fighting for position with the Clippers.

Do you believe this is going to be one of the most competitive years in league history in the Western Conference?

Speaker 2

Sure, Let's league history.

Speaker 1

Is modern history.

Speaker 2

We got a lot of we got a lot of years to stack up, and I know a lot of y'all not really trying to look at I mean, look, I remember when the Western Conference was garbage in the eighties. Lakers fans don't really like talking about you know, they don't really talk about that. But like good reason, they actually won the Chips. It'll be another thing if you come out of the West all the time and you can't get it done. They got it done. But like

I thought that was the case last year. I don't really see anything that new, to be honest with you. I mean, I know Clippers fans are going to probably see it a different way because, you know, they had a different kind of team last year, like an end stage team with some high star power, you know, a level of desperation that comes with the contract status of the guys that they had. Like that's not the case anymore. We're in a different kind of era as far as

discussing where the Clippers are at. But the Western Conference was like that last year, Like Becase was different last year compared to the year before.

Speaker 1

No, no doubt, it's always tough. I just see it as well. Memphis was out of the picture last year. We expected them to be back. How many teams are actually getting significantly worse. Most would point to the Clippers as being that team because they lost Paul George of a team that's going to take a real step back when there's all these other teams that could get better.

Speaker 2

Yeah, I mean the Clippers is the only team in the entire league East or West that lost an All Star, you know, So there's that part of it. No other Yeah, another team has to deal with that. But then again, the Clippers are also they look a lot more like the team that they were for years before James Harden got there, before Russ got there, as far as a team built around two stars. So I think a lot of people are going to react more to what the Clippers lost than to who the Clippers have mostly been

under Toronto Loo anyway, it's just astet of P's. It's James Harden, you know, when you look at teams like Memphis, just like, on one hand, you get job back, but on the other hand, Joe's not coming back to the same team that he left when Memphis was the two seed in twenty twenty three, and in I think believe they were the two seed also in twenty twenty two as well. If the two, or I believe they were two.

Speaker 1

They were up there. I'm thinking of the year they lost the Lakers in the first round.

Speaker 2

They're just the Lakers. They were two for sure. Yeah, the year before. I'm trying to remember quickly who had home court advantage between the Warriors and the Grizzlies in that semi finals, and like the reality is like a lot of people are going to react to that Grizzlies team and it's like, yeah, like that that Grizzly team had home court advantage, like they were fifty six and twenty six. The Warriors were fifty three and twenty nine

wound up winning the championship as a three. So like the Grizzlies are a team where it's like, how much better are they going to be? It's like, on one hand, yes, John coming back changes a lot, Like they were literally the worst offense in basketball last year. They were terrible to watch play basketball, like from the jump, and Joh changes a lot. On the other hand, that team is not as good as those teams that were two seeds number one and number two. The thing with Jah is

Joh don't stay healthy either. Like John didn't just play nine games because he was suspended for twenty five of them. Joh had a shoulder injury that took him out for the rest of the year. Joe rarely stays on the floor for you know, John's probably going you can pencil Joh in and probably miss twenty games. So that's the thing with these teams. It's like, on one hand, yes, on paper, the competition is going to be crazy, but

what separate teams every year? Player availability? And yes, if you're the Clippers, you're probably a little bit concerned about that. If you're a team like Memphis, if you're a team like Golden State, if you're a team like the Los Angeles Lakers, you should also be concerned about that. Some of the teams that might take a jump, they gotta take massive jumps, like the Spurs have to take a massive jump to be quote unquote competitive like they were.

Of course, they looked better in the second half of last year because they started the year damn near five and thirty. Like, if you're going from an F to a C minus, you're gonna look like an improved team.

Speaker 1

All yeah, but what just happens if they actually play wemby real minutes like it it's they're not I think as far from being a playing team as some people might believe.

Speaker 2

Yeah, no, that play in Battle is going to be what's crazy? You know, I think all these teams in the West have real flaws, Like like Denver's not going to be as good as they were last year. I think Phoenix has a reason to be better, but no one is going to be scared of Phoenix if it

gets to a playoff situation. Like I think Phoenix actually like they hired the right coach if they wanted to get their regular season stuff together, Like Bud goes to teams and makes them better in the regular season, but you knows, I.

Speaker 1

Don't think they playing seventy five games this year.

Speaker 2

Well that's the thing. It's like Budd is coaching three guys who, yeah, KD I expect will miss some time. Book is a guy who doesn't always still on the floor. But Brad can't be as bad as he was last year. I think they're gonna just be in a better state when they got their guys actually available to play. And you know, even even teams like Dallas, how good do

you think Dallas is going to be? Like I expect them to be really good, But at the same time, they're the typical team where given a short run, bacon hurt you. Given a long season, they're more likely to run in some real bumps and stuff because of the guys that are that are on their team, like Klay Thompson is all of a sudden their third most important player, and that that's a little scary. So the competition in the West is more like every night is just going

to be something. But the teams that are going to be at the top of the West, they have real flaws. And the teams that are already at the bottom, it don't take much for them to be like, Yo, we were talking some game and we ain't really about that life. The Clippers, I feel like, are literally dead smack in the middle of that. They are the most bubble of the bubble teams. There's like, if.

Speaker 1

Kawhi plays sixty games, right, that's a sing it's playing enough.

Speaker 2

Yeah, And I think he will, like I think he had some bad timing and bad fortune with where his knee was at.

Speaker 1

Can we talk about that. I want to ask you about that because like I'm not trying to be an alarmist, but I have real concerns when it sounds like a right knee that had been under the knife multiple times prior was swollen and they couldn't get it over under control for almost two months. We don't even know when

the swelling really subsides. You just kind of have to go off of the timeline of when he showed up for camp or Team USA, right, and that's almost three months so when and he said, then, you know, two weeks beforehand he had a turning point. It's like that to me is really worrisome. Is that am I being a little bit too caution cautionary there?

Speaker 2

I don't think he can be too cautious with Kawhi, Like it's just because Kawhi Leonard finishing a playoff series, whether his team wins the damn playoff series or not, would be an event that we have not seen since the twenty twenty one quarterfinals against the Dallas Mavericks. So you know, I think you have to reasonably expect Kuhi to miss time. I think there has to be a maintenance plan for Kawhi to you know, get through the season. Like that's just what it is. And so there aren't

a crazy number of five and sevens. I know, people are I reacted to the fact that they have sixteen sets of back to backs and if Kawhi misses games on those back to backs, then you're just gonna have to be ready for that. But I do feel like if Kawhi, the most important thing for right now is

that Kawhi is going to be ready for camp. Like when I last saw him in Vegas in July, he was feeling, he was feeling good, he was feeling like he was in good spirits, like he could have did the Team USA thing, Like he wasn't in distress or anything like that. He was ready to work. We've seen him be in San Diego working at USC working with Eric Musselman, Like I think, you know, you have to

let basketball players play basketball. And I do think the Clippers are going to do things differently to kind of adjust for the fact that they don't want his knee to get worn down at a terrible time. And I think that reasonably that probably means Kawhi is a shoe in the mist fifteen to twenty games. The hope is that that's all you have to do is just manage, you know, stuff and hope that he doesn't have an

occurrence where something random pops up. What you don't want is any Joe Ingles incidents or any time where he falls on the dude and springs an ankles. Seriously, you want to just avoid the freak stuff from happening. And if Kawhi is out there, the team's going to be good because that's what Kawhi does. He raises the floor and he raises the ceiling. Not every star does that, and James is a similar way. Like I think people react to James in the playoffs and James having fallouts

with the teams that he's been on. What people will gloss over because James is the kind of player that you move go posts for is the fact that James is a guy who is a league average at worst offense every single year. So the Clippers are going to

need offensive contributors this year. Well, at the very least, it's good that you have James Harden as part of the solution, the figuring that stuff out, not just getting himself more opportunities to do what he does well, so as putting the ball to the basket, but he's going to work with ben guys who are new to the team to get them up to speed, to do things that a lot of those guys are trying to get paid or in position to get paid, they haven't done before.

And that is a floor raising thing. And we're talking about regular season at him right, We're not talking about what they might do in the playoffs. So those guys getting a reasonable amount of games out of those guys, both individually and as a combo, is going to be a good place for where the Clippers are going into the season.

Speaker 1

My biggest concern is just is it over with that one issue of the swelling or is this something you have to manage all the way through where it.

Speaker 2

Can manage it. I think you're gonna have to just manage it. We're gonna We're probably gonna hear from Kawhi about if he's learned anything, if there's something about his body that he feels good about that he feels concerned about. And I think the team is probably spooked.

Speaker 1

You know, I think Tmusa was spooked law I think what he said, we know they were no, but particularly by the language Kawhi used of right now it's in a neutral state. I think that set up a red flag for them where you could say Kawhi felt good enough to go. I think the reason they sent him home was maybe because they just weren't sure if he was able to sustain that level of play or they'd be a setback at some point during the campaign and they didn't want to have to deal with that. That's

my guest. I didn't like it. Of course, I want Kawhi to be playing, and if he says he's ready to go, you know, he's such a legacy player and one of the greatest players of his generation. I think he should have had that opportunity. But I think that's why.

Speaker 2

I mean, look, man, they got an up close look at him. They had Derek White on speed all and they felt better with because to me, it wasn't just Kawhi that they had to consider as far as get Derek White on the team. The fact is they had other guys that weren't playing, weren't practicing, weren't going to be ready to play in the exhibitions, or we're going to be limited in the exhibitions. And it was like, do we make a decision now or do we risk you know, Katie not getting his calf right or Joelle

not being ready to go. And I felt like Kawhi was always going to be the guy who was whether Kawhi looked great or Kawhi didn't look greater. Really it was a matter of, you know, Kawhi is not going to be a flashy dude. Okayhi is just going to show up and go through the emotions. It was t USA basically to me, this is my read on it, and this is I feel like Kawhi's reading as well. I feel like it was like, we have this zude Derek White, who we know is healthy and going to

be ready to play. Do we feel better about him being with us or do we feel better about risking whether it was Kawhi or somebody else being shorthanded for a port or the a portion of the Olympics. And I just feel like they took a I and Derek, who was more of a short thing than Kawhi was. Yeah, and he.

Speaker 1

Played well too.

Speaker 2

By the way he played well played he played a role that you know they that team needed, Like it's not like they replaced Kawhi with Jalen Brown. You know, they didn't replace Kawhi with another Kawhi, a assimilate of that player. They were like, we want a sure thing we want a guy who's here, Like, if anything, look at Kevin Durant replacing Kawhi, Like KD wasn't the one playing in Vegas, and then KD got because he had

the points record. What are you gonna do? You wanna send KAD home when Kawhi is out there feeling his way out? Nah, Like you're gonna get Derek White in there, and you're gonna hope, all right if KD is there, at least you know KD got a level to get to and kt got to that level. So it worked out for USA. It was definitely a more eventful Olympics. I feel like than any Olympics that I've ever experienced since two thousand and four.

Speaker 1

You're listening to Clippers Talk. It's a Clippers Talk Live edition. I'm outa Maslim. We got Lot Murray of the Athletic here, having talked with Lawn sometime, a lot to catch up on. I know you guys have a lot of questions too. Here's Miles Johnson. Since it's topical we're talking Kawhi, but also we mentioned James Harden a little bit, and this is the new duo. Now it is pretty damn clear twenty one Blackjack, whatever you want to say for their

jersey numbers. The two one three era is over. It's Kawhi, it's James Harden, and Miles Johnson wants to know this from law the points rebounds assist expectations for Kawhi and James Harden this year.

Speaker 2

Mole sound like he's trying to do a get a fantasy draft together. Like individual numbers are a little like it's a little tough to project for me because I'm like, I mean, look, what do you really expect. I think it's more important to have guys play play games than it is to expect them to hit certain numbers. Like I think sometimes guys numbers go up and that's a bad thing.

Speaker 1

You know, efficiency goes down, but the overall numbers.

Speaker 2

Go up or your team just ain't good enough, so you needed you need those players to do more. For instance, like you know, like Ajia Wilson right now, like Ajie Wilson's going is, her numbers are crazy good right now, but her team ain't running the league like it was, you know, in the years where her numbers were not needed to be as high as they are and right now for instance, So yeah, I think, yeah, Kawhi needs to hit twenty five game. I think James needs to

hit twenty a game. I don't think either one of those guys hit those numbers last year. As far as points, rebounds, like Kawhi's rebounding has declined over time, but I think that I think seven the game is probably a good a good number. The thing with kaw Kawhi is a

pretty good contested rebounder. That's something that there are some guys who grab a ton of rebounds, but like Jason Tatum for instance, Jason Tatum is an outstanding rebounder from a I just got rebounds perspective, But Jason gets a lot of uncontested, cheap rebounds, okay, you know, and.

Speaker 1

Then the Russell Westbrook boards.

Speaker 2

I'm Tatum gets a lot of uncontested rebounds. And then if you flip it, a guy like Aaron Gordon, like Aaron Gordon gets doesn't have as many counting number rebounds, But if you look at the kind of rebounds Aaron Gordon gets for an outstanding rebounding team, and the Nuggets like Aaron Gordon gets the toughest rebounds in the league.

Like so if you look at it. From that perspective, Kawhi is a really good, like contested rebounder, but there's gonna be more of those that he's gonna have to get because instead of Paul George, you're playing with Derek Jones Junior more often, and Derek is not going to be around the perimeter as much. It's going to be a cascading effect. So there's going to be more rebounds that Kawhi is going to have to, you know, pry

his hands on to secure possessions sort of. Clippers. I think the Clippers are going to be a pretty bad rebounding team this year, but you know there's a side effect to that. I do expect them to be more aggressive as well, trying to force some turnovers. James is a guy who last year he have five rebounds a game. I think that that guy is a really good rebound for reguard, like I think he can get back up to six next year. We're talking about rebounds like dimes

per game. James slipped to eight point five last year, and the thing with you know, James Harden going eight point five, he was still close to top five in the league. In a sistber game and look at all the mouths that the Clippers offense had to feed. Again, you don't have PG, you don't have Russ you got, you don't have as many playmakers. James averaging tennisist per

game is a thing that is a real possibility. Like he's got he's going to have guys, he's gonna have to create the balls want to be in his hands. I think you know, he led the league and assists his last year in Philly, Like, it's a pretty good expectation. Like ten tennisis per game is a pretty good number for James and possibly reach like he can average twenty

and ten next year. Kawhi Kawhi has never been a huge, you know, playmaker, So I mean where he was last year is probably about where he'll be next next year. I think for a sists per game is probably what you can expect for Kawhi. And yeah, I think that covers points, rebounds, and assists. But good luck on you old fantasy draft bro Like, I don't know why you would draft any Clippers for your fantasy team, but if

you need to. If there's one Clipper I'm drafting for fantasy, it's James Harden because I trust his health more than Kawhi's I trust defect. The ball is going to be in his hands all the time. Like Toronto Lu learned in November of twenty twenty three that what you're not going to do with James Harden is tell him to get ready to catch and shoot from three. You're gonna get the ball in his hands to get the most out of James, and Tlu leaned into James more than

he's leaned into any guard he's ever had. Like and now you got less, guys. James Harden is going to put up crazy numbers. I'm not sure how efficient he will be. I don't feel great about his efficiency, but he's his counting stats. His volume is going to be spectacular going in the next season.

Speaker 1

J m I thirteen twenty four said Harden will be at twenty ten and six on forty four thirty eight eighty seven shooting splits. That is optimistic, I'd say, but it's not totally crazy. How many more shots do you think he ends up taking per game? Because he was only at a let been with the Clippers last season. Law I was talking with somebody in like maybe fifteen to seventeen. They were saying seventeen to twenty. I think that's just far too many. Where do you have, Matt?

Speaker 2

I mean, I just don't think there's there's areas on the floor. James doesn't hit and just doesn't get to fifteen shots per game is a good baseline for me. So, I mean, you have to look at it like this, where are your shots coming from? We already established James ain't really about that catch and shoot life, and so you need other guys to set you up to shoot that shot. Their ball will get out of his hands and get back in his hands on occasion, and he is.

It's not like he's a bad catching shoot guy. It's just that you know, the ball has to be out of your hands and back in your hands somehow. You have to play with other guys who make plays. So for the most part, we're talking what James is outstanding at, and that is the pull up three, that sidestep three. Like, we're gonna see that a lot. That dude's going to be launching them three is a lot. Like The concern is can he embrace the floater we saw in game four?

I wrote a whole story on float school, you know what I mean. But he wasn't the floatgoat in Game five though? So like because James is the type of player where if that thing is working and he knows he needs to hit it, he'll hit it. But James is also the kind of player where he'll get discouraged, you know, so it's like, oh, I got my ship blocked, like, and then he won't he won't go back to it.

Speaker 1

You know, he'll feel like he can Minnesota.

Speaker 2

Yeah, And and it's like that's where it's like, Okay, James is good at reading the game, and I think James is leaned into his ability to create for others at a high, high level. Like again, how many tennis seasons does he have? Like he's one of the very best passers the game has ever seen in that regard. But the dude has to score. And it's easy, I think for him to get the pull up three off, because all you need to do is dribble, dribble, dribble, create some space and get that thing off. Will he

hit the mid range more often? Will he embrace the floater more often? How can he get to the rim? Because when you're older, any player who has bursts to consistently get to the rim as a special player. James used to be that guy. Does James consistently get to the rim at this age of his career, And if you see it early, I don't care. You got to see it over the course of the dog days of the season. I thought, James last year, here's how the season win.

He needed some time to get acclimated and to get into playing game shape. I thought he actually came to the Clippers in good shape physically, but as far as being a basketball player and playing games, he needed a good ten games to get to the point where he was comfortable playing games. And then he got to that point and the Clippers offense took off, and then you saw in February that there was a little bit of a Okay, we've been playing hard for two months, now,

let's see some regression. And then he finally missed games in March. Right, So it's sustainability. How can James be effective? Efficient? And that third part sustainable and what does that look like?

A sorry his shot diet and that's and I have concerns about that part from an efficiency standpoint, but I think those three's are going to get them, and I think he knows he has to hit the paint more often, and he's going to get you know, I think you're going to see a lot more paint James Harden than you did last year.

Speaker 1

That answer kind of ties into a good question from Grant Mona from the Sporting Tribute and talking about his raine concern with fatigue. Will he be able to sustain it while being asked to score more at the age of thirty five. He just had a birthday a week or so ago, and I have concerns about that. I think you have to manage James Harden to some extent to the season. Having to do that with your other best player in Kawhi Leonard while trying to stay out

of the play in that seems very difficult. That's a difficult balance.

Speaker 2

I think it was a balance that they had to do with Paul George as well. Like the thing with Paul is you saw it last year. You know why Paul was able to play as many games as he did, It's because they took responsibility away from Paul. Like on both ends of the floor, they didn't have Paul chasing around the smallest guards. They let Terrence man get his get his head beat in. With that responsibility which I'm sure Terrence is appreciated the fact that they have two

guys to handle that instead of Terrence. You know, Derek is going to do that to start games, and Chris Dunn is going to be asked to do that in relief. On the other end of the floor, Paul wasn't running as many ISOs, as many pick and rolls. His off ball was enhanced, and Paul had to kind of accept that. But you know that James Harden allowed out for Paul to be healthy efficient, not because Paul and Pete and

James clicked together. You know, I think Paul played better when Russe was on the floor, But at the same time, Paul didn't have to take the beat down that on ball guys have to take, and I think that helps Paul get through the season. You know, Paul had a little rough patch in there physically at the end of January and throughout February.

Speaker 1

But points per game, Yeah, it was bad.

Speaker 2

But but but but you know, like Paul was able to be healthier last year than he was able to stay healthy in the previous two years, right, And obviously a lot of that also comes with not having your arm smashed by Yusef Nurkics and not having your knee smashed by Lugan Stewart. Like, again, there's some luck involved in that as well. So sustaining James Harden, I think he's very stubborn. I think he wants to play all

the games and all the minutes that he can. They literally had to pry him to the bench in March because if it was up to James, he wouldn't have missed even the games that he did miss Like that's how James is wired. James is more durable than Kawhi and Paul George are, and at the same time, there are things that James can't do that other guys can do. So the key to sustaining James, especially if the key is getting James to do the most, I think Terrence

is gonna have a lot to do with it. If you're gonna want James to be able to get a little bit easier buckets over the course of games, you need to put the ball in Terrence Man's hands a lot more. And Terrence has to show that he can make things happen as a playmaker. That is something that people probably aren't talking about as much, but I believe that if Terrence and I believe Terrence is the better option to start so that Norm can do what we know he's capable of, and that is cook entire second

units by himself, like me and me and Norm. Norm doesn't like to hear it, but me and me and Norm like used to talk all the time about, hey, you have more points than the entire other team's reserves combined. Like we didn't have as many of those games last year because Norm's scoring output wasn't as required. It will absolutely be required this year. But we know what Norm doesn't do. Normans. Norm's on the court to get buckets.

Norm's not on the court to send Zoo bots wrap around passes like Terrence can do that stuff, though, and Terrence has to be able to do more on the ball because the entire offense just needs somebody. You're not gonna ask Derrick Jillones you're gonna do that Zoo, I'm sure if you're gonna want to talk about Zoo on here, Like Zuo is a proficient post player, but what Zoo is not is a guy who's going to be a

guy who you play through. You know, we see that if Zoo's allowed to post jus up and match them and score. He can be incredible. If a team says, screw that, we're gonna beat the hell out of Zoo, double team him, take him out the game, Zuo's probably not hurting you as much like Zoo's not a proficient passer. He's not a guy who if you put two on Zoo and Zoo's catch areas aren't expansive. Zuo is a low block guy, a role guy. He's not a guy who's setting up, spacing the floor, picking him pop in,

doing any of that stuff. So Terrence is the guy who has the versatility to do more. Has shown us he can do more, but has to actually do more. And Terrence will be highly motivated to do those things because he's the one who's next in line for a new deal, whether there comes from the Clippers or some other team.

Speaker 1

And to me, the other reason you got to start him next to James Harden is you can't have Norman Powell and James Harden as you're starting backcourt. Defensively, it's just gonna get cooked from the outset. I don't care who's behind them. It just leads to all sorts of problems. You mentioned Terrence Man the contract extensions Zoo gets paid. All quiet on the Terrence Man front right now, unless

you've heard something behind the scenes. Do you think he goes into this season betting on himself that he can get more money after having a big year.

Speaker 2

He has every reason too, Like if there's one guy who has no reason to trust that his role is going to be the same from day one to eighty two, Game one, the game eighty two Sarence Man, Like we've seen it every single season of his career, So he can win the starting job, but how well will he play in that role? And plus I think the Clipper should feel that way too, Like I know the Clippers are gonna say, yeah, we want Terrence back, because what

else are they going to say? Like, of course you want Terrence on your team, playing well, playing for you, take a deal that fits you as an organization. Terrence changed representation last year. Okay, so Terrence is read by the same people that play pgs repp by. I just think that's a relevant thing. Like it's not everything, but I don't think it's nothing. Uh. Terrence Man was asked

before last season when he was extension knowledgeable. Hey, so what's the chances And Terrence shook his headings like nothing's happening there. That was last year. The last time Terrence sign an extension wasn't until we were coming home from the Ontario game back in twenty twenty one. That was October. So if the same timeframe matches up, and again that's extension was like, you're still under your original deal for that year. The year after then your extension kicks in.

It was a two year extension and that didn't kick in until twenty twenty three, a year ago. Okay, so like and again that was the previous representation for Terrence. But it's like, you know, Terrence took a deal way earlier than most people would extend for that was after his second year in the NBA. And again as a forty eighth pick, you're looking at that, it's like lock it in. Terrence has no reason to give the Clippers

any favors. Now, if I'm Terrence Man, unless you get an overpayer or something like that, I feel like, play this out. See what the team does, See what the trade deadline looks like, See what your role is, See how much more money you can make being that ye're not sharing the floor with for future haul famers. It took Terrence until last year to win a starting job and then he gets hurt and then he comes back

and James Harden's on the team. Like that was an adjustment and that was his most stable you know again October to April roll of his entire career to this point, Like Terrence is every reason to be like, let's see how this goes.

Speaker 1

Yeah, and needs to start fast from the outside. He had the ankle injury in training camp or the very end right before the season started that I think hurt him, but he turned the four.

Speaker 2

He like, look, we all saw how good Terrence was starting in January shooting the basketball, and Terrence is going to be the first one to tell you, hey, look I start seasons slow shooting it. He he can't do that this year, Like this team is every team again. We just got finished talking about the West. I clearly remember last year's West. At the onset, everyone knew how

competitive the West was going to be. There was the outside pressures of the ND season torn the TV contracts being up, the player participation policy and all of those things that it was like even from upstairs, you know, the message was we need the best players to play right and how that was going to affect competition in the league overall, people are gonna forget how last year started.

Last year was incredible from a competitionandpoint, and the damn Clippers were three and seven at them, they were three and seven, okay, and they had to put the pedal to the metal, like even they win a few games. Seelu tells me, minutes, we're not gonna send anybody, so what there's a five and seven coming up. Minutes are going to be dictated by winning games, and so yours urgency. At least every team in the league has some level of optimism going into these media days at the end

of the month. That optimism is going to go straight to hell by December when reality sets in, and the reality will be mean different things for different teams. For the Clippers, it means if Toronto Lo decides to start Terrence and Derek Jones together, then those dudes better improve the defense significantly and those guys have to make the very most of their offensive opportunities. It's a very easy job for Derek Jones year. It will be very difficult

for Terrence. Man, It's not impossible for Terrence, but he can't come into the season passing up shots, missing shots from the corner, not knowing how he can get increased volume with the players that he's playing with. That can't happen because then the Clippers will sit there at three and seven again and they won't have a magic pill, Like, what are you gonna do? Start Norm? Like they could do that, but that would I believe that decreases the ceiling of your team. Yes, yes, like we all know

the role that Norm is best at. Like I think they want us to start Norm. Two years ago, wh Kawhi was dealing with his recovery, his comeback season, and after like a week, Tilu was like, you know what, I don't think I can do that. And there were a lot of moments that t Lou had over the course of that season, you know, for example, not having

a competent backup center. You know, there are a lot of things we learned that the team didn't really look at going into the season as being a potential issue.

Speaker 1

It's funny when Terrence turned the corner in twenty twenty four, I remember there was a quote from Paul George that got into his head maybe a little bit in a good way, and this was good leadership. You could say he made a joke like twenty twenty four, we're shooting the shit out of the ball, and Terrence just kind of cleared the mechanism, got a blank slate and shot forty four percent in twenty twenty four and then forty five percent in the series against Dallas, granted on low volume.

So hopefully he's got that confidence coming into the start of this season, because I do think it's his offense that's going to keep him on the court to start things off, because I'm not worried about his defense, but he's got to do something the offense.

Speaker 2

That thing. I am worried about his defense, Like, really, I don't think Terrence had a good year defensively last year, and a lot of it is because because he was in a role that the team needed him to be in, but was really just not something that played to Terrence's strengths.

Like Terrence is better guarding up, and what that means is if you have Terrence guarding bigger bodies, physical guys, guys where Terrence can be able to put contact on guys and be physical, that's where Terrence is at his most effective. Get let Terrence guard Luka Doncic's not Kyrie irvings, right, And there's a lot more Kyrie irvings, And there's a lot more Kyrie irvings in the NBA than there are

Luka Doncic's. Now you have a guy in Dereck Jones Junior who he can chase those dudes around point of attack, Okay, and he can do it for twenty five minutes a game. That allows Terrence to guard your top wing if you will, your guy that isn't starting plays but is going to get the ball in the half court run some ISO's that kind of thing. Having Terrence play against those guys more often instead of being in the back court trying to be a spider is a lot more effective for him.

But he needs to he needs to show that he can be more of a playmaker. You know how many steals in blocks Terrence Man had in the Ploseason series in that six game series, Uh?

Speaker 1

Under ten?

Speaker 2

As many as you and I bro Oh, come on, Terrence played one hundred and eighty seven minutes in the playoffs, didn't have a single steal, didn't have a single block, And yes, he did a great Jolbum. He'll shot.

Speaker 1

He shot twenty from three that kept him in that series.

Speaker 2

Exactly. I'm not talking about Terrence's ability to defend in the playoffs. I'm talking about Terrence's overall Like what is he giving you off the ball as a defensive playmaker, as someone who's doing stuff, And so I think Terrence, you want the defense that Terrence gave you in the playoffs because you want to put him in those matchups more often. Now, even that has an area of improvement.

That's why I said the defense. This is what I'm worried about with Terrence, because even if he's in more advantageous situation defensively from a matchup standpoint and who he's guarding, you got to do more in that role. You got to be able to, you know, come up with some turnovers. This team has to force more turnovers, and I thought they did a good job of that last year. But you don't have Paul George, who's one of the best

guys in the league at getting steals. You don't have Russell Westbrook, who I thought was really good for him. You do have Chris Dunn, and the more Chris Dunn plays, the more likely you are to force turnovers. But then Derek Jones, you're not a guy who forces a lot of turnovers, and you're not going to really ask him to do that as much as a point of attack guy like it would be nice, but Derek is going to focus on preventing guys from getting comfortable shots. Terrence

is comfortable that role too. Someone else has to force some turnovers, though, and if it's not going to be Derek, it's got to be Terrence. And what you can't have is you can't have Terrence going damn near two hundred minutes in between steals and blocks.

Speaker 1

Well, especially as you mentioned earlier, and I agree, if you're not a great rebounding team and you're getting the to miss, you have to close out possessions.

Speaker 2

Here and got to close out possessions.

Speaker 1

And when that possession battle, which is the InVogue thing to say now in the NBA, it's not just the NFL anymore so a Visa Zoobos does get paid. What did you think of the deal? Fair market value? Is Big Zoo gonna give him that big return on investment?

Speaker 2

I think so? I think is a great deal for him. We already know he's severely outplayed his contract as far as going into this season, like to think that there is more than thirty centers in the league that are going to make more next year than Zoo. It's like, well, Zuo's outplayed the contract extension that he signed already and he's going into I don't know if I want to call I mean, he's in his prime, Like he's got several years left in his twenties, and that's going to

be huge. He's playing with James Harden, who he did not have a training camp with last year, and you saw once James got up to speed how much better Zoo was. Right, Zuo is going to have a really good season next year. We'll see if James is still on the team the year after. But like we saw, like Zuo has rarely gotten to play with the kind of point guard that enhances what Zu does, and now he's got James Harden. It's it's a that's a big deal.

So again, we know what Zuo's good at. Maybe you know, some other people don't know what Zuo's good at, And I gotta maybe write more explicit stuff about that. Zu can help me. Zu can help me with that, Like ZU can't give me one big game and then the next game miss all of its loaders. Okay, so there's that.

Speaker 1

How about giving him some consistent minutes. How about he doesn't play twenty six minutes les he did the year I.

Speaker 2

Don't think I think that's That's the thing though with Zuo, Like we saw Zoo without a competent backup play a ton of minutes and Zoo get worn out by that. I think that, yeah, like that's I think Zoo. I mean, Zoo will be the one to tell you. Getting Mason Plumley was huge because it didn't overextend him. Like, I don't think Zoo is a thirty thirty five minute player at all. I think Zoo is a twenty five to

thirty minute player. And because what you're asking Zoo to do requires Zoo to actually be able to do it for four quarters. If Zoo's gonna get more touches, well he's still going to have to be able to do what he does on the other end of the floor at a high level. And I think he can do it. But production isn't just how many minutes you're playing, how many touches you're getting. It's like who you're playing against and can you be effective against a number of different teams,

like the teams that are going like the OKAC Thunder. Now, the OKC Thunder did Zoo a favor by signing Isaiah Hart and sign I will tell you that. But last year you couldn't. You couldn't really, like it was hard for Zoo to play against Okay, see with hit Holmgren just running circles around him, Like, that's a tough matchup for Zoo. There's a lot of matchups that are a little tough for Zoo than others. So you know, there there are teams where Zoo's like, yeah, he can play

over thirty in this game, like Toronto Lou. I think he played Zoo forty minutes in one game last year, and t Lou made a scene like Zoo had had to do a bit, you know what I'm saying. It's like, Yo, we had as to play a lot of minutes. We ain't. We ain't really going to do that, But I'm glad he was able to handle it. It was you guys need.

Speaker 1

To get the conditioning up a little bit. I I agree with that. I just don't see how they can. I don't see six seed if zu bots isn't averaging thirty minutes per game, Like, I don't.

Speaker 2

I don't think expect I don't think you can. I don't think you you can expect him to do that. He's a guy who wears down if he plays a ton of minutes like that.

Speaker 1

So at twenty seven, like, what, what's wearing him down so much?

Speaker 2

Workload? Man, center, dude, bigger.

Speaker 1

Body, save he hardly touches the ball at the time.

Speaker 2

He's going to touch the ball more man, and when he's on the floor, he's going to be a guy who touches the ball. I think more this season upcoming than any other year in his career. And again, I think.

Speaker 1

The most important player on the team because that's where I got him.

Speaker 2

Uh yeah, I think that's a reasonable thing to say. Really you really want to say that guy should be Terrence. But Terrence is a wildcard, whereas Zoo's less of a wildcard. Zoo's more of a constant. Zu is like and I think the other thing they watched for that's caat Calf. I really hope doesn't prop up next year because that's something that's been an issue three years in a row. It might not show up in the games played because

Zoo's really good at missing the right games. But it has been a thing where three years in a row, I've seen this dude either missignificant time, be on a cart heading out of the arena during All Star break. You know, I want Zoo. Zuo's gonna gonna get a chance to eat and to show that those numbers aren't just quote unquote efficiency numbers. I like volume. Zuo's going to get the ball more. Zuo's going to be James Harden's target on pick and rolls. The Clippers were not

a heavy pick and roll team last year. I think they're going to run more picking rolls this year. They just need more guys to diversify their offense, and Zoo's going to be the guy. Zoo has to show that I'd like in again, it's year nine for him. I'd like to see an expanded skill set for Zoo. As

great as he is in the post. Like, I'd like to see Zoo like show the coaching staff that he can comfortably hit a shot outside the paint, that he can confidently hit the double teams, that if he puts the ball on the floor he can draw more fouls. He's so great in the post without being a guy who draws siles out a high rate. Well, let's draw

some fouls this year, Zoo like. So there's things where Zuo is going to get the greatest opportunity to showcase his offensive game than in any of his previous eight MB eight seasons, and a lot of it's going to be on Zoo to show that all that stuff that you have let us kind of you've hinted at, this is the time to show it.

Speaker 1

So if I say over under twenty nine minutes, are you going under?

Speaker 2

Yeah, I'm going under. Ooh, I sound like I sound like you just set me up to sound like Rick James on Charlie Murphy's True Hollywood Stories. But yeah, I'm going I'm going under if.

Speaker 1

I'm going over, because I just think it's necessary. He played thirty two minutes per game against Dallas in that series. He was detonating. He was their second best player behind James Harden.

Speaker 2

For me, you're talking about a playoff series though your playoff seron. I understand, but every game, like the end of your season, you got four months the rest if you don't win it.

Speaker 1

I just said he was productive. Those were taxing minutes and he did it, Like I don't. I just don't see a path for them to stay afloat if it beats a Zoo bots isn't dramatically more utilized this season.

Speaker 2

Yeah, I mean, well the other party would two. And I know, like we refer to Zoo and his rim protection how great it was, Like I think, I don't think Zoo was great and defensively in the playoffs last year. I feel like the Clippers protecting the paint, protecting the

rim in the playoffs was It was a disappointment. I don't put that all on Zoo, But look at what Zu did in the regular season, where I can reasonably say he was the best rim protector in the NBA among starting centers, and then look at what them rim protection numbers and what the output was in the playoffs. It wasn't nearly as good. So that's what I mean. I think you want Zu to do more in the

minutes that he's on the floor. But Mobamba better be ready to play, Kobe Brown better be ready to play whatever small lineups that Toronto Lou figures that he's going to come up with. Because it's twenty twenty four in the NBA. You will have lineups out there that doesn't have a traditional center. They're gonna have to be effective. So that's where I'm looking at. Averaging thirty minutes, Adam means for every game you're playing twenty five, you're playing

thirty five. That's what that means. For every game where Zoo's like, oh man, they only got twenty minutes, foul, trouble, ineffective, nicked up, whatever, it means that you're doubling that with a forty minute game.

Speaker 1

Well, well, look he played. He averaged twenty eight two years ago. I think you can average thirty now at the age of twenty seven. Like, if he's without Paul George, I think it's possible. I think it's very possible, and I agree possible.

Speaker 2

I just don't think it's likely.

Speaker 1

Okay, I they didn't lose that series to me, though defensively they lost it on the offensive end.

Speaker 2

No, they lost it. They lost it because the bottom line is this. Look at all the points that were scored by Luca, Kyrie, Paul and James, and then look at the points that are scored by every other Maverick, every other clip. I'm not looking at this right now, this is a feel thing. Y'all watching this, and y'all want to break out, y'all calculators, y'all can get back to me and Adam, but I'm pretty sure you're gonna look and be like this. That That's how even the

series was. It came down to one one team stars shot the ball and the other teams didn't. Like that's really that decided the series. Like Luca kept coming as inefficient as he was, Kyrie was like, man, I'm glad I got that first quarter out the way. It's time to get buckets, you know, because Kyrie, you need to do a damn thing in the first quarter in the series.

Speaker 1

And Paul George said, I'm good with taking fifteen point.

Speaker 2

Paul just Paul had games where he just didn't have you know, he cook himself out mentally in that series, Like he had foul trouble. We knew he was playing through it as far as trying to navigate the game on both ends of the floor. He put it together in that in game four, he was like, I get the circumstances. I'm coming out no matter what. And even in that game, the third quarter Paul ran out of

buckets and next thing. You know, the Clippers are trailing after being up by more than thirty, but what was it?

Speaker 1

Crazy three?

Speaker 2

One?

Speaker 1

Crazy three?

Speaker 2

And that was the difference in that game, and that hard voters like when those guys were able to figure out what was happening and they started the series like that. They played Game four like ef it were just going. They were good. I feel like they relaxed going in the game five and they wind up losing by thirty and that was your season. So yeah, what do you want to talk about, dam.

Speaker 1

Jay am I one three, two four? Ask this? I'm not asking this. He said, how did you feel about pg's comments after he left? And what do you think you will do in Philly law recent comments from his father, the B team comment contract comments being offered sixty million when we know it actually means one hundred and ten million, but he presented is they were only giving him sixty million. All that.

Speaker 2

I mean, I wrote about it, you know, like I knew how everything was going down that last week in the June, and I knew how Paul was. I knew how Paul's feeling, how Paul's family is feeling, how the Clippers were feeling. Right, we knew. We just knew what the feeling was, and so everything that has come out of it, Like, I'm not reacting as much to it because it's not a surprise to me. Like I knew

what the feelings were going. We were in Hawaii and people were asking about Paul in his contract, and Paul was looking around, like what do you want me to say? You know, like we just I just feel like I spent the whole damn year with those dudes in getting a feel for stuff. So I don't really have as much of a visceral reaction to the fallout as I feel like a lot of people who might have gotten comfortable with the idea that, you know, Paul was at least going to take the high road on a lot

of stuff. Like I think Paul's mentally preparing himself for a rude awakening when he gets back here on November sixth or whatever the date is. But I think that's where Paul's at his most comfortable. I think that's how he treated Indiana. You know, Oklahoma City did him the biggest favor of all. They paid him and then they said him where he wanted to go. So and Okay, see obviously has no hard feelings because they got Shay and they got draft picks for you know, forever.

Speaker 1

So like this part out. I know it's live, but I'm cutting this out.

Speaker 2

Yeah, like so so like that, Paul. I think Paul's comfortable being being, you know, the bad guy. I think the more you talk about it, the more comfortable you'll be when you got to actually face the music. And that's great because he's going to my city. He's going to Philadelphia, and you know, Philadelphia is the type of city they don't if you get paid a bunch of money and ain't, they ain't gonna celebrate you for long. They want you to produce immediately. He's going He ain't

going to Indiana. Okay, see the Clipper's version of Los Angeles. Like no shape, it's just reality. Like you're going to a place in Philadelphia where if you have an zero for ten game, if you have a quiet game and a big spot, you will be booed. And they don't need to wait to the playoffs to do it. You will be booed on Halloween. If you underperform with a

big price tag, you can't do that in Philly. Like Philadelphia is passionate but they're passionate in a way of you underperform, and we will let you know right away. The worst thing you can get from Philadelphia is apathy and not caring and not showing up. But yes, the next level above that is play poorly in front of those people and see what happens. And I think Paul

understands that. So I think that Paul's going to be great in Philly because he's got guys that are going to put Paul in the positions that are most comfortable for him on both ends of the floor, especially offensively. Defensively, I've got concerns, but I don't think Nick Nurse teams rebound anyway. So I think that's going to be great for what the Philadelphia seventy six ers do offensively. The

meal ticket is Joel. Joel gonna walk his butt to the elbow and he gonna do what Joelle does, especially in the regular season. Tyresse is going to play fast. He's going to play like Russell Westbrook plays, and that's going to be great for Paul because Paul doesn't have to worry about the extra ball handling duties. But Tyree is going to get the ball to Paul. And when

Paul has it going, he's gonna cook. And when Paul doesn't have it going, you got Tyresse, you got Joel, you got some other guys who can handle the ball, who can shoot the ball. I think it's a great situation for Paul from a basketball standpoint. The other stuff, I think Paul's gonna have to adjust to and get used to, not just being back in the East, but being in cold Weather City, being in big city, being in big market, that Philadelphia media. I'm telling you, I

grew up there. It ain't sweet like it's going to be different. But as far as his and everything, like again, I knew where this was headed or possibly headed, and I knew the playoffs were going to be the big variable. If Kawhi was healthy and playing and doing what Kawhi basically was able to do all season. Maybe we're having different conversations. Maybe the Clippers get out of that first round series and look at the West. The West was not as good, not as airtight as you thought it was.

Speaker 1

They had the past, they had the pass fifth.

Speaker 2

Seed made it to the finals, Adam Yea and not just any fifty, but the fifty that was then a seed in the middle of March. You know what I'm saying. But the West as competitive as was, it's also competitive in a way where your very best teams are vulnerable, and they will be vulnerable from the beginning of the season to the middle of the season, to the end

of the season. Wherehere he got the playoff standings set in stone, and then when the playoffs actually start, they will be vulnerable the whole way through.

Speaker 1

I think it was another missed opportunity. I think they get out of that series with Dallas.

Speaker 2

And an arrow full of them, and then.

Speaker 1

They had nobody went back to back in the five years in the two to three era in the NBA, they had a great opportunity if Kawhi could ever stay healthy.

Speaker 2

I do want to act bet there were five different Western Conference champions.

Speaker 1

Yeah, that's what I'm saying, Like nobody, nobody was that dominant. There was no super team with the Golden State Warriors anymore. It was right for the picking and the Slippers couldn't take advantage of it.

Speaker 2

I don't think anyone even went back to back appearances in the conference finals. Like you get teams that make the conference finals one year and missed the playoffs the net. That's what happened to the Clippers. Yeah, you know what I'm saying.

Speaker 1

Like, Denver didn't make it this year.

Speaker 2

Denver didn't make it back to the conference finals.

Speaker 1

The State Warriors didn't make it back.

Speaker 2

The Lakers are like the conference finals. Let's running back. The only thing they ran back was a seventh seed. Bro Yeah, and the Chanzy was an accomplishment for that team last year.

Speaker 1

Phoenix didn't make it back in twenty two because Dallas blow them out in the second round in games. So yeah, nobody made it back. Uh.

Speaker 2

That's the West. The West to me isn't Oh, look at how good these teams are. The West is yo. It don't take much for your season to go to shit. Like, that's the West. It's what's your weakness and how how likely is that weakness going to be exploited? Nothing. Every team in the West has a major concern right up to the OKAC thunder.

Speaker 1

Yeah, I agree with you. Uh. I want to ask you this specifically about Paul George. I said this the other day. I believe he was always gonna take the two hundred million and always knew it was going to be out there. He would have taken it from the Clippers had they offered it, they weren't going to. Maybe if they get out of the first round, something's different. If he bawled out and they got he got him out of the first round, maybe they have to give

it to him. But do you believe the stuff he said in this podcast regarding you know you felt disrespected because Kawhi was offered this. He said, just give me what Kawhi got. But then two seconds later he said, then they offered me the one fifty. And I was like, all right, we're in the ballpark. It's like, wait, you just said give you what Kawhi got. They offered it, you didn't take it. You wanted more money or you

wanted to know trade clause. Do you think it was always about the money and he was always gonna end up in Philly because they telegraphed this. We saw they didn't make a move of the trade deadline. We saw they were going to keep that max slot open. To me, the writing was on the wall.

Speaker 2

I could have swore when the Sixers played in LA against the Clippers that there were we won Paul Chance when the because that game was embarrassing for the Clippers. I'm pretty sure the arena was filled with with with that stuff. I could have been wrong, but I'm pretty sure that's what I heard. Like even Sixers fans, they know what it was. But I feel like all the negotiation game stuff to fall out from it, to talk from it. I mean, you know, look at the contract

James Harden signed. James Harden signed the contract that probably was offered to Paul at some point. I don't think that's ironic. Now, look, Paul has to me, Paul has the right to feel disrespected, because the reality is, Paul has never saved money on a contract. Any contract that he's ever signed has been the one that he was slotted for or the one that like he's never like. His previous contract was an extension that was signed after

the bubble. What happened in the bubble, Paul played really you know, even Paul knows, like Paul played the kind of basketball that really concerns you in the bubble. And then he signed the deal that he extended for and Kawhi matched that deal this season after after Kawhi towards ACL. So like Paul has always been driven to make the most that he can when he can, and I think Paul did that. I think the difference is there might have been a chance to re sign with the Clippers

if it just made sense. And because Kawhi got hurt, because the team flamed out, because it's James, because Russ went from the guy who was running training camp to the guy who basically was, you know, kind of phased out over as the year went on, and obviously Paul had a big voice in supporting Russ, and that's what

wound up happening with Russ. I just feel like all the things that could have went into, you know, the off season with things being compatible with the Clippers and Paul didn't work out.

Speaker 1

So he said disrespected, though I feel like he.

Speaker 2

Does, but that was no. I don't feel like he was disrespected. But I am an empathetic person, and I understand how a player is going to look at his value in his situation versus everybody else, and how they're going to look at it if you're everybody else, take it if you're a the Clippers. I don't think it's a mistake that the Clippers pointed out exactly when Paul was an All Star and when he wasn't exactly when Paul was good in the playoffs and what he comes

to the playoffs versus the four years. I don't think that that is, you know, I think the Clippers are looking at like, listen, Paul was great, but y'all have to understand this is a business and Paul, you know, Paul understands this a business too. That's why Paul is playing for the contract that he's playing for at a place that if you also listen to what Paul has been saying over the past few months, it's clear that Paul wanted to stay as close to la as possible.

He wanted to have the comfort of being here with the price that he knew he could command. He wasn't going to get that from the Clippers. He really orally wanted that from the Clippers. Well, it's not like you're getting that from the Lakers. Not that you'd want to play there. He would have wanted to play in Golden State. I think he was very clear about, you know, please

send me to Golden State. But to go to Golden State requires the Golden State Warriors getting to dump the remains of a team that didn't even survived the playing tournament on to the Clippers, Like that doesn't improve the Clippers in the short term, and it really don't improve them in the long term because of some of those salaries.

So Paul, a guy who would have preferred to stay as close to the West Coast as possible, winds up taking the money out of place that geographically, you know, that's not where I don't think he would have wanted to go there. But it is a great money situation. It's a great basketball situation. Yeah, So the other stuff, you'll be like, all right, we'll figure it out.

Speaker 1

He kind of gets your cake and get it eat it too. It's not like he's going to a bad team. You can make the argument he's going to a better team in some ways, or at least a little bit healthier of her team.

Speaker 2

In a lot of ways. He's going to the same team he's going.

Speaker 1

He's got a young guy in Maxie.

Speaker 2

That's like, here's the thing with Tyresse, though Tyresse and I love Tyrese as a as a player, as a I especially love him as a person like that dude is like that dude's a great a great dude, a great vibes dude. He's a legitimately good person, a hard worker. He's earned the contract that he got, you know, but he plays a position that is a dime a dozen in the NBA.

Speaker 1

Okay, yeah, but forty in a playoff game like he just did.

Speaker 2

Okay, But if you put the ball in a lot of dudes' hands in this league, they're going to be able to do something like that. That's what I'm saying. What he does is we used to talk about centers as the most replaceable players in the league, and you know what, Zoo's contract kind of speaks to that. There isn't a whole lot of difference between the guy who is number ten versus a guy who's number twenty and start as centers, You're asking a lot of centers to

do a lot of the same shit. Screen, protect the rim, rebound, be mean, that's it. You ain't asking a whole lot. There's not a lot of variants in that position. We're getting to that point with the point guard position, where if you're a small guard, we're just asking dudes to run, pick and rolls, hit some pull up, hit your shots. Don't be a complete liability. On the other end of the floor, Tyres does that a little bit more consistently and better than a lot of other guards. That's why

he's doing the contract that he's on. That's why he is an All Star. But let me be real about it, there's a whole lot of dudes like that. You know why Jamal Murray's never been an All Star. It ain't just because he plays with nicolea. Jokicch It's because Jamal Murray does a lot of stuff that a lot of the dudes who wind up being All Stars wind up

doing okay. And so for every time you get Jamal Murray running dudes crazy in the playoffs, you get what you saw from Jamal Murray in this past postseason where he just kind of flamed out against the Timberwlves at the end, Like there's so much there's so many of these small guards that do a lot of the same things, and so what do the Clippers have. The Clippers are

actually an anti small guard team. They realize that. They're like, if we're gonna have a guard that needs the ball in your hands all the time, you want that guard to be, you know, either great size or great skill. And with James Harden, you got a big guard, so that actually helps you defensively, because hiding James Harden is different than hiding tre Young. Okay, that's just what it is.

Speaker 1

Is post good. Well again he guards up on the post.

Speaker 2

He's all right, you know, I'll give justin.

Speaker 1

The stript club, the stript club exactly.

Speaker 2

You know what I'm talking about. Like, not every small guard's doing that. Are you hiding James Harden? Are you? Does Cee Lou go out of his way to say in every other press conference, oh, James isn't. We're not asking him to be a stopper, like we heard that a dozen times probably last season. But what does James

give you as a high guy defensively? He gives you rebounds, He gives you an opportunity to force turnovers, and he gives you an opportunity where guys try and post them up and they turn and their post game is inadequate, the balls on the ground. Like, there aren't a lot of small guards who do that on a consistent basis. So even as a liability defensively, James is a guy that gives you a little bit more than some of

these other weak ass guards out here. So there are a lot of guards who do great ship, but at the end of the day. There's a reason the Philadelphia seventy six ers were like, let's get Paul georgan pay him two hundred Let's get Paul George and pay him max money in his age thirty seven season. You know, because Tyree Maxy and Joel Embiid ain't enough. You need Paul George to be able to give you a little bit more. You need him to give you a year

or two more of all star production. Because having a small guard and even one of the most dominant bigs in the league that ain't that ain't enough. You You need something more to, you know, rise above what the other teams in the East can present to you.

Speaker 1

Yeah, and they see though I don't know, man, that was hope he doesn't hear.

Speaker 2

That because we talk about guards. It's a guard dominated league. But you know why as a guard dominated league, because the rules put it in position to let guards run wild in the league. Like that's why the guards have numbers now in twenty twenty three, twenty twenty four that you weren't seeing at the turn of the twenty first century. Like we literally change the rules in the NBA to let guards do ship that they weren't doing in the nineties. That's that's real.

Speaker 1

I think some of that is two all time drafts and the level of skill is incredible. Some of it's the rules. They're taking advantage of it in the playoffs though I see hand checking all the time.

Speaker 2

Still, how many guards are are leading their teams further than you expect them to. Even Steph Curry needs a lot of help, of course, but he needs how many bigs?

Speaker 1

How many bigs. There's a couple of very unique bigs in this league still that can do it all.

Speaker 2

But there's not a ton That's why you don't see any of these gms. You don't hear Lawrence Frank ever saying you can never have enough bigs, you can never have it's wings, it's a wing.

Speaker 1

I'm with it. My point was Max is a buck as opposed to playing next to Kawhi and James Harden who just turned thirty five, Like that is an advantage that they do have.

Speaker 2

And I think Paul saw that. You know, Paul's gonna look at Joel. Paul's gonna look at Joel like a lot of like the Stephen A Smith troll faction is going to look at Kawhi, Like, you know, if you're gonna blame Kawhi for not being there at the end, well, what's Joel's biggest issue? And this is coming from someone who actually likes Joel, like I know people like to you know, people don't like Joel. I like Joelle, like,

I'm always gonna like Joe too. But Joel indeed is one of the least reliable players in the postseason, you know, even when he's on the floor. So if you're gonna put that on Kawhi because Kawhi can't get through the playoff series, well, getting Joel to play through a playoff series, even win multiple playoff series, we haven't seen that yet. So that's Paul's got to look at it like this, Joel is your new Kawhi. Okay, he's big, maybe he's more durable, but he's also a guy who still has

a lot to prove even as an MVP. Tyressee is your new Russell Westbrook. Tyrese is younger and able to play the kind of style of basketball that you wanted to play. James does not fit either one of those. And James, obviously, you know, people were thinking last year that James and Paul were going to commiserate over Darryl Moury. Well, now Joel and Paul are going to commiserate over the

James Harden experience. But you know what, I bet you James is going to feel empowered by that, and I bet you, going into this next year, Paul doesn't have to worry about having to fit in with James, but he is. That's his new situation. It's like, I know Paul loved playing with Kawhi, loved playing with Russ. I don't know if he'd say the same about playing with James, not on a personal level, just on a play style level,

Like the ball was out of his hands. The last time Paul George complained about the ball being out of his hands, it was Doc Rivers team, and Doc Rivers obviously wound up up getting replaced by t Lou. It's the same situation. That's who he's looking at playing with.

Speaker 1

And then he got the ball back in his hands. They didn't like being picked up ninety four feet. I I wish Russ could have shot like Tyrese MAXI for the Clippers, will tell you that much right now, All right, a few more here? Is it possible this is from Betsy c. The Clippers just didn't want to help Golden State. If they're gonna lose PG anyways, it makes more sense to lose them to Philly instead of a conference opponent.

Law they weren't given Kaminga. I mean, if they gave the right package, I think they would have sent Paul Georgia Golden State.

Speaker 2

You don't you don't know. Look, Golden State would love to trade Jonathan Kaminga like and I think, yes, why.

Speaker 1

If they would love he just the second half at least Steve Kerr gave in the second half of the season, so I think they're starting to.

Speaker 2

Believe in him. I think. I think the Warriors were a playing team the entire year and didn't survive to play in tournament. That's what I saw. The Warriors are very strange. They put together basketball team because of the mistakes that they have made even while winning a championship. Mind you, So every report.

Speaker 1

Is they won't give out Kaminga in a trade. Same thing for marketing.

Speaker 2

Look man, Jonathan Kaminga is contract extension eligible before the start of the season because he was drafted in the first round UH in twenty twenty one. Right the Warriors have the decision to make on him. Do you pay him now, do you trade him at some point, or do you put him the isaacacro zone and be like, you're restricted, will pay you then immediately, or you're restricted and we're just going to play this thing out. Johnathan k Minga is a tough player because, like he's a

power forward. Okay, he's not a comfortable shooter. He's not a bad shooter, but he's not a comfortable shooter. He's a little bit too much like Andrew Wiggins. But he also shares the same team as Draymond Green. If the Warriors want to defend at a high level, they put Draymond at power for it and start someone like Trace Jackson Davis. You know why the Worriors can't do that, it's because their offense would be terrible because there's not

enough guys who can shoot, and that includes Jonathan Kaminga. Again, I'm not saying Cominga can't shoot. I'm saying Jonathan Kaminga is is a bucket getter more than he is a guy who is comfortable standing in the corner waiting for his shots to come. Yeah, okay, so you have a dilemma there, how do you get the most out of Jonathan Kaminga individually as a player, which they had to lean into more because you know, Draymond suspended, Clay's having

his issues. Like it's like, okay, you need someone to help help out and score points, but how do you do that in the context of what kind of team you have. I think the Warriors would love a team to take that issue off their hands, and they haven't found the team to do that yet.

Speaker 1

With I don't know if they. We're gonna see.

Speaker 2

Plenty of the Warriors. By the way, in October, we're gonna be with them in camp. We're gonna see the first preseason game against them the first weekend of the season. It's gonna be a nasty back to back. I don't know how that's how that happened, but it's gonna be Denver on a Saturday afternoon and then Golden State on a Sunday evening. Like first weekend of the season. We're

gonna see plenty of the Warriors. We're gonna see plenty of the dynamic between those teams and what their adjustments are. We're gonna see teams look at Paul George leaving the Clippers as like, we don't want to talk about the Clippers anymore, and Klay Thompson leave the Warriors and you know, make the Warriors great again, talk like we we know

how the sausages made. We know that one team made the playoffs and has like nine national TV games the entire season, whereas the Warriors damn near lead the entire NBA in national TV games. And again they didn't even earn a seven game series last year. So like, anything you hear about Jonathan Kuminga's value coming from coming from that team needs to be Actually, you need to see

it before you believe it. That's all I'm saying now, No, the Clippers should not have been excited about getting Jonathan Kuminga. We've seen Jonathan Kaminga play basketball. He's a talented player individually. If you're trying to get the best out of your team circumstances, how the heck do you fit that player into what you're trying to build. That's the concern with with with with cominga.

Speaker 1

Sure, he's twenty one. It's twenty one, Like it's it's a lot of talent and unrealized potential so far, but I think that is enough for teams to come calling. At least uh.

Speaker 2

Team didn't happen. Do you pay him? Do you pay him now? Do you pay him later? What's his value? Yeah, same thing with Brandon Ingram in New Orleans, Like that's restricted.

Speaker 1

I'd let him play it out and if I have to match, I have to match. That's what I would do.

Speaker 2

Yeah, that's a you know, for for some teams, if they feel good about that, then they'll they'll they'll do it. And maybe they might feel good about that in the middle of the season in February, if you look at the Warriors and the standings and the Warriors are like, we gotta do something, maybe that maybe that's what happens. You know, look at Brandon Ingram, different situation, but a similar kind of player. It's like Brandon Ingram as a

talent in a vacuum. It's like, oh my god, it's a it's a wing who can put the ball in the basket. He can run pick and rolls like, he can make plays. Of course you'd want that guy on the team. Okay, cool, what's his value from one year to your team? And what are you paying that dude? And that you get carried.

Speaker 1

Please? Can he take more threes? Please?

Speaker 2

And again, unlike and unlike Jonathan Kaminga who you mentioned, is twenty one and has years of upside to figure out the holes of his game. BI is who he is and who he probably is going to be, and like he's you know, he's coming in a place where we saw BI team USA pre that that was incredibly disappointed by anybody with a reasonable basketball opinion his experience there. You saw BI in the playoffs. You didn't have zion.

You are going up against the one seed. You mentioned yourself after you eliminated the Kings, that that Oklahoma City thunder team ended your season in the playing turn of the year before next thing, you know, Willie Green is benching b I to spark his team like that, and so it's like, what are you doing with that player in the short term and the long term? I think with every player in the NBA, there's a reasonable level of talent where you don't want to disrespect these guys.

They're all talented, they're all good, they all provide some level of value. But you're building a team. It's a team game. It's not hey, let's have that guy on our team, or let's get the most out of this guy from an individual level, despite my guy's playing fantasy basketball and preparing for their drafts. It's what does your team look like in this short term and what are

you doing from a team building standpoint. That's why the Clippers are complicated because they're like, we're so used to teams saying trade this guy, you're gonna get value for him, because that's what makes sense in the short term, because none of these people give a damn about what happens in the long term. With these teams. We love to talk about the light years of the Golden State Warriors and not thinking about, oh shoot, Kevin Durant, Klay Thompson

might not be back next year. We're going to be the worst team in the NBA for a year. No one talks about that, So I got to bring that up.

Speaker 1

Adam, Hey, it's fair. Lakeb's a big listener here on Clippers talk too, so he's gonna hear this. Miles Johnson has a good question, how aggressive, if at all, do you think the Clippers will be if they exceed expectations? Law This is interesting if they did get off to a hot start, if they are in the hunt, you know, as a top five seed in the Western Conference around the trade deadline. Do they try to make a move, Do they try to get back into serious contention.

Speaker 2

Because we was the guy they go after.

Speaker 1

I obviously it could materialize differently, basically all other teams are doing. There could be teams that are sellers all of a sudden. But the Lavignon name's been out there, b I's been out there, as you mentioned, Jeremy Grant's been out there.

Speaker 2

Well, y'all know me. I think a lot of people who've asked me questions about guys, I'm more likely to not be nice about it. Betsy c can tell you all that. So like, I'm not at the I'm not really trying to have that conversation right now. I'm a I'm a defer to that conversation about individuals. But as far as the principle of what you're asking, we've seen

it every year. The Clippers were dead in the warter when Paul George swore the ligament in his elbow in Christmas and had that daunting January of twenty twenty two ahead of them, while Covid was dripping through the whole league, minds you. Okay, I saw Winn and Gabriel and and this dude, James Ennis played for one team on a Tuesday, and by Saturday they were playing for the damn Clippers in Brooklyn.

Speaker 1

Okay, and that Brooklyn victory was legendary though.

Speaker 2

Exactly that's real ones. No, So like that team had no business staying in the in the middle of the Western Conference. The Clippers were all ready to be like, yeah, you know, look at our roster. We're not We're not. Like they had an eight game road trip that was going to take them from MLKD basically through the last day of January. They split that road trip, I believe, and so you look overall and they were like come home.

They had this emotional game winner against the Lakers. You know, I'm pretty sure that was the Reggie Jackson skipping game. You know, that dude was like Austin Reeves, I got a bucket and so like Aaron Bledze never played another NBA game in his career, okay, like never again. Justice Winsbrow, I thought Justin Winslow was like, oh, there's no way

they break this team up. Justin Winslow had them all on a boat in Miami, that dude wound up playing getting included in the trade, like Keon Johnson got included in that trade. Somebody's son got included in that trade that brought Norman Powell and Robert Covington to DLA Clippers.

And why did they make that trade? Because they looked at their team survived that January, even with Paul George contemplating season ending surgery, even with Kawhi Leonard doing nothing more than jumping over a damn box and getting it reported on national TV, and they were like, this team has a chance, this team has a chance. Let's go get Norm Powell just so Norm pal can break a bone in his foot a weekend later. So like, we know that that front office and I know the CBA

is different, We know that circumstances are different. But the whole point of not paying Paul George and not going to make a stupid trade with a division rival just to say you got something for Paul George was to maintain in some level of flexibility in case you do want to make a trade, in case you do exceed expectations, and then you can make some lose if they make sense. So, yes, the Clippers have a track record of doing stuff rather

than a track record of not doing stuff. That's how James Harden winds up on your damn team, even when you have a whole training camp that might as well have been called We're not training for James Harden. So you know, yes, answer your question.

Speaker 1

Expect that there's a great answer for Lobbry. A couple more burning questions here, a lot. We still got a little bit of time before the game.

Speaker 2

But you see Taylor Swift yet?

Speaker 1

No, I see she drawn up players right now. I hear she's offensive coordinator.

Speaker 2

They might might might be. Man, they gotta lose some games this year. Man, I'm tired of I'm tired of talking about Taylor's Taylor Swift and the Chiefs.

Speaker 1

The Swifties are tough. Frankie Boy nine wants to ask, do you guys think Kevin Porter Junior will be used a lot this season? He was a beast in Houston. Now he's being investigated by the NBA. Correct, he could still be suspended BEFO for the season, even stars.

Speaker 2

I would expect there to be league disciplined. I don't think the league will not discipline him that. I think there will be disciplined and because of that, I think the toughest suspension for any player, for any team, for any coaching staff to deal with is one where you're starting the season suspended. Patrick Beverley is in Israel and everyone's going to point out that, you know, Pat Bev himself that he could have signed a deal and everything.

I think a huge barrier to signing a deal for a player like that is when you know that he's facing a four game suspension on site. So and all Pat bever did was throw the damn bal to some ignorant stands in Indiana. Apologies if they actually weren't ignorant and they were saying nice things to Pat Bev, I just doubt that was the case. So I think that the tough thing, you know, and again Pat's a veteran, he's played is he played his beast basketball. I think,

you know, go and do your thing. But I think a factor in him going to the overseas wasn't just the money or the fact that he's been in the league. I think he got suspended. Man. So, like, like, what team is like going crazy over adding a player that they are going into the season trying to establish something and they can't even have that guy ready to play.

So you know, it's different than an injury. So with Kevin Porter, a guy who not only might be suspended to start the year, but didn't play in the NBA for a year. I don't care what level of basketball you played, not playing on that level is still going to put you in a position where there's an adjustment period, an acclimation period to play in high level basketball again. And so to begin the year, I don't think he'll

be in the rotation now. He's talented enough and the Clippers aren't talented enough to where that has a likelihood of changing over the course of the you know, over the course of November going into December. But when I've put my initial rotations together, Kevin's been excluded in that. I actually I got to see Kevin last week, so, you know, and we had a good conversation about about basketball, about life stuff.

Speaker 1

And think it's good spot right now.

Speaker 2

I think I think he is you know, I think him being on the Clippers is an indication that the team thinks that they have the right people to support him. I think basketball, again, we look at basketball from the lens of stats, highlights, numbers, money, fame, even and it's easy to just get roped into those things. But it's like it's a workplace. It's you're going to work, You're going to be with a team. You're going to be with these dudes every single day for like six months straight.

Like you you can't bring a player like Kevin Porter on the team, be like figure it the fuck out. Like everyone in the league knows Kevin Porter's, you know, dealt with some things, and Kevin Porter's putting himself in situations that are unacceptable. So you have to have that player be in a position where you can support him so that beyond the basketball, you can make sure that he doesn't do stuff that puts him in a bad place. And so I think the Clippers have the I think

Kevin knows that. I think Kevin knows the responsibility that is ahead of him. I think he knows that there's a lot more scrutiny that's going to come his way between now and the end of this calendar year on and off the floor, and so he's got to adjust toy off the floor stuff before you can get to be on the floor stuff. So I get everyone looking at Kevin Porter and what he's done in the league. He put fifty on Drew's head three years ago. He's been a starting point guard. He earned a big contract

from the Rockets. I get all that. I have respect for that. I also know that Kevin Porter Junior, him being on the basketball port goes beyond the basketball. Everyone knows that he's on a zero tolerance situation right now, Like that's a pressure that a reasonable citizen is like, Oh, that's easy, I'll just behave not everyone's like that, So we'll see where it goes. So I get people want

to talk about basketball player Kevin Porter. I feel like we're some steps away from basketball player Kevin Porter.

Speaker 1

Anything else you can divulge from that conversation with him.

Speaker 2

I mean, he's healthy, he's playing basketball. You know, this isn't a player who you know. It's like, it's different than Kai Jones, for instance. Right, Like, my whole thing if I got to see Kay this summer was can Kai actually be on the floor. You know, Kai didn't get a chance to play in summer League. Why because he messes damn ankle up. You know, prior to Summer League, Kai didn't play at all. Once the Clipper signed him.

There was no time to do that. Kai Jones went and signed a ten day contract with the Philadelphia seventy six Ers, And it's crazy that there is a seventy six Ers Clippers pipeline. He's in it. But like this, you know, he was under that deal. His deal expired right around the time the Sixers came to LA and I knew I was going to ask people about Kai. The reality was Kai signed a ten year deal, played a couple games in the g mess his hamstring up.

So Kai signed a deal with the Clippers and was and it was like he was never going to put a uniform on. They just wanted to get him in the system. That's another part of me talking about how basketball.

You see all these highlights, you see all these oh he was drafted in the first round, and it's like, you gotta get a dude to be able to simply be professional, you know, get relationships built so that you know what works and what doesn't work as part of a treatment plan, a preparation plan so that eventually he can get on the floor. So I had to spend, Like I was telling dudes this time last year, when Kyle was tripping, I was like yo, Ky ain't contributing

to nobody playing basketball this year. Kyle got some things he got to deal with and the Hornets knew that, and the Hornets were like, we can't even have you in training camp. And the Hornets let him go, and the NBA PA they stepped up. They put him in position to where he can get the help that he needed. And then he had to go to AMERICAUP play for Bahamas, and then the Sixers were like, okay, you're ready to play, let's put you in our get. Unfortunately, from there he

had the injury issues. He heard his hand string, he hurts his foot ankle before a summer league, so he missed a ton of time there. Fortunately now Kai is healthy. So like it's the same thing with Kevin Porter. It's like basketball is complicated and it's easy for us to get excited about, you know, guys playing basketball, putting up numbers,

the things that we like basketball for. But when you were around the team, you realize it's so much more that goes into getting guys minutes than the actual basketball.

Speaker 1

There's a couple other complicated situations. Maybe I don't know how you defined it, but are bones highling and PJ Tuck are gonna be on the team. Are they going to be in training camp with the Clippers?

Speaker 2

Yeah, I mean Bones, I saw Bones. I think it was last week, and I think here's and in respect of both of those guys, I love this conversation, by the way, So shout out to you and shout out to Taylor Swift for not rocking the state so far.

Speaker 1

You're killing it. I've been texting in the message part here, I'm like, great stuff from law while you're saying all.

Speaker 2

This, Yeah, like like, okay, look at bones situation. He comes into last year and I'm the backup point guard to Russell Westbrook. He killed last summer. I thought he did a great job working out. We know Bones is the kind of player where it's like Bones like the hoop, So we saw Bones hooping. Kawhi says in training camp. Yeah, we have two point guards this year, so I don't have to do that shit. You know, you got Russ's

your QB one and Bones is your QB two. And all of a sudden, in the middle of the year, not the middle of the year, but it's in season, you have this trade with James and at first tlu Is trying to make it work for everybody. That doesn't just mean starting all of Russ, James, PG, and Kawhi. It also means continue to play norm off the bench, continue to play Bones off the bench. Oh, Terrence is going to come back in the middle of the road

trip in New York. We're gonna introduce Terrence and he's going to play, And I'm just foxing on Bones right now. Eventually it gets to the point where it's like there's too many small guards in the rotation, so we need to consolidate that right away. And then it got to the point where it's like, we need to put Russell Westbrook in the second unit so that James we don't need to like bully James into being James Harden. That's what needed to happen. Like, it's not that Rusted anything

wrong to have to go to the second unit. It's that James was not performing like the player that the front off is traded for, and the only way to fix that was to stop pretending like James Harden was a shooting guard. So like like they wanted to have Russell continue to be the point guard because that's the team that they had training camp for. And that's and as a coaching staff, you don't go into a year saying, oh, the front office is going to do this, so we're

going to prepare for that. No, as a coaching staff, you're like, the front office could fire our ass, so we need to get done with what we have now.

Speaker 1

So side note, did the front office ever want Russell Westbrook or did they just have to try to make that work?

Speaker 2

They had to try to make it work, But I also think they wanted him on the team, Like last year, even when.

Speaker 1

Lawrence Frank was like talking about the type of point guard they were looking for the trade deadline and Rust didn't check any of those boxes.

Speaker 2

I always, George, I always told people the thing with the Clippers front office is that, yes, they have their idea of what kind of players they want. However, unlike a lot of teams, they actually keep a pretty good dialogue with the stakeholders on the team. They don't work in a silo. So, yes, the front office they have their preferences the players. We see it every draft. We see it with the players that they do bring in

all of that. But the difference between them and a lot of front offices is even if there's some conflict or some disagreements, they keep the door open. The door was open for Paul, for Kawhi, for Tilu to go to Lawrence and be like, I saw what you did. We need Russ and guess what. Russ exceeded everyone's expectations, Like Russell Westbrook came in and you saw it when they didn't have Kawhi and Paul to finish the Sun series and Russ took off and was doing things that

we hadn't seen Russ do in a while. You know why, going back to that Tyrese Snaxy point, tyre Snasey drops forty in a playoff game with the balls in his hands because tyres is really good. Well, it turns out if you give Russell Westbrook the ball and let him do Russell Westbrook stuff, you're probably going to get some volume out of it.

Speaker 1

He had a good series. He also had a game one where he went three of nineteen. He had the block on Booker. Overall, it was probably.

Speaker 2

They won, and they won that game they did. I do different players in that.

Speaker 1

I think it's ten years a little bit mixed. Though as a Clipper, I would I would not define it as a success Honestly.

Speaker 2

I think I think Russ would tell you the same thing. It's it's definitely mixed because and again I swear, you know, getting staying with the bones point, Rusk is going to the season like I'm going to be this team's leader. I'm going to have the ball in my hands and my job is to get the Stars the ball in the spots they need to be getting in. And I think the Tilu is going to, you know, be fine

with that happening. Now, just be fine. He built the whole training camp out of getting the most out of putting Russell's position to succeed, and that was going to happen. And what Blue team up is that, you know, they try to maintain as much as that as possible. When you lose six games in a row, it forces your hand.

It means that Russ has to go to the second unit, not because Russell was playing poorly, but because you need James to play like James Harden and the only way that was going to happen at the balls in James hands. It means that you're gonna have a second unit where okay, Russ is going to be in the second unit, but that also meant that Bones was not going to see the light of a day as long as the following

four guys were healthy. James Harden, Russell Westbrook, Norman Powell, Terrence Man and guess what, for the most part, all four of those guys, they pretty much didn't miss any time Bones. I don't think Bones handled that particular adversity well. And he checked out. I thought he checked out behind the scenes, and I thought that as.

Speaker 1

What it looked like behind the scenes with him, Well, how did he portray checking out?

Speaker 2

I just feel like, you know, you kind of saw in the garbage Time games. I think you saw when their games were in January that he didn't even get on the floor even with the margin in hand. Like, I just feel like it was being known behind the scenes that Bones would have preferred a different situation. He wanted to be traded. And guess what, he wasn't at home exactly. It was because those guys weren't traded. And those guys, again, behind the scenes, they weren't really they

were happy. They were disgruntled. I think that's an objective way to put it.

Speaker 1

So they're still on the team.

Speaker 2

Well, that's the thing. If you're dealing with that. In the season, that's going to create conflict and that's going to increase your chances of people not being on the

same page. That's where frustration comes in. But in the off season, when things calm down, when you can see your family, when you can do the things that you need to do, when you can hoop in whatever league that you hooping in, when you got some fresh air, when you took a vacation, you know, you can have some conversations, you can settle down, and you can have

a better sense of where your expectations are. And that released to PJ Tucker too, because PJ Tucker, while all this shit was going down with James Harden, PJ was thinking, Nick Nurse is going to start me, you know what I'm saying, And he did. PJ was in training camp, PJ was participating every day. PJ started the first week of the season for the Philadelphia Sydney Sixers, and that whole time, Pj's like, man, that shit going on with James,

that's crazy. Well, PJ got roped into the trade and PJ PJ didn't want to be traded to the LA And then.

Speaker 1

I don't think they wanted to have to trade for him either, right, it goes well, no.

Speaker 2

It was like, look, this is the deal that we had, Like for instance, they didn't want Nico Batum and the deal, but that's that's who they needed to trade to make the deal work. You know. Now, next thing you know, Nico Beatum is back here. You know.

Speaker 1

So PJ complained to you because I know he complained to multiple outlets that he wanted a bigger role. He didn't sign up for this. Did he talk to you about it?

Speaker 2

I don't want to look at it as him complaining to me, like I don't want to put a I don't I don't want.

Speaker 1

To be the expressed frustration.

Speaker 2

I mean, I think he explained yes is a short answer, But I think the frustration is not something that that's not like I look at him, be like, PJ, are you frustrated? Like he's a basketball player, want to play, Yeah, you're gonna be frustrated like and so he wanted to be traded. Well, guess what, no team's gonna trade for his contract, especially not for just his contract, right, and

so he had to get through the season. And I think that the reality is this, I wouldn't have been surprised if the Clippers were like, you are so untenable to be here that we need to stretch and wave you. But I don't think we're dealing with that. I think now we're dealing with a situation where all those people mad that the Clippers let Eric Gordon go because they knew that there's a possibility that, you know, they could have the flexibility with their roster to bring someone else in,

and the someone else being James Harden. Well, now you're gonna keep PJ. Tucker around more than likely because unless the team is like, we really need PJ. Tucker between now and the end of October, you're more than likely gonna be like, well, PJ, you're gonna compete, and more than likely other guys are probably gonna play above you. Like I expect Nigo between Kobe Brown to play more than PJ. Tucker reasonably speaking, But you know, I think

he's going to get his Jordan Miller, I guess. But Jordan's Jordan's biggest concern is can he do the stuff that he's done on respectably lower levels on a level where he's competing with you know, let's just the name is Amir Coffee, Like Amir is my second string small forward. Going into the year, there's five guys hunting for Amir Coffee's job, and a Mere Coffee. This greatest land leg that he has a stand on is the fact that he's done it in games that matter the most for

the Clippers, you know, regular season games. These other dudes might have higher ceilings and they might have longer roads to get to where a mir is. But Amir's a pretty good incumbent, a pretty good guy to say, you want his job, go and beat that guy out. And so I think Jordan might get a fair shot to beat that guy out. But that guy it's his job until someone takes it from him, right, Yeah, PJ. Tucker, it was his job until someone took it from him. Well,

Kobe Brown took that job. But guess who wound up getting an opportunity and staying with it. Amir Coffee. Mere Coffee was nowhere close to the rotation again last year, and even with PJ. Tucker falling out the rotation, Amir Coffee wasn't a consideration to play. But Amir got his opportunity when Paul missed his first game and a Mirror played so well that when it came down to someone's not going to be in a rotation between a mirror

and Kobe. Well, Kobe looked like a guy who needed to be in the G League and a guy who needed some more seasoning, a guy who wasn't quite ready yet to play at that level. And there's a Mirror who is literally a five year NBA veteran, and I was a guy a mir Yeah, And it's like it made it easy on the coaching staff. It's like, well, Amr is ready to play in Kobe's and PJ. We're trying to trade PJ and we're gonna keep PJ on

ice and Amir is playing. Next thing, you know, Amir is a rotation player for a team literally winning twenty six out of thirty one games, and then started playoff games for a while, started playoff games, and you know what had happened to Amir in the playoffs is as simple as Amir just wasn't getting He just didn't make the most of his opportunities, and there weren't a lot of opportunities to make the most of. It was a role that there's a reason Derek Jones Junior is on

this team. It's not like you lose PG and it's like, hey, mere Coffee's ready to start. It's like, oh, we're gonna lose p We need a guy. We're getting Dereck Jones Junior right away. Derek Jones Junon is gonna start. Like he's of all the guys the Clippers brought in that was new to the team, he's the one who got the biggest commitment from a financial and a year standpoint like that, Dude's going to be playing and starting and fulfilling a role where the Clippers are hoping Derek leads

a team in something very specific next year. So but yeah, if you talk about Bones, you're talking about PJ. The vibes were shitty as far as those guys go last year, but I think the off season allows for guys to be in a different place and to be in a different situation. I still think those guys would prefer to move on. But again, Bones is what Adam say it with me a small guard and those guys are a dime a dozen. There's no team falling over backwards to

acquire a player like that. Like the Minnesota Timber was a great example. Minnesota needed another guard. Tim Connolly drafted Bones when Tim was in his last year with Denver, there was an admiration there. Minnesota wound up trading for Monte Morrison instead. Okay, and not even Monte got a lot of burn with Minnesota. Monte had a very uneven season.

Speaker 1

Well move initially, but he didn't play much.

Speaker 2

Yeah, he didn't play much. Like Monte had a rough season, and a big reason is because he was hurt going into the years. As soon as he got healthy, he was eligible to be traded. He just never really got a swooting. Now he's in Phoenix. But what did Minnesota do. Minnesota looked at they're depleted assets, and we're like, hmm, we would like to have a guard. And Tim Connolly's like, you know, I like bone silent. Let's get blue blood

conference bone siland. And that's who Rob Dillingham is, same size, same GM, drafting that kind of player for his for his Northwest Division team to fulfill a similar kind of role for that Minnesota Timberwolves team.

Speaker 1

And so like, they're not MAXI, they're not MAXI, they're.

Speaker 2

Not MAXI, they're not bone siland. Like so if you want bones siland, you gotta really want bones silent, because again that dude is eligible for an extension. Obviously that's unlikely for obvious reasons. But then it's like if anything with bones, Hiland is going to get a guy who is eligible for restricted free agency next year, Like so you know, we'll see what happens. When it comes to PJ.

It's like, PJ has a tradable contract. Any team that's horrible next by February, excuse me, Like, let's get PJ Tucker. We can buy out the last year of his deal, and PJ will go and play for whoever wants to play with after that, and that is going to be a key factor in the Clippers team building. Maybe there's not a team in October that makes sense for PJ Tucker.

We see what the roster spots look like. But in February, after some of these teams been punched in the damn mouth, they're like, yeah, we'll take on whoever's contract to make some moves, get some assets out of it, and say that we have an open contract spot going into the next offseason. That is how you have to look at it.

I think PJ is gonna I haven't talked to PJ, I haven't seen PJ, but I think PJ is going to be in a better place going into training camp than perhaps he was, you know, going into last year's trade deadline. Bones. I'm pretty sure Bones would like to be on a team where he's not staring at the

third string point guard role. But I don't think there's any chairs left looking at the state of the small guard position in the NBA where it's like, what is a team that obviously, now again, injuries might change something.

There might be a team with a biblical you know, you know, basically you're Memphis Grizzlies of last year, a biblical tie of good guys who you just run out of guys like I feel like this happens to the Cleveland Cavaliers every year and then then all of a sudden you're like, oh my god, we have nobody who can dribble the basketball.

Speaker 1

Or what happens if Kevin Porter Junior gets suspended? Like does then Bones become more valuable to the Clippers somehow.

Speaker 2

I don't think I think that's already built in. I don't think that, Like, like, I don't even look at Kevin Porter Junior as a point guard right now, you know what I mean? Like, I look at you want to go depth chart, point guard James hard and Chris Don Bones Island shooting guard, Terrence Man, Norman Powell, Kevin Porter, Junior small Ford, Dare Jones, Junior, Amirka, and Cam Christy, who won't even be around the Clippers. He's going to be playing a ton of games in San Diego, which

is not even in San Diego. It's ocean side power forward Kawhi Leonard, Nicholas Patoom and pretty much want more likely Kobe Brown and center. It's if it's a Zoobots Mobamba and insert insert player here, Like I'm for now saying Kobe Brown's your third string center, but Kobe's going to play a lot And obviously I think Kai Jones has the lead on a two aay contract spot. He's

on an exhibit ten right now. There's two two way contracts on the Clippers, Jordan Miller, who is going into his second year on that contract, and Trenton Flowers, an undrafted rookie who is already on a two way. He's got a long way to go in every single regard, but it's a good sign for him that he's already on that contract. Kai is there's an open two way contract spot. I would consider kai Jones the front runner

for that spot. I think everyone wants to see kai Jones get that get that spot, get that contract if the Clippers can't complete any trades before the beginning of the regular season, and I think that is your expectation. I think you have fifteen contract spots already accounted for to two eight contract spots already accounted for, and Kai's the front run runner over guys like Elijah Harkless or you know, ray J. Dennis or anybody like that.

Speaker 1

Harkless just got what that invite earlier today. I love his defense. I know the chance of him as saw that.

Speaker 2

People saw that. But like I told people in late June, like I mean, and this ain't on Keith, but like people like see tell them, tell them, I mean again, it's not on Keith. You know, I'm sure Keith got Keith. Keith got great sources, Keith got people who talk to him. I'm just saying, if you are. You know, I said the same thing in late July that you know, the Clippers were bringing Elijah in on an E ten, like

we're talking six weeks ago. So if someone saw it because Keith got way more followers than me, then I understand that. But I'm just telling y'all like that was a that was a deal that was already done six weeks ago, so I'm glad you saw it today, But like that was a that was a contract that's not new today. Like we know the Elijah was going to be with the Clippers in camp like more than a month ago.

Speaker 1

I just needed some news today to make things interesting.

Speaker 2

You know.

Speaker 1

I gave it a retweet. But at the Law Murray and you is where I go for my source when it comes to Clippers news and information and great analysis as well, even dime droppers on the chat. Now, as we've been up for almost damn near two hours here with law Murray on the live stream, well I don't I don't want to take any more of your time. We gotta get ready for the game. Maybe you're getting some pre games snacks in. I don't know where it is. Football's coming in a half hour.

Speaker 2

Dude, I'm gonna do. I'm gonna be doing basketball work during the football game. Because the funny, the great thing about football and why it is our American pastime is that over a three and a half hour time there's only like ten to fifteen minutes of actual game being played, and therefore I'm just gonna be multitasking. Football is a great family sport because you ain't got to do a damn thing. You can do a whole lot of multitasking during a football game. Can't do that during basketball game.

Basketball game, you blink for five minutes a team down by ten.

Speaker 1

So what's the next piece you're working on right now that everybody can be looking forward to from the athletic.

Speaker 2

Oh man, I mean me and my ors were talking about that earlier today. But it'll more than likely involve some level of player ranking. So yeah, I'm I'm in a player evaluation mode heavy right now across the entire league. So I don't know how soon that'll turn around. But that's my next project. And you know, obviously whatever else Sty'll let me write.

Speaker 1

So it will be thorough, it will be comprehensive, It will be La Murray. That's the way he does things, includes all the contexts and then filters it down to come up with these great opinions that you heard today on this live. This has been another edition of Clippers Talk, the third live. We have done law once again. I want to thank you for doing this and staying on for so long. It was just great to hang out with you again and shoot the ass when it comes to be ball.

Speaker 2

Hey appreciate it, man. And you know, it's like we're coming to a different basketball team next year, like an expansion team almost. So looking forward to making my way around the into it Dome and figuring out when we'll talk about hoop again.

Speaker 1

We'll get real familiar. One of the opening night, you know, I have I already told somebody I don't know, but we're gonna have you on pregame one of the first, one of the first days they're into it. Do so for La Murray. I'm at a Moslin We're at one hour and fifty five minutes. He're on this Clippers talk Live. Talk to you next time, likely earlier next week, because I'm done. We're done for this week.

Speaker 2

It's oh

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