Broadcasting from the Hip Hop Weekly Studios. I'd like to welcome you to another episode of Civic Cipher, where our mission is to foster allyship empathy and understanding. I am your host, Ramsy's job.
He is Ramsey's job. I am q Ward. You are tuned in the Civic Cipher, Yes you are, and we got some interesting things to discuss today. Was hoping that you'll.
Say the right way to put it interesting. Definitely. We're going to spend some time talking about Governor Mike Parson.
If you're familiar with this state of Missouri. There's been a lot of goings on in that place, and I think that his position really illuminates what we say when we talk about things like systemic oppression, because he is like kind of a physical individual embodiment of that idea of oppression, as in so far as systems are concerned, because I think a lot of people think that systems were created and they are artificially like turning on their
own access, like self refueling. But indeed there are individuals who rise to the top of those systems in many circumstances, and then they get to continue to double and triple down on historic injustices, and we're going to talk about that.
We're also going to spend some time talking about the name it's been in the news lately, Luigi Mangioni, and kind of the way the criminal justice is, the criminal justice system is looking at his situation and how a lot of times he's afforded some leeway and some benefit of the doubt that doesn't really come up a lot of times if a person is black. And so these are both things that Q definitely wanted to talk about. So we're going to take the time to talk about
that and more. But before we're going to before we get there, we're going to discuss, as always, some Ebony excellence, shall we and I think you know you shall today.
So by the way, okay, this week's EBNY Excellence sponsored by Actively Black. There is greatness in our DNA. Visit actively black dot com. This week we'll be highlighting Colorado buffalo athlete Heisman Trophy winner Travis Hunter. Many people know Travis Hunter as a number one overall high school prospect who committed to Florida State University and famously decommitted to go with coach Prime to Jackson State, which to say it was controversial at the time, really wouldn't be saying enough.
Went on to Jackson State. They did great things there. He then followed coach Prime again to the University of Colorado, where he became not just the Heisman Trophy winner, but I have to pull out this list to make sure I don't miss anything, because it is a very long and extensive list of awards that he won this year.
I'm a fan of this guy, and I'm to be fair, just kind of learning more about him.
Yeah. Travis Hunter, the twenty twenty four Heisman Trophy winner, was also First Team All American Offense and First Team All American Defense. If that was the whole list, that would be enough, because he was a unanimous first team
All American on both teams. He'll be the cover of the NCAA College Football Games CFB twenty five and Academic All American with a four point oh GPA, the Big Twelve Defensive Player of the Year, the Associated Press National Player of the Year, the Lot Impact Trophy winner, the Paul Hornings Award winner, the Bernerick Award winner, the Blittnikoff Award winner, the Walcher Campbell Award winner, and again the Heisman Trophy. All of this this season. This is not
a compilation of his entire career. All of that happened this year, and I think he deserves to be highlighted in our Ebony excellence.
I'm glad that we are able to do that. Shout out to you, Travis Hunter. Keep going, all right, Mike Parson. Because of the fact that it is challenging, I'm going to try to put this as kindly as I can. I know you hate when I do this, but are just challenging for a lot of our brothers and sisters, particularly,
are brothers Caucasian brothers. To conceive of an invisible system that is artificially oppressing black people when black people have the same twenty four hours in the day, when they themselves were born into impoverished circumstances, and they have made a name for themselves and made an honest go at it,
when they simply just cooperate with police. How inconceivable an artificial system that oppressing black people is to those people, It can be understood understandable if you allow them that much grace, right, And this is for people who maybe they don't have any hatred in their heart, maybe they sincerely or they haven't come to terms with the fact that they might have some biases that whatever, these people
may exist. Okay, so I have to have this hypothetical argument because you know, for the folks who listen to the show, you might have to take this into a conversation with your family, a conversation around the water cooler at work, and talk to individuals who fit this bill. And you cannot come at those people guns blazing like, hey, you're racist. Systemic oppression exists, because they're immediately going to
reject it on his face and push back. So you have to kind of meet them where they think they are. So forgive me for playing into the delusion, but I think it's necessary if we're going to make some progress. Okay, all right, So this in this thought experiment, this man exists, right. He cannot imagine an invisible system oppressing black and brown people because everybody has the same access to the American dream.
Look at Oprah, look at Jordan, look at you know insert name here, look at Lebron and they don't think of those Obama. Yeah, and they don't think of those people as one in a million, you know, gifted natural talents or people that were exceptionally lucky and had the right set of circumstances happen in the right road for them. They look at them as people who work just as hard as they do, ignoring the fact that they don't have as much success as an Oprah or an Obama.
But you know, this is the way that the world makes sense to them. So we're going to meet them there. How we personify systemic oppression really matters because I think that it might help that concept live in the minds and the hearts of those people. So today we're going to talk about Governor Mike Parson. Now he's in the news lately because he has pardoned. I think it is the right term. I'll give you the exact term because I have an article from the Associated Press to share.
But he's pardon a police officer who is convicted of killing a black man. I'll give you the full story in just a second. But the juxtaposition of his position it might have been a matter of months ago, and we actually covered that on this story, where he had the same capacity to pardon a black man, whether it was considerable doubt over whether or not he was guilty, and chose not to exercise that I think that it illuminates how there, indeed are people at the helm of
many of these invisible systems that show the bias. I think that it's been woven into this country and indeed into the individuals, because I'm sure if you asked Governor Mike Parson, are you a racist man? He would simply reply, no, absolutely not. How could you even suggest such a preposterous thing to me? But I think that we'll make a case that it's at least worth considering. Allow me to begin. I know you're ready to go get it. Let me paint the picture.
Okay.
This from the Associated Press. A white former Kansas City police officer who was convicted of involuntary manslaughter and the fatal shooting of a black man, was released from prison Friday after Missouri's governor commuted his sentence to parole. The decision by Republican Governor Mike Parson to free Eric Devanderer Sorry Deval, I had the name. I'm so sorry Devalkennair. That was It came after months of public debate about the case, which had fueled both racial justice protest and impassion.
Please for mercy from Devalcanaire's supporters. Who asserted he had been unjustly convicted. De Valcnaire was serving a six year prison sentence. He was convicted in twenty twenty one of killing twenty six year old Cameron Lamb as he backed into his garage. This is another story that we covered on the show. Lamb's name was invoked frequently during racial injustice protests in Kansas City in twenty twenty following the police killing of George Floyd in Minneapolis. Lamb's family even
met with then President Donald Trump that year. So what we have is a story that was covered, an unjust murder of a black man by a police officer. Okay, this happened before twenty twenty, That happened since policing existed. Okay, it has certainly happened before twenty twenty, happened in twenty twenty,
and still happens now. Okay, And as long as this type of stuff keeps happening, we are still going to do this show, and we are going to prioritize this show and not prioritize some of the other things that we do. They're way more on. But this is necessary, and this is this is a labor of love for us and We appreciate all of you who tune in and listen and get this dose of game that we think will help subtlely create the ripples that we need to create the waves of change in this country. Right
back to the lecture at hand. So Governor Mike Parson looks at this story and the story that we all know is true. This man was convicted, okay, and he says, you know what, I'm going to commute his sentence. Perhaps because he's a police officer, perhaps because he's a white man. But these aren't things that Governor Mike Parson would admit. He may not even know it. I know, I know, I know you, I know I knew that laugh was coming. But he may not. It's not it. It's not impossible,
however improbable. It's not impossible. He may not even know that he has such a strong bias. Right, He might just simply say, you know what, this man was doing his job, he thought he was doing what was right. He took an action that was unfortunate. An individual lost his life, and it just so happens to be the case that the officer is white and the individual that
was killed as black. That might be his logic and there might be a lot of people who follow that logic, most of them because they needed to be true, but a small handful of people who think that that logic is plausible enough to have his sentence commuted. Right, Okay, Now here's where we're going to flip the script. This is from the Equal Justice Initiative. We covered this on
this very show. Despite Saint Louis County prosecuting Attorney Wesley Bell's opposition, Missouri executed Marcellus Williams fifty five, for a nineteen ninety eight killing that he consistently maintained he did not commit. Quote. Marcellus Williams should be alive today, mister Bell said statement shortly after the execution. I goes on to say, if there's even the shadow of a doubt of innocence, the death penalty tea should never be an option.
This outcome did not serve the interests of justice. That's the end of the quote. The prosecuting attorney wrote that new DNA evidence, increasing doubts about the credibility of the state's key witnesses, and constitutional defects including ineffective counsel and rationally discriminatory jury selection at trial, compelled him to ask
the court circuit to correct this manifest injustice. A lot of physical evidence was collected at the crime scene, including the murder weapon which was a kitchen knife, bloody shoe prints and fingerprints and hairs on the victim's t shirt, her hands, and the floor that did not match her or her husband, and none of it can be tied
to mister Williams, the prosecutor wrote. Mister Williams was excluded as the source of the footprints and hairs, the fingerprints, and male DNA that was recently recovered from the knife handle, with no direct evidence leaking mister Williams to the crime. The state's case depended on two unreliable witnesses, and of course there's more there. Of course, you can check out the rest of the Equal Justice Initiatives website. But there were many calls to Governor Mike Parson to pardon this man,
to commutisent, whatever the case, just don't kill him. He could still be alive and in prison if you so choose. Just don't take his life because of all of this doubt cast on the case, and the Governor chose not to. He didn't miss these, he didn't not get he didn't hear about it. It's not that he didn't not hear about it. That's what I'm trying to say. He chose
to just let the execution take place. Now, same person, same system, two outcomes, one with a more humanitarian and indeed a more reasonable, logical and linear path to a pardon or to a commuting of the sentence. Now, now that the picture is painted, Q, Flora is yours.
You know, often when we have this conversation, the thing that catches me most off guard. And Okay, as I was saying that, I realized it wasn't true. It's not what catches me most off guard. Is just what upsets me most is that in the case with the white officer, there's not an argument being made that he didn't kill this person. We acknowledge that he killed him, we acknowledged that the person was unarmed. But we've somehow come to the conclusion that this officer was just doing his job
and enough is enough. He doesn't deserve to be in prison, as is the case in most instances. We're not saying he didn't do it.
I'm just saying he doesn't.
We're just saying he doesn't deserve any accountability for it. We're just saying there's nothing wrong with what he did.
That's a great way to say it.
When it's a white officer, when it's a white man, when it's a white person, that benefit of the doubt always exists, That ignoring accountability always exists. That escape hatch, that strap door, let's just all be human beings about this and give this person another chance, always exist. And again, people think when we make our cases that we're saying let's be harder on everybody else, when we're simply saying, let's be easier on these afford us the same humanity.
Everybody's here, the benefit of the doubt, the same grace. Not let's kill police officers back. No, how about we just demand they stop killing us? Is that okay, let's kill more white men. No, let's just not kill the
black ones. Because Ramses and I unfortunately consume more of these stories and more of these videos than ever makes it in front of you, guys, We've seen white people being pursued by law enforcement, shoot at them, throw things at them, punch them, running to them with their cars, and the officers never even return fire when being shot at, never even fight back when being punched, never even harm people when they're trying to run them over with their cars,
And in many cases, after these people have killed multiple people, they are pursued with grace and kindness, fed making sure that they're okay, given the benefit of the doubt, that maybe they're just having a bad day, that the worst thing that this person has ever done really isn't who they are, and we should all collectively just give them a break.
Now, let me add something right here, right now, there's a video up on our social media. If you don't follow us, we're at Civic Cipher on all platforms. Right now, there's a video on our social media of an officer pulling a car over on the side of the freeway. There's a gentleman black. He's walking back to his car, the car that was just pulled over because he was let out on the freeway. And I couldn't tell you the story that happened before the video, but he's walking
to the car. The officer is behind, So let me start over. The police officer pulls over maybe a van or something like that. Right the officer is radioing in to dispatch or something and saying, hey, I pulled over this vehicle, blah blah blah. The officer gets out of the car. A gentleman approaches on the officer's left side and is walking by the officer toward the vehicle in front of the police cruiser, right, the van that we're
talking about here. And the officer says, do you know this person or something like that, and he's like, oh, no, I'm just getting a ride to the hospital. Right, And the officer pulls out and the guy keeps walking, just walks right past. The officer pulls out his gun and shoots him, and the man, the black man, drops right to the ground. He's like, no, I'm just getting ride to the hospital. Pulls out his gun, dam goes right to the floor. Ok, you can watch the video you yourself.
Then a woman jumps out of the driver's seat of the van and she's screaming. She's like, oh my god, what have you done? What have you done? And the officers he had a gun. Now, the guy didn't move, he wasn't running. He walked right past him toward the band. Didn't turn. No, no sudden movement. You can watch a video for yourself. Shot him, balls right to the ground. Woman is screaming and she's like, he was his hat at something like his hat flew out the window of
the band while we were driving. He went to go get his hat, and he's walking back to the car. We're on the way to the hospital. You know what I'm saying. And the officer's like, Oh, I'm sorry, I'm sorry. I'm sorry, I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. So Dio Hughley says something that I feel bears a lot more, repeating that the most dangerous place for a black man to live is in the imagination of a
white person. So this is not just police officers, but this includes you know, your Karens and your people that call the police on black people for just existing being black and close enough to your comfort zone. Somehow, we've been marketed in such a way that we are always the threat when and I don't I don't want to pretend like we don't live in a reality where wealth inequality shapes outcomes and some people who feel like crime is their only option to take that path.
Right, it's not because they're black, No, it's because of wealth and equality, false equivalence.
Right. But the fact is, I've been robbed by white people, Black people, the Mexican people, everybody that I've ever lived around. They all crimes at large. We all have right.
It's exactly entirely different conversations.
But the narrative that has been chronicled largely in this country, especially in as far as white folks are concerned, is that black people are to be feared. And so again the idea of us living in the imagination of white folks being the most dangerous place for us to live. It plays true in my story, and certainly, as you mentioned, we consume this professionally so that we can, you know, discuss really systems that exist and bring them to life
with examples, because this isn't just an isolated incident. We're not picking on Mike Parson. We're talking about systems and people like this and people like Donald Trump and people like you know. That list goes on and on. They get elected and they quote unquote do the will of the people.
And I think it's important to highlight before we move on, the prosecuting attorney who got this black man convicted was a part of the team saying, hey, we got this one wrong, we got this one wrong, and we probably shouldn't execute this person, because not only is there some benefit of the doubt here, the DNA present isn't his, the hair present isn't his. The footprints present don't belong
to him, the husband or the wife. This same governor who sought in his heart and all of his grace and mercy to parton the white officer who he knows for sure killed the black man in his driveway here, could not find it in his heart to just make sure that the state didn't execute a man who it was most likely not only didn't deserve to die, but did not commit the crime. That's important because it's not saying this guy committed this crime but doesn't deserve to die.
No, no, no, no.
The evidence is saying that, most likely this guy didn't even do it. Right, But we're going to pardon the guy that we know did do it.
And man, that's that's a lot to live with. But yeah, you're right. There are systems, but there are also people, and sometimes they work together.
