And now.
Watching my mic back, you're like that striking water head, borders behind him and the borders.
So if you're just tuning into City Soccer, I'm your host, Ramses.
Job, you know, Ramses on our return to the show, I'm never as lighthearted as when we started. I'm just q ward at this point, you know, when the show comes on, I try to give a little about the time. When we get here, I'm so annoyed and fed up that I almost just say yeah, I'm hi, Hi people, how you doing.
We'll tell you that you should stick around. We still got a lot more showing story for you. When we were talking about Wells Fargo and they're discriminatory loan practices and now they're killing black opportunity a follow up to I think this will be our third segment where we're talking about black Belt and for the lack there and
some of the culprits. And in this episode we're going to be you know, talking about against some discriminatory loan practices killing black opportunity from someone who is not a first time.
Offender Wells Fargo, let me hold some yeah exactly.
So first, however, we're going to talk about becoming a better. Ally, I like this part of the show because I think this is why everyone listens. You know, you want to learn how to support your black and your brown brothers and sisters, and you know, marginalize peoples across the board. And I think that having sorts of conversations really in powerful. At least that's what I hear. I agree, you know in my travels, like, oh my gosh, I didn't know that.
So they were going to talk about Harvard. Harvard created a one hundred million dollars slavery reparation fund. The story
comes from Yahoo, so Instagram. Harvard was founded in Cambridge, Massachusetts, in sixteen thirty six, and got a one hundred page report that made several recommendations about how this one hundred million dollars should be spent, including the improvement of educational opportunities for descendants descendant communities, honoring enslaved people through memorials and research, and creating partnerships with black colleges and university.
I like that it also recommended identifying supporting directive to descendants in Black and Native American enslaved individuals who labored on Harvard's campus and who were enslaved by previous Harvard leaders. I own to underlying Native American because a lot of times our brothers, Native brothers get left out of these conversations. So I'm glad that Harvard is it's identifying them as well.
The report found that Harvard's staff, including four presidents and slave more than seventy individuals until slavery was outlawed in state in seventeen eighty three. I mean, as a state had to outlaw it, Harvard, the enlightened institution, didn't trink it upon themselves to do so. The report also found that the university quote benefited from extensive financial ties to slavery,
including donations from slave traders. It's said that from the mid nineteenth century welleson the twentieth century, Harvard presidents and prominent professors promoted race science and eugenics. Eugenics sign end quote conduct. I did abusive research, including the photographing of enslaved and subjugated human beings. Harbard's subjugated human beings. That's the tough. Harvard's announcement comes as US institutions grappling with
how to make amends for their role in slavery. Last year, the leaders of the Jesuit Conference of increased vouch to raise one hundred million dollars to benefits the descendent of slaves. It wants. Oh all right, now moving on.
One hundred million dollars is not nothing, by the way, I just wanted to say that out loud.
Yes, everybody needs to do that very individual but these institutions follow their lead. Yeah, that's how you become a better ally. So this comes to us from Black enterprise. It's a I think it's primarily a financial publication.
And business and finance.
Yeah, so we don't pull from this very odd often, but lately we've been realizing how important money is. You always knew that, Cue. You always have talked about capitalism, and I've always kind of echoed, but you said that you obviously have a deeper education with respect to capitalism, and it's the invisible forces that come into play with that economic system in place. I'm just a great audience
for you. But recently we've had to come to terms with how finance as well, you know, and so forth, you know, create opportunities, mobility or on the other end of the spectrum, restrict, stagnate, stagnate or otherwise limit your opportunities to live a full life relative to the people around. If everybody's poor, nobody knows what poor is. Everybody's rich,
nobody knows what poor is, you know. But if there are poor people and people driving through their neighborhoods collecting and drive it back out, and what you have is a condition that causes people to realize something's wrong with what I'm dealing with, and they take advantage of whatever opportunities there are to try to pursue a better life for themselves. As in human nature, it's true across the board for all people of all colors and all places
in every corner of the planet. Right, we just kind of have to bear the front of it because we black folks in this country have been on the receiving end of harmful racist legislation and harmful practices not just by the government, but by local institutions and by individuals. For a long time, it was perfectly legal to discriminate against people and not serve people. And you know, you have to give these people need dignity if you if you choose not to. And now in twenty twenty two,
that civic cipher exists. And now after a year and a half of doing the show. Money is the thing we were happy to do. I'm not a munchy, humbly person. I've been very blessed, but I do recognize that it's a very important deity and it is time for us to pay out. So again, Civil rights attorney Bank Crump says Wells Fargo discriminates. Wells Fargo's discriminatory loan practices are
killing black opportunity. Right at the presser, Crump, along with co counsel Lisa Friedman and Suzanne bish urged Wells Fargo's shareholders to approve emotion by the SEIU, one of the country's largest labor unions, to conduct an independent racial equity audit on the bank. Crump also urged other politicians to follow the lead of New York Mayor Eric Adams and
stop investing with Wells Fargo Bank. Now I'm going to stop parents the story, and for those that do, listen to my daily podcast on the IRT media app called the Black Information Network and Daily Podcast, you might have heard this story. There's a very good friend of mine and Ques who told us this story, and we both believe it to be true. There's a gentleman who lives where we live in Arizona.
His name is.
Arturo's a Hispanic name comes from Tucson, who are very poor at floor is in his house. Our party, as he is known, is a billionaire. That's a billionaire. What would be He owns the Anaheim Angels. He owns under armor by himself, and he owns I think huge stakes in like carvan and a bunch of others. Put a businessman that is start in marketing outdoor billboards and soul. I had to do case study on him. When I
was in college. My undergrads named Mark, so I know this name no moreno in the nineties, I believe is how the story King to us went into a Wells Fargo bank and the approach to teller looking as he looks a human being whose ancestry is tied to Mexico. Right, no great offense there, but to some people that is an offensive look.
I was going to say that there should be no offense there, but remember where we are.
But to have such a high dollar amount on your check, so I'm not sure how this part of the story also don't holp me to it. But he went into the bank and he either attempts to cash or deposit or something like that into one of these accounts. The teller did not believe him and believed that two perhaps be fraudulate, which by itself isn't the worst offense. But it was after this, after the back and forth between Arti and the teller, when Arti was made to sit
and wait while they investigated, and they embarrassed him. And you know, obviously that's a very especially me to do business with the financial institution that it's good. So Artis says, you know what n Riches is in. You know what, I'll tell you what, this doesn't even need to be a problem. I'll just withdraw all my money. You don't even have to worry about this check. Oh no, not from that one account to all my accounts. Right, and
as it turns out, we'll stargo bank. That branch at least didn't have enough money to fund his withdrawal because I believe his holdings with the bank at the time or someone in the neighborhood of this is the way the story was told, someone in the neighborhood for hun dollars. So what happens is because they couldn't honor his request, a powerful man well I mean just get my lawyer was involved, you know, since you wanted to make it into that. We'll show you what power looks like. I'll
show you how wrong you are. I love the sort o way. The people at the branch end up having to get a hold of the CEO of Wells Fargo. CEO well Spargo had to fly on a private jet immediately to Arizona to talk to Riti Molno face to face because he knew if Ardi pulled out four hundred million dollars from well Spargo that the stock price would drop and they could not afford that at that time. You know, and this is well Spargo, is that the burnie made off one or I forget what it was.
And a few years ago they were gotten into trouble for doing like some sort of practice. They had to settle out of court front of ours post all happenings they had so like a classics of lawsuit. Recently, we'll start of took my house during the a procession. Right, I gave him all their money, he still took my house because they had the power to do it even though they were paid. This is a sort of right. When the CEO comes out has a conversation with ARTI
what does already say? It says, all right, I'll keep doing business with you. These are my terms. We're going to hire more Hispanic people in your branches. We're gonna put a Spanish people in your advertisements. In what else part, We're gonna make sure that there's some representation, there's some inclusion. Going to change this culture, because what I experienced was wrong. If you want to keep my business, then you're going to have to do right, not by me, by everyone.
So obviously already, after hearing stories, a big hero of mindse I like people that stand up for other people. I think that another part of this is that you realize how institutions like this hold a lot of power over your personal well being and the mobility to have in society if they just don't like you. You know, because already has four hundred million dollars, but I'm still
working on that figure. You know, a lot of us are a lot of us listening, and even with four hundred million dollars still they still had to deal with that. So I'll continue. The pressor also included black homeowners who say they're victims of Wells Fargo's discriminatory bank practices and have joined the class action lawsuit against the bank. Again just a brief story, but and I don't know that
this was a racist base thing. But I do realize that I know for a fact that I checked that I was a black home owner when I applied for that loan, because I was proud of that fact that I wanted to contribute to that statistic. So if they wanted to find that out, they could. But I don't know that that factored into it. But I do remember this bank giving them all the money that they asked for to get caught up on my loan because I
fell behind. Annoyed thing was everyone they had all the money they needed, that filled out all the people where could be was fun. And they sent the check back to me and said, you know what, instead, we'll just take the house. And as it turned out, they could get more money selling the house than they could keeping me as a customer, and so I lost my house, had a foreclosure, had the Fortunately I made it out of that obviously during the day, well compared to them.
But you know, these sorts of practices, once you add a little bit of like a racist component, or you see it happening to one group of people more than other groups of people. You start seeing a pattern and it becomes one of those things that reinforces on a deep psychological level how this world and how this country
feels to us. I mentioned before that I used to work at a place called Brown and Brown Nissan in Arizona, and I was probably seventeen eighteen years old working there selling next eras and centers and you know all those cars, right maximums and whatnot. Cool people, Yeah, you know, But I found out that the Nissan Corporation was lending money to black people, are charging higher interest rates across the board to the court, they had to settle and wit
longdoing and settle and pay to pay for that. And what I took from that is that I, being a part of that machine was actually getting people in black people that would come and be so excited to get their new centers. Man. I was because you know, I've always been a car bess. I've been into like more fancy cars or whatever. But there's some peoples they have a new car that doesn't break down. They're elated over
the movie. And for some people, that's for me, that's as long as I'm happy, and I my babies are staying good. Right, these people it's like the biggest day of their life, and it was soured. And I was happy for having helped them get the right colored car, the right features, or just getting a car and working extra hard and staying with people helping them with their
credit over months, all that sort of stuff. They finally got their car, and then to know that those black folks were overcharged and I was the person that, you know, I got a commission off of that, so I was a part of trying to sell the car toon. I felt taking advantage unused, but the lasting impression was for me at least, why did they hate us? Right? So when I look at this well Stargos thing, I'm like, why did they hate us? What do we do? There's
no way to not pay. They either pay or they take the house.
The interesting thing is pointing out those trends, though, right when you have the data that supports the argument almost indefinitely right to stretch it out for as much time as you like, scale it however you'd like. It points to very very obvious discriminatory lending. And you know, pointing those things out makes you the person that you're the one made to feel uncomfortable by pointing out that these
things exist. You almost have to put on white gloves and be very delicate about how you say these things out loud to not offend the person that's doing the oppressive you know, prejudice, kind of awful things. You know, how gear you shine that light at me? I would I would never do that. I'm far too decent a person for that. Except I have all of the information and the data that proves that that's not the case.
Set us, So all right, I'll continue. The class action suit was filed by Aaron Braxton in March twenty twenty. Imagine, well, Spargo's systematically discriminated against black homeowners and it's evaluation and refinancing applications. That's sort of what I get. A Bloomberg News invest detigation backs up the claim, finding that the bank approved black homeowners seeking to refinance mortgages during the pandemic at a much more rate than white homeowners forty
seven percent to seventy two percent. Again, they approved black homeowners at forty seven percent and white home owners at seventy two percent. Additionally, the bank has paid out millions in racial discrimination claims made by workers and customers. In twenty twelve, the Justice Department ordered the bank to pay one hundred and seventy five million after charging African American and Hispanic homeowners higher fees and improperly placing them in
subprime loans. In twenty eighteen, Wells Fargo was accused of praying on black and Latino homeowners. I think that was the case that I was talking about, but that one doesn't say it went to court. I'm so sorry. I didn't know that I would remember that, so that's why I'm not prepared to articulate it. But this might have
been somewhere between twenty sixteen and twenty eighteen. Wells Fargo had to beat crow because they were super duper wrong, and if you just look up whatever happened at that time, you'll find all. Right now, we would not be doing our job if we didn't get in a word from Wells Fargo. So we will take a moment to share
the words of Wells Fargo' spokeswoman Jennifer len Getting. She shared this with Black Enterprise again the source of our researcher, and she responded to the press conference saying, quote, we are deeply disturbed by allegations of discrimination that we believe do not stand up discrutiny. We're confident that we follow relevant government sponsored enterprise guidelines and our decision making, and that our underwriting practices are consistently applied regardless of a
customer's race or ethnicity. These unfounded attacks on Wells Fargo's stand and start contract to the company's significant and long term commitment closing the minority homeownership gap, Langan said. She goes on, in twenty twenty, Wells Fargo was the largest bank lender for home mortgages to black families, and this is consistent with our performance over the last decade from twenty eleven to twenty, in which the company helped as many black families purchase homes as the next three largest
bank lenders combined. Okay, so let's let's she said that. Okay, and sure, but we were talking about Fox News Earth, so let's try to dissect this language. Okay, I'm not sure who the next three the largest lenders are, but off the top of my head, I named Chase, which, if I'm guessing, it's probably the biggest, you know bank in the country. You know, at least for this type of banking Bank of America, which might be number two. Who knows bill Wells Fargo, you know, maybe they're number three.
I don't know, so don't want me to. But in any case, it's a matter of how big Wells Fargo is relative to those other three. If every bank is the same size, right, Wells Fargo is the same size as the Credit Union on the corner, then yeah, that's saying something. Absolutely Wells Fargo, You're absolutely right, we got
nothing more to talk about. But if Wells Fargo is a giant compared to the next three financial institutions that create these sorts of loans, then that's a real easy bar to get off, right, because if Wells Fargo is three times the size of the next three lenders, and then yeah, that's that. That makes sense.
And this and this isn't a punitive response from us. We don't know that Wells Fargo isn't.
I'm just saying this is how language works, right.
Yeah, And saying we're the least racist of the racist isn't really a flex.
Ya.
It's not saying and I'm not saying that that's what they're saying.
I'm just saying yeah, and we've talked about on a show that it's we're picking on Wells Farbo right now because A we can and because we have personal experiences, but b because that's what the articles about this has been about Bank of America Chase. It could have been about again the credit union on the corner by your house. Listening to us today in whatever city you're in, you know, here in Vermont listening, you know, I shout out Vermont.
It's such an ex Vermont, you know, and I've been there. Your your your state is so kind, your people are so kind. Shout out to all our listeners in Vermont and our affiliates. We have two broadcasts affiliates, so thank you both for carrying the show. Anyway, if you live in Vermont, we'd be having the same conversation about your financial institution as well. So we're just so happens to
be the case that we're talking about Wells Fargo. And I say that to say that we're not saying that Wells Fargo is the only institution that engages in discriminatory black practices. In fact, we've spent a few shows now describing that the whole of I guess the economics as
they relate to black people. The economics of this country as it relates to black people is biased away from black people getting and retaining wealth and tour white folks and not just black people losing wealth, but Hispanic do anybody mellimated? You know? And then you know white folks, and then Asian folks, largely, especially upperly mobile, super educated Asian folks, have been able to benefit from that. And
I'm not playing into that model minority myth. There are systems in place that allow a lot of those folks to get fast tracked. There's a you know, what we do in this country is we try to get brains around the world. You know, we don't. This is how America is great. We go around, we scour the planet, We get all the best minds. We bring them here
and put them in the best institutions. And in order for them to come here and study, we make sure that they have to stay here, live here, reside here, and work here before leaving to go back to their countries. And so we kind of have a monopoly on the world's brains. Maybe monopoly too strong a work, but that's really our strongest asset when it comes to a lot.
And China has a lot of people, a lot of those Asian countries, Southeast Asia Asia proper, we have a lot of really smart folks, and so there are fast tracks to get here, to get to the wealth. And then if you choose to stay, have children, you know, bring over family members, et cetera. There are systems in place for you to do that. So those things often contribute to see look at those Asian folks, they're doing great, or do they have system in place to get them
a new great? Or did you give them loans that are only good in black neighborhoods so that they could continue to have problems and develop rational tensions with black folks and so forth. I won't lean into that one again, but we should revisit that topic at some point.
Shall we.
Yeah, but first some black history. It's not for the way black history factor. Have you seen Charlie and the Chocolate Factory?
I have, actually, yeah, multiple times.
I think it's the Monk the track. Yeah, so I saw the original movie. I don't even know if those original movies, but I saw the version of the movie. But Gene Wilder likewise, and then later there was a version of Johnny Depp and I think that was called Charlie and the Traplic Factory, right, But it's the same story. So if you're not familiar with the story, basically a kid it's broke or his family as a grandfather that's
bed ridden, and there's this contest by Willie Wonker. This is famous the confectioner or whatever it is the word the person that makes candies. This guy decides who wants to give away his chocolate factory to a kid, or that he wants a kid to win a lifetime supply chocolate, that's what it is, and has this contest right and puts five golden tickets. This is why the term golden ticket, you know, it's popular. So it's part of our collective
consciousness that comes from the story that tick. Anyway, evil eyed viewers of the show, or black one of the two or non white one of the three might have noticed that Willy Wonka had a global contest children all around the earth send chocolate to every corner of the globe where children can hear it. And those five golden tickets went to five white children. Several things like that that show you how important you are.
You grow up black because of course they did, right.
But you know it's a story. I'm not going to leave into it, but just little things like that over the lifetime, it frames the world and in a way, in a strange way for you know, white folks, you might not get it because it's normal, but for us it's like normal. You know, we're not a part of that. That's not a thing for us. But how cool would it be if we were? So I'll read it. This comes from NPR. Donald. Sorry, Rold, how did that?
Don't we say?
You leant how to say? Tell me out?
Roll Dall?
Rold Dall, rolld Dall's widow says Charlie from the Chocolate Factory was originally black? How about that? Our way? Black history factor Charlie Buckett, the he wrote of Rold Doll's famous children book, Charlie and the Chomplate Factory also which also inspired two films in a British confectory confectionery company, was originally written to be a little black Boy, according
to an interview with Felicity Doll, the author's widow. She spoke earlier this week on BBC Radio Forest Today program alongside her Roll Dall biographer, Donald Sturk, who said it was the writer's agent who quote thought it was a bad idea end quote, And had the author turned the protagonist white, now how different with things might things have been?
How much stronger of a story with that had been for little black kids around the world to feel like it's possible to be lucky, you know, to wake up you know most you know, at least the people I grew up around were port. I wasbor growing up, and luck wasn't really a companion for me growing up. You know. It's just kind of like very unlucky. Anyway, I'll continue, People would ask why Charlie was black, stir quoted the
agent is saying. The BBC interviewer followed up by suggesting a new rewrite of the book that would recast Charlie as a black child, to which Felicity Gaul responded it would be wonderful with And that's.
As well.
Charlie and the Chocolate Factory, in which your boy from an impoverished family and Brittany finds the fifth and final ticket to any tour of the factory run by eccentric chocolate tear really wantka. I was just one of the many wildly successful children's classics written by Doll that also inspired mission most major most pictures. Others included James and the Giant Peach, The BFG Matilda, and Fantastic Mister Fox. Although beloved by many, Doll faced numerous accusations of racism,
both on and off the printed page. Here's what the story is text what we worry because that's what we do. Perhaps the most notably, the NAACP called on Dall to alter his portrayal of the famous factory workers known as the Obolumphas and Charlie and Chocolate Record. In the book. The original publication, they were described as African pigmies whom walk and discovered and then shipped to his factory to
make use of their labor. Dolls transformed the envelopers into orange tinted factory workers with green hair in subsequent editions of the book. In twenty sixteen, The Forward, a Jewish newspaper, posts a series of anti Semitic quotes attributed to Doll, including quote there is a trait in the Jewish character that does provoke animosity and Pierre reached out to the old Doll organizations for response to the Forwards. Quotes and more generalized critiques of racism, but did not hear back
the four publication. The actor who played Charlie Bucket in nineteen seventy one film adaptation, Peter Ostrom, was a bite featured in the film with Blondze with a blonde side park, as reported on NPR's weekend edition Sunday in two thousand and five. After starring the originally the Austroa never acted in another film and went on to become a better area.
So in this story, you have whitewashing, which is something that we have talked about when we need to talk about on the show, and we have now the opportunity to ponder not just this instance, but all the many instances when we get written out of stories, or we have opportunities to be in stories, or when people we think the casting of white characters to be black that reaction to them because we've seen this going all the way back, like, oh, we've always been white. No, not
in all the instances. Superman has always been white. He can't be blaming. James Bond has always been white, he can't be black. Well, listen, because now I'm seeing that sometimes these things actually start out white even racist people because saying and racist stuff here. And at least in one of his books, a character was back and we never got to see what that would become. And this is just another page in our black reality, but it's important to share it. And yeah, that's our great black
history fact. Your thoughts.
You know, it's interesting throughout the history of art and literature, we've always been able to point to the differences between rich and poor, even extreme levels of classism and you know, very very poor and very very rich where a middle class doesn't even exist. The lack of empathy and grace with regard to even casting black people as a part of these stories is what always catches me off guard, because what harm would it actually do to let the sympathetic figure of a story be a black.
Kid that's having And that's just heavy enough for us to leave it right here. So thank you so much for tuning in to Civic Cipher once again. I'm your host, Rams's job.
I go by the name q Ward.
Today's show is sponsored by Hip Hop Weekly Magazine and produced by our producer, Maggie Williams. Maggie be Knowing Stuff, Knowing Stuff Man. Listen at the website Civic Cipher dot com. You can download this in any previous episodes. You could send us topics if you want us to talk about them, links to articles and anything like that. Get all the information there. You can donate to the show. Show is growing,
and I say it, but it really is. We're at the almost thirty cities now and it continues to row with your support.
It's because of y'all.
Because of y'all, and don't be afraid to become a Patreon because that really helps us the most. I'm gonna ask that you forgive the quality of the audio. This week. I am zooming in Q of courses in the studio and we'll we'll be back to normal next week. But for this week, we had a lot to talk about and I didn't want to miss this week. So for now to zoom call again, forgive the audio, and be sure to follow us on social media at Civic Cipher And until next.
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