¶ Intro / Opening
Chapter two.
I'm Erik Cargill.
And I'm Rachel Elnar. And this is Cheers and Tiers
Design Leadership Tales Retold.
Alright, Erik. I'm so excited because today's guest is a Seattle based designer with over thirty years of experience in marketing and brand development. She is a principal of Quesinberry Associates, otherwise known as Q and A, and has worked with major brands like Amazon, Microsoft, the Gates Foundation, and UPS, earning recognition from How Magazine, Grafis, GDUSA, and others. A champion for the design community, Wendy served as AIGA Seattle Chapter President, directed the twenty fifteen AIGA Redesign Awards, and received the AIGA Fellows Award in 2019. She also led the Seattle show and taught at Cornish College of the Arts.
And fun fact, she was the handwriting model for the Microsoft tablet launch where Rob Lowe read his name in her penmanship, an iconic moment for any soda pop Curtis fan. Welcome, Wendy Quesinberry
Hello. Thank you for having me.
Oh, so nice to see you. Thank you for joining us.
Thank you.
You know, ever since I got involved with Seattle, you've always been a mainstay. And one thing that I've never asked you about was how did you get involved? How'd you get involved with AIGA, and what was your what was your path to leadership?
¶ Wendy's Journey with AIGA
Well, so I went to Savannah College of Art and Design a million years ago, and, the only chapter available when I was in school was the New York chapter. So I signed up because that's what you're supposed to do if you're a good design student. And then I moved to Seattle in 1991 and immediately started volunteering. And I usually worked the check-in station. That way I could learn who everybody was and introduce myself to important people.
And then it what's funny is, going back and looking through, you know, old communications and things. In my memory, I was like, and then I immediately got on the board. But, obviously, a few years happened. And so I in 02/2002, I got on the board as membership chair. And then I was in that position for four years. And then after that, I went into the leadership into I'm sorry, the president's chair. So I just kinda leapfrogged all the other ones and just went right for the top.
Nicely done. Nicely done. And who who who was in the chapter when you were president?
When I started, Brooke McKay Castro was president. Marty was in it, was on the board. Terry Marks. I think Terry might have just rolled off the board itself. David Kendall, Kevin Berger, Aaron Shurts. So a number of people, that we all know and love, were on there. And when I started, I think the board was 14 people. It was pretty sizable.
Oh, that's a big board.
Yeah, and I think That's
a big board.
I think while I was on the board, it was between fourteen and eighteen people.
Well, I'm glad you said everybody on the board because I was like, can you name people in the chapter? I was like, oh god. No. Not everybody in the chapter. You you got where I was going with that. Thank you. Thank you for picking that up. When and where was your first leadership retreat?
So my first one was Las Vegas. And I found some old scripts from where we were supposed to do, What has your board done this year? And we wrote scripts to be a Doctor. Phil show, Monty Python and the Holy Grail. And I was trying to remember, we must have done the Doctor. Phil, because we probably just didn't feel like we could pull off some fake British accents.
But we rolled through our year's events in that format. Oh my god. That sounds like so much fun. What year was the Las Vegas Leadership Retreat?
Two thousand five? Pretty sure. Okay. Because my next one was Pittsburgh, and then after that was Miami.
Okay. All right. All right. We're piecing together the timeline now. Great.
Okay. Great. Because I really wanted to go to Oklahoma was the next year,
right? Omaha.
Omaha. And I really wanted to go to that one, and I just didn't. Miami was my last one.
Yeah. Because Omaha was 02/2008. That was the last year you were a chapter president. So that makes sense. Right. Yes. Okay. Great. So you let someone else go?
Yes. I I let them go.
You allowed them.
Well, it's hard,
right? When you
go, it's really difficult to let go.
Very much. I think I must have had conflict or something because I definitely would have said, oh, no. I still need to go. I need to make sure there's a good transition or something.
Of course. I made those you know, the leadership retreats are are, you know, fairly legendary for the people that that have gone. And and I always like listening to the stories that people have to have to share about about those retreats because I've certainly missed out on some pretty, some some fun times, but was also part of some.
So I heard some things about Miami. All right? So I went to Omaha. Was my first retreat. Miami, I heard that a lot of people were in the pool all the time. Can you tell me if that was true or not?
Oh gosh. I'm sure that's true. What sticks out of my memory is going to bars and the trend at that time was having beds as seating. Oh, okay. And so every bar you went to, it would be like, I guess we'll sit on this bed here. And it was really weird and awkward. And so we all got on this one bed, and then the server comes, and everyone kind of starts throwing out their drink orders. And then the server says, Oh, I'm sorry. You can only buy bottles.
Oh gosh.
It was bottle service on the Exactly.
On the bed, and we're like And you know, a bottle is like $100 or something like that. And so then everyone's like, Oh, well,
we can just go to
the liquor store across street and drink in our room. So everyone leaves, and I can't remember why it was like me and a couple other people were, I don't know, still sitting around. And then this server comes back with individual drinks with like a pile of them. And we're like, Wait a second. You said only bottle service.
And she said, Well, we decided to make an exception. And I, Well, now there's only like three of us here. We can't drink all those drinks, and we had to send them back. I'm sure we drank a couple, but we did. We were just like, what's happening? So then, of course, everyone had their bottles and partied in the rooms.
I got to ask about this, the aesthetics of this. A bed, like full on bed, not like futon, not like hide a bed. This is
It was like a queen bed, like probably more like a king-size bed because it did become like, oh, I guess I'll sit with my legs crossed here, and then you can sit next to me there. And I'm slightly uncomfortable if we lay down, but there's so many people. Like, it was just so odd. And I think it was really meant for maybe just a few people who were super sexy in Miami. Intimate? Yeah. Yeah. And then it's just everybody else goes there and it's like, oh, I'm on a bed now with a bunch of people.
I remember what I was going to ask now. This was just in reference to something you mentioned earlier about Monty Python. Was that your suggestion? Because I know that Terry Gilliam is a fan you are a fan of Terry Gilliam's work.
I was going to get excited when you said Terry Gilliam was a fan of my work. But
Could be. Could be.
Who Who knows? It it might have been my idea because I do I love Terry Gilliam so much that if I can put him into any situation where I can emulate him, I'm thrilled.
I rarely find anybody who has actually seen the movie Brazil, let alone seen it and liked it. I happen to love that movie.
Oh my god. So wonderful.
And I have a a a good friend of mine that I used to work with. He and I would would just quotes down the hall, and it was it was so fun. You know? Anyway, I wanted to ask you a little bit about you know, this is a bit self serving. So sorry, audience.
I I wanted to ask you a little bit about the Seattle chapter back then. When I was in the chapter, so would have been seven or eight years after you were president, we had a a lot of events, a lot of monthly. From what I understand, the Seattle chapter back when you were president, not as many events, but the events were still very profound and very influential and inspirational. Can you speak to that a little bit? Like, what were some of the events that stuck out in your mind for this Seattle chapter specifically?
¶ Memorable Events in AIGA Seattle
Well, so when I became president, think, I'm making an assumption, but I think people were a little grumpy with me at first because previously, we did have a ton of events. Oh, yeah. And it was I just thought, okay. We all love each other. We love to be around each other, but we do have other things going on.
And I thought we're gonna get more bang for our buck if we have fewer events that are really amazing, and then people can feel like they could go to more things. And so we did reduce the number of events. And then just naturally, I think it goes up because people get so excited. But we had we had a lot of people, a lot of big, you know, celebrity designers come to town. We had Stefan Seigmester.
We had Marty Neumeyer do a workshop for his book, The Brand Gap. We did the paper fashion show back then. Into the Woods, which was prior to May and after May. So we had a lot of really great events that I think, it just I know we're all so in love with all of our time with AIGA, but it really just felt like you were going to something where you were gonna learn, you were gonna be inspired, you were excited. It wasn't a drudgery of like, Ugh, well, now I got to go to this event.
You were just so happy to be there and be part of it.
I wish I went to the Into the Woods. I had heard about it. Oh, my gosh.
Yeah. Those were so fun. And one of the things I always did, I don't know why this wasn't why more people didn't do this, I always volunteered to chaperone whoever came to town. And I was like, I'll go to the airport. I'll take them to the hotel.
I'll take them out to dinner. I'll take them everywhere. Because I just thought, when else do you get to have this person that you see in books and you hear about? Like, when do you get one on one time with them? And so I was always first like, I'll take it.
And so I got to spend time with Gail Anderson, Louise Fili, and Stefan Segmeister, I have a great story with him where I don't know why he did this, but he let me come to his meetings. And so I sat in on client meetings, and the one was at the public library. And I drove, And so we have the meeting, we go to leave, and it was cash only parking, which I had no cash. So I just turned to him and was like, Hey, you got some cash, Steph? Poor man had to pay for my parking.
What did he say? Did he say anything?
Oh, he goes, Oh, sure. I got some.
And that's the great thing about AIJ, right? Like, there's some trust. There's camaraderie there between, it's not like, Oh my gosh, this person's asking for money. Everyone seems so When
¶ Starting a Design Studio
did you start your studio? Was that part of the bio? I should probably listen to the bio.
Was that a photo of No, I don't think I had that in there. Okay. I graduated college in 1991, and that was a huge recession. So couldn't get a job to save my life. And the other big difference was so I grew up in Florida, which is Bowen, Georgia.
I was much I was very used to people being extremely direct. So when I moved to Seattle, and everyone kind of dances around something, whatever the answer is, and they don't want to hurt your feelings. So every interview I went to, somebody would say, Oh, when you work here? And I was like, Score. I got the job.
I am so amazing. And then they'd ghost me like, never hear back from them again. So I thought, Oh, what did I say on the way out? Who knows? And then I interviewed with a New Yorker who was living out here. And I don't even know if I got a full sentence out, but she was like, Okay, we'll just stop you right now. You're never going to find a job. It's a recession. You're competing with people who have ten, fifteen years experience. Go get a retail job.
Try again in six months. And I was like, oh, thank you. That's what I needed to hear. So I go, oh.
I love that your answer was thank you. I love that your answer was thank you because somebody from Seattle would not say thank It
would be devastating. But I was thrilled so that I got a retail job and just started freelancing from there, and it kind of just built up over time where then, after freelancing for, oh, ten years or so, then I was like, Oh, I could hire someone, and then just started building up from there. So really, it was kind of late '90s, around February, that I considered myself an established studio.
I love the name, by the way. The Quesinberry and Associates is Q and A. That's so clever.
I feel like I should make up a story and say I'm an amazing brand person. But it was one of those things where it's like when they say, You have to have a name. It's like, Oh, Quesinberry is my name. And Associates. Wow, we lucked out and that's Q and A. That's great.
I love accidents like that.
It's meant to be. Exactly.
So when you got involved with AIGA, you had your studio already. Did you encourage other people, well, within your studio to also join AIGA? And what about the leadership principles and things that you were learning in AIGA did you bring back to your studio?
Well, very much encouraged everyone to be part of AIGA and people were on the board later and of course went to lots of events. And I think from being on the board, what I gained was confidence. And it was such a great incubator for trying out ideas, for collaborating, for all these things that really, you're running an organization, you have hundreds of people to answer to, but you're not going to get fired. You can try things out, and if it didn't work, it wasn't going to crash the stock market. So it was like a great thing to be like, I have this wonderful idea, and I'm not quite sure how to do it.
¶ The Importance of Community
And you could talk to other people on the board and talk to membership and try things out and tweak it as time went on if it wasn't quite right. So I think in that sense, it just was this really great place to learn how to be a business beyond the design portion.
AIGA Seattle is kind of not really in existence right now. There's kind of in flux. I know that there's been talk about people wanting to start up a chapter. And I think community is what a lot of people are missing out on. And I know that I got to see you last week for the happy hour. Remind me of the name again.
It's Creative People Doing Happy Hour.
Creative People Doing Happy Hour. Great, because it did have that sense of community and it did feel, it had that feeling that I personally have been missing. So thank you for doing that. Are there any other things that you either miss about community or that you are actively participating in?
Well, think most of it is the missing part. And that's how the happy hour got started, was I was reaching out to AIGA friends that I hadn't seen. I got tired of saying, I haven't seen you in three years, four years, five years. And I was like, God, I'm sick of saying that.
And
so then I would say, I'm going to set up a happy hour. And then I eventually would start to get reminded, like, you keep saying that. So it's like, Okay, I better do it. And so the whole idea was just, Okay, I just want to set up a happy hour, invite everybody, they can invite more people. And if you show, you show.
If you don't, you don't. And I feel like that over time, we've been made to feel like if you don't show up to something, you've let somebody down. Mhmm. And I understand that we're all busy. It's really hard. So if we can just have something that is steady, like same bar, same first Tuesday of the month. If you show, you show. If you don't, you don't. Nobody is You don't have to tell me why you didn't show up. You don't have to worry about it.
Just come. And so it's kind of taken on its own life and growing, and it's so lovely and wonderful to reconnect with friends and talk about things that we did in the past and talk about like, Hey, what could we start up again? And so it has been really, really great, and I'm loving it.
It has and thank you for doing that. There was definitely several generations, I guess I could say, of designers that were there and mingling together and that was fantastic. And it was very touching. And so thank you for doing that and putting that together.
And I do think that historically was a stumbling block, was the multigenerational. And I don't know why, I don't know if it was programming or what exactly. And maybe we've come to the other side where there's everyone has a hunger for this community to be together. And so it doesn't matter what you do. It's just I just wanna be around other designers.
¶ Professional Growth through AIGA
That's so wonderful. Mean, for me, like, just being around our own community, creative community, design community, definitely fills my heart. Makes me just feel like I'm part of something larger.
Exactly.
Being involved and also, being part of leadership at AIGA Seattle, did it give you anything professionally? Did it feed anything for you professionally?
Oh, very much. I got to do campaigns. That's another thing I actually miss, was when I was on the board and somebody would take on an event and design all the materials. And it's always, always, always will stick in my head is a Valentine's Day event where we did paper fashion show, but Scott Scheff designed the materials. And that will just forever be in my head because I loved it so much.
It was so beautiful and fun, and And it was back in the days where you had so many print sponsors, and you could be like, yeah, we'll do a hit of silver in there, and we'll do this, we'll do that. And they're just pulling out all the stuff so you could just design really cool stuff. So for me, was also like I had events where I did campaigns for, and that was fun because I got to do all the writing, the design, all of it, and the planning of the whole campaign. So those things also and again, it's because you're in a supportive community, you can explore a lot more than you can usually with a business client.
It is so much fun to do design for designers.
It is.
It really is. And they're not asking me for little changes that go the opposite way. If anything, it's more creativity. I love I love designing for designers, so that makes sense.
Yeah. Because most of the time you hear it, that's cool. I get it. I love it.
Why did you decide to do it that way?
Well, I think of, like, half the time as a designer, it's almost like you're in a cage match where you're just like, you go into it and you're just like,
I've got to defend why I did all this stuff. And I know it's the right answer.
And it's like you're almost tense before you even show anything versus you're with other designers who are just like, cool. I wouldn't have thought of that.
I love that.
So much like, did your involvement with AIGA contribute to any of your client work or your professional, you know, within your own studio? Did you get any work from AIGA?
Such a good question. I don't know. I have found, least throughout my career, very rarely does somebody say, I found you for this specific reason. I always felt like it was just part of the bigger picture and was a very important part of the big picture. Because I I have, over the course of my career, had people go, and I don't even understand this question, but they're like, oh, what are your credentials?
And you're just like, okay, if you like my stuff, those are my credentials. I always used AIGA as the most important foundation of who I was as a designer so that they could see like, oh, this is the organization for designers, and you've been very involved. You've been the chapter president, etcetera. So that has always been kind of my foundation for the background of my work.
So back to leadership retreats real quick, we can, if we can kind of go back there a little bit. Were they doing human pyramids back when you were going? Was that a
I don't remember that. I feel like that was all after.
That Omaha. Was Omaha. So you just missed Omaha.
Exactly. I have a feeling that maybe there was, I mean, clearly there's a lot of alcohol consumption for the pyramids, but maybe we were like doing too much and then we couldn't even make it to the pyramid time.
I love that.
Wasn't there an Into the Woods where there was an incident? Like, there was some sort of I'll have to do my research on that, and that'll be on a different episode. But I think there was there was, like, some sort of incident where where we were asked not to come back to that facility. Oh yeah. What?
Yeah, yeah, yeah, for sure. I think it was other
than Do you
Drunken Swimming.
Was it Drunken Swimming?
Yeah. Yeah. Yes. Rachel, so you have a picture in your head, the listeners have a picture in their head. We would take over this place called Sleeping Lady Lodge in the mountains, beautiful.
It's just like these cabins and all this deep forested area, there's a stream, and it's just peaceful and lovely. And we would just come in and just be out of control and loud. And so it's thankful that we were the only people there. We had the whole facility to ourselves, but we were kind of loud and out of control. So, I think there was a drunken swimming one night that then the venue was like, we need a break.
Guys, it's called Sleeping Lady for a reason. After that, was was it Suncadia? I don't remember.
Yes. Yes. They moved to Suncadia.
They moved to Suncadia. So still had the programming. It just moved. Exactly.
Yeah. Yeah. No explanation. We don't know why.
No. We don't know why. Are you out of questions, Pause. I'm out of questions. I'm out of questions.
I can tell you a good story about the AIGA conference, not converse, in 02/2003 in Vancouver. So the Seattle chapter
Vancouver, Washington.
Vancouver, Canada's the only one that went out of the country. I remember that Okay,
I didn't know this, so this is all new to me.
Yes, So the Seattle chapter rented two buses and drove up. And we had to leave seven or 08:00 in the morning. And of course, that came with David Kendall having two giant jugs of Bloody Marys. So, I mean, by the time we get to the border, we're already tanked. And then a couple people got pulled off the bus because they weren't quite sure if they should be going into Canada.
¶ Future Vision for AIGA Seattle
And it was so much fun. And Terry Marks made us all shirts that said AIG-EH for Canada. Nice.
Nice. That's great. How was that received?
Well, again, I think a big group of people from AIGA pay no attention to how anything is received. We're just like, I'm amazing. But I will say, of course, I still have mine. And this was, oh, maybe just like seven or eight years ago. I'm in Florida, and I'm wearing that t shirt, and I'm pumping gas. And some guy goes, oh, so you're Canadian. And I had to pause and just like, what? And then I looked down, I go, yeah, I am. Those
are the legendary stories that I would expect, you know, that are outside of the realms of, you know, the programming and everything, the after programming.
The happy hours that you're putting together, such a great idea. Is there a larger vision for that?
So the idea stemmed from at the beginning of the pandemic where I was dreaming big because why not? The world was falling apart. You might as well create a brand new one. So the idea was to start with dinners, and just have inspiring people at those dinners. And then have three day, weekends where somewhere in The US, you have a workshop for three days.
And then have a week long workshop in Europe. And in my mind, they were all about, you're being inspired. Three days was enough to set your brain on a paradigm shift of, like, I could make a shift or I could learn something more, etcetera. And then the week long would be where you're really honing in that great idea. And so, of course, it was during the pandemic.
Who is gonna go to any of these things? Nobody. So but that stayed in my mind. And so then when I decided to start up this happy hour, my husband, Todd Christensen, who works in the office with me, he reminded me, okay, we've got this great idea of these inspiration workshops. And so the happy hour is kind of like, oh, could it create this bigger series of ideas, series of workshops?
And then it's also, could this be the start of restarting our chapter, our AIGA chapter here? So kind of like a little bit of both of those things. Like, how could we do more with this happy hour because there's a big hunger for the community to get back together, for the young designers who haven't had that community to be part of it, for people who miss it to get back into it, all these things merging together. It's a really great time to be doing all of this and resurrecting all of this.
Thank you for doing that. I mean, feel like as a younger designer twenty years ago, having this community really helped my career, really got me connected, kind of got my start. You had this great network when you're in college, then you fall out of college and all of a sudden it was like, what's happening? So I don't know how younger designers, emerging designers are doing right now, but I feel like building up this community will only help them as well.
Exactly. And especially the whole work from home.
Like, as
you're talking about, you lose your connections when you leave college, you go to a new place, and then it's like, if your start was working from home, it's like, who is this design community? It's like, where are they?
Very good point. Very good point. Well, I'm sold. And if you need help with that, you've heard it here. Perfect. I'd like to throw my name into the hat and be a part of that if in any way that I possibly can.
I love it, I love it.
So yeah, I'll sit on a bed or whatever I need to do. Whatever I need, I'll pay for bottle service. Totally fine, totally fine. Wendy, I wanna thank you for taking your time and being here today and sharing these stories with us. I just wanna share a story with you that, of course you wouldn't have known this but I got started with AIGA pretty late in my career and I was very nervous when it began I didn't really know anybody and my first event I don't remember where it was but I think it was somewhere in Capitol Hill here in Seattle and you made me feel so welcome.
You came right up to me and just we had a conversation and it wasn't really about what the conversation was. It was just that it made me feel very welcome and I just want to thank you for that. That essentially how my involvement in in AIGA started because it wasn't it wasn't long after that that I that I volunteered and then the first the first night I volunteered, I was proposed, you know, a position on the board. That's a whole different story. Yeah, I've
been tripping you.
Yeah. Yeah, but, you know, like what you've done with the community, with the happy hour, it's a warm and inviting place and everybody's, you know, welcome to come and be who they are, and I appreciate that so thank you.
Thank you.
And so I just want to say in you know the best AIGA fashion that I possibly can, cheers!
What are you having? Cheers.
I am having Nocino Have you heard of Nocino ? No. Okay, so Nocino . Let me have a little drink. Wanna say cheers and have a little drink. So we have a black walnut tree in our backyard and there's a big story about the black walnut tree in our backyard. The lady that owned the house before us had the mayor come and christen this tree, and it's it's 22 feet around. Woah. Gosh. Is that is that circumference? Circum... we're art students. Who knows? Yeah.
Those are numbers.
Where's the geometry folks here? Anyway, it's 22 feet around and there's a plaque. When we bought the house, there was a there was a plaque and a binder that came with this tree.
Oh my gosh. Anyway.
Anyway, my wife found a recipe for a drink called nocino. And during the summer solstice, you take unripened kind of like teenage walnuts off the tree and then process them and then ferment them and then by the winter solstice you have a drink called nocino that, and it's a digestif, it's very herbal. Next time I see you, I'll bring some.
Next happy hour. Yeah, exactly.
Next happy hour, I'll bring some nocino. If you like herbal drinks, you know, it's not something you slam. It's not like you you don't wanna do jager bombs with this kind of stuff.
You don't slam them.
Well, I don't, yeah. Maybe somebody else will that's sitting on a bed, I don't know. Has that joke died? Have I killed it? Just killed it? I put it to bed as a- Oh. Okay, that was the last one. That was the last one. Anyway, I could tell you more about Nochino and the whole process and more about my tree, but
I love it.
That's what that is.
Very nice well I'm having a Pimms cup which is also herbal and
I'm having hot tea which is also herbal because I'm sitting
all the way around
Wendy, was so nice meeting you and such a joy to laugh with you. Oh, yes. I'm so excited about what you guys are doing in Seattle and just your overall attitude and just bringing back the community. I'm quite honored to have this interview, so thank you.
Oh, well, you. I'm very honored. Yay. Thank you so much. Thank you again. It was great to join you. Thank you. I really appreciate it. Alright. Talk to you later. Alright.
Bye. Bye bye. Cheers and Tiers. We'll be back next time with more design leadership tales retold.
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Cheers and Tiers Design Leadership Tales Retold is a production of chapter two and hosted by us, Rachel Elnar and Erik Cargill. This episode was produced and edited by Rachel Elner. Podcast graphics by Erik Cargill. Animation by Verso Design and Megatoe Design.
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