The opinions expressed by Chayo Busquets are supported by his extensive experience as a family therapist and in the previous analysis of the cases presented here welcome. This is Chayo with you. In jewels. We begin very good afternoon to everyone as I am Chayo Busquets, this Chayo with you and we are ready to start today' s program. We' re going to have a program that I ' ve already started announcing to you since last week and I already have it
on social media today. I put them there, then, that we' re going to have this program and I' m especially happy to have this program on a holiday, because it' s going to allow these women who are either pregnant or wanting to get pregnant, or they' ve just given birth or not so recently, but they just don' t feel good. Today we' re going to talk a little bit about it and that they can be accompanied with their family, with their partner, so that they can
get acquainted with everything we' re going to talk about today. Because, in fact, many times in pregnancy or postpartum delivery, there are many symptoms, from physical to emotional, that we don' t just know where to accommodate and that sometimes can even give pity, can give guilt because what happened. If I wanted to have this beautiful and wonderful creature and now it turns out that I don' t jump from emotion, what happens to me.
Well, let' s talk about all this. She is with us the psychologist and doctor in psychology, Tania Villanueva, and I especially thank her for coming to participate here with us, because she is a survivor of depression and postpartum anxiety. It sounds to them, they have heard it, it approached them, or or or at some point in their lives. Well, that ' s what we' re talking about today. So Tania, welcome Hi, chayo. Thank you very much and thank you for the invitation and this
opportunity. No, thanks to you, and most of all, I appreciate your sharing. Since I asked him how I' m going to introduce you, he told me as a survivor of depression and postpartum anxiety, and that I thank you immensely, because I think he already gives a door along with the profession that you have and that you do a little bit of that and here we' re going to talk about it today. What the hell is depression of anxiety is invented by the chiptile moms who just gave birth and want
attention what a very good question you look at. Usually the term postpartum pressure is used to encompass as a bunch of as you said symptoms or manifestations of discomfort in moms who have just had a baby u. These can actually be because of a hormonal issue. The first two weeks. It' s usually a matter of hormones. Not where a change is not known eh as drastic in the whole life of the human being as the one that occurs in pregnancy
and with the hormonal change in the postpartum. So, well, the first few weeks, there' s an upset there, and that, as you say, not being Chippy, they don' t cry so much. Not the first two weeks can be part of this adaptation like our body, not to that hormonal change, but sometimes that of that sadness, that desire to cry a lot bad humor. There may also be little desire to do things,
not as if this one felt super tired, that good. Besides, of course there' s a lot physically, but there' s something in this tiredness that' s a little different. Not then all of this has been called postpartum do and depression and can be as a sadness and as a discouragement, but it can also be anxiety, a constant over- concern about any issue that has to do with the baby, about hygiene, for example, at home and around what the child occupies. Anyway, there' s
like a lot of going. You can go for a bunch of ice creams and say technically they have different names, they' re not different diagnoses, but they' ve been covered a lot, like in postpartum depression. But there may be anxiety, there may be an obsessive compulsive disorder in rare cases. But if there are registered, there' s postpartum psychosis, anyway, there' s a variety of that there' s being there is and we ' ll talk about it. But you jumped rather. I jumped in with
my question straight to childbirth. No and to this postpartum and depression or postpartum anxiety a little, so you shared with me since you arrived another little, because it is what is most familiarly heard, that comes to pass. But that' s not how it starts. Birth starts by getting you pregnant, let' s go back to pregnancy and it' s normal and it' s not normal. When if anyone has to say this thing here that'
s happening, I need to see what' s going on. That' s also a big question and I also like how you connect not postpartum. But of course, before there was something and although we know a lot about postpartum depression, or it is the one that is most commonly talked about when there is depression, postpartum in pregnancy there were already the first signs of emotional
discomfort, which are generally overlooked. Okay. Then it is expected to say embraces are more sensitive, not that there is as an easier cry, that situations are lived as more emotionally intensely. And so, uh, that' s considered normal. Not then, oh, well, it' s the hormones. Oh, well, it' s the baby' s emotion.
Oh, well, that' s the way it goes, not that it ' s women and their hormones that we culturally even evaluate quite aha eh, but if the discomfort, it often starts eh since pregnancy and the way we can see how this is no longer very normal. This is no longer the cry of I' m very sensitive. It' s not when, for example, I start to lose my taste for my activities, uh, not that I used to get a lot of anxieties all the pleasure, when I have little energy, when I start to sleep badly, let' s not
talk later. That' s why you' ve already conquered me, of course, you have to sleep and sleep well. Or we' re back here in Chayo with you and talking to Dr Tania Villanueva. She is a doctor in psychology and expert in all these things of pregnancy, postpartum and so on, and we had started to talk Tania about this as a context of how suddenly the discomforts begin and when the discomforts are no longer normal discomforts, because it seems that you are pregnant. And then you have to put up
with everything. Don' t hold it all, because it' s pregnancy. It doesn' t become the easy answer to be giving him jef and I would even tell you when you said well, we started with because I did it saying good before postpartum, there was labor. Let' s go back. Right now you mentioned these as comments. That' s where they ' re some of the women. It' s women' s hormones. There is some connection between the premenstrual syndrome that many women suffer and how it
will go in pregnancy. Then you have nothing to do with it, yes and it' s not like a direct complan relationship. But it has been seen that those who present as more discomfort in the premonstral phases, premenstrual history, if they are people who can be as more susceptible in the psychological emotional part to hormonal changes and then present later this m ok yes, what about it, with the pregnancy, then there is. Yes, there are physical
and emotional discomforts, either one or the other or both. Or it' s a rule. It' s not a rule. And something I like to say a lot every time I talk about this topic, how good to me if it means a lot to me. But it is how we are also forgotten that every story and every woman and every pregnancy is also different, what we live, different. Then we can' t just assume that if
one thing comes up there' s gonna be another. Or what every circumstance in which a pregnancy occurs moves different things into a woman' s mind, into her emotions, and into the circumstances that are surrounding also everything that is happening with her working life, as a couple and so on and, if well, the most common discomforts of pregnancy, especially when it is the first
case not when she is the first baby to have a woman. Eh what is usually presented is a lot of worry, there is a lot of anguish and again there is a normal part where Í m ejaculating you, because Í m facing something very big for the first time and Í m nervous, no, but theré s another part where this concern can, for example, as I told you a long time ago, take away your sleep, that is, you may start spending all day with a thought that
we can say obsessive, not or it́ s very repetitive, very constant, that doesń t let you think much about other things or about everything that can happen no, and theý re usually thoughts that go towards the
negative, not like catastrophic scenarios. Let' s say not that such that something goes wrong in childbirth, how about that right now something that I' m doing is wrong for my baby that such that my emotions at the moment are causing, uh a damage not to my son how much so that I ' m not going to make a good mom, that such that it changes a lot the relationship with my husband, because already from now on I notice that things start to be different, that such that they don' t help
me, that such that at work I don' t fuck myself there are a lot of things and I tell you a part, those concerns are very valid. But when they already start to do something that they don' t let you enjoy the rest of the pregnancy, you can' t live it also from the beauty of this transformation, because we can already start thinking perhaps to someone who would like to approach a therapeutic environment where he works, what
is all that that is moving him. No, what' s going out there and the part of the dream I' m going to say again, because stopping sleeping can be at the end. Above all, it is said well, pregnant women stop sleeping in a hurry, because the position is already comfortable. The body such, but there is something that is also the head. I mean, I' m thinking all the time. I feel like I' m very active all the time mentally and I can' t figure
out how to turn off that head activity. And that is already another of these signs. And for the most important reason that we should attend to that as soon as possible is because also the lack of sleep is a very strong factor in presenting later also depression and postpartum anxiety ok is that, like everything, we are discovering how one thing is related to another in our history process. We' re going back with more of this and we' re also
going to talk back from nothing else. We' re worried. There' s a reality if things could happen for this little guy and you have to take precautions. I say one that comes to mind a lot is often folic acid, for example, we' re not going to talk about that too. You' re properly taking care of everything you have to attend to, what we have to be with on this good Earrings. With regard to the growth and development of the baby, yes, we need to have adequate,
balanced feeding. Now there is also a topic with this new forms of feeding, but well, proteins, for example, in pregnancy you need a lot of good fat protein consumption. Not that also helps the development of the baby ' s brain. Em we need to go periodically to doctor' s consultations and when there are, for example, contractions ahead of time. Some are normal, but also depending on the intensity and frequency n degrees if there were
bleeding. And all these things are and indicators that we have to always keep in mind, not when the baby is already moving and we feel it good, when we already feel it, because they can move from more or less soon, but when we can already feel it being no longer super pending every second, but if you have a normal rhythm of usually moving a little bit in the evenings, then be aware that this continues to happen to the extent that it has happened for us previously and when it has not, then,
yes, it is important to call the specialist gynecologist asnos orienta you coordinate a talk group of this. Yeah, and I coordinate a circle of moms,
mom circles, Tuesdays is a day a week. We do it in a virtual way and the idea is that women who are pregnant or in the postpartum period can meet with other women who are in these stages as well and talk about how they are doing, their experience, with these changes, with everything they are living, how they feel about the family, the couple, friends. Sometimes they like to hear the cute part. I don' t feel
super happy. I' m so excited. I' m very excited and that' s a very important part, not in the maternity project, but there may also be days that I feel so distressed about bad, uh, I don' t know, uh, a little nervous, worried when there
' s some discomfort. That is very difficult to communicate to anyone, not even health personnel, for example, gynecologist, gynecologist no. Sometimes they are very focused on the body part, no, and when a mom tries to communicate from the emotional part, they don' t always know how to respond to this. Then women, when they begin to have this, this other experience that is not expected, because they can feel very alone and very guilty.
Not what' s happening to me, because I feel this. Maybe there' s something wrong with me, no, and circles help us listen to other women who can say don' t look. We' ve all felt that way at some point. That' s how it went for me.
I was able to solve it this way and what I do in the Group is not only eh, because allowing this contact between them and the support that they can give themselves if we do not also work relaxation tools, not strategies with breathing, and also e and make us expectations more real, because many times part of the discomfort comes from the idealization of motherhood in magic,
the exact magic. So much we can land in our reality and in our circumstances this new event and e and well, because we go together, not as walking the path of motherhood, together that becomes much richer, much more full, with less guilt, with less sense of loneliness. These are precious experiences. Yes, and above all I' m thinking about whether this is an ordinary pregnancy and it can generate all those suspicions in our treacherous mind.
Now I don' t even want to think if you had an unwanted pregnancy, if you had a pregnancy outside the time when your family was waiting for you, not if your partner didn' t answer the question and you stayed as a single mother. Let' s do it. How useful it can be to have an echo in a group like the one you coordinate. I have the phone here for whatsapp or call in case they' re interested in
this group you' re talking about. Tania is called mom' s circles and the phone is fifty- six, thirty- seven eight, zero eight, forty- one fifty- six, thirty- seven, eight, zero eight, forty- one. I' m going to put it on social networks too so that everyone has access to the phone and you don' t lose anything because, besides everything, I have extraordinary news for you. It ' s free. They are groups that meet in a virtual way. You don' t have a problem with distance. You can do it from your
cell phone, from your computer. The thing that best suits you and Tania is the one in front. So we' re going to ask you back to talk to us a little bit more about this subject so you can just give yourself an animated Tania. I' m pregnant. I' m in
labor I' ve got the best of things I can. They spend those fifteen days that you told us about at the beginning of the program, where what may be a mismatch as a result of our body being accommodated and adapting to the fact that once again we are no more, not two, but they follow the symptoms and I don' t feel well anymore, no, no more physically emotionally and I don' t want to even imagine that anxiety that must give of then not that the creature was going to be the happiest
woman in the world and besides I was going to give myself identity because I am a mother, no and women or we are mothers to many people yet or we are nothing. And then it turns out that I don' t feel that instinctive love, not that they say it exists. So the first thing is whether or not there is that absolute love for the baby and second, what happens when a woman starts to feel that way? Look, I
like this question a lot too. There' s no such love is not instinctive, the love for the baby is not eh, because it came out of my body. Then I love him forever is, like all human relationships, something that needs to be built. It' s a very, very particular relationship that doesn' t look like the others, because, in fact, how we bond with the idea of that person who' s coming and who, in fact, is inside of us at the beginning. It'
s, uh, they give special characteristics to this bond. But finally that ' s a link where, at the beginning, the baby doesn' t have so much chance to express, for example, it' s not then for the mom to build it for her baby, not to destroy this for both at the time of breastfeeding, of hugging, of talking to them to
look them in the eyes. All this is forming and many times what can happen is the frustration of saying woe, for I thought that I was already going to have it here and that I was going to feel incredible and suddenly I see it and I don' t even know who is no, who is this stranger or is unknown. That can be difficult. No e then, well, there' s no such thing and a little bit of what I was talking about before I landed expectations and being more in reality, because
it' s a first step to understanding this. We are not going to build that relationship with our sons, daughters, nothing is going to be given. Of course, now another thing that is very important and that I also like to talk about it a lot and remind the moms a lot in the circles and in all the spaces that I can accept is that, as in all human relations, all human relationships are built up have eh a diversity of
emotions around and motherhood can generate a lot of ivalence. Motherhood can feel a lot of love and a lot of closeness and desire, for example, to take care of and be close to the baby, but at the same time feel some rejection and some discomfort. They may feel sad because beyond hormonal, they have changed a lot of things in life. If there were no babies, well, the change from just being two in a couple and suddenly having
a third is very strong. Routine change everything changes a lot and that can generate anger sometimes or sadness, and that' s also em It' s okay to feel it, because no, and the problem can come when we start judging by having this other part. No, not just feeling love. And that' s what we' re going to talk about coming back, because it' s very important how you treat yourself and what you allow and what not of the others' treatment of You when you' re there totally.
I was asking you Tania, okay, I already peed the postpartum. I' m in the postpartum, I' ve lived this situation. I don' t make up, I feel bad and I' m blaming myself for what we have to do to be more merciful to ourselves and what limits we would have to put to others when they make comments out of place. How important is the issue of boundaries. But, well, let' s start with ourselves. The first is to remember that there will be no equal
maternity. There will be no equal experiences, something that I also think is very important to keep in mind, not to compare with other moms, with other things, with the maternity ideals that there are on social networks, that we find on the Internet, where everything seems to be under control and perfect.
That' s not real. So let' s also land that part and don' t judge ourselves from there, from the external reference, not since I' m going to compare myself to us and then I' ll say oh it' s not that she' s better, Mom, it ' s that she' s better, it' s that she can do that and I can' t. And that' s a good first step
to becoming more merciful. The other is to understand that this experience of motherhood well, is a challenge of the greatest that there can be and, as I told you, each one lives differently and there are many who do not have an incredibly good time. And that' s fine. Repeat it. It' s okay with you guys. Not good at motherhood. That' s a very important thing. Yes, with all the good intentions of the world, they make them around us to try to encourage us and not to
tell us things they shouldn' t say. Look. There' s a lot of stuff. A fair one is that sometimes it is the others who compare us. There can be no women who intend as if the mother who is not having a good time, and thank or value some things that she has in her favor. What he does is discredit his experience. Then tell him don' t be sad. You have everything, you already have your baby You could be very happy, or I had it very difficult. I
had only one of you. I had six and I washed my hand and I had no one to help me and I don' t know what. I' m not everything. All comparisons must be avoided. Please, always another thing is the thing that people do with very good intention, but since they don' t know what, another way to help and that is, to a woman who is having a hard time, you can, you can, don' t be sad, don' t be angry. So, when we say this, we' re denying what a person is living that
we want this one of the worst things we can do. So the most important thing for those around us, if they' re listening to us, if they know someone so a mom who' s suffering from this start of motherhood, the best they can do for them to tell her I' m here with you, you' re not alone and ask her what I can help you with, how you need me to support you, that' s what and listen to them without judging, giving advice, without trying to solve
anything. Listen to what they have to say and ask them what you need to fear how can I help you? Remind them that you love them and that you are not alone, that you are there for them and well, for the moms. We find it very difficult to set the limit. Sometimes not because he who tells us these things, because they are close people and we know well- intentioned. Then it can be hard to tell someone hurts me what you tell me, or this doesn' t help me right now.
Please, please don' t tell me this, but we have to try we also have to practice in the most loving way possible we also say thank you very much this could help me in such then also give, as an alternative to the person, thank the intention with which comes his comment and ask Sometimes we also find it hard to ask for support. She' d like me not to know that you' re going with me to see a psychologist, a psychologist to help me, because housework is going beyond me between
the baby and this. Please help me with the dishes today, or help me pick up my big son at school today so I can get some sleep sometimes we need to say. We don' t know how to ask, We don' t know how to ask clearly we lack to go into more detail with how it is treated when already suspect someone who has postpartum depression that that actually already merits the diagnosis, because that is already a diagnosis, it is no longer a series of characteristics that we say to him, it is
a diagnosis. What' s to be done, Tania? It' s very important to go with a psychologist, psychologist, ideally someone who specializes in perinatal psychology. Okay, I' ve heard about women I' ve worked with who psychologists and psychologists don' t have this specialty. Many times they miss this diagnosis m because there are a number of criteria that do not always meet. Postpartum depression has many faces and generally in the more general formation of
psychology, since some are not known, but another is left aside. So, yes, yes, it would be important if you have the possibility that it was someone with that specialty is the best thing, or someone good, because you have this experience not working with women in these stages, eh just there, in interview with specialists, because we can already know if the diagnosis, in fact, is a depression, some anxiety, because already some disorder
not at this stage or if it is making an emotional crisis what is derived from the change. But this, this difference, is very difficult to make for someone who doesn' t have like this, or because it' s important to make the difference changes. Yes, it is a depression I postulate that it is an emotional alteration the consequence of such a clear strong experience as having a child treatment, how you will treat the case depends on how what
we are saying is our diagnosis. No. When there is a diagnosis of postpartum depression, it is often necessary to strengthen therapy, the therapeutic part with some pharmacological part. Many times it is necessary are antidepressants, antidepressants, no yes, anxiety also controls it with antidepressants. This is important and sometimes generates as a lot of confusion or a lot of fear to say how you are going to medicate with this type of drugs to a woman who is breastfeeding or
not seeing, living, living, exact adaptation process. But it' s important that you know, because sometimes it' s also the reason why we don' t come with a specialist, because it' s the fear how much they tell me that if I have depression and then they' re either going to take me away from my baby or they want to intern me, they' re fantasies, no and fears, or how much so that the medication they give me has me asleep all day and then I can' t
take care of my baby or how much the medication is bad for my baby and it' s going to happen to him through my milk. In principle, I tell you there are medicines that have been tested and are safe for breastfeeding and that are good. Recently came out the first e, the first drug that is specially designed for postpr WOW depression, but that works itself amazing. It' s not going to commercialize yet, but yes, but we
' re on our way. It is completely ignored that this, that this exists, is sometimes ignored with it knowledge and we ignore it or because you don' t have the information and the poor woman doesn' t know what the hell is happening to her. Yeah, Wow, Wow, Oh, Tania, No, well, yeah, as you can see, all this information was more than necessary for you to be aware and able to. Above all, and as I say to you, as a woman, always validate
yourself. Start by validating yourself because you won' t validate the other one. If you' re not valid, you' re probably already aware of my pregnant nonsense. Not if you' re saying it yourself, then what respect the one in front of me will have to say, hey, don
' t wait for me. You are in a temporary situation in which millions of things are happening in your body beyond realizing that already in itself, but there are a number of alterations that are very important, that take into consideration, that validate them and that ask to be respected about this is temporary.
So you have to live with that. The result is something that we want, because we want, that we want it to work out as best as possible and that, somehow, makes us enter a next stage of life, because we are not going to go back to what was before. That' s for sure, but enter a better stage of life standing and in the best position. Tania, I think it' s the greatest wish we can give to a fully pregnant woman. And I' m glad you said temporary.
Sometimes there' s the fear of already too. I' m never gonna be okay, I' m never ever gonna be me again, I ' m never gonna be emotionally, mentally balanced, and that' s in doubt, with the right treatment, things are gonna be okay again. For this it is good, because I remind you that Tania coordinates this group of breast circles, which is virtually a day of the week, a time of time, connected with other people in the same circumstances, with whom you can
talk about what in other contexts you cannot. So I give you the data again. It' s already on social media, but I' ll give you the data again. Fifty- six, thirty- seven, eight, zero- eight, forty- one, fifty- six, thirty- seven, eight, eight, forty- one can send whatsapp or call for information about mom circles. Don' t let the opportunity pass, they' re
getting really rich. Self- help groups all their lives have been very famous for the huge impact they have and Ti Tania thank you so much for coming to discuss these issues with us. Thank you very much. To Ti Chayo a taste and then good. I want to go xavi shando that the week that enters Easter week major in our country we will have a series of programs to all s Mondays, Tuesdays and Wednesdays. The programmes will be aimed at
their children and adolescents. What problems do they have, what handling tips can be given to them. Anyway, everything that has to do with this. On Monday, in particular, we' re going to talk about whether your parents got divorced, if they already told you that they' re going to split up, how to deal with the conflict they have and if they' re already divorced, they' re already separated and now they have a new partner, how and what if it' s up to you and not,
and how you can adapt and help understand those circumstances. Tuesday how to handle conflicts that arise at home and what happens to bullying at school, how you can face it and, above all, identify what role you play in bullying at school, because this is addressed to everyone. Wednesday we' re going to talk about what happens when you feel sorry to speak in public and you have to give the class, present the project. Well, some strategies, how to handle it, how to do it, and how to handle it
Plus, the mockery and the joke that others can do to you. There ' s a lot of skills I' m going to recommend. And Thursday and Friday notice that they have asked a lot again for the program we had with our Taritron couple therapist of what are those things that impact a couple relationship in a significant way. And she talked about seven skills that we don'
t have to acquire to not spoil our couple relationship. And on Good Friday we will repeat the program that we had now in commemoration of Women' s Day, with our dear neurophysiologist Eduardo Calixto, who came to talk about why a woman stays in a violent relationship, Despite this, to be having a hard time, what happens Neurologically speaking, have asked for those two programs very much. So let' s take advantage of it and in Easter, Thursday
and Friday we will repeat them to you. That' s what you' ll see We' ve got a super week ready. The week that comes in, let' s notify your children because they' re going to be pure tips and recommendations directly for them and well with this we get to the end of the program. I' m Chayo Busquets. This was Chayo with you until tomorrow here at 1: 00 in Chayo with you Audio Center