I love words. Standing alone in a sentence, working together, playing off each other. It's why I admire great writers. Words are just letters, but they can move you, consume, entertain, enlighten, even frighten you. Words are constructive and destructive and everything in between. I even have favorite words. For me, the words I love the most are the ones that spark my imagination. This is just an outcome or can curate or compress an entire series of
events. One of my favorite words is impact. I'm not talking about its application of physics when two things collide. My passion is for people who positively impact the lives of others, impact their communities, their country, and and even our planet. And the ones I admire most do so without recognition or need for validation or reward. These are the people who remind us that life isn't a dress rehearsal, that we have a choice to make things happen
or to simply wonder what happened. They put a dent in our universe and not one that needs to be prepared, but one that needs to be fertilized to create conditions for more success, for more humanity. My guest today is making that type of impact. His name is John Cornish. I was tackled, smashed, thrown on the bounds a 1000 times. What happens when you get hit? You get back up. And what's the number one
football rule? The only play that matters is the next one and that's a rule of football, and that's a rule of life too. If you're a Canadian Football League fan, you'll know him as an all star running back. Handoffs, Cornhus, touchdown. Couple of Canadians have hit major. A Canadian hall of famer. If you happen to be a student at the University of Calgary, you'll know him as your chancellor, and he's the youngest to hold that title in Canada
and one of the youngest to hold it in North America. If you live in Calgary, Alberta, you might be inspired by his work as the founder of Calgary Black Chambers. The second we put him into that box, oh, he's black. He's a football player. All of a sudden, we start limiting what that person is. It's an organization John founded to serve as a mentorship and advocate, fostering the growth of black students and future professionals. This is Chatter That Matters with Tony Chapman presented by RBC.
John Cornish is an Impact player. And, John Cornish, welcome to Chatter That Matters. Thanks for having me, Tony. I really enjoyed getting to know you sort of as this voyeur. We had a lot of things to unpack, but maybe we'll start at the beginning. You're born in New West New Westminster, British Columbia. That's right. Five kids, and your mom was sort of the sole provider on a music teacher's salary. I'm always fascinated by that. We kinda grew up in a
similar situation, and I never thought we were poor. But if you if you ever had done the balance sheet we were, how did it work out for your group? My mom, I consider her an entrepreneur now. I didn't necessarily know that term when I was young, but she made it work by first teaching piano, which she, she was stacked up like almost all my friends in high elementary school and
high school went to see her for piano lessons. But then she ended up, working as a music director at 2 different churches, and then she got a calling to the church. And then sort of by the time I was entering high school, she was already done her studies and she was a curate at the Christ Church Cathedral in Vancouver. So, you know, she managed to make it all work somehow.
And did any of your friends ever go on to be somebody in the music world or any of her students that she kinda looked at and said, I remember when I had to sort of slap them to do their scales and now look at them? I am not aware of any. I know my sister did really well. You know, she she got all the levels, and she became a music teacher herself. And now she's continued the family tradition. But I'm not too sure about, you know,
those those success cases. I'll have ask my mom about it next time. I love the fact that she goes on and becomes an Anglican priest. And then one of the other stories I loved about her, because you speak so so fondly about her, is that you come home on a Christmas break, and she's got this big smile on her face. And you kinda go, you know, did you meet someone? And she goes, yes, with a big smile. And you ask, well, what's he like? And what did she say? The the sparkle in her
eye, you know, extra big smile. I didn't really know, what was going on, but she said that, you know, it's a she, took a second to process it. Okay, what's she like? And that's Andrea. Now Andrea has been part of my life 22 years. Wow. And I love the story about Andrea. And your your mom flies back, and we're gonna get into the fact that people you don't I've I've talked to earlier in the opening about, you know, hall of famer and stuff in the
CFL. But the other story I loved about your mom, she flies back from Israel. It's an important game, and I think you're getting you won CFL's most outstanding Canadian. And in your speech, you thank your 2 monks. Yeah. You know, it was it was funny because my mom didn't actually watch me play too much football in my early days. High school, none. And then, eventually she came down and watched a few in Kansas. But her and Andrea, Andrea was a Tiger Cats fan,
growing up. So she was a natural CFO fan. My mom became more and more of a CFO fan. And now they they watch a lot of the games. They follow the stamps. They follow the the tie cats. But to have them there, you know, I have their their picture right here, of that day. And, you know, somebody I remember this. Somebody pointed at Andrea's, you know, she looks so proud of you, John. And it
was it was a pretty proud moment. It was a a a long time coming in terms of my football career, having sort of, you know, restarted at the bottom, and then worked my way up in the CFO. She must have looked at your hands all the time as a piano teacher going, what are you doing risking him on the football field each time? So, you know, it was it's funny. I think she understood where my calling was. Okay. Well, he's he's pretty good at this.
May maybe he'll make something of it kind of idea. And then she sort of relaxed on the, taking care of the fingers and hands. Although, eventually, and it is self inflicted. I I did I did bust my pinky a little bit. It doesn't bend all the way straight anymore, but what can you do? Well, pianist is probably not in your future anyways. Kinda gonna play offense, defense here,
and go back to your elementary school. Another article, you describe yourself as the only black kid, and in high school, you described yourself as an Oreo, black on the outside, white on the inside. And I'd love you to just talk about, was this an identity crisis for you, or was this part of the superpower that you take later on in life that you found a way to be who you are versus be defined by the fact that you didn't necessarily look like everybody?
Well, I mean, it started in my household. I was the only black kid, visibly black kid in a household of 5 kids. When my mom, I mean, one of the ways she made it work, I never had a babysitter. I had my older siblings. I very frequently went out with them and I was always pretty big, when I was a little kid. So I, I tended to fit in quite well, but I was the only black kid. And that was the case with my older siblings, friends, and then going to
elementary school, very much the same thing. I think I can count on one hand the number of, incidents that could be considered racist to me in in highest in elementary school, But I never defined myself as an Oreo. When I got to high school, that was an epithet given to me, by the black kids that I'm now around because they heard me speak. Oh, I see. I read it I read it completely differently. I said you describe yourself. So this is, you had to find your own space because you're not one of
us and not one of them. And now later in life, I understand that it's sort of that intersectionality, where, you know, you're not black, you're not white. So, so what are you? And now there's, there's many mixed people and you see people all the time, but there was a time and it was difficult for my mom and her parents after I was born. It was a bit of a surprise that I was black. We're gonna leave your youth in a minute, but I I love the story about
when you started at sort of the Lou Marsh Trophy. I guess you're obviously very athletic, presented that Canada's best athlete, and it's always going to people like Mary Lou and Wayne Gretzky and stuff. Canada is a ice hockey nation, but then Donovan Bailey comes around and he changes everything. Yeah. For for me, I mean, I I got to see a black person win this award. And I was a big Mario Lemieux
fan, Wayne Gretzky fan. So I knew this award, the Lou Marsh existed, but I had never seen anybody that looked like me win it. And when I saw Donovan Bailey win it after, you know, having set the record in the 100 meter and then beating Michael Johnson in the 150 meter race to officially properly take the title as world's fastest person. It was at that point I was just, you know, I think I could do something like that. I this was sort of before football. I had run track,
done pretty well in that space. So I thought there's a possibility of of being able to do something. But then that idea sort of stuck. I didn't know what sport it was gonna be, where it was gonna take me, but that was something I wanted to do. And so you go to the University of Kansas. You go to the University of Kansas to play football, going after a degree in psychology, and once again, you're the only, this time, the only Canadian on the team. And Kansas isn't
you know, that's a big football world. What made you choose that university, and how did you get them to realize that having a Canadian in the team was to their advantage, not a disadvantage? I sent out a 100 VHS tapes. Right? There's no YouTube. There's no like this is free DVD burners and stuff like that. So I had to send my tape out. I spent hours in the UPS store. Side note, I actually recently saw again the UPS clerk that helped us ship off those
100 VHS tapes and in sequential visits. And they remembered me because I'd spent hours there. But because I sent all all that tape and I gotta say, you know, if you search John Cornish old school on YouTube, you will see my high school football tape. It was pretty good. Most of the schools I sent it to accepted, scholarships, including Stanford, who I I didn't quite get past the academics there. I had some outstanding French grades, but I had family in Kansas.
So when Kansas came to visit me, they sent some coaches up. I met them great time. That's what really solidified my choice there. My mom's mom, her brother set up shop down in Iowa. He taught at Graceland College as well as the University of Iowa and Iowa State University. So he had his family and kids there. They moved down to Kansas City, and all of a sudden, I have family in the Kansas, Missouri, Iowa area. And that would that's what sealed the
deal for me in Kansas. I I remember I had Jesse Palmer on the show, went down to play the Gators. I Andre De Grasse has gone on. He's got a scholarship in the states. And they describe it as some of the best times of their life. But before we get into the experience, I I was shocked at just how much you put out in terms of numbers. 2 time MVP, won a bowl game. I mean, you crushed your time down there, but you also, in one interview,
described there's times you were in the doghouse. But instead of really kinda complaining or barking or being this sort of snubbed athlete, you said that was also an important part of defining who you were. So what did you learn about who you are in in university besides shattering these records? I had the opportunity to go down to Kansas actually a few weeks ago. They invited me down to raise a flag before a football game. It was pretty incredible, to see them. They were ranked at the time. It
was very exciting. But I got to remember all those things that I did when I wasn't playing football. The small island in the middle of a 3 lane road allowing a crosswalk, that was my spearheaded effort as a student senator. My time as a student senator also led to the campus having Wi Fi back in 2004. Right? That was a, you know, part of the housing committee, Jayhawk Towers Association, homecoming committee. I was on in a fraternity, and it like, I had such a
incredible experience outside of football. I was in the dog house most certainly, but that sort of gave me some space to really discover who I am. And so going back, I got to remember, I was like, I am still this person today. Yeah. I always had football, but I always had my other things at the same time. You must be very proud that every year the best Canadian in the NCAA wins the John Cornish Trophy. So I won the, the inaugural year of the BC Football Player of the Year, BC High School
Football Player of the Year. Appreciated that. But at that point, it'd be really cool to have a trophy named after me someday. So that idea, you know, took that, put it on the shelf, never thought about it again. But then there were some people talking, I was gonna get into the hall of fame. You know, let's let's bring some recognition to these Canadian athletes that don't get as much recognition as they should playing college football
down the street. They asked me if I wanted to be a part of that. I was absolutely sure. Because, you know, it's been incredible to see how far Canadians game has come since this trophy has come out. And since when I went down, we had from BC, we had 4 athletes. Now we had we shipped 30, 40 athletes a year down in the States to get a great education and play the game they love. So I'm glad this trophy once a year, My mom gets her Google alerts. She loves it. Yeah. It's it's it's a great
honor, and I'm happy to be a part of it. Before we get into your CFL and what brought you into the hall of fame, I'm why weren't you drafted in the NFL with the kind of numbers you put up? I had no real desire to play in the NFL. It was weird, right? Like I had to juggle the 2 ideas. Going into the NFL as an undrafted person, I had 24 offers to join teams, undrafted. Or go up to the CFL where I thought there was a greater potential to, win the Lou
Marsh. Unfortunately, I didn't realize that there was a really good player in Calgary already, Joffrey Reynolds. So so I came up. There's a set up shop. You know, he was doing well, you know, setting the all time stamp, Peter's records and stuff, and I was just running the bench. So all that to say, don't regret a thing. I do wanna say this though. When I finished college, I was number 5 in the nation. You've heard of 2 running backs in my draft class, Adrian Peterson and Marshawn
Lynch. And there was 5 other guys taken, and you never heard their names once. When I looked at your stats, and I I mean, I was a massive CFL fan in the days of Tom Cousineau and Billy White, Hugh Johnson, the Montreal Alouettes kind of rebirth. And, I used to love the Hamilton tie cats. You know? I mean, CFL was everything. But when I looked at these numbers, 9 seasons for the Calgary Stampeders, 6.7 yard average per carry, unless I've got my math wrong and I'm completely
out of date, those are those are just right off the charts. 3 straight 1000 yard seasons, 3 consecutive most outstanding Canadian awards, 1 most outstanding player honor, and 2 Grey Cups. I'm glad you chose Canada because you must you electrified a lot of games, and you must have made the fans just so happy that you're a part of their an incredible franchise. Yeah. I I was really lucky to be drafted by
the Calgary Stampeders. I, I still give Wally Buono, the the BC Lions head coach, a lot of grief because he had 3 opportunities to draft me in the CFL, and he didn't. He John's gonna go to the NFL. He always tells me that. But I loved my time here and don't regret it, for a second. In fact, you know, I consider Calgary a sticky city. I came here, met my wife, built a huge friend base. It's incredible. And I do want to say this in particular, the Calgary St. Peters did
one thing unique. They retained me as an ambassador for the team. And in doing so, I've now worked longer for the Stamps as a ambassador than I did as a player. And what that's given me the opportunity to do is interact with so many different people that watched me play and sort of got to see what I did on the field. And then now we get to celebrate the Calgary Stampeders together. It's incredible to have all that stuff and thank you for pointing out the yards per
carry. To put it in context, nobody has been remotely close to that number. 6.2 in a season, great. 6.7 in a career, only one person has done more than that. Willie Fleming in the 70s, you may entire in the history of the CFO. So it was cool to sort of leave my mark, same way I had in high school and in college, you know, get some records, get some awards, and have a good time while
I'm doing it. I mean, I can only imagine your wall of trophies. Is there any one and we talked about the Lew Marsh award that you actually there's something you dreamed about even before you were into football. You win. But is there anything else that stands out for you that says, you know, if I had to take one thing on a desert island, I mean, what what trophy would you bring that sorta exemplifies who you are and why you
feel you matter? I'm not really sure a trophy would be the best thing to bring to a deserted island, but if I was forced to pick 1, it would be my 1st college MVP. So this is the team MVP, MVP, the John Hadel award, one of the all time greats at the University of Kansas. But I picked this one because like we discussed, the
dog house. Coach, the head coach at the time, he, you know, one time he asked me in the middle of a team meeting after I had sort of, chuckled at him calling out another player, John Cornish, where are you on the depth chart? I was like, 8th coach. That's right. You're gonna stay there. Right? And then the following season, I helped the team win his 1st bowl game in a decade. And then, you know, set the record the following year, get an MVP twice, that that's that's a special
something to that. How how important is, maybe the word spite's the wrong way, but when somebody kinda tries to push you back and, you know, put you in your place, how motivating is that? Because a lot of young people get pushed back, and a lot of people just fall back on their back feet. But there's people like you that somehow or other say I'll prove you're wrong. I think it's fundamental to who I am in that, I have this core, I am who I am and, you know, I've been cussed out before
is what I told my wife. You know, it's just one of those things, you know, like, you got cussed out in high school and college, and, you know, as a professional and then as a employee, these things happen. Why they're gonna happen. Why let that affect you? I think there's too many people allow outside things to affect them. And that's never, I've been blessed or or really lucky or however it goes. Be resilient to, outside forces. I wanna move now to what I think is some of the the best
work you're doing. But just before I finish, there's one other thing that I thought was one of those, you know, the gifted athletes somehow managed to do, which is against all odds. 2014, you're knocked out. You missed 9 games. You come back. How many games have you got left in the season? There's 9 games or 8 games, basically. I played in 1, and I finished it last day. Yeah. And you win the rushing title. Take your team to the
gray cup. At running back from the University of Kansas, number 9, John Voorhees. I have to believe a lot of players were probably initially doubting if you're ever gonna come back or be at anywhere near that gear, and you somehow or other come back and seem to take it to an even higher gear. I mean, I'd scored a touchdown in that first game. I got knocked out, and then I was able to convince my team doctor that I had in fact not scored a touchdown in
that game. I was pretty afflicted by the concussion. But going back further, after the 2013, western finals loss to the Saskatchewan Roughriders, I consider that day the most spiritual day in my life because I realized something very simple. I mean, I could be the best. I know it's got the Loom Marsh that season, But if you aren't trying to elevate those around you, that is for not. Right? Like who cares about you being the best? Like how good do you do you make the
people around you? And so I came into the 2014 season with that in mind. It wasn't about me being the best, it was about elevating others. Because we had this opportunity to just play. Right? Oh, you know, I'm way back in the rushing lead. Like, I will never get the rushing title. I did not care about it. We didn't care
about anything other than winning the Grey Cup. And that was a real lesson from the 2013 loss was you can win games during season, you can win some playoff games, but the only game that really matters is the Grey Cup. It is my pleasure to present the 100 and second Grey Cup to the Calgary Stampeders. And that was the mentality that we came in. In 2014, I was selected a team captain for the first time in my professional career.
Right? As a leader, I had the opportunity to set the tone. And I think, you know, even from the sidelines, I was able to do that, and then they decided to keep me around on the sidelines as an ambassador to continue. When we returned, John and I discussed life beyond football. How he travels from hall of famer to mentor to financial advisor, and the work he's doing to motivate and inspire youth. Something that will matter, not only for today, but for decades to come.
Hi. It's Tony Chapman from Chatter That Matters. The world's upside down, and having peace of mind seems to be the exception versus the rule. RBC Wealth Management is hoping to change that. They don't have a crystal ball, but they do have a team of experts dedicated to working with you to preserve and grow your wealth, and help you manage risk so that you can enjoy the rewards of your labor. Your peace of mind and financial health matters to RBC.
This one back from the 20 yard line. The pitch up front to the 10 down to the 5. Touchdown. John Cornish. When I talk about values, it's really about how much you can affect the world around you. Well, I always go back to the words of my great chancellor, Bob Hemingway at the University of Kansas, who said, life isn't about what you do for yourself, it's about what you do for others. And the second we start putting others ahead of ourselves, stop being so selfish. We can really work to
improve the world. You're listening to Chatter That Matters with Tony Chapman presented by RBC. My guest today is John Cornish. He's not only an impact player when he played football, He's making an impact in his community as the founder of Calgary Black Chambers, really looking to level the playing field through advocacy and mentorship to give black professionals a seat at the table.
When did you know it was time to hang up your cleats? Because every athlete I've talked to, they say the thing they miss the most is the camaraderie, the culture. I've even talked to Navy SEALs, and they say the same thing as you'll never replace what happens in a locker field or a battlefield. Did you feel the same way when you when you left the sport? I certainly understood that there was no replacing the locker room. Because I had started working at a bank as a
teller 3 years prior to my retirement. But what that allowed me to do is, you know, build a new team while I was still on my old team. And I think that's a lot a lot of players don't have that opportunity. A lot of players retire and then figure things out. I figured things out and then retired. I wanna get into your the wealth management and banking at the end, but what I also like about what I saw after you left that locker room is this kind of mentality of head, heart, and hands,
really the not for profit. I mean, you've done so much. I mean, the MC for Alberta's Children's Hospital, working with that risk at home, the Woods Home, and then the founder of Calgary, Black Chambers. Was it a sense I I need to give back because the world's been so good to me, or was it maybe the values from your mom? Or what instill that sense? Because a lot of people, with all the swagger you must have had, would have just said, you know, you're lucky that I give you the time.
Well, in 2010, I started volunteering at the Children's Hospital, as a football player going there before game day, the following year, I started volunteering for real as a proper, like, red shirted volunteer at the children's hospital, pushing around the video game cart, playing video games with the kids. It was the second or first Tide, whatever, best experience in my life. The only other thing close to it is Habitat for
Humanity when I was down in Kansas. Building somebody a home and seeing them come into their home for the first time, there's few things like that. But it's been part of the deal. I was raised by my mom and this, you know, serving soup kitchens in the church hall. You know, I I was a student youth services for an entire summer at a church camp. Volunteering has always been part of what I I've done. But then I had 2 mentors
along the way. A chancellor of the University of Kansas who I happen to, you know, become well acquainted with because, you know, football, the late Bob Hemingway said to me, life isn't about what you do for yourself, it's about what you do for others. That always
stuck with me. And then my other mentor, Dan Crawford, you know, the guy that invented the ladder match, the the wrestler who harassed me on the front line of the, of the bank until, you know, we started talking, and now he's one of my closest friends. He told me that every football player, every athlete has a shelf life. So if you're not doing something to the community, you're not
gonna be known for very much longer. So talk to me about the Calgary Black Chambers because instead of just volunteering, you created an organization. You shaped it in terms of what you felt mattered most. So give us a playbook on what you're doing and what you hope people get from it and what you get from it. It was pretty incredible to start it up. Have my wife produce a live YouTube video, for the 1st Calgary Black Achievement Awards. Like, we did that from
our basement. Right? The following year, we put together and organized from top to bottom because this is fully volunteer thing, 300 person sit down dinner at the Calgary Petroleum Club. And then I created my own curriculum for teaching the kids for which we got the Friends of Education Award from the Alberta School Boards Association. Right? It was just, I was doing the things that I'd learned. I learned how to make pitch decks, I had learned how to write grants, and I had learned how to
work hard. And so we did those three things. The Calgary Black Chambers now has raised over $300,000 under the leadership of Chi, Ilya and Duo. And she was a lawyer. She was a vice president when I came in. And then we were encountered a weird situation in that I was asked to be the chancellor of the University of Calgary and RBC was like, you know what, John, just RBC is the bank you work with. That's right. Yeah. So I took the chance to roll, and I had to step
back from the the Calgary Black Chambers. So, you know, we started the organization because my wife, she was a little bit tired of all this, you know, millions of different volunteer roles. You're never really moving the needle forward because you're just here, there, wherever. So it was her idea to start her own thing. And I started running up to black people on the street because that was where the data pointed. That was where the issues were.
Poverty is 3 times rate for black people as it is otherwise. You got people working the same job, 1 black and one not, black guy makes $20,000 less. And this was the most, glaring one for me. Almost a 100% of black kids feel like they can graduate college, only 50% have the financial means to do so. So we tried to tackle those 3 problems, and then we put together a
coalition of people and it's still going strong. Share a story where somebody got handed the ball by you and ran with it, and because they were connected to your organization, have soared versus maybe dropped out because they didn't have the financial means or they didn't have the mentorship? For me personally, you know, this is still sort of in the works, but there's several students at the university that have received scholarships from the Calgary Black Chambers, and there's a few
that have even crossed the stage at convocation. I've built great relationships with these guys as well as they've built their own organizations on campus. They had they brought in the, former president of Ghana. He's the highest, African dignitary, highest ranking African dignitary to ever visit UCalgary. So when you provide support, people pay it forward, and then more good things happen. I think good begets good. And and when there's more people out there that care about each other,
good things happen. So talk to me about the chancellor at the University of Calgary, the youngest Canadian to ever have that role, one of the youngest to have that role in North America. What does that role entail? I'm I'm an ambassador. You know, it's a a slight reframing of that. The chancellor has very formal activities where you're the person that presides over convocation. That's a, I would I wouldn't use the term grueling, but it
is the hardest thing I've ever done in my life. But then there's, you know, working with the senate, that's the university's, volunteers, working with the board of governors, making decisions that actually affect the university. And then the piece I like the most, just just getting to go to the different events and have a good time. And I really like the speaking engagement pieces, because it's, that's what that's what I love to do. I feel like I can help
people with my voice, hopefully, and then it's always fun. And you don't have to answer this question if you don't want to, but I'm fascinated, frightened, and disturbed about what's happening in a lot of the universities across this country where we're seeing this incredible divide. You know, I look at what's happened at Harvard, where president just resigned because it looked like they weren't definitive in their support of, the horrific act of activities that happened
October 7th when Hamas crossed the border. You're seeing a lot of times on campus where it still seems to be marginalized people don't seem to have the level and equal seat at the table as people that aren't as marginalized. They don't have the same privileges. They don't have the same network, the same access. Is that just the media creating that or your experience being in university that you feel we need to fix that there
if we're gonna fix society afterwards? I I would actually posit that, you know, as much as the university innovates and creates the future, it's also a slow moving monolithic entity. And I say monolithic, it's monolithic from the outside and hugely complex looking in from the inside. Universities really shouldn't have any business
giving comments on global affairs. Right? And very often when people get involved in this, like I'm gonna say something against Thomas because that was really bad that they did. Seems straightforward enough. But it's such a complex issue that few people can give it the real nuance it deserves. So it's really it's one of those things that stay away from it, stay away from it. And people don't know that if you walk yourself into something like that, it's gonna be problematic. I'll use an example
from the university. We had this set of students who elected to, unfortunately, walk around campus raising their hands like a Nazi and, you know, with some makeup to make them look like a Nazi. They were punished, but I do think that there's there's a blurring line where there's like, can do this, you can't do that. That line has been become so blurred now. I I think there's when you talk about the media's perception of it, you know, the media's always looking
for the story or the the the big the big take. I think the biggest problem we face now is that people talk about cancel culture. It's not cancel culture. It's it's speaking away from sort of the generally accepted. Right? And so squash and dissent. I I I feel that, you know, we need to make sure universities are continue to be places of true free speech, where people can, you know, battle ideas versus, you know, getting involved in more serious things. I think we're in a place where,
short tensions are very high. Coming off of COVID, family members don't talk to each other anymore. People have lost social norms. Social norms have shifted. Things are different now. The things we used to be able to do, we might not be able to do anymore. And it's happening in all spaces. I'm a fan of comedy, and I I watch a lot of the biographies of these comedians that, you know, used to work the college campuses and the small comedy clubs honing their craft.
A couple of them, I really admire, say, we can't go back to university because we're not allowed to be funny anymore. We're not allowed to pick on somebody. We're not allowed to build a story that way. So there's no point because the comedy we know, there's no longer imitation. And to me, that seems that university would be the 1st place you'd wanna be able to bring that. Even afterwards, there's a massive debate. Was that
right or wrong? It it's part of shaping it. But, anyways, we're getting we're getting off track, and and I I, I was just fascinated with it. I love the fact you said, you know, you a couple years before you ended your school your playing career, you started off as a bank teller. You've built a very successful wealth management practice, highly regarded within RBC. What's your secret for creating
this new playing field for you? Like, what did you take from your football days and your volunteer days that you're bringing to this practice that lets you, once again stand out as an individual? You know, I've I've done it a few times in my life. You start at the bottom. I think there's a lot of expectations that come with, you know, I'm coming from college. You know, I'm really good in college. That means I'm gonna be really good here. These things don't
always play out. And I'll go back to it again. I think a life without expectations is super important. I mean, I came out of football understanding I was gonna work as an associate on the wealth management team. And then RBC came in knocking. I had legitimate wealth management experience under my belt. I had a CFA charter. Right? Because I knew like, you know, as much as you say, oh, I know how to do this. It's it's always better to, like, put in the training. That's
what the CFA charter is. It's training your mind to think about the time value of money. So now we've, I I love my clients. I was told by one of my mentors, John, like, you know, your your clients are gonna be your your your friends. You're gonna be so busy, you know. And so I've been lucky enough to, have some great clients and the privilege to help them reach their goals. And is your mom
still with you? Yeah. What does she think? I I have to believe she's immensely proud that after the football days, instead of just being the glory days, Springsteen sign sign you might be you might be playing your best days yet. I I like to think I am, but, you know, I'll let you in on something, Tony. My wife and I, 2 years back, we encountered something that I'm not sure, like, who knows? It's called, we call it award
fatigue, right? Award fatigue. It was so much so that my parents didn't do their normal Christmas letter this year. Like, no, John, we're just gonna take off it off. They would, you know, they have 2 pages front and back of a letter, and she they'd go on about stuff, and then they'd have the 2 paragraphs about me. And then, you know, little sentence about this other kid, sentence about this other kid. You know, I'm not sure what it is. I
I'm hoping to continue doing these these cool things. I think life after being chancellor and, like you mentioned, youngest chancellor in Canadian history, like, okay. What next? Why don't we end on that? Because it seems that, as you said, it's not always been met by expectations. It's not always been, I'm gonna do this or that. I mean, Lou Marsh, you wanted to win, but you you're obviously sending out a 100 football tapes. You wanted to play ball. But have
you got a sense of what's next? Is it politics? Is it continue to grow with your wealth management practice? You know, where where do you see yourself in the next? Because you're a young guy. You've already made a big impact. I have to believe that retirement will never come easy to you. It's gonna you're always gonna be wanting to do something and feeling that there's value in it, time well spent. So any sense of what's next? I think this
is the greatest job I've ever worked. You know, having the opportunity to work with RBC alongside my wife. I know my mom recognizes that too because she knows I was a little kid. When she was that mom with 5 kids, you go into the bank, I always loved going to the bank. I wanna work at the bank someday, mom. I was like 6 years old, realizing that this is the job that I will be doing forever. I think the biggest piece that, you know, I wanna, you know, bequeath some nice endowments
here and there. But, you know, like, I think there's a lot more you can do. I think, we're gonna live a lot longer. There's so much time left. I think I'm just approaching the middle of my journey. So I always wrap up with my 3 takeaways, and there's some great ones. I think the first one is you put in the work. You know, they I think they talked about a 1000 hours of practice, but sending out a 100 tapes, getting
to know the the guy in the courier service. Even as you said, you know, when I went into wealth management, I just didn't go in because I was well known and I could open doors. You did your homework, and I did this incredible lesson in life for people because we especially this generation of video players, we learned very quickly how to skip go from one level to another level to another level. But in the real world, I think the more that we understand the nuances and we
understand how things work, I think it's a great piece of advice for people. I love what your mentor said. It's not not what you do for yourself. It's what you do for others. It's one of the great quotes, but, you know, you back it up. I mean, you backed it up with your volunteer work. I love the fact that you, you know, you used to go in there and say, oh my god. Here comes a football player before the game. And then next year, you got
the red shirt on, and you're delivering and playing video games. And then the third one is, I think when you became a leader, when you became captain of the CFL team, and you said, my job is no longer about winning records. It's about elevating others. I think that's a great lesson in life for a lot of people because as we start to see success,
we wanna have more success, more recognition, more validation. But the difference between me and we and I and a team is really your ability to bring others along and elevate each other and look at each other. And as you said, have fun and have one winning. So for all of that and more, I knew you'd be
a fantastic guest, and I really enjoyed learning more. I knew about you as a as the CFL hall of famer, but I had no idea that there were so many other notes other than maybe playing piano that were was part of, John Cornish. Well, I appreciate you having me on, Tony. Chatter that matters has been a presentation of RBC. It's Tony Chapman. Thanks for listening. Let's chat soon.