Late fifteen to ten touchdown. What's up, guys, Welcome into a brand new episode of Chargers Weekly, Episode number two from Indianapolis as always, joined by the Voice of the Chargers Matt Muney Smith and Money another gym of a pot ahead.
Yeah. Look, there's all our friends are here and they're kind enough to sit with us as they make the rounds. They got a lot of requests, they can't honor them all. And today three of our favorites, CD Charles Davis, just one of the you know Tennessee cornerback when he was playing, and of course part of you know the premiere one of the premiere productions on CBS when it comes to college YEP games. He called the Charger Houston Texan playoff game and does a great shot for NFL Network covering
the Senior Bowl in the draft. So he's going to join us, our old friend Matt Harmon, who's met reception perception. So today's cool because you know, ce deal give us the overview. And then Matt Harmon, who has has been charting wide receivers for a decade now, is going to just dig into the wide receiver free agency class. Some of the options there the draft and what might be available there. And then you know, one of my absolute favorite people that we get to connect with whenever we
come down to the combine is Lance Airline. And Lance is the guy that writes every single bio for the NFL Network. And so when you're when I worked for the NFL Network, I had seven hundred names and a giant binder back in the day before it was digital. They would give me three binders, massive binders. And he
was all from Lance, all from Lance. He wrote every single bio, graded every player, every comp But his dad is you know, his dad is well known as one of the great o line coaches in the history of the NFL. And so Lance was kind of raised on offensive line, and so we'll focus on that with him.
He gave us some great names. Matt Harmon obviously with the wide receivers and so much uncertainty in the Charges wide receiver room this offseason. So we'll get to Matt, we'll get to Lance, but we're gonna kick this thing off with Charles Davis. All right, Maddy, one of our favorites. Charles Davis joins us here on Charges Weekly, and Charles, we saw you in Houston Yeah, I'm just talking about just the quick turnaround with the NFL. It never stops.
Saw your round and you are in. You go from NFL mode to draft mode very very quickly.
Yeah, I think we all do right. If you're in the NFL, you're making these transitions all the time, you know. And after draft mode, we'll be into OTA Mini camp mode, then we'll be into short break mode, then we'll be we'll be intestipating in training camp, and then we're in the preseason, and then we're into the sea. It just
keeps going. I am old enough to remember when the pat when the newspaper would arrive, the headline at a certain point around this time of year would be pictures and Catchers Report, and it would be this massive headline. I remember one year it said pictures and Catchers Report. I don't you know, I've conflated things. But along that line, in the time frame of it, there's this blurb about Giants draft Rocky Thompson number one. He was their first
round pick. He was a kick returner, wide receiver out of North Texas State. It was three inches Pictures and Catchers Report. Yeah, now it's pictures and Catchers Report. Is the blurby and where will Aaron Rodgers go?
Na it right?
Headlines that's how we've changed.
Yeah, let's go to Houston. Let's talk about that. You called the game, and you know, one of the things that DJ said, Uh, you know we're both fortunate enough to work with DJ is that you know you're and it's an old football cleahere, right, your weaknesses get exposed in the postseason. So did you feel like that's kind of played out for the Chargers and they kind of have a pretty good idea of what needs to be addressed, I.
Would think so. I mean it's a very smart organization, as you guys know, especially with the changes that you've had over the last year. I mean just in last year. What's been infused there? Because I remember seeing Joe Hortiz when he got the job and we were talking knowing m from Baltimore, and I was like, so congratulations during cap hell huh yeah, And he knew it when he took job.
He's not naive.
He Jim and the rest of the organization went to work knowing, Okay, we got to try and mitigate here, we got to go bring some and the moves they've made let's be honest about the moves they made her off the charts. We got to talk to JK. Dobbins before the game. Well, the enthusiasm. He came in and literally hugged all of us to say hello and then hugged us all goodbye. I was like, can I just
hang with him for a while? Really like him? But you're talking about you know, this was not new front line, not new defensive front, not new We've had that for X number of years now. So here's an opportunity now to start to make some moves that way and see where they're gonna go. I mean, I'm looking at this. I actually did some notes last night for myself. You know what's gonna happen? Edge rusher wise, right, because for a long time that's been a strength. But right now
could that be beefed up? I'd say the answer is going to be yes, you're gonna have to do that. We mentioned inside in terier when people want to run the ball defensive front, on the offensive side of the ball. Everybody likes a good tight end. Oh yeah, right, everybody. Any quarterback I always talked about young quarterbacks love the
tight ends. Every quarterback loves a good tight end. We're gonna do it the pivot, you know, because offensive line really started to get a makeover, a bunch of different places to go.
But you Jo said yesterday about Zion maybe getting a look at center.
I did not hear that.
That's an interesting that's an interesting thought because if he can and now you're just replacing it that guard position, you've really strengthened your your offensive line. Because I think that center has become more valuable than ever. I really do, just by the way people are doing things. Would we say that the Super Bowl of Seattle and the Patriots really brought into focus how big it is to have the center. Yeah, and the interior line taken care of.
And we probably missed the lesson that Sean Payton gave us for years ago, especially if you have a smaller quarterback.
Now you don't.
You have monster a quarterback, but the smaller quarterback exists in the league like crazy. Sean Payton got out ahead of it because what did he have in the middle Mammoth people, the Jarry Evans Is of the world and what have you. Because Drew wasn't tall, but that allowed him a cup to step up in and find sight lines and throw the ball and networked pretty well for them.
Charles, I think they've taken kind of a two step approach with the offensive line. You get old you already have Slater who's doing a big contract, and now it's time to solidify the interior line. But on top of that, you mentioned what Joe did this past year has been masterful. But now I guess it's a good problem. You have twenty six unrestricted free agents, So how do you prioritize which guys come back while knowing that you have some holes into your offensive line? And then how does the
draft come into play? How does the unrestricted free agency dictate what they do in the draft?
The priorities are going to be who are the guys that we feel like we have to have to play and what's our price tag on them? Without saying, well, we really like him, so we'll go a little higher. Now you're starting to eat into your margins and you're going to hurt yourself elsewhere. I have a pretty good idea that Joe and crew are going to be like, this is what we value him. If we get him for this.
We're good.
If not, we'll go elsewhere with luck. Yeah, right, and go from there. And then once you're done with that, then you know what you've got to do in the draft. And because as our friend Daniel Jeremiah said, this is a meat and potatoes draft, Yep, you're probably pretty decent shape to go get people with whatever round you want to the guys that have a chance to play. And I think that's where they're good. I think that's what they'll do. And I'd be surprised to hear that they overpaid for anyone.
I really would. I don't think that's how they operate.
Those that are watching a lot of people listening right now on the pod, but those that are watching, they get to see the exquisite taste in headwear that CD with his melon hat brought to the table never shows a sweat stain. Throw them in the dishwashers. That yeah, we surfing. They're amazing.
They're amazing, Right, how did you get turned onto it?
They sent me one. They were just like, hey, we hear you're a surfer I was talking about on the air, and they're like, if you like, if you ever want to wear a hat in the water, try this out, and they flipped it to me. I was like, Holy crap, this thing.
I need to hang out with you more. No one's ever sent me anything but.
Well, since they will never se.
My son turned me onto it. He said this because I wear hats a lot, because the hair is you know, there's there's not a lot to it. So so the so my son goes, listen, you know, you're always in a hat. This is what I want you to try. So I always let him pick my head. And there, you know, he said. And he told me, he said, you're not gonna want to wear anything else, and he's right. I brought three with them.
There we go. Your son knows. Let's let's get into the chiefs because people are taking shots at him now, saying, lookod, look at this. There's it's the a f C. West. It's a pain. It's been a pain for a while. So what do you think moving forward? You know, the challengers you had Broncos and the Chargers make the playoffs, Like, yeah, how in peril do you think the throne is for Kansas City going into twenty.
Twenty the most imperil it's been under Andy Reid.
And and I don't mean to be overly dramatic, it's just simply you have two teams now that know that they can do this. Like, even though you don't have the actual full evidence, the idea that the Chargers lost twice to them last year is still confounding to them. You flip it over to Denver. Was that a block field goal?
Yeah? Right about that.
We didn't matter, but they laid it on them anyway because it felt good. You know, it felt good to go ahead and let your rookie quarterback get some more experience and beat them down like that. They still have to go get it done. I don't think the Chiefs are going like, oh, they're off the cliff. I don't
think they're there. But I do think that the confidence level of everyone in the AFC West has to be at an altar time high, Like if there's a chance to go get this is our chance to go get them right now.
Now.
We'll see what Kansay does offseason. But guys, this is like NBA when you have the same team make deep runs. How many extra games now are on the wear and tear of your core? Because you know the league is the league is your core and then you build around your core, and around your core changes all the time, but your core Mahomes, Kelsey, Chris Jones, those guys, how many extra games have they played?
Now?
It just keeps going and going and going. And I'm telling you that Super Bowl I'm taking zero credit away from Philadelphia. But if Kansas City didn't look like a fighter who had gone one fight too long, I don't know what else to do. I don't know what else to say. That's how they look that night.
Now.
I don't expect them to be that way in next season, but I also don't expect them to go fifteen and two.
Just don't say it, you.
Know, Charles, Let's go back to Houston too. I think that that game was the perfect illustration of this Chargers offense in what's lacking on the outside? Talk out one hundred ninety seventy yards receiving. Nobody else really did anything in that game. The Chargers are lacking an X A receiver on the other side of Ladd. Can you find it in this draft? What's the best way to approach it? Because it sounds like t Higgins is franchised. I don't know. I don't know how you going to get him out
of Cincinnati. I don't think you are Adams an option like what would you do me?
Baron comes with him.
That's what it sounds like. It's a good number two, right, good number two.
It sounds to me like Devonte Adams replaced Randall cobp as Aaron's running guy, right and and somewhere Alm those are. It's like, yo, yo, yo, what about me? Don't forget me. We'll see if they do. I think you can find those guys. I think there's a bunch of them there. Obviously at the top of the food chain. You know, you get to Travis Hunter is the receiver, is a corner, you know that sort of.
A deal you've got. You know what is Luther Burden for you?
Right?
Although he kind of looks more.
Like La lad Yeah, I think right right, thank you?
Right, you have from McMillan that. But he's not gonna I don't think he's gonna blow us away running.
No.
I think he's gonna be fine. But you're not gonna go what did he run again? I don't think you see that he wins with body control, going up and getting it rout running, which I love like a Drake London, thank you, just not quite as big as Drake, right, Drake's monsters we saw that's a big man. It's like, damn, that's a big man. Right, So I totally get it. But I do think there's a bunch of them out there. It's not as sexy as we've had it before, but I've said it before. Dj' is probably sick of me
saying it. As long as we're gonna play football the way we're playing it, every year, you're gonna a million receivers, you are, and most of them are gonna be fairly accomplished because they've been playing pitch and catch since seven on seven in middle school.
Yep.
So it's a whole different ballgame.
Last thing for you, CD, we appreciate it. You were at the Senior Bowl. You mentioned the pivot, and you know, I think maybe the biggest name to come out of there was Gray's Abel. Thank you so talking there we go, so talk to us out there.
He is.
You know, it used to be crazy to think that you take a center, you know, but you look at what Linderbaum's done. You look at some of these centers that go and then last year Graham.
Barton, remember Corey Linsley when you brought him over a free agent.
It's difference that it made the difference that it makes. So can you see that, Like, does that if you have Colston Loveland, if if a Marion Hampton is there, if Tamax slides, Like, can you see Gray's able being a realistic pick for this team or is it too rich?
I feel like I still feel like he would be a second round guy. You know, I think if those other guys were available, I think they'd go there.
I just do.
I think it's It's still one of those things where can you name the rams front five? Can you name the interior guys? Because it especially as the way, especially the way the season went.
Yah, I know what you're saying, and yet they function.
So if you have the right play call or the right system and all that, you can do it. I think you can hide a few deficiencies there better than because if you can get Loveland right, you gotta go exact, you gotta do it. But if I could get Gray's abel, I'm making my center like I'm not playing in MC guard I'm putting him at center right away. You know who if you get him later, the Monnheim kid out of us see a heck of a week, and I think that he can play in this league. I'd be
surprised if he can't. I need to do some more work. I've got Drew Kendall from Boston College down. I'm old enough to remember his old man. And you remember not a center, but Ozzie Trapea who was putting Trapillo Trapella, who was playing a tackle at.
The Senior Bowl, big out of Boston College.
I played in the Japan Bowl with his dad, and his dad passed away young. He had a heart attack and passed away by putting Japan Bowl with Steve. That's when I go, old brothers.
Get right.
We were in we were in.
Tokyo.
We're in Tokyo. And I'll just leave it.
This way, those old bowl games that we grew up watching, the hull of Bowl, Japan Bowl, right, senior all those think of it this way. Bo Jackson played in the Japan Bowl.
Bo Jackson played in the Japan Bowl.
Pretty great. Think about that, Yeah, it's pretty great.
Not in twenty twenty five.
Could you imagine if he said, you know, I think I'm playing in Japan, but and how many people have tackled him in his camp?
Right?
No, no, no, absolutely not. You don't even get on the plane Japan.
I'm not even risking it, not even a tourist.
But in that Japan Bowl I played in Brett Fulwan was the first round pick for the Packers.
Oh yeah, played in Japan Bowl.
Look at that fantastic Charles Davis.
Get for an hour, man, We can't take it for your time to your next destination. Appreciate you, s gread to see you. Guys. Always the best, the best man. This week is so fun. So many friends joining us on Chargers Weekly. Matt Harmon in person in Indianapolis, first combine.
I mean, I'm just still struck. Friend. I mean, that's that's high bar.
Right.
I appreciate colleague, not contemporary.
Workplace proximity is a former work worker. Absolutely, it's awesome to be here. It's great. Peanut butter denial, Yeah, peanut butter denial. Many many or chain out. We're chain in today. Yesterday was chain out. We'll see tonight though, chanin's probably coming out.
It's coming out.
Yeah.
Listen, you don't throw around weight on inclined bench and keep your chaining. You know, Matt's remade his body. He's all barrel chested. He's throwing around freaking plates at the y m c A, you get your chain out.
That was what I was doing, like an hour ago. I was up in the hotel gym, you.
Know, just full at the podium. Today we are we interviewing you.
I think I probably should get up there and see how long it would take for somebody be like, wait a second, that guy, that guy's not a ball play.
That's that guy dissects wide receivers. Now you're gonna have to get the line plate, dude, you know, with this new body of yours.
It is funny. I interviewed thelak neighbors at the at the super Bowl, and people like my podcast were just like, wow, this's got a lot of Engagemently, let's go check out the comments. Most of it was like, does neighbors need to hit the weight room? Was like no, no, no, no, no, no, I'm like probably sixty pounds having that right.
No, I'm I'm a big bodied white dude that lives in Virginia. That's all I got.
Hey, that's all I've got to do is lift weights.
So let's tell the people about reception per se. Nobody's better at it. We're gonna talk straight wide receivers with Matt. He does reception perception. He's done it for a long time,
You're great at it. Let's go just share with the people to kind of I think set a baseline last year, huge wide receiver class, sort of what you thought and where Lad McConkie fit into that mix with I think it was what the sixth pass catcher taken in the draft, So kind of how you shook how you saw last year shaken out.
Yeah, last year was great for business. It was a great receiver class. We had those three guys that were all Tier one prospects, Harrison and dounesay neighbors. I think I talked to you guys about this last year that you could order those guys however, and I didn't really care. It was basically like, what's your flavor. And really the funny part is that you could argue that two guys outside of that top three were the two best rookie wide receivers last year, which I think was Lad mccaukey
and Brian Thomas Junior. So just funny that it's one of those things where this is projecting to the NFL. Man, anything can happen you get in the right situation, and some of those guys that are maybe tier two or even Tier three prospects can produce in the right situation, which lad was certainly one of those guys. And man, what an incredible rookie season he had. And I think he showed you very early on like all of the
things that made him such an awesome prospect. You know, there were some questions, right obviously, durability concerns, you know, the playing time and overall just where does he fit on an NFL field, because I do think he got stereotyped as kind of like a bunny hop slot receiver. But man, that guy's a real deal downfield route runner. And I think it was the early on you could really see Herbert gravitate to him because of like when he's working in zone coverage, he's just always settling at
the right spot. And you know, Herbert is such a smart, like cerebral quarterback, that is really something that he values. But it was I think it was like the Week six Saints game. Was it was around that time where he had the two monster sideline touchdown. Yeah, and that one to me where I mean he was sidelined touchdown
but he was very far away. Yeah, Yeah, And that play was very significant to what I think that you could see that trust because Herbert actually looks to like the backside dig which I think was a zero two two was the guy there and or semi fo Hooko excuse me for Hooko was the the read I think the first year on that play, he whips background so fast and throws that like slot fade to Lad McConkie, who wins it in tight coverage and then rips off
like a yards after catch play which man coverage winning at the catch point yards after catch. That's a pretty good wide receiver right there.
What do you think he will look like in year two with someone on the other side of him that is perceived as a one A or a a number two? Like how do you view Lad? Is he a sure fire number one? Or do you think that they need I guess they just need a different type of receiver on the other side of.
It, Yeah, they do. I think they're need is pretty obvious for like an X receiver, because I think Lad can win inside out his in terms of yards per route run. He's actually better on the outside than he is on the inside. And I mean he's damn good working that slot. So that's that's a pretty incredible thing.
For giving him someone that can kind of like move him from that flanker slot position is pretty crucial to me because I do think he's capable of being a number one receiver, Like, do you want to throw him the ball one hundred and sixty one hundred and fifty times in a year? Probably not, for a variety of reasons, but I think he's a guy capable of being your
first read in the vast majority of your concepts. But having someone that can not just clear out space from the X receiver position, but can win in that spot as well, that just makes the.
Offense more dangerous overall. So it seems like this year you talked about it last year is good for business. This year's a bit of a struggle. I think it might have been. Was it Kuiper's draft mock draft that had t ma max sliding all the way to twenty two?
Can you envision, like what's your grade on on McMillan versus like where he would have fit in last year, And whether or not you think in a league that is desperate for wide receivers and they get paid a ton of money, so it's a premium position, whether or not it's realistic that that guy's there at twenty two.
Right. That's the thing for me because DJ had him slipping Dan Jerem I had him slipping to the bucks as well, right, And then to me, I struggle kind of seeing that happen, especially if he goes out, because he's gonna work out right, like he's gonna run the forty. If he goes out and rips like a four or five two or something like that, I think then he's
locked himself into probably the top fifteen picks. I don't care about his forty time, like that doesn't really matter to me, but that does set the narrative of who you are as a draft prospect when I watch him, and I'm still like working my way through the film on these guys for reception perception, it's always an eight game sample if those are available, I'm like about halfway through that right now. To me, he's kind of charting
out as more of like a tier two prospect. So that would have put him last year in the conversation with like Brian Thomas Junior in that range, which again he was made.
It to twenty right, whatever it was at twenty six or.
I just think in this class though, he's the Travis Hunter kind of discussed aside. I think he's the best just receiver. And to me, like you said, it's such a premium position. The money is crazy there, and there's so many teams that need, like we just talked about the Chargers need an X. I can go down the list and tell you, like a lot of teams need that skill set. And I just struggled to see him
slipping that far. But shoot, if you made it to LA, that is exactly the guy we are talking That's like the best version, the best outcome of what we're talking about from that position.
And that's what we're trying to identify. Is okay, if it's not in the draft, you know, there's rumors about guys like DK Metcalf and Adams and you know, Tyreek Hill, all these different players. You know, we've talked about Chris Olavin, Garret Wilson. Who knows what's gonna happen with the cap
situations in New York and New Orleans. If you had to scour the league in terms of guys who could be available via trade or just straight up free agents, who do you think makes the most sense for the Chargers.
That Adams one, I mean makes a ton of sense to me. You know, he wants to play on the West Coast. Don't blame him. I'm a guy that moved away from the West Coast a stupid decision poorly. If I'm him, I love the idea of getting back there for sure. And again, he's somebody that can play the ex receiver position. Now you also he moved around a little bit with the Jets last year, but he can play at that spot. Be kind of the backside ISO guy.
Allow you to move Lad McConkie into a bunch of different positions, maybe work him off like full speed motion concepts. There's there's a lot you can do there having that guy who's also a credible threat. I mean, once he hit the field for the Jets, it allowed Garrett Wilson to really do a lot of this like move around stuff we're talking about. So I think he would be a great fit, you know, if he's available, if it fits, they have a lot of cap space to do it.
I'm just curious like where the Chargers view themselves as like how close are they how much do they want to push the chips into I think they feel and I think they should feel that way. You know, they have the quarterback, they have the head coach. You've got a lot of these like pieces that outkicked their coverage last year, maybe outkicked expectations. Can we get an interior
offensive line locked in here? Can we get one more pass catching threat, because that just and you know you got needs on the defensive side too, You got things to check off there. But offensively, I do feel like they're right there, and a piece like Adams would be an ideal, you know, kind of archetype for that. If we get beyond that. I mean, there's just not a lot of guys in this free agent market that fit into that like potential X receiver bucket.
Yeah, the Alave thing has always been interesting, and obviously there's that Southern California connection as well, and that for whatever reason, it just feels like there's always some sort of issue with the Saints and their pass catchers. Yea, if for whatever reason they decide to make him a vail and I know the concussions are kind of scary they're doing that thing, but I mean, he's he is also a perfect fit right for kind of the way he plays. He would fit in right there, wouldn't he?
I think so, And I think he is a guy who has a lot of untapped potential right from a production standpoint, for sure. It just felt like him and Derek Carr were never quite like a good fit for each other, and like sometimes you can be a you know, we could haggle about where Derek Carr ranks in terms of NFL quarterbacks, but he's a starting quarterback in the league, and Olave is a guy that should be kind of on that upper trajectory. But some guys just don't see
the game the same way. Their styles don't fit in together. I don't think that would be an issue in this offense, where again you're getting so much play action, you're getting shot plays like that really fits into a Lave skill set, because when I've charted him out his first two seasons especially, I mean, awesome separator, another guy that just gets open,
and that really is what you felt lacking. I've never seen, I mean, I've never seen a freaking playoff box score like the one that the Chargers had where it's just Adam McConkie has one hundred and ninety seven yards and the next highest is what like eighteen or something like that, or was anybody even in double digits. It was absurd. I've never seen a wide receiver split like that because the other guys just can't consistently separate. If you can get somebody like yeah, it's the idea of a big
ball winning X receiver, that's one thing. But if you have two guys who are uncoverable, it's a pretty good start.
Joshua Palmer understricted free agent. You know a lot of conversation about Quintin Johnson in his second year more of a mixed bag, but he had some good games. How do you view Quinton coming into twenty twenty five.
I think you can. You can get away with him being your third receiver. The problem is, like he's a volatile player. I think that's always going to be the case. I don't think he's useless. I think there are This is just what happens to guys who have drops in big moments. They immediately start getting like its spirals, like you start taking away everything that they do bring to the game. And I do think there are things that he does really well. I think he needs roll catering.
We've talked about this a lot we took about it previously. He can't just be an X receiver. That's not his game. The ball tracking is an issue. Winning against press coverage consistently is an issue. But he's a run after catch streat. I think he works on these, like inbreaking routes, and I would say from literally the first game I remember watching the Chargers this past season, it's like, Wow, this coaching staff has such a better understanding of what this
guy is than the previous group that drafted him. Ironically enough, because there was like a couple of plays where even in that first game, again he's off. Then he's still primarily line up at X in that game, but he's off the line of scrimmage, and we're just working him on quick in breaking routes and letting him go after the catchdowns. Like I could probably like group the amount of times he did that as a rookie. On one hand, you know, so that is something that he can do.
But I think he's somebody that you just don't want to be throwing the ball to eight, nine, ten times. Again. You sprinkle him in like three. I think that's that's perfect. Then you can get something out of a player like that.
I don't know how much you mentioned you're kind of trying to go through eight games for reception perception. How deep have you gotten into the draft class this year?
I've gotten about like six seven guys in.
What do you think of Matthew Golden.
I think he's interesting. He's kind of the hardest player for me to get my mind around right now because I think the three four games I've had are a little bit of a mixed bag there. It kind of gives me like Jordan Addison vibes a little bit right. He's not a full field, consistent separator, but he has real big flashes, but there are moments where he wins like big time catches too, and especially late in the
season for Texas. So I think he's a guy that I don't know if he's a future number one or something like that, but definitely someone you can you can kind of have in the rotation. And again, he's the one I'm probably still trying to get my mind around the most in terms of players who are projected in the first round. Other guys I think I have got like a pretty good grasp one and sometimes that's the
way it is. I can't remember I was talking to you yesterday, because you know, some people push back like, oh, eight games, like that's not the that's not the full season. Like you can talk to like scouts stuff like that, they're finaling reports on like free games, you know. But and sometimes after one two games, like I get this player, but that's standard, just the standard, and we still do eight games, but sometimes even three four, and I'm like, I don't quite I don't quite know where we are
with this guy yet. And that's kind of where I'm at with.
Golden Keenan, Allen, Mike Williams. Last year, the big debate was, Okay, you're gonna keep Joey and Khalil versus those guys. They're both unrestricted free agents right now. Mike was obviously coming off a big injury, Keenan had some injury issues. What did you see from those guys this past year, because you know they're also unrestricted free agents who have history with Justin Herbert.
Yeah, And Keenan said, like, I'm only playing in La Chicago.
Yeah, mine in the Sand or Virginia.
Yeah, we'll see. I mean, everybody everybody says they're only doing something until the checks start coming in. And there's also two teams in LA and you know, I think he actually would make some sense for the Rams if
he's a kind of low cost edition. Although I was talking with our another one of our former workplace proximity associates and I mean my business partner slash friend, James co yesterday that if he was to replace Cooper Cup in the Rams offense, it's interesting from a receiving perspective, but you are going on to the other end of the spectrum from blocking, you know, standpoint, like Cooper is one of the best blocking receivers in the league, and
Keenan was definitely that was an issue for him in Chicago last year. And it is kind of hard in Chicago last year, Like I kind of want to give all those guys a pass because these are, like, especially the two former Pro Bowl receivers, These are you know, proven guys like DJ Moore think about and I'm off on a tangent here, but like DJ Moore, he's a guy that has played in some rough situations in throughout
the course of his career. And this is probably the first time you can look at the film and be like, I don't know if this guy's fully bought into what's going on here, and even some of his public comments, which again is outrageous. This guy has played for some weird coaching staff, so there was a lot going on in Chicago last year. I think Keenan showed you he's one of these players that sometimes with wide receivers you just fall off the cliff. Other times there's a little
bit more of like a steady tick down. And I think he could still be useful to the right team. I don't know Chicago. I don't know if LA the Chargers are that right team. Mike Williams. I mean, I think it was tough last year. I just think it was tough to.
Expect the injury.
He's a big guy.
He's never been like a two different teams.
Yeah, and he's never been an above average separator either. I also thought that him and George Pickens kind of have like a very overlapping skill set there in Pittsburgh too, so you're kind of looking a little too samey. And I mean Russell Wilson, like every offense just kind of becomes the Russell Wilson offense, where you're looking at deep shot wide receivers, tight coverage go routes, fades and things
like that, which is Mike Williams's skill set. But I mean you're you're asking a lot for basically two guys play the same position and play the position the same way to be on the field at the same time and thriving. Right.
All right, well, reception perception check it out. He was all over lad last year and uh, you know, business was good last year, business was booming. So let's hope that the combine turned some of these dudes out there. Are you doing tight ends?
No?
I know you well, you thought it was. I was listening to one of the I remember when you were lovely know you were kicking it around. You were kicking the idea around. What was it last year or the year before you were talking about tight ends, isn't am? I not right? Am?
I remember you are remembering that the audience desperately wants to see some of the tight end charting. There's two problems with that. One. The technical answer is I've been doing reception perception for ten years now. There's a very over ten years. There's a clear database, like I can tell you what each metric tells you like this. This matter is because of this, and this is where we know that this guy should play all that stuff, and
we're starting the database over. If we're like including tight ends, it is a different position. Even if these the lines can get a little blurred. The non technical answer is I'm happily married man. I'd like to stay happily married.
Man.
I got enough damn work with. There's like fifty sixty wide receivers. I need to charge up grind Will Disley tape for us. Tell you what, gritty guy, all right, it's grit.
It's it team grit, all right, Matt. We appreciate it, man, appreciate.
You, guys.
Thank you well, Maddy another one of our favorites. I can't believe it's been a year since Lancier Line joined us and it was a draft where Joe Alt, Oh.
Can you here, I'm just coming down a little bit too loud.
Oh, I'm sorry.
No, it's just my radio, you know. Just I just go to the producer, I say, on the what is it? I don't even I've been to radio twenty seven years.
Chargers Weekly hosted around on the return, I was I was just gonna find my game.
I need a little bit more me in my air, more me in my air. Please, that's that's that's a routine for me. I like me, me like me, some me exactly.
At last, we were just saying, how you know you gave us all this great insight on the offensive line h last year, and the Chargers selected the best offensive lineman in the draft in Joe Alt, and now the bookends off for Shawn Slater and Joe Alt gonna be with the Powder Blue for the next decade plus.
However, you may need to go back to the.
Well, here we go, this is how we get it started.
You may need to go back to the well. I like the book, NDS, I like your book. I think you go you always go guard. Well, if you can't, well you go best player available.
Well, because you.
Know, I covered the Houston Texans and uh so obviously really in tune with with that match up the Chargers and Texans. Yeah, and uh DJ and I talked a little bit during the week about strengths and weaknesses of the Texans and I, you know, I kind of gave
him a scouting report. He gave me the scouting report on Chargers, and the one thing that really stood out was this could be trouble because the Texans can mix it up a little bit on the interior as rushers, and that was an issue for the Chargers last year. And I think that, you know, strengthening that immediate weakness has got to be a priority. And I don't I
don't know that you do it with one pick. You know, you may have to do it free agency and a pick, but this isn't a good free agent market, so you may need to go two picks.
But the good news is it's pretty good guard draft.
You got some centers you can look at, so it's it's it can be taken care of. Probably need to do it inside the first four four rounds, though.
Let's uh, you know what, Let's start just I want to make sure I got it right. Let's start with the free agent market. You said it's not a good guard market, but obviously.
It's not a good free agent market in general.
Yep.
There may be a couple, so that's what I want to get at. So let's say if they try to mix and match, right, I don't know. I don't Maybe they'll spend twenty two twenty four million bucks on Trey Smith. I don't know. If I see him doing that. I don't know if I see Kansas City.
Let great fit. I don't. If I'm Kansas City, I can't let them go, right, I just I just can't.
You'll catch a French Chargers, Yeah, you'll catch a You'll catch a tag for me from me before where I'll.
Let you go.
Okay, So then let's go. I'm just going through the PFF rankings here. I don't know if these would be your rankings, but next in line as will Fries look good before he got hurt?
Solid?
That fit?
So I think that's a fit.
Fit take million bucks a year?
Well is that what guards get with here?
I mean, you know Houston needs them, Chargers need them. Everybody needs a line, right.
Well, I'd like him for a little less if I could, But no, I mean, if if money's not an issue, then yeah, fries and would make a lot of sense. A guy like Gray's able, you know, who can play center or guard. You know, in a perfect world money
you want tackle guard or guard center. You always want position flexibility, but you'd also like not just like get you out of a game and an emergency, you'd like I can start like Landon Dickerson when he came out of Alabama, he was a center at that time, but he can play guard, and the idea was he'll eventually go to center when Kelsey's gone. So you want guys
who have dual starting flexibility when possible. The tackle to guard thing is is usually you have a guy's kind of short armed or not big for whatever the case may be, or not maybe quick enough depending on if you're going to more of a gap scheme like the like the Chargers have, and so you want somebody who's got the pass pro finesse.
And so I think there are.
Some players that that can be found in free agency who fit immediately, who are veterans and they won't have the the bumps in the road that you're going to have with the rookie.
So if you can't get one.
What about Tevin Jenkins?
Maybe maybe too much mad case.
I mean, Tevin is a talented player, but they've had to really hustle over there to get him motivated. Although he came off of a really good season, like he's when he's motivated, he.
Plays really really well.
But you know, I don't know what the Chargers room is like, I don't know how he fits into that room. That's always a question that that that I guess the study from the front office is.
Going to have to do on this.
Let me just throw the rest of these at you. Tell me if if one of them jumps out at you. Zeitler, James Daniels, McCarry. How about Aaron Banks taking a flyer on him?
Aaron Banks is big and strong, might be a guy that you get cheap, and then you might. What you do is you go probably twice in the offensive you know, you go once in a fifth round, you go another time in the first or second round, and then you say, okay, we got some competition. Now we got three new we got three new faces we're throwing in the offensive line room. Let's let's get to it. Because to me, I mean,
just about every job should be up for grabs. There should at least be real competition there because you got too much, you know, I mean, there's still some holes you can get better running back, can get better wide receiver. There's there's some spots to get better in the secondary. But you're not that far off if you're the chargers. So you have to your your approach needs to be
pretty it needs to be pretty aggressive. And this is only year two for this, you know, for this particular group of coaches, and and so if you didn't get it done in year one, your job should be up in the air.
Two. Lance's kind of a two part question here, George. He said yesterday that they may experiment with experiment with a Zion Johnson at center. Uh, you mentioned Gray Zabel, a guy who has a lot of positional flexibility in the interior. A. What do you think of Zion potentially at center?
And B?
Would Graysabel be a solid pick at twenty two or is that somebody that slide to the second round?
You know, I'd say it's too early. But here's the thing. Cole Strange was a first round pick from New England. You know, New England has gone Logan Mankins in the past. They went you know, New England always believed in if we get a good guard, we're gonna draft good guard and we don't care.
We're not gonna play games with it. We just will do it in the first round.
I don't think that's the worst idea in the world. Is that a little early for grays Abel? I guess, but who really cares if he becomes a ten year starter? Like, what difference does it make if you drafted him if you, because he's not going.
To be there when you draft him the second round, we'll be there fifty five, so he's not going.
To be there.
So either you're trading back and hoping that he's still on the board or you or you take him there. So I don't know, I don't know how you how you work it, But that's a guy that would make sense coming in at playing. If if Zion could give you the snaps, that's great. Can he is he a good snapper? Can he identify fronts? It may not require that Zion is a very smart guy. Is he football smart? I don't know. You're gonna be BookSmart. You may not
have a great feel and instinct. Sometimes it doesn't matter. Sometime the guards are making the calls an identifying the front. So Gray is a tough guy, as you mentioned he has he has He has three for one position flexibility, probably more emergency right tackle in the league, but starting guards, starting center, very strong core so he can hold up to bull rushes. He was fantastic at the senior well, just really really good and much better than I had anticipated.
But you always love having a guy with tackle experience in because they're just they're just they're going to be more savvy and they're going to be more technically sound in pass pro. And for me, that's obviously like a huge, huge get. But you can't really sacrifice, like Jim Harball is not going to sacrifice your ability to be tough and kind of move people around. But that the duo blocks and the gap scheme stuff. So Grey's abel actually fits that too. So he's one of those guys that fits.
What if he let's say he's there, Booker's there.
I mean Booker, you race it up and it's over.
That would be it that Yeah, But I'm saying so.
Because Booker's wired the way you want him to.
He's big, like like like Hardball likes him, and he's strong and physical, so hert I mean, Booker should be one of the guys who's at the very top of their list because he's also considered the leader at Alabama. It's not Milrow, it's not anyone on defense. The leader is a guard of the team of the team. So now you've got a guy in a room that's already got a strong room with all you got a lot of football character. Now with Alt and Schlater and Booker. And you know in Zion Johnson he's got a lot
of football character as well. You got to really you got the right kind of room if you got Booker. I just don't think Booker is going to be there. I know he's not gonna be when you're drafted. So because because what I'm telling you is what a lot of teams want. And it wouldn't shock me if somebody moved up. It's crazy to move up for a guard. But there's not a lot of first round guards. So thirteen fifty yeah, I mean, you know that's not where I have him graded, but where you have to slot them.
And now DJ loves all the intangibles. The people at the Alabama program speak extremely glowingly of them. Well, if you think they're doing that to DJ, to myself, what do you think they're telling the NFL teams, they're telling them.
The same thing.
And so teams who say, man, we need somebody inside who's tough, who's a leader, Who's Houston Texans?
Who I cover? They need somebody inside who's tough, who's a leader? Will you draft ahead of them?
So, I mean, you can't play games with it if Booker's there, Race the card up, but I just.
Don't see what are you?
Twenty two two?
Yeah?
I just I think he goes inside the top eighteen picks.
You mentioned flexibility, what about Membo?
That's another one.
Maybe.
Yeah, you have to trade up to get Membo. But Membo.
You know, it's funny I talk to a team that isn't quite as high as I am on them, but they're just wrong. I'm right and they're wrong. Mimbo is really going to be good. He is very tough. He's he's about three hundred and thirty pounds of solid mass. He's a little shorter than most tackles, but he's got thirty four inch arms, which makes up for it because he's got that wingspan. But what makes Membo different to me is, you know, he's mostly been in an outside
zone scheme. A lot of inside outside zone, which is a move based offense blocking scheme. For those listening what the Chargers do and what Jim did at what Hardball did at Michigan, there's a lot of double teams and then you work up to the linebacker called duo blocks or gap scheme. But I think Membo can do that. Like he's strong, he's got really good hands, He's very technically sounded, he's tough.
He's very tough.
So from a from a culture fit and from a scheme fit, Membo is fantastic and he gives you the potential to step out at right.
Let let all roll over to left tackle.
If something happens Slater and Membo to right side, maybe Mimbo go's left side. You know, he can slide, he can play an emergency swing tackle if you're not happy with your swing tackle. But I think he is a long time starting guard and a good one if you got your hands on him. But he goes before Booker potentially lace.
That was my next question to you is we saw All go out with a knee injury earlier in the year, missed the game. Slater has had some injury history. What about just adding to a strength and like the third or fourth right and getting another tackle that maybe has that positional versatility to kick inside the guard. Are there any guys you can think about and maybe those mid rounds that the Chargers may be attracted to.
Yeah, I think if you start looking at third and fourth round probably you know Anthony Belton from NC State is a name. He's a big massive guy, but he's tough, he's physical, he's got a little better feet than you're maybe expecting.
I think a player, and I'm trying to think, you.
Know, specific to to I think Jack Nelson from is more of a four round type of tackle from Wisconsin. But you know, he's a big ten player and he comes from the same type of mentality over at Wisconsin that that. You know, it's when you when you try to figure out what a team is gonna do, you really sometimes you have to try to get into the personality of the team. And with Hardball, there's no He's
not sneaky exactly. I mean he told h he basically told us he was drafting an offensive lineman last year. Like you know, most teams try to smoke screen. I don't think he's capable of it. But he's also he's also like easy for me to read because I can just look for Chargers. I go look for Michigan, Michigan men boy, the boys in blue, and I'm looking for that, only it's a it's a lighter color, more a softer blue now, but it's not softer in the interior, you know,
in the trenches. So Charles Grant loved Charles Grant, and he is a player.
That's he's third at the latest.
He could be a riser and I'd kind of plugged him into the third fourth at first when I first watched him, and I thought, boy, this is a guy
that is going to be a steal. Well, if I'm thinking he's a steal in December, he's probably gonna test well and he's not gonna be a steal because offensive lineman get pushed up, so he won't be there for the Chargers third round pick, I don't think, And he could end up going in a second because he is a tackle guard flexible player too, but he is a tremendously quick zone scheme guy, so I don't know that he would fit schematically.
What about just center, if they're going to maybe try Zion at center, if they bring back Bozeman on a you know, lower number contract. Everybody loves him in the room, so I'd be really surprised. And then if they're going fishing in those late rounds for you.
Know, if you want to fish in the late rounds.
Jake Majors from University of Texas Money and I talked about him the other night. One of the smartest centers in the whole draft, really really football smart. He's tough, he has good size, so he's not like one of these three hundred and two pounds centers that has to try to eat all day to keep his weight on. I mean, he's in a three fifteen range, I think something like that. I don't know where he will be if he's weighed here, what he's going to be here.
But he's a hardy. He's a good hearty size for center.
What do you have on him? Money?
I got him at Let's see, they don't have it here.
Let's see for that look yep, so that's where he plays.
See your guy, Well, this is the guy that Lance and I were talking about. Then I went back and watched the Michigan game and I was like, he's holding his own against Kenneth Grant. He's holding his own against Mason Grant. He had a good game that day.
You got to see what the Longhorns look like. A good look against Michigan. And I love watching best on best, and he more than held his own against those two guys. And he's smart, he's durable at the point of attack, and you know, he's the type of guy that I think can become a starter, even if you're taking him in the fifth or sixth round. And and and that's what you love to find. There's a lot of centers who start in this league that were fifth, sixth, seventh
and undrafted, usually like fifth, sixth and undrafted. You find it all the time, and you have to so you can afford other players. You have to go find late round guys.
Lansay, if I get you off the offensively just for a second, goes hand in hand.
Though.
I don't know if we're seeing a running back renaissance. You see what Saquan did and to lead the Eagles to a Super Bowl victory. He saw with Derek Henry did in Baltimore. The Chargers could use an Omari and Hampton and Ashton genty. How do you view this running back class and who do you think would be the best fit from a running back perspective, knowing what you have on the offensive line right now on the book ends.
Well, I think it's a really good it's a really good running back draft for what you guys do. There's some hammerheads in here. There's some tough guys, some physical players, and it happens to be very deep. I mean, you can go find guys in a fifth round who are gonna fit and maybe sixth who can come in and give you good number two carries. You want to find a number one, number ones or in this draft as well, Amara and Hampton.
You know.
To have two first round maybe three for round running back. I think Travion Henderson is going to test well and he could be a real wildcard after what Jamior Gibbs has been able to do.
Ashton Gent's gonna go high.
But Omarion Hampton is the perfect kind of right down the middle, no no gatherers feet. He's he's accelerating through into and through contact. He's a big guy, He's been extremely healthy. He's a number one back who's gonna get a lot of carries, maybe in the first round.
Uh.
Quinn Shawn Judkins is another tough guy, very tough, physical, not as explosive in terms of hitting the big chunk plays that's typically not really a concern for a Jim Harball type offense.
I mean, if you get it, you get it. If you don't, you don't.
If you if you want to have a hardcore player like a Judkins in the first running back spot. Then just go find a guy with a little more a little more juice at the second running back spot.
Uh.
But then you get to players like I think another guy that would fit would be Cam scattaball as a as a second. Now i'm making him a second. I'm trying to beat you up by committee. So I want to have the first guy who beats you up. Then I want to have the second guy who comes and does some of the same stuff. In that case, my third running back needs to be the splash and dash player who maybe gets three or four carries but does all the third most of the third down work for you.
But you can go into the like the fourth and fifth rounds Montreal Johnson out of Florida, Jordan James out of Oregon. These are guys who are extraordinarily physical and who have a certain mentality, And this is a great draft for mentality running backs. You know, guys that are gonna get between the tackles and keep it between the tackles. It's just that, you know, you got to do the work on how many of these can catch passes as well, how many of these guys keep it on the track,
Because what you don't want is. You don't want players who try to bounce it. You know, you can have a physical player who likes to kind of every once in a while drift into the world of finesse and think he's going to be a slick I remember watching Chris Carson.
Remember Chris Carson.
Yeah, when he came out of Oklahoma State, and I just kept seeing like he's so big and strong, why does he keep dancing around and trying to be a finesse back? And I read an article where his running backs in the same room with him gave him hell over the same thing, like, dude, you're so big and strong,
you got to just be running over people. When he got to the league, that's what he became, is a running back coach or an offense coordinator or maybe a veteran got in his head and said, you're so big, what are you doing?
Man?
Just go run over people? And he was a he was a nightmare for a little bit. Like he was a really physical back. So good draft have physical backs.
Great stuff. He writes all the tree. You hit up NFL dot com and you click on a player's name, and that is all Lance. He's done the great He's done the bio. He's done the write up, he's done the comparison, seven hundred eight, So we're talking about.
Fifty five hundred over the last eleven drafts.
But right now we're sitting at about three forty five three for that one hundred and forty five to go.
Yeah, they don't push back on Lance. Man knows what he's talking about, and we appreciate it.
Man.
Thanks brother, you're the best.
Thanks guys, So buddy, we are spoiled. Two more podcasts this week. This one was.
Fun, absolutely great one.
Today.
We'll have great one tomorrow. Mina's gonna join us, so Mina comes from over at ESPN. We'll have danme Brugler, our friend from the Athletic puts together The Beast another. You know, we talked about Lance in this one. Danged the same way, six seven hundred names that he's grading and putting up reviews on. And it's Brett Coleman exactly, our friend that you see if you go to Charger games, you see him breaking it down up on the giant board.
Just incredible at watching tape and breaking players down. So most definitely gonna be another Gret one tomorrow.
It's easy to forget because we've had like so many twenty guests this week. Exactly we'll do it. Should we do a Prime forty seven recap? No no, no, so not do that that. We'll skip that one. Use your imagination. And I need to go take a nap.
For buddy up.
Chris, it's been charges weekly. We'll see you tomorrow.