Yet we're rolling live from the Farmland Fresh Dairy studios. This is serial Killers.
This is Serial Killers. I'm Scotty b oh yeah, and our friend Ben Mendelkerr is here.
Hi. How's it going.
We met Ben in Austin last month during the iHeartRadio Podcast Awards and his podcast Watch. What Crappens was up for was a pop Culture Best pop Culture.
Best pop Culture Podcast, and they won.
We did not, So we've invited a winner on the show today because we're just a bunch of giant losers. And this is going to be an interesting hybrid type of podcast because we're going to start it off as a Serial Killers and then I have to get the hell out here because I have an appointment. So we're going to turn it into a bowl chat where you guys will just chat and chat and chat about all things Bravo that I know nothing about and board games.
He also likes board games, So down to talk board games.
Oh I wish I didn't take that limited edition board game home that General Mills sent us. You know General Mills made uh yeah, the Lucky Charms mouse Trap game. But what Yes, it's Lucky Charms Mousetrap and it's with Lucky the Leprechaun instead of the Yeah, I'm sorry, I stole it from my daughter Cooper.
That's okay.
Otherwise you guys could have played it.
It's probably it's probably better to be with Cooper.
Yes, all right, so let's get rolling because, uh this cereal is well. First of all, what cereals do you like? You a sugar guy or you were like, what do you like?
Well, unfortunately, I'm at a place in my life where I have to eat healthy cereal like Cashee, the Cashee herty O's or whatever it's called, like the hearts. It's like barely has any flavor and it purports to be good for my heart. But I grew up eating honey nut cheerios. That was like my go to. Then I had a period of time where I ate life and I've always loved Special Ki plainly. Last week, I have to say this may be TMI, but I feel like this is a place for sharing.
Yes it is.
Last week I had my first baby's first colonoscopy. I I had to have a low fiber diet and they said popped ry cereal and I said, I am eating Special K this week. Congratulat I so much Special K. I had it for like breakfast, I had it for lunch because I love Special K.
And yeah, and me being the big boy that I am, refused to callon oscy and I just pooped in the box the call of guard. You know that thing?
Yeah, that's two different. I think it's I feel like it's two different. Yeah, I guess kind of is.
When my doctor said it was fine, and I'm all good, So let's move on and need some healthy, crappy cereals. So the one that I werelling to do one today because this is abridged, the one that I chose for us because you like healthy, is going to be a disgusting cereal good this is This is one of the Magic Spoon serials. Have you heard of them?
Oh no, I haven't, But I like this hot daddy on the on the front.
What is that clip art you caught?
Where's that cana cana?
Yeah, there's like a muscle daddy on the front.
So okay, So Magic Spoon is a line of cereals. It started off just being sold on the internet. You saw ads on Facebook all the time.
Like your podcast never was. So we're sponsored by farm Lane for Daies think you so much Harmly Fresh dairies.
Oh can you eat cow's milk? Drink cows milk?
Perfect amazing, But like they sponsored a whole bunch of stuff because they're like they're really leaning into like millennial focused advertising. So they were on a ton of podcasts like you want a Healthy Cereal Magic Spoon, but not Cereal podcasts now. I think it's because we've trashed I think four out of five of them.
See, that's the one thing. I don't really think that a cereal company could sponsor us because we would just crap on them if we didn't like it, you know, you know we we like to tell the truth and tell things how it is, and if it's not good, we're gonna say it's not good. So anyway, Magic Spoon started as just internet only. Now you can get them at Target, Walmart, big supermarkets and everything. And these are like ten dollars a box.
Ten Well, Cereal has gone up in general, Mike, cos it has, it has, so you have to that's a lot of money to spend for not a lot of flavor.
Right, so this this is cinnamon roll flavor. We have not had very good experience with Magic Spoon. Cereals. This is probably like the six or seventh one, and I think only one of them we did not spit out.
Okay, do they all have like some sort of muscled ad on the front they all things?
Yeah, they all have the strange box, aren't like that?
I don't know if we have any.
I know, I think one of them has like Ursula, but like their version of ursula, like a weird.
It's ever like a gay that's working on the graphic Yeah, yes, right, yes, and then it is canvying.
And the bag is like only three quarters full. So after all that, it's ten bucks for seven ounces of nothing. So anyway, it.
Looks nice, yes, yeah, like the meaning like the it looks like the graphic design person definitely was like they just got out of college.
They've got their first job. They're working at Magic Spoon. They're doing the thing.
Yeah, they're trying.
And I could tell you. The problem that we always have with Magic Spoon is it it goes. It starts off okay, and then once you have it in your mouth for more than about five seconds, it turns to complete horse craft.
I've had Zeal do that.
Yeah, it has that weird taste.
Because it's grain free. Why are they proud that it's grain free.
I guess gluten free people like them or something.
I don't know.
So I'm gonna go back to the formula of Fresh Dairy's fridge.
I'm going to inspect their their word, their word jumble in the back.
It's also too much like I mean, this is unappealing to me, Like, give me three words, not twenty seven.
It's very moonshine. They have moonshine. This is a word here.
It's a young hip cereal.
Oh pardner, that's spelled in the dialect version partner not partner.
I'm trying to see if we have any Andrew.
He won't let me.
I found moonshine, young moonshine.
Yeah, perfect, there's probably a better off with moonshine. But we're using Farmland, Fresh Areas organic whole milk today.
Oh so, Ben, I'm excited, don't be Oh you already milks mine? I milk.
It's it smells. It smells a little bit like a cinnamon roll.
It's giving cinnamon right. It's looking yeah, it's looking vaguely like I'm trying to mat they.
Look like fruit loops, but not fruity colored.
It looks a little bit like you've got honey smacks in there. Almost.
But yeah, okay, okay, not bad, right, Yeah, keep chowing.
This one might not turn.
I don't right right, my first bite is probably fine. It's nice. It has more flavor than my cashi. I feel like you.
Failed us on this one, Scott. I was expecting bad. I got somewhat decent.
That's fine.
Yeah, she's not bad.
In fact, I like the airy texture.
It is an interesting texture.
I kind of like your podcast gets sponsored by Magic Spoon after.
We invite Magic Spoon to be a sponsor of Watcher Craps.
I mean, look, it's not spectacular, it's not incredibly sweet. It tastes healthy, and it doesn't have that that after Stevia slash bean crap taste that we get usually from these type of cereals. So it's not horrific.
I would dare to say, I actually like it.
Yeah, wow, I like.
It shockingly decent. I do you know a rating skill? No, okay, so what we do is a bowl is like a full star. A spoon is like a half a star.
Up to five balls. Yeah, so I'm simply going to give it two balls because it's not as bad as I thought, but I don't love these type of cereals.
I'm going to give it three bowls in a spoon, Like it's really not bad for a cinnamon cereal. She's it's a nice alternative. Yeah, I think I like three bowls in a spoon. Yeah, I think that's I think that's just right. It's like, it's not a top tier. It's definitely no special k No, it's not a honey nut cheurio.
And it doesn't have like the indulgent fun of a frosted flake or like a cover above. I feel you on that, but it's actually like quite tasty, and I really do enjoy this airy texture. But would you go.
Pay ten bucks a bocks for this? Or are you just gonna buy honey nut curios for a dollar ninety nine when it's on sale you ten dollars?
Ten dollars may actually knock it down, spoon.
Oh, look at that. I don't do it by pricing. But you know the.
Value is not great. But if we weren't considering value.
I mean you can it's your rating.
I guess you know. I know I'm still gonna I'm gonna rate it based on you know, because sometimes if someone were to serve it to you, if you're at someone's house and they're like, here's some cereal, you're not considering values. I'm gonna Keep'm gonna keep it out of three bowls on this moon.
And this actually was served to us by one of our listeners, Matt sent this to us, so we didn't pay for it. So what the hell.
I'm finishing my entire my entire cup of cereal.
That's I'm very impressed.
For a party. Get you actually can take the match, Yes.
Please do, but make sure you guys take a picture first, so listen, I get a bell. I'm so sorry. This is a day where I just have a lot of my plate. I feel like Andrew today were so busy, so busy, lots of meetings, lots of schedule things. Uh so I'm gonna go. You guys, do what you want. Yeah, I mean, hey, feel free to dive into some of the old rantid cereal. I won't do that, you know, Try what you want, Maria. Yeah, that's yeah. It's been sitting there for months and months and months, and it's
probably opened. The bag is ripped open. So just enjoy the staleness. All right, so thank you so much. Thank it was pleasure, absolutely pleasure to you.
And next time he comes back, we'll do a full episode. But now we'll go into more of a bull chat. Hey do your thing great, you have a mic.
Now I'm going to take over this mic. Here.
All I do is press the stop record button.
Well, you just press the stop and then just title it with this keyboard here, okay, and then enter and it'll save it.
I'll sunday. Thank you.
I take my little cups here for Oh wow, you're actually taking things home.
That's a surprise. Yeah.
Nice, Okay, great, bye Scott, Bye Scott, we'll miss you.
You guys can just go ahead talk.
I think I forgot something.
Okay, well great, awesome, okay, So a huge fan of the podcast.
Thank you very much. Ten out of ten, thank you. And you've been doing it for ten years twelve years? Twelve? Yes, oh wow, that is a whole bag of marshmallows, I can. Yeah, that's wild. Yeah, we've been doing watcher crappings for twelve years. We started in yeah, twenty twelve. Wow, which is wild.
I know it's crazy. So, like, what made you want to start like did you and Ronnie just hit it off immediately?
Like where'd you guys meet? Yeah, So I used to blog. That's like my origin story is blogging. I started a bloger twenty years ago with my friend and the blog it was called tv Gasm, and we used to write recaps of TV and at that time, no one was doing TV recaps and so it was like it became it really blew up and wound up actually selling the blog, which is wild. That was really the peak of like what everyone was like, Wow, blogs, What's this new exciting
thing that's gonna be here forever. So we were able to cash. So then we were now like official bloggers and we were like, you know, we were working. We were bought by Beata Murray Productions, which did like the Real World and the Challenge and all that stuff, and so now we needed to like build out our blogging staff and so we had we sort of like put out the word like, hey, submit to write, and so Ronnie he submitted and his sample was really good. So
he started writing for TV gasm. And he lived in La so I'd met him a few times and he was really cool, really funny. So that's how we met and then fast forward to twenty ten or eleven or so, and I had left TV Gasm, I'd started a new blog, and that new blog, I had started to blog about the Real Housewives, and I got hired to host a web show about the Real housewives called Housewives Hodown and
naturally I love that title. Yes, And so my job as the host was that I always had to bring on guests, and so I would bring on Ronnie because I knew that he was covering the Real Housewives at TV gasm and he's funny also, yeah, and so I'd bring him on and we just had like a lot of fun doing it. And also my friend Matt, I'd bring him on, and the three of us always had
like really good chemistry. And then the web show, the network that the web show was on, just went down, and so but we still really enjoyed doing what we did. So we thought, like, let's start a podcast.
Yeah, you know, and I feel like you were early to the podcast game, like twelve years ago, like nobody was doing podcasts yeah, or if they did, it was like a we don't really know how to get it. Hope for the best, like maybe we'll find it some place like there were.
Definitely were podcasts enough that there was you know, the Apple Podcasts store Ateah that time, it was like there was a podcast action on iTunes and there were podcasts, but it was really Cereal that made podcasting like a thing that like everyone particular like Mainsture, it made it mainstream. He made a thing that like a viable form of entertainment for people. So yeah, we were I think maybe about two years before Cereal. Cereal, Yeah, we started podcasting. We invented it.
I think you were actually the first podcast yeah for sure. Yeah, sure, yeah, we came up with the word wow. Love that. So what Housewives did you like? Would you say?
Is?
I know Diamond touched on it, but what's like your favorite version of the Housewives.
Well, I've always loved Ronnie. Ronney has always been my absolute favorite, like number one. Like I just I think Rony is It's just perfection and I've always loved it. I don't love the new cast. I just don't think that they have the right energy.
The only one I've seen is this new one, and I have to tell you, I was kind of like, I don't really know what's going on here.
Yeah, I think that Bravo cast it to be like, look at these these like five fabulous or six fabulous women that you can be friends with, and like, I don't want to be friends with my real housewives. Now. I want to laugh at their delusion. I want to like see them and say, how do these people exist in a real world? How do these people go to a restaurant and act like this? That's what I go.
For for a real housewife.
Same, I don't go for like this is the real New York like this is I want to like, Oh my god, I just want to sit and watch fashion influencers. I don't, I don't. I curse.
Yeah, I don't give a fuck. No, no, no, no, Like when I watch reality TV, I feel like I grew up in reality TV, like Flavor of Love, legit, Like that was my eighth grade high school experience was Flavor of Love. So for me, I'm like, the more delusional, the better. So when it's not and you're trying to make me feel who is coming through on this mic? This is the fun part about these studios. We don't know how they work. Hey Diamond, I can hear you
in here? Oh, I can hear you in here? No, no, I can hear you, can hear you.
She doesn't get it. You're a guest on Serial Killers at the moment.
Hold on, maybe I move one of these two.
I don't know about touching these yea.
So this controls like all of New York in here, and so I'm just casually like great, yeah, now, oh great, it's fixed, amazing, exciting, great, Okay, so we're back to the show. Amazing, show, fabulous, fun, little technical difficulties.
By the way, should I be like looking at the camera like well we talk or looking at some times I look at that and I'm like, I don't. Then I feel like i'm too It's like NPR, like the NPR skit on SNL. I never saw that. Oh sorry baby, sorry.
But yes, flavor of love. I want delusional I love delusional reality people. I don't understand the trend of trying to make them normalized, like they.
Are not normal. It's I think a lot of it is that it's like it's shortsighted attempts to you know. I think in the past few years, there's been obviously a lot of discussion about giving terrible people platforms in American culture and and the and the dangers that come with that, which is I think a totally important thing to discuss, and it's also very valid. We do not want to be giving terrible people platforms because it's way more insidious than we ever expected the ramifications of that.
That being said, for the Real House delusions, how about we do more public service announcements like please don't like, let's watch these people make fun of them and like, let's not take any lessons from them. Okay, like let's not. And I think what happened was that Bravo may have tried to like pivot a little too hard into like we're not gonna we don't we want to give like fresh exciting faces a platform. Instead, it's like yeah, but like make them delusion, make sure they're still delusional.
Yes, you have to cast a delusion otherwise, like why are we doing a show? Yeah, there's no point.
We need to be able to make fun of them, Like I just don't think that I'm tuning in to to feel like these people are my friends. That being said, I I have watched Tomorrow Night's Summer House, and I can't say anything because it's embargoed, but I was definitely watching along like they were my friends. I was sitting there like with like my like my chin on my on my wrist, just like giggling. Like every time Page Disorbo made a joke, Page, I'm like, you know, you're
she's not talking to you, Ben right. So I can aspire and I can blur those lives.
But just once the summer comes around, they tape in New York. You haven't been invited to a Summer House party.
A years ago. I went to the Summerhouse in season two.
I love that.
Yeah, So, so Ronny and I would watch for Crappins. We do live shows, and the very first big live show we ever did was here in New York City, and that was during season one of Summerhouse, and we invited Kyle Cook and so Kyle came with Amanda and Christina Gibson who was on season one came, and Steven who was on season one and two came. So the four of them came to our live show, which is
really cool. And as it happened, after that live show, I was going out to the Hamptons because my friends have a house there which is very boogie, and I was like a step into the boogie life. And so I told them. I was like, yeah, I'm going out to the Hamptons this weekend. They're like, oh, you gotta come to the house. You gotta come house. I was like yes. So we went to the house and like, were they filming? They were filming. I'm proud to say I was fully
edited out of the footage deemed worthy. Damn. Yeah, but it was great. It was so fun to be in the summerhouse. Yeah.
They tried to do a reality show once years ago. We're good Diamond, thank you the show. They tried to do reality show years ago, and so like we were miked for a scene and I was like, oh my god, Like, where is this gonna go?
Wait? What was the reality show that you were at? Oh?
I can hear you again?
Can I do these things?
I don't know what that means? What does take out of Q means? Oh, that's also doctor Brad, the foot doctor from my feet are killing me. Oh, you never know who's gonna stop y.
Does he do foot massages? Can I get a message? Probably it's probably like insulting he's a doctor? Yeah, so true, so true? Can I get a ful massage? Make it hurt? Nice to meet you. I hear you do something with me? Can I get a fit massage? Oh? I don't know. This is a scary board. Sorry, we've learned things now. Yeah we should have known.
I'm not Union. I can't touch the board. Oh okay, sorry, not a party, sag Aftra, thank you. So yeah, they micd us. It was supposed to be a whole scene and we were at a restaurant and I was supposed to like bring up the scene if it was for Summerhouse. No, this was for like the reality that they were going to do of the Morning Show. Oh yes, like we had cameras filming for like two weeks.
Never when this is a real basically yeah.
And it was like I just remember sitting in the restaurant. I had to bring up like the plot because I was Elvis's assistant, So I had to one of the people we were out with, like she was planning her own show, and they were.
Like, you have to say the line like Elvis is counting.
On you, likely in the middle of like this lunch that's going nowhere. I had to be like, you better not mess up because Elvis is really worried about this show. No wonder why it's on the cutting room floor, like no drama whatsoever. Commercial break, commercial break.
I should have flipped the table, Yeah, you should have. I mean it's interesting. So I've I've never been a reality star, but i have I've like flirted with the experiences like I was at I was at the Summer House. Yeah. I did. A huge Big Brother fan even though the show, I mean it's a terrible show. You're you know, you're safe. But like Big Brother, what they used to do is they would have like, uh, it's called media Day, and they would invite members of the media into the Big
Brother House. This is like a like maybe like a week or two weeks ahead of the season to promote the show. They'd invite members of the media into the Big Brother House and you'd spend the whole day there and have like the Big Brother experience. And so you do, like you'd all be in the house together. You do like a Head of Household competition. You do like a Veto competition. There's nominees all this stuff, and you're micd up. You go into the diary room and at the end
they edit together a little episode. And so it was obviously a dream come true for me to be in the Big Brother House. I got to go in because my friend Joe Adallion, who was a TV writer or critic, he like like sort of sponsored me. He said, like, oh, Ben's going to write something for whatever the publication was that maybe it's like the rap I don't know, some bizarre fine. So I got to go in and it was so fun and I got to like be like pretend to be a reality star for a day. It was.
It was so fun getting micd up, you know, and like, so I did it two years in a row. In the first year, I did it like as if I were playing Big Brother, which was I was like pretty chill. I didn't want to make a splash. And when I watched the DVD, I was like, not on it. They had me. I was like for like one diary room and I was like, that's so wrong. So the second year, I was like reality star and I was like, this
is how it happens, because you get that bug. Because I went in the second season and I was like loud and brash. I didn't care who overheard me strategizing. I was like and I was all over that DVD and I was like, I was like, people like I don't know I was like, I was the bane of people's existences and I'm in my mind I was Everyone's probably like, oh man was very nice. You watch it back and you're like, sorry, excuse me, I'm so sorry. I just want to make a strategy.
Strategy with you?
Can I make strategy? But like I totally could see how that bug for like screen time, Yeah, takes over.
For sure for I. Like, so I am a huge Survivor fan, so r I was like.
I'm two episodes behind.
I haven't watched anything since forty The episodes.
Are so long right now, Like I watched the first two episodes of this season and they're both two hours long. I'm like, we don't, Like it's a lot.
I feel like that's what fans always wanted, but now that they got it, it's like, did we really need it?
It's just it's hard and like they have added so many convoluted things, especially in the beginning of the season. It's like, all right, people are going to go on a journey and they go up to a mountaintop and one person gets this, and one person gets that, and then this there's this type of immunity in this advantage. That advantage too much. Just let me play what in the movie itols. That's fine, get.
Do that too too much? I so season thirty seven and thirty eight, I was actually I made it to finals casting like I was about to beat on it and I got cut. But it was like you had to stay isolated and by yourself for the casting, and I disliked that immensely.
Yeah, they put you in a hotel, right, yeah that's for a while. Yeah.
It was like a full week of just like by yourself. You eat by yourself, you go to like producers meetings and you're just there.
It's like, yeah, what am I doing? This is scary? Yeah, it's they gotta like get you through that. So that way the didn't know if you're really My friend went through that and he got all the way to the end.
And then yes, Scott bowting, Yes, no, okay, I can hear you though. Hey Scott, you're on speaker now.
Hey, I'm sorry to interrupt. I don't know about you guys, but I now have like a film on the top of my mouth. I've already had to drink two bottles of water because whatever this cereal did to me, So I might have to.
Amend my rating.
Oh okay, Oh wow, so you called into amend your rating? Okay, go for it. Yeah, sure, what are you doing?
So?
I'm pretty sure I gave it two balls. I need to drop it down a spoon to a ball in a spoon because of the after effects.
That's all a film on your mouth.
Yeah, it seems a little critical. I'm not gonna lie. I don't feel the film.
I don't have the film. No, no, I don't.
Maybe maybe it interacts with my salaiva differently than it does with yours. But if it happened to me, it could happen to others, so they lose a spoon.
It's well, thank you so much, Scott. We appreciate you.
Take care. No bye, Wow, that's so bizarre. I don't have any but I wonder I've been sort of sipping this coffee. Maybe the coffee, the acid in the coffee is dissolving the film.
I've literally had nothing.
I really enjoyed that cereal and.
It's been bad. Like the chocolate one is like not it, not it? But that was decent. Yeah, I like a decent one. But anyway, reality people not for me, no, maybe one day, who knows, But for right now, I don't know.
It's like it's fun to visit. It's fun to visit the world. Like I love seeing you know, I live in La I love encountering a reality show shoot. I feel like one of the most special things that ever happened to me is that I once went to a bar and Audrina was filming a scene for The Hills, Yeah, and I was like, I got to be there. I got to see a scene from the Hills being filmed,
Like that's that was at that time. That was the dream to be somewhere and they were filming for The Hills and I got to see her on a date with Ryan Cabrera and I.
Was that was peak two thousands right there.
Oh my god, you don't even know what a dream that was for me. Wow.
So that one was fully scripted, though.
So I think it was largely scripted. So from my understanding of it was that the scenes and the scenarios were scripted, but they what they actually said in them, It was it was like it was like not scripted interactions. I think that like that's a a thing with reality TV I believe, is that obviously there's a good amount of scripting and manipulation. But I think like the worst reality shows are like truly all scripted, where where they're
really like their lines and there's all of it. It's lines and you can tell and you can tell yeah, because if these people were good actors, they wouldn't be doing reality TV.
So accurate right completely, Like yes, they definitely have. And this is what I try and explain to people, especially when it comes to like Real Housewives. There are storyboards, like they know that point like this character throughout the season is going through a divorce, So how is the divorce going to interact with this?
Yes? And how do we get from point A to point B? And I've been told that like like, for instance, certain shows, there's a show I heard about that a producer like I think it was Jersey Delicious, Like I'm so sorry, wow, Okay, it's like they decide they know where they want the show to go and then they work back where it's like, okay, how can we get
the characters to get to this place? Got it? And so there is that, But I think that the best shows, if it is scripted, like highly scripted, you don't see the scene. So I actually really think the Real Housewives are top tier because the interactions often feel very organic, like some of the stuff they say in the confessionals like you know it's planned, or like you also can tell if maybe they said something and the producer said
that was really good. Can you kind of just like say it like this instead or build tighter Like sometimes I'll have them re say something.
It's a show at the end of the day, so you want the best product.
But what I don't like is when it's literally just so obvious that like this has been something that's been written and these people like got a lot of the a lot of like a lot of the shows on E are like that are really high scripted, and they sit there and they're like doing singsong e. It's like it's like watching a sixth grade play and they're like the other day, I was really upset with when she said that. It makes me wonder, like is she even a friend? I don't know?
Okay, wait, so there was a show me and my friend Miranda love watching one season. Wonder reality shows like only one season give me the worst of the worst. So Tinsley from the Housewives Right the Diamond was obsessed with she had a show one season two thousand and eight.
Yeah, it was a highlight or something like that.
Yes, have you ever seen it?
Uh huh? It is so bad.
Yeah, when we're talking scripted, like there's just that random woman Devora God, I forgot about that. Oh I've watched it at least three times. Like that is we watch it?
You know. The thing is that it's fantastic. It's the celebrity reality shows that are the that are the biggest defenders because celebrities actually have an image that they're trying to protect and they so they are very like is always highly high scripted, which is why I generally don't
watch the celebrity reality shows. But sometimes there are somewhere like despite the scripting, like the weird shit comes through, like Whitney and Bobby Brown when they had their show that was like you were you cannot script Whitney Houston asking Bobby Brown to like wipe off a dingleberry from her ass, or Paula Abdul like sobbing through her show.
I never liked either of those, but I do remember the Whitney Houston one, the scene when they're in I think the Las Vegas strip mall and they're like trying on glasses and doing like the head bobbing thing. Ten out of ten.
Those are both Bravo shows actually, which is the craziest part really Bravo shows. There was like obviously the I think the first big or maybe the first ever celebrity reality show was The Osbourne's, which was such a big team And I remember when that show ended and they they did like a bit where it was like clear that they were like saying lines that were and I was like, I could not believe it. I thought it was all.
I thought, you guys were really doing these things.
The Osborne's was such a thing. I think people forget about that it was such a thing.
Yeah, it's like an early yeah, the first of its kind in like the family style reality show that doesn't didn't really exist before then.
It was part of the first wave of a reality TV. It was like you know, in that first from two thousand to like two thousand and four or five, Yes, that all those all everything was being thrown at the wall.
This Surreal Life was my other personal.
Favorite love Surreal Life.
That one also didn't feel scripted, like I can't. It just felt like these people truly didn't know how they got into this house, Yeah, and why they were there.
Yeah. I wonder like, at what point did scripting become more, like when did it really start to take over? Because I know for sure by two thousand and five there was a lot of scripting because I used to be a segment producer on a show called Reality Rundown on the Fox Reality Network. Oh okay, and so I'd have to watch these awful reality shows, like a Ted Nugent show or like just these random you've seen the worst
of the worst. Yeah, there was a show like Amy Grant and like not good, not like Three Wishes or something. It was like Amy Grant's like fixing Communities. I love that, but just not Amy Grant. I was so happy to do an Amy Grant show, but it was the show. And there's like Lisa Lobe had like a dating show, all these weird things.
Oh, Morosa had a random one on like a public access channel that people forget about.
I love a Morossa. I love her so much.
She's a great reality villain.
Again.
I think she plays it extremely well, like she knows she has to be a character, but at the same time, like.
So good at it, Like she's been doing that for twenty years being Amerosa and I met her once and like I just felt so connected to her. She was the best, Like we were just like we liked hugged. We just became friends and like I don't know if she still follows me on Instagram. I don't know if I don't know if she still remembers me. But like I loved her, I loved I loved Amerosa.
My question is just say Beverly Hills now, we talk about like acting being too much, it kind of taints the formula of the show. I feel like the Beverly Hills now is just all actresses. Like I don't know when that started, but I just don't feel like it has sort of moved into like soap opera.
Yeah, you know, I'm okay with that because it does represent a certain kind of miliea of nice word yeah, thank you. I invented that too with podcasting.
Wow, the originator of a word no.
But because there is like what's so interesting about Beverly Hills is that there's this there is this like group of people who were all like either child stars or soap stars or just sort of like this mid pack tier of actors you know that are like they're not quite D lists, because I think reality stars are now the D list. Yeah, but they're like they're definitely not A lists and they're not really B lists. Like it's like they do soaps, soaps pretty much, yeah, yeah, and
go back home. And then they're also connected. There's a they're all connected. There's this an incestuous group of David Foster and O J. Simpson and they and the Kardashians. They all are connected. This all they're all really like bound by that O. J. Simpson murder if you really look at it, they're all connected to it.
If there was one person then in the LA circle that you think could be on that show, Like, so there is no Teresa, there is nobody moving the plot forward. Do you think that show needs someone like that there?
I would like that. I think it needs it. I think it needs like someone I think it needs a little bit of an agitator disrupt her. You know, Brandy was that for a little bit, and then.
I think she leaned too hard into being an actress and then didn't work for her.
For Brandy Landville, yeah.
I think she really just kind of, like I don't know, fought her own hype and that's kind of what led to the downfall.
Well, Brandy's downfall is that she's completely spiraling in the wake of this whole thing going on with the girl's trip, Ye, with the allegations with her and Caroline, and you know she we've seen Brandy she's she's a mess, but like she's sort of Brandy and she's like she's and Caroline was like, I don't want to deal with that, Like she's clearly Brandy was doing the Brandy thing and Carolina did not want it whatsoever, which is totally within Caroline's
rights and Brandy. I think it seems like without seeing the footage, knowing that Brandy should have just been like, Okay, I went too far and I'm really sorry. I should have respected Caroline's boundaries. I thought that, like it was gonna be funny, but instead she's been out of control on social media, like going after Bravo, doubling down, and it's like, oh, Brandy, no, what are we doing?
Like this sense just get over it, like say you're sorry.
You're sorry, move on, say your save your reality career. But now she's going to be like untouchable.
Who knows, maybe she'll wind up, does Foctor reality still exist.
It turned into Nagio. What yes, I'm so sorry, what yes? It turned into nat Giou in two thousand and seven or eight.
Well, maybe she'll get a nice dating show. The Naccio will make a show for her something.
I guarantee that, Like, you know, she's proven now that she's a liability and now she's I think joining Beth neew the reality reckoning. I don't know what's nice for Brandy, but it's fingers crossed for the only fans money. Maybe that's probably the next up.
Yeah, to feel bad, But at the same time, it's like I don't know something about I just think that she just watching that show and just seeing her come back and beyond these things. It's again it felt like very much a character, like she knows she has to be an agitator, which there's a natural way to do it.
And she was. I don't say she was doing a good job. I mean she was. She did really good job on The Traders. She was on Watched the Traders. It's so good.
God, is the Traders that good?
It's better than you could ever imagine. Really, okay, I mean better like you don't even investing. Watch both seasons. Season two was phenomenal. Season one was great as well. Just go watch season one, then watch season two, then you will you will never be happier. I've converted so many friends to it, people who don't watch reality TV.
I've heard it's like an escape room meets, Like there's so many fun little puzzles that they do and sort of.
It's really like the game Mafia. You ever played Mafia? I love Mafia.
That's one of my favorites.
Oh, it's just it's Mafia. It's literally it's like watching reality stars play Mafia.
I love that.
All it is. It's all it is. It's literally like you have a large cast and you know, some of them are traders, the rest are faithful, and the traders are murder are quote unquote murdering the faithful, and the faithful are trying to find the traders. And that's all it is. And they throw in competitions. The competitions don't really make sense because they don't do anything. They just throw them in because some executive was like, well, we
need to show something for the trailer. We need action, but like yeah, we need action, but like we don't need it, Like it doesn't have any consequence to the strategy or the implications or anything, but like who cares. The competitions are fun, but they're useless, unnecessary. The show is so good in yeah, yeah, I'll watch that one. You will love it.
Okay, So Catan board games, whitch your favorite board game?
My favorite board game of all time is a game called Concordia.
Shut.
Do you know that I love Concordia?
Okay, yes, Concordia is the love that game. It's all the best elements of Catan. Yes, where it's like you're never bored, meaning like you're always picking something up and there's some so much fun strategy involved.
Concordia is such a brilliant game because the strategy is deep and the choices are hard, and it's really tense and the rule set is really small. Yeah, and I play like a ton of board games, and like, I love games with tons and tons of rules, like Catan is often considered a gateway game because that's the first time you get your bite of like, oh, this is what board games can be. It's not just monopoly, it's not just you know.
Sorry, currency, there's strategy, there's so many control and you're like, I remember So I played Catan for the first time ten years ago, twenty fourteen, big big moment in my life.
I played it and I was like, I did not know a board game could be this utterly amazing. In fact, I did not know a game could fill me with these emotions. I was at a bachelor party weekend in Lake Tahoe, and all I wanted to do all weekend along with play Catan. I just want to play it over and over and over, like I just I could not get enough. It was like can so relate? It
was like the world opened up to me. And then I started researching other board games and I got into the board game hobby, and Concordia is like a great next step. Although you can play, I've played it with people who've never played real like strategy strategy games, and that one's so good, but like there is such a world of games out there you don't know.
Diplomacy is the one that I really want to play, but I heard it takes an entire day and I just don't know if I have it in me.
So I used to be scared of that too. I've actually never played Diplomacy. The other thing I hear about diplomacy is that it ruins friendships.
So I want to play it though, Like I'm into that, Like I want to watch people strategize, like that brings me joy.
I'm not I'm still not sure about diplomacy. But what I will say is when I first heard about diplomacy, it was like, yeah, it's a game, but it takes six hours, and it's like, what, that's insane. Now I will now play a game that will be like twelve hours long, and it's fine, Right, It's fine because like, who cares if it's twelve hours. You're to be able to spend twelve hours with your friends playing a game
where you're all doing something together. Given that, like going out to dinner with your best friends, that'll be like a two hour experience. So to be able to spend twelve hours with your with your.
Favorite people with that yelling at each other, yeah, hoping to your best reality villain self without a needing.
To Yeah, you really can do that, diplomacy is obviously legendary. I really enjoy a game called Twilight Imperium. If you're talking about an epic game, I've never heard of this. It's a game that you have to gather at like ten am and you're gonna play it till midnight. Wow, and that's great. That's a big epic space game. I'm not even like a space sci fi guy. But you have like your spaceships and you build up your fleet and you go attack people. It's really fun.
I've never heard of this game, Twilight Imperium.
It's a big one in the hobby. A really good strategy game is one called Brass Birmingham or Brass Lancaster, Lancaster Great Games or like economic simulators. Okay, I've never heard of that one. Oh no, this I'm telling you. There's a in there's so many.
I tried playing. So they had a Catan Settlers of America. Okay, the rule book was way too big, Like I was confused.
All right, well you know sometimes well they're I'm sure there's like a video that might help. I try.
It's usually the same three people, like they're really getting off on just one of those three. Someone's making money.
There's always like someone like sitting on like a wide shot, a static wide shot, being like and they do like a sing song any thing when you move your thing. Now you do this, play a card and then you take the action. They're trying to They always try to do like a newscaster voice, and it's like, but what happens is always the same things. You start like getting lulled asleep.
You have a good audiobook voice.
I feel like you get in. Oh thank you.
Yeah, maybe I'll keep podcasting.
It's great. Listen. If someone wants to pay me to do the audiobook. That way, I can say I actually read, because I'm actually be like literally reading the book. Do you do Audible? Do I do Audible? Audible as a sponsor of Watch for Crappens, We love Audible.
Also a sponsor of our morning show, So we love Audible.
We love Audible. So good.
They're books, chefs.
Good.
Let me think, what other games do you like?
Ticket to Ride? So I okay, yes, Ticket to Ride is great.
Europe is the better version.
Europe is the better version. It's also a simple game. However, that being said, so Ticket to Ride would also fall under the Gateway game thing. And the thing is with Gateway games is they're always great. I just played Catan again like three weeks ago, and so, like, I still play my Gateway games, and it's always I love playing them, especially bring new people into the hobby. But what happens is as you explore these games, For me, my experience is that you sort of you find games that build
upon those that are just even deeper and richer. And so while Ticket to Ride is great and I always will have fun playing it, like, there are is like a world of train games that takes ticket to ride and just like it's like on.
Crack and get passengers on the train? How is the train moving a game?
There are elements actually and then there's so like while Ticket to Ride is great, like I want some more meat on the bones. So and there are these games I play a whole genre of games that they're very niche, but I'm making it my mission to make them not niche. I want to I want to train these games because I think they're great and I think that they they're actually more accessible than their reputation is known for the genre. It sounds to an outside of the genre, sounds wacky.
It's they're called eighteen x X games, which sounds very desultory. What it sounds like porn in eighteen xx. So it's it's a series of train games that all seem to take place in like the eighteen hundred's okay, so is so like one game is called eighteen thirty one, game is called eighteen forty one, games called eighteen twenty two, so they just call them all eighteen xx. Great, So yeah, it's just it just sounds like porn. It sounds like
barely legal porn. Yeah, but it's actually just a they're just economic train games.
And saying it's an economic train game on the box doesn't sound as fun as eighteen xx.
Maybe get that like.
Random person who's walking in and like, ooh dirty trains.
Yeah, but they are like great they take those are like all day games. They're all long. Some people say I can play one in three hours.
Google what this box looks like for an eighteen xx.
They're not like, so let's see what's a good box? Look up like eighteen twenty two MX. These names are really they just fly off the tip of the tongue.
Eighteen twenty two MX.
That's the one that takes place in Mexico and has a nice, a nicer box.
Oh this looks fun, Okay, yeah.
Isn't it? Isn't that pretty? I like it? Well, I chose that one because I like the color scheme. Which is so okay, here's my this is the elevator pitch that I do. I'm now looking at the camera because now I'm no longer a dressing you. I'm addressing America. I've been addressing you the entire time I've been sitting here hiding behind my camera like this. But now, okay,
imagine ticket to Ride. Okay, And for those who don't know, Ticket to Ride is basically like you have a map of America or Europe or Europe or many other places. Actually actually a new Ticket to Ride legacy that came out that's supposed to be great. Okay, But you're making
these routes. You're making train routes. There's train tracks that reach across the map, and you're trying to connect like I don't know, like maybe La to like Phoenix or something, or like New York to Pittsburgh, and you're just you're putting these little pieces on and when you put up enough pieces on the track, you've made your connection and you get points. Right. That's the that's the gist of it. And so imagine Ticket to Ride. And imagine if I'm watching,
I'm like, you know, Andrew is doing really well. I would like to invest in Andrew, and if he does well, I mean to get a kickback. Like I've just bought used. I bought us, like you have a stock, like you have shares. You are a public company. There are ten shares of Andrew, and I'm gonna buy twenty percent of Andrew because I believe he's playing Ticket to Ride really well. And then you do do really well, it's like, oh, I just got five dollars off of that, because not
real dollars to game dollars. I got five dollars because your performance was so good. Wow. And now it's like I'm not only caring about what I'm trying to do. I care about what you're doing, and maybe I want to help you do well because I mean to get a kickback. And that is sort of an overly simplistic view of what AIGHT and XX games are, which is that like you are building a map, yeah, building routes, but you're investing in people and in your stuff and
I love that. The way that the decisions unfold from that is it's remarkable. It's like my favorite thing.
I can see a lot of fights starting from that, because if like I'm choosing to invest in you, but like I'm not investing in someone else, like I could see that causing some controversy.
You can get some controversy there. You can block people's routes, you can destroy their trains, like.
I am one hundred.
It's really like it's not for everyone, but I think it's for more people than people realize. And there's a there is like math involved, Like that's where people get turned off. It's like because you have to calculate, Like okay, because you get money for the routes, like on my route from you know, Trenton, New Jersey to Philadelphia is gonna get me thirty dollars or whatever, and I've got to divide that amongst all the shareholders. But you just
got a calculator. Yeah, it's easy, like whatever type it in and divide. Yeah.
Usually I'm not the math guy. I leave that to someone else, but there's always someone at the table does the math for sure. I'm good at Catan is nice because I can resource draw, like oh my god, here's your brick, Like that's easy for me.
What's the best part about Catan is I think all the table talk is really fun, like all the like negotiating, like that's so fun and you know you can just do it for hours.
Yeah, last do you like the expansions of Catan? So I don't actually own any of the expansions. I'm possible to play the tabletop version. You always have to play it on Steam. It is not fun in person.
What the which one?
Like the city is in Cities and Knights and Seafarers. So I've done big not fun. I've played them both.
I have. I mean I have that the five and six player expansion, but I've played Seafares, which was fun, but it just is like a bigger map, right Yeah, and the Cities and Knights. I played it once and I enjoyed it, And some people say that's the best way to play it.
It's the only way I play it, really. Yeah, it's the engine, and it it changes the whole game, right, like because you're now there's like an extra thing you have to worry about pirates, which is like what you have to worry about, like where everybody else is going. There's tiles that you're flipping over. So much more fun, way better game.
That's what everyone says. But I do enjoy the purity of just Catan for sure.
Sometimes fun to go back to the original the og And yeah.
I've definitely heard that once you do Cities and Knights, like you just sort of that like that just becomes the way you play.
It's a deeper strategy for sure. And then Original Catan. I don't know, especially with new timers, it's like I wouldn't say it's easy to kind of manipulate the game, but it's a little easier.
Yeah. I mean that's the other thing is that I like the purity, and I also am afraid that if I went to Cities and Knights it might ruin the basic game for me. And then I like having the base game as like this special, like clean experience there. Yeah.
My friend Josh who got me into Katan probably literally the same time as you, he refuses to play any expansion. He's like, I'm only sticking with Catan. There's way better games out there than Katan. I'm gonna stick with you O, like just that keep it simple.
Yeah, And like I play expansions for like literally every other game, but I just with the Catan. I keep it classic. I want the classic Catan experience. Let me think of what.
Other ones I like.
I know I would love to know what other games you're you're playing, and.
There's one I really I own, Like I bought this one off today. I was so prepped and ready for it. The rules were impossible, and I'm telling you I tried, I really tried. But this was supposed to be like Mafia meets like a Concordia, like it fit all the things that I wanted currencies involved. There's like a little wheel something AD some.
Like huh something a D but social deduction? Yes? Was it? Was it a the box of a camel or something AD? And it's like, no, it's futuristic like twenty thirty seven or something. Imperial maybe I don't know. There is a game called Imperial twenty thirty that one, oh that one, wait that was that's nothing, But that one has nothing to do with Mafia, right.
So the same by this game thinking that it was nothing, Actually that one's sort of close to Yeah, that one with the alien wait let me see.
Yeah, imperially, by way, there's twilet imperium this one. Yeah, that's the same. That's the same. Designers can actually no way mm hmm huh.
And this game is easy to learn. You've played this so I.
Played it once many years ago, and I could not wrap my brain around it. But I think that now I would because that one's supposed to be like diplomacy and Catan sort of mixed together. Yes, And that one so that one has the idea, right that you are investing in companies and the companies go and they go, they attack each other on a map whatever. That's the
same concept as the eight and XX game. That one actually takes from the eight and xx genre and adapts it to diplomacy because in AH and XX you're investing in companies and those companies build the rails, and in that game, the companies do the map stuff.
Wow, Okay, I need to learn this one, Like.
This is I've I've been meaning to revisit that because I played it in like twenty sixteen or whatever. Yeah, but now that I know the eight and xx genre, I think i'd have a better I would be better able to wrap my brain around how that game works, because it's really hard to think, like you want to think like, oh, this is my company, this is me as a player, but it's actually no, you're investing in that company and you want that company to do well,
but you pull out of it. God, it's not doing well and go to a different company.
Okay, we'll need to set up a board game night for sure, because you and I would love to also like take you to one of the board game stores and show you the games that you might like.
I'd love to show you, like bring you into the hobby in like I know I'm going to go to when I'm when I'm here in New York City, I go to the Complete Strategists that's on Never heard of this. Yeah, it's right by the Empire State Building. It's like thirty third and like fifth Avenue something like that. And then there's a there's a place down by NYU, but it's like very small and cramped. It's called like something grounds Hidden.
No, it's a coffee shop. We have one in Hoboken. It's not as funny either. Do you get can you like bring? Is it like b yo?
Well, the Complete s Tragist is just a board game shop. Oh okay, great, The one by NYU is like a coffee shop whatever with board games, with board games. There a lot of board games, but you can buy board games there too, But like the one, uh, the Complete Tragist has a really a huge selection.
I love that. The problem is my apartment. I'm in a one bedroom. I'm like really trying to find places to put these board games.
Well, what games do you have? You got Imperial twenty thirty.
Yes, I'm Imperial twenty thirty. I have Diplomacy. I buy them thinking like, oh, I'm going to set this up and then nobody is investing with me for you know, my six hour journey to play Diplomacy.
I guarantee you if you do like a little bit of research or you go to board game geek, you could probably find a Diplomacy game to play. There are people out here, there are people in Manhattan or in New York City or Hobo again, that will be that it would be down to play. To play see, I guarantee play it. It just seems so perfect.
Like I love the thought that like afterwards, after you strategize, then you find out like where people are attacking.
So you like all of that. Do you like attacking games? Do you like deception?
I love that. That's like my favorite thing because I like being able to kind of just do your own thing. Usually it's very for me. I have a very simple strategy. I usually just go in and very nice and then like hopefully get ahead and then it's like over and I'm done.
Right, Yeah, I mean your Survivor fans. Yeah, like the backstabbing and all that stuff that is miammo. Do you have you played Secret Hitler? That is one of my favorites. That's my favorite of the social deduction guys. So good, that one is fantastic.
Yes, Quarantine that's how like I got through with my friends.
Did you play? Have you played Dead of Winter?
No?
Oh? Dead of Winter is one of my all time favorites. Okay, again, it's not like the setting is not something that gets something excited, but it's, uh, it's a game where it's a cooperative games. We're all playing together and it's a zombie apocalypse and it's wintertime and we're in like a
we're in like a town. It's being overrun and we have to like we have to like basically survive, but one of us is potentially a trader and working with zombies, not necessarily working with the zombies, but working against us. Like they have their own agenda. Everyone has a private agenda, and everyone's private agenda makes them look like they're the trader, and they're sometimes there isn't even a trader in the game.
It depends on the draw of like your ear agendas, and so you're trying to work together to achieve a goal for the colony, but the trader maybe subverting that and it is that sounds wonderful, so fun. Yes, it's one of my all time favorite games. It is a brilliant, super super fun game. I've never had a bad game of it. It's always been like just just great. I did the Mansion one where it's like you're in a mansion mansions of madness. Yes, I never played that.
Got Italian. Not great.
It's not my style of game.
I didn't really understand what I was doing. I was in a basement. Somehow I got out of the basement. I was very confused, and then we won, and I was like, I don't Yeah, this isn't connect.
Not my type of game where it's kind of like trying to like emulate a sort of like movie or something like that. I don't like that. There's a whole game like the former number one game Gloomhaven. There are all these games that are like campaigns and whatever. I don't want it, no too much. I want strategy, Yes, strategy always yes, and someone make an argument. There is strategy. I get it, I get it, I get it. But it's like storytelling, like I'm good, like well, Dead of Winter.
What's good is that the storytelling sort of comes naturally and flows into it, which is really good. There's an amazing game that's out right now. I don't know if this would be your vibe or not, but it really blew me away. It's called Hegemony, And basically every player plays a different class in society. So the one player plays the working class, one player plays capitalist, one player
plays middle class, and one player plays the state. And you're all working together to try to like not working together. You're all you're trying to advance your segment of society, but you have to rely on each other. So like, the capitalist class hires people from the working class. So but the capitalist class has to pay the working class. The working class needs the jobs, capitalists needs the labor. Middle class serve in the middle, the state needs to get taxes. Geez wi.
Fun so fun, Yeah, okay, I'm in. Do you like Castle Burgundy?
Of course? Yeah. Castle Burgundy is a classic.
My friend Josh who got me into Catan, he's like huge he's I think number ten in the world for Castle Burgundy.
Number ten in the world. Congratulations to Josh.
He loves the Castle Burgundy. It love that one. He tried to get me into. Agricola.
I like it great too, very intense.
Sometimes I just forget that things are I need to do certain things.
That's the fun of it. Yeah.
Usually so intense leads to not like I luck myself into a win, like I haven't. I haven't Castle Burgundy. I could say, like, oh, I can maybe put some strategy down, like I can think ahead Agricola, It's like, I don't know where this is going to go towards the end.
It's I have some friends who are super into Gurricola and like that's like you can play it on like a super super high level. I don't play it like that. But I first of all, I enjoy just making a farm. That's what the game is. You make a farm and you have to feed your family peace. It's very peaceful and the most stressful game you could ever play. Like you're but like and you have little like animals that you know mate, and they.
Make more vegetables.
It's like the most delightful sounding thing and it's so stressful, but it's such a fun game. I just I don't play it very often, just because my friends are always like, want to play Agricola and like no, I'm like, I want to play my train game instead, don't play Agricola. I'm like, fine, But it's I don't know why I have an attitude about it because I love it and I own it and it's a great game.
I need to get into the eighteen xx like you've you've sold me on it? Yeah, is it on? There's a website that you can play it on. You can play it online. Yeah, called h and xx dot games. Don't add three X.
Don't add the third X. Who knows? Like it's important to learn the rules. I'm trying to think of a good resource to learning eighteen xx I YouTube, but there's like eighteen xx media content is a little rough. I'm not gonna lie, it's not that is not Like the best version of Board Game Con had a lot of like older men wearing like train caps, so it's like, you know, it's just so you know, like just so
you're prepared. Yeah, I mean, but the board game Geek, which is the central hub for all board game things They do a video series called Game Night where they have a group of people that always play games, and they did one for a game called eighteen thirty, which is like considered to be like the king of all the eighteen xx games. It was like the one that really kind of kicks hard. This not kicked, it really broke through because this the first eighteen xx game. Comment
like nineteen seventy two. Oh wow, So it's been around since the Vietnam War was still happening, it was before Watergate. It's been around for like fifty years, been around the block, but eighteen thirty is the one that like broke through and like made it what it is today. So Game Night, the video series Game Night, if you want, that's how I was first intrigued by it. Go check out Game Night.
They play eighteen thirty and they they sort of guide you through it and you'll get some good general ideas. There's also this really like fun lady named Amby who does a she does a video called like board Game Blitz, and she's like very cheery, love that and she talks she loves talking about H and XX. So that's a good resource too. Done. I want to make some at and xx content for YouTube, but it's like it's not easy.
No, I mean, then you gotta get the wide angle.
And then I'm the guy talking about trains on the internet. Nice little side side hobby like I aspire, I aspire, I will obviously you can already tell. I'm always trying to bring people into aight and XX. I am into this game because it's so fun, and like, the more people that are into it means that there's more people I can play with. Yes, I'm very self interested for sure.
The next time you were in town, please set up a day I will play eighteen XX.
I would probably need a third or fourth person.
Done, but I can get it.
And we'll need like a table spit, We'll need some tables. We'll we'll fix because I will do this.
I'm in. I'm one hundred percent, and I'm always down to learn new games. I am ready. I love everything you've mentioned about this game. It sounds like an elevated strategy game. I love Concordia. I'm in.
Yeah, it's it's not like Concordia at all, but it's.
Not like that one.
It's but it's more ticket to ride on steroids, on steroids and just like, you will never go back to Ticket to Ride after it. I have to say it's just so good in or you will hate it and you will say I can't believe Ben made me waste six to eight hours playing this game. Listen.
I when a game takes out long to me, I feel like usually means the game is good.
Yeah. Well, one thing that I will warn you about is that the sort of like the last hour of it can be a little tedious. A lot of people just sort of stopped playing. They'll say, it looks like you're gonna win, so let's just say you won, which is sort of funny, and it's sort of you sort of like play the game until the bank runs out of money, and so sometimes you're sort of going through the motions. And especially it was late at night, it sort of has a weird, not great finale element to it.
But who's one in the morning, You're like, I gotta go.
The journey through it is so fun and so rewarding, and there's so much fun table talk, and there's so much so many fun like negotiatings, like negotiating negotiations, and the there's just so much depth to it. It just says it's the best.
You got me, you got me, I am in. We will play eighteen.
I never thought that this podcast would start with cereal and then somehow get to eight and XX. I'm actually blown away.
This is why we were award nominated. Truly, just yeah, blessed the breath.
By the way, substantial section dealing with reality TV and Real Housewives. Yes, I'm very impressed.
I mean that's our Wednesday episodes. It's bull Chat, so we could just talk about whatever.
I'm so impressed because you really hit like the three things that I love the most in life, which is food, reality TV, and board games. Yeah, it's like literally my three passions. Like I have a food newsletter, like I do watchracrap Ins, I do a food substack, and then I have and I do I do co host a small board game podcast. So this is literally my three my three creative outlets are right here on this podcast, right.
Damn wow, bull Chat, we really hit them all. Well, thank you so much for coming on. I'm sure next time you're in town will not only play board games, we'll do a full Serial Killers. Yes, we'll blow it up, so I'm looking forward to that. Well, thank you so much for coming, Thanks for having me awesome. Well bye guys, see you later. This wasn't live, but bye by