Hi everybody. Its weak. Katie Source, everybody gets me. Hey dude, and welcome to episode 24 of infinite quests. It's a lot of episodes are there really is. I'm really amazed. I remember, we were like, let's just get 10 episodes out and we'll see what happens. And now, for, now, this is our job. Yeah, that was our job. That's really weird. Well, I really thought our office would be cleaner. Once this W is Nikki, we're totally to prize. Hey, sweetheart me to it's okay.
Well, do a cleaning session so dirty and here. So, hey before we start this episode, I just want to recommend that. If you're my mom don't listen to this episode. So, um, but okay, that's kind of a funny joke but in all seriousness, this episode is going to be about Kink and sex and ADHD. D. And so if you are uncomfortable with me, hearing stuff about sex and sexuality, if this is not
the right episode for you. If you know me in person and you don't want to know some things about me that you can never unknow. Perhaps, skip this one. Yeah, I'm gonna go ahead and say Mom and Dad do me a favor and skip this one. I just don't want to have that in the back of my head the whole time. I honestly don't know if my mom was my podcaster. I'm pretty sure my mom doesn't listen to this podcast. But just in case, if you are my mom, maybe maybe skip this one.
Cool, cool. Well, Katie, so it's finally here. We're having the king episode. We're having this talk to you forever long, the long-awaited Kink episode. I should, I should say right off the bat that when I say Kink, I am saying kinkajou50a CA ke because apparently, a lot of people think that I'm talking about cake when I'm talking about Kink because I tend to
mutter. And so I've had this weird fear that everyone is going to be very confused about my Affinity for baked goods for the next two hours. Or however, long, this episode will want to be. So yes, I'm talking about kink like, the sexual practice. Well, so Katie, you're an experienced Kink person. You talk about King Khan. Tick-Tock side gigs. Sorry. Can cut the hair if you wanted to. But I didn't think of a case. I do have an only fair. Whereas I'm very new.
You sort of introduced me to the world. That's really. Thank you so much. It makes me sound. Like I was like, join me. My Cults but you were, you were interested in it before you met me, you just didn't really know how to start right? Yeah. Absolutely. I mean, I, I'd always sort of had this I don't want to sound like a. I'd had this, like, hole inside my heart or something that needed to be filled.
But there was always this like gray area in my head that like ever since I was like a young person like 10 11 12 wouldn't like there was always like this, whoa, things intrigued me that don't seem to Intrigue other people. And then, as I got Older and like became more sexual. I realized like oh some of the stuff has to do with sex and so I've always been sort of approaching it but I've never had like a Virgil to my Dante. Oddly specific reference so no I think it is. Thank you so much.
You've done a lot me great great service. Was we travel the layers of Kink. Hell, maybe I think maybe like honestly like the the I feel like the place to start is just by defining what We are talking about when we say Kink. Yeah, because one of the things that I think is really interesting is that I literally Googled what is kink because I've always had sort of like my preconceived notions in. My understanding that I've built in my years is like a gangster and a kink educator and that
kind of thing. But what I found is that there's actually like a weird sort of change in the terminology that is happening. And so I wanted to talk about that at the very top of the episode for people who might be like, what the fuck are they talking about? It's so when we talk about Kink we are talking about the activities that are most normally sort of held under the
umbrella of BDSM. So consensual practices that involve but are not limited to like bondage and discipline dominance and submission sadomasochism basically like power Dynamic like exploration the power Dynamic and how those manifest in our lives and our sexual life.
Lives in that kind of thing. But one of the interesting things that I found in my research is that there is there's been sort of a change in the terminology like it used to be BDSM was the term like if you were into BDSM like that was your definition but as BDSM sort of like porn basically, like as porn sort of became more graphic and became much more about like just like the dominance and submission side of Things. There is sort of this trend to start just talking about Kink as
a whole. So Kink is basically the opposite of vanilla sex, you know, straight vanilla sex and that's like the origin of the term is like if you have straight regular sex, there is no is straight. There's no Kink, It's Not Bent. And so that's like literally where the term comes from is kink. Well, that's interesting. And I know that I might, that might be a lie, but I read that on the internet and I said it out loud. And then I went 90 people are going An email us and tell me how wrong.
But that is that is part of the the history that I read is like, the term Kink comes from like that sort of like, change in what would other be like, heteronormative sex? So yeah, I think such a core part of it. And you've already said the word and I want to make sure we highlight it. We give it the attention. It deserves is these consensual practices. So if you're having a Non-traditional sexual encounter
that. You feel wasn't consensual like that's that's not an accurate representation of King, what Kink is no, Kink is all about something. I particularly enjoy about it is, although you're doing these things that from an outside perspective, might seem dangerous or risky. It's all within this immensely, safe bubble of consent and understanding. Well, which I think is amazing. And I like that.
You said that, because I think, right off the bat, one of the things that I want to address is the things that kink aren't is
not. And like, first off, Kink is not non-consensual, like, Kink is always, negotiate, even non-consent in scenes is negotiated, and like, that's a whole other bag of potatoes that I don't want to get into, but, like, consent is vital and mandatory for any King practice, and I think that's really important, but the other thing is that Kink is not indicative of abuse. It is not indicative of, you know, Bad parenting, like you have daddy issues or mommy issues or anything like that.
It is not indicative of mental illness, it is not indicative of any sort of like, Brokenness or anything wrong with you. It is a predilection, it was a series of preferences, but for many people and I think this is really interesting, and there's actually a really great quote that I'm going to frantically pull up as fast as I possibly can. Ann Jillian, Keenan who writes a lot about sex and kink says, Kink can be such an orienting force that for many of us, it
even overpowers, gender. Hmm. And I think that's really interesting because king is not indicative of, I literally just said this, but like, king is not indicative of being broken, or you're crazy, or you're gross or disgusting. But at on the other side of that many people, Are fiercely protective of their Kink identities and they are fiercely, sort of. I don't want to say guarded, but but their identity in the Kink Community makes up a huge part of who they are.
And so the conversations about kink in like sort of the larger more like I don't say like normal but like conventional Society can be really difficult because talking about like being the submissive or being you know. I don't know like a Like a leather daddy or something. People can look at you and go, like, what the fuck is wrong with you like oh did you get spanked as a kid like that kind
of thing where it's like? No, like this is a major part of who I am and I think it's really important to acknowledge that right off the bat as we go into this episode and we talked about Kink because especially talking about Kink and neurodiversity, I don't want to paint the picture. That what we are saying is that like every kingster has mental illness, or has a neurodiversity, nor does every person, No type urgency or a mental illness, enjoy kink like, that is not what we were saying.
So having cleared that up, shall we move on to the episode? Sure, I feel like I just apologized for 15 minutes before we started the episode but like it's just it's really important to me that that like we we approach this conversation from like a very clear point of why we were talking about this. Yeah, I mean I think you clarified for an appropriate amount of time and I think one's not to draw.
A terribly bold parallel, but or analogy but I think I mean for me personally and on in perhaps we'll get into this a bit more later. My understanding of my own neuro diversity in my understanding of my own Kink identity were both very much a similar experience and in fact aided in each other. Yeah and so I think if you are newer version and you are also kinky it's it. Well speaking from experience it helped me to learn More about my kinking identity.
It gave me sort of the courage to learn more about my neurodivergent identity. That's really interesting know, and I think to like one of the reasons why I really wanted to do this episode is because I have found that there is such a fit for neurodivergent in the Kink Community.
Like it makes a lot of sense. I'm going to talk about that a little bit later, but one of the things that I struggled with was fine, Finding resources about like Kink safety and neurodivergent see, like, how do you play safely in a scene, when one person or both people have time blindness, how do you deal with rejection sensitive dysphoria in terms of being a
top or a bottom, you know? And and those kind of conversations like that is why I started like making the Tik toks and and the content that I've been producing is because so much of the conversation around Kink is Towards there are two like, you know, neurotypical people having these conversations and so the I don't feel like there are nearly as many resources and guides and things. There should be for people who do have neurodivergent.
He's, you know, and I think that that's important to acknowledge as well. Like, as we, as we talk about this because we are both neurodivergent and that presents its own series of challenges, And stuff. Absolutely. One of the more striking ones to me was was dopamine deficiency. ADHD person has a dopamine
deficiency. And when you're just getting flooded with all this crazy dopamine, especially early on in can can you experience what you've told me is called frenzy like oh my gosh, this is amazing. What? No, let's do this at Forever all the time which means all the time is a very risky thing to try to hold in your brain when you have time by this. But that was that was definitely something that I If I didn't
know from you, thank you. That's, you have to be careful about the amount of dopamine that's getting flooded in your brain, when you're a nerd virgin person and a neurotypical person. But especially if you're a person who already has an ADHD deficiency. Yeah, well, and for somebody who might not be hit to the cool
lingo. When we talk about frenzy, we talk about, it's a very common experience in the Kink community and it's a new person comes into the scene, and they start playing Saying and they start, you know, experiencing like kinky activities and they tend to sometimes people will be like, I need more, I need more right now and it becomes like a very dangerous cycle of risk-taking activities where people are going out of their way to experience as much candy
as they possibly can. Right off the bat. And, and so, that is called frenzy. Because it is not necessarily the healthiest way to sort of, like, get in. Lived in the community. And I was one of those people. I had Wicked case of frenzy but because I was primarily playing with, you know, individual Partners. Like, you know, one at a time,
they didn't know. And so like I just some really dangerous stuff and so I that's something that I think is really important, especially in conversation with neurodiversity is, is that like dopamine drop and one, just dropped like dropping, In general, like sub drop down, drop is such a real thing and it and it's about the burning through those chemicals in your brain and you just, you feel like shit the next day.
But when you already have naturally, lower levels of dopamine and serotonin like wow, can the sub drop hit hard and then even more with like, rejection sensitive dysphoria and sub drop. It's not great, you know. Yeah, I don't know where I was going with that but this is this Really good podcast so far. It's just me apologizing for everything that we haven't talked about yet. I'm really nervous, I'm really nervous about this episode.
This is something like I'm so passionate about and I care. So deeply about the Kink community and like the neuro-diverse community. I like I'm really scared that. I'm going to say the wrong thing, you know, and I realize that we have the ability to like edit, we can add it this, but like I don't know. Like I just like I feel like I have so much to say about this and like now I'm trying to like say it all at Once which is silly because we could just do a
part two and part three. That's true. Cajun, for forever is our pocket. I'm having frenzy about the Kink podcast. This is what is happening right now. Well, alright, so then all, then all, I'll give you a real. Let me talk. Let me try to say everything. Okay, I am going to drink my very noisy drink right now. Yes, please. I regret putting ice in my drink. Yeah, ice and podcasts just generally not friends well so I was just reading there's a
researcher named. Hughes at the University of California. Santa Cruz, who is a prominent Kink researcher who basically goes on FetLife and whatnot and assembles these research projects to just study, what is up with Kink? What trends are going on in King and he identified five stages of Kink development in a person's life. The first is sort of self-exploration when you're that, apparently, typically occurs before the age of ten, or this does not necessarily have
anything to do with sexual. Reality it's just particular episodes of you know TV like a superhero movie where there's a
person tied up in distress. Again it's not necessarily sexual it's just that for some reason makes your brain go like oh this is intriguing it draws your attention or if you're playing cops and robbers or Capture the Flag, you want to be captured, you enjoy being captured and or kept in jail and Capture the Flag. I'm gonna have I'm like you haven't told me about this yet and so I'm realizing that live
time. Be running through these moments in my head and I'm very excited to see what I like. I'm gonna have a podcast breakthrough. I know I'm gonna have a podcast breakthrough. Okay, keep going, keep going. Because I've already had my first and I'm like, yep. Okay, I know is, I know.
Okay, absolutely. Like so I was gonna list all five, but but this first one is in, is fascinating, because I'm doing the same thing, like, I remember being like, but when bear, when memory, barely existed for me, like those little things where I don't remember what was happening. I just remember little snapshots. I remember like, I always really liked trying to get, like I would wear a long sleeve shirts, stretch out the sleeves.
So they were like, way over my hands and I always like trying to get them as Tangled as possible. So that like I was restrained in my shirt again. Nothing to do with sexuality had no idea what sexuality was it just for some reason that was intriguing to me stuff like that. I'm trying to think of other. Not example. They don't necessarily want to bring up because you do a lot of weird stuff when you're a kid for no reason. This is a judgment.
Is our thank you very much. But I remember like, what else? I remember? Whenever I would like, go to the bathroom. I was always like toilet. Water is a weird, like, I didn't, I never liked drank, the toilet. I don't know that if you did drink the toilet water, that's fine. But for some reason, I was like, what makes that different than normal water? Isn't it weird that we consider this to be? But like that.
Just for some reason just triggered my my brain to be like to wonder about that kind of thing. Which is was just fascinating to read that. That apparently a kink one's relationship with King. Apparently according to Samuel Hughes starts very early and what's fascinating about that to me is that at that same time I was noticing things about my nirodha vergence, he's in much the same way. Interesting which now I'm now
looking back. I was like oh yeah I was my basement was constantly you know filthy with with half-finished project you know when I was six I really enjoy. Like crumpling up tin foil and hitting it with a hammer. So it became like this little piece of metal. Like, I love that. I did it all the time but I would, I would like do that and then forget about it and then become obsessed with spray-painting.
Like I remember there's a big board in my basement where I would just put like things up against the board and then spray paint over it and then remove it. So it had like this little print on it. Oh yeah. So I was just constantly doing stuff like that and like when my friends came over, some of them the people that ended up being my really good. I'd like childhood friends love doing that kind of stuff and some of them were like, what the fuck are you doing?
Like, do you want to watch TV? Like, I don't understand what you're doing. You're doing. And I think, well, the second stage of Kink relationship is well, Samuel Hughes has five stages. We can relationship typically occurs between the ages of 5 and 14, where you basically start to realize that these Fascinations that Again, also may not be necessarily sexual are not shared by everybody that there's that. You know, you might feel that you should keep them secret or
that you should feel ashamed. God, forbid about those sorts of things. And again, in much the same way as I started. Realizing that not everybody, not everybody shared those same neurodivergent qualities that I didn't understand were part of some larger trend of the time. I started becoming ashamed about those. I showed you becoming ashamed about how messy my backpack was and how, you know, I couldn't sit and just watch TV with my
friends. And so that Mike my relationship with King has followed a remarkably similar trajectory like, every statue of a step of the way. This is fascinating, I love that you're drawing this parallel, right? So what's the, what's the third of the third typically use occurs between the ages of 11 14, which is sort of evaluation Just, okay. So where does this leave me? And I guess you could sort of think of this as like, Gestation period or like a simmering
period? A distillation period where you know, where does this all leave me these for evaluation? What do I do now? Typically at this point, it starts. This is General apparently again, according to Samuel Hughes is research, this is occurs between the ages of 11 and 14 and that's when This, it's no generally becomes a markedly sexual thing. Masturbation is involved, seeking out pornography static Samuel Hughes. Let's buy the fucking numbers.
I do my own life well when you like I was 11 I was 11 years old. The first time that I masturbated. Like I remember that I was 11. Like I'm just fuck you. Samuel Hughes. Yeah it was like I don't will even when I first started like I don't know at what point like became or it goes from like Mindless self-exploration to official like masturbation. I have no idea but I remember. Yeah, like around 14.
I didn't know it was, it was like, it feels so weird to using the term kink in relation to an 11 year old, but it was me. Yeah, I'm referred to my 11 year old self. I did I didn't masturbate in the way that like I don't know one would picture masturbation like picture what it is and movies and stuff like that sure it was just Like trying to experience. Interestingly, Sensations on my genitals. Frankly. Yeah. And that was like a several year long period.
Eventually I realized like more efficient ways of doing it, and that became the way that I did it. But in those early stages as that weird fascination with strange, things started to blend and grade 8 into sexuality. There was like, yeah, 11 12 or between the ages of 11 and 12. It was just, it was what I now noticed to be sensation play. Is I was just curious about all these weird Sensations that are happening not to mention during those ages of I will generally
what is going through puberty? Hmm. And so your sexual self is Awakening, there's all sorts of strange, hormonal, things happening. That's one of the reasons why, I mean, I'm sorry to cut you off, but like I think it's like one of the reasons why I like I changed the way that I introduced my Tick Tock videos and I thought a lot about this because I used to be like, if
you're not 18, get the fuck out. What I realize is like I was Even when I started exploring my sexuality, like I was, you know, I was 11 12 13 and it's like I do. I think it is appropriate to be like, hey kids, let's talk about fucking sex. No, but I think that it's really important that we talk about sex and sexuality in a way that makes the 11 and 12 year olds, not embarrassed and not ashamed.
And if they have questions and if they have concerns like they can go to the They trust and say like, hey like this is the thing that I want to learn more about or whatever like there shouldn't be. I think there's. So I'm going to say that better. Like there's such a stigma and there's such like this weird thing about like we can't ever talk about bodies with kids. We can't ever talk about sex and it's like, do I think that like, like it's very nuanced?
I think, you know, it's very delicate thing because you don't like, every kid is at a different developmental stage and like kids mature. Differently and that kind of thing. But like it sweet like it's weird. It's just like you said, like it's weird thinking of like sexuality in terms of myself as an eleven-year-old. But like I remember that like I remember having those thoughts and like being confused as an 11
year old. And so I wish that there was a way that it was like appropriate to like have those conversations in a way that doesn't make you sound like an absolute fucking creep monster, you know, because it just like, I don't know. It's like I just like I worry so much about like the The Katie's of the world who are like out there being like, what's wrong with me? Why do I like these things?
And it's like well your 12. We can't let you listen to this podcast yet but someday you're gonna be like I wish I had this when I was 12 and it's just like, what are you? I don't know. I don't know how to have those conversations. Yes, it's something, it's something that honestly infuriates me that whenever like sex education is brought up in school.
Like even the idea of referring to the bear science behind sex to somebody under the age of 18, Politicians and notable typically religious figures will say like it doesn't belong in the schools, that's the job of the parent but not them. I'm not fucking talk to my kids about that kind of shit they can learn on their own. There's so like these, its it frustrates me. How much kids and teens and whatever sub 18 year old people are just so left, just figure it
the fuck out. Yeah, like have fun. Like, I'm going to put a blindfold on you and tell you to run through this room and you're Figure out what's going on in there by smashing into everything and you're going to have an awful time, or I could just take the blindfold off and say, look all this stuff like it's absolutely infuriating. So then the next phase as Samuel Hughes puts it stage for of King
development is finding others. He's this typically occurs between the ages of 11 and 18, perhaps that that middle evaluation phase was very quick. Started, but again, this does not necessarily mean that you were finding other people as sexual partners. I remember when I was I think I was probably 13 when I met groups of people who I could say, like, hey, you know, isn't it? Kind of weird. I don't even drink toilet, water, or whatever. The hell people who weren't
immediately put off. I want to very quickly clarify what that Eric has been talking a lot about toilet noise and that is not it. Anything. That's not the king conversation. That Eric is alluding to know. He just picked up a very weird accepted her strange example. But yeah. So that's, that's not my thing. That there's anything wrong with that being someone's thing. But just for the sake of
accuracy, that's not my thing. It was just a weird example of like a conversation that I wondered about, but it couldn't have. I couldn't have a people because they were so guarded all the time, but I remember when I met like this group of people, I can remember their names, I won't say them, but I can remember their name. Ames when we could and I did, I felt like I could just Express things I could just say things and say, isn't that weird.
What do you think about this? I remember my first the first, girl, I kissed actually her name was Miriam. She had a nickname that everybody actually called her, but her real name was Miriam. It's a very strange nicknames. I don't actually but Miriam you know who you are. If you're listening. Hello. That's a better or worse. Docks of like she had a nickname but here's a real nail like nobody. Nude, this is noting. But anyways, I remember she was
my first kiss. We were kissing or kissing on like a merry-go-round at a park. You know the ones that you could like spin. Mmm. And I kiss I was kissing her and then I just remember saying like isn't it weird that we don't just spit in each other's mouths. A shortage of topics I was like is this the same thing? Like that's all we're doing by kissing is the swallow saliva and that's fine but if you spit in someone's mouth it's like straight it It's the same thing.
You're just exchanging saliva and she just laughed really hard. She was like, yeah, it is weird. And I was like, I don't wanna be, I remember I clarify. It was like man Miriam, like I want to clarify. I'm not asking to spit in your mouth. I mean, if you want me to, I will I'm merely wondering why that's weird but kissing isn't, well, if you're interested like sidebar, you, there's a lot of saliva in your own mouth right now. Yeah, you listen.
It was a lot of saliva in your mouth right now. Make it out. But if you spit like into your hand right, imagine looking at back up, it's gross, right? And that's disgusting. It's the same thing. It's already in your mouth, it's just now you've removed it from your mouth and you're putting it back in. Why is that so much weirder? I have no idea if I still lose sleep over it. Anyways, I remember all of your
phones or web right now. Katie, they are, they are, they're all of your bones, bones are wet. I just Wet all of them. They're all inside of you wet, right? So perhaps your teeth, my teeth are very wet right now. What about your cochlear bone? It's the bones. The tiny teeny. Tiny bone in your ear. I feel like those probably went. Those are covered in hair in earwax. I don't think that's true. We're gonna have to edit this part out. Nowhere, this is too gross.
You gonna leave it is what gives it gives. It gives it gives a good seasoning to the fuck. Although I know you'd like undress, salads and dry sandwiches. Listen, I have sauce. I'm so sidebar to the sidebar. I don't like sauces, I like pasta sauce, I like pancake syrup and that is about it and I don't know why you keep trying to feed me.
Only and vinaigrette when I have clearly told you over and over and over that, I don't like sauces, they creep me out, I don't like them, they taste bad, you're not going to change my mind. Hey, hey, Eric. Hey, what's up? Hey, are you, are you ready for this? Yeah, it's our first commercial ever. Oh my God. We're like in a visual -. Well, Eric. I have a couple questions for you. Do you know what I like being able to see? Love? It's like my favorite.
It's like my favorite thing. Do you know what else I like being super stylish? I like both of those second only to being able to, you know, what the third thing. I like affordable glasses. Frames that Are also quality. You seemed my first three favorite thing. That's really weird in exactly there with us have ever that order. Well, I have some really good
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top. Well, when you feel when you frame it like that case, I know when you view it through that lens. Ocular it's it's really Uncharted Territory because like when you go to the eye doctor there's no it's like you know, but the A and then the letters get smaller. Yeah. Yeah. That was a really good heart. I would say, whatever. I just That also, their logo is glasses. Did you know that?
I didn't know? Yeah, the L 0 0 L makes a little pair of glasses and, you know, and you can go look at it. If you go to Z little.com, that Ze, L, o0, elle.com, and use discount code, kto for 10% off your order. I've been, I've been looking on their own, their own, their stuff lately and we get one of those sweet Atticus Finch class is gonna look so good. I'm gonna like walk around and I'm going to be like, I am jack stands. I already objected to that idea because the code Katie.
Oh, I can. And that because everybody wants to know, I'm just going to tell you right now. The green glasses are called the Doulton glasses and you can get them for 10% off of Steel. I know. All right. Do you feel? We have commercial data quickly? I think we can work some pre adequately Lexa Let's glasses, pun, that was a really good class. I'm extremely proud of you. Thank you all. Okay, thanks T, little nailed it. Crushed it bye. Hey everybody. It's me.
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Okay, bye. Anyway. So back to spitting and Miriam's, mouth, and Miriam's mouth. I remember the feeling of alleviation when I could finally just wonder stuff to people again, some of them were related to sexuality. Some of them fucking work but I remember just being able to just be myself, sometimes they would laugh. Sometimes they would go, huh? But they weren't just completely Like they were engaging, they weren't just like, that's weird.
We're not going to talk about that, and that was also the fucking same with mine order of urgency. There were certain people who I couldn't just be openly ADHD of around. Like I just couldn't do it. They would. Or if I could, I was like a prop. I was there for entertainment. Yeah, it makes me sad, I was fucking entertaining. I mean, look, I was, you're not liked it.
I liked being attained. Well what I think is really interesting is like and I haven't gone into a lot of specifics with mine, but Like one of the things that I very, very clearly remember. Is like, my I found my like Kink Community right around that age. I was like 14 15. You know, back in my day we didn't do have the internet and cell phones but like finding online communities of flight, King stirs were like, yeah I'm totally 18. You know. But like that was How I Learned
like that was how I found. Out that like, there were other people who liked the things that I like and I think like Tick-Tock has become that for a lot of people like whether or not it is you know like oh I have ADHD. Here's a community of ADHD people or autistic people or King stirs or whatever. Like I feel like a lot of our listeners, a lot of our viewers are in that part there.
In that like, especially our younger Our viewers are in that moment of like finding out that there are other people like them. And it's like, weird to remember back because I like, I literally haven't thought about it in years. Like I remember the websites that I used to go to. I remember like the fucking like, Geo cities message boards because I'm elderly, you know, that I would, I would frequent and I would, I would learn things about Kink and BDSM and that kind of thing and it's like
now we might be part of that. Since like other people's Journeys, and that like weirdly like, makes me happy. Like I feel like it's a little bit like full circle. Yeah, absolutely. In for a moment think that makes me feel a lot of pressure to be like accurate and whatnot. Yeah. Honestly what I was looking for, at the time, I didn't know this is what I was looking for at the time but looking back I wasn't looking for accuracy - so I was
looking for fucking honesty. Yeah. Well maybe people were so guarded about I mean I'm still frustrated when I when I would ask strange. Like, I'm trying to be honest without being vulgar, but when I would like, you know, there'd be a scene in a movie that would be watching with my friends, and there's like, a person tied up, or there's a person like, you know, in distress, and it's a movie. So I'm not we're not looking at
her sexually and distress. Yeah, but like and, you know, just for the because I want to be like intellectually and emotionally intimate with, like, my friends. That's something I value in a relationship. I would feel dear to What I was thinking, which is like, you know, I don't know. Wouldn't you like that to happen to you or something like that? And they like they wouldn't they would either laugh in a dismissive way.
Like that was an entertaining and funny thing to say, thank you, Eric, or they would just go to Jesus and like, not doing so laughing. Like, you're laughing right now because I'm laughing. That's because I know the movie that I asked my friends about. What was it? There it this is a true story. This is a real true story about me and it's funny that you said the, the first Just sort of exploratory level, one of. It's the same scene. It's been the same scene for a lot of my life.
Oh God. I think my brain is telling me that you've told me. I think, I had, I want to try to think of it. I don't want to sit here in silence for 10 minutes while I try to remember. Okay, as soon as you say it, I reserve the right to go. Aw god dammit. I wouldn't, I would have gotten there. Are you ready?
Yes, I'm ready. It's the corset lacing scene for meet me in st. Louis, I would never have gotten okay, but that, that was one of the first times that I remember being like, Actively fascinated by this, like idea of like corsets and confinement and like that kind of thing. And then I remember being like older and like, you know, you want to show your friends, the movies that you've loved.
And so I showed them means he was, which I want to be very clear is a fucking Judy Garland movie musical from like the 1940s. Like it is not a sexual film like in any stretch of the imagination. One with that song that you forgot the lyrics to yeah. The trolley song. That's just that's what. Yeah, so on. Okay. Yeah, I see I've told you about this movie because I love this.
I love that movie. But like, so I remember being a teenager and like showing it to my friends and being like, Oh my God, like one of you like so cool. If like we all like had court like corsets or whatever and they're like what the fuck is wrong with you? Like, I don't remember being like, Oh, I'm the, I'm the weird one, I'm the one. But like to this day like now, like as an adult who like I'm Comfortable talking about my sexuality, like lingerie and like corsets and like that.
Like, they are so, like appealing, you know what I mean? And like that is that it's like a part of my, like, coal King identity is like the, the clothes that I wear. When I am King King, I can't, what the hell is the now or the verb form when I'm I'm already taken playing in a six. You say playing. Yeah but I mean it also depends because like, you know, No. I mean we're going to get to this probably later but like, you know, I'm a switch.
So like I'm not always subbing or submitting what sometimes I'm topping or will. Like, I don't know, I don't know. I'm sure that there is a word and we're going to get another 40 emails. Like you fucking idiots. I also want to clarify.
I'm glad you use of those terms. So there's subbing being dismissive person and then the opposite of a sub generally speaking, if you're looking on the internet and stuff, they term you will most commonly see is dominating Just so happens that Katie doesn't aesthetically like the word dominate. The term Dom, I hate it. Why?
Oh so instead Katie used the term, use the July, I say top is a topping and bottoming topping and bottom because I have this weird, I think part of and I also hate the term brat but that's the term that I use the most on picked up because I think it's the funniest but like, I think that submission is a This Nomar because in a healthily negotiated seen, really and truly, the submissive has all the power.
The submissive, is handing that power over to the the Dom or the top or whatever you want to call it. But like, I am up, like, when I am my this, you know, subby a sudden all of a sudden Subspace McGee. I am under absolutely no impression. In that, at any point, I could just be like, hey, I don't want to do this anymore, and it would stop because I'm in charge, I am in control. And so, like, and there are some people who, like, genuinely give up that power and have like that
genuine power exchange. But even that is negotiated, even that is part of the submit the submissive, or the bottom, whatever. And so like, I just say top and bottom and like in my head, top is the person doing the thing and the bottom is the person, having the thing done to them. But I also think it's important because I am a switch and like not to spill the beans this early in the episode but like we have been doing stuff and we will switch in the moment.
And like so it's so it's like all of them surprised everybody. This is the big reveal. This is the first recorded. We've referenced it on like lives and step was the first recorded instance of yeah. This is it to being to being romantically involved. Sorry. Nobody said it was her. Antic joke's on you because that was significantly louder than the rest of the episode in. You're going to have to you're doing it in this week's. Oh haha, oh no, it is so loud. Look at how that we all that
does spiky spikes? Oh no that's terrible. Well so on so I mean I'm sorry you go. No no you go. Thanks but no I mean so like I don't know like I realize that it is a very /. It's like the same thing. Like I hate being called I'd ma'am. I fucking hate ma'am. I live in the south I could called mammals.
I fucking hate it. And so like for me like I have my own sort of like verbiage or like, I like to say top instead of Dom but like in the general Kink Community like when I am teaching workshops, when I'm educating, what I'm doing classes or whatever like I say so sub and Dom like I use them interchangeably but like I personally Katie I don't like calling my Self like a Dom. I say I top sometimes. Yeah. I like the idea that That the submissive person isn't actually submitting.
Like they still have as much power that as they ever have, which is why I love the concept of calling an instance of a kink encounter a scene because it's a scene in the same way that when two actors are like, Ian McKellen isn't actually a wizard, what you are aware that he is not actually wizard. So well, how does he know where to stand? People told him where, how does he know what to say what's in the script and the script? That's a very heavy.
I'm really proud that we took that bit so far as a reference from the for 10 people, just just, you're welcome, but in much the same way, and it Kinks a scene is basically an instance of a kink encounter. So scenes, begin scenes. And yeah, well, I and I do want to say, though that when you get into conversations about like, 24/7, oh, we're like outside of the bedroom. Like those are also perfectly
valid and totally like normal. Normal parts of much of the Kink Community, but like, because there are a lot of Lifestyle people, you know what I mean? And that is super valid, but that also comes with its own. I mean, I know, I just said this, but like, its own set of like negotiations and rules and agreements and that kind of thing. But yeah, yeah. I get what you're saying. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. In that. Yeah, I guess why I guess my room. So I was just harping on the
language involved. And I use saying that like, oh, it's submissive person isn't necessarily actually giving up power. Although, in some cases mean, I think they're, I think, I think the words seen lends itself well as forwards towards edifying that, yeah, I think the like I think like like a loan like I think it's like a loan, you know, it's looking Allah in alone alone. Yes, not alone like Home Alone. Um, because I feel like home loan. Not like the Home Alone.
Yes, like a hunk but boom, but like, I think, like, for me, the appeal of submission, the appeal of being the bottom is like, I don't have to think. Oh yeah, I am turning off my brain. I'm looking at my partner and saying, like, I'm trusting you to like guide this experience and make this experience into something real Like I don't have to think I will just do and that to me is like, really, really appealing. Oh yeah.
But you know, for other people, it's for other reasons, you know, like some people like the service aspect of it. Some people like the sort of care element of it. Like its submission looks different on everybody because the terms and your partner and it's so complex, it's so complex and I've no idea how to talk about any of it. I think that's poison. That's why one of the reasons why it's so fascinating like something. I like to think about is like do well.
So let me ask you, let me ask you, let me give you a little question here. Kok. And to anybody who's well? Who wants to? Okay, try it. Oh God, now I'm nervous. What is the single most complicated naturally-occurring structure? That humans have ever observed in a universe? The. The spiral know what question I was quite similar to the human
brain. The human brain is by far the most complicated naturally, occurring structure in the entire universe that we've ever observed Stars gravity for forces all acting together. We can make very accurate models of galaxies and ship. Those are for generally pretty well, understood. I mean, there's still a lot, we don't know. But in terms of, we understand galaxies, much better than we understand the human brain. That's annoying. Right? I find that to be D, like, I'm annoyed.
You own what? I am deeply annoyed own. The most complicated, one of the most, you own, an instance of the most. I would rather own a Galaxy because it would Jim, it's fucking, it's exhausting having this brain for janko's Alton must be very jealous of Will Smith and the other man in Black and that cat, let's be real jealous of that cat. Well, have you ever noticed that it only rains when I cry? Eric, that's probably really
funny. I'm sorry, it's that was a really tight Men In Black Rock. Reference, you're welcome. Anyways, do you know so given that one human brain is the most complicated naturally-occurring structure that humans have ever observed in the cosmos. When you put two of those motherfuckers, together whole Eddie is infinitely more
complicated. So, every conversation, every interaction you have with somebody else is two different instances of the most common, most complicated naturally-occurring structure that we've observed in the cosmos interacting with each other.
And so, a kink scene is one of those instances which is why it's so fucking complicated but also why it's so fucking fascinating as every single kick relationship is unique in the same way that every single human relationship is unique I'm stressed out know that's stressful. I think it's pretty cool but also on the topic of you turn like being submissive and turning your brain on how much of that do you think has to do with your ADHD? All of it. Okay.
This is I know that you're not shocked but we forgot to do the last one, the last of Hughes all the five, we got to do that because otherwise we're never going to get. We got it. What is it? Tell me about it right now go oh gosh. So the fifth one is as an as an adult finding others in exploring with others. Especially it's like the I mean I don't know if this is what what Hughes intended is to be
thought of as well? I think of it as like the promised land like now for example, where we You and I are both in that phase. I just got really excited to yellow level 5. The next time we're doing a scene together. I love her like you know animation and like a RPG or an MMORPG when you level up and there's like yeah, Sparkles and stuff. I'm gonna get you a little, you know, like when like the PlayStation, like the little blue in the little achievement is alive. Oh yeah.
I'm gonna scream achievement unlocked, level 5 and I'm just gonna ruin everything box. You fucking pleb. I don't play video games. My whole ass. But so that's that sort of which. And so again this is my under slyke interpretation of what
users trying to say. So one is you're sort of in the dark, you kind of notice that you find interesting things like well this scene in the movie where the person or in the superhero movie where things are tied up or like, for me, I like getting my shirt sleeves, all tangled so that I can't move followed by a period of might have another situation. Largely, I can reject because they are also in that same
phase. And then the sort of weird middle speed period, where a, an immense stigma is created in your own head. Well, now just created in your own head, but because of yeah, and Society treats, that makes that kind of stuff you're in the sort of like, oh shit. Here we go. Then it's followed by another phase of further exploring and then finding people that do are at least willing to explore and have perhaps taboo. Ian's and then the fifth stage is like okay.
Now that I found these people now that I'm like eight over 18 and have agency and can go where I want all that stuff. Now I can explore my own identity and help other people explore their identities. And that's just a is a wonderful place to be if you know if you're being healthy and consensual and safe about it, of course.
So that's sort of how I understand it, and I think those five stages are Eerily similar to at least my own experience with minor diversion see is I mean you're certainly an argument to be had I think it's kind of strange which is not to say that again. Like as you said at the top of the episode it's not that. If you were kinky you are a nerd a virgin or if you're no different than you were kinky. The Earth are separate things but in this case I find them to
be mentally analogous. Yeah, I also something we haven't really touched on yet that I'd love to talk about is how does Kink. Aydin or in any given any way relate to your narrative urgency. Oh well, I'm glad that you asked Eric because I was the next thing that I wanted to talk about. You did a good job that was real good. It was a great Katie, that's your thing, not mine transition also just so everybody knows this is gonna be a long episode
part. One of this is part one but also this probably going to be a long boy because we fucked up and got way off track. So, okay, so the thing that I think is really interesting about kink Neuro Divergence is
that. So there's been a ton of studies done on on basically sex and and neuro divergency particularly sex in ADHD and over and over and over the studies show that people with ADHD experience dramatically higher levels of sexual, dysfunction than neurotypical people and like it shows up in like thirty nine percent of men and like, Forty-seven percent of women and stuff like that. But starts, whatever. What do you mean by sexual dysfunction? Well, I was going to tell you
Eric, so good. So here's the thing. So across the board, they'll sort of like dysfunctions or problems that people with ADHD tend to have during sex are the following. Thanks I wrote them down, trouble paying attention and staying focused during sex in general having a low sex drive. Now I want to caveat by the saying that there is also a sort of other side of the coin. Of a lot of people also experience hypersexuality, but it can kind of peak and Valley as well.
Or sometimes you have like, extremely low, sex drive, and sometimes it's like, oh God. It's all I can think about, but it tends to be very one or the other with a lot of people with ADHD with that too. With the the the balance between hypo and Hyper. Sexuality is very sudden, changes in your sex drive, like literally you can be like doing the actual fucking having sex and Like change your mind in the middle of it. You like I hate this.
That's all I want happens to me all the time like 50% of the time at least. Yeah. So then another component that comes into play is things like Risk and risk taking behavior, that tends to be a little bit more related to hypersexuality and then the big sort of glaring. Major one is for for anybody, with ADHD, trouble orgasming, and then for men in particular erectile Gin and then for women just trouble with arousal. So those are kind of the problems.
But what I think is very interesting about Kink and what I think is very interesting about King as it relates to ADHD is that Kink is very, very uniquely suited to help with a lot of these problems. And I'm very carefully and very specifically using the word help. Not solve because I am not purporting.
That Kink is like the the savior of everything it's going to cure your ADHD, not saying that, but if you, if you think about Kink and you think about like what is going on when you're having these like Kink experiences, a lot of them are sort of a direct answer to the issues of sexual dysfunction in people with ADHD. And I think that's Fascinating. It's so interesting. Oh yeah, absolutely. I'm sorry I spaced out during the last again since I watched it happen.
I was like there's no no one is home. I'm sorry I still really like and the lessons. I cut last like three words and I was like oh shit. I totally missed that. Do you mind repeating yourself for the for the viewers it further? For the listeners at home? No, that's when I for me personally. Not for you personally, because you've been paying attention this whole time.
Yes, no. I mean, I think it's just, it's fascinating how if you start sort of breaking down the component pieces of Pink and different activities, and different things that you can do in Kink. They sort of become like a one-to-one parallel of like, a lot of the problems that people have in terms of sexual dysfunction. Oh, so they're like microcosms of yeah, like will like you talked about earlier like trouble paying attention or staying focused sensation play. Yeah. Right.
Like varying than the sensations. Exploring different senses like Like bringing attention to or taking away different senses like that is really really oh yeah useful but they're still like a stigma of like home again I can't use a blindfold because that's not kinky and I'm like yeah and it works fucking great if you have ADHD because you don't have anything to look at, you can just focus on the sensations that are happening around.
You like, oh yeah. I mean I think in, I said earlier that my as I explored my Tink identity, my idiot. Gee I'd enter alert a virgin identity started to take shape as well. And one of the Big Show absolute Shockers to me was we were doing a scene one time and you like I fucking love classical music like a lot and you were like I'm going to put music in years. I can't remember what peace it was specifically. I think it was Rachmaninoff 5.
There is no Rachmaninov, five. Well that I was wrong. I think it was Rock three. But and I remember being when when we, when we were like again negotiating like what do we want to seem to be? What are we going to do? I was like, yeah, that sounds great. And so but then the moment came and you did in the scene started and I was listening to rock three which is one of my all time period pieces of music. Rachmaninoff's, third piano,
concerto. By the way, I remember being like, we got like a couple minutes in And I was like this is not going to work because it was just too much, which is strange because in my everyday life, I very often need many different things going on, such to focus on any of them in any capacity. And so I figured out in a kink setting in a sexual setting Katie your, I'm so thirsty. Your water is out. There you go. God, I was. So, I was so worried.
You're going to start chewing on that ice, but then he started choking and I was very relieved. Now, I'm chewing and choking in the face. This is a great podcast anyway. Hey everybody with me so phony, I'd like to personally apologize for this weeks, episode sponsored by bad Life Choices. I have some Shock some styrofoam nearby phone either of those together, whatever you want. But I remember being shocked
that that wasn't the case. But yeah, because in my everyday life, I'm doing work or cleaning or whatever. I need to have many different things going on since to focus on anything because then I can bounce back and forth switching between focuses and that just helps me keep stay going. But that is apparently not at all the case in any sexual
setting. Take your otherwise which I've I don't like I don't know what's up with that because I'm only like two months into my Kink experience but I found out in Kink. The opposite was true earplugs blindfolds restrained at minimizing of any other variables. So that the Sensation that in this case, that you are giving to me, is the only thing that's happening. Yeah. Like one of the most something I get asked about a lot that I'm hesitant to talk about because I'm bad at.
It is practicing mindfulness and being which is roughly can be described as just viewing in in a completely objective and not judgmental way. The physical the sensation is that are going on. The noise is your hearing Sensations within your own body. The most mindful I've ever been in my life by far was when we were doing wax play when you were doing wax play on me which to those listening to what that is basically. Clearly. There are these specifically made candles.
That who's wax who's I'm just personal bank account 69? Whoo. Yeah, sure who, you know I'm very in George the candles that's I'm picturing them dancing. Now with looks like little like Lumiere Beauty and the Beast. I was thinking of our guests. I'm sorry that we got to do it. Steamboat Mickey, you know, chard and he's like bouncing. Yes. Anyways, jeez, what are we doing? Well, I need to clarify for safety purposes.
Sex wax. Wax wax Play Wax melts at a low temperature so that's enough to kind of like hurt a little bit and notice it but it's not hot enough to do tissue damage. Do not ever do it. Do you wax play with regular? Can do it ever? It's bad for you bad bad time. Anyways, I was blindfolded near plugged, and you would basically drip this wax onto me which again, was not enough to tissue damage is hot and like, sort of jarring, but it's not doesn't do tissue damage at random spots in my body.
And My entire brain went beu in the only thing that was occurring. I was just aware of my entire body because I never knew where the next drop is going to fall. Right? And that like changed my understanding of what mindfulness was that experience figure out? That's like a really nice compliment. I really cute. Well was the wax like well it could if I wasn't I helped a little bit. I'm just being a great as my job could have been replaced by a robot soon enough.
All this ours is topical but Anyways, so my as my king identity has been developed, so to his minor diversion identity and I think a lot of it, it's also interesting. I think a lot of it has to do with turning my brain off, like, when I am sobbing or bottoming, I my brain turns completely off. I'm just I'm trusting you to provide whatever experience you think would suit the moment and so I don't have any decisions to make I don't have anywhere to go.
I like being restrained for that reason. I don't have to worry about moving my arms because they're In the same spot but you also absolutely kind of tie in both a conversation about consent. And then also like one of the problems that a lot of people with ADHD have is like their mind. Suddenly changing is like you absolutely have the power in the moment at any point to be like nah, no. So, like we're done or like can you change this or fix this or whatever?
And I think that is also one of the other reasons why it's it kinky. Is so appealing is because like you have permission to change your mind.
Emily. I want to be very clear, you always have permission to say no and you always have permission to change your mind but like in Kink especially because there's so much communication and there's so much negotiation that it is understood that like you're like and I struggle with it, you know, I struggle with like asking for changes or stuff like that, but it is sort of understood that like sometimes stuff is going to go wrong or something that worked yesterday.
Day isn't going to work today and so it's always a constant conversation about consent and change and negotiation. Whereas I think that like, sometimes we have this idea that like, oh I'm having sex gotta see it through like no, fuck
that. Yeah, you don't I think like the the high-octane this of a that candida can occur during King Cena, the volatility that can occur during the Qing scene requires the couple or people or however, the whatever the fuck is going on. On to be hyper-vigilant about consent and communication and negotiation, all that stuff, such that like, during vanilla sex, all of those practices that we've learned through King scenes. We're now just extremely good at saying, like hold on.
My arm is not getting this position or whatever the hell. So I'm trying to think of a good analogy, the one I'm thinking of is like, so I'm a professional cook and in a kitchen it is very dangerous to be unaware of your surroundings. It's very dangerous to just whip around without without Checking, first? Because somebody could be carrying a massive pot of boiling oil, and Scar. Both of you for life. Like you, it's because of the yeah, Eric, Katie, I'm sorry. Yeah.
You want to you want to try a little bit more about well, then some hot oil Birds on your face. I'm sorry. It's okay. I'm just giving you shit. Anyway, makes you look cool because of the volatility and I and danger that is, that is present in a professional cook culinary setting. There's you have to be ever Vigilant about the sorts of things such that.
Now, when I'm in far, less high octane situations, I'm still very aware of my surroundings, I'm still very aware that when I'm coming around a corner at speed, that I should slow down for a second. And look before I and so, I think, Kink play Kink kinky - can very much even just in even infrequent, kinking experiences, encounters scenes can help vanilla sex, like, if you have a partner and you're not, you're not, neither of you are particularly kicking.
Every once in a while, just doing something that requires a bit more communication, a bit more, just, yeah, it can help. You just get on the same page about, hey, if you don't like something, you can always tell me which not to be overly, you know, brought about it. But, in everyday life now, it's like, I feel you Katie that I can say like, hey, bothers me when you do this little stupid thing because we've established that we both of us always have permission to say what makes us
comfortable and stuff like that. So, I'm also, I think you are very good at and I am very bad at. Yeah. We're, we're, we're working on you did well. Less that we were using the, I know the deep muscle tissue massage or thing. The one thing that and you not enough sex, way under some very quick, just in it, just in a massage way, I asked for one whole thing. You did good, I did it. Ooh, yay! Yay. But anyways, I think I'm in a stage.
I'm in the beginning of my Kink identity, I suppose at least early. Stage 5 of my Kink identity. Largely, thanks to you. Thank you very much. And so I'm sort of, I'm realizing a hero. I'm realizing all the ways that it's that it's helping me that I didn't expect. I couldn't imagine my life any other way, pretty great. Well, here's what I think at this point I think we need to do a part 2. Yeah. We're I think I think we're going to have to do a part two. I was gonna bring up a whole
new. We're going to bring up. Well, let's, let's let's save it because we can, we want to start over, but I do want at least you keep our episodes to reasonably consistent lengths of people know that they have enough time to listen to it on the way to work. Keep it--keep it consensual that consensual one hour wear.
Yeah. But the difference between how being submissive helps my ADHD because I'm is make 0 decisions and how being dominant or topping helps made EHD I'm making all the decisions but for one exact purpose which is to provide my partner, the best possible experience, so I'm never wandering anything. I'm just all everything I'm doing is in service of making your experience as good as it can be which is like the exact opposite of being submissive.
But it helps my ADHD in exactly the same way. It's called being a service. Top Eric. Whoa, that's that's what that is. It's all the lingo. So now I'm going now. So just that is that the teaser trailer for next time? Was it is, do you have any? Do you have any Outlet will closing thoughts at the at the end there before we I mean, shut it on out. I think the thing that I would say and again, like I feel like I'm just preemptively apologizing because I don't, it's weird.
Like I've spent so long teaching workshops and classes and like, and being in the Kink Community. But I still have this fear that. I'm gonna like say the wrong thing and it's like, well, if you say the wrong thing then you apologize. And you educate yourself and you move on but I'm just like what if I was wrong. You know. Yeah. Because I think that's my perfectionism showing through, but I think that the real thing is like, Kink is huge. It is a huge topic.
There's a, there's a lot to it, there's a lot of nuance, but I don't know. Like the the reason why I wanted to start this conversation is because I'm realizing how many people we are. We are meeting and hearing from and and and honestly learning from who are On stage 3, stage 4 Stage 5. Like there's so many people who are out there and who are looking for information about like, well, how does Kink apply to me?
How does my special concerns? How do my special needs and wants and that kind of thing, how do they How do they translate into my belonging to the Kink Community I think and and what I would say is like my answer to those people's like you belong like you absolutely belong like you are valid regardless of neuro divergency regardless of mental illness, like whatever things that you might have that you feel like are a hindrance. They're not.
Because the whole point of Kink is solving those problems together and establishing that intimacy to Gather and negotiating and communication, communication inning, that's the word that you use. And I think that's just like
that's that's the whole point. Like that's why I wanted to do these episodes because I just I don't ever want anyone to feel like they don't belong especially when I feel like there's so much good and there's so much like, healthy, good stuff that can come out of participating in kink. Shining shimmering splendid. Tell me princess, I can show you the world, don't you? Dare close your eyes. Let's talk about butt sex here and she's like a whole new world
is about Buck text. It is a song about butt sex, right? You're welcome by the way. Yeah, thanks. Fuck you and of the podcast. Graduations. You made it to the end of the episode before we go f from all of us at infinite cost, we just want to say thank you. Thank you for listening to our podcast week after week. Thank you for leaving us reviews. Letting people know why you love the show. Thank you for sharing our content on social media. You have no idea how much all of
that helps us out. We are building something truly special together and we could not do it without you our community. And Eric, and I just wanted to take this opportunity to say thank you. We are so, so grateful, this week, in particular, we want to thank our new patrons, so, thank you to Kayla Brianna Kitty Samantha Jessica, RK, Becca, Elliot, and last but not least Commodore cuddle butts. Thank you particularly to
Commodore cuddlebuns. Anyway, if you're interested in becoming a patron yourself, you can head on over to patreon.com slash infinite quest for more information. And again, from all of us at infinite Quest. Thank you. Remember to be kind yourself this week. Remember to drink water and remember that. We love. You have a great week. Everybody will see you soon.