You are listening to the IFH podcast Network. For more amazing filmmaking and screenwriting podcasts, just go to ifahpodcastnetwork dot com. Welcome to the Bulletproof Screenwriting Podcast, Episode number three forty seven. It is a miracle every time you make a movie, and a bigger miracle if it turns out well. Mark Forrester broadcasting from a dark, windowless room in Hollywood when we really should be working
on that next draft. It's the Bulletproof Screenwriting Podcast, showing you the craft and business of screenwriting while teaching you how to make your screenplay bulletproof. And here's your host, Alex Ferrari. Welcome, Welcome to another episode of the Bulletproof Screenwriting Podcast. I am your humble host, Alex Ferrari. Now,
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over to covermiscreenplay dot Com. Today on the show Guys, we have Golden Globe winner for Best Director Mark Forrester, whose films like Monsters Ball, Stranger than Fiction, Finding Neverland, The Kite Runner, and a couple of blockbusters you might have heard of, Quantum of Solid, James Bond and World war Z. Mark is a fascinating filmmaker because it really brings deep characters and story structure to whatever film he is doing, whether it's something like Monster's Ball or
something as complex as World War Z. And in his new film A Man Called Auto starring Tom Hanks, he brings that in more Now, there are no killer zombies in this one, and there's no spies, but it is a heartfelt story that I absolutely fell in love with, and Tom Hanks is remarkable in it, and it really will kind of shake you when you watch it. But Mark and I had a great conversation about his career and his new film as well. So without any further ado, please enjoy my conversation
with Mark Forrester. I like to welcome to the show, Mark Foster. Hey you do, Mark, I'm good, Thank you, Alex. I'm very good by friend. So my first question we're going to jump right into it, is how did you get started in the business. You know, I grew up in Switzerland and the mountains and Davos and you know, surrounded by just the nature and not much My parents and had a TV, and I always had to play outside to entertain myself versus being entertained, and that's
sort of inspired me to become a storyteller. And the first time I saw a movie in the theater, I said, that's what I want to do. Now. How did you get involved with Monster's Ball because that was such an impactful and crazy movie. You know. I made a movie called Everything Put Together and the premiere at Sundance and the writers saw that movie, and at the time producers saw they all saw it and they said I would be
right for it. And they were trying to get the movie made for like eight years, and they birth first I couldn't get it made and it was, you know, originally Sean Penn directing with Robert de Niro, Sean Penn and Marlon Brando, and it was too expensive. When they first thing, they asked me, look, we've been waiting to get this finance for all this time. We would make the movie with you, but can I make it for three million dollars? And I made the Sundance movie for fifty thousand.
I said, three million dollars, that's I can do that. So that's how it started. So when you're when you were directing Hallie and Billy Bob in that film, uh, like, didd you see what was going on with Haley's performance at that point, like because she was amazing. You know, I didn't predict that she would win an Oscar at the time of shooting, but I definitely saw when I saw performances she was extremely powerful, extremely raw and vulnerable and and that's what we discussed and that we wanted to
go for and that it felt real. And you know, because Hallie, you know, it's such a you know, glamorous and beautiful human to really make it believable in the part I felt she worked extra hard on it. How what advice do you have for directors who want to pull those kind of raw and you know, to you those kind of emotions out of an actor, What did you do to make her feel comfortable enough to be that vulnerable
on screen? You know, ultimately you you you know, you discussed part in depths in your vision in depth, and you communicate your vision and I feel once you connect with an actor to make them feel comfortable and understand the visions you have, that's the key thing. I mean for the most vulnerable scene between the intimate scene between Billy Bob and her, you know, there was a close set of course and and closed everything that they felt totally protected
and safe. Now you you made the jump from Indie to slightly larger budgets, just slightly from Monsters Ball to the James Bond. How did you handle psychologically the jump from fifty three million to a couple hundred million. I mean there were a couple of movies between, true, yes, there was so so you know, I had, like I think financed like four four or
five movies in between. So did the budget increasing? They went bigger, and you know the one the Kiturner was the one month before the Bomb movie, but still it was only like the twenty five million dollar range. And it's it's like the same saying if you have like a you know, your small sort of boutique shop or boutique you know, custom made shoe shoe store, and then suddenly you become CEO of Macy's or something, and and it's
a different saying. You suddenly have so many more people, so many more questions. You're shoot in seven seven seven countries all over the world. You know, there's two one million dollar budget and and history of a franchise that's
one of the most or the most successful franchise in history. And you suddenly it's suddenly when you start reflecting all this, thinking, I hope I'm not gonna you know, this is not not going to go that that ship is not going to sink, because otherwise my career is over all, right exactly, So what does that feel like being on the set for the first day of shooting Quantum of Solace and you just sitting there like, okay, there's
a million people running around trying to get this and going how did that feel being on the set on a Bond film. It's such a legendary franchise, you know. To begin with, we started on purpose. The movie very intimate, was not some of the big, big action sequence and big sets, so that it felt very familiar to me. I knew the territory, I knew how to how to do those those scenes, and from that we started growing. But you know what feels like before you're always under the radar,
nobody really cares. And then suddenly Bomb moved me, and suddenly you have the world press attention on you, and that that is actually the biggest pressure, and that I didn't you know, so you don't, you don't, you don't think about that that suddenly everyone and everyone will right about you, and before that nobody really cared. How did you deal with that psychologically? And how did that affect if it affected at all your creativity or your
process? I mean, the process of the movie was a tricky one because there was a writer strike going on at that time in two thousand and eight, so we had a sort of unfinished screen and then the strike was from October to February, so it was very tricky. It was often just standing Craig and me in the trailer trying to figure out what you're going to do next. So that was the even more pressure. I think if we would have a completed script that everybody said, this is fantastic, that's just going
to shoot it, it definitely deflates some of the pressure. But if you have something that's not completed and you are suddenly stuck in that position and you have a release date in place, only five weeks to cut the movie, it's it's kind of intense now. I mean, obviously you also worked on World War Z, which is another small independent budget. How did you deal
with the stress of heading up such big productions? I mean, as a director, it's just so many people in so many departments, and you're still trying to be creative and still be intimate with your actors. How do you handle that stress? You know, I'm like, it's interesting. I had like the World was Z. It's for the Israel sequence when the zombies time over the wall, and remember that sequence. So when I drove in the
morning, I had a driver drive me to set in Malta. We shot it in Malta and we came to set and we pulled up and he looked at two thousand extras and helicopters in the air and buses and every hand's going on. And I Friday, a driver literally had an anxiety attack just looking at it and then not helpful now, and I was like, oh, whoa, what are you doing today? And so you just go out and you just have to focus and you can't. You have to blend out all
the chatter. And I think that's one of the key things for the director in general. You you know, you have so many voices always in general, from the financial studio, actors, producers, whatever, that you really stick to your vision. You when you hear the chatter, you take some stuff you like, but ultimately you have to stick to your vision. And I think it's part of your art in that to be able to stay calm and blend it out. We'll be right back after a word from our sponsor,
and now back to the show now. As directors, you know, there's always that day that you feel like the entire world's coming crashing down around you. I'm assuming you have that every day, but there's more than there's that one day on any production that you don't know how you're going to get through it. So what was that day on any of your productions and how did you overcome it? I think you know, I would say when we were shooting Western China, the chitro our line producer forgot too. It was
before digital. It was still stoodent a film and our line producers forgot to order film, so so we only have short ends left, you know, short ends. So basically where we're shooting these scenes, and there was a six minute dialogue scene and they only have like two minutes of film, so I couldn't tell the actor, you can only we're going to peace mail this, and she's doing it in pieces. So the actor is like the actors that playing six minutes of roles and actually the how are on it, but
there only two minutes of film in it. So at the end I knew there was no film in it, and then I pick basically next time, I just shoot the middle and then the end. But sometimes the actors didn't understand why do you do so many takes and this? If I we got it, then it was so great, and but they were away and that
was super stressful. Is thinking you have these great performances, but you don't have to own film and just telling them, oh, you know, we don't have any film in the camera right now, which is like out wasn't wasn't the right thing to do now on your new film A Man called Auto, which, by the way, I saw and I absolutely loved. There's such a beautiful film, and Tom Hanks is this newcomer. Tom Hanks is fantastic, by the way, discovery a real discovery, without question. How
did you get involved with this project? And also like it seems like you're going back to your roots a little bit. It's a very intimate film, very small in scope comparatively to the other big things you've done over of your career. Yeah, you know, I I read the book and I was
so touched and moved and I loved and I cried. And then I saw there was a Swedish version of the film, which I saw was good to and and I thought, this movie, we have to make an American version out of this because it's so you know, it's so funny, but it's also so touching and dark, and it's like both but ultimately it's a life affirming film. And what I loved about it it brings a neighborhood back together. And I think we also divided these days, and I think that's still
at the end. This is you know this, I always feel like it's one country. We all need to work together, and even though we have different point of views, and there's so many different characters on that street, which is so Sweden. I like the new neighbor, the Mexican family that moves in across the street, who she comes over and tries to do some much food and I think food is one of those great things that we can literally all share, which which definitely someone's heart. But she's so persistent,
that neighbor that her name is Marianna Travino marriage she plays Marisome. That Otto's character Tom, who Tom Hanks plays just that ultimately, like he just opens up. He can't he can't take it anymore. Do you do you still get nervous when you're directing people like Tom Hanks, Like when on that first day on set, you're like Tom Hanks is here. I mean the key is I love that and I think he's one of the greatest stars ever. He's definitely, you know, greatest talent that we worked with. I mean
it's so extraordinary. You know, after forty years, he still loves what he did does and is a big movie star. And he comes in the morning and he sits on set and he never leaves. He's like in like a meditation. And you know, usually stars of that caliber you take to take there out to the trailer. He never really stays there all day long as a crew. He just sits there the crew and then you realize change lives. He doesn't leave, and it's just this concentration and this sort of
just being there. It's pretty pretty special. How do you approach the different how do you approach different acting styles and you're directing, because you know Tom Hanks is probably different than a halle Berry is different than a Brad Pitt,
Like, how do you adjust multiple characters in the same scene. Yeah, it's it's basically you you have to like find a way to get to connect and see what what the actor needs or not and how open they are and how willing you know, so you know, how how doing there to collaborate. And I was pretty lucky starout my career that I always worked with the actors who were very open and we had I never had like, you know, the sort of the nightmare situation, and that they were very focused and
prepared and and on time. So I never dealt with with with the with the divas of the show business, which I'm I'm very very blessed. But but at the same time, you just see what they need and really try to feel them out, because sometimes it's better to say nothing than too much that because sometimes the actor needs their space and they find it. You as a director maybe just have to say, maybe we can just try a different prop you know, try this or that. It's less than giving them a
direction, it's less trying something a different direction. So that's you know, how how it really from person to person it differs. And how did you balance the darkness of this story with the humor because you did it so masterfully, because you i mean, you definitely touch upon very very dark themes in this in this movie, but yet you're laughing and crying and dealing with those
things. It's a very fine balancing act you did. Yeah, it's it's a lot of it is in editing because you know, we obviously shot a little bit more here and there, but it's just final this balance also between the flashbacks and present day that you go, you don't stay too much in their flashbacks to come back that the emotional still could stay connected with Tom and
in the present day and also in the in the flashbacks. Ultimately, it's just give enough information that creates sort of a mystery and enough for you to wanting to keep watching. And it's truxtaposing sometimes the dark with the with the humor straightly direct you know when this is the hinge breaks and he's on the floor and he lands right next to the paper with the with the you know, yes two for eight dollars, and then he says that, I mean
that that takes you right back into the humor. Right, it's just so fun, like like what is like he's just did that and he's like, nope, it look so good deal. I gotta keep this so beautiful. Uh Now, I'm gonna ask a few questions ask all my guests, Mark, what advice would you give a filmmaker trying to break into the business today. I mean, ultimately, I think that you know today, you know you can make your film on your phone. Basically what really comes down so
is a great story. And I think also when you find your story, the more a personal connection you have with that, the better. It's either you know, if you don't have the funds. I would ever to do a short and then have the feature script ready. So you shoot the short and then say, look, this is my short and this is what the
feature is going to be. And that's you know how to raise money and figure it out and get actors and people that we love the short, let's take our bet on this guy, or to make a feature for if you can raise the money. But no matter what, it all comes down to the script, that the script is really strong and be free. I think it's important to give it to other people to read the script, to have them have a look, get feedback, and just keep working on that.
But I think the stronger the script is better. And then the other thing is once you make a movie and you have a movie that works, let's say it's Sunlands or any of the festivals and summer buys it, that you have a second script ready because you don't want to too much time say oh, I have nothing now I have to write another script or find something for the next year or two to get that going. But at that time we leave it in such a fast society that that might have been too late.
So I see, to have a second project ready is important. As well. Now, what is the lesson that took you the longest to learn, whether in the film industry or in life. I think, you know, patience and stuff to make some things. Uh, you know you always have to learn like even sitting in traffic and stay calm. You know, it's like in patients with his people, was you know, with your kids, with everything, it's like just to be patient. I think it's just really
it's a hard one. What did you learn from one of your greatest failures? Yeah, you know there always a silicon valley is built on failures. You Seeing failures are truly key for an artist or anyone because you learn from them. For instance, after finding everyone, I made a film called Stay that wasn't Ryan Ryan Gosling, only Watts, great cost great, You and McGregor are great cost to act. And the critics didn't love it, the
artists don't love it. It has found a little bit of following throughout the years. But when ultimately, when I made that movie, I think, why does this? Didn't that movie work? And then I and out of that movie came strange her fiction, which also is sort of absurd and comedic.
But that movie worked, and I was able to make that sort of absurdness in that movie emotional, and it wasn't able to do that in Stay, even though visually it's cool and compelling, but it ultimately it didn't connect with people emotionally and strange fiction bit so, then in the hardest question of all three of your favorite films of all time three of my favorite films, Well, I mean it's it's a tricky one. You know, I love a lot of the dead directors. We'll be right back after a word from
our sponsor, and now back to the show. You know I love in Imar Bergmann, Swedish director. I would say, like wild strawberries of his I really really enjoy I you know, I mean there's three. That's a tough one. Three today. I know it changes tomorrow, so it will be on your tubes. Don'tn't worry that that, you know, I like, you know, I always love the Marx Brothers dock super so good. It still holds, It still holds today. Yes, And I see Howard
Harks bringing up baby, it's one of my favorites. Two because I just love how fast that dialogue goes and how she performs it. And that's also one of my favorite films, and where can people watch A Man called Auto? Hopefully they all will watch it in the theaters because it's a movie that really you should experience in the theater, and it's one of those movies you know, people seem to come out for it, and it's something you want
to experience together. You laugh and you cry, and you don't want that alone alone at home for of TV. So right now, it's still in the theaters for the next couple of weeks, so please go and support it. And the very last question, I'd love to hear your opinion on this as a filmmaker. We grew up as filmmakers. We grew up loving movies at the theater, but that seems to be becoming more and more of an
endangered species unless there's certain kind of films. What do you what are your hopes for the future, my friend, Because it's tougher and tougher to get people at the theater nowadays. You know, a man hook Auto was a kind of movie Hollywood used to make. Yeah, and they don't make them very much anymore. And I'm run into a few people now and said, really, they said, we have hope again because the manhood Auto. Seems like people came out to see it, and we didn't think those kind of
movies would still play in the theater. And I'm so glad they came and supported the movie. And I hope you know that people will keep coming out for movies like that, because that will keep those movies alive, because the financiers, obviously in the studios, will not pay for a movie when no one shows up, and they very quickly have their algorithms. You know, so many people don't. The decisions today are not being made anymore by the
gut by like the ould studio heads or people. It's more only made by algorithms and marketing. So can I market that movie? What's the algorithm it? Can we sell it? And they run these numbers and that's that's how it gets done. Mostly, Mark, it's a pleasure talking to you, my friend. Please keep up the fight, the good fight, my friend, and keep making the films you're making. I really appreciate it. Thank
you so much. As every good day, take care. I want to thank Mark so much for coming on the show and sharing his knowledge bombs with all of us. Thank you so much. Mark. If you want to get links to anything we spoke about in this episode, head over to the show notes at Bulletproof Screenwriting dot tv. Forward slash three forty seven. Thank you so much for listening. Guys, As always, keep on writing no
matter what. I'll talk to you soon. Thanks for listening to the Bulletproof Screenwriting podcast at bulletproof Screenwriting dot tv.